Author Topic: Are we going to believe God or scientists and NASA  (Read 17171 times)

Bender

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Re: Are we going to believe God or scientists and NASA
« Reply #110 on: July 05, 2016, 01:14:46 PM »
If the globe is correct and a fact than the sun would set in every land, come on.

 :confused:
Alhamdu lillahi rabbi al-alameen

imrankhawaja

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Re: Are we going to believe God or scientists and NASA
« Reply #111 on: July 05, 2016, 01:18:34 PM »
:confused:

ben i was guessing that you really like to talk in signs language now a days

are you getting lectures as well lol ? :hmm

Bender

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Re: Are we going to believe God or scientists and NASA
« Reply #112 on: July 05, 2016, 02:11:10 PM »
ben i was guessing that you really like to talk in signs language now a days

are you getting lectures as well lol ? :hmm

If I understand correctly what he is claiming then I do not have other words then  :confused:
Alhamdu lillahi rabbi al-alameen

imrankhawaja

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Re: Are we going to believe God or scientists and NASA
« Reply #113 on: July 05, 2016, 02:32:13 PM »
If I understand correctly what he is claiming then I do not have other words then  :confused:

 :sun:

 :yeah:

wrkmmn

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Re: Are we going to believe God or scientists and NASA
« Reply #114 on: July 05, 2016, 03:09:54 PM »
IS THE EARTH FLAT

13:3 And it is He who has spread the earth wide and placed on it firm mountains and running waters, and created thereon two sexes of every [kind of] plant;7 [and it is He who] causes the night to cover the day. Verily, in all this there are messages indeed for people who think!

78:6 HAVE WE NOT made the earth a resting-place [for you], (7) and the mountains [its] pegs?
21:30 ARE, THEN, they who are bent on denying the truth not aware that the heavens and the earth were [once] one single entity, which We then parted asunder?  - and [that] We made out of water every living thing? Will they not, then, [begin to] believe? 21:31 And [are they not aware that] We have set up firm mountains on earth, lest it sway with them, and [that] We have appointed thereon broad paths, so that they might find their way, (21:32) and [that] We have set up the sky as a canopy well-secured? And yet, they stubbornly turn away from [all] the signs of this [creation], (21:33) and [fail to see that] it is He who has created the night and the day and the sun and the moon - all of them floating through space!

  13:3           وَهُوَ   And Him       ٱلَّذِى the one that         مَدَّ extended/extends (occurs fifteen times)      ٱلأَرْضَ  the earth ,       وَجَعَلَ and made/makes         فِيهَا in her(it)         رَوَاسِىَ  anchors        وَأَنْهَاراً  and rivers ,       وَمِن and of         كُلِّ every         ٱلثَّمَرَاتِ  the fruits    جَعَلَ made/makes         فِيهَا  in her(it)       زَوْجَيْنِ    coupled-ones  ٱثْنَيْنِ     two .     يُغْشِى  He is covering/enveloping        ٱلْلَّيْلَ   the night       ٱلنَّهَارَ the day;         إِنَّ  Verily        فِى  in        ذٰلِكَ this         لَـآيَاتٍ * signs         لِّقَوْمٍ   for people  [that]     يَتَفَكَّرُونَ they are reflecting/contemplating.

79:30   وَٱلأَرْضَ   and the earth      بَعْدَ after        ذٰلِكَ  this       دَحَاهَا spread out/ widened/ enlarged her(it) (occurs once in Quran)   


88:17  أَفَلاَ  Do then not      يَنظُرُونَ  they see/ contemplate     إِلَى at     ٱلإِبْلِ   the camels/ clouds   كَيْفَ  how   خُلِقَتْ   I have created
88:18 وَإِلَى  and at     ٱلسَّمَآءِ the heaven     كَيْفَ how رُفِعَتْ  I have raised
88:19   وَإِلَىٰ  and at   ٱلْجِبَالِ the mountains  كَيْفَ how  نُصِبَتْ  I have erected/ set up
88:20      وَإِلَى  and at    ٱلأَرْضِ the earth     كَيْفَ how     سُطِحَتْ I have spread out/ flattened (occurs only once)


All translators are translating the ending words of 88:17-20 the same way, as if they copied each other. How can they miss that the words are written in the perfect tense for ?I, you(masculine, feminine, singular), and she? , it is a basic rule. I almost made the same mistake because I was going to translate only 88:20, but I was inspired to translate from 88:17, and then I noticed it. Glory be to God.

