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Hijab khimar

Started by centi50, June 15, 2021, 09:24:26 AM

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jkhan

Quote from: reel on June 16, 2021, 09:13:40 PM
Adornment in Quran typically is called to fashionable wear and sparkling stuffs. See:

7:26 O children of Adam, We have bestowed upon you clothing to conceal your private parts and as adornment. But the clothing of righteousness - that is best. That is from the signs of Allah that perhaps they will remember.

28:79 So he came out before his people in his adornment. Those who desired the worldly life said, "Oh, would that we had like what was given to Qarun. Indeed, he is one of great fortune."

Middle path is the best. The other two extremes contribute to oppression and safety concern.

Peace Reel...

Everyone knows Arabic word Zeenath is adornment etc... But your suggestion that in these verses Zeenath means artificial adornment abd not natural adornment of women is definitely has the best befitting meaning... I never thought of it all these time... Did you know about this for long time sis?

I am really feeling satisfied about it... Isn't gorgeous two eyes and sexy lips of women not not arousing feelings of men.. Men knows.. Then why to keep opening it...  So..  I feel now that modest dress in public  but inside the women may wear all the adornmentts she wishes... But not expose them in public... But by chance anything exposed it doesn't matter.. That's probably what God means "aparent"... So ehrn they come home.. They can relax and be adorned with all adornment what a woman prefers to... So family members seeing her in glittering manner is not an issue... Women with best of dresses and jewelleries always look 10 times better than her natural beauty... So it doesn't befit in public specially  in streets.. But may befit for any functions.. Coz everyone wears.. For example in a sancturaly(masjid) ... Or in a function...  But in streets to show off while others wear normal cloth is not preferable and it is only puting herself at risk... Khamar has a point as well.. Covering chest has meaning.. Women in general the best jewellery is worn in her neck upto chest even the dress best part is around chest theor only all decorations are much applied.. Probably cover them in public..

That befits with the verse relaxing dress for those who passed age of childbirth and those who not willing to marry.. They can relax with dress then their artificial adornments are exposed.. But it doesn't matter.. One reason people (Men)  knows already they are old and not interested  marriage... But if they cover better..

So all in all what I understood in a nutshell is wear modest dress in general public not in functions.. But always be adorned it is women's freedom.. But don't expose unnecessarily except to certain group...
If daughter of anyone wear in style and with lovely jewelleries and be like a queen inside home, don't that make the rest of the family members happy.. They are the people allowed to see the Zeenath of her..

It is nothing to do with natural body parts.. Privates parts are always needed to be covered..
Thank you sister Reel.. I think for me it makes sense..
Let us die with guidance

reel

Quote from: jkhan on June 16, 2021, 11:49:50 PM
Peace Reel...

Everyone knows Arabic word Zeenath is adornment etc... But your suggestion that in these verses Zeenath means artificial adornment abd not natural adornment of women is definitely has the best befitting meaning... I never thought of it all these time... Did you know about this for long time sis?

lol, no, only after coming to Quran alone I took a deeper look into how the word adornment was used in other verses. At first, I focused only on the idea that the verse never mentions covering of hair.

Quote from: jkhan on June 16, 2021, 11:49:50 PMI am really feeling satisfied about it... Isn't gorgeous two eyes and sexy lips of women not not arousing feelings of men.. Men knows.. Then why to keep opening it... 

You are 100% right. I guess that's why, in the end, they came up with this:

It was narrated from 'Abd-Allaah that the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: "The woman is 'awrah and when she goes out the Shaytaan gets his hopes up."

(Narrated by al-Tirmidhi, 1173).

Al-Albaani said in Saheeh al-Tirmidhi (936): It is saheeh.



QuoteSo..  I feel now that modest dress in public  but inside the women may wear all the adornmentts she wishes... But not expose them in public... But by chance anything exposed it doesn't matter.. That's probably what God means "aparent"... So ehrn they come home.. They can relax and be adorned with all adornment what a woman prefers to... So family members seeing her in glittering manner is not an issue... Women with best of dresses and jewelleries always look 10 times better than her natural beauty... So it doesn't befit in public specially  in streets.. But may befit for any functions.. Coz everyone wears.. For example in a sancturaly(masjid) ... Or in a function...  But in streets to show off while others wear normal cloth is not preferable and it is only puting herself at risk... Khamar has a point as well.. Covering chest has meaning.. Women in general the best jewellery is worn in her neck upto chest even the dress best part is around chest theor only all decorations are much applied.. Probably cover them in public..

