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Nearness and Guidance -> Knowledge and Wisdom = Peace and Prosperity

Started by Man of Faith, June 20, 2013, 08:06:17 AM

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sushi1992

Quote from: Man of Faith on January 04, 2014, 04:58:39 PM
Chapter 14 Message check

14:1 ALR, a Message which We have sent down to you so that you may bring the people out of the darkness and into the Light with the permission of their Lord, to the Path of the Noble, the Praiseworthy.

14:4 And We have not sent any messenger except in the language of his people, so he may clarify for them. But God misguides whom He wills, and He guides whom He wills. And He is the Noble, the Wise

Red: It is thus strange that we use Arabic when God has promised the Messengers speaking the language of his people. This phrase ought to question the obsession with Arabic and its importance for the Message, and that it just happened that these people got their presentation of the Message in this language in the 7th century.

14:5 And We sent Moses with Our signs: ?You shall bring your people out of the darkness and into the light, and remind them of the days of God.? In this are signs for everyone patient and thankful.
14:6 And Moses said to his people: ?Remember the blessings of God upon you that He saved you from the people of Pharaoh; they were afflicting you with the worst punishment, and they used to slaughter your children, and rape your women. And in that was a great test from your Lord.?


In all the happenings occurring with the Messengers presence here on Earth it is primarily to remember what God did for you and not the Messengers who channeled God's words. Despite this the Messengers tend to have exaggerated importance and idolization to their name.

14:7 And your Lord proclaimed: ?If you give thanks, I will increase for you, but if you are rejecting, then My retribution is severe.?

This ought to be what rejecting God is; to not give appreciation and remain completely heedless of Him no matter if you have Knowledge or not. We ought to keep in mind what God's definition of rejection is. Often it seems that you can know that God exists but you "forget" about Him, lose focus.

14:9 Did not news come to you of those before you: the people of Noah, and ?Aad, and Thamud, and those after them whom none know except God? Their messengers came to them with clarity, but they placed their hands onto their mouths and said: ?We are rejecting what you have been sent with, and we are in doubt as to what you are inviting us to.?
14:10 Their messengers said: ?Is there doubt regarding God, the initiator of the heavens and the earth? He invites you so that He may forgive some of your sins, and delay you to an appointed term.? They said: ?You are merely human beings like us; you wish to turn us away from what our fathers used to serve. So come to us with a clear proof.?
14:11 Their messengers said: ?We are indeed human beings like you, but God will bestow His grace upon whom He pleases from His servants. And it is not up to us to bring you proof except with the permission of God. And in God the believers should place their trust?
14:12 ?And why should we not place our trust in God, when He has guided us in our paths. And we will be patient to the harm you inflict upon us. And in God those who trust should place their trust.?
14:13 And those who rejected said to their messengers: ?We will expel you from our land, or you will return to our creed.? It was then that their Lord inspired to them: ?We will destroy the wicked.?


The Messengers practically preached the same Message in this summary by God and so did Muhammad and Jesus. No more no less.




The losers:

14:21 And they appeared before God, all of them. And the weak ones said to those who were arrogant: ?We were following you, so will you avail us anything from the retribution of God?? They said: ?If God had guided us, then we would have guided you. It makes no difference if we cry out or are patient, for we have no refuge.?
14:22 And the devil said when the matter was complete: ?God had promised you the promise of truth, and I promised you and broke my promise. And I had no power over you except that I invited you and you responded to me. So do not blame me, but blame yourselves; I cannot help you nor can you help me. I reject that you have set me up as a partner before this; the wicked will have a painful retribution.?


Green: They foolishly followed their spiritual leaders when they uttered complete nonsense which had no basis in the Message and prohibitions never authorized by God.
Blue: The devil is an invisible but powerful deceiver and is most efficient when humans distance themselves to God and thus loses His protection, and when we give in to our lusts.




But the righteous Believers were these (who mainly upheld these criteria):

14:23 And those who (1) believed and did (2) good works were admitted to estates with rivers flowing beneath them. In them they will abide with the permission of their Lord. Their greeting therein is ?Peace.?

It is incredible how many times God repeats this phrase throughout The Book and people still complicate the Message.

