Baca / Meca

[Layth]

Salam,

This is a good video on the evidences that's Meca-Arabia is not the Meca of the Quran.

https://youtu.be/qOnGvzVceVo

[Mohammed.]

salaam,

I just watched the first few minutes, but seem not good.

How one can expect ruins of large rock/clay buildings and cities from an ancient 'islamic city'?, when they had lead a simple life!. Qur'an repeatedly mentions such large buildings and structures were made by transgressors/disbelievers/ignorant people! (eg: 15:78-83, 89:6-14).

They say "it was an agricultural city" but "to date there is no record of trees having ever existed in ancient Mecca"
From the Qur'an:
"Our Lord, that I resided/inhabited from my descendants at a valley of no plants/crops at Your House/bayt, the Forbidden/Restricted/Sacred- 14:37

They also say things which are not in the Qur'an, i.e. from traditional sources (e.g. about Prophet Muhammad's father, grandfather, wife's name, wife was a merchant etc.)
I think it's not worth watching for a Qur'anic muslim.

[jkhan]

salaam,

I just watched the first few minutes, but seem not good.

How one can expect ruins of large rock/clay buildings and cities from an ancient 'islamic city'?, when they had lead a simple life!. Qur'an repeatedly mentions such large buildings and structures were made by transgressors/disbelievers/ignorant people! (eg: 15:78-83, 89:6-14).

They say "it was an agricultural city" but "to date there is no record of trees having ever existed in ancient Mecca"
From the Qur'an:
"Our Lord, that I resided/inhabited from my descendants at a valley of no plants/crops at Your House/bayt, the Forbidden/Restricted/Sacred- 14:37

They also say things which are not in the Qur'an, i.e. from traditional sources (e.g. about Prophet Muhammad's father, grandfather, wife's name, wife was a merchant etc.)
I think it's not worth watching for a Qur'anic muslim.

Peace Mohamed...

It will take sometime for you to get the crystal clear picture...  God will, you will soon... Try to grasp it within Quran whether Makka has any value within the context of Quran... It is not something that me or anyone can make you to convince... It should come within us.. coz the weight of topic not simple.. Simply from God's guidance it should creep in.. Just see t ponder below verses while many other are already know factor relevant to the topic... Prophet Messenger Mohamed cannot be from Macca...  These verses speak manifestly he is very very close to where children of Israel used to live... Mohamed duty is to deliver the message to it is meant with... So being in Macca to deliver to children of Israel is far from truth... Being in Macca while addressing children of Israel in their day to day life is pointless...He has to go to Israel and address them.. That's delivering message.. He never lived in a place called Macca... He was a neighbor of Israel... Mohamed was part and parcel of children of Israel as well...  Only difference he was an Arab but verses of Quran seems not alien language for both... If you notice 27:76 and 3:93 it is manifest Muhamed knew language of children of Israel naturally and children of Israel knew Mohamed's language naturally.. That can only possible with close proximity of both community... Asking them to bring the tora and recite and God telling quran clarifies most of the things to children of Israel in which they differ.. .. God never spoke any other community that QURAN directly address.. Only the people of Mohamed and children of Israel...  Ummul qura (6:92)and places surrounded it.. That speaks the truth ...

61:06 "And [mention] when Jesus, the son of Mary, said, "O children of Israel, indeed I am the messenger of Allah to you confirming what came before me of the Torah and bringing good tidings of a messenger to come after me, whose name is Ahmad." But when he came to them with clear evidences, they said, This is obvious magic"

3:93 "All food was lawful to the Children of Israel except what Israel had made unlawful to himself before the Torah was revealed. Say, [O Muhammad], "So bring the Torah and recite it, if you should be truthful"

27:76 "Indeed, this Qur'an relates to the Children of Israel most of that over which they disagree"

[Mohammed.]

salaam jkhan,

..it is manifest Muhamed knew language of children of Israel naturally and children of Israel knew Mohamed's language naturally.. That can only possible with close proximity of both community..

