Author Topic: Shia's claim on Qur'anic Verses  (Read 182 times)

The Sardar

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Shia's claim on Qur'anic Verses
« on: May 08, 2019, 08:59:17 PM »
Salam/Peace everyone, i came across a Shia website and it uses Qur'anic verses that is "supposed" to support a Shia Imam Caliphate but i am not sure about that.

Here is the article: http://why-sunnis-convert-to-shia.com/quranic-verses-of-imamate/

And i noticed they did some distorting like 33:33 which their translation is off

33:33. And stay quietly in your houses, and make not a dazzling display, like that of the former Times of Ignorance; and establish regular Prayer, and give regular Charity; and obey Allah and His Messenger. And Allah only wishes to remove all abomination from you, ye members of the Family, and to make you pure and spotless. (Fatima, Ali, Hasan, Hussein)

In this lined part the word Bayt does not mean Family, that's 'âla (ءال):

Alif-Waw-Lam - To return, be before, come back to. To interpret [by consideration], explain. To contract, withdraw, become. To preside over, hold command or authority. To come to be. To put in a proper state/condition, or to compose [an affair]. To resort to; namely [a thing of any kind; the thing or place whence he or it originated, or came. His or its origin or source; his or its original state, condition, quantity, weight; any place. A former action, saying, or the like]. To return or restore to [ a thing, place, or disposition]. To explain, expound, interpret [collecting the meanings of dubious expressions by such expression as is clear, or plain, without dubiousness]. To explain the meaning of that which is equivocal or ambiguous. To be seen from a distance.

al n.m. 2:49, 2:50, 2:248, 2:248, 3:11, 3:33, 3:33, 4:54, 7:130, 7:141, 8:52, 8:54, 8:54, 12:6, 14:6, 15:59, 15:61, 19:6, 27:56, 28:8, 34:13, 40:28, 40:45, 40:46, 54:34, 54:41

awwal n. num. (f. ula) 2:41, 3:96, 5:114, 6:14, 6:94, 6:110, 6:163, 7:38, 7:39, 7:143, 9:13, 9:83, 9:108, 17:5, 17:7, 17:51, 18:48, 20:21, 20:51, 20:65, 20:133, 21:104, 26:51, 28:43, 28:70, 33:33, 36:79, 37:59, 39:12, 41:21, 43:81, 44:35, 44:56, 50:15, 53:25, 53:50, 53:56, 56:62, 57:3, 59:2, 79:25, 87:18, 92:13, 93:4

awwalun n.m. (pl. of awwal) 6:25, 8:31, 8:38, 9:100, 15:10, 15:13, 16:24, 17:59, 18:55, 21:5, 23:24, 23:68, 23:81, 23:83, 25:5, 26:26, 26:137, 26:184, 26:196, 27:68, 28:36, 35:43, 37:17, 37:71, 37:126, 37:168, 43:6, 43:8, 44:8, 46:17, 56:13, 56:39, 56:48, 56:49, 68:15, 77:16, 77:38, 83:13

awwala vb. (2) n.vb. 3:7, 3:7, 4:59, 7:53, 7:53, 10:39, 12:6, 12:21, 12:36, 12:37, 12:44, 12:45, 12:100, 12:101, 17:35, 18:78, 18:82

Lane's Lexicon, Volume 1, pages: 162, 163, 164, 165  ##  http://ejtaal.net/aa/#q=awl

And Bayt:

Ba-Ya-Ta (ب ي ت) =

by/in/at night (excluding sleep), entered upon or passed the night
tent, house, home
Thinking about something and its end result
Concealed or conceived something in the mind
A structure of clay or any structure signifying a habitation, an abode or dwelling.
Buildings, uninhabited houses, shops, ruins, bazaars, places where the entering is allowed by the owners.
Ark of Noah, Mosques, places of worship, Kaabeh or Jerusalem
A grave
Household or family
Nobility
Sudden attack in the night or a surprise attack in the night
Remaining through the night (e.g. bread or water that stays out and becomes stale)

