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HELP NEEDED! Crisis of Faith: The Truthfullness of The Qur'an...

Started by LiberalGamer, March 23, 2022, 11:29:24 AM

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Noon waalqalami

Quote from: LiberalGamer on March 23, 2022, 11:29:24 AM
-fasting in the north pole,

peace,
2:185 شهر lunar cycle رمضن ramadan (heat after summer solstice)

the sun never sets at north pole in summer
exempt per instructions below never occurs

2:187 وكلوا and eat ye of واشربوا and drinks ye of حتى until ىتبىن is shown لكم for you الخىط the thread الابىض the white من from الخىط the thread الاسود the black من of الفجر the dawn ثم furthermore اتموا fulfill ye of الصىم the abstinence (fast) الى to الىل the night

multiple topics in a thread perhaps one at a time i.e. patience

103:1 والعصر and (by) the epoch/time
103:2 ان indeed الانسن the humankind لفى surely in خسر loss
103:3 الا except الذىن the ones امنوا believes they of وعملوا and work they of الصلحت the righteousness وتوصوا and exhort they of بالحق in the truth وتوصوا and exhort they of بالصبر in the patience



shukri

Quote from: LiberalGamer on March 23, 2022, 11:29:24 AM
Having a bit of a crisis of faith right now, the emotions have subsided a bit, so my writing might sound a bit too calm but I am still very much unsure of everything.

You are not alone.
I also had experience the same thing
I even starting from scratch as an atheist/agnostic

Quote from: LiberalGamer on March 23, 2022, 11:29:24 AM
Now, let's go back to the present day context, you can still
A) Believe that The Qur'an is from God
B) Believe that The Qur'an is from a Human in the 7th century

Yes, I believe that the Quran must be from God.
Why?
Because of the verses 74:30,31,35,36,37

74:30 Over it is nineteen
74:31 We appointed angels to be guardians of Hell, and we assigned their number (19)(1) to disturb the disbelievers,
(2) to convince the Christians and Jews (that this is a divine scripture),
(3) to strengthen the faith of the faithful,
(4) to remove all traces of doubt from the hearts of Christians, Jews, as well as the believers, and
(5) to expose those who harbor doubt in their hearts, and the disbelievers; they will say, "What did God mean by this allegory?" God thus sends astray whomever He wills, and guides whomever He wills. None knows the soldiers of your Lord except He. This is a reminder for the people.

74:35 This is one of the great (miracles).
74:36 A warning to the human race.
74:37 For those among you who wish to advance, or regress.

What is the Miracle of 19 stipulated in 74:30,35!"
The Quran is characterized by a unique phenomenon never found in any human authored book. Every element of the Quran is mathematically composed — the suras, the verses, the words, the number of certain letters, the number of words from the same root, the number and variety of divine names, the unique spelling of certain words, the absence or deliberate alteration of certain letters within certain words, and many other elements of the Quran besides its content. "

Simple facts: https://www.masjidtucson.org/quran/miracle/simplefacts.html

In surah al fatihah:
http://www.masjidtucson.org/publications/books/bp2/BeyondProbability_TheKey_AlFatehah.pdf?

In basmallah:
https://www.masjidtucson.org/publications/books/bp/bp.pdf?

The most comprehensive so far:
https://sites.google.com/site/evidenceofgod/math-miracle/19/math-miracle-in-a-nutshell
https://www.masjidtucson.org/publications/books/vp/contents.html?

Al Quran challenge for the people in doubt:
2:23 If you have any doubt regarding what we revealed to our servant, then produce one sura like these, and call upon your own witnesses against God, if you are truthful.

The challenge is here ... http://www.masjidtucson.org/publications/books/bp2/BeyondProbability_TheKey_AlFatehah.pdf?

Note 1:
The God's signature of 19 (74:30-37) is not only embedded in the Quran, but also stamped everywhere in the entire universe...
1) https://submission.org/Quran_chemistry_code_19.html
2) https://sites.google.com/site/evidenceofgod/golden-ratio-19
3) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X8xoIXNol18

41:53 We will show them our proofs in the horizons, and within themselves, until they realize that this is the truth. Is your Lord not sufficient as a witness of all things?

This God's signature of 19 proves that the Quran and everything in this universe belongs to One entity i.e. belongs to the owner of signature-19. There is God and the only One!

Note 2:
About other things you mentioned in your post,
I'm sorry, I'm not capable of discussing it here as my knowledge is minute...

17:85 They ask you about the revelation. Say, "The revelation comes from my Lord. The knowledge given to you is minute."