How you /your forefathers discuss/got familiar with the Qur'an -which revealed in Arabic language?
Do you people live in close proximity to Arabia? Do you people know Arabic?

Asking them to bring the tora and recite and God telling quran clarifies most of the things to children of Israel in which they differ..

Muhammad was a messenger of God, he knew the truth, and truth is beyond language. Language is not a barrier-whether Muhammad knew or not knew their language.

God never spoke any other community that QURAN directly address..

Qur'an directly addresses bani israel people probably because they were people having more knowledge of former scriptures, messengers and prophets. It doesn't necessarily mean Muhammad's place was in close proximity to bani israel's place.
People of different languages/places/communities can have good relationships and interactions through many ways (e.g. trade)

We don't have clear evidence to know how were/ the places exactly where bani israel people lived/distributed/occupied in Arabia 1500 years ago (Remember that they were generations of hundreds/thousands of years)

Also think about the natural source of water present in makkah-Saudi Arabia.

in Hajj, there is a practice of giving drink (9:19), which requires water, also water required for other basic needs, ablution etc. of thousands/millions of people. Which means the place requires a source for this huge quantity of water throughout the year (Hajj /Umrah).

I believe the well has/had enough water for the needs of true Qur'an followers at all time.

[jkhan]

Sahih Translation...
3:96-97 "Indeed, the first House [of worship] established for mankind was that at Makkah - blessed and a guidance for the worlds. In it are clear signs [such as] the standing place of Abraham. And whoever enters it shall be safe. And [due] to Allah from the people is a pilgrimage to the House - for whoever is able to find thereto a way. But whoever disbelieves - then indeed, Allah is free from need of the worlds


Then why it is kept  closed nowadays for the fear of Covid?  Isn't it really safe there?  Or is not the right place? For me anyway not.. But what about those claim Makka is the place... Why is not safe?

[Layth]

Salam,

Then why it is kept  closed nowadays for the fear of Covid?  Isn't it really safe there?  Or is not the right place? For me anyway not.. But what about those claim Makka is the place... Why is not safe?

Makka is the town of Lot. That is why the Quran told its recipients "And you pass by them (Lot's people) in the morning; and in the evening; do you not comprehend?" (37:137-138)

The black stone in the Kaaba is likely the remnant of the meteors that struck the town.

[tutti_frutti]

Salam,

Makka is the town of Lot. That is why the Quran told its recipients "And you pass by them (Lot's people) in the morning; and in the evening; do you not comprehend?" (37:137-138)

The black stone in the Kaaba is likely the remnant of the meteors that struck the town.

Salam, petra cannot be makkah in my understanding (following is just my unerstanding and obviously i could be wrong)

The God says that whoever enters the house is safe (3:97), that the house is in a safe land (2:125-126, 95:3), that everyone around them are snatched yet they are safe (29:67), that it is the oldest house (3:96... so must be still standing otherwise it would not be the "ancient house"), it is for all mankind (2:125 ... so must still be standing as we too should go there given we are aprt of humanity), all humanity of all times since it being built must go (3:97 ... owed to The God that humanity goes and again we are part of humanity) ... petra is destroyed and majoritarily buried underground so cant be the holy city with kaaba in it .. and kaaba must still be standing and not destroyed ...

Plus it is not one city that is blessed, but many cities blessed in a holy land (34:18)

I think bakka is the valley kaaba was built on, around which the city of Makkah was built (people live around the house - last part of 2:196)
and they were prevented to fight at the inside of makka (48:24) a people who i think also prevented them from entering the masjid al haram (next verse 48:25) - so same people The God withheld their hands against within makkah are the same ones who prevented them from the house - so same people same place

Yes based on surah 105 and other clues we can extract petra is city of lut, and muhammed lived there.. but remember muhammed migrated .. he migrated to the secure land/makka (which i equate to egypt (5:20-22 compared with 28:3-6, 26:54-59, and 7;137))

plus they have "already come across/passed by"  (25:40) so perhaps they left the place of lut and no longer are there i think

salam