Author Topic: Muslim Imam says that watching pornography is halal  (Read 1471 times)

Amra94

  • Apprentice
  • **
  • Posts: 303
  • Gender: Female
Re: Muslim Imam says that watching pornography is halal
« Reply #30 on: October 31, 2019, 06:40:53 PM »
"Lower your gaze but secretly watch people do it. You cant convince retards"


Reply
It is more retarded to think that only the Quran is the source in Islam. I would like to ask you what does God mean by lowering gaze? I doubt any Quranist can answer this question except to use ones own assumptions and give a ruling to it and then again would contradict the very statement of Allah(Swt) who says

"And We have sent down to thee the Quran explaining all things"
(16:89)

If Allah says that everything is explained in the Quran, then why can't you bring a single proof to prove that watching porn is haram?
The Quran is only clear to those who use their reason. Which you do not do.

jkhan

  • Truth Seeker
  • ***
  • Posts: 926
  • Gender: Male
Re: Muslim Imam says that watching pornography is halal
« Reply #31 on: October 31, 2019, 08:24:17 PM »
Dear  brother.... Zakir..




LGBT is clearly forbidden.
 
Interesting.... Where it is given an unequivocal statement by God saying “forbidden for you is LGBT” or “Forbidden for you homosexuality”… If no unequivocal statement still if you say Forbidden... why contradiction here and why allow porn... based on what?....


Brother I wish myself and others can keep patience with you and with your ignorance of clear verses of quran only hoping that you learn… but if your intention is waste time of others with clear rejections of exposing your flaws, then better we leave the ignorant ones aside…

Don’t skip… answer pls … that’s the better way of argument if you want to survive…. Otherwise you will look fool in those who look at this debate in a neutral point of view.… “Having sex with Mother or Father or Sister or Brother or Son or Daughter is forbidden in Quran with a clear cut or unequivocal statement?” iF Yes .. bring the verse… If NO.. then why forbid what God has not Forbidden… if NO and if still forbid then there must be a reason with logic away from unequivocal statement by God.. isn’t it?
I can bring loads of examples not only related with sex but on every topic…

Cerberus

  • Truth Seeker
  • ***
  • Posts: 551
  • Gender: Male
Re: Muslim Imam says that watching pornography is halal
« Reply #32 on: October 31, 2019, 08:57:24 PM »
bait and switch ?

jkhan

  • Truth Seeker
  • ***
  • Posts: 926
  • Gender: Male
Re: Muslim Imam says that watching pornography is halal
« Reply #33 on: October 31, 2019, 10:39:20 PM »
Brother Zakir....

7:33 “Say, "My Lord has only FORBIDDEN (harrama) immoralities (fawahisha-plural)- what is apparent of them and what is concealed  … …....”
17:32 “And do not approach unlawful sexual intercourse (zina). Indeed, it is ever an immorality (fahisha-singular) and is evil as a way.”


Carefully look at above verses… Word used Harrama and Fahisha… and apparent and concealed…..

As per 7:33 God has made haram (immoralities-fawahish) of any nature be it manifest or concealed.. then the next verse 17:32 says not to near ZINA.. and clearly called ZINA is FAHISHA and reiterated as EVIL as a way…So it means, ZINA is one of those which comprises FAHISHA list or zina itself a fahisha…

Now apply logic and reason.. coz God says us to use the reason.. isn’t HE?... the people who are involved in various type of Porn is clearly doing ZINA (includes LGBT) and you and your imam emphasize watching what they do is Halal while God has Forbidden ZINA… God says bring 4 witnesses against those who do ZINA prior to punish them, but you claim watching them is HALAL… after watching a Halal thing, HOW WOULD YOU EVER BE A WITNESS AGAINST THOSE WHO DOES ZINA while you claim what they do is fine since watching them makes you feel better and stimulate… ridiculous part is… God orders for 100 lashes as punishment for those who are fornicators… But you and your imam are in support of the fornicators which you watch (live or Video) as porn and claiming it is brilliant side support and halal…. You watched a halal matter but God orders 100 lashes for what you watched..what contradictory thing that is… You are super nonsensical like all your hadith oriented people…. You don’t have any constructive way to reason the quran or any general matter and unfortunately you are blinded to reason the quran…simply brainwashed by scholars...Amra94 said rightly about you in her last thread..… Now did I use Hadith to explain your pathetic and weak claim… what I used is only quran and reasoning it to substantiate..…
Open your eyes if you in fact love to live in janna…. I have no time to allocate for ignorant folks but I will dedicate for believers my valuable time..… Peace brother... May Allah bless you with what is right…