Note 3:
And if we really believe there is God and the Quran came from Him, that's a good start for our journey AND then we just sincerely leave it to our Lord as our teacher to capture the wisdom of His message in the Quran. God willing!

55:1 The Most Gracious
55:2 Teacher of the Quran.

Thank you.
"My Lord, pardon me if I have forgotten or erred"

Wakas

Quote from: shukri on March 27, 2022, 04:12:47 AM
74:30 Over it is nineteen

What is the Miracle of 19 stipulated in 74:30,35!"
The Quran is characterized by a unique phenomenon never found in any human authored book.

The "it" in 74:30 refers to a feminine object. "quran" is a masculine.
All information in my posts is correct to the best of my knowledge only and thus should not be taken as a fact. One should seek knowledge and verify: 17:36, 20:114, 35:28, 49:6, 58:11. [url="http://mypercept.co.uk/articles/"]My articles[/url]

[url="//www.studyquran.org"]www.studyQuran.org[/url]

shukri

Quote from: Wakas on March 27, 2022, 05:05:03 AM
The "it" in 74:30 refers to a feminine object. "quran" is a masculine.

Yeah, it's up to you bro.
The issue of the pro and con of verse 74:30 are the old story.
Anybody is entitled to his choice.
No need to rise here.

Note: Everything will come with pros and cons AND we are commanded by our Lord to choose the best one.
39:18 They are the ones who examine all words, then follow the best. These are the ones whom God has guided; these are the ones who possess intelligence.

Thank you.
"My Lord, pardon me if I have forgotten or erred"

shukri

Quote from: Wakas on March 27, 2022, 05:05:03 AM
The "it" in 74:30 refers to a feminine object. "quran" is a masculine.

Just to show an argument of the word "it".

Some say that the word "it" in verse 74:30 is referring to the word "Hell" (a feminine object) in verse 74:31
74:30 Over it (Hell) is nineteen.
74:31 We appointed angels to be guardians of Hell (it), and we assigned their number to disturb the disbelievers, to convince the Christians and Jews...

Anyway I do not know arabic and cannot say who is right, who is wrong.
BUT I think this argument is the best (in my opinion) to explain the word "it" in verse 74:30.

Thank you
"My Lord, pardon me if I have forgotten or erred"

jkhan

Quote from: shukri on March 27, 2022, 08:16:15 AM
Just to show an argument of the word "it".

Some say that the word "it" in verse 74:30 is referring to the word "Hell" (a feminine object) in verse 74:31
74:30 Over it (Hell) is nineteen.
74:31 We appointed angels to be guardians of Hell (it), and we assigned their number to disturb the disbelievers, to convince the Christians and Jews...

Anyway I do not know arabic and cannot say who is right, who is wrong.
BUT I think this argument is the best (in my opinion) to explain the word "it" in verse 74:30.

Thank you

Peace..
Of course the word IT refers to Hell.. And what is the issue here?
Nothing... If anyone has any issue let them detail rather than just rhetorically question..
19 is incontrovertiblly the guardian of Quran like the guardians of Hell are 19 ..Why Hell needs Guardians?  Are those who are living in it are powerful to escape from it?  But they can distort Hell. They can live as they want.. But guardians won't let it happen.. They ensure they deserve their punishment...
There is no grammar issue here.. They only think so.. But useless their effort is...
Iddah of 19 is a different matter... And Hell and 19 angels is different...  That's future... Is it happening? No..  But does the idda of 19 happens?  Yes... It does... It happens and and the predicted outcome / listed matters are also happening...

Further, I would like to ask this question again...
Would you anyone think that these verses of chapter 74:30-35 would have increased the faith of believers duirng the time of Mohamed?  If Yes why?  How could it have increased.. What is the reason behind it..?
Does these verses increase the faith of believers now?  Yes..  I don't if all people who believers, but whoever does believe in this has increased their faith... Including me..

good logic

Qoran  is masculine Revelation-Ayatan- is feminine.
GOD uses both  Qoran and revelation for Qoran:
16:101
Revelation-feminine-
When we substitute one revelation in place of another, and God is fully aware of what He reveals, they say, "You made this up!" Indeed, most of them do not know.
وَإِذا بَدَّلنا ءايَةً مَكانَ ءايَةٍ وَاللَّهُ أَعلَمُ بِما يُنَزِّلُ قالوا إِنَّما أَنتَ مُفتَرٍ بَل أَكثَرُهُم لا يَعلَمونَ
Or
16:02
Qoran-masculine
Say, "The Holy Spirit has brought it down from your Lord, truthfully, to assure those who believe, and to provide a beacon and good news for the submitters."
قُل نَزَّلَهُ روحُ القُدُسِ مِن رَبِّكَ بِالحَقِّ لِيُثَبِّتَ الَّذينَ ءامَنوا وَهُدًى وَبُشرىٰ لِلمُسلِمينَ

