News:

About us: a forum for monotheists, and discussion of Islam based on The Quran

Main Menu

Non performers of As-Salaat are not true believers

Started by Mazhar, August 13, 2013, 05:58:37 PM

Previous topic - Next topic

Mazhar

Be always mindful for performing As-Salaat; and just peep in the Hell-Prison to listen its dwellers.

: The time bound Protocol of Servitude and Allegiance is the fundamental protocol for non-verbal demonstration of the truthfulness of one's claim of having accepted and become a believer. This is manifestation of belief and key to success and fruitfulness:

Be always mindful for performing As-Salaat
[url="http://haqeeqat.pk/index.htm"]http://haqeeqat.pk/index.htm[/url]

god1quran1

Quote from: Mazhar on August 13, 2013, 05:58:37 PM
Be always mindful for performing As-Salaat; and just peep in the Hell-Prison to listen its dwellers.

: The time bound Protocol of Servitude and Allegiance is the fundamental protocol for non-verbal demonstration of the truthfulness of one's claim of having accepted and become a believer. This is manifestation of belief and key to success and fruitfulness:

Be always mindful for performing As-Salaat

Is there anywhere in the quran where the action verb used alongside salat is equivalent to 'to perform'?
Azfar

Mazhar

Quote from: god1quran1 on August 13, 2013, 11:01:00 PM
Is there anywhere in the quran where the action verb used alongside salat is equivalent to 'to perform'?

Perform: Fulfill requirement: to do what is stated or required;
              accomplish something: to carry out an action, especially one requiring care
              fulfill obligation

The verbs and the words used are all action words; I hope it is known that Active Participles are made from verbs and they are called Verbal agent. Verbs and verbal agents perform that what is required in the verb.
[url="http://haqeeqat.pk/index.htm"]http://haqeeqat.pk/index.htm[/url]

god1quran1

Quote from: Mazhar on August 14, 2013, 04:23:32 AM
Perform: Fulfill requirement: to do what is stated or required;
              accomplish something: to carry out an action, especially one requiring care
              fulfill obligation

The verbs and the words used are all action words; I hope it is known that Active Participles are made from verbs and they are called Verbal agent. Verbs and verbal agents perform that what is required in the verb.

Yes the verbal agents may perform what is required in the verb but that does not mean the meaning of every verb in a language changes to 'to perform'. What the action should be is decided by the verb that does the action on the noun.

The verb in the Quran most commonly used with the noun 'As-Salaat' is 'aqimu' which has an entirely different meaning from to perform.

By claiming that as-salaat should be 'performed' implies that this noun is some kind of a ritual. This is  not supported by the actual action verb used with salaat everywhere in the Quran.

When 'aqimu' is understood as 'to remain steadfast' it suggests that 'salaat' is a more meaningful activity that has some practical value.

Azfar

IAMOP

The idea that salat is a ritual or practice, which is intended for The God and somehow is obligatory because The God needs it from us, that idea is a delusion and a lie and a grievous wrongdoing to all of mankind and those who propagate it shall not be helped.


We cannot feed The God but The God can feed us. There is nothing we can do towards The God to help The God because God is free of need.


Then we must understand that all such commands are for US. So that we can see the God's handiwork, so we can escape the confusion and fog of those who do not appreciate the God. If your salat does not give real results, and real changes in your emotions in every salat, it is not salat. You are pretending but you will not fool those of us who know. And those who practice the real salat will know because it strengthens them from the inside, it brings cool water to the hot and dry parts of their heads - both figuratively and literally.
As you fall asleep and wake up to a new day
So shall you enter your grave and arise to the last


"Now no person knows what delights of the eye are kept hidden for them - as a reward for their deeds" (32:17)

Mazhar

QuoteWe cannot feed The God but The God can feed us. There is nothing we can do towards The God to help The God because God is free of need.

Living by one's own opinions and understandings is individual's prerogetive. But still he needs excuses to uphold his opinion.

Allah does not need to be fed; He feeds but does ask for Assalat:

وَأْمُرْ أَهْلَكَ بِالصَّلَاةِ وَاصْطَبِرْ عَلَيْهَا لَا نَسْأَلُكَ رِزْقًا نَّحْنُ نَرْزُقُكَ
Refer 20:132

[url="http://haqeeqat.pk/index.htm"]http://haqeeqat.pk/index.htm[/url]

Mazhar

Quote from: god1quran1 on August 14, 2013, 08:39:21 AM
Yes the verbal agents may perform what is required in the verb but that does not mean the meaning of every verb in a language changes to 'to perform'. What the action should be is decided by the verb that does the action on the noun.

The verb in the Quran most commonly used with the noun 'As-Salaat' is 'aqimu' which has an entirely different meaning from to perform.

By claiming that as-salaat should be 'performed' implies that this noun is some kind of a ritual. This is  not supported by the actual action verb used with salaat everywhere in the Quran.

