Author Topic: Hot/"ramadan" Answer  (Read 251218 times)

Scrappy-doo

  • Apprentice
  • **
  • Posts: 179
  • Gender: Female
Re: Hot/"ramadan" Answer
« Reply #2570 on: August 18, 2017, 12:16:10 PM »
I don't know how much this will contribute to the discussion but here we go. I live in Southern California and June 19th was the first really day above body temperature reaching 107F. The temperature was intense and it was humid. While waiting outside I witnessed the full moon on its rise from the east looking bright and full. Coincidentally the next day as the first day of summer (summer solstice). Temperatures soared to 45 degrees Celsius (113 F).
It is as if the moon brought the heat with itself. I do not know perhaps it is a Sign for me.

2:185 shahru ramadana: The month/full moon of Ramadhaan :   

Shiin-ha-Ra = make it notable/known/manifest/public/infamous (in a bad or good sense), hire/contract for a month, stay a month, month old, month, new moon, moon, full moon, any evil thing that exposes its author to disgrace, a vice/fault or the like, big & bulky, reputable/eminent.

Ra-Miim-Dad = to be burning, heat, be blasted by the sun. ramaDda - to sharpen (a spear) between stones, roast, pasture on a burning ground, burn. ramDda - scorching heat, burning hot (ground). ramadzan - the ninth month of Islamic calendar, the month of fast.

I basically witnessed the scorching heat of the full moon/month

Cool!
Non illigitimus carborundum

Noon waalqalami

  • Advanced Truth Seeker
  • ****
  • Posts: 1262
Re: Hot/"ramadan" Answer
« Reply #2571 on: August 19, 2017, 01:33:45 PM »
In Lughat-ul-Quran, Parvez writes that al-sana(t) is called a year of hardship/famine and al-aam a year of greenery and abundance. So may be 29:14 is saying that Noah mostly had hardship except for a little time of ease.

Peace, cannot have 1,000 years of hardship (perhaps in hell/one's head) likewise three separate words/meanings ...

18:25 ولبثوا and stay they of فى in كهفهم cave theirs ثلث three ماىه hundred سنىن  sinīna/years (lunar) وازدادوا and increases they of تسعا nine of (i.e. those asking the questions add a 9) 18:26 قل say الله the god اعلم knows بما in what لبثوا stay they of له for him غىب unseen السماوت the heavens والارض and the land ابصر sees به in it واسمع and hears ما not لهم for them من from دونه besides him من from ولى guardian ولا and not ىشرك associate فى in حكمه wisdom his احدا anyone of



29:14 ولقد and surely ارسلنا sends we of نوحا Noah of الى to قومه folk his فلبث so stay فىهم in them الف thousand سنه sanatin (period of time) الا except خمسىن fifty عاما Aama/year of (solar) فاخذهم so seizes them الطوفان the deluge وهم and they ظلمون were unjustly




Novice

  • Apprentice
  • **
  • Posts: 433
  • Gender: Male
Re: Hot/"ramadan" Answer
« Reply #2572 on: August 19, 2017, 02:56:33 PM »
Pease

Sorry I missed this post earlier.


Peace, cannot have 1,000 years of hardship (perhaps in hell/one's head) likewise three separate words/meanings ...

18:25 ولبثوا and stay they of فى in كهفهم cave theirs ثلث three ماىه hundred سنىن  sinīna/years (lunar) وازدادوا and increases they of تسعا nine of (i.e. those asking the questions add a 9) 18:26 قل say الله the god اعلم knows بما in what لبثوا stay they of له for him غىب unseen السماوت the heavens والارض and the land ابصر sees به in it واسمع and hears ما not لهم for them من from دونه besides him من from ولى guardian ولا and not ىشرك associate فى in حكمه wisdom his احدا anyone of

I guess living in a cave unconscious is not enjoyable time but difficult time.

29:14 ولقد and surely ارسلنا sends we of نوحا Noah of الى to قومه folk his فلبث so stay فىهم in them الف thousand سنه sanatin (period of time) الا except خمسىن fifty عاما Aama/year of (solar) فاخذهم so seizes them الطوفان the deluge وهم and they ظلمون were unjustly

When a messenger is doing everything to convey the message and people are not listening then it is a difficult time. The verse can be interpreted that most of his life he faced difficult time because the message was not accepted except for a little time.


Noon waalqalami

  • Advanced Truth Seeker
  • ****
  • Posts: 1262
Re: Hot/"ramadan" Answer
« Reply #2573 on: August 20, 2017, 12:47:10 PM »

I guess living in a cave unconscious is not enjoyable time but difficult time.

When a messenger is doing everything to convey the message and people are not listening then it is a difficult time. The verse can be interpreted that most of his life he faced difficult time because the message was not accepted except for a little time.

Peace, do simple word substitution to see that meaning ascribed by Parvez below is senseless/contradicting...