No more comments from me on this topic… if you raise any hadith topic separately I will in sha allah participate…

good logic

  • Wise One / Burnout
  • *****
  • Posts: 4920
Re: Muslim Imam says that watching pornography is halal
« Reply #34 on: November 01, 2019, 12:44:45 AM »
Peace Zakir.
You are not reading the posts properly . you have repeated the same gaff here, quote:

First of all you should understand the arabic meaning for this verse. The arabic word"فَرُدُّوهُ" means to refer back meaning to refer to the prophet(Sal).
 (And) if you differ in anything amongst yourselves, refer it to Allaah and His Messenger
(4:59)

 Refer back to the prophet? it says to the messenger. in the verse not prophet.
And I explained why GOD choose to say messenger .i.e messenger of Allah who delivers the message of Allah-Qoran-

But you ignore . I find that you are not asking a sincere question since you are not interested in reading posts properly.
Your aim is to discuss hadiths really. Brothers and sisters are not going to take your bait.
The subject has been discussed before  search the forum.
Thank you.
Peace.
TOTAL LOYALTY TO GOD ALONE.   IN GOD I TRUST

38:65″ Say:? I warn you; There is no other god beside GOD, the One, the Supreme.?

 http://www.total-loyalty-to-god-alone.co.uk/website-pages/good-logic/

zakir

  • Beginner/Inquirer
  • *
  • Posts: 20
Re: Muslim Imam says that watching pornography is halal
« Reply #35 on: November 01, 2019, 01:21:08 AM »
Dear brother jkhan, you said
"Brother I wish myself and others can keep patience with you and with your ignorance of clear verses of quran only hoping that you learn… but if your intention is waste time of others with clear rejections of exposing your flaws, then better we leave the ignorant ones aside…

Don’t skip… answer pls … that’s the better way of argument if you want to survive…. Otherwise you will look fool in those who look at this debate in a neutral point of view.… “Having sex with Mother or Father or Sister or Brother or Son or Daughter is forbidden in Quran with a clear cut or unequivocal statement?” iF Yes .. bring the verse… If NO.. then why forbid what God has not Forbidden… if NO and if still forbid then there must be a reason with logic away from unequivocal statement by God.. isn’t it?


My Reply,
There is clear evidence of Allah azza wa jal forbidding homosexuality. Prophet lut said to the homosexuals,

And Lūṭ, when he said to his people, ‘Do you commit abomination such as no one from among the peoples has done before you? Indeed, you approach men with desire, instead of women. You surely are a transgressing people.’” (7:80-81)


“Indeed, you commit such immorality as no one has preceded you with from among the worlds. Indeed, you approach men and obstruct the road and commit in your meetings [every] evil.” And the answer of his people was not but they said, “Bring us the punishment of Allah, if you should be of the truthful.” (Qur’an 29-28-29)

But, for porn I ask you kindly where is an expkucit verse?

seekingtruth1111

  • Apprentice
  • **
  • Posts: 145
Re: Muslim Imam says that watching pornography is halal
« Reply #36 on: November 01, 2019, 07:37:28 PM »

But, for porn I ask you kindly where is an expkucit verse?

Peace Zakir,

Quran gives boundaries and limits. If we cross the limit we  transgress. Not always you will find specific verse.

Are you looking for a verse which says " Do not watch porn?" 

Obviously that does not exist. I just want to ask you what do you understand by "lowering your gaze and guarding private parts" the following verses. When you look at the naked people showing their private parts performing sexual act(zina) in the porn  what is happening with your gaze/look?

24:30 Tell the acknowledging men to lower their gaze and guard their private parts, for that is purer for them. God is fully aware of what you do.
24:31 Tell the acknowledging women to lower their gaze and guard their private parts, and that they should not show off their attraction except what is apparent, and let them cast their clothes over their cleavage. Let them not show off their attraction except to their husbands, or their fathers, or fathers of their husbands, or their sons, or the sons of their husbands, or their brothers, or the sons of their brothers, or the sons of their sisters, or their children that come after them, or those who are still their dependants, or the male servants who are without need, or the child who has not yet understood the nakedness of women. Let them not strike with their feet in a manner that reveals what they are keeping hidden of their attraction. Repent to God, all of you acknowledgers, so that you may succeed.


Also what do you understand by "go near fawāḥisha"  and " go near zina" in the following verses ?

http://corpus.quran.com/wordbyword.jsp?chapter=6&verse=151

6:151 Say: "Come let me recite what your Lord has made unlawful for you: that you should not set up anything with Him - and do good to your parents; and do not kill your children for fear of poverty, We provide for you and for them; and do not come near immorality, what is public of it and private; and do not take the life which God has made forbidden, except in justice. That is what He enjoined you that you may comprehend."

http://corpus.quran.com/wordbyword.jsp?chapter=17&verse=32

17:32 Do not go near adultery, for it is a immorality(fawāḥisha) and an evil path.


