What does the root 3bd (ع ب د) means as per Quran?

[jkhan]

Dear Novice and almarh....
My intention here in writing the reply to you both is not convince you but to say what I am convinced in Quran about Salat and its one of the meaning...
For me 17:110-111 is more than enough as verdict that salat is clear cut.... In 2:238 God asks us to guard salah and stand and no other physical postures are mentioned... Imagine God says 4:101-103 about Salat...  Whatever u understood by it.. Doesn't matter.  Just look at the verse 4:103 God elaborates 03 postures in it... Standing, sitting down, on your sides...  This is right after the completion of salah ... If God can manifestly say these three positions once finished the salat God won't miss out all the postures of salah.. Coz God only gave our posture for Salat.. That is standing... See the order of postures... Once salat is over.. Salat is only standing... So once it is ended those who performed salat will be in Standing position spontaneously .. Even after salat God orders to remember Him but it is not Salat but just remembering... So standing then once tired of standing then sitting then tired move on to sides... That's so natural... If Salat ended in physical sujud..i.e..in a sitting position thrn to say immediately to remember after Salat to STANDING AND SITTING AND ON SIDES... it's pretty weird...
4:142 even hypocrites so salat just to show... But here also only given the command as  STANDING  and no  other postures..
Even zakaria while he is doing Salat he was standing... No other postures stated.. Remember don't confuse the meaning of sujud... For me sujud is not at all a physical posture... I don't mind what is your understanding of sujud.. I will prove it if anyone open a new topic on it..
Even God says don't stand in such Masjid.. Here also only posture is standing..
Even one of the familiar verses 62:11 Here also the standing...
I have the above explanation just for everyone to think.. But for me 17:110 - 111 is more than enough as physical Salat..
How hilarious you guys asking how many times to do rakah...has God explained you how many times to wash your hands and face etc.. If your mom asked you to wash your hands before eating when you were kids.. Would you ask how many times or how I have to wash... It's self perceptions... We know why we wash hands n not the repetition . But God has ordered to wash.. Just wash it.. Does that order not consist one time at least ...  You like to do it 2 , 3 4 or whatever.... Keep doing...  If God asked us to stand.. Do we need to know how many times to stand in Salat ... This is nonsensical at level best...
If there is a beginning there is ending... If you wash your face you have to complete washing it and we can't ask how to complete washing the face.. If god asked us to wash the hand till elbow we can't keep asking which point of elbow.. Oh water went past the elbow.. Oh God water went upto my armpit... Or water went Upto my knees.. Just rubbish.. Don't put youraelf into hardship.. God is so crystal clear.. Just keep it simple... Same way.. Once you making salat you need to complete it and cannot keep doing forever.. If it is Fajr.. You can't keep it doing till sunrise... We are doing salat to admire our load on given and specified time so we go to make it during that time... After all we humble in Salat with great humility and if we feel that's enough thrn end it... That's up to you.. Afterall a true surrenderer will end it with much of submission..
For these God doesn't need to give step by step rules.. As of property division... As of anyone's capabilities they can admire God to be in connection with God... Salt is least if connection but there are many ways to approach God...

God has taught us Salat... 2:239 ...even in this verse.. We can understand that while riding or walking the act of Salat can be performed without causing any blemishes to it.. Coz the only posture for Salat is standing.. If the salt involves many a complicated positions as we are aware.. Then this verse needs further explanation hoe to do the Salat while riding and walking... That's must.. At least for me..
God bless us all..

[imrankhawaja]

4:101-103.

protecting,helping,gaurding,security all can be attitudes/kinds/parts of sala.
one can perform it in the cause of God by not taking service money etc.

in seventh century that sala was need for community when they were under attack (security issues) hence focusing on all parts of sala give us and warn us about duties more than rituals.

modern person is getteing his sala done through CCTV  i rate those people 1400 yrs ago, they faced tough time and its obvious they give duties at those times considered as salas for ch 107 good example set there, as much i think about that chapter the concept of sala make me think more about it. so in this ERA its our duty/responsibilty to check what sala we can perform for our God that will give benefit to the people of God.

although sunni/shia people are using modern technology in their mosques using gps loudspeakers etc.

