Author Topic: Second Shahadah vs Actual Shahadah in the Quran  (Read 9667 times)

Man of Faith

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Re: Second Shahadah vs Actual Shahadah in the Quran
« Reply #80 on: April 26, 2013, 02:08:44 AM »
Peace supportpeacenotwar,

I understand that Godsubmitter' s post is like a kick in the head. I felt a bit upset too, but relax, it cannot be as bad as it looks I think.

God bless you
Website reference: http://iamthatiam.boards.net

supportpeacenotwar

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Re: Second Shahadah vs Actual Shahadah in the Quran
« Reply #81 on: April 26, 2013, 02:17:11 AM »
Salaam Man of Faith,

I think you're right, I felt like I should clarify that I wasn't in any disagreement over most of the points. it may be he hasn't be following all of this thread either.

May Allah bless and reward you for your efforts
The above post may no longer represent my beliefs based on evidence and considering such topics further.
I no longer follow a "Quran only" approach.
I would simply say I follow Islam.

hawk99

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Re: Second Shahadah vs Actual Shahadah in the Quran
« Reply #82 on: April 26, 2013, 06:55:38 AM »
Peace All,

One cannot claim to be a monotheist and commit atrocities.  Because monotheism
is to believe in the one God.  Now that belief in the one God is demonstrated
by certain moral behaviors, while certain moral behaviors demonstrate that one is
not a monotheist.  Satan can go to the masjid under the guise of being muslim and
have all the appearances of being righteous, but his/her immoral behavior exposes
that person as not a monotheist but hypocrite or a kaffir.  You are what your conduct
reveals.  By the way monotheist are special i.e., Abraham, Moses, Jesus,
Muhammad, the saints, the righteous.


Peace and love to all:

Surely, those who believe, those who are Jewish,
the Christians, and the converts; anyone who
(1) believes in GOD, and
(2) believes in the Last Day, and
(3) leads a righteous life,
will receive their recompense from their Lord;
they have nothing to fear, nor will they grieve.

   :peace:

 
The secret to monotheism can be found in the garden

supportpeacenotwar

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Re: Second Shahadah vs Actual Shahadah in the Quran
« Reply #83 on: April 26, 2013, 12:34:34 PM »
Peace hawk99,

In terms of my opinion, and in terms of this thread I refer to when people use a label to define themselves as Monotheists even though they don't really believe - that some of these people who are under the banner of Muslim or Monotheist are doing wrong. Just like every other group as well. The Quran is quite clear that there are some people who swear by strong oaths about belief but they don't believe at all. Like you say, it depends upon the individual's actual behaviour. As always, Allah is the best Judge.

May Allah bless and reward you for your efforts
The above post may no longer represent my beliefs based on evidence and considering such topics further.
I no longer follow a "Quran only" approach.
I would simply say I follow Islam.

hawk99

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Re: Second Shahadah vs Actual Shahadah in the Quran
« Reply #84 on: April 26, 2013, 02:35:55 PM »
Peace supportpeacenotwar,

Thankyou for your well worded reply, but I reinterate that behavior (words + deeds)
is what defines a person not a self appointed title.  If a person declares "I am charitable"
but in reality they are stingy, that person is not charitable but stingy.  Then charitable
becomes a false identifier or a lie.

[47:30] If we will, we can expose them for you, so that you can recognize them
just by looking at them. However, you can recognize them by the way they talk.
GOD is fully aware of all your works.

[47:31] We will certainly put you to the test, in order to distinguish those among
you who strive, and steadfastly persevere. We must expose your true qualities.

God is All-Knowing

   :peace:


 
The secret to monotheism can be found in the garden

supportpeacenotwar

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Re: Second Shahadah vs Actual Shahadah in the Quran
« Reply #85 on: April 26, 2013, 02:58:35 PM »
Peace hawk99,

Thanks for your courteous response! I'm actually in complete agreement with you. Well said.
The above post may no longer represent my beliefs based on evidence and considering such topics further.
I no longer follow a "Quran only" approach.
I would simply say I follow Islam.

