Author Topic: Seeing spiritual world  (Read 2292 times)

ilma_bee

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Seeing spiritual world
« on: May 01, 2020, 06:49:20 AM »
Salam

Throughout past years I've heard about some ulema, sufis, arifs, saints etc who were able to see spiritual world and people in their real form. I even know a very respected righteousnes person to whom this happened during hajj, but unfortunately It's not possible to talk to him. This is something that is really important for me and my faith, and I'm not asking out of curiosity (one thing in all these stories and confessions hurt me deeply). So please, if anyone knows someone who is into spirituality and can see humans in real shape let me know..or if you know some valid stories about it, let me know, it would mean a lot.

Jafar

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Re: Seeing spiritual world
« Reply #1 on: May 01, 2020, 09:40:05 PM »
Maybe you can explain what do you mean by seeing people in their real form?
Are you talking about 'seeing' the aura / prana / chi ?
Or seeing and interacting with ghosts ?

Cerberus

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Re: Seeing spiritual world
« Reply #2 on: May 02, 2020, 07:01:05 AM »
I think people ought to sit and determine what exactly is "spiritual", I believe it is most of the time associated with fairytales. Spirit ? Spirituality ?  Spiritual world ?

ilma_bee

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Re: Seeing spiritual world
« Reply #3 on: May 02, 2020, 09:17:28 AM »
It has to do with religious people who got purification and were able to see the reality of stuff. For example, they saw some bad person in an ugly shape (that person looked pretty in material world)

Bikrun

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Re: Seeing spiritual world
« Reply #4 on: May 02, 2020, 10:24:08 AM »
It has to do with religious people who got purification and were able to see the reality of stuff. For example, they saw some bad person in an ugly shape (that person looked pretty in material world)

Salam,

Don't you find all this a bit prejudiced, partial, and kind of predetermination? "Good" people can be able to do bad things and "bad" people can be able to do good things given the circumstances. Some times there is a necessary evil... Sometimes you must hurt someone for his good so you look bad to that person while you are not. So good and bad are relative and arguable terms in many situations and then just someone claims (or not) he can actually see the "real" (?) stuff? Like there is an absolute and final "real" stuff?
42:43    And for he who is patient and forgives, then that is an indication of strength

ilma_bee

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Re: Seeing spiritual world
« Reply #5 on: May 02, 2020, 11:50:45 AM »
No, but if many pious people said to have seen the same thing.. it becomes difficult to just ignore these sayings.

Bikrun

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Re: Seeing spiritual world
« Reply #6 on: May 02, 2020, 01:09:31 PM »
No, but if many pious people said to have seen the same thing.. it becomes difficult to just ignore these sayings.

It could easily be explained by a mental pathology or disorder and a previous common cultural / literacy / collective imagery reference leading to more than one person seeing the same. Just as many people have seen green aliens in flying saucers in different places, times and cultures.

Many pious people in Christian tradition had visions of Holy Mary and or other saints, and they were indeed pious. And so on in other religions, with their own signs and symbols. Does it mean something?

Then I do not know why I remembered this article. Feel free to ignore it

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/21725389/



42:43    And for he who is patient and forgives, then that is an indication of strength

huruf

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Re: Seeing spiritual world
« Reply #7 on: May 03, 2020, 03:03:56 AM »
This epilepsy thing is one of those attributed to Muhammad by non believers in Qur'an revelation.

On the other hand, seeing, particularly when we talk about the arabic of root b-S-r, means seeing with the capacity of understanding not or not necessarily with the eyes. Summing up, it is a capacity to "see" beyond what you were able to "see" previously to that thing that you now "see". Take for instance a mathematical principle, it is an arkanum to you, but then, at some point, you grasp it, you get it, you understand it, it speaks to you, and you are iluminated, you just feel like indeed a big light has been made in front of your "eyes".

This spiritual thing, that the poster speaks about, is that kind of thing, "seeing", understnding, getting something you are not used to get and which speaks directly to you and MEANS.

There are different orders or realms that we may be able to "see", and, wonderfully, when we "see", it gives us peace. Of course, what you "see" is difficult to describe, because to transmit it, the hearer must have had some "vision" him or herself of something similar, that "en"lightening" that appears as a miracle almost.

That is THE LIGHT: "God is the light of the heavens and the earth". You see God. Because The light is a name of God and there is no light that is not He.

We all get it in some degree, in fact, if we do get something, it is His light. No need to run about for spiritual en"lightening". It is with us if we care to take repose and wonder about anything. ¡Why! ¡How! ¡What! There is no separation between "matter" and "spirit". We are small and we reach to something, but not all, by far, but what we do "see" is the light. ¡Alhamdulilahi rabbul'alamiin!

Salaam

ilma_bee

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Re: Seeing spiritual world
« Reply #8 on: May 03, 2020, 06:41:58 AM »
Hi Huruf

Thank you for your reply, but I can't see how is that related to what I asked. You didn't understand my intention. I didn't say I want to get illuminated to see stuff, I said I have problem with what people saw when these spiritual eyes opened for them (from the stories and sayings I heard about). And I'm trying to see if there's any chance that it's not correct what they interpreted...

Cerberus

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Re: Seeing spiritual world
« Reply #9 on: May 03, 2020, 11:49:16 AM »
I think Huruf is saying that the stories you heard about could mean that those people gained a better look at the world and at other people through understanding. That it is not something of the eye but rather of thoughtfulness and understanding and consideration etc.

This is why I have asked you to take some time to find out your own meaning for what is spiritual. Generally people associate spiritual to some kind of magic glowy white shape or whatever but it could be completely wrong. What if spirituality was something related to thoughtfulness, understanding, reasoning etc ?

As Bikrun said, people are neither good or bad, their actions are. But!! One will first have to define what is good and what is bad.

Concerning what people say, an example from the history of my country, the king at that time was exiled and people said they saw his face in the moon. That's the people...