News:

About us: a forum for monotheists, and discussion of Islam based on The Quran

Main Menu

Destiny and Free will

Started by Emre_1974tr, July 11, 2022, 06:11:29 PM

Previous topic - Next topic

Emre_1974tr

This world is not a world of testing "from Allah's point of view". Because He already knows what we will do. This world is a miniature - a sample life that "symbolizes what we would do if we lived forever". And since we don't know what will happen, it is a world of trial for us.

That is why some people's test is terminated by Allah "at the very moment of their disbelief". But if that man had lived two more years, perhaps he would have died a believer.

In the same way, another person is made to die by Allah "at the very moment of being a believer ". But perhaps if he had lived two more years, he would have died as a disbeliever.

"If we are eternally good or bad", we are made to live a representative short life accordingly. And this two-day life is a paper sample that summarizes what we would do if we lived forever in this world.

- They set off again. After a while they came upon a boy; he killed him. Moses said: "You have killed an innocent man, not even for a life? By Allah, you have done a very bad deed!" (Surat al-Kahf, verse 74)

"As for the boy: his parents were believers. We feared that he might lead them to disbelief. " (verse 80)


"We wished that their Lord would give them a child superior to him in purity and more advanced in mercy. " (verse 81)

Here the test is ended before the child grows up and commits his sins. So it is like it is clear from the beginning what a person deserves or does not deserve... Also, if the child had lived, he could have led his parents astray. But since they did not deserve to go astray, they are saved.

Again, some verses say that the unbelievers in hell will demand to return to earth, but they are told that even if they were sent to be tested again and again, they would still be among those who lose the test. So even in eternal trials it is already known what we will and will not do.

In the same way, another verse says that some people are created as the people of hell. That is, they are the ones who are wicked at heart and their destination is known from the beginning. They are made to live this brief life of testing so that in the hereafter they can see the filth in their hearts and have no right to object. Don't misunderstand, because those people will choose evil with their free will, and because Allah knows this, He created them for hell. Otherwise, He would not have created those who would go to hell at all, and there would only be those in paradise. But He allows them, the evil ones, to come into existence.

In short, you get what you deserve. This worldly life is nothing but an example that represents - summarizes - the virtue or vice in your heart. The righteous are always put on the path to paradise in one way or another, the wicked are always taken astray in one way or another, and their trials are terminated at the very moment of their hellishness. A person can be a believer all his life and become a disbeliever in his last days and lose, whereas another person can be a disbeliever all his life and become a believer and repent in his last days and end up in paradise. In other words, "the good ones are always won" and "the bad ones are always lost".

If Allah Almighty presents us with options A and B, He knows which one we will choose, so He ensures that we get the result we deserve by using our free will. In other words, we are not robots in this 2-day test, and the choices really belong to us. But as I said, since it is known what we will do if we are faced with choices, we are presented with choices (scenarios) that will help us get what we deserve so that we can face the good or evil in our hearts.

There is also another function of this world. It is to give us a taste of some small troubles and rewards. In short, if the first function of this world is to separate the good and the bad, the second function is to start giving small punishments and rewards in this world.

***
Let us give a few more examples for those who are in doubt about this:

Surah Al-Qasas 50 So if they cannot answer you, know that they are only following their own desires. Who is more astray than he who follows his own desires without guidance from Allah! Allah does not guide the wrongdoing people.

Surat al-Tawbah: 85 Let not their wealth or their children envy you. Allah wants to torment them with these in this world. He will bring them out as disbelievers.

Surah Yunus Surah 70 Enjoy a little in this world, then they will return to Us. Then We will make them taste a severe torment for what they disbelieved.

9:55 Let not their money and their children impress you. Allah wants to punish them with them in the life of this world, and to make them die as disbelievers.

Surah A'raf: 179 By Allah, We have created many of mankind and jinn for Hell. They have hearts, by which they do not understand; they have eyes, by which they do not see; they have ears, by which they do not hear. They are like cattle. Perhaps even more confused. They are the heedless.

In short, since Allah knows before He creates a person whether that person will choose good or evil, He creates the person He knows will choose evil, knowing that he will go to hell. And He gives that evil person this brief example of 2 days. But again, completely free will is exercised.

27. Oh, if you could only see them standing by the Fire and saying: "What if we were sent back, and did not deny the verses of our Lord and were of the believers?"

28. The truth of the matter is that what they used to conceal has been brought against them, and if they were sent back, they would certainly repeat what they were forbidden. Indeed, they are liars.(Anam)

In other words, even if the wrongdoers are tested millions of times, they will still lose the test. Anyway, this 2-day scenario makes us face the goodness or treachery-evilness in our hearts. Otherwise Allah already knows what we deserve.

And in this representative test, since it is known which options we will choose, the scenario is brought to us exactly the options that we will face what is in our hearts. Then the moment of the end of our test is realized at a moment when we will be in paradise if we are among the good ones and in hell if we are among the bad ones.

Otherwise, a person's thoughts can change constantly, a person can have periods of faith and periods of disbelief throughout his life. Here, it is not a matter of chance and coincidence whether the moment of that person's death will coincide with a believing or unbelieving moment. The test of those who deserve paradise with faith and the test of those who do not deserve paradise ends in a moment of faithlessness by the Creator.


***
All the options (scenarios) that are presented to us allow us to face the good or evil in our hearts and also to get what we deserve.


Surah Ali Imran:


154-Then He sent down on you after that sorrow a security and a sleep that enveloped a group of you, while another group were in their own troubles, and they had an unrealistic opinion of Allah, like the opinion of the ignorant: "Is there anything for us to do?" Say: "Verily, all work is Allah's." They conceal something in their hearts which they do not reveal to you, saying: "Had we been consulted in this matter, we would not have been killed here." Say: "Even if you had been in your homes, those who were destined to be killed would have gone out to their deaths. Allah has brought this upon you to test what is in you and to reveal what is in your hearts. Allah knows what is in your hearts.