Bender

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Re: Second Shahadah vs Actual Shahadah in the Quran
« Reply #86 on: April 28, 2013, 03:03:08 PM »

أُولِي: This word is always in construct--possessive phrase. "Ya" at the end is indicator of its accusative state; in nominative state it is written with Waw.

Salaamun alayka,

RED: Yes I agree  :handshake:

BLUE: Thank you, I have to check similar words and ayaats to confirm or not. may take some time...

The role of a noun in a sentence is reflected by its case ending. "qaimam" is in accusative case. It is therefore circumstantial clause. This is Active Participle. Allah the Exalted is AlQayum. The manner how He the Exalted maintains everything is by the principle "bilqisti". "He the Exalted is the firm upholder of created realm with justice and equity".

Ok, thank you for explaining your point.
But what is your reasoning that it is NOT all three? Or NOT only malaikat and/or ulu al-ilmi?
in 2:127 you thought it were both of them not only Ibrahim.

salaam,
Bender
Alhamdu lillahi rabbi al-alameen

mmkhan

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Re: Second Shahadah vs Actual Shahadah in the Quran
« Reply #87 on: April 28, 2013, 04:44:18 PM »
Salaamun alayka,

RED: Yes I agree  :handshake:

BLUE: Thank you, I have to check similar words and ayaats to confirm or not. may take some time...

Ok, thank you for explaining your point.
But what is your reasoning that it is NOT all three? Or NOT only malaikat and/or ulu al-ilmi?
in 2:127 you thought it were both of them not only Ibrahim.

salaam,
Bender

Salaamun,

Red: The word used 3:18 is قَآئِمًۢا which is singular. Please take a look at the same word in  3:75, 10:12, 39:9 and very famous aayat 62:11 and Malaaika and Ooluli3lmi are plural.

Hope this may help inshaAllah.


May Allah increase our knowledge and guide us on His path :pr
mmKhan
6:162    قل إن صلاتي ونسكي ومحياي ومماتي لله رب العلمين
6:162    Say: My contact prayer, and my rites, and my life, and my death, are all to Allah, Lord of the worlds.
 
3:51

Bender

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Re: Second Shahadah vs Actual Shahadah in the Quran
« Reply #88 on: May 02, 2013, 01:29:10 PM »
Salaamun,

Red: The word used 3:18 is قَآئِمًۢا which is singular. Please take a look at the same word in  3:75, 10:12, 39:9 and very famous aayat 62:11 and Malaaika and Ooluli3lmi are plural.

Hope this may help inshaAllah.


May Allah increase our knowledge and guide us on His path :pr
mmKhan

Salaamun alayka brother,

Thank you very much  :handshake: Yes it did help alhamdullilah.
This raises some interesting questions  :hmm

never knew that 62:11 is famous, doesn't look like some "controversial" ayaat.

salaam and may Allah increase our knowledge and guide us on His path  :pr ,
Bender
Alhamdu lillahi rabbi al-alameen

supportpeacenotwar

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Re: Second Shahadah vs Actual Shahadah in the Quran
« Reply #89 on: February 18, 2020, 05:21:51 PM »
I've been advised that if a thread I wrote on a topic no longer represents the beliefs I have on the topic now, that I can write a post even if the thread is older because we can't delete or modify posts. So this post is about that my beliefs on the topic of the shahadah in the Quran has changed and the original post on this thread does not represent my beliefs on this topic of the second shahadah as commonly known. I think the second shahadah, as often referred to, actually makes sense considering the Quran as the final revelation from Allah swt. Other posts here, or on other threads, may also not represent my beliefs now, but I didn't have the time to go through each page and check the context of the discussion. I would simply say I follow Islam and the Quran, but not a Quran-only approach. I'm writing this only for reference, not really for discussion as I don't intend to log into this forum much at all and don't have the time for discussions either. I'm writing this post in case anyone does come across this thread by searching the forum and I don't want this thread to be misleading for anyone.
The above post may no longer represent my beliefs based on evidence and considering such topics further.
I no longer follow a "Quran only" approach.
I would simply say I follow Islam.