News:

About us: a forum for monotheists, and discussion of Islam based on The Quran

Main Menu

Would someone explain 6:130 for me

Started by jaythikay99, March 12, 2007, 05:39:35 PM

Previous topic - Next topic

Arnold Yasin

Salaam Afridi,

I do not know what you have experienced and how, but I have studied the phenomena of spiritual beings for long and there are a lot of rational explanations for the experiences. Your personal experience is not enough as it is subjective. Research should give sufficient answers in the future.

Main point is that the word Jinn has no fixed meaning in the Quran.

afridi220

Quote from: Arnold Yasin on July 24, 2007, 06:07:41 PM
Salaam Afridi,

I do not know what you have experienced and how, but I have studied the phenomena of spiritual beings for long and there are a lot of rational explanations for the experiences. Your personal experience is not enough as it is subjective. Research should give sufficient answers in the future.

Main point is that the word Jinn has no fixed meaning in the Quran.

Salaam arnold

I agree Jinn has no fix meaning but but the which are described in Quran are real like human bud they are hidden and they show them self to some peoples I have seen them with my own eyes this is not a story from a book are from a film if you want to experience then set in a lonely place. OK leave that too dangerous.

i have seen then even on broad day.

Peace
Peace


People are often unreasonable, illogical and self-centered; forgive them anyway

Arnold Yasin

salaam,

I have settled many times in lonely places but have experienced none. 90% of all Dutch people I know has never experienced anything coming close to encountering spiritual beings. But all Sunni's I know, 90% of them has experienced them. Isn't this a bit strange and a coincidence. The people who are not brought up with these stories, the Dutch people, do not experience them. But people, the Sunni's, who are brought up with these stories do experience them.

It is all about how you teach your brain to explain phenomena. Buddhists will only see Buddha in their dreams, never the virgin Mary. But Catholics do see her. Chrisitians see Jesus, Hindus never see him in their dreams or visions. People who are brought up with the believe spirits walk the earth see them everywhere, people who are not brought up with them never see them.

Do you see a pattern emerge? It is how you are brought up to explain feelings, sounds, twists of the eyes. Your brain searches confirmations to your beliefs. You can say, but Arnold I have talked to them, seen them, felt them.
This subjective experience is not enough to convince they exist. Of the 10 "Jinn experiences", how many of them were not a bit filled in by your brain?

I remember when I turned Sunni, I started to search Jinn spirits everywhere. I heard stories from every Sunni how they have encountered them. I looked everywhere and I thought I had encountered some. Whenever something strange happened, it had to be Jinn.

Since I studied the subject and learned it is superstition, I have never experienced them again. You say a desolate place, how come you see them so such? You live in a deserted place?

Jack

QuoteI have settled many times in lonely places but have experienced none. 90% of all Dutch people I know has never experienced anything coming close to encountering spiritual beings. But all Sunni's I know, 90% of them has experienced them. Isn't this a bit strange and a coincidence. The people who are not brought up with these stories, the Dutch people, do not experience them. But people, the Sunni's, who are brought up with these stories do experience them.

strawman....
You gotta follow the truth even it brings the whole thing crumbling down around you - Sam Tyler, Life on Mars (UK)

I do not feel obliged to believe that the same God who has endowed us with sense

Lobster

`What lies before us and what lies behind us is nothing compared to what lies within us.` - Emerson

'Phoenix! You are in Hot water, maybe you should change your name to Lobster.' - Khalil

Jack



he's comparing his experience from the people he knows, how many people he know? all dutch and all sunnis in the world?  That doesn't mean its true for all dutch or all sunnis per se.


Thing is almost everybody regardless of culture, race, religion ...etc believe in that kind of stuff...
You gotta follow the truth even it brings the whole thing crumbling down around you - Sam Tyler, Life on Mars (UK)

I do not feel obliged to believe that the same God who has endowed us with sense

afridi220

Quote from: Arnold Yasin on July 25, 2007, 02:27:27 AM
salaam,

I have settled many times in lonely places but have experienced none. 90% of all Dutch people I know has never experienced anything coming close to encountering spiritual beings. But all Sunni's I know, 90% of them has experienced them. Isn't this a bit strange and a coincidence. The people who are not brought up with these stories, the Dutch people, do not experience them. But people, the Sunni's, who are brought up with these stories do experience them.