165-When a calamity befalls you which you brought twice as much upon your enemies, do you say: "Where is this from?" Say: "It is from your own side." For Allah is all-powerful.

166-And what befell you on the day when the two armies clashed is by Allah's permission. And He will make the believers known.

167-as well as that it may reveal the hypocrites, to whom it was said: "Come, fight in the way of Allah or defend yourselves!" They said: "If we knew how to fight, we would have followed you." On that day they were closer to disbelief than to faith, saying with their mouths what was not in their hearts, and Allah knows best what they conceal in their hearts.

178 - And let not those who disbelieve think that Our abandonment of them is good for them. We leave them only to increase their sins, and for them is a humiliating torment.

Muhammad

29. Or do those whose hearts are sick in their hearts think that Allah will never reveal their bitter hatreds?

30. And if We had willed, We could certainly have shown them to you, and you would certainly have recognized them by their faces. You would also recognize them by the manner of their words. Allah knows all that you do.

Surat al-Tawbah 64 The hypocrites fear lest a Surah should descend upon them which will inform them of what is in their hearts. Say: "You mock. Allah will reveal to you what you are afraid of."
***
There is also the side of the event that involves angels and jinns.

They too are confronted with what is in their hearts.

Iblis' confrontation with the treachery in his heart in the incident of prostration to Adam showed him that he could not actually be a high ranking angel.

Because Iblis was one of the wrongdoers who chose evil of his own free will. He just needed to be exposed on some occasion:

ARAF

11. We created you, then gave you form, then We said to the angels: "Prostrate yourselves to Adam"; they all prostrated, but Iblis did not, he was not of those who prostrated.

12. (Allah) said: "What prevented you from prostrating when I commanded you?" (Iblis) said: "I am better than him, you created me from the fire and you created him from clay."

13. (Allah) said: "So come down from there; it is not for you to be arrogant therein. Get out, for you are of the despicable."

14. (Iblis) said: "(At least) give me time until the Day when they will be resurrected."

15. (Allah) said: "You are of those who have been given time."

16. So, he said: "I swear by Allah that I will sit on your right path to lead them astray, in return for your leading me astray.


Notice that Iblis realizes that Allah has revealed the evil in his heart through this event. That is, he realizes that Allah has led him astray. Of course, Iblis knows that all the blame here lies with him, because of his free will he has revealed what was in his heart. He faced the truth.

That is why he also made his request in anger:

HIJR

39. (Iblis): "My Lord," he said, "because You have tempted me, I will certainly adorn them on the earth and I will tempt them all.

40. Except the servants among them who have been given piety (My temptation will not affect them).

When his true identity is revealed and his mask is unmasked, Iblis gets very angry and wants to lead people astray himself.

But Iblis knows that his misleading people will only lead some evil people to confront the treachery in their hearts. That is why he expresses his helplessness by saying "except for the servants who are given ihlas".

In short, at least two birds are killed with one stone. Both the true face of Iblis has been revealed and he will be instrumental in unmasking evil people until the Day of Judgment.

Surah Al-Zuhruf 36 Whoever disregards the Reminder of the Most Merciful and turns away from it, We will cause a devil to haunt him, and he will be his companion.

Surat al-Maryam 83 Have you not seen that We have set the devils upon the disbelievers and they make them move and twist?

In short, in the life of this world-universe, servants attain what they deserve through their free will, and they see and experience the good or evil in their hearts.

***
As we said before, Allah makes everyone face what is in their hearts by taking advantage of their free will, and at the same time He makes sure that they get what they deserve in this 2-day test:

ENFAL

8:5 Indeed, your Lord took you out of your house for the fulfillment of a certain plan. A group of the believers did not like it.

8:6 They disputed with you about it as if they were being driven to their deaths, even though the truth had come to light.

8:7 Allah had promised you to defeat one of the two groups, but you wanted to meet the weaker of the two. But ALLAH wishes to realize the truth by His words and to cut off the pursuit of the disbelievers.

8:8 That He may realize the truth and remove injustice, even though the guilty dislike it.

8:11 He was lulling you into slumber as a security from Himself, and He was sending down on you water from the sky to cleanse you (from thirst), to drive away from you the filth of Satan (despair), to convince your hearts and to strengthen your feet.

8:17 You did not kill them, but God did. And when you threw, you did not throw, but ALLAH did. But thus He tested the believers with a good test. ALLAH is All-Hearing, All-Knowing.

Since the righteous deserved to do as they were commanded, and the wicked deserved to lose by fighting the Prophet, they were made to face each other so that each might get what he deserved:

8:42 You were on the far side of the valley and they were on the other side of the valley. And the caravan was lower than you. If you had decided on this encounter, you would have disagreed about it. But Allah was carrying out a pre-planned work. So that the destroyed may be destroyed with a clear proof, and the living may be kept alive with a clear proof. ALLAH is All-Hearing, All-Knowing.

8:43 Allah made them seem small to you in your dream. If He had shown them to you many, you would have scattered and disputed about it. But ALLAH saved (you). He knows the essence of the breasts.

8:44 And when the time came and you met them, He made them little in your eyes, and He made you little in their eyes, so that ALLAH might accomplish what was planned beforehand. The affairs return to ALLAH in the end.

And Satan, after dragging the wicked after him, flees the scene in panic:

8:48 Satan embellished his deeds for them and said: "None of the people can defeat you this day, I am on your side." And when the two armies came face to face, he turned back on his heels and said, "I have nothing to do with you, I see what you do not see, and I fear Allah. Allah's punishment is severe."

8:51 "This is in recompense for what your hands have done. Surely God is not unjust to servants."

8:54 Like the followers of Pharaoh and those before them. They denied the signs of their Lord. So We destroyed them for their sins. We drowned the followers of Pharaoh. They were all wrongdoers.


Those who are working to send people to hell are in fact only enabling the truly wicked to confront what is in their hearts. Otherwise, they cannot roll any good person into hell.