"going near" is not committing fawāḥisha or zina

The participants of the porn movie are committing fawāḥisha or zina . By watching it we are coming close to it or bringing it close to us(in our phone/laptop/tv etc). That is my understanding. You may argue differently .

Watching fawāḥisha or zina seduces us from our soul/nafs.  More we watch it more we get addicted and increases our addiction to watching it.

http://corpus.quran.com/wordbyword.jsp?chapter=12&verse=24

12:24 And she was obsessed with him, and he did obsess with her - had it not been that he saw the proof of his Lord - it was thus that We turned evil and immorality(fawāḥisha) away from him; he is of Our loyal servants.






jkhan

  • Truth Seeker
  • ***
  • Posts: 926
  • Gender: Male
Re: Muslim Imam says that watching pornography is halal
« Reply #37 on: November 01, 2019, 08:59:04 PM »

Exactly ST1111,,,,
Very good point 'nearing zina'... Let me put that this way... What went wrong to the woman who seduced Yousuf... She was looking at Yousuf excessively in a manner to develop her desire though Yousuf doesn't belong to her... That look on Yousuf's body enticed her to seduce Yousuf when opportunity arises .. Had she lowered her gaze she would not have carried away... That's control.... Unfortunately what she did was NEARING ZINA.... that promted through watching without lowering gaze....
People who practice zina in porn are not believers  .. They can't practice zina and still call believers... So those who look at DISBELIVERS and tempt their feeling and call halal... If halal bring some believing men and women and let them do porn and call halal.. Can you do that? Is that right way... Then why approach DISBELIVERS who lost the path of Allah and those evil people who drag you to path of Satan resulting hell.. ..
Remember Porn is not word probably in the yester society..(no need porn then while prostitution was in abundance)... So it is not in Quran either... So  reason your wits and see what is happening in porn... Thus judge... There is limit for foolishness.... Porn is business of evil people who knows only evil... If you encourage watching them then you only cultivate evil ....what difference it makes to the one who runs prostitution business and who runs porn business? All under one umbrella.... Sadly you don't get it... I won't be surprised  even now if you ask 'pls bring unequivocal verse from QURAN '....😂 lol... You are funny...

O! Zakir your belief is not complete without hadith... Right? then at least follow below hadiths and see that even allow porn....


Allah has written for Adam's son his share of adultery which he commits inevitably. The adultery of the eyes is the sight (to gaze at a forbidden thing), the adultery of the tongue is the talk, and the inner self wishes and desires and the private parts testify all this or deny it. Abu Hurairah. Bukhari, Muslim, Abu Dawud.

"No man or woman should look at the naked body of each other (unless married). Sahih Muslim"

By God, I would prefer to be thrown from the skies and spatterred in parts than to look at someone's private parts or let someone look at my private parts. Narrated by Salman. Almabsooth kitabul istehsan

Once someone's thigh was open in public. The Prophet said don't you know thigh is supposed to be kept covered? Jerhad Aslami. Muatta Imam Malik, Tirmidhi, Abu Dawud

 The Prophet, peace and blessings be upon him, is reported to have said: 'The eyes commit adultery, the tongue commits adultery, the hands commit adultery, the feet commit adultery and then the private parts confirm it or deny it." (Reported by Ahmad Ibn Hanbal...

It's time for you to neglect your own hadith...

Below verse suits you your imam...
24:19
" Indeed, those who like that immorality(fahisha) should be spread [or publicized] among those who have believed will have a painful punishment in this world and the Hereafter. And Allah knows and you do not know."

zakir

  • Beginner/Inquirer
  • *
  • Posts: 20
Re: Muslim Imam says that watching pornography is halal
« Reply #38 on: November 02, 2019, 03:43:16 AM »
 Brother jkhan, Assalamu Alaikum!

You have mentioned the following,

Exactly ST1111,,,,
Very good point 'nearing zina'... Let me put that this way... What went wrong to the woman who seduced Yousuf... She was looking at Yousuf excessively in a manner to develop her desire though Yousuf doesn't belong to her... That look on Yousuf's body enticed her to seduce Yousuf when opportunity arises .. Had she lowered her gaze she would not have carried away... That's control.... Unfortunately what she did was NEARING ZINA.... that promted through watching without lowering gaze....
People who practice zina in porn are not believers  .. They can't practice zina and still call believers... So those who look at DISBELIVERS and tempt their feeling and call halal... If halal bring some believing men and women and let them do porn and call halal.. Can you do that? Is that right way... Then why approach DISBELIVERS who lost the path of Allah and those evil people who drag you to path of Satan resulting hell.. ..
Remember Porn is not word probably in the yester society..(no need porn then while prostitution was in abundance)... So it is not in Quran either... So  reason your wits and see what is happening in porn... Thus judge... There is limit for foolishness.... Porn is business of evil people who knows only evil... If you encourage watching them then you only cultivate evil ....what difference it makes to the one who runs prostitution business and who runs porn business? All under one umbrella.... Sadly you don't get it... I won't be surprised  even now if you ask 'pls bring unequivocal verse from QURAN '....😂 lol... You are funny...