It is all about how you teach your brain to explain phenomena. Buddhists will only see Buddha in their dreams, never the virgin Mary. But Catholics do see her. Chrisitians see Jesus, Hindus never see him in their dreams or visions. People who are brought up with the believe spirits walk the earth see them everywhere, people who are not brought up with them never see them.

Do you see a pattern emerge? It is how you are brought up to explain feelings, sounds, twists of the eyes. Your brain searches confirmations to your beliefs. You can say, but Arnold I have talked to them, seen them, felt them.
This subjective experience is not enough to convince they exist. Of the 10 "Jinn experiences", how many of them were not a bit filled in by your brain?

I remember when I turned Sunni, I started to search Jinn spirits everywhere. I heard stories from every Sunni how they have encountered them. I looked everywhere and I thought I had encountered some. Whenever something strange happened, it had to be Jinn.

Since I studied the subject and learned it is superstition, I have never experienced them again. You say a desolate place, how come you see them so such? You live in a deserted place?

Salaam arnold

It is not about Sunni or any religion or country. or living in desert places if you read my post i said they dont appear to every one and one still living in my home,

actually i was going to tell you that you set in a lonely place at night in Read so and so verse from Quraan and then you will see for your self but said leave it it is dangerous and you can get kill.

Please dont take it as a personnel attack my personnel belief is that when God says jinn O, ins or tribes off jinn he is telling us about this nation of jinns and not about hidden things.

I accept  you have  great knowledge of Arabic and you under stand Quraan better then me and i respect you for that but Quraan is God book and it is for every one  and very easy when he says man then he means only man and not some thing else.


Peace all
Peace


People are often unreasonable, illogical and self-centered; forgive them anyway


Arnold Yasin

Quote from: DArgento on July 25, 2007, 01:52:15 PM

he's comparing his experience from the people he knows, how many people he know? all dutch and all sunnis in the world?  That doesn't mean its true for all dutch or all sunnis per se.


Thing is almost everybody regardless of culture, race, religion ...etc believe in that kind of stuff...

Peace,

I have studied the belief in spirits in cultures on Earth for several years, it is a big part of my Theology study at Amsterdam college. I just gave a short example to explain why I am a skeptic. I respect the belief in spirits, but I believe myself there are many psychological and neurological factors involved that explain them. Mankind has come a long way in understanding the Reality around him. Belief in spirits is one of them. It refers to believing in loose powers in nature, is the same reason why people believed in mutliple gods, seeing the forces of nature unrelated and working loose from each other, seperate powers fighting each other. This is also why everyone on Earth has believed in mutliple gods, spirit belief is directly connected to this.

Polytheism disapeared, but the fragmentary view on nature remained and thus the belief in spirits is maintained. This is also connected with the belief God intervenes constantly in the world. No consistency in the world and the Laws that control it. Views created through not seeing the connection between the Laws of the Universe and seeign them as chaotic.

And where does it say in the Quran you can summon spirits with it? It is a Guidance for mankind, not a seance book. It is send as blessing to Mankind and now you say you can summon evil jinn with it? Sorry Afridi, but this belief goes directly against the Quran. Self-imposed fear can create experiences to fulfill the expected result.

Jack

peace Arnold

Sure, I understand, I was just saying... I do agree with your general point that your mind manifests things, however at the same time i have known many people to have seen these things... people who were not at all superstitious, people who were skeptic of such things, and a friend of mine's brother has a recorded video of a ghost....It is what it is, I am not really sure either way
You gotta follow the truth even it brings the whole thing crumbling down around you - Sam Tyler, Life on Mars (UK)

I do not feel obliged to believe that the same God who has endowed us with sense