Saffat

161. You and what you serve,

162. You shall not cause anyone to fall into temptation against Him.

163. except the one who will be released into Hell.

***
Let us continue to give evidence from the relevant verses:

Ta-Ha

110. He knows their past and their future, while none can comprehend Him in knowledge.
(Allah already knows who will do what in the future)


133. They said, "He should have at least brought us a sign (a miracle). Did not the evidence (proof) in the previous Books come to them?

134. And if We had destroyed them with a punishment before that, they would have said: "Our Lord, if You had sent us a messenger, we would have followed Your verses before we became so lowly and disgraced!"

(He knows what they would have done if they had been tried in another way)


Enam

109. They swore by Allah with all their oaths that if a miracle came to them, they would surely believe in it. Tell them: "Miracles are only with Allah." Do you not understand that they will not believe even when a miracle comes to them?

110. We turn their hearts and their eyes upside down, and We leave them as they did not believe the first time, and they wander blindly in their transgression.

111. And if We had sent down to them the angels, and the dead had spoken to them, and We had gathered all things and set them before them, they would not have believed except by Allah's will. But most of them show ignorance.
(He knows what they would do if different options were put before them)


Rum

51. By Allah, if We send a wind and they see that the earth has turned yellow, then they will be ungrateful.

52. So you cannot make the dead hear. Nor can you make the deaf hear the call if they turn away.

53. And you cannot enlighten the blind from their error. You can only make those who believe in Our verses to hear, and they become Muslims.


QASAS

56. You cannot guide whom you love. It is only Allah who guides whom He wills. He knows best those who deserve to be guided.


Almighty Allah knows very well that if people were tested in infinite variations for eternity, He knows which of them would be among the good ones and which would be among the bad ones. That is why He ends everyone's test as they deserve in this 2-day representative-miniature test. But again, he does this without touching free will. Since He knows what His servants will choose in this 2-day test, He brings them the choices that will allow them to face exactly what is in their hearts, and He takes the good ones to paradise and the bad ones to hell in a moment.

For example, Iblis was doing as he was told, but Allah knew that he was one of the wicked. And in order to reveal the treachery in his heart, He put the option of "prostrating to Adam" in front of him. He knew he would not do it. And then Iblis realizes that he was trapped and he says, "in response to your temptation".

***
Let us continue with the subject:

Our Lord knew what those people would choose before He created them. He created them to get what they deserve. So that those who would choose good would go to Paradise and those who would choose evil would go to Hell:

HUD

119 Except those whom your Lord has mercy on. For that He has created them. Your Lord's words, "By Allah, I will fill Hell with mankind and jinn" will be fulfilled.

He also knows from the very beginning who will have the best morals and who will be worthy of being chosen as prophets. This goes without saying.

In the story of Moses, this "2-day summary test, confrontation with what is in the heart" is also evident:

Surah 28 - Qasas

In the name of Allah, the Most Merciful and the Most Gracious.

1. Ta, Sîn, Mîm.

2. These are the verses of the Book, which declare clearly to you.

3. We will recite to you a portion of the story of Moses and Pharaoh in truth for a people who will believe.

4. The truth is that Pharaoh had established himself in that place and divided its people into groups. He despised and oppressed a group of them: He slaughtered their male children and treated their women shamelessly/exploited their wombs/released their women into the world. He was indeed one of those who spread mischief.

5. And We desire that We may bestow mercy on those who are oppressed in the earth, and make them leaders, and make them heirs.

6. And give them means and power in the earth. And We will show Pharaoh and Haman and their armies what they feared.

(Since Allah knows how His servants will react to which option, He is implementing His plan to give their free will what they deserve)

7. And We revealed to the mother of Moses: breastfeed him! And when you feel fear against him, let him fall into the river. Do not fear, do not grieve! We will bring him back to you and make him one of the Messengers."

8. Finally, Pharaoh's family found him as a lost thing and took him. He was to be an enemy and a worry for them. The truth is that Pharaoh and Haman and their armies were on the wrong path.

9. Pharaoh's wife said: "He is a light in my eyes and in yours. Do not kill him, for he may be useful to us, or we may adopt him as a child." They did not realize it.

10. And the heart of the mother of Moses was empty in the morning. She was in a state that she would have revealed it if We had not given her a binding in her heart so that she might be among the believers.

11. His mother said to Moses' sister, "Watch him." So she watched him from the sidelines. They were not aware of it.

12. And We had forbidden him women who suckled before, so his sister said: "Shall I introduce to you a household who will take care of him for you, and take it upon themselves to educate and teach him?"

13. Finally We returned Moses to his mother so that she may be enlightened and not grieve and know that Allah's promise is true. But many do not know this.

14. And when Moses reached the age of valor, We gave him wisdom and knowledge. Thus do We reward those who think well and act well.

************************

(Then Pharaoh and his followers face the evil in their hearts and leave the land of testing in the middle of the closing sea)

41. We made them leaders calling to the Fire, and they will not be helped on the Day of Resurrection.

42. We put a curse on their backs in this worldly life. On the Day of Resurrection they will be among the disfigured.

***

In the story of Joseph, again we see that our Lord knows the future and that in this 2-day representative and summary test, He ensures that people get what they deserve with their free will:


YUSUF

4. Joseph once said to his father, "My father, I saw the eleven planets, the sun and the moon, and I saw them prostrating themselves to me."


5. (His father Jacob said:) "My child," he said, "do not tell your dream to your brothers, lest they plot against you. For Satan is a clear enemy to man.


6. "So your Lord chooses you, and teaches you the interpretation of dreams, and completes His favor upon you and the family of Jacob, as He completed His favor upon your fathers Abraham and Isaac before you. Your Lord is All-Knowing, All-Wise."

Since our Lord knows how people will react to whatever choice is put before them, He is giving Joseph and those around him the adventure that will enable them to confront themselves in this way.


