Author Topic: ACCORDING TO THE QURAN , ALCOHOL IS NOT HARAM, IT IS "CONDITIONAL HALAL"  (Read 2205 times)

Emre_1974tr

  • Apprentice
  • **
  • Posts: 189
  • Karma +0/-0
As the followers of the Quran know, only God can determine what is halal (lawful) or haram (forbidden).

16/116*And do not say, as to what your tongues falsely describe: "This is lawful, and that is forbidden;" that you seek to invent lies about God. Those who invent lies about God will not succeed.

16/35*And those who were polytheists said: "If God had wished, we would not have served a thing other than Him; neither us nor our fathers; nor would we have made unlawful anything other than from Him." Those before them did exactly the same thing; so are the messengers required to do anything except deliver with clarity?

And the forbidden/haram food and drink (the blood) are announced explicitly by our Lord in His book:

5/3*Forbidden to you is that which is already dead, and the blood, and the meat of pig, and what was dedicated to other than God, and that which has been strangled, and that which has been beaten to death, and that which has fallen from a height, and that which has been gored, and that which the wild animals have eaten from except what you managed to rescue, and what has been slaughtered on altars, and what you divide through arrows of chance. This is vile. Today the rejecters have given up from your system, so do not be concerned by them, but be concerned by Me. Today I have perfected your system for you, and completed My blessings upon you, and I have approved submission as the system for you. So, whoever is forced by severe hunger and not seeking sin, then God is Forgiving, Merciful.

However, interpreters of the Quran hide our Lord's message by distorting the meaning of a verse (5/93), thus they can add other harams to the God's list. There is a passage in surah Al-Ma'idah about "hamr" which is translated as either alcohol, intoxicants or wine. This passage is between the verses 90-93 and the next verse 94 starts a new topic.
5/90*O you who believe, alcohol, and gambling, and altars, and arrows of chance are tainted - by the work of the devil. You shall avoid him so that you may be successful.

5/91*The devil only wants to cause strife between you through alcohol and gambling, and to repel you away from remembering God and from the contact prayer. Will you be deterred?

5/92*And obey God and obey the messenger, and be aware. If you turn away then know that it is the duty of Our messenger to deliver clearly.

5/93*There is no sin upon those who believe and do good works for what they eat* if they are aware and believe and do good works, then they are aware and believe, then they are aware and do good; God loves the good doers.

*The verb "ta'ima" (translated as what they eat above) applies to eating and drinking (taste) in Arabic and the 93rd verse of surah 5 shows that the drinking hamr (alcohol or wine) or eating beef marinated in wine is NOT haram for "believers" as long as they avoid the work of Satan.

To be more specific, (illicit) sex is forbidden, but the exception is lawful sex. Having lawful sex with spouses is halal for believers. Just like sex is "conditional halal" for believers, drinking alcohol is conditional halal for believers as long as they meet the criteria stated in 5/93 and are able to avoid the work of Satan.

Some interpretors distort the true meaning of this verse (5/93) and dare to make some additions to the God's words in brackets. They translate the sentence in past tense (what they have tasted/ they tasted) and claim that the word "taste" refers to a time period before the prohibition of alcohol. However, this is obviously mistranslation because what is haram (shirk) for believers is describing something as haram before the God prohibits it. In other words, mistranslating this verse referring to the past leads to logical fallacy in the Quran.

To summarize, as is stated in 16/67 the alcohol, the substance itself, is good and lawful provision:

16/67*And from the fruits of the palm trees and the grapes you make strong drink and a good provision. In that is a sign for a people who comprehend.

16/114*So eat from what God has provided you, that which is good and lawful, and be thankful for the blessing of God, if it is indeed He whom you serve.

16/115*He has only forbidden for you what is already dead, and the blood, and the meat of pig, and what was dedicated to other than God. But whoever is forced to, without seeking disobedience or transgression, then God is Forgiver, Merciful.

What is illicit in "hamr" (alcohol or wine) for believers (2/219) is explained in 5/91 and it is not forbidden as long as one can meet the criteria in 5/93.

7/32*Say: "Who has made unlawful the nice things that God has brought forth for His servants and the good provisions?" Say: "They are meant for those who believe during this worldly life, and they will be exclusive for them on the Day of Resurrection." It is such that We explain the revelations for those who know.

Because "hamr" is a nice provision in here, the public of paradise will be served hamr in the hereafter. (47/15)

Peace

huruf

  • Wise One / Burnout
  • *****
  • Posts: 6487
  • Karma +1/-0
Re: ACCORDING TO THE QURAN , ALCOHOL IS NOT HARAM, IT IS "CONDITIONAL HALAL"
« Reply #1 on: January 23, 2018, 02:18:49 AM »
A Qur'an is nto a book of magic, saying the word halal or haram does not make anything into something else it is not.

This question has abundantly been dealt with in the forum. May be whoevers reads this thread should look at others threads where this has been dealt with, thus avoiding repeating things ad nauseam.

As to the poster, it might be a good idea for him to give speeches to the different branches and meetings of Alcholics Anonymous, or rather may be he should go to one of those meetings and listen.

When the Qur'an says that it is the work of Shaytan does anybody really need to be advertised about the un measurable benefits of alcohol?

Does the Qur'an tell us to follow as monkeys the traffic lights red haram and green halal in order to discern between what and why we should AVOID something or not?

