Quote from: Arkan on February 23, 2011, 11:52:47 AM
Hello again Wakas,
Yes, I'm using an entirely new username, please forgive my secrecy but I trust you'll understand why 
I gave the Jesus-myth as a short explanation as to the final days and weeks in the turning point of my understanding, after years of trying to reconcile truth and practise in Islam.
The historicity of Jesus - Jesus the man who was born of a virgin, who exists in no secular sources is in fact a recyled pre-Christian deity (the fact that such things as the virgin birth are accepted in Islam is testament that it recylced the same myths) such as Osiris. Looking in a simillar manner to other pre-Jewish and pre-Islamic/Christian events shows that most of the stories can be seen as having origins in Polytheistic cultures.
If you look further it spills out into the Judaism's Egyptian Captivity myth among other things (since many of these facts are included in the later religions) the original source for these stories being found in ancient art and writing. Genetic analysis of Jewish people corroborates movement contrary to the one found in mythology.
Again - the issues surrounding these things are not the sole reason why I'm no longer a Muslim, there are other issues pertaining directly with Islam itself and the nature of the God and I'd rather reacquaint myself with people right now than sit here writing long posts lol 
How are you doing anyway Wakas?
I'm going to say that I haven't read the rest of the thread, but I just wanted to respond to this.
As far as Jesus is concerned, the idea that he is a recycled myth relies on really old and mostly bogus information. Pretty much every major scholar on the subject agrees that Jesus was a historical figure. The agreement is that he was a Jewish peasant and considered himself to be a prophet. The fact that he himself is not mentioned in secular documents isn't really a big deal because his immediate family is well documented, aka his brother James and the Jerusalem church which was a wholly Jewish group, ie they didn't claim that Jesus was a man-god or anything like that. They believed him to be a prophet. This is what the Quran says as well. I would recommend you read "Jesus, Interrupted" by Bart Ehrman. Excellent book on New Testament scholarship. From your post, it seems like you aren't very aware of what is known about the historical figure of Jesus, so if you are still interested, I would highly recommend it. It is a very easy read.
As far as the story of Exodus goes, it is also easily verifiable and there is much evidence that supports it. If you are interested, read "The Mystery of Israel in Ancient Egypt: The Exodus in the Qur'an, the Old Testament, Archaeological Finds, and Historical Sources ". Here are some quick facts that you should consider.
-The "Israel Stele" of Merneptah mentions Israel, and it refers to them as a group of people, not a nation.
-Unlike the biblical version, the Quran implies that the group that left with Moses was a rather small group. The bible claims it was 2-3 million.
-Unlike the Bible, the Quran states that God preserved the body of the Pharaoh. The fact that pharaohs were mummified was lost at the time Muhammad was a live so for the Quran to claim that God had somehow preserved the Pharaoh so he could be an example to people is certainly something to consider. Also, this statement is not found in the Bible, so if Muhammad was just copying it, this was a rather bizarre and accurate statement of him to make. The Quran mentions many nations and people being destroyed, but the Pharaoh is the only one who is said to have been preserved.
-Hamman is a clear reference to the high priest of Yamānu (also spelled Amon, Amoun, Amen, and rarely Imen or Yamun, Greek Ἄμμων Ammon, and Ἅμμων Hammon). Note that the Pharaoh consults Hamman for religious matters in the Quran. He also asks Hamman to make him buildings. The construction of religious temples was done under the directions of the priests of Amun in ancient Egypt. The Bible doesn't mention any such figure and the knowledge of the religious courts of ancient Egypt was lost at the time of Muhammad. In fact most knowledge of the customs and language of ancient Egypt was lost by 300 BCE.
-The Pharaoh asked Hamman to build him a building so he could climb up there and see this God of Moses. The idea of climbing a high place to speak with gods is in fact what the ancient Egyptians believed. I've seen this idea mentioned in several documentaries on the History Channel and other channels.
-In the Quran, the Pharaoh keeps saying that he thinks that Moses just wants to drive the people out of the land. Why does he keep saying this? It is because not too long ago, the Hyskos who were a semetic people like Moses had driven the Egyptians out of lower Egypt where the Pharoah now lived. They were driven out only a few generations before Ramesses.
-The Pharaoh is called Firaun al-awtad, which is often translated as the Pharaoh of might or the Pharah of the stakes, but when read in context, it is probably saying the Pharoah of high/many buildings. Who was the Pharaoh who was obsessed with building? Ramesses II. All the things noted above also point to him being THE pharoah, and yes we do have his body.
-The "Israel Stele" was completed under Ramesses successor Merneptah soon after the death of his father. In it he claims that the tribe of Israel is destroyed. Clearly this wasn't the case. The Pharaoh's would often claim victories when really they had lost. This is apparent in some of the victories Ramesses II claimed because we also have records from the opposing side (the Hittites).
-The Quran says that the Pharaoh declared himself to be THE God (79:24). Although Pharoahs were considered divine, very few of them actually made this claim. As it happens, Ramesses II did declare himself to be God. The inscription of him declaring this is found at his temple at Abu Simbel. Again, the Pharaoh is the only one that the Quran says made such a claim and no one could have known this at the time of Muhammad.
As far as the location of the real Mount Sinai, I think it has been discovered. Everything is there. A giant stone altar with engravings of the Egyptian bovine god Apsis, the cave of Elijah, the bitter springs, and even till this day quails descend by it in large groups which is what the Israelites were supposed to have eaten. It is located in modern day Saudi Arabia.
http://www.arkdiscovery.com/mt__sinai_found.htmI think the story of the exodus is actually one of the greatest signs that the Quran is indeed divine. There are so many things in there that Muhammad just could not have known.
