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Where does the term "surah" come from?

Started by runninglikezebras, August 21, 2015, 04:58:03 PM

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runninglikezebras

Where does the term ?surah? come from?

It is common knowledge that a chapter of the Koranic text is called a ?surah ? .

But where did we get the term?

If we are to believe assertions frequently penned in the West, its origin is unknown. In The Messiah and his Prophet (vol. II p.184-185), we evidenced a certain similarity with biblical Hebrew, but one that is still too distant; another similarity, found with the rabbinical Hebrew term ?ura?  ( i.e. a paragraph or a margin note) seems more convincing. We are coming closer to the meaning of ? writing ? or ?chapter?, but not yet in a fully satisfying way.

If we turn to the Aramean language however, we begin to approach the answer. Many are a priori opposed to this examination, as Islamic rhetoricians hold that the origins of Islam owe nothing to the Aramean culture and are instead rooted in the other side of the Arabian peninsula ? but of course the same tell us that Muhammad often travelled in the direction of Syria, where he met Bah?ra the monk, for example...

So, what do we find in Aramean? A word, śirţ? (transposed in Hebrew writing: ), means line, but more essentially, writing [1]! The word seems to derive from the old Aramean root śfr, to write, which became in Hebrew ś?fer ( , the one who writes, found in the Koran in 80:15, safarat, scribes). However, in certain Aramaic formulations, the ?f? changes into ?w?, and writing is expressed by the word ś?rat [2].

This time again, we had to turn to the north of the Arab cradle of the time to find an answer to the question of the origins [3].




[1] See for example K?bert?s Vocabularium Syriacum, 1956, p.133 which provides as an illustration: ?the Jacobite writings.? As a general rule, the K?bert explains that   in Aramean corresponds to  in Arabic (whereas corresponds to  ).

[2] The question was brought up by Christoph Luxenberg at the March 13-16, 2008 Inarah Otzenhauzen Conference (Saarland), on ?The Early History Of Islam And The Koran?.

[3] Aramean, a very ancient oral and written language, has a lot more to teach us, particularly in regard to our knowledge of the first centuries of our era. Doesn?t the same Aramean word reappear in the word ?soutra ?, also meaning ?writing?? Research finds a stimulus in questions that are posed and in what appears to be coincidences. Several Pali and Chinese manuscripts from the first centuries of our age suggest a total of ? 42 soutra-s.? No one can say for sure what this number represents. But it could very well refer to the -as yet- little known collection of Aramean-Christian holy scriptures in existence during the first century. The word we use today to designate the text of the Gospel only applied to its content then (literally, it meant: the Proclamation). Moreover, today?s ?gospels ? didn?t exist as such: no specific term designated the memory aids or transcriptions of the twelve Apostles? preaching, whose only prescriptive value rested on oral teaching. According to the Judeo-Aramean way of counting, what we call today the ?Old Testament ? consisted of thirty books (the ?other writings ? being left aside), namely: the five books of the Torah, the Psalms (=1 book), the six ?major prophets ? (i.e. Joshua, who is believed to have written the book of Joshua; Samuel, the presumed author of the books of Judges and Samuel; Jeremiah, the presumed author of the books of Kings and Jeremiah; Isaiah; Ezekiel, and the twelve ?minor prophets ?, from Hosea to Malachi), giving a total of 30. If one adds the twelve ?Memoirs of the Apostles ? mentioned by Papias and several oral Eastern traditions, one arrives at 42 texts. All these ?books ? must have been referred to as ?writings ? / śirţ? ?s in first-century Aramean. To be continued.

