Author Topic: Stuck on these verses clarification  (Read 1521 times)

jkhan

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Stuck on these verses clarification
« on: November 06, 2019, 03:22:42 AM »
Verses 22:39-41 …….

I am not satisfied with any of the translations available for whatever the reasons for above verses of quran… My heart doesn’t accept any of them… something bothers me while reading the verses without being able to get any meaning by using religious places…specially mentioning of religious places such Monasteries, Churches, Synagogues, Mosques… I feel like (sawamiu) ~~ Reform centers, (Bi’au) ~~~Trading or Business or Fare, (Salawat) ~~~ Morals / Ethics,  (Masajid) ~~~ Sanctuaries ( natural & man erected)..
Does anyone think in a different way to all the translations or even direct Arabic words? Or are you perfectly fine with religious places as translated or take the quranic words as religious places..…

If anyone has totally different translation or understanding pls comment… I searched whether it is discussed before in the forum but could not find exactly..

Iyyaka

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But he said, Yea rather, blessed are they that hear the word of God, and keep it. (Luke - 11:26)

Mazhar

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Re: Stuck on these verses clarification
« Reply #2 on: November 06, 2019, 05:31:27 AM »
Verses 22:39-41 …….

I am not satisfied with any of the translations available for whatever the reasons for above verses of quran… My heart doesn’t accept any of them… something bothers me while reading the verses without being able to get any meaning by using religious places…specially mentioning of religious places such Monasteries, Churches, Synagogues, Mosques… I feel like (sawamiu) ~~ Reform centers, (Bi’au) ~~~Trading or Business or Fare, (Salawat) ~~~ Morals / Ethics,  (Masajid) ~~~ Sanctuaries ( natural & man erected)..
Does anyone think in a different way to all the translations or even direct Arabic words? Or are you perfectly fine with religious places as translated or take the quranic words as religious places..…

If anyone has totally different translation or understanding pls comment… I searched whether it is discussed before in the forum but could not find exactly..

Read with what is done within them. Do people do that in trading centers?

jkhan

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Re: Stuck on these verses clarification
« Reply #3 on: November 06, 2019, 08:15:01 AM »
Read with what is done within them. Do people do that in trading centers?

Peace brother Mazhar

Would pls elaborte it rather than I guess something else by what you hsve  written....
Further can you translate those four words and explain the meaning...

Dear Brother Iyyaka...
So.... You don't go in line with major translations... It means you have found it differently.... Can you explain those three verses... Don't translate but explain what you get by the three verses to get a better picture ...

Mazhar

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Re: Stuck on these verses clarification
« Reply #4 on: November 06, 2019, 08:36:31 AM »
Peace brother Mazhar

Would pls elaborte it rather than I guess something else by what you hsve  written....
Further can you translate those four words and explain the meaning...

Dear Brother Iyyaka...
So.... You don't go in line with major translations... It means you have found it differently.... Can you explain those three verses... Don't translate but explain what you get by the three verses to get a better picture ...


لَّـهُدِّمَتْ صَوَٟمِعُ وَبِيَعٚ وَصَلَوَٟتٚ وَمَسَٟجِدُ يُذْكَرُ فِيـهَا ٱسمُ ٱللَّهِ كَثِيـرٙاۗ

Certainly monasteries and churches and synagogues and mosques would have been demolished wherein the name of Allah is mentioned quite often.

So these places are where people go for prayer or one may say worship. Thereby in simple terms these are referring religious places where people congregate for no other purpose but to remember and mention Allah.


jkhan

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Re: Stuck on these verses clarification
« Reply #5 on: November 06, 2019, 09:00:39 AM »

لَّـهُدِّمَتْ صَوَٟمِعُ وَبِيَعٚ وَصَلَوَٟتٚ وَمَسَٟجِدُ يُذْكَرُ فِيـهَا ٱسمُ ٱللَّهِ كَثِيـرٙاۗ

Certainly monasteries and churches and synagogues and mosques would have been demolished wherein the name of Allah is mentioned quite often.

So these places are where people go for prayer or one may say worship. Thereby in simple terms these are referring religious places where people congregate for no other purpose but to remember and mention Allah.

So... You go inline with all major translations... Fine... You highlighted may be to say in masajid God's name remembered much.... In fact the verse only says masajid... Right.. Not all  God's name remembered.... Somehow those places God's name not remembered ... Is it fair..

Mazhar

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Re: Stuck on these verses clarification
« Reply #6 on: November 06, 2019, 09:05:36 AM »
So... You go inline with all major translations... Fine... You highlighted may be to say in masajid God's name remembered much.... In fact the verse only says masajid... Right.. Not all  God's name remembered.... Somehow those places God's name not remembered ... Is it fair..

No, all that are mentioned earlier.

jkhan

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Re: Stuck on these verses clarification
« Reply #7 on: November 06, 2019, 09:12:57 AM »
No, all that are mentioned earlier.

Are you sure?.. Feehi or feeha is Singular.. Right... And feminine..  :confused:...pls explain better...

Mazhar

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Re: Stuck on these verses clarification
« Reply #8 on: November 06, 2019, 10:39:19 AM »
Are you sure?.. Feehi or feeha is Singular.. Right... And feminine..  :confused:...pls explain better...

Some time try to skim some grammar book. Feminine Ha is used to refer broken plural objects since then they are grammatically treated singular.

is used 244 times in Ayahs. At the very first place it refers feminine broken plural noun.

http://haqeeqat.pk/236.FeeHa.htm

Easy to see its use in all ayahs use search engine by F-3 on this text page of Full Qur'an on my website

http://haqeeqat.pk/quran.html

Iyyaka

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Re: Stuck on these verses clarification
« Reply #9 on: November 06, 2019, 01:58:55 PM »
Dear Brother Iyyaka...
So.... You don't go in line with major translations... It means you have found it differently.... Can you explain those three verses... Don't translate but explain what you get by the three verses to get a better picture ...
Peace,

I have added more information for reflection in my post https://free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9610597.msg427316#msg427316
I hope that highlighting the structure of this passage and the inter-connected elements will help your reflection.

Sorry not to answer directly and much longer (top long here - even if colour and structure has "obvious" meaning) but otherwise we must first ask the question: what is the relationship between the ROOT of these words and the proposed STANDARD translations ?
It is "clearly" for me a lexical entry...
But he said, Yea rather, blessed are they that hear the word of God, and keep it. (Luke - 11:26)