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Surrogacy

Started by Sania Haque, December 17, 2020, 06:36:29 AM

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Sania Haque

I tried to search posts on this topic but I wasn't able to find anything. Sectarians prohibit it for weird reasons which I personally donot find convincing. From the pov of Quran, is it ethically wrong ? To some extent I can see that if it's traditional surrogacy where surrogate is the biological mother of the child and her egg is combined with the intended father's or donor's sperm and the donor and the surrogate are not married but what about gestational surrogacy (aka the Host method) in which the surrogate becomes pregnant via embryo transfer with a child of which she is not the biological mother ?

Hadithians prohibit even the traditional surrogacy if the biological mother is not married to the father and give reasons like it will create a lineage problem. But I donot see how it's going to create any problem. It's the same as adopting and even it is same has a husband having a child from second wife ( this has been practiced since ages ). They say that this is equivalent to zina  since the surrogate is using the sperm of a person who is not her husband but how is fusion of two gametes can be equal to zina I donot see their logic here tbh. I didn't know Allah prohibited zina because the couple are producing illegitimate babies. Hearing their argument just killed my brain cells but I would like a Quranic input here. 

As for gestational surrogacy they quote the verse in Surah al-Mujadalah (58: 2) where the Quran says:

"...their mothers are only those who conceived them and gave birth to them (waladna hum)."

As i said to some extent i understood that traditional surrogacy could be wrong if the donor is not surrogate's husband but I didn't find anything wrong with gestational surrogacy. But now they quote this verse and I dont know what to think. I dont want to blindly believe them. Is it really true that Quran doesn't consider the egg donor as a biological mom, but a woman who carried the baby despite not sharing any genetic ties with baby ? I do feel that they might have twisted the verse as the whole ayah goes like this

Those of you who ˹sinfully˺ divorce their wives by comparing them to their mothers ˹should know that˺ their wives are in no way their mothers. None can be their mothers except those who gave birth to them. What they say is certainly detestable and false. Yet Allah is truly Ever-Pardoning, All-Forgiving.

But I am not sure. I think I am not being able to get out of my sectarian mindset of trying to find the the haramness/halalness of everything. my rational side says this is utter bs and surrogacy is definitely not forbidden. My brainwashed side says to even confirm whether breathing is haram or not (jk). What's your opinion on this ?

PS bit off topic but how do you delete a post/reply here

jkhan

Quote from: Sania Haque on December 17, 2020, 06:36:29 AM
I tried to search posts on this topic but I wasn't able to find anything. Sectarians prohibit it for weird reasons which I personally donot find convincing. From the pov of Quran, is it ethically wrong ? To some extent I can see that if it's traditional surrogacy where surrogate is the biological mother of the child and her egg is combined with the intended father's or donor's sperm and the donor and the surrogate are not married but what about gestational surrogacy (aka the Host method) in which the surrogate becomes pregnant via embryo transfer with a child of which she is not the biological mother ?

Hadithians prohibit even the traditional surrogacy if the biological mother is not married to the father and give reasons like it will create a lineage problem. But I donot see how it's going to create any problem. It's the same as adopting and even it is same has a husband having a child from second wife ( this has been practiced since ages ). They say that this is equivalent to zina  since the surrogate is using the sperm of a person who is not her husband but how is fusion of two gametes can be equal to zina I donot see their logic here tbh. I didn't know Allah prohibited zina because the couple are producing illegitimate babies. Hearing their argument just killed my brain cells but I would like a Quranic input here. 

As for gestational surrogacy they quote the verse in Surah al-Mujadalah (58: 2) where the Quran says:

"...their mothers are only those who conceived them and gave birth to them (waladna hum)."

As i said to some extent i understood that traditional surrogacy could be wrong if the donor is not surrogate's husband but I didn't find anything wrong with gestational surrogacy. But now they quote this verse and I dont know what to think. I dont want to blindly believe them. Is it really true that Quran doesn't consider the egg donor as a biological mom, but a woman who carried the baby despite not sharing any genetic ties with baby ? I do feel that they might have twisted the verse as the whole ayah goes like this

Those of you who ˹sinfully˺ divorce their wives by comparing them to their mothers ˹should know that˺ their wives are in no way their mothers. None can be their mothers except those who gave birth to them. What they say is certainly detestable and false. Yet Allah is truly Ever-Pardoning, All-Forgiving.