Quote from: Novice on June 24, 2017, 02:03:56 PM
In Lughat-ul-Quran, Parvez writes that al-sana(t) is called a year of hardship/famine and al-aam a year of greenery and abundance. So may be 29:14 is saying that Noah mostly had hardship except for a little time of ease.

Likewise three separate words:  عام Aam/year (solar); سنىن  sinīna/years (lunar);  سنه sanatin (time-frames/dates)

12:47 قل said تزرعون thou cultivating سبع seven سنىن sinīna/years of hardship/famine? دابا usual of فما so what حصدتم harvest you فذروه so leave it فى in سنبله corn husk its الا except قلىلا little of مما from what تاكلون thou eating

17:12 وجعلنا and made we of اللىل the night والنهار and the daytime اىتىن signs two فمحونا so erase we of اىه sign اللىل the night وجعلنا and made we of اىه sign النهار the daytime مبصره visible لتبتغوا to thou pursue ye of فضلا bounty of من from ربكم lord yours ولتعلموا and to thou know ye of عدد number السنىن l-sinīna/the years of hardship/famine? والحساب and the account وكل and each شىء thing فصلنه explain we it تفصىلا detailed of

70:4 تعرج ascend الملىكه the controllers/angels والروح and the spirit الىه toward him فى in ىوم day كان be مقداره measure its خمسىن fifty الف thousand سنه sanatin/years of hardship/famine?



Novice

  • Apprentice
  • **
  • Posts: 433
  • Gender: Male
Re: Hot/"ramadan" Answer
« Reply #2574 on: August 20, 2017, 02:12:06 PM »
Peace, do simple word substitution to see that meaning ascribed by Parvez below is senseless/contradicting...

Quote from: Novice on June 24, 2017, 02:03:56 PM
In Lughat-ul-Quran, Parvez writes that al-sana(t) is called a year of hardship/famine and al-aam a year of greenery and abundance. So may be 29:14 is saying that Noah mostly had hardship except for a little time of ease.

Likewise three separate words:  عام Aam/year (solar); سنىن  sinīna/years (lunar);  سنه sanatin (time-frames/dates)

12:47 قل said تزرعون thou cultivating سبع seven سنىن sinīna/years of hardship/famine? دابا usual of فما so what حصدتم harvest you فذروه so leave it فى in سنبله corn husk its الا except قلىلا little of مما from what تاكلون thou eating

17:12 وجعلنا and made we of اللىل the night والنهار and the daytime اىتىن signs two فمحونا so erase we of اىه sign اللىل the night وجعلنا and made we of اىه sign النهار the daytime مبصره visible لتبتغوا to thou pursue ye of فضلا bounty of من from ربكم lord yours ولتعلموا and to thou know ye of عدد number السنىن l-sinīna/the years of hardship/famine? والحساب and the account وكل and each شىء thing فصلنه explain we it تفصىلا detailed of

70:4 تعرج ascend الملىكه the controllers/angels والروح and the spirit الىه toward him فى in ىوم day كان be مقداره measure its خمسىن fifty الف thousand سنه sanatin/years of hardship/famine?


Peace Noon

Here is what Parvez explained in his Lughat ul Quran. All the meanings you gave for three words are given by him as well. What he wrote is that a usage of AAM and Sinina is also time of hardship and time of abundance.

