Author Topic: FAITH  (Read 2211 times)

Mohammed.

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FAITH
« on: February 01, 2019, 09:23:39 AM »
Peace,

Do you really believe in GOD?
Then why you go to the doctor when you are ill? While GOD can heal all your illnesses?
Why you ask someone for a job? While GOD is capable of doing everything?

And you say,
You alone we worship and You alone we seek for help. [1:5]

Qur'an says,

Did the people think that they be left that they say: "We believed." And they are not being tested? [29:2]
##
Do you order the people with the righteousness and you forget yourselves, while you are reciting the Book? Do you not comprehend? [2:44]
And seek help through patience and through the prayers. And that it truly is a great/burden except on the humble. [2:45]
##
And most of them will not believe in God except while setting up partners. [12:106]
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And We will test you for We know those who strive among you and those who are patient. And We will bring out/justify your qualities/information. [47:31]
##
...Anyone who puts his trust in God, then He suffices him. The commands of God will be done. God has decreed for everything a measure. [65:3]

Peace and best wishes
-my current understanding. Verify for yourself -17:36.
O you who believe! Enter perfectly in islam/ Surrender yourselves wholly unto God [2:208], [3:19-20,85 2:132]

Sultan Brandon

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Re: FAITH
« Reply #1 on: February 01, 2019, 09:48:50 AM »
و عليكم السلام

Because then our free will and responsibility to improve ourselves and do good work would be null.  It goes back to why God created this affair on earth with all of its challenges to begin with.  We act, God supports.  You don't walk in front of a car and say, "I trust in God!" and expect not to get hit.  You look both ways and try to make the best decision but if you make a mistake then God may protect you.  Or if you're sick you take a remedy like garlic because that's the method that God might use to guide and heal you with, otherwise it would take a miracle every time instead of practical solutions that improve you through learning and gaining skills.  Its also why monasticism is a deviation because we shouldn't just sit and do nothing but pray while expecting that our Lord will do everything for us.  God willing, be He Glorified, the All-Knowing, Most Wise.

In the name of God, the All-Mighty, the Merciful
بسم الله الرحمن الرحيم

20:75 And he who comes to Him as a believer doing good works, for those will be the highest ranks.

20:76 Gardens of delight, with rivers flowing beneath them, abiding therein. Such is the reward of he who is developed.

57:27 Then We sent in their tracks Our messengers. And We sent Jesus, son of Mary, and We gave him the Gospel, and We ordained in the hearts of his followers kindness and mercy. But they invented Monasticism which We never decreed for them. They wanted to please God, but they did not observe it the way it should have been observed. Consequently, We gave those who believed among them their recompense, while many of them were wicked.

57:25 We have sent Our messengers with clear proofs, and We sent down with them the Book and the balance, so that the people may uphold justice. And We sent down the iron, wherein there is great strength, and many benefits for the people. So that God would distinguish those who would support Him and His messengers in the unseen. God is Powerful, Noble.





Cerberus

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Re: FAITH
« Reply #2 on: February 01, 2019, 10:26:27 AM »
To have faith is to understand that whatever happens to you is through good/right/purposeful intentions. That Providence has good intents. And they are explained. It is for one's betterment. So after truly grasping that one accepts whatever comes to them, trusts that it is for a higher good and does not blame anyone for what is not in their control.

The world doesn't lack of "believers" in a god. People have believed in a magical entity that would bring them success and health and all sort of profits for a long long time.

What is GOD ? You may not exactly know, but atleast ask, what is God to YOU ? How does the idea "there is a god" affect you ? How does it do so ? Is it through fear ? Is it through hope or other things ?

What do you mean by "illness" ? The illness of the body or the illness of the "soul" ? I suppose you mean the illness of the body. What's the difference between your teeth falling apart and your ceiling falling apart ? Won't you try to fix it ? Or is it because your teeth are part of your body and it MUST need a magical or paranormal way of fixing itself ? What's the difference between your body and your refrigerator ? Both you use on a daily basis and both you will leave on earth to decay upon departing.

Why do you ask someone for a job you say ? You have skills, I assume, and you tell the person: "I will lend you my skills in exchange for some coins" or you could use your own skills and make some coins yourself.

But really, you need to reconsider how the idea of God affects your life, in all honesty. Gotta keep thinking. It's all about thinking and expanding your understanding, not limiting it to superficial conclusions.

jkhan

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Re: FAITH
« Reply #3 on: February 01, 2019, 07:20:02 PM »
Dear Mohamed..
Peace
I will keep it simple and short....
If you have CCTV in your home,  will you be free of fear or go out and ask the enemy to shoot at you?  Hoping enemy won't shoot since CCTV around....
We believe God doesn't mean He needs to spoon feed us....
Mohamed and his companions not required to fight with enemies to save their lives... Simply they believe God could have destroyed enemies .....
Pls use your knowledge in wider angle.....