People are twisting these verses to make them fit their poor understanding of the creation, but twisting the word of God does not make falsehood become truth.

How this world works is a very complex idea, and difficult to explain and understand. This, because things are not the way they are perceived, because what is perceived is an illusion created by the movement of the sun, moon, earth, relative to the position from where a person is observing. For example, in northern pole summer, in the Arctic circle, people say that the sun goes in a circle around them, but the sun is not moving, it is the turning of the earth that crates that illusion. The earth turns East/ counter clock.  And, the circle created in the arctic by the sum is also evidence that earth is a sphere not flat. Or, like the new moon, it will always be at the same place every month, about 16 degrees (approximately, too many threes around me, and use very simple tools) above/following/behind the sun at sunset, yet it has been there all day, but it is only visible until the sky darkens a little; and, they set to the west keeping the same distance, yet they are not moving, but it is us that stop seeing them because we are turning with the earth. Everybody in this world sees the same moon phase, and only at sunset, well those 24 hour from where it was first visible will see it a little bigger. Then, the moon increases its distance chasing the sun around 13 degrees per day until they cross at full moon, and then it is the sun chasing the moon. Then, the last moon, always visible before sunrise and above/ followed by the sun a few degrees; and it stays at the same distance from the sun all day, yet not visible after sunrise because there is too much light. However, all that it is only the illusion we see, and it is not what is really happening. What is really happening can be better explained by a 3d model using a lamp as the sun, or a video of the moon moving around the earth while the earth moves around the sun. Another example is the sun, is so far away that the diameter of the earth makes little difference in the illusion, so , for example: now that is summer (this is approximate), when it is midday in Texas, people in Europe(aprx 6 h to the east) is watching sunset, and people in the Marshall Islands (aprx 6 h to the west) is watching sunrise, which is also evidence that the world is a sphere shape. 

Also Quran says earth moon and sun follow their paths/ orbits, so the earth is moving.
In a gospel I have, P. Jesus says to his disciples that they shall turn around the light just as the planets turn around the sun.

May God increase our knowledge and give us wisdom.   


imrankhawaja

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Re: Are we going to believe God or scientists and NASA
« Reply #115 on: July 05, 2016, 04:36:58 PM »
perfect and excellent

moreover word duhaha drived from a root that gives meanings of egg early scholars was unable to understand but modern scholars who used the root concept translate it as egg shaped which is also in harmony with current model that says its geo spherical i.e flattened at poles


Timotheus

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Re: Are we going to believe God or scientists and NASA
« Reply #116 on: July 05, 2016, 11:33:33 PM »
IS THE EARTH FLAT

13:3 And it is He who has spread the earth wide and placed on it firm mountains and running waters, and created thereon two sexes of every [kind of] plant;7 [and it is He who] causes the night to cover the day. Verily, in all this there are messages indeed for people who think!

78:6 HAVE WE NOT made the earth a resting-place [for you], (7) and the mountains [its] pegs?
21:30 ARE, THEN, they who are bent on denying the truth not aware that the heavens and the earth were [once] one single entity, which We then parted asunder?  - and [that] We made out of water every living thing? Will they not, then, [begin to] believe? 21:31 And [are they not aware that] We have set up firm mountains on earth, lest it sway with them, and [that] We have appointed thereon broad paths, so that they might find their way, (21:32) and [that] We have set up the sky as a canopy well-secured? And yet, they stubbornly turn away from [all] the signs of this [creation], (21:33) and [fail to see that] it is He who has created the night and the day and the sun and the moon - all of them floating through space!

