Author Topic: Do we need books to believe in God?  (Read 27021 times)

Invalid777

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Re: Do we need books to believe in God?
« Reply #170 on: December 15, 2015, 01:27:07 PM »


You saying G-D's Guidance doesn't guide ?!
Or, that it doesn't guide the deaf/dumb/blind who reason not ?!

You use your eyes to read the Quran. Does that mean your eyes guide you? It doesn't.  The Creator gave you equipment and the data. It is your job to turn it into information. The only souls who fail to do so are the ones blinded by a disease in their hearts. They are sick. Their souls are in coma, neither dead nor alive. They did not use their equipment hence they are dumb, deaf and blind.


Religion is the world's most prolific mental illness

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mJM5mipwebw

hicham9

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Re: Do we need books to believe in God?
« Reply #171 on: December 15, 2015, 01:36:32 PM »
You use your eyes to read the Quran. Does that mean your eyes guide you? It doesn't.  The Creator gave you equipment and the data. It is your job to turn it into information. The only souls who fail to do so are the ones blinded by a disease in their hearts. They are sick. Their souls are in coma, neither dead nor alive. They did not use their equipment hence they are dumb, deaf and blind.

Ignoratio elenchi.

The Qurān does guide,
those who are willing to be guided.
I was not delivered in this world into defeat, nor does failure course my veins.
I'm not a sheep waiting to be prodded by my shepherd. I am a lion, and I refuse to talk, walk or sleep with the sheep.

Invalid777

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Re: Do we need books to believe in God?
« Reply #172 on: December 15, 2015, 01:54:42 PM »
Ignoratio elenchi.

The Qurān does guide,
those who are willing to be guided.

Quran is like a road to enlightenment. The one who paved the road for you guided you, not the road. Hence Quran does NOT guide. The Source of Knowledge guides.
Religion is the world's most prolific mental illness

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mJM5mipwebw

hicham9

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Re: Do we need books to believe in God?
« Reply #173 on: December 15, 2015, 01:57:31 PM »
Quran is like a road to enlightenment. The one who paved the road for you guided you, not the road. Hence Quran does NOT guide. The Source of Knowledge guides.

The Qurān is not a "road," but a Light shining/illuminating in the darkness (as i pursue), it guides/leads to the straight/correct path, that's it's main purpose/duty [as assigned to it by The Assigner, The Absolute One].
I was not delivered in this world into defeat, nor does failure course my veins.
I'm not a sheep waiting to be prodded by my shepherd. I am a lion, and I refuse to talk, walk or sleep with the sheep.

Invalid777

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Re: Do we need books to believe in God?
« Reply #174 on: December 15, 2015, 02:06:09 PM »
The Quran is not a road, but a Light shining in the darkness (as i follow it), it guides/leads to the straight/correct path, that's it's main purpose [as assigned to it by The Assigner, The Absolute, The One].

That the Quran can both guide and misguide only shows its double-edged nature, like every thing.

Again, who guides? The light shinning in the darkness or the one who made the light shine?
Religion is the world's most prolific mental illness

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mJM5mipwebw

hicham9

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Re: Do we need books to believe in God?
« Reply #175 on: December 15, 2015, 02:10:35 PM »
Again, who guides? The light shinning in the darkness or the one who made the light shine?

The Light guides/directs/leads by the Will of its Maker/Assigner.

To me, the Qurān is the message-bearer : G-D's Messenger.
Conveying G-D's Message/s is what it does.
I was not delivered in this world into defeat, nor does failure course my veins.
I'm not a sheep waiting to be prodded by my shepherd. I am a lion, and I refuse to talk, walk or sleep with the sheep.

Ahmet

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Re: Do we need books to believe in God?
« Reply #176 on: December 15, 2015, 06:14:47 PM »
I had the same dilemma about this concept of God, knowing all, and still testing humans and rewarding / punishing accordingly. It's like playing a game in God Mode. You know what's gonna happen, yet you still play. Well, I can only hope that it isn't the case here.

To avoid deviation from the subject, I opened a new topic:

http://free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9608077.0

reel

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Re: Do we need books to believe in God?
« Reply #177 on: December 15, 2015, 06:39:57 PM »
I actually agree with Invalid777. That's the reason why traditionalists can't see those anti hadith verses.

"I fear that nothing will lead me to hell more than ḥadīth"-Hadith collector: Shu'ba Ibn al-Ḥajjāj

hicham9

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Re: Do we need books to believe in God?
« Reply #178 on: December 16, 2015, 04:37:47 AM »


وما كان لبشر ان يكلمه اللـه الا وحيا او من وراى حجاب
او يرسـل رسـولا فيـوحى باذنـه ما يشـا انـه علـى حكـيـمـ
وكذلكـ اوحينا اليكـ روحا من امرنا ما كنت تدرى ما الكتب ولا الايمن
ولكن جعلنه نورا نهدى به من نشا من عبادنا وانكـ لتهدى الى صرط مستقيمـ
صـرطـ اللـه الذى لـه ما فى السمـوت وما فى الارض الا الى اللـه تـصـيـر الامـور


42:51-53
I was not delivered in this world into defeat, nor does failure course my veins.
I'm not a sheep waiting to be prodded by my shepherd. I am a lion, and I refuse to talk, walk or sleep with the sheep.

Invalid777

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Re: Do we need books to believe in God?
« Reply #179 on: December 16, 2015, 11:32:29 AM »
I actually agree with Invalid777. That's the reason why traditionalists can't see those anti hadith verses.
And it's why they wrote a false interpretation of the Reading(Quran) and had to invent a false language. For example, SJD to the Muslims is a physical movement. It would be like me randomly claiming today that the word 'thinking' is to prostrate. It takes an extreme amount of deception to go around and tell people to prostrate when they hear the word 'think'.

No matter how much knowledge you provide them(Quran, Tora, Gospel), they'll never get it. They are not self-aware. "I believe in God/Allah and his book/s" are just empty words they parrot. They don't know themselves so how can they know their Creator? They can't. They are "kafireen".
Become self-aware and you will know your Creator and receive knowledge from The Source of Knowledge. Knowledge is not limited to the Reading(Quran) but you also have access to the knowledge you were created with in your Ruh. The Reading(Quran) is a physical copy of what is within you(Ruh). This is why these traditionalists can't see the anti hadith verses. Their hearts are sealed, unaware of themselves. Only the Creator can make someone become self-aware, not a book, stone or human.

MUHSIN KHAN
"Those who reject Our signs are deaf and dumb in darkness. Allah sends astray whom He wills and He guides on the Straight Path whom He wills." (6:39)

Quote from another website
Quote
Allah has set a seal on the heart of the kafireen
"As to those who reject Faith it is the same to them whether thou warn them or do not warn them; They will not believe. "Allah hath set a seal on their hearts and on their hearing and on their eyes is a veil Great is the penalty they incur."  [Al-Qur'an 2:6-7]
2. The word qalb in Arabic means heart as well as intelligence

The Arabic word qalb used in these verses means the heart. It also means intelligence. Thus the above verses also mean that Allah has put a seal on the intelligence of the kafirs (unbelievers) and they will not understand and believe.
3. In the Arabic language heart is also used as a centre of understanding
In the Arabic language the word 'heart' is also used to connote one's centre of understanding.
Religion is the world's most prolific mental illness

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mJM5mipwebw