But I am not sure. I think I am not being able to get out of my sectarian mindset of trying to find the the haramness/halalness of everything. my rational side says this is utter bs and surrogacy is definitely not forbidden. My brainwashed side says to even confirm whether breathing is haram or not (jk). What's your opinion on this ?

PS bit off topic but how do you delete a post/reply here
Peace everyone..

First of all Sania, let's find out the root cause, WHY a person or persons go for the option of surrogacy OR surrogate mother?

Possible options

1 ... Wedded couple but no child naturally
2... Wedded couple no child coz of some unfortunate reasons/incidents..
3... Anyone who wishes to adopt a child of his own sperm without marriage.. Etc etc..

Also possible option for a woman willingly agrees to be a surrogate mother ..

1... Money for her immediate reasons
2.. Business addicted
3.. Lost her respect/ chastity due to some unfortunate reasons or intentionally..
4.... Never loves to grow children of her own.. Etc etc..

Well note the suffering of Maryam she went through in her society without a father even though it was God's will.. .. So,  It clearly indicates no chaste woman will voluntarily accept any such act to bear a child of another and in the end doesn't belong to her legally.. So only a woman who has no self respect to her chastity can contribute to such act... Do you agree as a woman to my statement above? It not explain why..

Let's see what Quran says.. 42:49-50 "..... .... He creates what he wills. He gives to whom He wills female [children], and He gives to whom He wills males. Or He makes them [both] males and females, and He renders whom He wills barren. Indeed, He is Knowing and Competent.

Now God says He Wills He grants... So that's God's will.. So being barren is God's will or having children...
So.. When one is barren and if still they Get child that means it was not the will of God... Baby cannot be a wedded couple's  child if surrogate mother gives birth.. Coz genuinely God rendered her barren... Well..well here she has a child and rejoicing while God rendered her barren. Did God grant the couple in fact a child?  No... That's totally against ethical way and only through unethical way it can be achieved... Against God's will and grant.. It is like God didn't give one riches but he opted to gain riches in unethical ways and here he has riches.. Does it mean Did God give riches to him?  No..
Unethical ways evil ways are always evil.. God doesn't prohibit each and everything in Quran but God never recommend evil ways.. Further God always says to us follow the best in Quran and explore QURAN... So for certain matters of life we have to penetrate with exploration in quran and take the best to follow...

Without an unchaste woman you will never have that baby if your wife is barren... Not only that surrogate mother is unchaste but she has to be heartless to give a baby whome she bore for 9 months to couples every year.. Selling her womb for petty price... Like selling ones own organ for price.. Example kidney ..
If God rendered your wife barren why you reject God's decision?  Why not pray for ages for a child .. Losing hope is not the sign of believer...

Further adoption is not at all comparable with this act.. Coz adopted child is not ones biological child at all.. That's  very manifest within Quran.. you may know the child's parents or not while adopting.. No harm.. Allowed.. Ethical.. .
Reasons for adoption is pure...
1... From parents who have many children who is finding unable to bring them up... So willingly give for adoption.. Still they are the biological parents..
2...from orphanage
3... From unknown sources... Left on public places.. Etc etc..
These make perfect sense.. Purely ethical and quranically allowed even directly.. Under the conditions no adopted child is biological child of anyone.. Call them by their biological parents name.. Though they live with adopted parents.. So simple..
Your view of husband having second marriage is no way near to the subject surrogacy.. Use your wits pls..

God allows breastfeeding by mothers other than the child/ren...so blood of another goes into another's body.. So donating blood can be much acceptable based on that rendition in quran .. That's my take..
But donating sperm or surrogate mother is not ethical.. But evil... If one donate sperm coz of his donation of sperm many a babies are born but he is unaware.. That's so unethical... Unnecessary reproduction going against nature and agsinst willingness of God.. Everything happens according to the will of God but not with willingness of God..