Quran is empty about the methods of ritual
called namaz(pray) what people take is as sala?

103 is clearing that movement of actions are not really important.( may b people used to do in ritualistic pray and it can be dangerous in war ground etc).

REAL thing is  they must b sincear in giving duties when community need it like wars, flood, earthquake, tsonami etc.

author try to make people understand what their sala should be but all
nations before us make their rituals their sala just that they dnt have to spend their money and services in cause of God , its pretty easy way to dodge God.

God bless you all

[good logic]

Peace Imran.
When you say, quote:

author try to make people understand what their sala should be but all
nations before us make their rituals their sala just that they dnt have to spend their money and services in cause of God , its pretty easy way to dodge God.

The author is asking them to do both and more::" Aquimi Salat, Give Zakat and do good deeds"
Those who dodge are fooling themselves not GOD.--Khasiru Anfusahum- neglected their souls, real sef.
GOD bless yu.
Peace.

[Novice]

My intention here in writing the reply to you both is not convince you but to say what I am convinced in Quran about Salat and its one of the meaning...
For me 17:110-111 is more than enough as verdict that salat is clear cut.... In 2:238 God asks us to guard salah and stand and no other physical postures are mentioned... Imagine God says 4:101-103 about Salat...  Whatever u understood by it.. Doesn't matter.  Just look at the verse 4:103 God elaborates 03 postures in it... Standing, sitting down, on your sides...  This is right after the completion of salah ... If God can manifestly say these three positions once finished the salat God won't miss out all the postures of salah.. Coz God only gave our posture for Salat.. That is standing... See the order of postures... Once salat is over.. Salat is only standing... So once it is ended those who performed salat will be in Standing position spontaneously .. Even after salat God orders to remember Him but it is not Salat but just remembering... So standing then once tired of standing then sitting then tired move on to sides... That's so natural... If Salat ended in physical sujud..i.e..in a sitting position thrn to say immediately to remember after Salat to STANDING AND SITTING AND ON SIDES... it's pretty weird...
4:142 even hypocrites so salat just to show... But here also only given the command as  STANDING  and no  other postures..
Even zakaria while he is doing Salat he was standing... No other postures stated.. Remember don't confuse the meaning of sujud... For me sujud is not at all a physical posture... I don't mind what is your understanding of sujud.. I will prove it if anyone open a new topic on it..
Even God says don't stand in such Masjid.. Here also only posture is standing..
Even one of the familiar verses 62:11 Here also the standing...
I have the above explanation just for everyone to think.. But for me 17:110 - 111 is more than enough as physical Salat..
How hilarious you guys asking how many times to do rakah...has God explained you how many times to wash your hands and face etc.. If your mom asked you to wash your hands before eating when you were kids.. Would you ask how many times or how I have to wash... It's self perceptions... We know why we wash hands n not the repetition . But God has ordered to wash.. Just wash it.. Does that order not consist one time at least ...  You like to do it 2 , 3 4 or whatever.... Keep doing...  If God asked us to stand.. Do we need to know how many times to stand in Salat ... This is nonsensical at level best...
If there is a beginning there is ending... If you wash your face you have to complete washing it and we can't ask how to complete washing the face.. If god asked us to wash the hand till elbow we can't keep asking which point of elbow.. Oh water went past the elbow.. Oh God water went upto my armpit... Or water went Upto my knees.. Just rubbish.. Don't put youraelf into hardship.. God is so crystal clear.. Just keep it simple... Same way.. Once you making salat you need to complete it and cannot keep doing forever.. If it is Fajr.. You can't keep it doing till sunrise... We are doing salat to admire our load on given and specified time so we go to make it during that time... After all we humble in Salat with great humility and if we feel that's enough thrn end it... That's up to you.. Afterall a true surrenderer will end it with much of submission..
For these God doesn't need to give step by step rules.. As of property division... As of anyone's capabilities they can admire God to be in connection with God... Salt is least if connection but there are many ways to approach God...