  13:3           وَهُوَ   And Him       ٱلَّذِى the one that         مَدَّ extended/extends (occurs fifteen times)      ٱلأَرْضَ  the earth ,       وَجَعَلَ and made/makes         فِيهَا in her(it)         رَوَاسِىَ  anchors        وَأَنْهَاراً  and rivers ,       وَمِن and of         كُلِّ every         ٱلثَّمَرَاتِ  the fruits    جَعَلَ made/makes         فِيهَا  in her(it)       زَوْجَيْنِ    coupled-ones  ٱثْنَيْنِ     two .     يُغْشِى  He is covering/enveloping        ٱلْلَّيْلَ   the night       ٱلنَّهَارَ the day;         إِنَّ  Verily        فِى  in        ذٰلِكَ this         لَـآيَاتٍ * signs         لِّقَوْمٍ   for people  [that]     يَتَفَكَّرُونَ they are reflecting/contemplating.

79:30   وَٱلأَرْضَ   and the earth      بَعْدَ after        ذٰلِكَ  this       دَحَاهَا spread out/ widened/ enlarged her(it) (occurs once in Quran)   


88:17  أَفَلاَ  Do then not      يَنظُرُونَ  they see/ contemplate     إِلَى at     ٱلإِبْلِ   the camels/ clouds   كَيْفَ  how   خُلِقَتْ   I have created
88:18 وَإِلَى  and at     ٱلسَّمَآءِ the heaven     كَيْفَ how رُفِعَتْ  I have raised
88:19   وَإِلَىٰ  and at   ٱلْجِبَالِ the mountains  كَيْفَ how  نُصِبَتْ  I have erected/ set up
88:20      وَإِلَى  and at    ٱلأَرْضِ the earth     كَيْفَ how     سُطِحَتْ I have spread out/ flattened (occurs only once)


All translators are translating the ending words of 88:17-20 the same way, as if they copied each other. How can they miss that the words are written in the perfect tense for ?I, you(masculine, feminine, singular), and she? , it is a basic rule. I almost made the same mistake because I was going to translate only 88:20, but I was inspired to translate from 88:17, and then I noticed it. Glory be to God.

People are twisting these verses to make them fit their poor understanding of the creation, but twisting the word of God does not make falsehood become truth.

How this world works is a very complex idea, and difficult to explain and understand. This, because things are not the way they are perceived, because what is perceived is an illusion created by the movement of the sun, moon, earth, relative to the position from where a person is observing. For example, in northern pole summer, in the Arctic circle, people say that the sun goes in a circle around them, but the sun is not moving, it is the turning of the earth that crates that illusion. The earth turns East/ counter clock.  And, the circle created in the arctic by the sum is also evidence that earth is a sphere not flat. Or, like the new moon, it will always be at the same place every month, about 16 degrees (approximately, too many threes around me, and use very simple tools) above/following/behind the sun at sunset, yet it has been there all day, but it is only visible until the sky darkens a little; and, they set to the west keeping the same distance, yet they are not moving, but it is us that stop seeing them because we are turning with the earth. Everybody in this world sees the same moon phase, and only at sunset, well those 24 hour from where it was first visible will see it a little bigger. Then, the moon increases its distance chasing the sun around 13 degrees per day until they cross at full moon, and then it is the sun chasing the moon. Then, the last moon, always visible before sunrise and above/ followed by the sun a few degrees; and it stays at the same distance from the sun all day, yet not visible after sunrise because there is too much light. However, all that it is only the illusion we see, and it is not what is really happening. What is really happening can be better explained by a 3d model using a lamp as the sun, or a video of the moon moving around the earth while the earth moves around the sun. Another example is the sun, is so far away that the diameter of the earth makes little difference in the illusion, so , for example: now that is summer (this is approximate), when it is midday in Texas, people in Europe(aprx 6 h to the east) is watching sunset, and people in the Marshall Islands (aprx 6 h to the west) is watching sunrise, which is also evidence that the world is a sphere shape. 

