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Dying in a state of kufr and shirk

Started by CavemanDoctor, March 08, 2006, 11:18:56 PM

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hawk99

Peace,

Unintended shirk is not the same as intended/malicious/criminal shirk.
Shirk setup to mislead, misguide, or confuse is the antithesis of guidance.
After the Quran was revealed those whose insisted that Allah had partners
are declared to be intentionally or arrogantly astray! 

[2:22] Then do not set up rivals unto Allah while you know.

[14:30] And they set up rivals to Allah, to mislead from
His path! Say: ?Enjoy But certainly, your destination is the Fire!?

Pay attention to this ayat:

[4:48] Allah forgives not that partners should be set up with Him; but He forgives
anything else, to whom He pleases; to set up partners with Allah is to
fabricate a great sin.


                                                          :peace:


The secret to monotheism can be found in the garden

Novice

Salaam

The word "shirk" comes from root ش ر ك which has the meanings of "to attach" "to  mix".

In Quranic terms it is attaching/mixing something with Allah. The commands given by Allah in Quran are for our welfare. He does not need anything for Himself.

14:8
وَقَالَ مُوسَىٰٓ إِن تَكۡفُرُوٓاْ أَنتُمۡ وَمَن فِى ٱلۡأَرۡضِ جَمِيعً۬ا فَإِنَّ ٱللَّهَ لَغَنِىٌّ حَمِيدٌ
SAHIH INTERNATIONAL
And Moses said, "If you should disbelieve, you and whoever is on the earth entirely - indeed, Allah is Free of need and Praiseworthy."

If someone is worshiping an idol what it can do to Allah. Does He care what humans worship? He is not a jealous God. He gave us guidance to sail through this life and get our nufus ready for next life. If we ignore His guidance and follow other than Allah, it damages us and hinder the (zaka) growth of our nufus. Worship is for deities not for Allah.

The concept of forgiveness is strange as well. The word "maghfira" means protection. So if we follow other than Allah's guidance we do not get protection as per His laws.

4:48
إِنَّ ٱللَّهَ لَا يَغۡفِرُ أَن يُشۡرَكَ بِهِۦ وَيَغۡفِرُ مَا دُونَ ذَٲلِكَ لِمَن يَشَآءُ‌ۚ وَمَن يُشۡرِكۡ بِٱللَّهِ فَقَدِ ٱفۡتَرَىٰٓ إِثۡمًا عَظِيمًا (٤٨) أَلَمۡ تَرَ إِلَى ٱلَّذِينَ يُزَكُّونَ أَنفُسَہُم‌ۚ بَلِ ٱللَّهُ يُزَكِّى مَن يَشَآءُ وَلَا يُظۡلَمُونَ فَتِيلاً

Surely Allah does not give protection, if you associate with Him (follow other than Allah's guidance) and whoever associate with Allah he had fabricated a great ithm. Do you not see those who give growth to their nufus, nay Allah gives growth as per His law and they are not done any injustice.

So shirk is to follow guidance of other than Allah.



Zulf

Greetings all,

Just some questions...

What is Allah?
How do you believe in Allah?
   Experience, cultural blind faith or philosophical assumption?
   I cannot see any differences between so called believers and non-believers except for rituals and claims of faith. No differences in
   attitude or behavior.

How do you follow the guidance of Allah?
   What is this guidance? Books? What about all interpretations which in turn end up pretty much subjective?
   Is there some other guidance?

How do you set up partners with Allah?
   Can Allah even have partners? Isn't that a contradiction in terms?

What does 'partner' mean anyway?
   Aren't we all agents of the Creator in various odd ways?

When we get a grip on this, perhaps we can approach what shirk might mean...  :-\ :o  :ignore:  ;D

If you name me, you negate me.

good logic

Peace Zulf.
Nice to hear from you.
This is me, from my perspective:

What is Allah? The Creator of what we see/
How do you believe in Allah/ By what I see and  hear around me(people, animals, plants...) .By my thinking /reasoning /searching and instinct.

