News:

About us: a forum for monotheists, and discussion of Islam based on The Quran

Main Menu

New Groundbreaking Arabic Book: Peacemaking from the Quran

Started by ayman, December 02, 2012, 01:35:03 AM

Previous topic - Next topic

The_Chimp

Quote from: ayman on December 03, 2013, 06:45:16 PM
Peace brother Timur,
I provide a short explanation of why "sujud" means obedience as you suggested. I just uploaded the new version.

Thanks for the great input and support.

Ayman

Where? Provide explanation where?

Sajdah - in Arabic means to prostrate and not "obedience".

The_Chimp

http://www.quran4peace.org/documents/Quran4peace-English-part3.pdf

This document is someone's made up and baseless views with many errors.

- -

QuoteAs we saw in the previous chapter, the common noun ?islam? is not the meaningless proper name of a religion.

Incorrect - virtually every scholar of Islam [Muslim or otherwise] would term Islam as a Proper Noun.

- -

QuoteFor example, while ?islam? means peacemaking

By whose reckoning?

The word Islam means "To submit". Well documented . . . unless one invents completely new meanings.

- -

QuoteAs we can see, the word ?taslim? in 33:56 is translated as salutation. However, by doing a simple search in the Quran, everyone can easily find the same exact word used in 4:65 to clearly mean ?submission? not ?salutation?.

Words have different meanings in different contexts . . .

Sallama does have the meaning of to send peace/greetings/salutation.

- -

QuoteIt is obvious that the word ?taslim? in the Quran is used to mean ?submission? and not ?salutation?.

Actually it is far from obvious. By finding different usage that alone is not sufficient reason to go and change the meaning of another word.

- -

QuoteSo, according to 33:56, when people say ?sala allah alayh wa salam? they are ignorantly saying that the god submits (the god be most exalted). So billions of people, including so-called scholars, have been mindlessly uttering what is essentially a gross blasphemyagainst the god!

Shock, Horror! Or what the case likely to be is . . . that YOU are wrong. Think about it . . . Arabs whose language it is . . . have produced outstanding scholars of Arabic and what not . . . and others that are not Arab . . .

They all missed it . . . and yet . . . . you have spotted this mistake?

Unlikely.

People are not saying God submits at all . . .

Read:

"Indeed, Allah confers blessing upon the Prophet, and His angels [ask Him to do so]. O you who have believed, ask [ Allah to confer] blessing upon him and ask [ Allah to grant him] peace."




The above is one bit . . . rest of document is filled with unqualified amateurish nonsense.







Timur

Quote from: ayman on December 03, 2013, 06:45:16 PMThanks for the great input and support.

You are welcome, thanks for your great work!

Peace.

Timur

Peace Chimp.

Quote from: The_Chimp on December 03, 2013, 07:11:00 PMSajdah - in Arabic means to prostrate and not "obedience".

How do you translate 2:58, 4:154 or 7:161?

Please have a look here: http://mypercept.co.uk/articles/meaning-of-SuJuD-from-Quran.html
Summary of issues: http://free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9601641.msg328785#msg328785

Here you can read an older article by brother Ayman containing information about the meaning of sujud. At that time he rendered it as "hearing and obeying", which is in the essence no difference to "obedience": http://www.free-minds.org/Old/articles/gods_system/name.htm

Here you contradict yourself concerning the meaning of islam:

Quote from: The_Chimp on December 03, 2013, 07:27:54 PM
Incorrect - virtually every scholar of Islam [Muslim or otherwise] would term Islam as a Proper Noun.

Quote from: The_Chimp on December 03, 2013, 07:27:54 PMThe word Islam means "To submit". Well documented . . . unless one invents completely new meanings.

So what shall it be? A proper noun or a common noun meaning "submission"?

Man of Faith

Quote from: Timur on December 04, 2013, 11:43:29 AM
Peace Chimp.

How do you translate 2:58, 4:154 or 7:161?

Please have a look here: http://mypercept.co.uk/articles/meaning-of-SuJuD-from-Quran.html
Summary of issues: http://free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9601641.msg328785#msg328785

Here you can read an older article by brother Ayman containing information about the meaning of sujud. At that time he rendered it as "hearing and obeying", which is in the essence no difference to "obedience": http://www.free-minds.org/Old/articles/gods_system/name.htm

Here you contradict yourself concerning the meaning of islam:

So what shall it be? A proper noun or a common noun meaning "submission"?


Peace,

Disregard them; they only follow their leaders blindly.

6:116 And if you obey most of those on the earth they will lead you away from the path of God; that is because they follow conjecture, and that is because they only guess.
33:67 And they will say: ?Our Lord, we have obeyed our leaders and our learned ones, but they misled us from the path.?


Peace
Website reference: [url="http://iamthatiam.boards.net"]http://iamthatiam.boards.net[/url]

The_Chimp

Quran 2:58

"And [recall] when We said, "Enter this city and eat from it wherever you will in [ease and] abundance, and enter the gate bowing humbly and say, 'Relieve us of our burdens.' We will [then] forgive your sins for you, and We will increase the doers of good [in goodness and reward].""

-

[4:154]

And We raised over them the mount for [refusal of] their covenant; and We said to them, "Enter the gate bowing humbly", and We said to them, "Do not transgress on the sabbath", and We took from them a solemn covenant.

-

[7: 161]

And [mention, O Muhammad], when it was said to them, "Dwell in this city and eat from it wherever you will and say, 'Relieve us of our burdens,' and enter the gate bowing humbly; We will [then] forgive you your sins. We will increase the doers of good [in goodness and reward]."

In all the meaning is right . . . inventing new meanings is OBVIOUSLY 100% wrong.

= = =

I do not contradict my self over the word Islam.

Islam - the word means "Submission". And it is also a nomenclature - when referring to the Muslim religion it is a Proper Noun.

Proper Nouns to have meanings! For example my name "Amin" is proper name and has a meaning!

Once again . . you simply cannot "invent" new meanings. It is 100% wrong.

= = =


The_Chimp

Quote from: Man of Faith on December 04, 2013, 12:52:39 PM
Peace,

Disregard them; they only follow their leaders blindly.

6:116 And if you obey most of those on the earth they will lead you away from the path of God; that is because they follow conjecture, and that is because they only guess.
33:67 And they will say: ?Our Lord, we have obeyed our leaders and our learned ones, but they misled us from the path.?


Peace

Sorry - but you are just getting abusive for the sake of abuse . . .

1. I am far more educated than you.

2. Far more smarter.

- -

Live with it.


Bender

Quote from: The_Chimp on December 05, 2013, 05:40:45 PM

Once again . . you simply cannot "invent" new meanings. It is 100% wrong.


Salaam,

How about inventing new words in ayaats of The Quran? How much "...%" wrong or right is that?

Salaam,
Bender
Alhamdu lillahi rabbi al-alameen

The_Chimp

Quote from: Bender on December 05, 2013, 05:46:07 PM
Salaam,

How about inventing new words in ayaats of The Quran? How much "...%" wrong or right is that?

Salaam,
Bender

100%. Pointless question. If you want to have a conversation - fine. Try this wise-cracking nonsense . . . I am not interested. Don't bother replying. I will report you for it.


Bender

Quote from: The_Chimp on December 05, 2013, 06:13:00 PM
100%. Pointless question. If you want to have a conversation - fine. Try this wise-cracking nonsense . . . I am not interested. Don't bother replying. I will report you for it.

Salaam,

BLUE: 100% wrong or 100% right?

RED: I just did it  :& have mercy on me  :&

Salaam,
Bender
Alhamdu lillahi rabbi al-alameen