Sarah

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Re: FAITH
« Reply #4 on: February 02, 2019, 06:03:39 PM »
Peace

If I'm not mistaken, in the Qur'an it even says ask the people of knowledge...
I don't think it's forbidden to seek help etc. but obviously if you receive help through a doctor for example and you get better, the help you receive is ultimately from God.
'These are the verses of Allah which We recite to you in truth. Then in what statement (hadith) after Allah and His verses will they believe? (45:6)'

Mohammed.

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Re: FAITH
« Reply #5 on: February 02, 2019, 11:35:46 PM »
Peace all,

What do you think of the last verse in the post?

I repeat
...Anyone who puts his trust in God, then He suffices him. The commands of God will be done. God has decreed for everything a measure. [65:3]

Trust for what? no any exceptions there in the verse!

Peace
-my current understanding. Verify for yourself -17:36.
O you who believe! Enter perfectly in islam/ Surrender yourselves wholly unto God [2:208], [3:19-20,85 2:132]

jkhan

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Re: FAITH
« Reply #6 on: February 03, 2019, 12:27:52 AM »
Peace all,

What do you think of the last verse in the post?

I repeat
...Anyone who puts his trust in God, then He suffices him. The commands of God will be done. God has decreed for everything a measure. [65:3]

Trust for what? no any exceptions there in the verse!

Peace

Dear brother Mohamed peace...
That last verse is concern to you.... Suppose you are a believer in God and you want to live your normal life.... Do you consider yourself a robot of God... No... What is the meaning of freedom and the test of God then..... Remember dear this world's life is not Janna to have everything as you like... But this is a temporary field preparing for the permanent one... So to achieve it we need to Trust God.... The trust each and everyone keeps nay vary drastically..... Depending on that God will be definitely sufficient.... If you think we shouldn't  need anyone only God to live the life while having the assistance of other is bit complicated.. No.... It is like one says.... I don't need anyone in this world and I have money,  youth and power and I am not weak to take anyone's help.... Meantime does he really live on his own... How many people are required for his life directly and indirectly Yiu can imagine....
Keep faith Mohamed and continue your life and look things in more vistas...
God guide us he has guided and accepted many....

Cerberus

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Re: FAITH
« Reply #7 on: February 03, 2019, 02:52:40 AM »

...Anyone who puts his trust in God, then He suffices him


Now that is a good question, most people  don't think about these stuff and rather debate what to eat, what to say in prayer etc...

One can easily perceive God as that black box in the back of your mind in which you put your lamentations and hopes, it alleviates a good deal of stress and worry.

However, God is extremely close to us, the parable of God's proximity as per quran is "Closer than their jugular vein".
Moreover God is also takes credit of the good/benefitial that happens to us:
"Whatever good happens to thee is from God; and whatever evil befalls thee is from thyself"

God the extremely close that Brings good when followed and brings bad otherwise is for me the spirit of God that is in everyone of us that allows Reason and Will. This is what humans are blessed with unlike animals and that is what they ought to use throughout their life to understand their surrounding and then discriminate between what is right and wrong, pure and impure, and with the Power of their Will to do the right thing.

But that is not all, there are obstacles put deliberately to weaken our Will and blurry our Reason. These are the things we deal with on a daily basis. God is forging us into becoming pure.

This is an example of how one can go beyond superficial readings.

Mohammed.

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Re: FAITH
« Reply #8 on: March 12, 2019, 03:33:42 AM »
peace,

"And what struck/hit you from a misfortune /disaster so (it is) because (of) what your hands gathered/acquired, and He forgives/pardons on much." [42:30]

So illnesses come because of the sins. Will the doctor be able to cure it properly?

"And if I am sick/diseased, it is He Who cures me.? [26:80]

And disease will disappear when God wills/after completion of punishment. (Since God will not let a self to suffer more than what it deserves)
Then what is the point of going to the doctor? It is SHIRK in my understanding! (Seeking help from the doctor when God is not helping!)
And the doctors usually prescribe some chemicals to suppress the symptoms which influences neuro-hormonal systems / body's defence mechanism i.e. finding alternative ways! - They are treating the disease not curing.
And when God punishes their patients with new new diseases these doctors and their professors get confused, not able to even treat as they used to do in normal cases (because their treatment /judgment is based on what they taught by their teachers).