21. The one who bought him in Egypt said to his wife, "Take good care of him, lest he be of use to us, or we adopt him as a son." So We established Joseph on the earth and taught him the interpretation of dreams. God is the One who accomplishes His work, but most of the people do not know it.

22. And when he grew up, We gave him wisdom and knowledge, and thus do We reward those who do good.

Again, with the free will of people, fate weaves its web and events follow one another in line with the plan of our Lord.

Even the fact that Joseph was shown the future through dreams, in itself, shows that it was already known what was going to happen. Our Lord knows who will do what in the face of which option, and He presents such options, representing what that person would do if he lived forever - if he were tested - that in this 2-day world, people are confronted with the good or evil in them with the option they choose.


47. He said: "What you have sown for seven years, leave it in its ears and store it up, except a little of it which you eat."

48. Then seven dry years will come after it, and it will devour what you have stored up for those years, except a little of what you have stored up

49. "And after that comes a year in which the people will be refreshed and in which they will press (fruit) and milk (animals)."

54. The king said: "Bring him, and I will appoint him to work for me." And when he had spoken to him, he said, "You are a trustworthy man who has a high position with us today."

55. He said: "Put me in charge of the country's finances. Surely I can guard well and know well."

56. So We established Joseph in that land, and he could move about as he pleased. We shower Our mercy on whom We will. We do not leave those who do good without reward.

Our Lord continues to carry out His plan.

After Joseph was reunited with his family, he witnessed the fulfillment of the dream he had told his father about:

100. He raised his parents on the throne. They all prostrated for him. He said: "My father, this is the fulfillment of the dream I had before. My Lord has fulfilled it, and He has done me good by bringing me out of prison and bringing you from the desert after Satan had driven a wedge between me and my brothers. Indeed, my Lord is very compassionate to whom He wills. He is All-Knowing, All-Wise."

101. "My Lord, You have given me sovereignty and taught me the interpretation of dreams. You are the Creator of heaven and earth. You are my Wali (owner) in this world and the Hereafter. Take my life as a Muslim and include me among the righteous."

***
There are also examples of even more accelerated trials that Allah uses to confront His servants with what is within themselves and to show them what they deserve.

In fact, these two days of brief trials are being prepared and finalized in a way that corresponds to what we would do if we were tested forever.

Our Lord sometimes tries the wrongdoers with requests outside of His ongoing law in order to confront them with the evil in them one last time. More precisely, He confronts them with this reality because He knows what they will do.

PROHIBITION OF TOUCHING THE CAMEL

ARAF

73. And We sent to Thamud their brother Salih. He said: "O my people! worship Allah. You have no god but Him. A clear proof has come to you from your Lord. This is the camel of Allah. A miracle for you. Leave it alone, let it graze on Allah's land. Do not touch it with evil intent. Otherwise a terrible torment will seize you."

77. Meanwhile they slaughtered the she-camel. And they departed from the command of their Lord and said: "O Salih! If you are of those sent from Allah, bring before us what you threatened us with."

78. Then they were seized by a violent tremor, so that they fell down in their own homes.

This is the opposite of the command to slaughter a cow that Moses' people were tested with, this time there is a command not to touch an animal. But when the wrongdoers slaughtered the camel, their cruelty was once again exposed and their trial was ended red-handed by the Creator.


PROHIBITION OF WORK ON SATURDAY

Surat al-Nahl: 124 Saturday has been made obligatory only for those who dispute about it. Your Lord will judge between them on the Day of Resurrection about what they disputed.

Surah A'raf
163 Ask them about the city by the sea; on Saturday they were wicked and unrestrained. On the Sabbath their fish would come to them in abundance, but when they did not keep the Sabbath they would not come to them. Thus did We test them because of their deviation from the way.

164. A group among them said: "Why do you advise a people whom Allah will destroy or torment with a severe torment?" They said: "So that it may be an excuse against your Lord and in the hope that they may be protected."

165. And when they forgot the advice given to them, We saved those who restrained them from evil, and We seized the wrong-doers with a painful torment for their apostasy.

166. When they became angry at what they had been forbidden and began to commit other excesses, We said to them: "Be despicable, mocking monkeys!"

This time a ban on Saturday work is imposed on a cruel people to make them face themselves one last time. And when they disobey this ban (after the good among them are saved), they face the bitter truth.

An example of such a different way of testing the wrongdoers is that for a period of time, some Jews were made unlawful things that were normally lawful:

Surah Al-Nisaa 160 And We made unlawful for the Jews that which was lawful for them before, because of their wrongdoing and because they kept many people from the way of Allah.

Enam Surah 146 We also forbade them the fat of cattle and sheep, except the fat of the backs and intestines of cattle and sheep and the fat mixed with the bones. We did this to them as a punishment for their transgression. Surely We are the keepers of Our word.

By the way, let us give an example of how our Lord knows what a person would do if he were tested with a different option:

ISRA

73 And they would almost have put you in mischief, that you might turn away from that which We have revealed to you and fabricate something other than it and attribute it to Us. Then they would have taken you as a friend.
74 And if We had not strengthened you, by Allah, you would have inclined to them a little.

76 They would have almost pressed you out of this land. In such a case they would have stayed there behind you for a little while.

If the prophet had been left there without support, he would have made the wrong choice. But because the prophet does not deserve it, he is saved from making that mistake.

Because what is important is what that person would do if they were tested for eternity. In this two-day sample-miniature life of trial, people are made to live a life in this direction, that is, in line with the outcome they deserve. Since it is known what each person will do with his free will in the face of which option, the options that will enable him to have the experience he deserves are put before him, so that he can be saved or deviate. Then, those who deserve heaven say goodbye to the world of trials in a moment of paradise and those who deserve hell say goodbye to the world of trials in a moment of hell.

In addition, what is done in this 2-day world is also instrumental in either solidifying or sealing hearts. But the real reason is what they would do if they lived forever in the world of trial, if they were tried in endless options...