14:24 Have you not seen how God puts forth the example that a good word is like a good tree, whose root is firm and whose branches are in the sky.
14:25 It bears its fruit every so often with the permission of its Lord; and God puts forth the examples for the people, perhaps they will remember.


Red: This analogy is very good to prove the (1), (2) and (3) theory if one understands what God means.




14:27 God makes firm those who believe with firm sayings in the worldly life, and in the Hereafter. And God misguides the wicked, and God does what He wishes.
14:28 Did you not see those who replaced the blessings of God with rejection, and they caused their people to dwell in the abode of destruction?


If one does not believe and indulges in bad actions constantly then God will even misguide people Himself. Certain groups come to mind immediately.

14:31 Say to My servants who (1) believe, that they should hold the Communion, and (2) spend from what provisions We granted them secretly and openly, before a Day comes when there is no trade therein, nor will there be any friends.

14:35 And Abraham said: ?My Lord, make this a land of peace, and keep me and my sons away from serving statues.?

The Message shines through here perfectly right in front of your very eyes who have probably read this phrase many times.

14:39 ?Praise be to God who has granted me to my old age Ishmael and Isaac; my Lord is Hearer of the prayer.?
14:40 ?My Lord, let me hold the Communion, and also from my progeny. Our Lord, and accept my prayer.?


Purpose of Communion, to implore God for the things we need.

The Message is really simple, is it not?

God bless you

Tis. Very well written. If only everyone saw it this simply....

God bless :peace:
Allah created all in the world for you to live and use. Use your knowledge, heart, mind and soul to determine your path in guidance with God, the Designer and Creator, and you shall succeed as a right

Man of Faith

Chapter 15 Message check

Let us proceed with yet another chapter of The Book to clarify the clear Message within the text.

15:1 ALR, these are the signs of the Message, and a clear Book.

Red: This is one of those verses that does not make any sense with the traditional view of ketaab as book and then ends with the traditional perception of Qur'an as Qur'an. At least not according to me.

15:9 Indeed it is We who have sent down the (3) Reminder, and indeed it is We who will preserve it.

15:86 Your Lord is the Creator, the Knower.
15:87 And We have given you seven of the pairs, and the great Book.
15:88 Do not linger with your eyes on what We have bestowed upon some couples from them, and do not grieve for them, and lower your wing for the believers.
15:89 And say: ?I am the clarifying warner.?
15:90 As for the dividers in what We sent down.
15:91 The ones who have made the Book partial.
15:92 By your Lord, We will ask them all.
15:93 Regarding what they used to do.
15:94 So proclaim what you have been commanded and turn away from the polytheists.
15:95 We will relieve you from those who mocked.
15:96 Those who place with God another god. They will come to know.
15:97 And We know that your chest is strained by what they say.
15:98 So glorify the praise of your Lord, and be of those who prostrate.
15:99 And (1) serve your Lord until certainty comes to you.


Red: This feels like a riddle.

I skipped many verses as they were not relevant for the Message check or simply would be repetition of the same things I linked to previously.

God bless you
Website reference: [url="http://iamthatiam.boards.net"]http://iamthatiam.boards.net[/url]

Man of Faith

Chapter 16 Message check

Let us immediately continue with the next chapter and see how the Message is incredibly simple and non-uniform. People are allowed to be their own individuals as long as they works towards becoming really good people and build up a strong Faith in God.

16:2 He sends down the angels with the Spirit by His command upon whom He wishes of His servants: (1) ?That you shall warn that there is no god except I, so be aware of Me.?

Red: The Message in its simplicity. If people simply believe, show appreciation and do good then mission accomplished.
Green: Indeed. God can inspire anyone whom he wishes, and there is nothing which indicates a time restriction.

16:3 - 16:17 God gives reasons to believe in Him, although they are outdated for a civilization of the 21st century, so they might not be so impressive today even if they are correct. Had God revealed a book today there would likely be allegories with outer space and planets in a more modern style. The old style of allegories are often abused by atheist to "patheticize" The Book even if they are not wrong but on child level nowadays.




