Author Topic: Wife beating in islam? The Quran strikes back  (Read 73678 times)

hawk99

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Re: Wife beating in islam? The Quran strikes back
« Reply #250 on: November 01, 2014, 10:56:39 AM »
Why does it take 40 pages or even any "holy book" at all to validate that wife beating is wrong? Doesn't thinking about our own moms give us empathy enough to know that is wrong without being told?



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huruf

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Re: Wife beating in islam? The Quran strikes back
« Reply #251 on: November 03, 2014, 01:06:07 AM »
4.34 is not addressed to husbands but to the community of believers. It is hardly to be taken that the community of believers be told to "beat" a woman just like that.

Also, it speakes not about husbands and wives but about men and women, nothing to do with husbands.

It also does not say that any woman (not wife) has doen anything wrong but that the community of believers FEARS that "they" the women, whoever they are, might to something wrong, but up till then nobody has done anything wrong, so nobody can be "beaten" for something that has not even hapenned.

Teh "idribuhunna" word has certainly avery different meaning from beat, it means as can be logically deducted to do something practical to avoid those women to do something that would be bad for them and the community. Let us not forget that this aya is part of a whole set of ayas that deal with social questions and it also deals with social questions. It is incumbent on the community as a whole thatit takes care fo the women, just as it is incumbent on the whole male population to take care of women in general. This is the question in the aya, that women are looked after, not that women should be punished for whatever imaginary doings might come to mind.

So it should something on the line of: finding out from the women themselves, let them know the consequences that their prospected actions might have, let them think about the whole thing by themselves and when some solution is found for the situation of the women, carry it out with them.

Salaam

Wakas

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Re: Wife beating in islam? The Quran strikes back
« Reply #252 on: November 03, 2014, 02:38:46 AM »
peace sister huruf,


Also, it speakes not about husbands and wives but about men and women, nothing to do with husbands.

Please refrain from repeating claims. If you wish to repeat them, then do not run away when challenged:
http://free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9606391.msg356394#msg356394



Quote
So it should something on the line of: finding out from the women themselves, let them know the consequences that their prospected actions might have, let them think about the whole thing by themselves and when some solution is found for the situation of the women, carry it out with them.

If someone can find a more coherent answer than the following then please let me know:

Quote
The understanding of DRB in 4:34 as "cite / indicate / put/show forth them" (to the authority) is the ONLY understanding that provides perfect internal coherence in The Quran. It is the ONLY understanding:
1) that provides a sequential link from 4:34 to 4:35
2) to provide identical solutions between men & women in 4:34 and 4:128
3) that fits and perfectly explains 58:1-4
4) that fits the divorce procedure of The Quran and related compensation
5) that explains the reasoning behind the context of wealth/inheritance/giving/kindness etc.
6) is consistent with the use of DRB with a direct object with no prepositions, in which it always means "put/show forth"
7) that 100% matches the use of DRB when used with a person as the object, e.g. 2:73, 43:57.
All information in my posts is correct to the best of my knowledge only and thus should not be taken as a fact. One should seek knowledge and verify: 17:36, 20:114, 35:28, 49:6, 58:11. My articles

www.studyQuran.org

Farabi

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Re: Wife beating in islam? The Quran strikes back
« Reply #253 on: November 03, 2014, 05:21:43 AM »
People tend to discriminate muslims by saying beating his wife is an obligations. It is not. Beating your wife is not an obligations, it is your right, and you can decide to do it or not. That allowance is to defend Job who are swore gonna beat her wife. And for that swore even though Job is regret it, God still command him to do his swore by taking a grass and do it.

And as the context of beating your wife, it is allowed in condition to educate them, not because it is your habit. In the quran, a woman can divorce her husband if she think she doesnot like it. I think we can contemplate this clearly to determined wheter a beating is because of lust or because a wisdom.