***
Also, these verses explain very well that people are confronted with themselves in this world and are made to face what they deserve in the Hereafter:

HAJJ

53 This is that Allah may make what Satan throws a Fitnah for those whose hearts are diseased and whose hearts are hardened. The wrongdoers are in an irreversible separation and separation.

54 This has been done so that those who have been given knowledge may know that it is the truth from your Lord, and they may believe in it and their hearts may respect it. Verily, Allah is the All-Wise, and He will surely guide those who believe to the straight path.

55 And those who disbelieve will remain in doubt about the Qur'an until the Day of Resurrection suddenly bursts upon them, or until the torment of a barren day comes upon them.

------------------------------------------------------------ -----------

Our Lord already knows who will do what in the face of which choice, and accordingly, He provides them with the testing environment and options that will enable them to achieve what they deserve.

***

Another way of providing an insight into fate and free will is through the way the Qur'an was revealed. As is well known, the verses of the Qur'an were revealed in parts. Sometimes the verses even provided answers and explanations to the events and questions people asked.

Surah al-Ma'ida

101. O you who believe! Do not ask questions about things that will trouble you when they are revealed to you. If you ask about them while the Qur'an is being revealed, they will be explained to you. Allah has forsaken them. Allah is Oft-Forgiving, All-Merciful.

102. A people before you also asked about them, then they disbelieved.

Surah Al-Baqarah: 215 They ask you what they should spend and give. Say: "What you give in charity should be for parents, relatives, orphans, the poor and helpless and the wayfarer. Allah knows best what you do in charity. "

Surah Al-Ahzab Surah 63 People ask you about the Hour. Say: "The knowledge of it is with Allah. " What do you know, perhaps that hour is near!

And in the eyes of Allah, who is timeless and spaceless, the Qur'an was already prepared to answer these events and the questions of people. In other words, since our Lord already knows what people will do with their free will, what they will ask, what will happen, the Qur'an performs its mathematical and other miracles in a complete way, even though it came down in parts and with answers. This is because God does not travel in time or space and the Qur'an was already ready before Him in its entirety. In other words, He knew how it would be in its completed form.

For God, who is timeless, there is no question of being in states of time such as "forward, past, present". We, on the other hand, are traveling forward in time.

Since our Creator knows how each person will react to which choice, and even what they would do if they were tested with infinite choices for eternity, He gives them a two-day confrontation with themselves, an example of a life of testing. The sending of the Qur'an and the coming of the prophets are also part of this confrontation, this test. In this way, people see the good or evil in themselves and have no right to object in the Hereafter:

Surah Al-Ma'idah 19 O People of the Book! Our Messenger has come to you at a time when the messengers were cut off; he is making clear explanations. Do not say, "Neither a bearer of glad tidings nor a warner has come to us." Here has come to you the bearer of glad tidings and the warner. Allah is all-powerful.

Surah Al-Baqarah 26 It is a fact that Allah does not tire of giving the example of a mosquito or even a being above it. In such a case, the believers know that it is a truth from their Lord. But the disbelievers say: "What does Allah mean by giving this as an example?" Allah leads many astray by it, and guides many to the truth and the good by it. Allah leads astray with it none but the transgressors.

Surah Al-Muddatair 31 We have made the inhabitants of Hell angels. And We have made their number nothing but a trial for those who disbelieve, so that those who have been given the Book may know clearly and clearly. That the faith of those who have believed may increase. Let not those who have been given the Book and those who believe be in doubt. And let those in whose hearts is a disease and those who have disbelieved say: "What does Allah wish to illustrate by this?" Thus it is. Allah leads astray whom He wills, and guides whom He wills to the truth and the good. Only He knows the armies of your Lord. This is nothing but an admonition and a reminder for man.

We said that this 2-day life of confrontation (test) with what is within oneself removes the right of the servants to object in the Hereafter. Let us continue to give examples from the relevant verses:

Nisa

165 And We sent messengers bringing glad tidings and warning, so that mankind may have no proof against Allah after the messengers have come. Allah is the All-Mighty, the All-Wise.

7:172 When your Lord brings forth the offspring from the loins of the sons of Adam, He makes them witnesses to themselves: "Am I not your Lord?" They say, "Yes, we bear witness." So you will not be able to say on the Day of Resurrection, "We were unaware of this".

7:173 Or you will not be able to say, "Our forefathers used to associate partners and we are their descendants after them; will you destroy us because of those who practiced innovations and superstitions?"

Human beings will have no excuse in the Hereafter for their deviations, such as disbelief, associating partners or following fabricated ancestral teachings. Both the revelations and proofs given at birth and the revelations and proofs we meet later on ensure this.

It is known what we would do with our free will if we were tried in infinite options for eternity, and accordingly we are made to face ourselves for 2 days (test). In this way, the evidence we deserve for or against us is collected.

Surat al-An'am: 123 In this way We have made the bigwigs in every city/every civilization the criminals of that city and civilization, so that they may plot and set traps therein. In fact, they do not play tricks on anyone other than their own selves, but they do not realize it.

Surat al-Anfal: 30 Those who disbelieved were plotting against you that they might bind you or kill you or drive you out of your land. They plot, and Allah also plots. But Allah is the best of plotters.

Surat al-Tur 42 Or do they wish to lay a trap? Verily, those who disbelieve are themselves caught in a trap.


***

Also pay attention to these verses:

ISRA

4. And We decreed in the Book to the Children of Israel: "Twice you will make mischief in that land and you will be very proud (you will be overbearing)!

5. And when the time came for the first time, We sent upon you Our servants who were very strong, and they went into the houses and searched you. This was a promise to be fulfilled.

6. Then again We enabled you to defeat them and We supported you with wealth and sons and multiplied your warriors.

7. If you do good, you do good to yourselves. And if you do evil, it is against yourselves. And when the time of your last transgression comes (We will send again such servants) that they may make your faces evil (cause your faces to fall in grief) and enter the Masjid (Jerusalem) as they entered it the first time, and destroy what they seized.