س ن و W-N-S
َۃُ ”
َ َّ لسن
ا) “as-sanah) means years (its plurals are “ات ٌ وَ َ
ُ ْو َن” ,(sanawatَ ” (سن
ِ ْی َن” and) sinoonِ ” (سن
 .(sineenِ ”(سن
There is some difference of opinion about its root. One school of thought says that its root is (S-N-H)
because the Arabs say “ ت ُہَ ْ
ً َسان
ُ َلانا
ف) “ saanahtu fulana) which means that I cut a deal with him on yearly
rate.
Ibn Faris says the real meaning of “ٌ
َہ
سن) “ َsanah) is dependent on a period of time.
َۃُ ”
َّ ْخل
َ ِت الن
َہ
سن) “ َsanahatan nakhlah): many years passed on the date palm. A second opinion says that its
root is “وَ ٌ
سن) “ َsano) from which “وُ ْ
َ ْسن
ی) “yasnu) has been derived, which means to go round and round a
well.
َۃُ ”
ِی
َ َّ لسان
ا) “as-saaniyah) means an animal which is made to go round and round a well in order to bring
water out .
َۃُ ”
َ َّ لسن
ا) “as-sanah) means one orbit of the sun. This is also called “ار ٌ د) “ َdaar), and since this orbit takes a
full year, therefore “ ُۃَ
َ َّ لسن
ا) “as-sinah) means one year.
َۃُ ”
َ َ لسن
ا) “as-sanah) is a solar year while “ام ُعْ َ
َل
ا) “al-a’am) is a lunar year.
َۃُ ”
َ َّ لسن
ا) “as-sanah) also means a year when there is drought and intensity, and “ام ُعْ َ
َل
ا) “al-a’am) is a year
when there is prosperity and good harvest .
29:14 And he lived fifty less than one thousand years
among his people
ِ
ِ َث ف
َب
َل
ْ َف فـ
ل
َ
ْ ا
ِهم
ْ
ٍ ي
َة
ن
َ ً
َ س اما
ْ َين ع
ِ
َْس
َّلا خم
ِ
ا
Here “ً
عاما) “ َa’ama) is the period without hardships and “ٌۃَ
سن) “ َsanah) is the period when there were
hardships.
Lane says “ٌۃَ
سن) “ َsanah) also means crop of which there are four harvest in a year.
َ ٍۃ”
ْ َف َ سن
َل
ا) “alfa sanatin) means two hundred fifty years, and “ام ٌع) “ َa’am) is one full year. So if “ً
 “ َخ ْم ِسْی َن َ عاما
(khamseen aama) are taken out from it, it leaves us with two hundred years, which could be a man’s age.
But these are all conjectures. When more historical facts come forth it will become clear what the Quran
meant to say that Nooh lived fifty less than one thousand years among his people (29:14). Some say this
is his period of messenger-hood, which commenced from the the era of an earlier messenger of Allah.
“َُّ
اه
َۃً” or) sannahَ ” (سن
ِی
َ ْسن
ت) “tasniah): opened it, facilitated it, made it easy {T, M, R}.

Source  http://qes.no/Lughat/LughatVolum-II.pdf

Noon waalqalami

  • Advanced Truth Seeker
  • ****
  • Posts: 1262
Re: Hot/"ramadan" Answer
« Reply #2575 on: August 21, 2017, 04:19:54 AM »
Peace Noon

Here is what Parvez explained in his Lughat ul Quran. All the meanings you gave for three words are given by him as well. What he wrote is that a usage of AAM and Sinina is also time of hardship and time of abundance.

Peace Novice, he/they are all over the place -- do you see the clear contradiction with below?

12:47 قل said تزرعون thou cultivating/harvesting سبع seven سنىن sinīna/years of hardship/famine?

Likewise with this receipt for sheep Perf-558 was year "22" (25 April 643 CE) bad/good year?

شهر shahru جمدى jumada الاولى the first من from سنه sanatin اثنىن twosome وعشرىن and twenty (i.e. 22) وكتبه and written his ابن son حدىدو hadidu


Novice

  • Apprentice
  • **
  • Posts: 433
  • Gender: Male
Re: Hot/"ramadan" Answer
« Reply #2576 on: August 21, 2017, 07:19:18 PM »
Peace Noon

What I understood from his Lughat is that Aam and Sinina were also used as years of hardship/famine or years of ease/abundabce. It does not mean that this usage is for each and every instance.

How would you translate/understand verse 29:14?

Noon waalqalami

  • Advanced Truth Seeker
  • ****
  • Posts: 1262
Re: Hot/"ramadan" Answer
« Reply #2577 on: August 24, 2017, 07:48:14 PM »
Peace Noon

What I understood from his Lughat is that Aam and Sinina were also used as years of hardship/famine or years of ease/abundabce. It does not mean that this usage is for each and every instance.

How would you translate/understand verse 29:14?

Peace Novice, need to study نوحا nūḥan (Noah of/a Noah); likewise 46:15  اشده ashuddahu/vigor his وبلغ and reach اربعىن forty سنه  (it's different uses) cross-reference especially with 18:82 واما and as for الجدار the wall فكان so it was لغلمىن for boys two ىتىمىن yatīmayni/orphaned two ... فاراد so intended ربك lord your ان that ىبلغا reached dual اشدهما ashuddahumā/vigor theirs dual (40 year old orphans?) perhaps forty سنه in context pertains to 40 cell divisions/iterations and is about aging; see Hayflick limit.

progressive1993

  • Wise One / Burnout
  • *****
  • Posts: 2451
Re: Hot/"ramadan" Answer
« Reply #2578 on: October 05, 2017, 11:31:46 PM »
Peace,

You are making things too complicated for yourself. The god simply tells us in 17:12 to use the day and night to know the number of years. No need for conjecture about eclipses or things to supposedly align with the galaxy center. The ONLY way to use the day and night to know the number of years is if we take the year as the interval between longest/shortest day/night, in other words the interval between solstices. THERE IS SIMPLY NO OTHER WAY TO APPLY 17:12 PERIOD.

That is not true as we could pick the interval between equinoxes. What speaks against this? Can you explain also why it can't be any other days?

Also, how would the intercalary period work - what happens if a 13th full moon appears. How exactly would one account for that, how long, etc.?
Are you a talker or a doer?