How do you follow the guidance? From Qoran so far(I came across Qoran and was curious about it!). At least it appears to claim it is a message from the Creator and has guidance in it. My instinct is also telling me ,this message makes sense(most of what I understand from it at least).

How do you set up partners with Allah? Since starting to be aware/think, I was always following something or somebody. My parents, my leaders, my peers my own desires. Now I realise(being aware of the message from Allah-Qoran-) I should only follow GOD s path-Sirat Al Mustaqueem- i.e I was setting up partners with Allah.

What does partner mean anyway? Another authority/source /way/system besides or alongside GOD s way/system as described in His message-Sirat Al Mustaqueem-.

Perhaps a lot of people are following GOD s path by instinct/without coming across a message, it is possible. I am now very much aware that I was not. So I am trying to change my ways/behaviour/stand with myself and others.
I also realise that following the right path -Sirat Al Mustaqueem- is for my own good/benefit. GOD has no need of anything from me.
GOD bless you.
Peace.
TOTAL LOYALTY TO GOD ALONE.   IN GOD I TRUST
38:65″ Say:? I warn you; There is no other god beside GOD, the One, the Supreme.?
[url="https://total-loyalty-to-god-alone.co.uk/?p=28"]https://total-loyalty-to-god-alone.co.uk/?p=28[/url]

Novice

Quote from: good logic on August 14, 2018, 03:04:22 PM
Peace Zulf.
Nice to hear from you.
This is me, from my perspective:

What is Allah? The Creator of what we see/
How do you believe in Allah/ By what I see and  hear around me(people, animals, plants...) .By my thinking /reasoning /searching and instinct.

How do you follow the guidance? From Qoran so far(I came across Qoran and was curious about it!). At least it appears to claim it is a message from the Creator and has guidance in it. My instinct is also telling me ,this message makes sense(most of what I understand from it at least).

How do you set up partners with Allah? Since starting to be aware/think, I was always following something or somebody. My parents, my leaders, my peers my own desires. Now I realise(being aware of the message from Allah-Qoran-) I should only follow GOD s path-Sirat Al Mustaqueem- i.e I was setting up partners with Allah.

What does partner mean anyway? Another authority/source /way/system besides or alongside GOD s way/system as described in His message-Sirat Al Mustaqueem-.

Perhaps a lot of people are following GOD s path by instinct/without coming across a message, it is possible. I am now very much aware that I was not. So I am trying to change my ways/behaviour/stand with myself and others.
I also realise that following the right path -Sirat Al Mustaqueem- is for my own good/benefit. GOD has no need of anything from me.
GOD bless you.
Peace.

God bless you GL. You saved me a lot of typing :)

Regrads

imrankhawaja

blessing of God upon all brothers/sisters

the category of shirk and kuffar are really difficult to understand when different societies have different types of  shirk so first most question is what shirk and kuffar is ?

wrong doing and sins always leave guilty feelings and its true and also  in every socitey wrong doing never encouraged
like rob,steal,rape,murder etc ..

but about this wrongdoing or sin (SHIRK) nobody whoever is doing it, he/she is not even feeling anything even the LAW didnt really bother about this wrongdoing/sin  so actually as far i can see we are understanding this term differently we need to find out what is shirk in reality ?

logically if shirk is what we consider as shirk then something is tricky becoz on one hand book of God claims every nation is there  due to a reason, and a survery tells us 98 % people adopted a same faith what they get birth in so while asking from them they are satisfied in their heart that they are not doing shirk(griss wrongdoing) but from the lens of other people they are in clear error? same goes with every label of religion.

why there is such a satisfaction on gross sin of all faiths ?

a close example of kaffir is firoon in literal sense who knew the truth but cant accept it due to ego.

we need to see what shirk is in actual.


Quote from: Zulf on August 14, 2018, 02:16:28 PM
Greetings all,

Just some questions...


peace zulf hope u allright, i ll try to answer some of ur questions  ;)

Quote from: Zulf on August 14, 2018, 02:16:28 PM

What is Allah?
How do you believe in Allah?
   


Allah/God is a master source of every material and immaterial thing/being.

because somebody must desinged all this game/play what we  can feel/see.