It seems that open polytheism (other gods) was the main issue when The Book was revealed so the accusations by God could possibly be different if God happened to inspire a scripture in this age. It is relatively easy to adjust the verses of The Book in your mind so that you see God's point regardless. Anyway, the gods narrated about could be changed by the god people have done out of Muhammad and Jesus with sayings that possibly never took place. Certain people think that Muhammad has the power of intercession and other ridiculous abilities so you could say that he has god-rank. And Jesus is still as of 21st century regarded as a god, so in ways The Book is still as valid as in the past although there could be a slight change of focus as the issues changed.

I still deem The Book to primarily be aimed for the contemporary population of the 7th century and could be used as a Guide now about 1400 years later, but it is not tailored for a modern population so to say. We have had a slight change of issues from when The Book was written although the moral lessons are still as valid, and because the Message is so uncomplicated.




16:30 And it was said to those who were righteous: ?What has your Lord sent down?? They said: ?All goodness.? For those who have (2) done good in this world there is good; and the Hereafter is goodness. Excellent indeed is the home of the righteous.

Red: Consider what you have done when you have done good. That is repeated countless of times in The Book and is the essence of this Message and the other one is purification and communication to God which I conveniently refer to as Communion.

16:32 Those whom their lives are terminated by the angels, (2) while they had been good, they will say: ?Peace be upon you, enter the Paradise because of that which you have done.?

Red: (2) BE GOOD, be of a GOOD character. That and (1) belief and service to God is all that counts. And certain mobilization to uphold justice because a Believer cannot be a bystander, and they know that dieing while being good would be like a blessing, nothing to be afraid of.




16:36 And We have sent a messenger to every nation: (1) ?You shall serve God and (2) avoid evil.? Some of them were guided by God, and some of them deserved to be misguided. So travel the earth, and see how the punishment was of those who denied.

Red: So I say: "You shall serve God and avoid evil!"

16:37 If you are concerned for their guidance, God does not guide whom He misguides; and they will have no supporters.

Red: No matter what you say; some people will not believe, so no reason to be sad because they only argue with you and want to imply that you are ignorant.

16:43 And We did not send any except men before you whom We inspired, so ask the people who have received the Reminder if you do not know.
16:44 With signs and the revelations. And We sent down to you the Reminder to reveal to the people what was sent to them, and perhaps they will think.


The Message is nothing new.

16:64 And We have not sent down the Message to you except that you may clarify for them that in which they have disputed, and as a guidance and a mercy for a people who believe.

16:89 And the Day We send to every nation a witness against them from themselves, and We have brought you as a witness against these. And We have sent down to you the Message as a clarification for all things, and a guidance and a mercy and good tidings to those who have submitted.




16:90 God orders (2) justice and goodness and that you shall help your relatives, and He prohibits immorality and vice and transgression. He warns you that you may remember.

What is the Message?

16:91 And fulfill your pledge to God when you pledge so, and do not break your oath after making it, for you have made God a sponsor over you. God is aware of what you do.

16:97 Whoever does (2) good works, whether male or female, and is a (1) believer, We will give him a good life and We will reward them their dues with the best of what they used to do.




16:98 When you read The Book, you shall seek refuge with God from the outcast devil.
16:99 He has no authority over those who believe, and who put their trust in their Lord.


Red: If you believe; God narrates that Shaytaan has no authority over you. And as you know belief in a nutshell is belief (Faith) in God and doing good; such people will be "shielded" against the temptations of the evil one.

16:101 And if We exchange a revelation in place of another revelation; and God is more aware of what He is revealing; they say: ?You are making this up!? Alas, most of them do not know.

A classical; "God's pen does never run out of ink", fits fine here.

16:102 Say: ?The Holy Spirit has brought it down from your Lord with the truth, so that those who (1) believe will be strengthened, and as a Guidance and good news for those who have submitted.?
16:103 And We are aware that they say: ?A human being is teaching him.? The tongue of the one they refer to is foreign, while this is a clear Arabic tongue.
16:104 Those who do not believe in the signs of God, God will not guide them, and they will have a painful retribution.
16:105 Inventing fabrications is only done by those who do not believe in the signs of God; and these are the liars.


