WIDTH OF HEAVEN AND WIDTH OF EARTH.. ARE THEY EQUAL AS PER 57:21

[Cerberus]

Ok you want to "believe in quran". But you forget these things: You are the one reading it, and that reading depends on your capabilities, which also depends on how far are you are willing to go in your studies, and the depth of your understandings. So at the end of the process it's no longer "believe in quran" rather it is to believe in the belief you constructed from your reading of the quran. That's a big difference.

[jkhan]

Oops off topic.  So let's watch some videos...
https://youtu.be/tqKjcqcSh4Y
How courageous people are to spread the truth... God bless them and guide them...

[good logic]

Peace jkhan.
So it comes to videos? What happened to Qoran?
Brother Cerberus has given you the benefit of a doubt and is asking you to search INSIDE YOU,
But you keep searching outside you and outside Qoran?
So are you just giving lip service to Qoran?
Do you really see the irony ?
Or may be your videos have got more truths than NASA videos?
We are here to reflect about the shape of our "Nafs" first and foremost?
Yes brother, follow Qoran and find your real self, then you will see reality and you will become less "fanatic" about false truths.
By all means discuss the shape of the earth but also realise salvation is about "Tuzakki" your own soul. This is the most important truth.
GOD bless you.
Peace.

[huruf]

Ok you want to "believe in quran". But you forget these things: You are the one reading it, and that reading depends on your capabilities, which also depends on how far are you are willing to go in your studies, and the depth of your understandings. So at the end of the process it's no longer "believe in quran" rather it is to believe in the belief you constructed from your reading of the quran. That's a big difference.

Spot on, Cerberus, better cannot be said.

That is the usual trouble, to take an opinion, and consecrate it into truth. Of ocurse it is legitimate to have an opinion and many opinions, but one cheats himself when one confuses his or her on opinion with truth. One may believe it is truth, but it is still an opinion, and it is dangerous to promote it into anything else, because then you are confusing yourself with infallibility. And nobody is infallible. Even if many times we are right 
we still are not infallible. So when e believe ourselves infallible even if it is only in one thing we do commit shirk, because al Haqq is only God, we are servants, oshippers of it, not the owners.

We may be right, of course, but we are not to pose as if we knew everything, because even if we are right it is still only partial and only an opinion, it may be a relief or a mercy of God, but it is not ours and we do not possess truth.

And also, it is also very, very childish and silly to turn certain kinds of things into a question of truth or lie. Eventually, God says so in the Qur'an He will show us truth. Till that moment our truths are provisional, interine. We gain nothing by becoming warriors for it. The wrong war, rather the right war or the right to competition would be to be merciful and generous with all as best as we are able and to the best of our understanding. The war for flat earth of unflat earth should not be on the level of faith or truth but on the level of humble study. Truth Al Haqq owns us, we do not own it.

Salaam

[NewFrenzy]

Ok you want to "believe in quran". But you forget these things: You are the one reading it, and that reading depends on your capabilities, which also depends on how far are you are willing to go in your studies, and the depth of your understandings. So at the end of the process it's no longer "believe in quran" rather it is to believe in the belief you constructed from your reading of the quran. That's a big difference.

He is in loving Allah and doing jihad  as Allah said he will bring a people who will love him,
Al-Ma'idah 5:54

يَٰٓأَيُّهَا ٱلَّذِينَ ءَامَنُوا۟ مَن يَرْتَدَّ مِنكُمْ عَن دِينِهِۦ فَسَوْفَ يَأْتِى ٱللَّهُ بِقَوْمٍ يُحِبُّهُمْ وَيُحِبُّونَهُۥٓ أَذِلَّةٍ عَلَى ٱلْمُؤْمِنِينَ أَعِزَّةٍ عَلَى ٱلْكَٰفِرِينَ يُجَٰهِدُونَ فِى سَبِيلِ ٱللَّهِ وَلَا يَخَافُونَ لَوْمَةَ لَآئِمٍۚ ذَٰلِكَ فَضْلُ ٱللَّهِ يُؤْتِيهِ مَن يَشَآءُۚ وَٱللَّهُ وَٰسِعٌ عَلِيمٌ

O you who have believed, whoever of you should revert from his religion - Allah will bring forth [in place of them] a people He will love and who will love Him [who are] humble toward the believers, powerful against the disbelievers; they strive in the cause of Allah and do not fear the blame of a critic. That is the favor of Allah ; He bestows it upon whom He wills. And Allah is all-Encompassing and Knowing.

[NewFrenzy]

Since when is an islamophobe media an authority in Qur'an?


Salaam

That is a great page on flat Earth and the Quran.
You don't like it I understand I also used to hate it but now I like it. Now I m reading many stuffs which I used to hate.

And that is not an Islamophobe media that is also like a user in this forum posting his views opinions interpretations which you may dislike.

[huruf]

That is a great page on flat Earth and the Quran.
You don't like it I understand I also used to hate it but now I like it. Now I m reading many stuffs which I used to hate.

And that is not an Islamophobe media that is also like a user in this forum posting his views opinions interpretations which you may dislike.

I do not hate that page or anything. I am not a perosn able to hate, but a disapprove it and consider it prejudicial to many people.

It is islamophobe, but another thing is that you consider that there is a certains strain of islamophobe that you like or that you approve of.

I accpet hat anybody may believe the earth is flat or that the with of this or that is such and such even if I do not believe it myself, being rong is not the same thing as being will willed.

