Why Remove 9:127&129?

[Layth]

Salam,

I see this as the key issue which pushes most people away from the subject of `19` without giving it its due research.

Most people assume wrongly that 19 means you remove 2 verses from the Quran.

Recall, in the 70`s & 80`s, no one had a problem to embrace the 19 sign - before the 2 verses issue.

[Jim19]

Shalom

God remove thses two false verses because it's the devil ( satan) verses , God protect his scripture by the number 19 , Please try to check well the God's miracle and take the subject by wisdom .
Shalom
Abdias

[jonny_k]

Peace bro "layth",

Salam,

I see this as the key issue which pushes most people away from the subject of `19` without giving it its due research.

Most people assume wrongly that 19 means you remove 2 verses from the Quran.

Recall, in the 70`s & 80`s, no one had a problem to embrace the 19 sign - before the 2 verses issue.

JK- Bro weve discussed this before and i showed you why code-19 does not allow for the approach you claim. I thought youd have revised tht view. Here see:
http://19.org/forum/index.php/m/20207/222/#msg_20207
One of the basic problems with your assertion is that warsh has ONE LESS word "allah" in 2:284 as compared to "hafs". thus if you exclude "allah" of 1:1 which is unnumbered in warsh, you still dont get 2698 BUT 2697 words "allah".

Bro Edip also wanted to discuss this with you personally over a "cup of tea" remember? THEN he decided to do it in chat and not wait. Did you two have tht conversation? http://19.org/forum/index.php/m/19413/222/#msg_19413 downwards. GOD Bless!

Last but not least code-19 had made predictions before and it will GW do so again. Should we unravel the oldest possible manuscripts we wont find in them the phrases in 9:128&129. IGOD Bless

[Layth]

Salam brother,

JK- Bro weve discussed this before and i showed you why code-19 does not allow for the approach you claim. I thought youd have revised tht view. Here see:
http://19.org/forum/index.php/m/20207/222/#msg_20207
One of the basic problems with your assertion is that warsh has ONE LESS word "allah" in 2:284 as compared to "hafs". thus if you exclude "allah" of 1:1 which is unnumbered in warsh, you still dont get 2698 BUT 2697 words "allah".

That is not correct. Warsh shows the same number of `Allah` as the Hafs. 2:284 is no different.

To reject 128 & 129 because of the count of the word `Allah` is distorted arithmetic at best.

Bro Edip also wanted to discuss this with you personally over a "cup of tea" remember? THEN he decided to do it in chat and not wait. Did you two have tht conversation? http://19.org/forum/index.php/m/19413/222/#msg_19413 downwards. GOD Bless!

God willing we will have out sit sown one day. I am united by Edip in monotheism and the focus on God Alone. Differing on some issues is natural.

Last but not least code-19 had made predictions before and it will GW do so again. Should we unravel the oldest possible manuscripts we wont find in them the phrases in 9:128&129. IGOD Bless

If you found the oldest manuscript without 128 & 129 then we would not be having this conversation...But since no such manuscript exists, then the burden of proof remains upon him making the claim.

[jonny_k]

Peace bro "layth",

Salam brother,

That is not correct. Warsh shows the same number of `Allah` as the Hafs. 2:284 is no different.

JK- Goto http://www.submission.org/quran/protect.html and type in "adding whole words" in the "find on page" option. Youll see that in the warsh text theres "huwa" in the last phrase(wa HUWA 'ala kulli shayin qadeer) instead of "allah" there. Besides this is by long not the only factor.

To reject 128 & 129 because of the count of the word `Allah` is distorted arithmetic at best.

JK- NO it is not as ive shown many times. Why cant you wait till we find the oldest possible manuscripts and then argue your case?

God willing we will have out sit sown one day. I am united by Edip in monotheism and the focus on God Alone. Differing on some issues is natural.

JK- It's been more than THREE years ago and yet you couldnt have a voice conversation with bro Edip. Please do it right away and dont delay no more otherwise tomorrow will never come  .

If you found the oldest manuscript without 128 & 129 then we would not be having this conversation...But since no such manuscript exists, then the burden of proof remains upon him making the claim.

JK- HOW can you say that no such manuscript exists? Please say we didnt find it yet, as before 1999 and Atlantics Monthly the tashkent Quran was also not known. Sunnis/shia for years never knew more or had access to more than the hafs version which was circulated everywhere in the market. GOD Bless!

[Hati]

Shalom

God remove thses two false verses because it's the devil ( satan) verses , God protect his scripture by the number 19 , Please try to check well the God's miracle and take the subject by wisdom .
Shalom
Abdias

Salam Brother,

  It seems the reverse is true.  If I based it from Abdias your the GV = 121060
and Gv ot the following verse is = 20301 1505 20150 301 10400501 70501041

              [074:016]  By no means! For to Our Signs he has been refractory!
              [074:016]  Nay! He is forward unto Our signs;
              [074:016]  He stubbornly refused to accept these proofs.