Source: http://rootsofislamtruehistory.com/subpages/Sura-the-word_EN.htm
[url="http://legrandsecretdelislam.com/"]http://legrandsecretdelislam.com/[/url] - [url="http://rootsofislamtruehistory.com/"]http://rootsofislamtruehistory.com/[/url]

fye

....

not sure but doesn't sound a lot like sutra?

as in the flower sutra...
from the buddha? remember him?
remember his messege?
Praise be to ALLAH
my friend and only friend

hicham9

Sureh is the quranic term for: passage (not chapter).
It comes from ancient Arabia, i imagine!
I was not delivered in this world into defeat, nor does failure course my veins.
I'm not a sheep waiting to be prodded by my shepherd. I am a lion, and I refuse to talk, walk or sleep with the sheep.

good logic

Peace All.

The three languages,Hebrew,Aramaic and Arabic share some common words ,so what?

They are still three different languages.

To imply that most Arabic words are  foreign words,is to deny there is an Arabic language?

Actually GOD knew people will make this claim,even say Qoran was tampered with!!!:
16:101
When we substitute one revelation in place of another, and God is fully aware of what He reveals, they say, "You made this up!" Indeed, most of them do not know.
وَإِذا بَدَّلنا ءايَةً مَكانَ ءايَةٍ وَاللَّهُ أَعلَمُ بِما يُنَزِّلُ قالوا إِنَّما أَنتَ مُفتَرٍ بَل أَكثَرُهُم لا يَعلَمونَ
16:102
Say, "The Holy Spirit has brought it down from your Lord, truthfully, to assure those who believe, and to provide a beacon and good news for the Muslimeen."
قُل نَزَّلَهُ روحُ القُدُسِ مِن رَبِّكَ بِالحَقِّ لِيُثَبِّتَ الَّذينَ ءامَنوا وَهُدًى وَبُشرىٰ لِلمُسلِمينَ
16:103
We are fully aware that they say, "A human being is teaching him!" The tongue of the source they hint at is non-Arabic, and this is a perfect Arabic tongue.
وَلَقَد نَعلَمُ أَنَّهُم يَقولونَ إِنَّما يُعَلِّمُهُ بَشَرٌ لِسانُ الَّذى يُلحِدونَ إِلَيهِ أَعجَمِىٌّ وَهٰذا لِسانٌ عَرَبِىٌّ مُبينٌ
16:104
Surely, those who do not believe in God's revelations, God does not guide them...
إِنَّ الَّذينَ لا يُؤمِنونَ بِـٔايٰتِ اللَّهِ لا يَهديهِمُ اللَّهُ وَلَهُم عَذابٌ أَليمٌ

16:105
The only ones who fabricate false doctrines are those who do not believe in God's revelations; they are the real liars.
إِنَّما يَفتَرِى الكَذِبَ الَّذينَ لا يُؤمِنونَ بِـٔايٰتِ اللَّهِ وَأُولٰئِكَ هُمُ الكٰذِبونَ

The Qoran I know,study and have checked is the original revelation to the last prophet ,according to my findings.

Bogus histories ,made up stories and theories are many. What is the truth? This is a question to ponder.
GOD bless.
Peace.
TOTAL LOYALTY TO GOD ALONE.   IN GOD I TRUST
38:65″ Say:? I warn you; There is no other god beside GOD, the One, the Supreme.?
[url="https://total-loyalty-to-god-alone.co.uk/?p=28"]https://total-loyalty-to-god-alone.co.uk/?p=28[/url]

runninglikezebras

Quote from: good logic on October 06, 2015, 03:02:26 PM
To imply that most Arabic words are  foreign words,is to deny there is an Arabic language?

This is bogus logic!  Every language in the world has foreign/borrowed words, they are still considered seperate languages.  Sura is a borrowed word in Arabic, deal with it.
[url="http://legrandsecretdelislam.com/"]http://legrandsecretdelislam.com/[/url] - [url="http://rootsofislamtruehistory.com/"]http://rootsofislamtruehistory.com/[/url]

good logic

Peace runninglikezebras.

I have no problem with words whatever language they might be.