Satan promised he will corrupt the nature... So it's only that he can corrupt nature if one follows Satan.. ... It clearly shows that such evil act is prompted by Satan making it seem perfectly alright.. Whoever follows Satan he misguides you..

[url="https://awakenwithalquran.wordpress.com/"]https://awakenwithalquran.wordpress.com/[/url]

Sania Haque

Quote from: jkhan on December 17, 2020, 11:00:35 AM
Peace everyone..

First of all Sania, let's find out the root cause, WHY a person or persons go for the option of surrogacy OR surrogate mother?

Possible options

1 ... Wedded couple but no child naturally
2... Wedded couple no child coz of some unfortunate reasons/incidents..
3... Anyone who wishes to adopt a child of his own sperm without marriage.. Etc etc..

Also possible option for a woman willingly agrees to be a surrogate mother ..

1... Money for her immediate reasons
2.. Business addicted
3.. Lost her respect/ chastity due to some unfortunate reasons or intentionally..
4.... Never loves to grow children of her own.. Etc etc..

Well note the suffering of Maryam she went through in her society without a father even though it was God's will.. .. So,  It clearly indicates no chaste woman will voluntarily accept any such act to bear a child of another and in the end doesn't belong to her legally.. So only a woman who has no self respect to her chastity can contribute to such act... Do you agree as a woman to my statement above? It not explain why..

Let's see what Quran says.. 42:49-50 "..... .... He creates what he wills. He gives to whom He wills female [children], and He gives to whom He wills males. Or He makes them [both] males and females, and He renders whom He wills barren. Indeed, He is Knowing and Competent.

Now God says He Wills He grants... So that's God's will.. So being barren is God's will or having children...
So.. When one is barren and if still they Get child that means it was not the will of God... Baby cannot be a wedded couple's  child if surrogate mother gives birth.. Coz genuinely God rendered her barren... Well..well here she has a child and rejoicing while God rendered her barren. Did God grant the couple in fact a child?  No... That's totally against ethical way and only through unethical way it can be achieved... Against God's will and grant.. It is like God didn't give one riches but he opted to gain riches in unethical ways and here he has riches.. Does it mean Did God give riches to him?  No..
Unethical ways evil ways are always evil.. God doesn't prohibit each and everything in Quran but God never recommend evil ways.. Further God always says to us follow the best in Quran and explore QURAN... So for certain matters of life we have to penetrate with exploration in quran and take the best to follow...

Without an unchaste woman you will never have that baby if your wife is barren... Not only that surrogate mother is unchaste but she has to be heartless to give a baby whome she bore for 9 months to couples every year.. Selling her womb for petty price... Like selling ones own organ for price.. Example kidney ..
If God rendered your wife barren why you reject God's decision?  Why not pray for ages for a child .. Losing hope is not the sign of believer...

Further adoption is not at all comparable with this act.. Coz adopted child is not ones biological child at all.. That's  very manifest within Quran.. you may know the child's parents or not while adopting.. No harm.. Allowed.. Ethical.. .
Reasons for adoption is pure...
1... From parents who have many children who is finding unable to bring them up... So willingly give for adoption.. Still they are the biological parents..
2...from orphanage
3... From unknown sources... Left on public places.. Etc etc..
These make perfect sense.. Purely ethical and quranically allowed even directly.. Under the conditions no adopted child is biological child of anyone.. Call them by their biological parents name.. Though they live with adopted parents.. So simple..
Your view of husband having second marriage is no way near to the subject surrogacy.. Use your wits pls..

God allows breastfeeding by mothers other than the child/ren...so blood of another goes into another's body.. So donating blood can be much acceptable based on that rendition in quran .. That's my take..
But donating sperm or surrogate mother is not ethical.. But evil... If one donate sperm coz of his donation of sperm many a babies are born but he is unaware.. That's so unethical... Unnecessary reproduction going against nature and agsinst willingness of God.. Everything happens according to the will of God but not with willingness of God..

Satan promised he will corrupt the nature... So it's only that he can corrupt nature if one follows Satan.. ... It clearly shows that such evil act is prompted by Satan making it seem perfectly alright.. Whoever follows Satan he misguides you..

