Author Topic: A challenge to those who claim Quran states 5 salat daily  (Read 23117 times)

Mazhar

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Re: A challenge to those who claim Quran states 5 salat daily
« Reply #90 on: February 19, 2014, 01:26:52 PM »
Salam Wakas,

Lest it is lost by of topic

Salamun alaikum;


1. صَلَاةِ الْفَجْرِ : Lane says: Basic perception: He clave, [a thing]; cut, or divided, [it] lengthwise: this is the primary signification, whence several others, to be mentioned below, are derived: Time reference:   فَجْرٌ  [Daybreak; dawn;] the light of morning; (Mgh, K;) because it is a cleaving of the darkness from before the light; (Mgh;) i. e., the redness of the sun in the darkness of night; (K;) the فَجْر in the end of the night is like the شَفَق in the beginning thereof: (S, O:) it is twofold: the first is called الفَجْرُ الكَاذِبُ [the false dawn]; that which rises without extending laterally, (المُسْتَطِيلُ, Mgh, Msb,) which appears black, presenting itself like an obstacle (مُعْتَرِضًا) [on the horizon]: 

2, 3, 4: These are mentioned in one compound sentence:



The figure of speech is climax; placement of words in ascending order towards the incoming moments of night.

The two timings for obeying the command وَأَقِمِ الصَّلاَةَ : are طَرَفَيِ النَّهَارِ:

It a possessive phrase for which reason Noon of first DUAL noun is dropped: the two visual transitions-edges [Solar ephemeris: position] of the bright day tapering towards the incoming night.   

The fourth is: وَأَقِمِ الصَّلاَةَ at َزُلَفًا مِّنَ اللَّيْلِ
"the early moments of the night". This sentence/time is defined by referring to the Sun:

"the point in time of rubbing and smoothly getting away of the Sun to the boundary of night getting cool and dark".

and

5    صَلَاةِ الْعِشَاءِ : the definite time is الْعِشَاءِ

Wakas

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Re: A challenge to those who claim Quran states 5 salat daily
« Reply #91 on: February 19, 2014, 02:56:26 PM »
Good idea:

The common problems with 5 salat daily timings as per The Quran
http://mypercept.co.uk/articles/problems-5-salat-Quran.html
All information in my posts is correct to the best of my knowledge only and thus should not be taken as a fact. One should seek knowledge and verify: 17:36, 20:114, 35:28, 49:6, 58:11. My articles

www.studyQuran.org

Mazhar

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Re: A challenge to those who claim Quran states 5 salat daily
« Reply #92 on: February 22, 2014, 01:00:30 PM »
Salam Wakas,

Do you think and translate the phrase as two corners on a straight line:

   

1.Fajr___________________________________________2 Isha

Pleiades

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Re: A challenge to those who claim Quran states 5 salat daily
« Reply #93 on: June 01, 2014, 12:11:56 PM »
Good idea:

The common problems with 5 salat daily timings as per The Quran
http://mypercept.co.uk/articles/problems-5-salat-Quran.html

Salam everybody, Its been a while since my last post but have been dipping in and out of the forum. I thought I'd share this response from bro Joseph to Wakas's critique. (A request from a sister).

http://quransmessage.com/critiques/Response%20to%20Wakas.htm


shukri

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Re: A challenge to those who claim Quran states 5 salat daily
« Reply #94 on: April 05, 2015, 07:44:39 AM »
Salaam ,

I give you simple proofs ... to prove that quran states 5 salat daily ... by using numeric miracle of this two key phrases of words ...

1) Observe the Contact Prayers (أَقِمِ الصَّلوٰة)

This phrase occurs exactly 5 times in quran  ...

11:114 You shall observe the Contact Prayers (1) at both ends of the day, and during the night. The righteous works wipe out the evil works. This is a reminder for those who would take heed.
 17:78 You shall observe the Contact Prayer (2) when the sun declines from its highest point at noon, as it moves towards sunset. You shall also observe (the recitation of) the Quran at dawn. (Reciting) the Quran at dawn is witnessed. 

20:14 "I am God; there is no other god beside Me. You shall worship Me alone, and observe the Contact Prayers (3) to remember Me.