God has taught us Salat... 2:239 ...even in this verse.. We can understand that while riding or walking the act of Salat can be performed without causing any blemishes to it.. Coz the only posture for Salat is standing.. If the salt involves many a complicated positions as we are aware.. Then this verse needs further explanation hoe to do the Salat while riding and walking... That's must.. At least for me..
God bless us all..

Salaam Brother

Your whole post is based on one assumption that salat=ritual prayer which has certain actions spread all over in different verses in bits and pieces. You have to struggle really hard to assemble the jigsaw of ritual prayer by using individual verses out of context.

Salat is an Arabic verb. Arabic words are derived from their roots. Each root has a basic meaning and all words derived from a root have the original meaning of the root manifest in them.

The root making the word salat means to follow closely.
Can you explain how the meaning of "following closely" become "ritual prayer"?

God bless you.

[Novice]

Salaam brother GL

You say I am following my elders. I say I am following Millat Abraham.

We did you meet Abraham to know what is "Millat Abraham" so we have to find it in Quran.

Quran claims to be a detailed book. It must explain the commands given in it. When it says follow "millat Abraham" then it must give details of "millat Abraham". I suggest brother spend some time to find out what is explained about Abraham in Quran to understand "millat Abraham"

You say contact prayer is not in Qoran, I say collect all the verses about it and you will see why "Aquimi Salat cannot be anything else:

Again assumption that salat=contact prayer. Please see all the verses to find out what salat is?

Root ṣād lām wāw (ص ل و) means "to follow closely"
The verb صَلَّىٰ Salla means "he followed closely"

The noun الصَّلَاةَ As-salat means "what you follow closely" For me As-salat is God's Guidance as preserved in Quran. Every set of verses before the command "Aqimi salat" gives us the guidance (the following) in the light of Quran.

The session can be called by a community leader to decide what is "Aqimis salat" in a certain situation in the light of God's revelation. (62:9)

To attend these sessions we are commanded to wash ourselves so fellow members do not have any discomfort. (5:6)

We can understand verses if we stick to the root meaning of the words instead of following alien meanings given by imams to control and oppress masses.

Then we inspired you (Muhammad) to follow the religion of Abraham,* the monotheist; he never was an idol worshiper..
ثُمَّ أَوحَينا إِلَيكَ أَنِ اتَّبِع مِلَّةَ إِبرٰهيمَ حَنيفًا وَما كانَ مِنَ المُشرِكينَ
Of course that includes Aquimi Salat.

Again an assumption that millat Abraham=riligion of Abraham and that it includes "Aqimis salat"
As already said above please find time to find out what Quran informs us about millat Abraham. I point out a clue that Abraham was not from "mushrikeem" and he was a "hanif".

Thanks brother for discussing it amicable. I will end my discussion here by quoting Quran once again for a sincere reflection.

2:170 وَإِذَا قِيلَ لَهُمُ ٱتَّبِعُواْ مَآ أَنزَلَ ٱللَّهُ قَالُواْ بَلۡ نَتَّبِعُ مَآ أَلۡفَيۡنَا عَلَيۡهِ ءَابَآءَنَآ‌ۗ أَوَلَوۡ كَانَ ءَابَآؤُهُمۡ لَا يَعۡقِلُونَ شَيۡـًٔ۬ا وَلَا يَهۡتَدُونَ
And when it is said to them to follow what God has revealed they say nay we follow what we found our elders on .....

31:21
وَإِذَا قِيلَ لَهُمُ ٱتَّبِعُواْ مَآ أَنزَلَ ٱللَّهُ قَالُواْ بَلۡ نَتَّبِعُ مَا وَجَدۡنَا عَلَيۡهِ ءَابَآءَنَآ‌ۚ أَوَلَوۡ ڪَانَ ٱلشَّيۡطَـٰنُ يَدۡعُوهُمۡ إِلَىٰ عَذَابِ ٱلسَّعِيرِ
And when it is said to them follow what God has revealed they say nay we follow what we found our elders on ..............

And there is no verse in Quran that gives detail of ritual prayer in one place as a command to follow, like how many units, how many sujud and raku in one unit, what to say in contact prayer etc..