Why do you have to always assume the worse ? Do you realize that family members also lend their wombs? There are mothers who lend their wombs to their daughters. There are sisters who lend their wombs to their siblings. yoou cannot lump everyone in the same category. I am not asking for a woman's character certificate here, I dont care why other choose to do something, that's their life, I am not in their shoes to judge them. Some people are desperate and only Allah knows what's going in their life. Now so I am asking what's your opinion on prosthetic body parts ? Allah chose to make them disabled so they should live with it. That can be your opinion but that's not mine.. Allah rendered that person disabled but well well they are going against Allah's plan, definitely they are inviting Allah's wrath. That is just unethical.  If God rendered you disabled why dont you just ask for sabr from Allah. Alternative options doesn't mean someone is going against Allah.I definitely don't think that if a person gets a prosthetic, even though God made him disabled, they are going against the will of Allah. And I definitely donot agree with your statement.  The society in which Maryam as lived is far more different than the society we are living. Anyways yours and mine definition of evil definitely differs. Thanks for your input. Peace, brother.

Sania Haque

Quote from: Sania Haque on December 17, 2020, 11:39:11 AM
Why do you have to always assume the worse ? Do you realize that family members also lend their wombs? There are mothers who lend their wombs to their daughters. There are sisters who lend their wombs to their siblings. yoou cannot lump everyone in the same category. I am not asking for a woman's character certificate here, I dont care why other choose to do something, that's their life, I am not in their shoes to judge them. Some people are desperate and only Allah knows what's going in their life. Now so I am asking what's your opinion on prosthetic body parts ? Allah chose to make them disabled so they should live with it. That can be your opinion but that's not mine.. Allah rendered that person disabled but well well they are going against Allah's plan, definitely they are inviting Allah's wrath. That is just unethical.  If God rendered you disabled why dont you just ask for sabr from Allah. Alternative options doesn't mean someone is going against Allah.I definitely don't think that if a person gets a prosthetic, even though God made him disabled, they are going against the will of Allah. And I definitely donot agree with your statement.  The society in which Maryam as lived is far more different than the society we are living. Anyways yours and mine definition of evil definitely differs. Thanks for your input. Peace, brother.

Secondly, Maryam as suffered the humiliation Because the society thought she committed zina. She was a chaste woman and people accused her of being with a man. I donot expect someone like yourself to twist the story of Maryam as to support your opinion. As for saying breastfeeding involves transfer of blood, i dont know if you mean it in literal sense or you actually mean WBCs.

Amra94

Quote from: jkhan on December 17, 2020, 11:00:35 AM
Peace everyone..

First of all Sania, let's find out the root cause, WHY a person or persons go for the option of surrogacy OR surrogate mother?

Possible options

1 ... Wedded couple but no child naturally
2... Wedded couple no child coz of some unfortunate reasons/incidents..
3... Anyone who wishes to adopt a child of his own sperm without marriage.. Etc etc..

Also possible option for a woman willingly agrees to be a surrogate mother ..

1... Money for her immediate reasons
2.. Business addicted
3.. Lost her respect/ chastity due to some unfortunate reasons or intentionally..
4.... Never loves to grow children of her own.. Etc etc..

Well note the suffering of Maryam she went through in her society without a father even though it was God's will.. .. So,  It clearly indicates no chaste woman will voluntarily accept any such act to bear a child of another and in the end doesn't belong to her legally.. So only a woman who has no self respect to her chastity can contribute to such act... Do you agree as a woman to my statement above? It not explain why..

Let's see what Quran says.. 42:49-50 "..... .... He creates what he wills. He gives to whom He wills female [children], and He gives to whom He wills males. Or He makes them [both] males and females, and He renders whom He wills barren. Indeed, He is Knowing and Competent.

Now God says He Wills He grants... So that's God's will.. So being barren is God's will or having children...
So.. When one is barren and if still they Get child that means it was not the will of God... Baby cannot be a wedded couple's  child if surrogate mother gives birth.. Coz genuinely God rendered her barren... Well..well here she has a child and rejoicing while God rendered her barren. Did God grant the couple in fact a child?  No... That's totally against ethical way and only through unethical way it can be achieved... Against God's will and grant.. It is like God didn't give one riches but he opted to gain riches in unethical ways and here he has riches.. Does it mean Did God give riches to him?  No..
Unethical ways evil ways are always evil.. God doesn't prohibit each and everything in Quran but God never recommend evil ways.. Further God always says to us follow the best in Quran and explore QURAN... So for certain matters of life we have to penetrate with exploration in quran and take the best to follow...