Quote from: Zulf on August 14, 2018, 02:16:28 PM

How do you follow the guidance of Allah?
   What is this guidance? Books? What about all interpretations which in turn end up pretty much subjective?
   Is there some other guidance?


Guidance is just a guidance
when human/gps/map/mind/book/interpretation will guide you to the path its involved risks in it so its a duty of passenger to continue the travel at his/her own responsibility. he has to make sure he is on the right path , and when he knows he is heading towards right path he will keep calm and sleepy but still risks  of accidents are  ahead ..

Quote from: Zulf on August 14, 2018, 02:16:28 PM
How do you set up partners with Allah?
   Can Allah even have partners? Isn't that a contradiction in terms?

What does 'partner' mean anyway?
   Aren't we all agents of the Creator in various odd ways?


partner means equal in terms of any power of finance/crime/relationship in worldy terms.

you are true there is not any partner of God in whole system a true logical God is one.

thats why people unrightfully set things/beings equal to God and it was a gross mistake,using word partners is not correct for God. God is far above what we can associate with him

agents are not equal to partners .. becoz partners are the creator  of  firm/business where agents work..

Zulf

I wonder exactly how people make partners equal to God.
What are some examples?
I've never seen any cases where people have an all-mighty God, and then they keep another entity beside God who is of equal powers. Not even Hinduism seems to be doing this.
Perhaps in cases where some group might argue that the creator is not all-mighty and then have other powers filling those gaps... but are there any examples of that in the world?

All the best
If you name me, you negate me.

amin

I think, When one says, my God is not yours then its Shirk, thats the basic start of splitting Him, like some having the idea that God blesses him and his clan more than other's, getting special privileges from Him. This is true in many religions like mainstream Islam, Jews, high class Hindu society thinking they are only born noble sacred and blessed etc.. and others not so.

huruf

Quote from: Zulf on August 15, 2018, 12:57:22 AM
I wonder exactly how people make partners equal to God.
What are some examples?
I've never seen any cases where people have an all-mighty God, and then they keep another entity beside God who is of equal powers. Not even Hinduism seems to be doing this.
Perhaps in cases where some group might argue that the creator is not all-mighty and then have other powers filling those gaps... but are there any examples of that in the world?

All the best

Glad to see you back, Zulf, hopefully you are staying with us some time.

I think that it is not a matter of showing any external appearance or imagerie of more than one "god", but rather our inner image.

Let us say e are worried out a dear person to us, that she may be in danger, that murderers or whatever may catch her...
Mentally where does a common sense worry and rationalisation of dangers end and where does the fear of the unknown start. Does not God also rule in those things we do not know?

Of course we should show caution in everything in life, but no matter how much precaution we show, things still happen, there creeps the fear of other than God...

For our own sake, once we behave with foresight and caution we should be able not to worry, but in fact we do worry...

That is just one way where our asociating to God may creep into our hearts and minds. We associat emurderers to God, car accidents, diseases...

Salaam

good logic

Saying GOD has got power and believing GOD is the only power are two different things.

our attitude towards our creator and our deep intention/thoughts/convictions about "who is our god/priority?" is the issue.

Some are rendering lip service to GOD and have "different gods/priorities". Other things/ways/systems/people that they hold dear to them and ignore GOD s  system.
There are many examples Zulf:
1- Our wealth and properties .
2- Our tradition /race/status.
3-Our ego/arrogance.
4- Our desires and loyalties to others.
...
All these  can take us away from being  fair/just and good to ourselves and others. i.e lead us away from sirat Al Mustaqueem.
They are the partners  that one can take as gods beside GOD Alone.
I am not saying we cannot have these in moderation and still keep on the straight path, but we need to stay  " conscious" and always aware that "loyalty to GOD s path" is the utmost priority.
My take.
GOD bless.
Peace.
TOTAL LOYALTY TO GOD ALONE.   IN GOD I TRUST
38:65″ Say:? I warn you; There is no other god beside GOD, the One, the Supreme.?
[url="https://total-loyalty-to-god-alone.co.uk/?p=28"]https://total-loyalty-to-god-alone.co.uk/?p=28[/url]