That befits with the verse relaxing dress for those who passed age of childbirth and those who not willing to marry.. They can relax with dress then their artificial adornments are exposed.. But it doesn't matter.. One reason people (Men)  knows already they are old and not interested  marriage... But if they cover better..

So all in all what I understood in a nutshell is wear modest dress in general public not in functions.. But always be adorned it is women's freedom.. But don't expose unnecessarily except to certain group...
If daughter of anyone wear in style and with lovely jewelleries and be like a queen inside home, don't that make the rest of the family members happy.. They are the people allowed to see the Zeenath of her..

It is nothing to do with natural body parts.. Privates parts are always needed to be covered..
Thank you sister Reel.. I think for me it makes sense..

You're welcome.  :)

But thanks to you too for the rational details. They are needed.
"I fear that nothing will lead me to hell more than ḥadīth"-Hadith collector: Shu'ba Ibn al-Ḥajjāj

Wakas

The translation of 33:59 has been changed on the site now, to "woman" instead of "wives".
All information in my posts is correct to the best of my knowledge only and thus should not be taken as a fact. One should seek knowledge and verify: 17:36, 20:114, 35:28, 49:6, 58:11. [url="http://mypercept.co.uk/articles/"]My articles[/url]

[url="//www.studyquran.org"]www.studyQuran.org[/url]

jkhan

Quote from: Wakas on June 18, 2021, 07:22:13 AM
The translation of 33:59 has been changed on the site now, to "woman" instead of "wives".

WomEn to be exact :handshake:
Let us die with guidance

centi50

Quote from: reel on June 16, 2021, 09:13:40 PM
Adornment in Quran typically is called to fashionable wear and sparkling stuffs. See:

7:26 O children of Adam, We have bestowed upon you clothing to conceal your private parts and as adornment. But the clothing of righteousness - that is best. That is from the signs of Allah that perhaps they will remember.

28:79 So he came out before his people in his adornment. Those who desired the worldly life said, "Oh, would that we had like what was given to Qarun. Indeed, he is one of great fortune."

Middle path is the best. The other two extremes contribute to oppression and safety concern.

Salam to all

What is the clothing of righteousness?how does it look like

God bless all

Noon waalqalami

Quote from: reel on June 16, 2021, 09:13:40 PM
Adornment in Quran typically is called to fashionable wear and sparkling stuffs. See:

7:26 O children of Adam, We have bestowed upon you clothing to conceal your private parts and as adornment. But the clothing of righteousness - that is best. That is from the signs of Allah that perhaps they will remember.

28:79 So he came out before his people in his adornment. Those who desired the worldly life said, "Oh, would that we had like what was given to Qarun. Indeed, he is one of great fortune."

Middle path is the best. The other two extremes contribute to oppression and safety concern.

Quote from: centi50 on June 19, 2021, 07:03:10 AM
What is the clothing of righteousness?how does it look like

peace,

not about expensive jewelry or Gucci clothes; use context.

likewise, issues with translations comparing different words.

7:26 ورىشا warishan/and fashion of ولباس and garment التقوى the righteous (e.g. pure mindset)
7:31 ىبنى O children ادم Adam خذوا take ye of زىنتكم zinatakum/adornment (opulence; clothes, etc.) yours

24:31
او or التبعىن the attendants غىر other than اولى holders الاربه the desire من from الرجل the menfolk
او or الطفل the young الذىن the ones لم not ىظهروا cognizant they of على on عورات private النسا the womenfolk
ولا and not ىضربن striketh they بارجلهن with feet theirs لىعلم to revealed ما what ىخفىن hided they من from زىنتهن zinatihinna/adornment (i.e. sexual opulence) theirs (f/p)

28:79 فخرج so came out على upon قومه folk his فى in زىنته zinatihi/adornment (opulence) his

