Convert - Shia inclined but very curious

[Aryan Warrior]

true, there's a difference.

lots of rules are based on opinion that's the beauty of scholarship

infallible as a human gets.. well that's an interesting concept but prob not the right wording

not many people praise Yazid nor did all Imams "rule" in the same sense of power as caliphate.. also lots of corruption took place so that messes things up.

Many Sunni's are against abrogation of the Quran. There are people that did abrogate Quran with hadith however there are many hard line against it. so i wouldnt say it's sunnism. but rather a branch of people/scholars therein.

there is alot of similarities and differences with shia/sunni

interesting views.

Welcome to the forum

peace

Yeah like I don't see how an imam or a prophet can be without sin as they are human and humans are made to sin at least once, thus why they can't be completely infallible but probably as infallible as humans get means that they sin less then others. Though I bet a lot of Shias think of them as without sin :/

There are indeed sunnis who are against abrogation, as I remember there being one in Tunisia for example who was against what Omar abrogate and some hadith that supported his claim. But most I have realized most do abrogate, such as abrogate good things like art which is clearly allowed as Solomon was described as an artist and yet a prophet who followed well in the work of God. Shias on the other hand allow these things as the Quran has clearly given an example of it being used.

As a shia-inclined, the Sunni mind set does disturb me a lot as they are so freakin strict on everything O_O

Regardless this is why i'm a shia

[SarahY]

well of course not, shias view the imams/ prophets as infallible i.e. perfect.

many sunnis are against abrogation. maybe you're an unfortunate person who live in an area where most do abrogate.

lots of muslims have artwork. in fact most mosques have beautiful intricate art. Shias have artwork but in noway would they paint the faces of the imams or prophets. nor would either shia or sunni pray in a direction of an art (particularly one with life i.e. an animal) as it would be perceived as a form of idol worship.

every scholar, scholarly opinion or marja3 will have their interpretations. i guess this is how bid3a evolves. while people say they dont do things they justify others in the name of religion. 

shias could be perceived as strict too.

just out of curiousity, what sources do you use to gain shia knowledge? and how do you gauge authenticity? or you don't do that?

[JLM]

As'salamu alaikum and welcome.

I'm an ex-shia myself, but we won't focus on that too much here. I just want to say that one should be weary of ahadith since it is all based upon oral accounts. As you probably know, oral accounts are not accepted as evidence in a court of law as it's weak and tends to be distorted. With that in mind why should oral accounts in ahadith be considered any different? It's just a little something to think about before venturing into this site.

Congrats on the conversion by the way.

[khan25]

first of all different shia sects  such as zaidia ,nizaria, mustaalids and imamites(12ers)  are all commercial sects rather than religious . 
secondly. shia (12er) hadiths were written long after the death of  prophet MUhammad and imam jaffar . and there is no hadith book written by any of the shia imams  themselves.and one get surprised when one knows that 2/3 of the shiites ' books are written just 3 or 400 years ago in safavid era in iran lolz.

[SarahY]

interesting what do you know about the safavid era, didn't they just promote shiaism? and revive islamic (shia) philosophy?

or you think they just reinvented the wheel?

[Aryan Warrior]

first of all different shia sects  such as zaidia ,nizaria, mustaalids and imamites(12ers)  are all commercial sects rather than religious . 
secondly. shia (12er) hadiths were written long after the death of  prophet MUhammad and imam jaffar . and there is no hadith book written by any of the shia imams  themselves.and one get surprised when one knows that 2/3 of the shiites ' books are written just 3 or 400 years ago in safavid era in iran lolz.

Haven't heard this one about them being written during the Safavid era. Al Kafi which is the Shia Bukhari was written about 300 years after the Prophets death and also contains hadiths of the Imams. Though the major difference is that Al Kafi when first collected was called by its collector as unreliable and that one should look at it and throw away whatever contradicts the Quran.

interesting what do you know about the safavid era, didn't they just promote shiaism? and revive islamic (shia) philosophy?

or you think they just reinvented the wheel?

Personally I as Persian clearly like the Safavid era for Persia came back but as for Shiaism, that is something i'm glad grew as well in opposition to Sunnism. While Shiaism is also traditionally runned, it at least isn't as fundamental as Sunnism O_O The difference in opinions we have now I think we can someone contribute to shiaisms opposition to the regular sunni standards then.

[youssef4342]

peace be upon you as well.

About shia's, a few days ago i was blessed with having a talk with a Shia Muslim Lady.
[Glory belongs to God Almighty, the Most Great! because just the day before that i was reading about some Shia ?Theology?, and here she was a living example that seemingly popped out of ?nowhere? in the middle of a wal-mart store!]

I don?t think she heard of following the Quran alone. To say, i kind of like her because
1) she kind of encouraged me to follow the Quran and use my mind/reasoning
2) she kind of was sympathetic with the 3 salat a day ?theory?, since shia muslims do accept the tradition that the Prophet combined his 5 salats and thus only did salat at only 3 times per day. [I currently do, to say, a ?liberal? version of salat, 3 times daily. I don?t observe rak?a counts however]
3) she was much liberal and kind.

I?ve had talks with sunnis before, but now, i think shia?s might just be a better audience.
Shia forums anyone?

[Aryan Warrior]

peace be upon you as well.

About shia's, a few days ago i was blessed with having a talk with a Shia Muslim Lady.
[Glory belongs to God Almighty, the Most Great! because just the day before that i was reading about some Shia ?Theology?, and here she was a living example that seemingly popped out of ?nowhere? in the middle of a wal-mart store!]

I don?t think she heard of following the Quran alone. To say, i kind of like her because
1) she kind of encouraged me to follow the Quran and use my mind/reasoning
2) she kind of was sympathetic with the 3 salat a day ?theory?, since shia muslims do accept the tradition that the Prophet combined his 5 salats and thus only did salat at only 3 times per day. [I currently do, to say, a ?liberal? version of salat, 3 times daily. I don?t observe rak?a counts however]
3) she was much liberal and kind.

I?ve had talks with sunnis before, but now, i think shia?s might just be a better audience.
Shia forums anyone?

Ah nice. Shiachat is a forum where Shias mainly are on. Yeah shias do pray 3 times as we normally agree on. Even thoigh they say that there are 5, they always combine it to 3 and even at mosques when they do it together. But one thing i've learned from shias is that the hadith is not as withstanding as it is with the sunnis in that if you reject a hadith, they won't call you a kaffir did you tell her of your
Quran only beliefs?

[youssef4342]

Yes i told her, but i don't think she herd about it before.
There might be a need to spread the message around!

[Aryan Warrior]

Yes i told her, but i don't think she herd about it before.
There might be a need to spread the message around!

Very true. The message does need to spread. Its just how the Protestant religion started against the Catholic beliefs, in this case its us vs the sunnis. This type of protest was what led Europe to the modern ages of freedom, let's hope this can spread similarly and be what brings the middle east to the same era