29:45 You shall recite what is revealed to you of the scripture, and observe the Contact Prayers (4), for the Contact Prayers prohibit evil and vice. But the remembrance of God (through Salat) is the most important objective.* God knows everything you do.

31:17 "O my son, you shall observe the Contact Prayers (5). You shall advocate righteousness and forbid evil, and remain steadfast in the face of adversity. These are the most honorable traits.

2) Turn your face towards the Sacred Masjid

    This phrase also occurs  exactly 5 times in quran ...

2:144 We have seen you turning your face about the sky (searching for the right direction). We now assign a Qiblah that is pleasing to you. Henceforth, you shall turn your face towards the Sacred Masjid (1). Wherever you may be, all of you shall turn your faces towards it (2). Those who received the previous scripture know that this is the truth from their Lord. God is never unaware of anything they do.
2:149 Wherever you go, you shall turn your face (during Salat) towards the Sacred Masjid (3). This is the truth from your Lord. God is never unaware of anything you all do.

2:150 Wherever you go, you shall turn your face (during Salat) towards the Sacred Masjid (4) ; wherever you might be, you shall turn your faces (during Salat) towards it (5). Thus, the people will have no argument against you, except the transgressors among them. Do not fear them, and fear Me instead. I will then perfect My blessings upon you, that you may be guided.

All the facts given above ... I extract from ...
http://www.universalunity.org/17.html#TheFiveDailyContactPrayers
 
 
And for the determination of middle prayer (salat wustha) ... just apply code 19 for these two verses AQ2:238 & AQ103:1 ...

2:238 You shall consistently observe the Contact Prayers, especially the middle prayer, and devote yourselves totally to God .

103:1 By the afternoon (asr)

22381031 = 19 x 1177949 -------> proof that middle prayer refer to afternoon prayer (asr) ---------> subsequently total prayer should be five ---------> dawn/noon/afternoon/sunset/night prayer ...

Thanks .
 

Noon waalqalami

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Re: A challenge to those who claim Quran states 5 salat daily
« Reply #95 on: April 05, 2015, 09:37:11 PM »
Salaam ,

I give you simple proofs ... to prove that quran states 5 salat daily ... by using numeric miracle of this two key phrases of words ...

1) Observe the Contact Prayers (أَقِمِ الصَّلوٰة)

This phrase occurs exactly 5 times in quran  ...

11:114 You shall observe the Contact Prayers (1) at both ends of the day, and during the night. The righteous works wipe out the evil works. This is a reminder for those who would take heed.
 17:78 You shall observe the Contact Prayer (2) when the sun declines from its highest point at noon, as it moves towards sunset. You shall also observe (the recitation of) the Quran at dawn. (Reciting) the Quran at dawn is witnessed. 

20:14 "I am God; there is no other god beside Me. You shall worship Me alone, and observe the Contact Prayers (3) to remember Me.

29:45 You shall recite what is revealed to you of the scripture, and observe the Contact Prayers (4), for the Contact Prayers prohibit evil and vice. But the remembrance of God (through Salat) is the most important objective.* God knows everything you do.

31:17 "O my son, you shall observe the Contact Prayers (5). You shall advocate righteousness and forbid evil, and remain steadfast in the face of adversity. These are the most honorable traits.

2) Turn your face towards the Sacred Masjid

    This phrase also occurs  exactly 5 times in quran ...

2:144 We have seen you turning your face about the sky (searching for the right direction). We now assign a Qiblah that is pleasing to you. Henceforth, you shall turn your face towards the Sacred Masjid (1). Wherever you may be, all of you shall turn your faces towards it (2). Those who received the previous scripture know that this is the truth from their Lord. God is never unaware of anything they do.
2:149 Wherever you go, you shall turn your face (during Salat) towards the Sacred Masjid (3). This is the truth from your Lord. God is never unaware of anything you all do.

2:150 Wherever you go, you shall turn your face (during Salat) towards the Sacred Masjid (4) ; wherever you might be, you shall turn your faces (during Salat) towards it (5). Thus, the people will have no argument against you, except the transgressors among them. Do not fear them, and fear Me instead. I will then perfect My blessings upon you, that you may be guided.