Again, our Lord says that He knows who will do what and what they deserve in the Hereafter.

Meanwhile, the fact that Allah knows who will go to heaven or hell before He even creates them, and that He created the people of heaven for heaven and the people of hell for hell, causes some people to falter philosophically for some reason.

That is to say, there are some people who raise strange objections such as, "If it is clear who will go where in the hereafter, why are we struggling?"

Nothing is certain from our point of view. Whatever we are going to do, we will do it with our own free will and then we will find out who goes where.

And this two-day representative test will take place in parallel with what we would do if we were tested forever. So no one goes to paradise or hell by accident. On the contrary, since it is clear what you would have been if you had lived forever, you will go to the eternal realm that you really deserve.

Otherwise, if Allah did not know what you would do if you lived forever, then everyone would be going to paradise and hell by chance. Whatever came out of the bingo, how you would come across in the world of 2 days, how you said goodbye, you would accidentally fall into paradise or hell.

But no, everyone is being brought to exactly what they deserve in a perfect way by our Almighty Lord.

Imagine a wounded person. You see him on the road and he needs urgent help. Now God knows whether this person will live or not. But you don't. That's why you immediately rush to that person's aid and work hard to save that person.

This is exactly the logic and reality of the test. We do not know whether we (and others) are going to paradise or hell. That is why we should run to the aid of both ourselves and all people. Both for the sake of worldly pleasure and for the sake of eternal happiness....

We should constantly produce good behaviors that will make people happy.


(My Turkish article translated with machine)

https://emre1974tr.blogspot.com/2011/07/kader-ve-ozgur-irade.html

Peace

[url="https://twitter.com/Emre_1974tr"]https://twitter.com/Emre_1974tr[/url]

[url="http://emre1974tr.blogspot.com/"]http://emre1974tr.blogspot.com/[/url]

Emre_1974tr

Our Lord's knowledge does not affect free will

The fact that God knows what we will do with our free will is interpreted by some people as "there is no free will". "That means we cannot do the opposite of what is known," they object.

No, knowing what we will choose with our free will does not affect the freedom of the will. There is not even the slightest connection.

It is one thing to be able to do the opposite of something, and quite another to do it.

For example, let's say a person will choose option A in such and such an event. Our Lord knows this. He(a person) has the freedom to do the opposite, that is, not to choose this option. But he will choose option A by his own decision.

In short, he may not do the act of choosing option A, but he will still do it.

It is not because God knows, but because he chooses option A with his free will that our Creator knows.

Let us give a completely different example:

Hud

107. As long as the heavens and the earth endure, they will abide therein, except if your Lord wills. Your Lord is the Doer of whatever He wills

108. And those who deserve happiness will abide in Paradise as long as the heavens and the earth endure. Except if your Lord wills. This is an uninterrupted reward.

God Almighty is telling us here what He will do in the future.

And He says, "I will never remove those in Paradise unless I will otherwise."

And he promises not to take them out.

In other words, he says, "I can change my judgment if I want to, but those in heaven will stay there forever because I freely willed that they should stay there."

This gives us a second proof, another evidence for free will.

In this case we know what God will do in the future.

But it means that our knowing what Allah will do in the future does not affect His free will.

Just as His knowing what we will do does not affect our free will.

It is one thing to be able to do something and quite another to do it. And this is the result of free will.


(My Turkish article translated with machine)

http://emre1974tr.blogspot.com/2011/07/rabbimizin-bilmesi-ozgur-iradeyi.html

Peace
[url="https://twitter.com/Emre_1974tr"]https://twitter.com/Emre_1974tr[/url]

[url="http://emre1974tr.blogspot.com/"]http://emre1974tr.blogspot.com/[/url]

Fusion

Dear Emre,
Very though provoking article and well corelated your own commentary relevant to the verses.
I have few clarifications to ask if i may.


1.    2:155
And We will surely test you with something of fear and hunger and a loss of wealth and lives and fruits, but give good tidings to the patient,
How would you reconcile this  verse related to the context of what you have written, can you please enlighten.


2.  9:55 Let not their money and their children impress you. Allah wants to punish them with them in the life of this world, and to make them die as disbelievers.

Here what is the context of this verse? I mean is having money and children a curse in its originality? I seen many people with these two characteristics and they are living a fine life and honest and (yes they don't believe in GOD as we want them to be but they lead a very clear true life in worldy sense  with no evil).. so where/what is the punishment for them in this life?

Lastly I quote your statement
"For example, Iblis was doing as he was told, but Allah knew that he was one of the wicked. And in order to reveal the treachery in his heart, He put the option of "prostrating to Adam" in front of him. He knew he would not do it. And then Iblis realizes that he was trapped and he says, "in response to your temptation".

You sounded like God has created certain people (jinn/man) as EVIL (done deal) and HE is using so called techniques to make these people realize in their heart/conscious that what they deserve eventually (hell) is JUSTIFIED. So its like a done deal... these are MEANT to be evil and fuel for fire. God only makes them believe of their evilness.. Now if i am outside of this scenario and look at this arrangement I will feel sorry for these folks? its not their fault that they were CHOSEN as evil  by birth? So no matter what explanation you provide, fact of matter is "these people are created with the purpose of being burnt in hell".

Please comment and thanks






Best Regards,

Emre_1974tr

Quote from: Fusion on July 15, 2022, 06:51:09 PM
Dear Emre,
Very though provoking article and well corelated your own commentary relevant to the verses.
I have few clarifications to ask if i may.


1.    2:155
And We will surely test you with something of fear and hunger and a loss of wealth and lives and fruits, but give good tidings to the patient,
How would you reconcile this  verse related to the context of what you have written, can you please enlighten.


