Convert - Shia inclined but very curious

[rraza]

If we're not struggling we're probably not on the right path, i dont think its meant to be easy.

Salam

Thankyou for your reply. You said you believe there is no one religion..just different paths to God? I think so too. However, if you believe in that then how come you believe in the quranic path to be true? PLease correct me if I am assuming stuff about you.

and i dont necessarily think Gods path is one full of struggle...on the contrary I think its the path that brings us most peace and tranquility and strength, so we stay focused on doing good in this life instead of looking into things like ..which hand does God want us to use while eating food..or what sort of goat does God want us to sacrifice after pilgrimage. But then again, Im only searching..that is merely how I think at this point in time. May God guide all of us to the Truth.

[Sirius]

Every hadith is probably not all baloney but I'd argue that it's besides the point. I guess the question is, what is their purpose? Or do they have a place in Islam? Or are they relevant? Even if every hadith was hypothetically verifiable these questions will still stand. Authenticity is an issue of course but it's not the only one in my opinion.

Looking forward to seeing more of your thoughts around the forum

[Producer]

President Ahmadenijad versus Ayatollah Ali Khamenei

Ayatollah Ali Khamenei brain damage by Misleding Hadith accusing President Ahmadenijad of Witchcraft.

I don't know if Ahmadenijad is doing witchcraft, or experiment with nuclear power or high-energy physics weapon. (high-energy physics is "witchcraft" to brain damage 'Shia).

Ahmadinejad, may worship Ali, that is wrong.

But also see what he does right - Guarding his God Give Life(quran 4:29);
1. Build a Nuclear Power Plant.
2. Support High-Technology Industries
3. Defense of Local Economy, Sustainability, Independence.

Sure people can look at his bad side on Speech and Economic Freedom.

Its hard to do Anarcho-Capitalist when Parasites simply rips and loots everything with their muscle Nato and IMF.


Many Mullahs thinks Technologies are Witchcraft(conjure from misleading hadiths). Without technology, that goes against guarding god give life.

[Indelwyn]

 
Sorry I missed this when I was away. 

WELCOME!!

[Aryan Warrior]

This is pretty late but I wanna reply as a shia inclined Quranist myself.

Basically first off welcome and how I see things as a shia inclined Quranist is that:

-Considering the religion was new and considering the fact that God had promised to keep this book and religion perfect, it would only make sense for God to send people who would keep according to the Quran.
-During that era you had the Caliphs coming in such as Abu Bakr and Omar and especially Yazid who wanted to change rules that were allowed or disallowed in the Quran. Thus the belief is that you have the imams who opposed change.
-the imams i've realized reference the Quran and not hadiths like what Omar tried to do at times (probably a bunch being fabricated) thus they were great Quranists themselves.
-While there are hadiths from both Muhammad and the imams in traditional Shia Islam, the only hadiths I might look for are ones that back up some claims in the Quran and reject all those that contradict or add new rules to the Quran.

Thus Shia Inclined Quranism

[Aryan Warrior]

but one other thing i'd like to add is that Shiaism by itself is quite Quranist as it takes the Quran in hand first and hadiths in second, thus hadiths that contradict the Quran are not accepted unlike the Sunnis who say otherwise. Thus why you see Shias pray 3 times a day as the Quran states unlike Sunnis who go 5 times for example.

Though the only problem with shiaism that keeps it from actually being pure Quranist is that it accepts far too many traditions not mentioned in the book as law, thus they like to ban music or chess sometimes :/ though as mentioned earlier in the topic, not all of them are unified in such views and many reject a lot of those anyways such as the one about music and chess (thus why both are legal and allowed in Iran)

Thus Shias in general are our closest brothers to  Quranists in the end

[SarahY]

Shias and sunnis alike both claim they take Quran first then Hadith. Whilst books and records mention that they are not 100% authentic actions respond differently. Hadith sources are not as largely expelled in shiasm compared to sunnism. there exists a whole fiqh of their school of thought. with more reading you'd notice similarities between shias and sunnis.

Every shia is required to follow a marja which has their specific rulings to be followed. Who were you thinking of taking as your marja?

although shiasm seems more intriguing it's not free from the errors. if you can stomach and believe the infallibility of the imams well i guess you're a step closer to shiasm

[Aryan Warrior]

Shias and sunnis alike both claim they take Quran first then Hadith. Whilst books and records mention that they are not 100% authentic actions respond differently. Hadith sources are not as largely expelled in shiasm compared to sunnism. there exists a whole fiqh of their school of thought. with more reading you'd notice similarities between shias and sunnis.

Every shia is required to follow a marja which has their specific rulings to be followed. Who were you thinking of taking as your marja?

although shiasm seems more intriguing it's not free from the errors. if you can stomach and believe the infallibility of the imams well i guess you're a step closer to shiasm

Well as I said, i'm SHIA inclined, so there is quite a bit of difference.

For one I don't follow a marja, but I do look at some opinions from various to see the thoughts on some thing and see if traditions are mixed in or not.

I also don't take the Imams are "infalliable" as they are human though I guess I can take them as "infalliable as a human gets" meaning they knew Gods laws better than most, which has proven considering how what they ruled made a more sense than any of the Caliphates like Omar or Yazid.

Regardless there is quite a lot of difference between Shia and Sunnis really as i've studied both and as a result really HATE sunnism for that as they abrogate the Quran  which means Hadith>Quran for the Sunnis.

As well unlike a traditional Shia I don't accept "new rules" from traditions that were never mentioned in the Quran like the hijab or beards or any of that stuff.

[Ervin]

Peace. Welcome brother. Your own deep understanding of the Quran is as close as you personally can come to. Others can only make sugestions. General guideline is that God is good. Now if someone says to you to do something that is bad or that it is shown to have bad results it  can't be from God.
The following verse from the Quran explains it:

Chapter 7 7:28 And if they commit lewdness, they say: "We found our fathers doing such, and God ordered us to it." Say: "God does not order immorality! Do you say about God what you do not know?

Thanks

[SarahY]

true, there's a difference.

lots of rules are based on opinion that's the beauty of scholarship

infallible as a human gets.. well that's an interesting concept but prob not the right wording

not many people praise Yazid nor did all Imams "rule" in the same sense of power as caliphate.. also lots of corruption took place so that messes things up.

Many Sunni's are against abrogation of the Quran. There are people that did abrogate Quran with hadith however there are many hard line against it. so i wouldnt say it's sunnism. but rather a branch of people/scholars therein.

there is alot of similarities and differences with shia/sunni

interesting views.

Welcome to the forum

peace