All the facts given above ... I extract from ...
http://www.universalunity.org/17.html#TheFiveDailyContactPrayers
 
 
And for the determination of middle prayer (salat wustha) ... just apply code 19 for these two verses AQ2:238 & AQ103:1 ...

2:238 You shall consistently observe the Contact Prayers, especially the middle prayer, and devote yourselves totally to God .

103:1 By the afternoon (asr)

22381031 = 19 x 1177949 -------> proof that middle prayer refer to afternoon prayer (asr) ---------> subsequently total prayer should be five ---------> dawn/noon/afternoon/sunset/night prayer ...

Thanks .

Peace -- are you consistent?

1.   5:12 اقمتم establish you (masculine plural) الصلاه al-ṣalata
2.   11:114 واقم and establish (masculine singular) الصلاه al-ṣalata
3.   17:78 اقم establish (masculine singular) الصلاه al-ṣalata
4.   20:14 واقم and establish (masculine singular) الصلاه al-ṣalata
5.   29:45 واقم and establish (masculine singular) الصلاه al-ṣalata
6.   31:17 اقم establish (masculine singular) الصلاه al-ṣalata
7.   33:33 واقمن and establish (feminine plural) الصلاه al-ṣalata

2:144
1.   فول so turn وجهك face your (masculine singular) شطر direction المسجد al-masjid الحرام al-haraam
2.   فولوا so turn ye of وجوهكم faces yours (masculine plural) شطره direction its

2:149
3.   فول so turn وجهك face your (masculine singular) شطر direction المسجد al-masjid الحرام al-haraam

2:150
4.   فول so turn وجهك face your (masculine singular) شطر direction المسجد al-masjid الحرام al-haram
5.    فولوا so turn ye of وجوهكم faces yours (masculine plural) شطره direction its


huruf

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Re: A challenge to those who claim Quran states 5 salat daily
« Reply #96 on: April 06, 2015, 12:15:19 AM »
This writing of masculine plural is a real trap. Everything that is not specifically feminine is called masculine although we do know without any doubt that there is a plural which is general, that is, cinludes anybody of any sex. Most "masculine plurals" in the Qur'an, as anywhere, are not masculine but global. That grammarians have not come with a proper figure for that is a grammatical misdeed, and given it a proper name is a grammatical misdeed but that does not change the substance of what is spoken or written.

It is fraudulent to make it masculine and exact one hundred scientifical evidences in order to allow texts, in this case the Qur'an to speak of both sexes everytime the "masculine" plural appears.

Also there is the singular masculine, which in fact is not such but inspecified singular when we speak of any person. We may be saying you, but we may be referring to an unspecified you who can be any person.

Salaam

Wakas

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Re: A challenge to those who claim Quran states 5 salat daily
« Reply #97 on: April 06, 2015, 09:26:20 AM »
In addition to Noon's post, is mankind lost only by the afternoon?

103:1 By the afternoon.,
103:2 The human being is utterly lost.,
All information in my posts is correct to the best of my knowledge only and thus should not be taken as a fact. One should seek knowledge and verify: 17:36, 20:114, 35:28, 49:6, 58:11. My articles

www.studyQuran.org

shukri

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Re: A challenge to those who claim Quran states 5 salat daily
« Reply #98 on: April 06, 2015, 06:41:35 PM »
In addition to Noon's post, is mankind lost only by the afternoon?

103:1 By the afternoon.,
103:2 The human being is utterly lost.,

Salaam ,

Some interesting points given by this article ... point 4 onwards ...

http://www.universalunity.org/17.html#MiddlePrayer

Thanks .

Wakas

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Re: A challenge to those who claim Quran states 5 salat daily
« Reply #99 on: April 14, 2015, 11:43:30 PM »
Those "interesting" points you refer have no consistency, one of the fundamental flaws in code 19 maths. In any case, here are my two favourite threads on code 19:

http://free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=16958.0
http://free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9601308.0

They are very telling in my opinion.

All information in my posts is correct to the best of my knowledge only and thus should not be taken as a fact. One should seek knowledge and verify: 17:36, 20:114, 35:28, 49:6, 58:11. My articles

www.studyQuran.org