        20301 1505 20150 301 10400501 70501041  1241060 = 19 x 106848160632 ... 33740.0000
          Why are you stubborn to God s verse/signs?
         God bless you.

              hati

[Hati]

Most people assume wrongly that 19 means you remove 2 verses from the Quran.

Salam Layth,

       Yes and it is in this verse [74:25] foretold that he (GV = 20030014 6003010805 = 505 725 = 1230 ) will remove the 2 verses:

[074:025]  "This is nothing but the word of a mortal!"
[074:025]  'this is nothing but mortal speech.'
[074:025]  "This is human made."

      The GV of 74:25 = 150 57001 1301 100630 1302300200
     
    1.   150 57001 1301 100630 1302300200 505725 9129 = 19 x 792473743690003316474894842371434691.0000
Number of digits read from file "custom_number.tmp": 38
The number IS a multiple of 19!
The amount of digits read is also a multiple
of 19:  38 = 19x2

2.    150 57001 1301 100630 1302300200 1230 = 19 x 792473743690003316474894842170.0000

   Total Gv of 9:127 = 7009
3. 150 57001 1301 100630 1302300200 20030014 6003010805 7009 = 19 x 792473743690003316474894842210684287370005687211.0000

4. 150 57001 1301 100630 1302300200 6003010805 = 19 x 792473743690003316474894842421211095.0000
    Birth = 11 19 1935
5. 11191935 505725 150 57001 1301 100630 1302300200  = 19 x 5890492371434289773690158474015858015800.0000

       God bless you.

               hati

       

[dc2]

Salam,
I see this as the key issue which pushes most people away from the subject of `19` without giving it its due research.
Most people assume wrongly that 19 means you remove 2 verses from the Quran.
Recall, in the 70`s & 80`s, no one had a problem to embrace the 19 sign - before the 2 verses issue.

i agree that this is one factor for alot of people's skepticism.
are you saying it is not necessary to remove 2 verses from the quran to accept the 19 theory? i didnt realize in the 70's and 80's that the removal of these two verses was not yet an issue. was the 19 theory given a good spot-light in the mainstream islamic media at the time?
do you know of any articles that discuss the evolution of the 19 theory objectively?
peace and thanks.

[jonny_k]

Peace "dc2",
Please "dc2" ill tell you the story regarding what happened in the 70s and 80s and you can verify at submission.org later and from bro Edip later who worked live with RK. First RK looked at the index of Abdul Baqi. AB, ALHOUGH HE DID COUNT THE "ALLAH" OF THE BISMILLAH, forgot at the end to include it in the final list and stated 2698. RK took these counts for granted. Then when RK counted the word by himself he ALSO MADE A MISTAKE but in a different verse where he got short of one word "allah" again getting 2698 and 9:128&129 were not yet recognized to be unquranic. This was thus a great sign from GOD without which he would never have got to know the secret of the no. 19. GOD Bless!

[Hati]

Shalom

God remove thses two false verses because it's the devil ( satan) verses , God protect his scripture by the number 19 , Please try to check well the God's miracle and take the subject by wisdom .
Shalom
Abdias

Salam Jim19,

Please explain why 1230 and 6003010805 produce multiples of 19 in a verse such as 7:53 that warns of wrong interpretation?

Do they look for aught else but its interpretation? The day its interpretation comes, those who before forgot it shall say, 'Indeed, our Lord's Messengers came with the truth. Have we then any intercessors to intercede for us, or shall we be returned, to do other than that we have done?' ... [7:53]  Gv = 530 1050900200650 1301 4001610305 10640 10140010 4001610305 10100630 1307001050 506065 4050 100230 1004 31400 2006030 2002501 21308100 80530 30501 4050 30080701 8010300807061 30501 16 502004 8050704030 100010200 13070010 20501 50704030

1. The above GV and Rashad Khalifah = 1230 is a multiple of 19!
530 1050900200650 1301 4001610305 10640 10140010 4001610305 10100630 1307001050 506065 4050 100230 1004 31400 2006030 2002501 21308100 80530 30501 4050 30080701 8010300807061 30501 16 502004 8050704030 100010200 13070010 20501 50704030 1230 = 19 x ...000

2. The above GV and Khalifah = 6003010805  is a multiple of 19!
530 1050900200650 1301 4001610305 10640 10140010 4001610305 10100630 1307001050 506065 4050 100230 1004 31400 2006030 2002501 21308100 80530 30501 4050 30080701 8010300807061 30501 16 502004 8050704030 100010200 13070010 20501 50704030 6003010805 = 19 x ...000

God bless you

        Hati




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