Without an unchaste woman you will never have that baby if your wife is barren... Not only that surrogate mother is unchaste but she has to be heartless to give a baby whome she bore for 9 months to couples every year.. Selling her womb for petty price... Like selling ones own organ for price.. Example kidney ..
If God rendered your wife barren why you reject God's decision?  Why not pray for ages for a child .. Losing hope is not the sign of believer...

Further adoption is not at all comparable with this act.. Coz adopted child is not ones biological child at all.. That's  very manifest within Quran.. you may know the child's parents or not while adopting.. No harm.. Allowed.. Ethical.. .
Reasons for adoption is pure...
1... From parents who have many children who is finding unable to bring them up... So willingly give for adoption.. Still they are the biological parents..
2...from orphanage
3... From unknown sources... Left on public places.. Etc etc..
These make perfect sense.. Purely ethical and quranically allowed even directly.. Under the conditions no adopted child is biological child of anyone.. Call them by their biological parents name.. Though they live with adopted parents.. So simple..
Your view of husband having second marriage is no way near to the subject surrogacy.. Use your wits pls..

God allows breastfeeding by mothers other than the child/ren...so blood of another goes into another's body.. So donating blood can be much acceptable based on that rendition in quran .. That's my take..
But donating sperm or surrogate mother is not ethical.. But evil... If one donate sperm coz of his donation of sperm many a babies are born but he is unaware.. That's so unethical... Unnecessary reproduction going against nature and agsinst willingness of God.. Everything happens according to the will of God but not with willingness of God..

Satan promised he will corrupt the nature... So it's only that he can corrupt nature if one follows Satan.. ... It clearly shows that such evil act is prompted by Satan making it seem perfectly alright.. Whoever follows Satan he misguides you..
Yes like you said God makes some women barren, doing unnatural things like surrogacy is going against God's will. And there are so many orphans, if you really want a child adopt one. Quran sure talks a lot about caring for orphans.

Sania Haque

Quote from: Sania Haque on December 17, 2020, 06:36:29 AM
I tried to search posts on this topic but I wasn't able to find anything. Sectarians prohibit it for weird reasons which I personally donot find convincing. From the pov of Quran, is it ethically wrong ? To some extent I can see that if it's traditional surrogacy where surrogate is the biological mother of the child and her egg is combined with the intended father's or donor's sperm and the donor and the surrogate are not married but what about gestational surrogacy (aka the Host method) in which the surrogate becomes pregnant via embryo transfer with a child of which she is not the biological mother ?

Hadithians prohibit even the traditional surrogacy if the biological mother is not married to the father and give reasons like it will create a lineage problem. But I donot see how it's going to create any problem. It's the same as adopting and even it is same has a husband having a child from second wife ( this has been practiced since ages ). They say that this is equivalent to zina  since the surrogate is using the sperm of a person who is not her husband but how is fusion of two gametes can be equal to zina I donot see their logic here tbh. I didn't know Allah prohibited zina because the couple are producing illegitimate babies. Hearing their argument just killed my brain cells but I would like a Quranic input here. 

As for gestational surrogacy they quote the verse in Surah al-Mujadalah (58: 2) where the Quran says:

"...their mothers are only those who conceived them and gave birth to them (waladna hum)."

As i said to some extent i understood that traditional surrogacy could be wrong if the donor is not surrogate's husband but I didn't find anything wrong with gestational surrogacy. But now they quote this verse and I dont know what to think. I dont want to blindly believe them. Is it really true that Quran doesn't consider the egg donor as a biological mom, but a woman who carried the baby despite not sharing any genetic ties with baby ? I do feel that they might have twisted the verse as the whole ayah goes like this

Those of you who ˹sinfully˺ divorce their wives by comparing them to their mothers ˹should know that˺ their wives are in no way their mothers. None can be their mothers except those who gave birth to them. What they say is certainly detestable and false. Yet Allah is truly Ever-Pardoning, All-Forgiving.