bata vb. (1) impf. act. 25:64

bayat n.m. 7:4, 7:97, 10:50

bayt n.m. (pl. buyut)
2:125, 2:125, 2:127, 2:158, 3:96, 3:97, 5:2, 5:97, 8:35, 11:73, 14:37, 22:26, 22:26, 22:29, 22:33, 24:36, 33:33, 52:4, 106:3
2:189, 2:189, 3:49, 3:154, 4:15, 4:100, 7:74, 8:5, 10:87, 10:87, 12:23, 15:82, 16:68, 16:80, 16:80, 17:93, 24:27, 24:27, 24:29, 24:61 (x10), 26:149, 27:52, 28:12, 29:41 (x3), 33:13, 33:33, 33:34, 33:53, 43:33, 43:34, 51:36, 59:2, 65:1, 66:11, 71:28

bayyata vb. (2)
perf. act. 4:81
impf. act. 4:81, 4:108, 27:49

LL, V1, p: 316, 317, 318  ##  http://ejtaal.net/aa/#q=byt


Another distortion they made is 38:26:

38:26. O David! We did indeed make thee an Imam on earth: so judge thou between men in truth (and justice): Nor follow thou the lusts (of thy heart), for they will mislead thee from the Path of Allah. for those who wander astray from the Path of Allah, is a Penalty Grievous, for that they forget the Day of Account.

In this lined part is a mistranslation, the word here is khalîfatan (خليفة) which means successor:

Kh-Lam-Fa = To follow/come after/succeed another, substitute or supersede, to supply/be a supplier to someone, to restore or replace a thing to someone, smite or strike from behind, yearn towards other than one's spouse (in the spouses absence/behind his or her back), speak of/mention someone behind his or her back, remain behind/not go forth, to be kept back from all good, to not prosper or be successful, to become corrupt or altered for the worse, retire/withdraw/go away, to turn away from/avoid/shun a thing, to become foolish/idiotic/deficient in intellect, contrarious/hard in disposition, to leave behind, to appoint someone as successor, disagree with or differ from someone, contradict or oppose someone, to break/fail to perform a promise, to follow reciprocally/alternate/interchange, repeatedly move to and fro (coming and going), to differ/ be dissimilar

khalafa vb. (1)
perf. act. 7:150, 7:169, 19:59
impf. act. 43:60
impv. 7:142
pcple. act. 9:83

khalf n.m. 2:66, 2:255, 3:170, 4:9, 7:17, 7:169, 8:57, 10:92, 13:11, 19:59, 19:64, 20:110, 21:28, 22:76, 34:9, 36:9, 36:45, 41:14, 41:25, 41:42, 46:21, 72:27

khalifah n.m. (pl. khala'if) 2:30, 6:165, 7:69, 7:74, 10:14, 10:73, 27:62, 35:39, 38:26

khawalif n.f. (pl. of khalifah) 9:87, 9:93

khilaf n.m. 5:33, 7:124, 9:81, 17:76, 20:71, 26:49

khilafah n.f. 25:62

khallafa vb. (2)
perf. pass. 9:118
pcple. pass. 9:81, 48:11, 48:15, 48:16

khalafa vb. (3) impf. act. 11:88, 24:63

akhlafa vb. (4)
perf. act. 9:77, 14:22, 20:86, 20:87
impf. act. 2:80, 3:9, 3:194, 13:31, 20:58, 22:47, 30:6, 34:39, 39:20
impf. pass. 20:97
pcple. act. 14:47

takhallafa vb. (5) impf. act. 9:120

ikhtalafa vb. (8)
perf. act. 2:176, 2:213, 2:213, 2:213, 2:253, 3:19, 3:105, 4:157, 8:42, 10:19, 10:93, 16:64, 16:124, 19:37, 42:10, 43:65, 45:17
impf. act. 2:113, 3:55, 5:48, 6:164, 10:19, 10:93, 16:39, 16:92, 16:124, 22:69, 27:76, 32:25, 39:3, 39:46, 43:63, 45:17
perf. pass. 11:110, 41:45
n.vb. 2:164, 3:190, 4:82, 10:6, 23:80, 30:22, 45:5
pcple. act. 6:141, 11:118, 16:13, 16:69, 35:27, 35:27, 35:28, 39:21, 51:8, 78:3

istakhlafa vb. (10)
perf. act. 24:55
impf. act. 6:133, 7:129, 11:57, 24:55
pcple. pass. 57:7

LL, V2, p: 428, 429, 430, 431, 432, 433, 434, 435  ##  http://ejtaal.net/aa/#q=xlf


And also 2:124 is also a mistranslation:

2:124. And remember that Abraham was tried by his Lord with certain commands, which he fulfilled: He said: “I will make thee an Imam to the Nations.” He pleaded: “And also (Imams) from my offspring!” He answered: “But My Promise is not within the reach of evil-doers.