When 'aqimu' is understood as 'to remain steadfast' it suggests that 'salaat' is a more meaningful activity that has some practical value.

A protocol that comprises of more than one action-gestures when referred as a collective unit, its heading will be "to perform" as I have captioned it.

The first protocol is:



And you people stand for Allah the Exalted in the posture of devoted humble servants-subjects. [2:238]

The basic perception infolded in the Root Root "ق و م" and قِيَامٌ Verbal Noun is of standing; straight position on feet as distinct from sitting, reclining or lying; or walking. In physical terms it is the most stable, established state of strength, alertness and equilibrium which other postures of sitting, reclining and lying flat lack. This state grants an ability to quickly react and respond to a sudden threat/attack.

Balance and equilibrium strengths a thing and grants stability, prominence and durability. Balance and equilibrium also create a stationary state. This Root thus also conveys the meaning of staying somewhere. And the point of staying becomes a place of gathering. Balance and equilibrium yields state of peace and tranquility. In whatever shade the words derived from this Root are used the; perception of balance and equilibrium, which is the primary condition of standing erect, shall remain predominant/prevail.

Qaniteena: It is circumstantial clause [حال]; and is plural active participle; stand in the manner of devoted humble servants-subjects. The postures are a nonverbal communication that provides significant information and emotional cues. The posture also communicates social standing. A person of lower status typically stands or they may remain standing until they are asked to sit. Gesture has a fundamental metaphoric property; it is not mere ornamentation. Gesture-speech combinations co-expressively embody the point of highest communicative dynamism. Gestures are the imagery of the thought of the performer for the onlookers.

It is Gesture-speech, highest communicative dynamism: Sublime submission of servitude and allegiance;
[url="http://haqeeqat.pk/index.htm"]http://haqeeqat.pk/index.htm[/url]

IAMOP

Quote from: Mazhar on August 14, 2013, 09:36:39 AM
Living by one's own opinions and understandings is individual's prerogetive. But still he needs excuses to uphold his opinion.

Allah does not need to be fed; He feeds but does ask for Assalat:

وَأْمُرْ أَهْلَكَ بِالصَّلَاةِ وَاصْطَبِرْ عَلَيْهَا لَا نَسْأَلُكَ رِزْقًا نَّحْنُ نَرْزُقُكَ
Refer 20:132
[Shakir 20:132] And enjoin prayer on your followers, and steadily adhere to it; We do not ask you for subsistence; We do give you subsistence, and the (good) end is for guarding (against evil).


So now you can see quite clearly:

salat is NOT a subsistence towards the God
salat *is* a subsistence towards the believer, it FEEDS the believer

I love how you cite the very ayat I referred to in the first place in some faint hopes of proving such a point, did you not step back and think for a second, "wait a minute, that's the very verse this person is referring to in the first place"?



Keep in mind I have said nothing about the fact it is a timed ordinance. Certainly it *must* be "performed" morning and evening at the very least but as to WHAT is being performed, the actual content of the ritual, that is where I see problems arising. Because as you very much well know, people do not go to the mosques to feed themselves. They go to appease a deity who they do not even understand or truly believe in. And this is the lie that is confusing and destroying the entire community

:peace:
As you fall asleep and wake up to a new day
So shall you enter your grave and arise to the last


"Now no person knows what delights of the eye are kept hidden for them - as a reward for their deeds" (32:17)

Mazhar

QuoteSo now you can see quite clearly:

salat is NOT a subsistence towards the God
salat *is* a subsistence towards the believer, it FEEDS the believer

Salat has nothing to do with sustenance. You are confusing two things that are poles apart.

And they steadfastly maintain the Institution of As-sa'laat: Time Bound Formal Protocol of demonstrating Servitude and allegiance to Allah the Exalted.
Further, they heartily spend part of the worldly resources for other's welfare which We have given to them as sustenance. [only for seeking approval and attention of Allah the Exalted].

Moreover, you people remain steadfast in maintaining Institution of As-sa'laat: Time Bound Protocol of Servitude and allegiance;
And remain willingly determined to pay Az-zakat: financial contribution for economic uplift of society;
And you kneel together in the company of those who kneel. [2:43]


First is social contact with the Sustainer Lord showing servitude and allegiance.
The other is social conduct with members of his species and other living.

[url="http://haqeeqat.pk/index.htm"]http://haqeeqat.pk/index.htm[/url]

ansmeh1998

Salaam,

        As far as I understand, those who insist for practicing a ritual in the name of salaat are virtually undermining the glorious term and their adherence to salat is nothing more than whistling and clapping as has been indicated in the verse 8:35.
To me, Mind is the trust that was accepted by the Human, the promised Khalifatullah, which was refused by all. Keeping Mind in strict harmony with the Brain is actually Islam.