But I am not sure. I think I am not being able to get out of my sectarian mindset of trying to find the the haramness/halalness of everything. my rational side says this is utter bs and surrogacy is definitely not forbidden. My brainwashed side says to even confirm whether breathing is haram or not (jk). What's your opinion on this ?

PS bit off topic but how do you delete a post/reply here

Okay I would like to make one correction here, I do want your opinion but which is based on solid proofs from Quran and not on circular reasoning. I hold a strong opinion that surrogacy is very much permissible in Islam. If not for the verse I mentioned I wouldn't even be asking this question. The other options like fostering/adoption better ? Yes. But that doesn't mean that other ways are prohibited if it is better and different from the traditional ways. As of now I really donot pay any heed to conservative Quranist's opinions. Their beliefs and way of reasoning mirrors the sectarians and there's nothing wrong with it but I have spent my whole life trying to view Quran through circular reasonings, now when I am trying to re discover Quran I want to use more logic now. Human opinions matter nothing at all in the face of Quranic evidences. I really dont care what others find unethical, I want some kind Quranic evidences that at least makes me ponder upon on it ( for example the one i mentioned in my original post ), i dont want personal deductions and reasoning when the message of some of the verses is obviously clear. Surrogacy does not create problem with lineage because obviously we know who's genes are being contributed. There is no freaking  way surrogacy = sexual intercourse and whoever says that then I am sorry i really feel like you are functioning on one brain cell ( no offense ). From my understanding of the verse, Allah is trying to say that no one is your mother except who gave birth to you because obviously you share her genes. But since I have not extensively studied the Quran properly and I have just started reading it from the very start, I want to be sure before accepting my view. Thanks, peace

Noon waalqalami

peace, natural/surrogate woman who gives birth or breastfeeds is considered a mother.

Gotthelf Bergstrasse Archive: Cairo, National Library: qāf 47
606-652, CE (95.4%) [¹⁴C-dating from ms.or.fol. 4313]
https://corpuscoranicum.de/handschriften/index/sure/4/vers/23?handschrift=73



31:14 ووصينا and instruct we of الانسن the humankind بولديه with parents his/said person حملته carry she him امه mother his وهنا weakness of علي on وهن weakness وفصاله and separation his في in (within <= less than or equal to) عامين year two ان that اشكر be thankful لي to me ولولديك and to parents your الي to me المصير the destiny

46:15 ووصينا and instruct we of الانسن the humankind بولديه with parents his/said person حسنا best/goodness of حملته carry she him امه mother his كرها dislike of/unwillingly ووضعته and gave birth him كرها dislike of/unwillingly وحمله and carry his وفصاله and separation his ثلثون thirty شهرا lunar cycle of حتي until اذا when of بلغ reach اشده vigor his وبلغ and reach اربعين group of forty سنه year/timeframe قال said رب lord اوزعني grants me ان that اشكر I thank نعمتك favor your التي the one انعمت favors thou علي upon me وعلي and upon ولدي parents mine وان and that اعمل I work صلحا righteous of ترضه please you واصلح and reconciles لي for me في in ذريتي progeny mine اني indeed I تبت turn (repent) اليك to you واني and indeed I من of المسلمين those acquiescent


Thus regardless conception method: same calculations apply min natural survival ~5 months.

p = pregnancy time/carry his (variable)
w = weaning time/separation his (variable)
w <= 730 days {31:14 (2 x 365 days = 730 days i.e. <= 2 solar years)}

870 days – p <= 730 days {46:15 30 x (lunar months / day) = 870 days}
p = 870 days – 730 days = 140+ days

30 shr = preg | preg | preg + wean | wean | wean
(Days) #days | #wks |#mths + #days| #wks| #mths