O! Zakir your belief is not complete without hadith... Right? then at least follow below hadiths and see that even allow porn....


Allah has written for Adam's son his share of adultery which he commits inevitably. The adultery of the eyes is the sight (to gaze at a forbidden thing), the adultery of the tongue is the talk, and the inner self wishes and desires and the private parts testify all this or deny it. Abu Hurairah. Bukhari, Muslim, Abu Dawud.

"No man or woman should look at the naked body of each other (unless married). Sahih Muslim"

By God, I would prefer to be thrown from the skies and spatterred in parts than to look at someone's private parts or let someone look at my private parts. Narrated by Salman. Almabsooth kitabul istehsan

Once someone's thigh was open in public. The Prophet said don't you know thigh is supposed to be kept covered? Jerhad Aslami. Muatta Imam Malik, Tirmidhi, Abu Dawud


"The Prophet, peace and blessings be upon him, is reported to have said: 'The eyes commit adultery, the tongue commits adultery, the hands commit adultery, the feet commit adultery and then the private parts confirm it or deny it." (Reported by Ahmad Ibn Hanbal...

It's time for you to neglect your own hadith...

Below verse suits you your imam...
24:19
" Indeed, those who like that immorality(fahisha) should be spread [or publicized] among those who have believed will have a painful punishment in this world and the Hereafter. And Allah knows and you do not know"

My Reply
Brother, I never said that porn is halal. Don't get me wrong. I just asked you a simple question and that is, where does it say unequivocal in the Quran that watching porn is haram? You instead of answering that question is now quoting hadiths. Now your desperation has brought you to quote from the story of Yusuf(Alahissalam) and how he was seduced. You are trying to bring and interpretation of your own to mean that the woman who seduced Yusuf looked at him. Where does it say in the Quran that she looked at him excessively? The story of Yusuf has nothing to do with lowering the gaze. Lowering the gaze could mean anything if you are relying only on the Quran. Most of the verses in the Quran are ambiguous and how can you give your own interpretation to the Quran? ten people will give ten interpretations on one single verse. I ask you, who is correct. This is what happens if you rely only on the Quran. You are a hadith rejector hence a deviant person no doubt. The prophet(Sal) explained the Quran through his sunnah which is preserved in the authentic hadiths. This is why Allah says,

."And, (O Glorious Messenger,) We have revealed to you the Glorious Reminder (the Qur’an) so that you may explain clearly to people that have been sent down to them and that they may meditate.”
(16:44)

For the sake of argument let's agree that the Quran is the only source in Islam and hadiths are all lies, Now Allah(Swt) says in the Quran,
"And We have revealed to you that Glorious Book which is a clear exposition of everything and is guidance, mercy and glad tidings for the believers.”
(16:89)

Now, according to this verse, everything is explained in the Quran and Quranists like you would agree to this verse. My question to you is , if everything is explained in the Quran, then why doesn't Allah mention anything about watching porn?

Allah says,
"And whatever the Messenger (blessings and peace be upon him) gives you, take that and whatever he forbids you, abstain (from that)"
(59:7)

I ask you, if the hadiths are unacceptable, then why does Allah tell us to follow the prophet(Sal) and to take whatever he gives us and to forbid things which he has forbidden?



I am convinced clearly after reading imam C.J Ahmed's fatwa that watching porn is halal if it is for a necessity. You have not read the full article and I don't know why you do not want to. Maybe you are scared that you might get confused. Again, here is the link for the article https://cjislam.weebly.com/why-watching-porn-is-allowed-in-islam-for-a-necessity.html

jkhan

  • Truth Seeker
  • ***
  • Posts: 926
  • Gender: Male
Re: Muslim Imam says that watching pornography is halal
« Reply #39 on: November 02, 2019, 04:37:02 AM »
Brother jkhan, Assalamu Alaikum!
 

My Reply
Brother, I never said that porn is halal. 

That's more than enough... Take care... I have honestly no time with such an ignorant person like you... You don't even argue to convince anything.... Just hovering with pure negligence....

Open a new thread for hadith of you want... Then if I wish I will give you a good debate  if you keep in track of debate... If you deviate in this same manner... Then you go argue  with your hadith followers who never support porn.... But you and your imam... God bless you..