Over it-the revelation/Ayatian, feminine- is 19,   why not?.
GOD bless you.
Peace.
TOTAL LOYALTY TO GOD ALONE.   IN GOD I TRUST
38:65″ Say:? I warn you; There is no other god beside GOD, the One, the Supreme.?
[url="https://total-loyalty-to-god-alone.co.uk/?p=28"]https://total-loyalty-to-god-alone.co.uk/?p=28[/url]

Noon waalqalami

Quote from: good logic on March 27, 2022, 05:19:42 PM
Over it-the revelation/Ayatian, feminine- is 19,   why not?.

peace gl :nope: learn basic gender, numbers, and "context" is your friend!


4:82 افلا do so not ىتدبرون they reflecting القرن the Qur'an (masculine)
ولو and in case كان was من from عند with غىر other than الله the God
لوجدوا surely found they of فىه in it (m) اختلفا divergences كثىرا much of

17:101 تسع tisa/nine (m) اىت signs (f)
27:48 تسعه tisatu/group of nine (f) رهط chieftains (m)


24:7 علىه alayhi/upon him (m)
24:9 علىها alayha/upon her (f)

66:6 علىها alayha/over it (f) ملىكه controllers/angels (masculine)
74:30 علىها alayha/over it (f) تسعه group of nine (f) عشر ten (m) {group of nineteen (masculine)}


عَلَيْهَا تِسْعَةَ عَشَرَ جُنُودًا over her/it (f) group of nineteen soldiers (masculine)

عَلَيْهَا  تِسْعَ عَشْرةَ استاذةً over her/it (f) group of nineteen teachers (feminine)

good logic

And context is ignored in 74:31?.
We appointed angels to be guardians of Hell, and we assigned their number (19) (1) to disturb the disbelievers, (2) to convince the Christians and Jews (that this is a divine scripture), (3) to strengthen the faith of the faithful, (4) to remove all traces of doubt from the hearts of Christians, Jews, as well as the believers, and (5) to expose those who harbor doubt in their hearts, and the disbelievers; they will say, "What did God mean by this allegory?" God thus sends astray whomever He wills, and guides whomever He wills. None knows the soldiers of your Lord except He. This is a reminder for the people.
وَما جَعَلنا أَصحٰبَ النّارِ إِلّا مَلٰئِكَةً وَما جَعَلنا عِدَّتَهُم إِلّا فِتنَةً لِلَّذينَ كَفَروا لِيَستَيقِنَ الَّذينَ أوتُوا الكِتٰبَ وَيَزدادَ الَّذينَ ءامَنوا إيمٰنًا وَلا يَرتابَ الَّذينَ أوتُوا الكِتٰبَ وَالمُؤمِنونَ وَلِيَقولَ الَّذينَ فى قُلوبِهِم مَرَضٌ وَالكٰفِرونَ ماذا أَرادَ اللَّهُ بِهٰذا مَثَلًا كَذٰلِكَ يُضِلُّ اللَّهُ مَن يَشاءُ وَيَهدى مَن يَشاءُ وَما يَعلَمُ جُنودَ رَبِّكَ إِلّا هُوَ وَما هِىَ إِلّا ذِكرىٰ لِلبَشَرِ

So according to you, the group of 19 Angels /guardians of hell are strengthening your faith  and convincing the Jews and Christians that tQoran  is divine?

And  according to me, code/Mathematical composition/interlock of the Qoran is strengthening my faith and convincing some Jews and Christians that  Qoran  is divine.
And I have no idea how these Angels are doing these to anyone,, but I can witness and see the number composition clearly doing these to various folks.
So, to you your context and to me my context.
GOD bless you brother Noon.
Peace.
TOTAL LOYALTY TO GOD ALONE.   IN GOD I TRUST
38:65″ Say:? I warn you; There is no other god beside GOD, the One, the Supreme.?
[url="https://total-loyalty-to-god-alone.co.uk/?p=28"]https://total-loyalty-to-god-alone.co.uk/?p=28[/url]

good logic

Peace All.
There is more to come from the numerical structure of Qoran  There is more to discover.
Here are some verses from Qoran that cannot be ignored:

[Qoran 2:118] Those who possess no knowledge say, "If only God could speak to us, or some miracle could come to us!" Others before them have uttered similar utterances; their minds are similar. We do manifest the miracles for those who have attained certainty.