870.00 = 116.00 16.57 4.00 + 754.00 107.71 26.00 <= amayni (solar) 730 days (False!)
_____________________________________________________________________
870.00 = 140.00 20.00 4.83 + 730.00 104.29 25.17 <= amayni (solar) 730 days (True!)
870.00 = 145.00 20.71 5.00 + 725.00 103.57 25.00 <= amayni (solar) 730 days (True!)
870.00 = 151.00 21.57 5.21 + 719.00 102.71 24.79
870.00 = 153.00 21.86 5.28 + 717.00 102.43 24.72
870.00 = 164.00 23.43 5.66 + 706.00 100.86 24.34
870.00 = 174.00 24.86 6.00 + 696.00 99.43 24.00
870.00 = 179.20 25.60 6.18 + 690.80 98.69 23.82
870.00 = 203.00 29.00 7.00 + 667.00 95.29 23.00
870.00 = 232.00 33.14 8.00 + 638.00 91.14 22.00
870.00 = 261.00 37.29 9.00 + 609.00 87.00 21.00 (average pregnancy 9 + 21 weaning)
870.00 = 290.00 41.43 10.00 + 580.00 82.86 20.00
870.00 = 319.00 45.57 11.00 + 551.00 78.71 19.00
870.00 = 348.00 49.71 12.00 + 522.00 74.57 18.00

53:32 الذين the ones يجتنبون avoiding كباير greater الاثم the detriment والفوحش and the immoralities الا except اللمم the small faults ان indeed ربك lord your واسع extensive المغفره the forgiveness هو he اعلم knows بكم in/concerning you اذ when انشاكم raises you من from الارض the land واذ and when انتم are you اجنه fetuses في in بطون interior body امهتكم mothers yours فلا so not تزكوا thou purify ye of انفسكم souls yours/yourselves هو he اعلم knows بمن in who اتقي heeds he

Neptin

Salaam, gestational surrogacy is permissible in Qur'anic principles, as for traditional surrogacy, I'm not quite certain.

You say you're looking for verses. There are no verses, it's all about principles. There is no extramarital sex involved, there is no kind of harm involved. So, it is all good.
Reclaiming Islam from extremism;
[url=http://flamesoftruth.wordpress.com]Flames Of Truth[/url]

jkhan

Quote from: Sania Haque on December 17, 2020, 11:39:11 AM
Why do you have to always assume the worse ? Do you realize that family members also lend their wombs? There are mothers who lend their wombs to their daughters. There are sisters who lend their wombs to their siblings. yoou cannot lump everyone in the same category. I am not asking for a woman's character certificate here, I dont care why other choose to do something, that's their life, I am not in their shoes to judge them. Some people are desperate and only Allah knows what's going in their life. Now so I am asking what's your opinion on prosthetic body parts ? Allah chose to make them disabled so they should live with it. That can be your opinion but that's not mine.. Allah rendered that person disabled but well well they are going against Allah's plan, definitely they are inviting Allah's wrath. That is just unethical.  If God rendered you disabled why dont you just ask for sabr from Allah. Alternative options doesn't mean someone is going against Allah.I definitely don't think that if a person gets a prosthetic, even though God made him disabled, they are going against the will of Allah. And I definitely donot agree with your statement.  The society in which Maryam as lived is far more different than the society we are living. Anyways yours and mine definition of evil definitely differs. Thanks for your input. Peace, brother.

Dear...
I quoted a Quranic verse and surrounded my explanation with it...if you failed to grasp it then it is your weakness.. Worse is that if one happen to do that...
Family members may do with love,  but cannot go against God's teaching...
God says I gave you two eyes for you to see... If he donate one eye to family member for love,  that is against God's creation... Love of family cannot break law of God.. If sister gives her womb to her sister out of love that doesn't make sense.. then Biologically father of the children of both sisters is one.. Can you suicide for the love of your family so that enough food for others ?  No. There are things that you can sacrifice for the sake of family and there things you shouldn't..
Maryam I brought to illustrate a chaste woman's character.. Is Maryam only the chaste woman on this earth.. No.. Chaste woman can't do this.. For love or any reason she can't bear a child of another in her womb.. Time of Maryam or now or future..society is same.i dont need to give woman's character  certificate but God gives.. God calls Maryam in Quran she was a chaste woman and a virgin.. So being chaste in the eyes of God pure.. . By giving a birth to a child to someone who has no child you are not doing any favor to God any good to your account.. But you only violate God's system and you practice evil..