33:28 ىاىها O you النبى the prophet قل say لازوجك to spouses your
ان if كنتن be you تردن desire الحىه the life الدنىا the world وزىنتها wazinataha/and adornment (opulence) its

reel

Quote from: Noon waalqalami on June 19, 2021, 05:36:01 PM


24:31
او or التبعىن the attendants غىر other than اولى holders الاربه the desire من from الرجل the menfolk
او or الطفل the young الذىن the ones لم not ىظهروا cognizant they of على on عورات private النسا the womenfolk
ولا and not ىضربن striketh they بارجلهن with feet theirs لىعلم to revealed ما what ىخفىن hided they من from زىنتهن zinatihinna/adornment (i.e. sexual opulence) theirs (f/p)


Sexual opulence is a metaphor. There is actually a technical term in fashion called feminine adornment. Usage:

QuoteConcern about the adornment of the feminine body, that is dress, jewellery, cosmetics and other adornments, already appears in the Roman period and it is a recurrent theme in Christian texts during the institutionalisation of Christianity.

Hesiodin his Theogony and in Works and Days makes a suggestive description of Pandorain which her ornamentation is emphasised. Pandorais moulded by Hephaestus and adorned by Athena. The latter adorns her with silver clothing, an intelligent veil, garlands of flowers and a crown made by Hephaestus. This is the first characteristic of Pandora, adornment. The second, related to the first, is falsity. Zeussends Pandorato Epimetheus as a trick because Prometheus, brother of Epimetheus, had stolen the divine Olympic fire to give it to men. Pandora, symbol of the uncontrolled woman and, therefore, feared, opens the box or jar (píthos) that contains the evils of the world.

Later, Tertullian, who lived between the second and third centuries, in De cultu feminarum, states that adornments are suitable for the woman, Eve, who is condemned and is dead, to cover over her death and to dress her up to give splendour to her funeral. The medieval treatises De ornatu also speak on this subject, as well as other texts, amongst them medieval and modern legal texts, that is, the sumptuary laws.http://www.ub.edu/duoda/diferencia/html/en/secundario6.html

Quote from: centi50 on June 19, 2021, 07:03:10 AM
Salam to all

What is the clothing of righteousness?how does it look like

God bless all

Being righteous both inside and outside.
"I fear that nothing will lead me to hell more than ḥadīth"-Hadith collector: Shu'ba Ibn al-Ḥajjāj

Abdul-Hadi

Greetings and Peace, all  :group:

Just felt like adding this to the conversation.

7:32 Say: "Who has made forbidden the nice things that God has brought forth for His servants and the good provisions?" Say: "They are meant for those who believe during this worldly life, and they will be exclusive for them on the Day of Resurrection." It is such that We explain the revelations for those who know.

ALLAH knows best.

:peace:

~Abdul-Hadi

centi50

Quote from: reel on June 21, 2021, 03:06:21 AM
Sexual opulence is a metaphor. There is actually a technical term in fashion called feminine adornment. Usage:

Being righteous both inside and outside.

Salam reel,

How does the righteous garment look like

Is it like Arab thobe? Or pants and shirt long sleeves for men

For women can it be skirt long upto ankles or how. Ontop of your clothes for women then the jibab is another layer of clothes?

God bless

reel

Quote from: centi50 on June 26, 2021, 01:07:19 PM
Salam reel,

How does the righteous garment look like

Or pants and shirt long sleeves for men

For women can it be skirt long upto ankles or how.

God bless

Aren't you a Quran follower? I thought we are all here for righteousness.

Btw, the verses in question are about protection during specific times. God isnt prescribing some fashion for reward. Maybe thats why he treates righteousness as a separate thing?

QuoteIs it like Arab thobe?

Ontop of your clothes for women then the jibab is another layer of clothes?


Sure dress up like that if you are going to middle east and staying there for a long time. You dont wanna later deal with asthma, cataracts, severe sun burns, abnormal skin thickening, grey hair.....too many to mention!
"I fear that nothing will lead me to hell more than ḥadīth"-Hadith collector: Shu'ba Ibn al-Ḥajjāj