Also Quran says earth moon and sun follow their paths/ orbits, so the earth is moving.
In a gospel I have, P. Jesus says to his disciples that they shall turn around the light just as the planets turn around the sun.

May God increase our knowledge and give us wisdom.   

alhamdullilahi rabbil aalameen.

i dont know what else to say.

may our lord guide those who strive in his cause, and increase in understanding those who seek and accept the truth. surely he is supreme
What could i say that is better than what God has already informed us of?
Follow God
Seek His guidance, the only guidance
Glory and Praise be to God, rabbil Aalameen

JavaLatte

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Re: Are we going to believe God or scientists and NASA
« Reply #117 on: July 06, 2016, 12:21:42 AM »
@ The Guided One

Brother, I think this is a kind of truth that will be known (people will finally know).

I prefer to be more focus on verse 57:21.

Peace.
[33:72] Verily, We offered the trust to the heavens and the earth and the mountains, but they refused to bear it and they were afraid of it; but man bear it - verily, he was transgressing, ignorant.

The Guided One

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Re: Are we going to believe God or scientists and NASA
« Reply #118 on: July 08, 2016, 03:29:51 AM »
The earth is flat, and anyone who disputes this claim is an atheist who deserves to be punished." - Sheik Abdel-Aziz Ibn Baaz, Supreme religious authority, Saudi Arabia

"He created the heavens and the earth in true (proportions): He makes the Night overlap the Day, and the Day overlap the Night: He has subjected the sun and the moon (to His law): Each one follows a course for a time appointed. Is not He the Exalted in Power - He Who forgives again and again?" (Y. Ali translation)

"overlap" is yukawwiru, a form of the verb kawwara, which means to wrap or to wind (like wrapping a turban). See http://www.studyquran.org/LaneLexicon/V ... 000165.pdf

They say it doesn't fit a flat earth, but suggests a round earth, around which day and night wind around. Even if it did, that still sounds like a non-rotating earth, and geocentric, with night and day as physical moving entities. The Arabs believed that the sky was like a dome (indeed that's how the movement of the stars during the night make it look), so imagining the night wrapping over the day and vice versa fits that view.

These 2 similar verses suggest night and day are physical moving entities, and do nothing to suggest a rotating earth:

7:54 Lo! your Lord is Allah Who created the heavens and the earth in six Days, then mounted He the Throne. He covereth the night with the day, which is in haste to follow it, and hath made the sun and the moon and the stars subservient by His command. His verily is all creation and commandment. Blessed be Allah, the Lord of the Worlds! (Pickthall)
13:3 And He it is Who spread out the earth and placed therein firm hills and flowing streams, and of all fruits He placed therein two spouses (male and female). He covereth the night with the day. Lo! herein verily are portents for people who take thought.(Pickthall)

Muslim scholars learned from writings of the Greeks and Indians that the earth is spherical from the mid 8th century onwards, though there is plenty of geocentric and flat earth stuff in the hadith and tafsir
The Words and Signs and Mercies of Allah are in all Creation, and can never be fully set out in human language, however extended our means may be imagined to be.

The Guided One

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Re: Are we going to believe God or scientists and NASA
« Reply #119 on: July 08, 2016, 03:46:39 AM »
Facing Toward Mecca:-"The Qur'an tells all Muslims to face in the direction of Mecca when they pray. However, this would only be possible on a flat Earth because it is not possible to bow down towards the direction of Mecca when you are on the opposite side of the earth. Due to the sphericity of the earth, a prayer in any direction will point towards the sky/outer-space, not Mecca. "

Quran 2:144:-? We have certainly seen the turning of your face, toward the heaven, and We will surely turn you to a qiblah with which you will be pleased. So turn your face toward al-Masjid al-haram..."
Qur'an 2:149----"wherever you go, turn your face towards the Sacred Mosque (in Mecca)."
The Words and Signs and Mercies of Allah are in all Creation, and can never be fully set out in human language, however extended our means may be imagined to be.