Islmaophobes are ill willed. They spend efforts and money, not theirs, in spreading it and iving every kind of
"proof" that islamophobia is justifiedIt is exactly the same thing as hen yougo about jews being this or that, but you will say but all jews ar enot like onlu some of them, there you are, then do not speak about jews at all, speak about people that this or that, exactly like the qur'an does. Those who do this or that, it is what they do what is right or wrong, not being knows as jew or muslim or christian. Don't you think that we could also create a great christianofobe page? There is no less material for it than there is for islamophobia.

Of course I will never approve of criating a chroanophobe pago ar any kind of ---fobe page. Than why should I approve of any islamohpobe page?

Wrong muslims are no less deserving of respect than wrong anything.

Salaam

[tlihawa]

Brother Cerberus has given you the benefit of a doubt and is asking you to search INSIDE YOU,
But you keep searching outside you and outside Qoran?

yes, I agree with you Good logic, to search inside of us for the truth.

51:20 And on the earth are signs for those who comprehend.
51:21 And within yourselves; do you not see?

within ourselves, we can find the truth.

41:53 We will show them Our signs in the horizons, and within themselves, until it becomes clear to them that this is the truth. Is it not enough that your Lord is witness over all things?

We can compare the creation of the universe with the creation of man,..it just about the scale.

40:57 The creation of the heavens and the earth is greater than the creation of the people, but most of the people do not know.

I have my own opinion regarding "searching inside of us" for the truth in here,

https://free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9609156.msg413444#msg413444

Hope it helps.

Salaam

[jkhan]

Hi Logic and the rest...
Yes brother quran is core for the believer and that's why from the beginning I started this topic with Quran.. But it does not mean that we should neglect our senses and the rest we perceive... Quran is instructions for salvation and at the same time wisdom and truth and proofs for many researches... It doesn't mean that we read Quran and read and be satisfied and agree... No.. Not for me.. Once thorough  with Quran then go search and find faults in Quran if possible that I don't see... For example God says to observe how the camel is created... So I cant keep reading it again and again or just like many mainstream guys keep reading it in Arabic hoping you would get benefit... No way.. Once God has said to see how camel is created go look how it is created and why it is created like that or is it created or evolution and why things are perfect... Etc. Etc. Don't tell me brother logic to bring quran and not videos... I know what i am doing... When God says we created two seas and both not join...  So search,  if not possible find out what others have searched and verify.... Quran is like school.. You remain as long as they keep you,  once done keep moving and do research what's taught in school rather than ponder and be satisfied what's taught in school is absolutely right and I am gonna live accordingly.. That's insane... That will make you a blind mere follower..
Yes MissHuruf and Cerberus everyone look at quran in their own angle.. Hadith believers found quran says they should follow hadith and they bring loads of verses to support it and you can keep denying them with what you understood.. So who is right and who is wrong and who will decide what's right.. Same Christians and jews and Hindus etc.. They all will claim they are right and rest are wring.. People can argue and they will bring their own proof and matter will go on.... But as I said earlier in one of my responses... "GUIDANCE CANNOT BE OF WRONG CHOICE " Then it is not guidance.. Yes God guides and if you feel if you are guided and if you are 100 % sure that doesn't end there.. Coz God guides..God definitely will make you feel bothered that you are wrong till He guides if you are someone destined for His mercy n guidance... . And until u die.. That's TEST... Then you should have that guts and strength and open mindedness to accept that I was wrong when truth is manifested... But for some they may think till their death they are guided but in fact not... Problem here is if Logic or Huruf or Cerberus or others feel that they are on right path and I have to accept that I am on wrong path.. Coz I don't accept the way they believe... Now who will judge here who is on the guidance.. No one can ... Right... That's why God tests with our senses... No one has seen the world is round but all are theory but there is one TRUTH... It is there in a shape how God created... BTW God didn't say it's a secret or rather Ghaib... That's where senses comes into effect.. Perceive it, feel it verify it and compare with God's book... Have you done it?...  Or you guys remain firm on something which has been taught to you and trying manipulate words according to what's taught... Then God's guidance is not there... Leave everything  what has been taught and start fresh and start ponder with your own knowledge so you are not biased to anyone or even to quran.. Then compare with quran if you have totally surrendered to QURAN... Surrender doesn't mean your heart accepted everything and not harbouring any doubt.. Surrending is just a reaction towards something with intention and not practical in all aspects, but a long process of reforming..
God kept in everything what is against the truth...coz God wants to guide whom He wills... But Satan wants to misguide.. So he spread his deception everywhere.. But he forgot his deception makes the believer more stronger.. For disbeliever Satan's deception is decorated... Unless this spinning ball theory is there I won't research the flat earth to this extent... God's plan is great.... God is using Satan itself for the true guidance  of believers.. Satan invent and we go away from it though  whole world surrender to it... God says we make our signs prevail UNTILL they know it is the truth... So if world is globe does it mean God brought the Truth or some yester year Sun worshipping Greek or NASA... In my experience God won't bring anything at once as truth... Only gradually it comes out ... If world is globe nothing to be brought as truth and everything is already exposed... That doesn't match with the Quranic verse... I trust the minority... Coz I know majority will trust Satan.. Coz Satan words are so fancy and attractive.. In fancy and attraction deception is hidden...
After seeing some of these public videos,  I personally feel how far Satan has convinced the hearts of people...
I wish God guide you all... But unfortunately  God never change until we change ourself. . God bless believers. 
https://youtu.be/bJyT2hD8ox0
https://youtu.be/M2qwvAivfGM
Watch it pls when u have time...
Most heated and surging topic in the internet and here it is moved to off topic.no idea what forum rules.. . Not an issue anyway...

[jkhan]

https://youtu.be/ujBBLYHBsQY

Watch this cool video... You can also do such while  you fly...what is best than self perceptions and verification..
God bless believers