Red: The inspiration is channeled to the receiving servant of God.
Green: It would be interesting to imagine that the same phrase could as well be repeated again if there would be a revelation in yet another language something like: "The tongue of the one they refer to is foreign, while this is a clear [insert random language here] tongue"




16:112 And God puts forth the example of a town which was (2) peaceful and content, its provisions were coming to it bountifully from all places, but then it (-2) rebelled against the blessings of God, and God made it taste hunger and fear for what they used to do.
16:113 And a messenger came to them from themselves, but they denied him, so the punishment took them while they were wicked.
16:114 So (2) eat from what God has provided you, that which is good and lawful, and be (1) thankful for the blessing of God, if it is indeed He whom you serve.
16:115 He has only forbidden for you what is already dead, and the blood, and the meat of pig, and what was dedicated to other than God. But whoever is forced to, without seeking disobedience or transgression, then God is Forgiver, Merciful.
16:116 And do not say, as to what your tongues falsely describe: ?This is lawful, and that is forbidden;? that you seek to invent lies about God. Those who invent lies about God will not succeed.


Red: This is haraam and this is halal etc. It is pretty clear that they indulged in various conjecture and possibly oppressed those who opposed this madness.

16:118 And for those who are Jewish, We forbade what We told to you before. And We did not wrong them, but they were wronging themselves.

The Jews had some community-specific prohibitions, and God is right that He told you about it previously. You see it earlier in my Message checks.

16:119 Then your Lord to those who do (-2) evil out of ignorance, then they repent after that and (2) they make good, your Lord after that is Forgiver, Merciful.




16:120 Abraham was a nation, (2) dutiful to God, a monotheist, and he was not of the polytheists.
16:121 (1) Thankful for His blessings. He chose him and guided him to a straight path.
16:122 And We gave him good in this world, and in the Hereafter he is of the upright ones.





16:123 Then We inspired to you: ?You shall follow the creed of Abraham, monotheism, and he was not of the polytheists.?
16:124 Indeed, the Sabbath was only decreed for those who had disputed in it, and your Lord will judge between them for that in which they had disputed.


This is one of the vague (translated) verses mentioning the Sabbath. I do not buy the argument to exclude it on this basis. I am going to have to continue to research on this.




16:126 And if you punish, then punish with equivalence to that which you were punished. And if you are patient then it is better for the patient ones.
16:127 And be patient, for your patience is on none except God. And do not grieve for them, and do not be depressed by what they scheme.


16:128 God is with those who are (1) aware and are (2) good doers.

It is clear that it is better to forgive than to seek revenge at all. God has made written that it is one of the main traits to be patient.

God bless you
Website reference: [url="http://iamthatiam.boards.net"]http://iamthatiam.boards.net[/url]

Earthdom

Peace Man of  Daith

Until now I agree if Kitab in QUran can be mean Book or letter/chapter.
Quran's language pattern indeed is a special, even for Arab themself.A word hasmany multiple meaning depend on it's context.

One of the example is the word "Rabb" in Chapter Yusuf.The word "Rabb: mostly directed to the One Supreme Being, but in that chapter also directed to Jusuf's FIr'aun

God Bless You

Man of Faith

Peace Earthdom,

I have put much of my brain processing power on ketaab, but its root word seems to incline towards to compose something such as a composition, but in my own philosophies it does not have to mean a concrete object in its noun form ketaab. Ketaab as letter could be it, but I find the word still connotes to kind of a prescription, much like the doctors give to their patients and that put me to the decision of using the word Message for the context of The Book. The problem we face with ketaab is that we humans have a tendency to always have to relate to things physically and that has caused ketaab to become a thing. But as a physical item 'ketaab' does not fit all the context and some of the verses look pathetic if you ask me, but if you give a slightly more abstract meaning such as message which a book could possibly be although it means more abstractly. A message is usually abstract in meaning and in The Book ketaab as concrete item does not suit the context.

Ketaab as letter is better than book, but I still am not satisfied with that as it does still not give enough. Ketaab in The Book is many times evidently not a physical item because it does not fit the context and it makes it faulty. For example; Abraham could not have known about physical books unless he knew the future as in the verse I was talking about in previous posts where Abraham together with his son prayed:

2:129 ?Our Lord, and send among them a messenger from among themselves, that he may recite to them Your revelations and teach them the Book and the wisdom, and purify them. You are the Noble, the Wise.?

Red: What book did he refer to? Could the man read the future or does ketaab really mean a physical book? If you replace book and insert Message then the sentence takes its true form according to me.