So repentance is the effective medicine. (Root cause treatment)
And honey may come after that.
?...from its bellies emerges a drink that has different colours, in it is a cure/healing for the people; in that is an evidence to a nation thinking.? [16:69]

And all the knowledge /guidance is from the Qur'an,
...say: ?For those who believe, it is a guide and healing. As for those who disbelieve, there is deafness in their ears, and they are blind to it. [41:44]

So in my view, using / suggesting any other medicine is,
Ignoring God's words (The Creator) and seeking alternative ways which are found by people / scientists/ doctors (just creatures).

[96:6] Alas, that truly the human/mankind tyrannizes/exceeds the limit.
[96:7] That he considers him(self), he enriched/sufficed (self-sufficient).


In short,
Physical /mental fitness is controlled by Immune system /Hormonal-neurotransmitter-chemical equilibrium and which is influenced by Attitude / consciousness / righteousness


*******
There are so many verses in the Qur'an which mentions the term for ill persons (Miim-Ra-Dad) e.g. [2:184, 2:196, 4:43, 4:102, 5:6, 9:91, 24:61, 48:17, 73:20]
But nowhere Qur'an mentions the term for physician/doctor!
--------------------------------------------------------------------------

Regarding Job-

Qur'an gives a clear example of the prophet Yusuf (Surah No. 12) where, job came to him when he was in prison!
Why Qur'an shares such stories with us? Just for information?

Another verse,
... and whoever reverences (fears and obeys) God, He makes/puts for him a way out/exit. And He provides for him from where/when he never expected. Anyone who puts his trust in God, then He suffices him. The commands of God will be done. God has decreed for everything a measure.? [65:2-3]

...and God is best of the providers.? [62:11]
-my current understanding. Verify for yourself -17:36.
O you who believe! Enter perfectly in islam/ Surrender yourselves wholly unto God [2:208], [3:19-20,85 2:132]

Sarah

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Re: FAITH
« Reply #9 on: March 12, 2019, 12:12:54 PM »
@Mohammed,
don't eat, don't sleep because God will suffice you by your logic.

Or...

Eat, sleep etc. and hope God will suffice you THROUGH HIS BLESSINGS...

God also wants you to use your brain!!!!

No it's not shirk to take medicine!!!

Sure your attitude etc. also influences your health but that's just one FACTOR.
'These are the verses of Allah which We recite to you in truth. Then in what statement (hadith) after Allah and His verses will they believe? (45:6)'

Mahdi Ibrahim

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Re: FAITH
« Reply #10 on: March 12, 2019, 01:27:43 PM »
Peace,

Do you really believe in GOD?
Then why you go to the doctor when you are ill? While GOD can heal all your illnesses?
Why you ask someone for a job? While GOD is capable of doing everything?


Allah is the Energy of EVERYTHING

Therefore this kind of thing is not even an issue for the Sunnatullah Alone Muslim

It is the issue for:

Quote
The Arabs say, "We have iman." Say: "You do not have iman." (49:14)

Even the jihad of 100 people against 1,000 people...

Quote
O Prophet! spur on the muminun to fight. If there are twenty of you who are steadfast, they will overcome two hundred; and if there are a hundred of you, they will overcome a thousand of those who are kafir, because they are people who do not understand. (Quran 8:65)

We only see the Light (Energy) in EVERYTHING, and His Promise (LordLaw of Cause & Effect).

There is no fear and no regret as long we:
  • Follow the Sunnatullah
  • Follow the Guidance, obey Natural Person
  • Jihad for the preservation of Natural Order/Natural Justice

Quote
Yes, the friends of Allah (Energy) will feel no fear and will know no sorrow. (10:62)

It is not even FAITH, and we don't need one..

We have CERTAINTY IN KNOWLEDGE; ie. "... the conditions of natural harmony.."  :laugh:
Matheism is the conditions of natural harmony for all situations | What defines you?

Mahdi Ibrahim

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Re: FAITH
« Reply #11 on: March 12, 2019, 01:51:02 PM »
...will never pass the test unless accept "Allah is Energy"

But you cannot will, unless Allah (ENERGY) wills. (76:30)

Quote
...those who are kafir, because they are people who do not understand. (Quran 8:65)

That is your reward, so taste it. The kafirun will also have the punishment of the Fire.

You who have iman! when you encounter those who are kafir advancing in massed ranks into battle, do not turn your backs on them.

Anyone who turns his back on them that day, unless he is withdrawing to rejoin the fight or withdrawing to support another group, brings Allah´s anger down upon himself. His refuge is Hell. What an evil destination!

You did not kill them; it was Allah who killed them; and you did not throw, when you threw; it was Allah who threw: so He might test the muminun with this excellent trial from Him. Allah is All-Hearing, All-Knowing.

That is your reward. Allah always confounds the schemes of the kuffar ("Anyone who turns his back on them that day").

