Author Topic: Simple grammatical structure in arabic words  (Read 1713 times)

TheBookAlone

  • Beginner/Inquirer
  • *
  • Posts: 49
  • Karma +0/-0
Simple grammatical structure in arabic words
« on: December 03, 2010, 04:12:00 AM »
Is there a difference between the two words "sadiqati" and "saduqati"? Does the apparent distinction of the the placement of the "dumma" and "kesra" in a word change the word completely?
(Q.4:135)  "O you who trust, be maintainers of justice, bearers of witness for the God even though it be against your own selves or parents or near relatives...the God has a better right over them both.  So follow not low desires, lest you deviate...

SarahY

  • Global Moderator
  • Wise One / Burnout
  • *****
  • Posts: 2350
  • Karma +2/-0
  • Gender: Female
Re: Simple grammatical structure in arabic words
« Reply #1 on: December 03, 2010, 04:33:35 AM »
have you got a context?

just reading it like that i could say sadiqati means my friend

saduqati not sure do you mean my charity?

anyway sorry can't answer your question, don't know too much about the vowels.. i just interpreted it from how i understood it if someone was to speak it to me..
We all have blind spots.
Follow your heart but take your brain with you.
ambiguity is there for a reason, why do you think?
We're all different, so how can we all be equal?

TheBookAlone

  • Beginner/Inquirer
  • *
  • Posts: 49
  • Karma +0/-0
Re: Simple grammatical structure in arabic words
« Reply #2 on: December 09, 2010, 05:47:16 AM »
I was looking at Q.33:35 and tried to understand why in the English translation it says the "truthful men and the truthful women" and then further on in the ayat it says in English the "charitable men and the charitable women".  How does one get from the root word "sad-dha-qa" which means "truth" to be change it to "charity"? 

My thoughts were such that in arabic grammar when you put a "mim" in front of a verb, it becomes the doer of that action, therefore, "truthful men and truthful women" would be "men that speak the truth and women that speak the truth."

I know that we are dealing with Quranic grammar, and that's where the confusion comes into play, because the "layman's arabic grammar rules may not apply when you are looking at the Quranic grammar.  You must see how Allah uses the grammar first. 

Thanks. 
(Q.4:135)  "O you who trust, be maintainers of justice, bearers of witness for the God even though it be against your own selves or parents or near relatives...the God has a better right over them both.  So follow not low desires, lest you deviate...

Mazhar

  • Wise One / Burnout
  • *****
  • Posts: 7352
  • Karma +0/-0
  • Gender: Male
Re: Simple grammatical structure in arabic words
« Reply #3 on: December 09, 2010, 09:18:38 AM »
I was looking at Q.33:35 and tried to understand why in the English translation it says the "truthful men and the truthful women" and then further on in the ayat it says in English the "charitable men and the charitable women".  How does one get from the root word "sad-dha-qa" which means "truth" to be change it to "charity"? 

My thoughts were such that in arabic grammar when you put a "mim" in front of a verb, it becomes the doer of that action, therefore, "truthful men and truthful women" would be "men that speak the truth and women that speak the truth."

I know that we are dealing with Quranic grammar, and that's where the confusion comes into play, because the "layman's arabic grammar rules may not apply when you are looking at the Quranic grammar.  You must see how Allah uses the grammar first. 

Thanks. 

Both words are Active participles. Active participle is derived from the Present Tense Active Voice Verb [المُضارعُ المعلومُ] and its pattern is فَاعِلُ when derived from three letter primary verb. The Active participle signifies the person or thing that performs the action associated with the verb from which it is derived.

The first two are sound plural, and their verbal noun is صِدْقٌ.

The other two are derived from the Present tense active voice deritive verb, Form-V. In such verbs, the particle of present tense is replaced by the consonant Meem with vowel Dhumma and the consonant preceding the last one of the word is given a Kasra.

For above reason you notice difference in the translation of both participles. I hope it clarifies.


SarahY

  • Global Moderator
  • Wise One / Burnout
  • *****
  • Posts: 2350
  • Karma +2/-0
  • Gender: Female
Re: Simple grammatical structure in arabic words
« Reply #4 on: December 14, 2010, 04:57:47 AM »
Well it can mean both...and lots of words derive from the root like alsaddiq - the truthful/ sadaqa - charity

this site might help in terms of grammar look on the right side and click on the arabic words for more info http://corpus.quran.com/wordbyword.jsp?chapter=33&verse=35#(33:35:1)

I don't really have an explanation so, sorry about that.

peace
We all have blind spots.
Follow your heart but take your brain with you.
ambiguity is there for a reason, why do you think?
We're all different, so how can we all be equal?

TheBookAlone

  • Beginner/Inquirer
  • *
  • Posts: 49
  • Karma +0/-0
Re: Simple grammatical structure in arabic words
« Reply #5 on: December 26, 2010, 03:45:33 PM »
@Mahzar...sorry, your explanation does not clarify anything for me.

@SarahY...I am not sure what you mean by "...it can mean both.."   

Is there anyone that can point me to ayats that make this issue clear.  We can refer to an outside source for arabic grammar but the danger in relying on that source alone without ayats to make the issue clear I understand would be speculation...would you agree or disagree?
(Q.4:135)  "O you who trust, be maintainers of justice, bearers of witness for the God even though it be against your own selves or parents or near relatives...the God has a better right over them both.  So follow not low desires, lest you deviate...