And its meaning is not adaptable to just this context, but that is true for the word ketaab كتاب wherever you encounter it in The Book.

It does not exclude that the word كتب does mean to compose something, but it does not have the absolute meaning that the result product has to be a physical item. In the case of The Book in relates to the contents of it as the Message.

Based on this I know that the Torah and Gospel are also part of the Message and not necessarily physical books. I personally believe that Moses only received guidelines on two stone tablets which he and his people were told to follow and which also Jesus were taught to follow although he came with news which the Message Gospel means and you know yourself what Jesus spoke about if you read one of the Gospel testimonies. What they taught are part of the grand Message, but Torah and Gospel themselves are the abstract teachings of respective era. The Messengers before Gospel taught strictly what was of the Torah while Jesus elaborated and showed that you could regard the list of commandments as the minimum requirement. What the Jews know of the original prohibitions they had that is the Torah, but lots of what they do is inventions much like we know happens to Muslims today. Jews have a relatively small list of things to do; the ten commandments and some community-specific commands. The list of the ten commandments (I think is al-furqan) is still valid for every Believer in the system of God and His Covenant.

Once again I am bold as to claim Torah and Gospel are not to be regarded concretely but abstractly although you follow Torah if you follow the (original) teachings of Moses althogh the Message is renewed with news that newer generations do not to be punished for their (the Jews from the Exodus and following generations) sins not to eat from the good which God forbade because the Jews had sinned. Possibly it is this that is the Gospel, i.e. that certain prohibitions were lifted and Jesus were a Light that showed that one could apply the heart in the interpretation of the Message and that the Torah is just the minimum requirement expected from a Believer.

So the Bible carries some Truth, but much of the Old Testament is not to be considered The Criterion and the Torah of Moses. In fact very little of it and you can apply logic that it has to be contained in text on two ancient stone tablets. And obviously the Gospels you find in the New Testament were not written by Jesus and nothing exists which were written by Jesus. There is probably nothing that Jesus wrote and the Gospels reveal most of what Jesus did quite well despite distortion, so there was really no need for him to write down anything. If you tinker on the Gospels next time you read them you find that the Message is not to do only minimally what is required of a Believer but do more and Jesus gave the optimum state of a Believer to completely reject the wealth of this world and only do things to help others.

God bless you
Website reference: [url="http://iamthatiam.boards.net"]http://iamthatiam.boards.net[/url]

The_Chimp

Quote from: Man of Faith on January 06, 2014, 01:04:56 PM
Peace Earthdom,

I have put much of my brain processing power on ketaab, but its root word seems to incline towards to compose something such as a composition, but in my own philosophies it does not have to mean a concrete object in its noun form ketaab. Ketaab as letter could be it, but I find the word still connotes to kind of a prescription, much like the doctors give to their patients and that put me to the decision of using the word Message for the context of The Book. The problem we face with ketaab is that we humans have a tendency to always have to relate to things physically and that has caused ketaab to become a thing. But as a physical item 'ketaab' does not fit all the context and some of the verses look pathetic if you ask me, but if you give a slightly more abstract meaning such as message which a book could possibly be although it means more abstractly. A message is usually abstract in meaning and in The Book ketaab as concrete item does not suit the context.

Ketaab as letter is better than book, but I still am not satisfied with that as it does still not give enough. Ketaab in The Book is many times evidently not a physical item because it does not fit the context and it makes it faulty. For example; Abraham could not have known about physical books unless he knew the future as in the verse I was talking about in previous posts where Abraham together with his son prayed:

2:129 ?Our Lord, and send among them a messenger from among themselves, that he may recite to them Your revelations and teach them the Book and the wisdom, and purify them. You are the Noble, the Wise.?

Red: What book did he refer to? Could the man read the future or does ketaab really mean a physical book? If you replace book and insert Message then the sentence takes its true form according to me.

And its meaning is not adaptable to just this context, but that is true for the word ketaab كتاب wherever you encounter it in The Book.

It does not exclude that the word كتب does mean to compose something, but it does not have the absolute meaning that the result product has to be a physical item. In the case of The Book in relates to the contents of it as the Message.

