Author Topic: Awareness of the Ancients  (Read 668 times)

Cerberus

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Awareness of the Ancients
« on: May 15, 2017, 06:17:48 AM »
I read these in another thread, and I was going to reply there but I finally decided to make a thread out of it.

Quote
What I understand by seal of prophets, is that if anybody claims something regarding God, and our identity as divine creatures to whom God addresses Himself we may check it against the Qur'an, if it is consistent with it, it is valid prophecying, if not it is not.

So was explicitely stated, Quran is the tool by which one can tell the right from wrong, and if anyone claims something about God or relating things we should go back to Quran.

I'm very glad the person who said that formulated it that clear because now I can see clearer into what is happening around the world and throughout time, and I can perhaps formulate my take on this.

The reason behind what was said is exactly the same for one who is for example born a christian and later becomes a "good" christian and judges right or wrong by his Book. Or a Sunni, or a Hindu, or even one who becomes a Quranist.

Let's now suppose that all of these religions were right, and their book were the tools that meant for them to verify what is right from what is wrong. What made the first people who were invited to them even accept them? Did they check them against their prior books or beliefs ?

Let's move to Quran in particular, what made those first muslims become muslims ? Did they check Muhammad's saying against their original beliefs, i.e their paganism ? What was Muhammad asking them for ?

What was Muhammad asking them for:

Moses, to people of Pharaoh [Quran,20:25+]

"My Lord, cool my temper

And make this matter easy for me

And untie a knot from my tongue

So they can understand my speech."


So people are required to have a certain understanding and awareness in order for them to be able to recognize the truth and those who don't, their parable is the following in the quran 2:71

"And so, the parable of those who're bent on denying the truth is that of the beast which hears the shepherd's cry, and hears in it nothing but the sound of a voice and a call. Deaf are they, and dumb, and blind: for they do not use their reason."

Now, looking back at the world, the world is mostly divided into a number of religious communities, each rejoicing what they have. Do you think that nowaday people still have this awareness that people of old time were required to have in order for them to even [1] recognize the truth and [2] accept it, live by it ?

And in case of a, supposedly, up to date prophecy/teaching, will they even be able to tell the right from wrong? Or will they automatically go back to what they have between their hands ?

These questions are rhetorical.

P.S: I'd like to reiterate to the person who wrote the statement that I quoted, this is not about you, and I thank you a lot for expressing it in a clear way. This is the reality and I do not expect you to defend yourself, as much as I'd like you and other people to discuss what I just said in its integral.

huruf

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Re: Awareness of the Ancients
« Reply #1 on: May 15, 2017, 09:39:47 AM »
I think any revelation, any message comes and impacts on the person as whole. What she experienced, per prejudices, her emotions, her sacars... Like hate comes through deep wound in  the pshyche may be caused in her very early life. Each person is a world her own world. It amounts to how much that person is satisfied with her present state and does not need any change in outlook or emotions, or may be de person is through a crisis and she really needs to change.

At any rate, we cannot say that a change is going to be always the only change. May be it lasts for while and then, like snakes who change skin, she will outgrow that and change again.

I do not know whether this answer your questions I am not very sure about what you wanted.

Salaam 

Cerberus

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Re: Awareness of the Ancients
« Reply #2 on: May 17, 2017, 12:42:55 PM »
Hi huruf,
I gave the first quote as an antithesis, and built the problematic, I have also left open questions for anyone but I answered those implicitely.
But I don't know how what you said relates to the topic.


reel

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Re: Awareness of the Ancients
« Reply #3 on: May 17, 2017, 04:43:10 PM »
Quote
What made the first people who were invited to them even accept them? Did they check them against their prior books or beliefs ?
If you just look around you will always find that every religion is connected to one God. As the Quran shows, it all started from Adam's time. His teachings are distinct. He invites people to truth and compassion. But then he gets replaced by human gods who  always leave behind evidence of their crimes in the religion in the form of cruelty and contradiction. It is very difficult to defend them unless threats are used to stop people from questioning, but the thoughts just don't easily go away. This is the story of us ex sunnis also. It seems things have not changed since the beginning of time. Probably, that is why, the people were able to accept?


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Do you think that nowaday people still have this awareness that people of old time were required to have in order for them to even [1] recognize the truth and [2] accept it, live by it ?

They do, but they prefer to inhibit it.
"I fear that nothing will lead me to hell more than ḥadīth"-Hadith collector: Shu'ba Ibn al-Ḥajjāj