Here they translated Al-Nâsi as Nations but that is not true, it's people or Mankind:

Nun-Waw-Siin = to swing, halt in a place, move, toss. Mankind, people, others, men.

nas (pl. of insan)
2:8, 2:13, 2:21, 2:24, 2:44, 2:83, 2:94, 2:96, 2:102, 2:124, 2:125, 2:142, 2:143, 2:143, 2:150, 2:159, 2:161, 2:164, 2:165, 2:168, 2:185, 2:187, 2:188, 2:189, 2:199, 2:200, 2:204, 2:207, 2:213, 2:219, 2:221, 2:224, 2:243, 2:243, 2:251, 2:259, 2:264, 2:273, 3:4, 3:9, 3:14, 3:21, 3:41, 3:46, 3:68, 3:79, 3:87, 3:96, 3:97, 3:110, 3:112, 3:134, 3:138, 3:140, 3:173, 3:173, 3:187, 4:1, 4:37, 4:38, 4:53, 4:54, 4:58, 4:77, 4:79, 4:105, 4:108, 4:114, 4:133, 4:142, 4:161, 4:165, 4:170, 4:174, 5:32, 5:32, 5:44, 5:49, 5:67, 5:82, 5:97, 5:110, 5:116, 6:91, 6:122, 6:144, 7:85, 7:116, 7:144, 7:158, 7:187, 8:26, 8:47, 8:48, 9:3, 9:34, 10:2, 10:2, 10:11, 10:19, 10:21, 10:23, 10:24, 10:44, 10:44, 10:57, 10:60, 10:92, 10:99, 10:104, 10:108, 11:17, 11:85, 11:103, 11:118, 11:119, 12:21, 12:38, 12:38, 12:40, 12:46, 12:49, 12:68, 12:103, 13:1, 13:6, 13:17, 13:31, 14:1, 14:25, 14:36, 14:37, 14:44, 14:52, 16:38, 16:44, 16:61, 16:69, 17:60, 17:60, 17:89, 17:89, 17:94, 17:106, 18:54, 18:55, 19:10, 19:21, 20:59, 21:2, 21:61, 22:1, 22:2, 22:3, 22:5, 22:8, 22:11, 22:18, 22:25, 22:27, 22:40, 22:49, 22:65, 22:73, 22:75, 22:78, 24:35, 25:37, 25:50, 26:39, 26:183, 27:16, 27:73, 27:82, 28:23, 28:43, 29:2, 29:10, 29:10, 29:43, 29:67, 30:6, 30:8, 30:30, 30:30, 30:33, 30:36, 30:39, 30:41, 30:58, 31:6, 31:18, 31:20, 31:33, 32:13, 33:37, 33:63, 34:28, 34:28, 34:36, 35:2, 35:3, 35:5, 35:15, 35:28, 35:45, 38:26, 39:27, 39:41, 40:57, 40:57, 40:59, 40:61, 40:61, 42:42, 43:33, 44:11, 45:20, 45:26, 46:6, 47:3, 48:20, 49:13, 54:20, 57:24, 57:25, 57:25, 59:21, 62:6, 66:6, 83:2, 83:6, 99:6, 101:4, 110:2, 114:1, 114:2, 114:3, 114:5, 114:6

Lane's Lexicon, Volume 8, pages: 120, 121  ##  http://ejtaal.net/aa/#q=nws

And their translation of 17:71 is odd:

17:71. One day We shall call together all human beings with their (respective) Imams: those who are given their record in their right hand will read it (with pleasure), and they will not be dealt with unjustly in the least.

Here the word Imam does occur but it's singular, not plural as they translated. In context, this is about Allah's (SWTAY) servants and the ships (Read from 17:54)

And their translation of 2:30 is also odd:

2:30.  And [mention, O Muhammad], when your Lord said to the angels, “Indeed, I will make upon the earth a successive authority.” They said, “Will You place upon it one who causes corruption therein and sheds blood, while we declare Your praise and sanctify You?” Allah said, “Indeed, I know that which you do not know.”

Here the word authority or Amrun does not occur in the Arabic text of Qur'an.

Amrun root word:

Alif-Meem-Ra (ا م ر) = command/order/enjoin, authority/power/dominion, counselled/advised/consulted, hold/appoint command, preside as a commander/governor/prince/king, experienced, become many/abundant.