Even youre beating your child if he/she is harming her brother or her sister am I right? Violence on some condition is neccessary to educate a person.
At first I thought I'll be neutral by replacing my emotional attachment, what then happened was, I switch my side from the other extreme to the other one. I had no idea what is neutrality.

aqua

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Re: Wife beating in islam? The Quran strikes back
« Reply #254 on: November 03, 2014, 05:29:16 AM »
Beating your wife is not an obligations, it is your right, and you can decide to do it or not.

And as the context of beating your wife, it is allowed in condition to educate them, not because it is your habit. In the quran, a woman can divorce her husband if she think she doesnot like it. I think we can contemplate this clearly to determined wheter a beating is because of lust or because a wisdom.

Beating a woman contradicts many parts of the Qur'an; read the contradictions explained here:

http://www.quranverse434.com/#problems-with-beat-them

JavaLatte

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Re: Wife beating in islam? The Quran strikes back
« Reply #255 on: November 03, 2014, 06:13:30 AM »
People tend to discriminate muslims by saying beating his wife is an obligations. It is not. Beating your wife is not an obligations, it is your right, and you can decide to do it or not.

Beating wife is a husband's right . . . !?!  ???
[33:72] Verily, We offered the trust to the heavens and the earth and the mountains, but they refused to bear it and they were afraid of it; but man bear it - verily, he was transgressing, ignorant.

Farabi

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Re: Wife beating in islam? The Quran strikes back
« Reply #256 on: November 03, 2014, 06:22:15 AM »
Beating wife is a husband's right . . . !?!  ???

I mean, it is not an obligations, it is your right like you scold your children when they making a mistake. What word you should pick for such condition?
At first I thought I'll be neutral by replacing my emotional attachment, what then happened was, I switch my side from the other extreme to the other one. I had no idea what is neutrality.

huruf

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Re: Wife beating in islam? The Quran strikes back
« Reply #257 on: November 03, 2014, 06:54:39 AM »
Wakas I repeat because you have run away from answering my arguments when you have answered this in the same way, that I am not right, but refrained your self from rebuting my arguments you plain ignored them.

I am not interested inb eing your police and I do not have the time, so I am not looking for the threads where that has hapenned and it has been several.
But you also repppeat, everybody repeats. The forums are full of repetitions.

On the other hand, the wording of the aya is so plain and clear that what has to be explained is how it does come that it is transformed into something else. THAT should be explained and not forgotten that if somebody chooses to make things signify other thing that their meaning, one must bring arguments for it. 

And I repeat for a good reason: not for you, not for those who systematically ignore things that do not suit their own state of thought, but for those who might eventually find the need to go beyond the usual comfortable preconceptions.

I am grateful that some peole chose to repeat things, so that if a did not catch something the first time I had more opportunities later on. I have learnt things that way.

Salaam



huruf

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Re: Wife beating in islam? The Quran strikes back
« Reply #258 on: November 03, 2014, 07:00:44 AM »
I mean, it is not an obligations, it is your right like you scold your children when they making a mistake. What word you should pick for such condition?

I would agree if you would agree that women should also "scold" and beat up their husbands when they need correcting.

Have you really read the Qur'an?

Salaam

 

JavaLatte

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Re: Wife beating in islam? The Quran strikes back
« Reply #259 on: November 03, 2014, 07:03:25 AM »
I mean, it is not an obligations, it is your right like you scold your children when they making a mistake.

Scolding children is parent's right . . . !?!  ???


Quote
What word you should pick for such condition?

I think it needs to be adjusted to the mistakes they make, and also, we need to look at the character of the kids who did it. Right now I don't have experience being a parent, so maybe I could not give proper input related how to educate children,

but I think "beating children" and/or "scolding children" are not the right ways to make the children honor their parents.


Even youre beating your child if he/she is harming her brother or her sister am I right?

I know that beating children is not effective way to educate them to be righteous.
[33:72] Verily, We offered the trust to the heavens and the earth and the mountains, but they refused to bear it and they were afraid of it; but man bear it - verily, he was transgressing, ignorant.