2.  9:55 Let not their money and their children impress you. Allah wants to punish them with them in the life of this world, and to make them die as disbelievers.

Here what is the context of this verse? I mean is having money and children a curse in its originality? I seen many people with these two characteristics and they are living a fine life and honest and (yes they don't believe in GOD as we want them to be but they lead a very clear true life in worldy sense  with no evil).. so where/what is the punishment for them in this life?

Lastly I quote your statement
"For example, Iblis was doing as he was told, but Allah knew that he was one of the wicked. And in order to reveal the treachery in his heart, He put the option of "prostrating to Adam" in front of him. He knew he would not do it. And then Iblis realizes that he was trapped and he says, "in response to your temptation".

You sounded like God has created certain people (jinn/man) as EVIL (done deal) and HE is using so called techniques to make these people realize in their heart/conscious that what they deserve eventually (hell) is JUSTIFIED. So its like a done deal... these are MEANT to be evil and fuel for fire. God only makes them believe of their evilness.. Now if i am outside of this scenario and look at this arrangement I will feel sorry for these folks? its not their fault that they were CHOSEN as evil  by birth? So no matter what explanation you provide, fact of matter is "these people are created with the purpose of being burnt in hell".

Please comment and thanks

Hello, dear Fusion, thank you.

In the first verse you quoted, it again talks about confronting people with themselves, revealing what is inside them. How you would react in the face of adversity, such as hunger or deprivation of wealth, is revealed to you and you are a witness to yourself. You have no right to object in the Hereafter. You also taste some of the small punishments or rewards you deserve in this world through these trials. Allah knows what you are and how you will react.

In the second verse you quoted, He talks about some people who are bad in total and He says that they will go to hell. The moment of their death will be completed as disbelievers. It says that the good things they experience in this world are not important and that they will have no share in the Hereafter. When we read the whole Qur'an, we see that some of the bad people who are going to hell also have some good and virtuous qualities and they are rewarded with some small rewards in this world. But these blessings only increase their rebellion. In this way, two birds are killed with one stone. They are both given some small rewards that they deserve and they are made to face the evil in them. But on the other hand, if you read the whole Qur'an, many good people in paradise are also given wealth, luxury and children in this world. these blessings bring out the good in good people. They live in paradise in both worlds.

As for your last question, everyone chooses good or evil with their own free will. Everyone chooses the path to heaven or hell with their own free will. That person is fully responsible and gets what he deserves. So Allah knows what you will choose even before He creates you. He knows whether you will be one of the good ones or one of the bad ones. He knows whether you deserve heaven or hell. Knowing this, He creates you and makes sure that you get what you deserve. That is one of the main purposes of creation, that everyone gets what they deserve. The fact that he created you knowing that you will go to paradise means that he created you for paradise. Or if he created you knowing that you will go to hell, it means that he created you for hell. And again, there is no intervention here, you choose heaven or hell with your own free will. And since Allah knows what you will choose even before He creates you, He has created you for that destination. He is creating you to get what you choose. No one is created bad or good, everyone is created at the same distance, at the same distance from good and evil. You always turn towards good or evil of your own free will.

So whatever you deserve, you are brought to the end you deserve in the most perfect way.

Peace
[url="https://twitter.com/Emre_1974tr"]https://twitter.com/Emre_1974tr[/url]

[url="http://emre1974tr.blogspot.com/"]http://emre1974tr.blogspot.com/[/url]

Fusion

Thank you for the explanation and I still have more questions please.

If God has knowledge that a certain individual will be good or evil? meaning He knows, then this simply means that the creation will of course exactly follows to act as God knew beforehand, and hence react along the same lines (being good or bad). You may call it a free will on the part of creation but sadly creations's actions will confirm to what God had knowledge about it (before even he/she was created).So where is the free will in true essence?

Suppose:
I have given two options A & B to choose from and I choose A.
God KNEW beforehand my choice of A
This means one thing only that the Choice of A is the only option that exists there because it is PREDESTINED by god for my case.
Hence my freewill is not a free will because am going to choose only what has already been predestined (A Choice).
Yes it is possible that the circumstances will be as such that I will be deluded into  believing that i am choosing option A of my own accord while fact of matter is, I could not have opted for option B under any chance..

As I understood, correct me please. that God is outside boundary of TIME. Meaning time is applicable to this universe and everything inside it.
So for me it make sense to say Yesterday I did that  and Tomorrow I am going to do so and so (while tomorrow has not come for me yet).
Now for god being outside of time, means everything for him is NOW. There is no tomorrow or yesterday for HIM in that sense. Hence know knows everything.  This can be the only way HE KNOWS EVERYTHING. Please your thoughts on this aspect as well?

salam.





Best Regards,

Aladin Azra

Allah has no knowledge about something that (still) doesn't exist, because that thing (which is not existing yet) is not Haqq, not real. He can conclude about many things, for all that behaves according to strict rules, as for example the Sun and the Moon are daa'ibeyn, meaning that these two behave as expected, meaning that if we learn about the laws of their movement we can predict things about them as eclipses or shape of the Moon - their movement is fully by the rules, so predictable as a result of a function of their movement. We can also make a robot or a game and create rules for the actions things will have. We can also calculate moves in chess game or in any other game which is fully limited by the rules. These all are constants.

If our lives are constants then we'll be robots. Note that Allah doesn't use edeb أدب (same root as daa'ibeyn) for humans, but sufis and others are trying to imply some strict rules of behavior on us, to turn us to robots.

Living creatures are variables in Allah's khalq, we have our free will, humans more then any other creature... Humans here are only free people, not enslaved people. So, Allah wants to know how we will behave, because HE DOESN'T HAVE KNOWLEDGE about that. When we chose and He allows that action He instantly knows, because that came to existence, it disclosed, is gayb. Things which come into existence are el-gayb and Allah has knowledge about all of them as soon as they come.



Ordo ab LICENTIA.