Salaam

Emre_1974tr

  • Apprentice
  • **
  • Posts: 189
  • Karma +0/-0
Re: ACCORDING TO THE QURAN , ALCOHOL IS NOT HARAM, IT IS "CONDITIONAL HALAL"
« Reply #2 on: January 23, 2018, 12:11:39 PM »
I'd say it isn't good for people, and that's what Quran says too. And the word used for it probably involves all kinds of drugs which intoxicate (and cause addiction).

The word (khamr) can't mean intoxicant. When you claim khamr is the name for intoxicants two problems occur. Khamr in paradise is in liquid form. (Rivers of khamr) and also it is not gonna intoxicate people. An intoxicator that wont intoxicate is a paradox. But wine that wont intoxicate no matter how much you drink and wont cause headache makes sense.
But this does not really matter. 5:93 obviously shows that moderate drinking of khamr is not haram.

Peace

armom

  • Apprentice
  • **
  • Posts: 102
  • Karma +0/-0
Re: ACCORDING TO THE QURAN , ALCOHOL IS NOT HARAM, IT IS "CONDITIONAL HALAL"
« Reply #3 on: January 24, 2018, 12:47:45 AM »
The word (khamr) can't mean intoxicant. When you claim khamr is the name for intoxicants two problems occur. Khamr in paradise is in liquid form. (Rivers of khamr) and also it is not gonna intoxicate people. An intoxicator that wont intoxicate is a paradox. But wine that wont intoxicate no matter how much you drink and wont cause headache makes sense.
But this does not really matter. 5:93 obviously shows that moderate drinking of khamr is not haram.

Peace

Salaam,

//obviously shows that moderate drinking of khamr is not haram//

5:93 doesn't say moderate drinking of khamr is not haram.

"Those who believe and lead a righteous life bear no guilt by eating any food, so long as they observe the commandments"

If this means that moderate drinking is allowed, then it would also mean eating moderate flesh of pig is also allowed.

For better understanding,
If one is forced by famine, without being deliberately sinful, then GOD is Forgiver, Merciful. (Surah Maidah, 3)

So, if you are only forced to eat when there were no food available then only you can eat/drink things which are prohibited.

Immediately the next AYAT says:-
"They consult you concerning what is lawful for them; say, "Lawful for you are all good things, including what trained dogs and falcons catch for you."

So Lawful are all "GOOD THINGS"

And KHAMR is not a good thing as mentioned as "Satan's handiwork" and also mentioned to "abstain from it"

Surah Maidah AYAH 91 says "Satan wants to provoke animosity and hatred among you through KHAMR and gambling"

So we eat all the "Good Things" and if forced by hunger (if there isn't any food available) then only you can eat what's prohibited by God.

I hope that helps.


Emre_1974tr

  • Apprentice
  • **
  • Posts: 189
  • Karma +0/-0
Re: ACCORDING TO THE QURAN , ALCOHOL IS NOT HARAM, IT IS "CONDITIONAL HALAL"
« Reply #4 on: January 24, 2018, 08:07:31 AM »
Salaam,

//obviously shows that moderate drinking of khamr is not haram//

5:93 doesn't say moderate drinking of khamr is not haram.

"Those who believe and lead a righteous life bear no guilt by eating any food, so long as they observe the commandments"

If this means that moderate drinking is allowed, then it would also mean eating moderate flesh of pig is also allowed.

For better understanding,
If one is forced by famine, without being deliberately sinful, then GOD is Forgiver, Merciful. (Surah Maidah, 3)

So, if you are only forced to eat when there were no food available then only you can eat/drink things which are prohibited.

Immediately the next AYAT says:-
"They consult you concerning what is lawful for them; say, "Lawful for you are all good things, including what trained dogs and falcons catch for you."

So Lawful are all "GOOD THINGS"

And KHAMR is not a good thing as mentioned as "Satan's handiwork" and also mentioned to "abstain from it"

Surah Maidah AYAH 91 says "Satan wants to provoke animosity and hatred among you through KHAMR and gambling"

So we eat all the "Good Things" and if forced by hunger (if there isn't any food available) then only you can eat what's prohibited by God.

I hope that helps.

There is a passage between 90-93 and verse 94 starts a new topic. Read carefully so that you will realize. Taime doesn't mean to eat only, eat+drink (taste). 5/93 is exactly about khamr consumption. Khamr is not a bad thing, it is good provision. SEE 16:67. Read the whole surah please. Hamr is a kind of sekeren and it is not bad by itself. What is rics is satan's handiwork, not khamr itself.... And Satan's handiwork is explained in 5:91.

No, we are not allowed to eat pork unless there is a risk of starvation. It is explained in 5:3.

Read carefully. Read the surah Nahl completely. Be honest to yourself and you will see the fact inshallah.

Peace

progressive1993

  • Wise One / Burnout
  • *****
  • Posts: 2611
  • Karma +0/-0
10:41 If they deny you, say: "My works are for me, and your works are for you. You are innocent of what I do, and I am innocent of what you do."

Emre_1974tr

  • Apprentice
  • **
  • Posts: 189
  • Karma +0/-0
Re: ACCORDING TO THE QURAN , ALCOHOL IS NOT HARAM, IT IS "CONDITIONAL HALAL"
« Reply #6 on: January 25, 2018, 03:21:14 PM »
5/93 There is no sin upon those who believe and do good works for what they taste (taime) if they are aware and believe and do good works, then they are aware and believe, then they are aware and do good; God loves the good doers.

Eating pork is halal when there is the risk of starvation. Allah does not list conditions such as believing, doing good works and being aware and believing again and doing good works again and again etc. The only condition to eat pork is the risk of dying because of hunger...That's why it is very very obvious that this verse refers to khamr and similar hard drinks.