Based on this I know that the Torah and Gospel are also part of the Message and not necessarily physical books. I personally believe that Moses only received guidelines on two stone tablets which he and his people were told to follow and which also Jesus were taught to follow although he came with news which the Message Gospel means and you know yourself what Jesus spoke about if you read one of the Gospel testimonies. What they taught are part of the grand Message, but Torah and Gospel themselves are the abstract teachings of respective era. The Messengers before Gospel taught strictly what was of the Torah while Jesus elaborated and showed that you could regard the list of commandments as the minimum requirement. What the Jews know of the original prohibitions they had that is the Torah, but lots of what they do is inventions much like we know happens to Muslims today. Jews have a relatively small list of things to do; the ten commandments and some community-specific commands. The list of the ten commandments (I think is al-furqan) is still valid for every Believer in the system of God and His Covenant.

Once again I am bold as to claim Torah and Gospel are not to be regarded concretely but abstractly although you follow Torah if you follow the (original) teachings of Moses althogh the Message is renewed with news that newer generations do not to be punished for their (the Jews from the Exodus and following generations) sins not to eat from the good which God forbade because the Jews had sinned. Possibly it is this that is the Gospel, i.e. that certain prohibitions were lifted and Jesus were a Light that showed that one could apply the heart in the interpretation of the Message and that the Torah is just the minimum requirement expected from a Believer.

So the Bible carries some Truth, but much of the Old Testament is not to be considered The Criterion and the Torah of Moses. In fact very little of it and you can apply logic that it has to be contained in text on two ancient stone tablets. And obviously the Gospels you find in the New Testament were not written by Jesus and nothing exists which were written by Jesus. There is probably nothing that Jesus wrote and the Gospels reveal most of what Jesus did quite well despite distortion, so there was really no need for him to write down anything. If you tinker on the Gospels next time you read them you find that the Message is not to do only minimally what is required of a Believer but do more and Jesus gave the optimum state of a Believer to completely reject the wealth of this world and only do things to help others.

God bless you

Your "personal" beliefs count for nothing . . . and are text book definition of "Conjecture". Only thing that counts is evidence from Quran.




Zulf

Quote from: The_Chimp on January 06, 2014, 02:44:17 PM
Your "personal" beliefs count for nothing . . . and are text book definition of "Conjecture". Only thing that counts is evidence from Quran.

His personal beliefs count for exactly as much as anyone else's personal beliefs.
People can prove anything about anything in any direction. Let's not judge each other. Instead try being silent and listen to Allah in your heart, not in your conditioned and fearful mind.
If you name me, you negate me.

The_Chimp

Quote from: Zulf on January 06, 2014, 04:56:01 PM
His personal beliefs count for exactly as much as anyone else's personal beliefs.
People can prove anything about anything in any direction. Let's not judge each other. Instead try being silent and listen to Allah in your heart, not in your conditioned and fearful mind.

Then - learn to keep it quiet. Isn't it dead ironic . . . that Quran only cover the gaps . . . from themselves? And claim to be restricted to Quran only? Yet that is so obviously NOT the case.

- -

QuotePeople can prove anything about anything in any direction.

Atta! But hat you cannot "prove" is what you just made  up.

- -

QuoteLet's not judge each other. Instead try being silent and listen to Allah in your heart, not in your conditioned and fearful mind.

Meaningless religious babble. Sorry never paid heed to such "sanctimony".

Zulf

Quote from: The_Chimp on January 06, 2014, 04:59:17 PM
Then - learn to keep it quiet. Isn't it dead ironic . . . that Quran only cover the gaps . . . from themselves? And claim to be restricted to Quran only? Yet that is so obviously NOT the case.
I'm certainly not restricted to "quran only". But anyway, I'll remain silent.  :-X . . .   ::)

Quote
Atta! But hat you cannot "prove" is what you just made  up.
No-one can.

Quote
Meaningless religious babble. Sorry never paid heed to such "sanctimony".
:rotfl:
Meaningless.. to you, yes apparently.
Religious? Not at all. I stand apart from religion.
But what do you pay heed to?

Peace  :sun:
If you name me, you negate me.

Man of Faith

Peace,

Please no fighting here. The Chimp is entitled to his opinion. Perchance there is someone else who appreciates the studies.

God bless whom he wills
Website reference: [url="http://iamthatiam.boards.net"]http://iamthatiam.boards.net[/url]