Amara (prf. 3rd. p. m. sing.): He commanded.
Amaruu (prf. 3rd. p. m. plu.): They commanded.
Amarta (prf. 2nd p. m. sing.): Thou Commanded.
Amarnaa (prf. 1st. p. plu.) We commanded.
Ya'muru (imp. 3rd. p. m. sing.): He commands.
Ya'muruuna (imp. 3rd. m. plu.): They command.
Ta'muriina (imp. 2nd. p. f. sing.) Thou command.
Ta'muruuna (imp. 2nd. p. m. plu.): You command.
Aamuru (imp. 1st p. sing.): I command.
Aamuranna (imp. 1st. p. sing. emp.): I surely will command.
U'mur (prt. m. sing.): Give command.
Umiruu (pp. 3rd p. m. plu.): They were given command.
Umirtu (pp. 1st. p. sing): I was commanded.
Umirnaa (pp.1st. p. plu): We were commanded.
Yu'maru (pip. 3rd. p. m. sing.): He is commanded.
Yu'maruuna (pip. 3rd. m. plu.): They are commanded.
Tu'mar (pip. 2nd. p.m. sing.): Thou art commanded.
Tu'maruuna (pip. 2nd. p. m. plu.): You are commanded.
Ya'tamiruuna (imp. 3rd. p.m. plu. VIII): They are taking counsel.
I'tamiruu (prt. m. plu. VIII): Take counsel.
Amrun (n.): Matter; Affair; News; Command; Authority.
Umuur (n. plu.): Affairs; Matters; Commands.
Imrun (n.): Grievous.
Aamiruun (act. pic. m. plu.): Those who command.
Ammaaratun (intransitive. f.): Wont to command.

amara vb. (1)
perf. act. 2:27, 2:222, 4:114, 5:117, 7:12, 7:28, 7:29, 12:40, 12:68, 13:21, 13:25, 17:16, 22:41, 24:53, 66:6, 80:23, 96:12
impf. act. 2:44, 2:67, 2:93, 2:169, 2:268, 3:21, 3:80, 3:80, 3:104, 3:110, 3:114, 4:37, 4:58, 4:119, 4:119, 7:28, 7:110, 7:157, 9:67, 9:71, 11:87, 12:32, 16:76, 16:90, 19:55, 24:21, 25:60, 26:35, 27:33, 34:33, 39:64, 52:32, 57:24
impv. 7:145, 7:199, 20:132, 31:17
perf. pass. 4:60, 6:14, 6:71, 6:163, 9:31, 10:72, 10:104, 11:112, 13:36, 27:91, 27:91, 39:11, 29:12, 40:66, 42:15, 42:15, 98:5
impf. pass. 2:68, 15:65, 15:94, 16:50, 37:102, 66:6
n.vb. 2:109, 2:117, 2:210, 2:210, 2:275, 3:47, 3:109, 3:128, 3:147, 3:152, 3:154, 3:154, 3:154, 3:159, 3:186, 4:47, 4:59, 4:83, 4:83, 5:52, 5:95, 6:8, 6:58, 6:159, 7:54, 7:54, 7:77, 7:150, 8:42, 8:43, 8:44, 8:44, 9:24, 9:48, 9:50, 9:106, 10:3, 10:24, 10:31, 10:71, 10:71, 11:40, 11:43, 11:44, 11:58, 11:59, 11:66, 11:73, 11:76, 11:82, 1:94, 11:97, 11:97, 11:101, 11:123, 12:15, 12:18, 12:21, 12:41, 12:83, 12:102, 13:2, 13:11, 13:31, 14:22, 14:32, 15:66, 16:1, 16:2, 16:12, 16:33, 16:77, 17:85, 18:10, 18:16, 18:21, 18:28, 18:50, 18:69, 18:73, 18:82, 18:88, 19:21, 19:35, 19:39, 19:64, 20:26, 20:32, 20:62, 20:90, 20:93, 21:27, 21:73, 21:81, 21:93, 22:41, 22:65, 22:67, 22:76, 23:27, 23:53, 24:62, 24:63, 26:151, 27:32, 27:32, 27:33, 28:44, 30:4, 30:25, 30:46, 31:17, 31:22, 32:5, 32:24, 33:36, 33:37, 33:38, 34:12, 35:4, 36:82, 38:36, 40:15, 40:44, 40:68, 40:78, 41:12, 42:38, 42:43, 42:52, 42:53, 43:79, 44:4, 44:5, 45:12, 45:17, 45:18, 46:25, 47:21, 47:26, 49:7, 49:9, 50:5, 51:4, 51:44, 54:3, 54:12, 54:50, 57:5, 59:15, 64:5, 65:1, 65:3, 65:4, 65:5, 65:8, 65:9, 65:12, 79:5, 82:19, 97:4
pcple. act. 9:112