(8:14-18)


THE TEST

Say: He, Light, is ONE, is EVERYTHING. (112:1-2)

We only see the Light (Energy) in EVERYTHING, and His Promise (LordLaw of Cause & Effect).
Matheism is the conditions of natural harmony for all situations | What defines you?

Mohammed.

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Re: FAITH
« Reply #12 on: March 12, 2019, 08:12:41 PM »
Physical /mental fitness is controlled by Immune system /Hormonal-neurotransmitter-chemical equilibrium and which is influenced by Attitude / consciousness / righteousness

Correction:
Should read Conscientiousness not consciousness.


@Sarah,

...say: ?For those who believe, it is a guide and healing. As for those who disbelieve, there is deafness in their ears, and they are blind to it. [41:44]

Of course FAITH matters.
-my current understanding. Verify for yourself -17:36.
O you who believe! Enter perfectly in islam/ Surrender yourselves wholly unto God [2:208], [3:19-20,85 2:132]

Mohammed.

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Re: FAITH
« Reply #13 on: April 03, 2019, 09:05:52 PM »
peace,

I think ‘muhlisan lahuddeen’ is a rarely discussed Qur’anic term

[39:2] We have sent down to you the Book with the truth, so serve God faithful/loyal/devoted the system to Him.
[39:11] Say: “I have been commanded to serve God, faithful/loyal/devoted the system to Him.”
[39:14] Say: “God is the One I serve, faithful/loyal/devoted my system to Him.”

And they were not commanded except to serve God and be faithful/loyal/devoted to His system, monotheists, and hold the swalat and contribute towards purification. Such is the straight/ valuable system. [98:5]

Say: “My Lord orders justice, and that you set your faces at every temple/Masjid, and that you call on Him, while being faithful/loyal/devoted to Him in the system; as He initiated you, you return.” A group He has guided and a group have deserved misguidance; that they have taken the devils as allies besides God; and they think they are guided! [ 7:29-30]

[15:39-42]
He(Iblees) said: “My Lord, for that by which You have caused me to be misled, I will beautify for them (what is) on the earth, and I will mislead them all.”
“Except Your servants from among them, the faithful/loyal/devoted ones.”
He(Allah) said: “This shall be a straight path to Me.”
“For My servants, you shall have no authority over them, except those who are misled and follow you.”

Also see (40:14,65, 12:24, 19:51, 37:40,74,128,160,169)

So what is 'muhlisan lahuddeen'? Qur’an demonstrates it in the following verses

He is the One who enables you to travel on land and on the sea, until when you were on the ships and We drive them with a good wind which they rejoice with, a strong gust comes to them and the waves come to them from all sides, and they think that they are (being) surrounded/encircled, they implore God faithful/loyal/devoted to His system: “If You save us from this, we will be of the thankful.” [10:22]

When they ride on a ship, they call on God, faithful/loyal/devoted the system to Him. But as soon as He saves them to the shore, they set up partners. [29:65]

This is the human’s state of mind (only)WHEN disasters/ difficulties come from all directions i.e. No escape (e.g. when their doctors are helpless, they will sincerely call GOD).
But for a true believer, this (GOD Alone) ‘state of mind’ is in his Whole life (in ALL Affairs) as commanded by the Prophet(s).
-my current understanding. Verify for yourself -17:36.
O you who believe! Enter perfectly in islam/ Surrender yourselves wholly unto God [2:208], [3:19-20,85 2:132]

Mohammed.

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Re: FAITH
« Reply #14 on: May 27, 2019, 09:00:32 AM »
peace,

When people have no money (for visting a doctor), the only way is to depend/call God,
And when they have money, they seek refuge with the doctor.

39:8
And if harm touched the human, he called his Lord repenting to Him, then if He made him own a blessing/goodness from Him, he forgot what he was calling to Him from before, and he made/put to God equals to misguide from His path, say: " enjoy with your disbelief little that you are from the fire's owners/company."

For Red bold
Qur'an does not mentions doctors but says,

"And if I am sick/diseased, it is He Who cures me.” [26:80]

People say we believe in one God. We are people of the Qur’an.
But it’s difficult/doubtful for them to think/believe that,

The One Who created/brought them,
The One Who engineered/designed them,
The One Who still keeps them alive/existing

can cure their diseases/illnesses!!!

Did the people think that they be left that they say: "We believed." And they are not being
tested?
[29:2]

All the praises and thanks be to God, Lord of the worlds.
-my current understanding. Verify for yourself -17:36.
O you who believe! Enter perfectly in islam/ Surrender yourselves wholly unto God [2:208], [3:19-20,85 2:132]