[Qoran 51:55] And remind, for the reminder benefits the believers.

[Qoran 87:9] Therefore, you shall remind; perhaps the reminder will benefit.
[Qoran 87:10] The reverent will take heed.
[Qoran 87:11] The wicked will avoid it.

What is the reminder?

The Qoran's Common Denominator(19 guardians of hell do not make sense?!!!)

[Qoran 74:30] Over it is nineteen.
[Qoran 74:31] We appointed angels to be guardians of Hell, and we assigned their number (19) (1) to disturb the disbelievers, (2) to convince the Christians and Jews (that this is a divine scripture), (3) to strengthen the faith of the faithful, (4) to remove all traces of doubt from the hearts of Christians, Jews, as well as the believers, and (5) to expose those who harbor doubt in their hearts, and the disbelievers; they will say, "What did God mean by this allegory?" God thus sends astray whomever He wills, and guides whomever He wills. None knows the soldiers of your Lord except He. This is a reminder for the people.
[Qoran 74:32] Absolutely, (I swear) by the moon.
[Qoran 74:33] And the night as it passes.
[Qoran 74:34] And the morning as it shines.

One of the Great Miracles
[Qoran 74:35] This is one of the great miracles.
[Qoran 74:36] A warning to the human race.
[Qoran 74:37] For those among you who wish to advance, or regress


[Qoran 15:9] Absolutely, we have revealed the reminder, and, absolutely, we will preserve it.*

The perfect preservation is a process that can only be achieved by putting the miracle into application. Some are in the state of denial, believing/ thinking that the preservation is complete per 15:9.
The Ultimate Miracle:
The Qoran's Mathematical Code.
[Qoran 2:106] When we abrogate any miracle, or cause it to be forgotten, we produce a better miracle, or at least an equal one. Do you not recognize the fact that God is Omnipotent?
( Surely you do not think this "ayatin" in here means verse/s?!!!)
*2:106 The Quran's mathematical miracle is perpetual & greater than previous miracles (34:45, 74:35). Like the Qoran itself, it confirms, consummates, and supersedes all previous miracles.

[Qoran 85:21] Indeed, it is a glorious Quran.
[Qoran 85:22] In a preserved master tablet.

The System
[Qoran 22:52] We did not send before you any messenger, nor a prophet, without having the devil interfere in his wishes. God then nullifies what the devil has done. God perfects His revelations. God is Omniscient, Most Wise.

* *22:52 Throughout this worldly test, Satan is allowed to present his point of view . This allows the people to make a choice between God's evidence and Satan's evidence. Satan's evidence is invariably based on lies. This system explains the fact that the devil's agents continuously come up with the most absurd lies, insults and accusations against every messenger (see 6:33-34, 8:30, 17:76-77, 27:70).

[Qoran 34:45] Those before them disbelieved, and even though they did not see one-tenth* of (the miracle) we have given to this generation, when they disbelieved My messengers, how severe was My retribution!

*34:45 The great miracles given to Moses and Jesus were limited in time and place; they were witnessed by a few people who happened to exist in that place at that time. But the mathematical miracle of the Qoran is perpetual (see 74:30-35)

It's God's supreme plan  to bless our generation and the generations to come, until the end of the world, with the divine, verifiable and a mathematical built-in structure within the Qoran's Arabic text. God s letters and words prove beyond doubt its divine authorship and authenticity.

Or do you have a better explanation for these verses and other verses like{46:10, 54:1-2, 44:13...etc}?

But of course the choice is there: believe or do not believe!

[Qoran 7:181] Among our creations, there are those who guide with the truth, and the truth renders them righteous.

[Qoran 2:42] Do not confound the truth with falsehood, nor shall you conceal the truth, knowingly.

[Qoran 5:77] Say, "O people of the scripture, do not transgress the limits of your religion beyond the truth, and do not follow the opinions of people who have gone astray, and have misled multitudes of people; they are far astray from the right path."

[Qoran 9:32] They want to put out God's light with their mouths, but God insists upon perfecting His light, in spite of the disbelievers.

But of course believing the message and following the straight path is the ultimate aim to unite all the believers.
GOD bles you all.
Peace.
TOTAL LOYALTY TO GOD ALONE.   IN GOD I TRUST
38:65″ Say:? I warn you; There is no other god beside GOD, the One, the Supreme.?
[url="https://total-loyalty-to-god-alone.co.uk/?p=28"]https://total-loyalty-to-god-alone.co.uk/?p=28[/url]