I deal with Qoran ,the one which GOD sent in Arabic. The words that are written in Arabic have a meaning in Arabic and a meaning in all the other languages whether they are borrowed or not.
GOD bless you.
Peace.
TOTAL LOYALTY TO GOD ALONE.   IN GOD I TRUST
38:65″ Say:? I warn you; There is no other god beside GOD, the One, the Supreme.?
[url="https://total-loyalty-to-god-alone.co.uk/?p=28"]https://total-loyalty-to-god-alone.co.uk/?p=28[/url]

fye

Quote from: good logic on October 06, 2015, 03:02:26 PM
Peace All.

The three languages,Hebrew,Aramaic and Arabic share some common words ,so what?

They are still three different languages.

To imply that most Arabic words are  foreign words,is to deny there is an Arabic language?

Actually GOD knew people will make this claim,even say Qoran was tampered with!!!:
16:101
When we substitute one revelation in place of another, and God is fully aware of what He reveals, they say, "You made this up!" Indeed, most of them do not know.
وَإِذا بَدَّلنا ءايَةً مَكانَ ءايَةٍ وَاللَّهُ أَعلَمُ بِما يُنَزِّلُ قالوا إِنَّما أَنتَ مُفتَرٍ بَل أَكثَرُهُم لا يَعلَمونَ
16:102
Say, "The Holy Spirit has brought it down from your Lord, truthfully, to assure those who believe, and to provide a beacon and good news for the Muslimeen."
قُل نَزَّلَهُ روحُ القُدُسِ مِن رَبِّكَ بِالحَقِّ لِيُثَبِّتَ الَّذينَ ءامَنوا وَهُدًى وَبُشرىٰ لِلمُسلِمينَ
16:103
We are fully aware that they say, "A human being is teaching him!" The tongue of the source they hint at is non-Arabic, and this is a perfect Arabic tongue.
وَلَقَد نَعلَمُ أَنَّهُم يَقولونَ إِنَّما يُعَلِّمُهُ بَشَرٌ لِسانُ الَّذى يُلحِدونَ إِلَيهِ أَعجَمِىٌّ وَهٰذا لِسانٌ عَرَبِىٌّ مُبينٌ
16:104
Surely, those who do not believe in God's revelations, God does not guide them...
إِنَّ الَّذينَ لا يُؤمِنونَ بِـٔايٰتِ اللَّهِ لا يَهديهِمُ اللَّهُ وَلَهُم عَذابٌ أَليمٌ

16:105
The only ones who fabricate false doctrines are those who do not believe in God's revelations; they are the real liars.
إِنَّما يَفتَرِى الكَذِبَ الَّذينَ لا يُؤمِنونَ بِـٔايٰتِ اللَّهِ وَأُولٰئِكَ هُمُ الكٰذِبونَ

The Qoran I know,study and have checked is the original revelation to the last prophet ,according to my findings.

Bogus histories ,made up stories and theories are many. What is the truth? This is a question to ponder.
GOD bless.
Peace.

question i don't speak arabic but have a question about the quranic phrasing which appears in the bible as well such as "camel through the eye of a needle" this phrasing is also found in books where details are given, "like as fast as lightening".

is this the way arabic is interpreted like with those crazy japanese symbols

ex: big (symbol for big) - dog (symbol for dog), and the context cluies would tell you if the dog is big or as big as a dog?

i've tried translating a verse letter by letter and this is what i think of the arabic language and it would usually mean both of the context clues when it come to ayat from the quran? what's you opinion about my understanding of arabic script or letters being like symbols playing both roles of letters and symbols like japan characters?
Praise be to ALLAH
my friend and only friend

good logic

Peace fye.
The objective is to try to understand what Qoran is really saying.

I do not know about symbols?

If you understand the message, that is the important thing..
GOD bless you
Peace.
TOTAL LOYALTY TO GOD ALONE.   IN GOD I TRUST
38:65″ Say:? I warn you; There is no other god beside GOD, the One, the Supreme.?
[url="https://total-loyalty-to-god-alone.co.uk/?p=28"]https://total-loyalty-to-god-alone.co.uk/?p=28[/url]