You asked my opinion on prosthetic body parts.. And you answered on behalf of me.. Who gave that authority to you?  Did I say so.. Just don't rush Sania... Either you read Quran thoroughly and question others or be silent till God guides you.. Jumping to run before trigering the lever is meaningless..
Artificial or prosthetic objects (body parts, gadgets etc)  absolutely fine...
God asked Musa what is in your hand... Musa said that this is my club it helps me for various purposes... Hope you get what that means..
To use what Human created is never objecced by God..
For example God didn't create the knife for you but material..but human.. So with that our lives are made easy...making our lives easy by using others help it objects is absolutely  fine..
If one lost his leg by accident or he doesn't have a leg by birth he is deprived of walking.. But God didn't take his life away.  So he will find a way to walk in hardship.. Getting assistance from others / other objects is never against the nature of God..  It is not changing nature.. But note carefully... Choosing evil way to accomplish our misfortunes is against God's law / God's nature.. Hope that sums up all your such concerns..
You may ask what's wrong in abortion... Root cause of abortion is misfortunes... To hide or avoid a misfortunes fallen in one's life cannot choose an evil way...

Evil is evil even it helps for self or others...

[url="https://awakenwithalquran.wordpress.com/"]https://awakenwithalquran.wordpress.com/[/url]

Sania Haque

Quote from: jkhan on December 17, 2020, 08:58:57 PM
Dear...
I quoted a Quranic verse and surrounded my explanation with it...if you failed to grasp it then it is your weakness.. Worse is that if one happen to do that...
Family members may do with love,  but cannot go against God's teaching...
God says I gave you two eyes for you to see... If he donate one eye to family member for love,  that is against God's creation... Love of family cannot break law of God.. If sister gives her womb to her sister out of love that doesn't make sense.. then Biologically father of the children of both sisters is one.. Can you suicide for the love of your family so that enough food for others ?  No. There are things that you can sacrifice for the sake of family and there things you shouldn't..
Maryam I brought to illustrate a chaste woman's character.. Is Maryam only the chaste woman on this earth.. No.. Chaste woman can't do this.. For love or any reason she can't bear a child of another in her womb.. Time of Maryam or now or future..society is same.i dont need to give woman's character  certificate but God gives.. God calls Maryam in Quran she was a chaste woman and a virgin.. So being chaste in the eyes of God pure.. . By giving a birth to a child to someone who has no child you are not doing any favor to God any good to your account.. But you only violate God's system and you practice evil..

You asked my opinion on prosthetic body parts.. And you answered on behalf of me.. Who gave that authority to you?  Did I say so.. Just don't rush Sania... Either you read Quran thoroughly and question others or be silent till God guides you.. Jumping to run before trigering the lever is meaningless..
Artificial or prosthetic objects (body parts, gadgets etc)  absolutely fine...
God asked Musa what is in your hand... Musa said that this is my club it helps me for various purposes... Hope you get what that means..
To use what Human created is never objecced by God..
For example God didn't create the knife for you but material..but human.. So with that our lives are made easy...making our lives easy by using others help it objects is absolutely  fine..
If one lost his leg by accident or he doesn't have a leg by birth he is deprived of walking.. But God didn't take his life away.  So he will find a way to walk in hardship.. Getting assistance from others / other objects is never against the nature of God..  It is not changing nature.. But note carefully... Choosing evil way to accomplish our misfortunes is against God's law / God's nature.. Hope that sums up all your such concerns..
You may ask what's wrong in abortion... Root cause of abortion is misfortunes... To hide or avoid a misfortunes fallen in one's life cannot choose an evil way...

Evil is evil even it helps for self or others...

See, I do not believe in the kind of circular reasoning you are giving. I do appreciate you trying to educate me but no offense but the way you reason is just like how any sectarians reasons. I think we have different ethical values that's why we are not able to find common grounds. And I wasn't talking on behalf of you ( i was being sarcastic in previous comment sorry 👉🏻👈🏻 ) anyways I donot see God giving any character certificate to women. Your beliefs I respect it, I just don't agree with it. I honestly donot get the logics you use. Thank you, peace