Author Topic: The Temple build by Abraham? And Moses? And Solomon? And in the time of Jesus?  (Read 1111 times)

Novice

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Plenty of guess work and legend, and also, is it significant? What is significant is what we are told for our own behaviour.

On the other hand there is no indication in Qur'an that Ibrahim at any time was going to sacrifice his son, that is, kill his son.
I can't recall that the Qur'an mentions any particular place where the dialogue between Ibrahim and his son about his dreams takes place. Therefore all this speculation about mount this or that is not from Qur'an nor is indorsed by it.

Salaam

Salaam huruf

You are correct in my humble understanding that Quran does not support the traditional story of Ibrahim slaughtering his son. Pleasing a god by slaughtering animals or human being sounds so pagan. What kind of a trial is to tell someone to slaughter his son and who gets any good from it?

huruf

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Thanks novice, the question is nto only all the questions we may ask ourselves regarding such a thing as sacrificing (killing) the own son or anybody for that matter, tho of ocurse that is fundamental, but the question for people who hold the Qur'an to be a revelation is whether the Qur'an purports such a thing. And the thing is that the Qur'an does not say anything like that, does not purport anything like that nor does it invite to such a belief or that God condones such an act.

If anybody wants to believe the attempt or intent to sacrifice his son by Ibrahim because God ordered him so, that is their business but they cannot attribute that to the Qur'an, regardless of the folk beliefs of any people. 

Salaam

Salaam

makeaway8

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Yes I was shocked too when I found out. I just randomly read "Moriah" somewhere, and then decided to do a Google search, and found out that the Tanakh scholars identified this place as the Temple Mount. It is also funny to see that instead the Sunnis claim that the "Moriah" in the Bible is their Marwah in Mecca.
God knows best.

I still don't know whether Safa is another mountain or something, but according to some root dictionaries it could mean simply "Stone", and the Monotheist translation uses this meaning.

Peace, you might read this if you think Becca is in Palestine.

Psa 84
..This latter is the singular to בּכאים in 2 Samuel 5:24 (cf. נכאים, צבאים, Psalm 103:21), the name of a tree, and, according to the old Jewish lexicographers, of the mulberry-tree (Talmudic תּוּת, Arab. (tût)); but according to the designation, of a tree from which some kind of fluid flows, and such a tree is the Arab. (baka'un), resembling the balsam-tree, which is very common in the arid valley of Mecca...
Keil & Delitzsch Commentary on the Old Testament

2Sa 5:17-25
Baca, according to Abulfadl, is the name given in Arabic to a shrub which grows at Mecca and resembles the balsam, except that it has longer leaves and larger and rounder fruit, and from which, if a leaf be broken off, there flows a white pungent sap, like a white tear, which is all probability gave rise to the name בּכא = בּכה, to weep (vid., Celsii, Hierob. i. pp. 338ff., and Gesenius, Thes. p. 205).
Keil & Delitzsch Commentary on the Old Testament


2Sa 5:23
The mulberry trees - Rather, the Bacah-tree, and found abundantly near Mecca. It is very like the balsam-tree, and probably derives its name from the exudation of the sap in drops like tears when a leaf is torn off. Some think the valley of Baca Psalm 84:6 was so called from this plant growing there.
Albert Barnes' Notes on the Whole Bible

IsaMuslim

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Salam,

How can you then explain this:

Quote
37:133   And Lot was one of the messengers.
37:134   When We saved him and all his family.
37:135   Except an old woman who remained.
37:136   Then, We destroyed the rest.
37:137   And you pass by them in the morning;
37:138   And in the night. Do you not comprehend?

Mohammed did pass by the city of Lot in the morning and in the evening, at least at the period of his life in which this part of the Qur'an was revealed to him.
Is Lot's city near to Mecca?
Is he who is based on proof from his Lord, as he for whom his evil works have been adorned for him and they followed their desires?
~ 47:14 ~

IsaMuslim

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Salam,
I recently discovered new information that could be usefult to those studying this topic, or reading this thread years after now.

There are two new mountains that in my opinion might be candidates to be the real Mounts Safa and Marwa:

Mount Gerizim and Mount Ebal. Both in the West Bank.



I think they might be canditates to be Safa and Marwa, and the actual place of the Masjid al Haram, because a group of Jews, namely the Samaritans, who are not considered Jews by the Rabbis, consider Mount Gerizim the real place on which God ordered them to build the Temple, and the location on which Abraham was going to sacrifice his son. In Deuteronomy 11:29 Moses is asked by God to put blessings on Mount Gerezim, and to curse Mount Ebal.

I am not claiming that this is the correct location, all that I am saying is that we who study this subject should also consider it.
Is he who is based on proof from his Lord, as he for whom his evil works have been adorned for him and they followed their desires?
~ 47:14 ~