ammar n.m. 12:53, 18:71

imr n.m. 28:20

i'tamara vb. (8)
impf. act. 28:20
impv. 65:6

Lane's Lexicon, Volume 1, pages: 132, 133, 134, 135, 136  ##  http://ejtaal.net/aa/#q=amr

Now they state that only Allah who can appoint an Imam or Caliph, that is true but i don't see how exactly this is supporting the Shia position and plus the word Imam means Leader or President:

Alif-Miim-Miim (ا م م) =
ammina: to propose, direct one's steps towards a place, repair to, go towards [5:2]
ummun/umm: mother, source, principle, prototype, origin, prototype;
ummi: belonging to mother, unlettered, Arab, who have no revealed scripture of their own;
ummatun: a man's kinsfolk, tribe, party, community, nation, group of living things having certain characteristics or circumstances in common, any grouping of human or animal, creation, generation, creatures of God;
ummah: way/course/manner/mode of acting, faith, religion, nation, , time or period of time, righteous person, a person who is an object of imitation and who is known for goodness/virtues;
imam: leader, president, any object that is followed (e.g. human/book/highway), model, example, pattern;
amama: before, in front of [75:5]

amma vb. (1) pcple. act. 5:2

amam n.m. 75:5

imam n.m. (pl. a'immah) 2:124, 9:12, 11:17, 15:79, 17:71, 21:73, 25:74, 28:5, 28:41, 32:24, 36:12, 46:12

umm n.f. (pl. ummahat) 3:7, 4:11, 4:11, 4:23, 4:23, 4:23, 5:17, 5:75, 5:116, 6:92, 7:150, 13:39, 16:78, 19:28, 20:38, 20:40, 20:94, 23:50, 24:61, 28:7, 28:10, 28:13, 28:59, 31:14, 33:4, 33:6, 39:6, 42:7, 43:4, 46:15, 53:32, 58:2, 58:2, 80:35, 101:9

ummah n.f. (pl. umam) 2:128, 2:134, 2:141, 2:143, 2:213, 3:104, 3:110, 3:113, 4:41, 5:48, 5:66, 6:38, 6:42, 6:108, 7:34, 7:38, 7:38, 7:159, 7:160, 7:164, 7:168, 7:181, 10:19, 10:47, 10:49, 11:8, 11:48, 11:48, 11:118, 12:45, 13:30, 15:5, 16:36, 16:63, 16:84, 16:89, 16:92, 16:92, 16:93, 16:120, 21:92, 21:92, 22:34, 22:67, 23:43, 23:44, 23:52, 23:52, 27:83, 28:23, 28:75, 29:18, 35:24, 35:42, 40:5, 41:25, 42:8, 43:22, 43:23, 43:33, 45:28, 45:28, 46:18

ummiy n.m. 2:78, 3:20, 3:75, 7:157, 7:158, 62:2

Lane's Lexicon, Volume 1, page: 125, 126, 127, 128, 129  ##  http://ejtaal.net/aa/#q=amm

So what do you think dear siblings, i would like to hear your thoughts on this?

woke

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Re: Shia's claim on Qur'anic Verses
« Reply #1 on: May 09, 2019, 09:58:58 AM »
Bayt is not a physical house. It is a construct. like the construct of a tent, or a poem verse.  in 33:33 Quran is saying stay in your "construct" in order to know it better. the Al-Bayt is The Construct, as in Allah's construct.  The construct of the righteous.  so when it says we only want to purify the people of the bayt. That means learn Quran's construct (right and wrong) and why? in order to purify the people entering this construct or system to keep it pure. It is not referring to shia or sunni, or ahl al bayt of shia
peace

quincy

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Re: Shia's claim on Qur'anic Verses
« Reply #2 on: July 04, 2019, 06:48:26 AM »
THE CREED OF ABRAHAM INCLINING TO TRUTH AND ABSOLUTE SUBMISSION TO THE MOST HIGH - THE LIVING AND ETERNAL GOD - THE CREATOR OF ALL