I beg leave now brother Gl and leave all posts for the readers to reflect on and find their own understanding of "Aqimis salat" in the light of Quran.

God bless you.

[Novice]

    your interpretation makes no sense!   

"then you establish for them "the following".   What does that mean?  Do they even have
the time during war?

Brother stick to the root meanings of words and see what they convey rather than following alien meanings assigned to Quranic words to control and oppress people.

In every war people do attend meetings with their commanders to get directions on what to follow. It may be called war strategy. Once decided it becomes the guidance to be followed closely. These meetings can be conducted during war and caution can be preserved and weapons could be held.

In fact ritual prayer will be a great danger and an opportunity to be attacked by enemy.

"when they all submit/acknowledge"     makes no sense.

In such meetings during war times listening to the commander and acknowledging it and following it closely would be required. It does make sense brother.

There is no rakat system as per Quran, how many times you stand is up to you except in congregation one follows the leader. 
Sometimes I do one rakat (for lack of a better word) sometime two, NO you need
not "follow the elders blindly" create your own system, you make the details,
don't miss out on this wonderful gift from Allah.  Stand bow and prostrate and say
what you want to say with help from Quran.  Make the physical salat once a day
or five times a day it is up to you. Make it sitting if you have pain issues. 
If you miss an entire day there is no penalty.

So create your own system and make details. Well Quran call it "following their "desires" taking their "desires" as their gods" etc.

25:43
أَرَءَيۡتَ مَنِ ٱتَّخَذَ إِلَـٰهَهُ ۥ هَوَٮٰهُ أَفَأَنتَ تَكُونُ عَلَيۡهِ وَڪِيلاً
Do you see the one who takes his wishes as his god .....

28:50
فَإِن لَّمۡ يَسۡتَجِيبُواْ لَكَ فَٱعۡلَمۡ أَنَّمَا يَتَّبِعُونَ أَهۡوَآءَهُمۡ‌ۚ وَمَنۡ أَضَلُّ مِمَّنِ ٱتَّبَعَ هَوَٮٰهُ بِغَيۡرِ هُدً۬ى مِّنَ ٱللَّهِ‌ۚ إِنَّ ٱللَّهَ لَا يَہۡدِى ٱلۡقَوۡمَ ٱلظَّـٰلِمِينَ
So if they do not respond to you then know they only follow their desires, and who is more astray who follow his desires without guidance from God, Surely God does not guide those who are transgressors.

So brother you can make your own rituals but they are not commanded by God unless they are detailed in a verse in the detailed Quran for us to follow.

And we cannot bring a verse from Quran detailing for us how to perform ritual prayer.

God bless you.

[imrankhawaja]

The author is asking them to do both and more::" Aquimi Salat, Give Zakat and do good deeds"

so you are trying to say author is saying to do SALA and RITUALs both ?
or sala and zaka ?
or sala and zaka and another things(rituals) ?
whats arabic of rituals (used) by quran?

God bless you

[Novice]

Quran is empty about the methods of ritual
called namaz(pray) what people take is as sala?

Thank you brother that is the issue under discussion. There is no detail of ritual prayer in the detailed Quran. I have been asking repeatedly to show me a verse detailing ritual prayer but no success as there is none in the Quran.

Anyway enough time spent on this discussion. Time to move on. My purpose was to bring out what is revealed in Quran without blindly following what is told to us by our elders. Let the readers decide what they find in the verses to follow.

God bless you.

[imrankhawaja]

In such meetings during war times listening to the commander and acknowledging it and following it closely would be required. It does make sense brother.

peace brother,
it does make sense certainly.
and also there is an example set in one occassion of WAR when a party of beleivers disobey the command of leader and resulted in heavy losses in war?

Although it was in the reference of self defence war for beleivers.

GOD bless you too

[Novice]

it does make sense certainly.
and also there is an example set in one occassion of WAR when a party of beleivers disobey the command of leader and resulted in heavy losses in war?

Thank you brother for reminding that war. In fact that is a good fit for the verb "salla" i.e. to follow closely. Muslim in fact lost that battle and incurred heavy loss because they did not follow closely what was decided for them by their commander.