Fusion

Quote from: Aladin Azra on July 16, 2022, 08:10:52 AM
Allah has no knowledge about something that (still) doesn't exist, because that thing (which is not existing yet) is not Haqq, not real. He can conclude about many things, for all that behaves according to strict rules, as for example the Sun and the Moon are daa'ibeyn, meaning that these two behave as expected, meaning that if we learn about the laws of their movement we can predict things about them as eclipses or shape of the Moon - their movement is fully by the rules, so predictable as a result of a function of their movement. We can also make a robot or a game and create rules for the actions things will have. We can also calculate moves in chess game or in any other game which is fully limited by the rules. These all are constants.

If our lives are constants then we'll be robots. Note that Allah doesn't use edeb أدب (same root as daa'ibeyn) for humans, but sufis and others are trying to imply some strict rules of behavior on us, to turn us to robots.

Living creatures are variables in Allah's khalq, we have our free will, humans more then any other creature... Humans here are only free people, not enslaved people. So, Allah wants to know how we will behave, because HE DOESN'T HAVE KNOWLEDGE about that. When we chose and He allows that action He instantly knows, because that came to existence, it disclosed, is gayb. Things which come into existence are el-gayb and Allah has knowledge about all of them as soon as they come.

Very interesting viewpoint. I see two different versions of what God knows (yours and emre). So as per your statements, when God talks about in several verses that he knows Ghaib and he has knowledge of all things, the context should NOT be things which does NOT exist..or happened yet... am I right?
You use the sentence quote  "HE DOESN'THAVE KNOWLEDGE". this means that GOD does not have the capacity to know omniscience in which case Yes Freewill to humans makes sense. Otherwise omniscience and freewill are incompatible. However this may suggest that God's knowledge is imperfect and he can not know beforehand.... 

So I am still not sure what to conclude....

thanks
Best Regards,

Emre_1974tr

Quote from: Aladin Azra on July 16, 2022, 08:10:52 AM
Allah has no knowledge about something that (still) doesn't exist, because that thing (which is not existing yet) is not Haqq.

You are so far away from the Qur'an, taken aback, so far away from reason that you are even further away from Islam than a hadithist, a sectarian.

Good luck on the very long road ahead, my friend (by the way, I have some Balkan roots too).

May you one day move towards the truth.

By the way, let's say you don't read the Koran, it shouldn't be difficult to read the verses I gave in my article.

Peace

[url="https://twitter.com/Emre_1974tr"]https://twitter.com/Emre_1974tr[/url]

[url="http://emre1974tr.blogspot.com/"]http://emre1974tr.blogspot.com/[/url]

Emre_1974tr

Quote from: Fusion on July 16, 2022, 06:21:54 AM
Thank you for the explanation and I still have more questions please.

If God has knowledge that a certain individual will be good or evil? meaning He knows, then this simply means that the creation will of course exactly follows to act as God knew beforehand, and hence react along the same lines (being good or bad). You may call it a free will on the part of creation but sadly creations's actions will confirm to what God had knowledge about it (before even he/she was created).So where is the free will in true essence?

Suppose:
I have given two options A & B to choose from and I choose A.
God KNEW beforehand my choice of A
This means one thing only that the Choice of A is the only option that exists there because it is PREDESTINED by god for my case.
Hence my freewill is not a free will because am going to choose only what has already been predestined (A Choice).
Yes it is possible that the circumstances will be as such that I will be deluded into  believing that i am choosing option A of my own accord while fact of matter is, I could not have opted for option B under any chance..

As I understood, correct me please. that God is outside boundary of TIME. Meaning time is applicable to this universe and everything inside it.
So for me it make sense to say Yesterday I did that  and Tomorrow I am going to do so and so (while tomorrow has not come for me yet).
Now for god being outside of time, means everything for him is NOW. There is no tomorrow or yesterday for HIM in that sense. Hence know knows everything.  This can be the only way HE KNOWS EVERYTHING. Please your thoughts on this aspect as well?

salam.

Of course God is timeless and spaceless. He does not move in a time and space. He does not learn afterwards, He always knows.

He knows what we are going to do before we do it. I have explained this in pages and pages of detail.

You have the freedom to choose A or B, but you will choose A and God knows it. You have the freedom to do the opposite, but you will not do it. God knows that.

Leave that, now I know what you have written above, don't I? If I had the possibility to go back in time, I would have known beforehand that you would write these things. What you will do with your free will is known here. You have complete free will.

Peace
[url="https://twitter.com/Emre_1974tr"]https://twitter.com/Emre_1974tr[/url]

[url="http://emre1974tr.blogspot.com/"]http://emre1974tr.blogspot.com/[/url]

Fusion

Quote from: Emre_1974tr on July 16, 2022, 10:21:58 AM
Of course God is timeless and spaceless. He does not move in a time and space. He does not learn afterwards, He always knows.

He knows what we are going to do before we do it. I have explained this in pages and pages of detail.

You have the freedom to choose A or B, but you will choose A and God knows it. You have the freedom to do the opposite, but you will not do it. God knows that.

Leave that, now I know what you have written above, don't I? If I had the possibility to go back in time, I would have known beforehand that you would write these things. What you will do with your free will is known here. You have complete free will.

Peace

Can you please put a definition to "what is free will" ? am not asking literal meaning but an explanation from Islamic point of view?

Also is our free will influenced by GOD? meaning that GOD gives us "Fursa/Opportunities" to either go for or Good or Evil?  because In QURAN it says God does not guide the wrongdoers(Az Zalimeen) ?  However the question is if God Does not guide the wrongdoers then where is the concept of repent and guidance for wrongdoers to come back to right path???

Also is our free will influenced by Satan? and can we consider example of adam and eve eating from the tree as their own free will [but also influenced by Satan as God also confirms that in some verses that satan seduced them] in which case what category of FREE WILL Adama and Yve chose when that is influenced by Satan?

Also is there a free will which is neither influenced by God or Satan?

thanks
Best Regards,