Author Topic: Is Quran anti- secular?  (Read 13739 times)

mquran

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Is Quran anti- secular?
« Reply #10 on: November 23, 2005, 04:42:00 PM »
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So, would the christians be forced to live by Quranic laws even when they dont believe in it?


Laws like 'dont kill' and 'dont cheat', yes.

peacefulmuslim

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Is Quran anti- secular?
« Reply #11 on: November 23, 2005, 04:53:17 PM »
Hi Mquran,
I didnt obviously mean 'dont kill' , 'dont cheat' laws. These are values, that any human, irrespective of any religion can realise and  understand.

How about lashing for adultery? What if the christians in the country do not relate to it?Would the law apply to them as well?

What about marriage and divorce laws? What rules will be followed for the christians? the ones mentioned in Quran(which they dont believe and accept) or seperate rules for them, according to their beliefs?

Jaxal

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Is Quran anti- secular?
« Reply #12 on: November 23, 2005, 04:56:15 PM »
SALaM PM

Excellent question. Only proves that Quran was never meant to run a country.
She Made Me See The World In A Grain Of Sand.
When The Only Choice You Have Left Is The Wrong One, It'S Not A Choice Anymore... It's Fate.

mquran

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Is Quran anti- secular?
« Reply #13 on: November 23, 2005, 04:58:59 PM »
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I didnt obviously mean 'dont kill' , 'dont cheat' laws. These are values, that any human, irrespective of any religion can realise and understand.


These are laws in the Quran though. If you don't take them as 'religious', thats fine.


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How about lashing for adultery? What if the christians in the country do not relate to it?Would the law apply to them as well?


If they dont relate to it, they shouldnt have sex in the public space like animals. If they do, its not a personal thing anymore , is it ? Obviously, adultery and fornication in thier own space is thier (as with anyone else's) own affair.


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What about marriage and divorce laws? What rules will be followed for the christians? the ones mentioned in Quran(which they dont believe and accept) or seperate rules for them, according to their beliefs?


There's no 'qisas' for marriage and divorce laws, i.e. whether you follow or not, there's no punishement stipulated unless of course, you cheat someone using marriage as a scam. If a marriage and divorce is straightfoward, there's no qisas or equal retribution.

peacefulmuslim

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Is Quran anti- secular?
« Reply #14 on: November 23, 2005, 05:03:21 PM »
Hi Jaxal,
Quote from: "Jaxal"
SALaM PM

Excellent question. Only proves that Quran was never meant to run a country.


I honestly wanted to know what everyone out here thinks on this subject.

I lived all my life in India. And I am sooo glad its a secular government and not a religious government (would be hindu government since they are the majority). If it was a religious government and muslims had to follow their religious laws, even if we dont believe it, it would be unfair, wouldnt it? Say, they followed crude laws like burning widows(sati) etc and if all people living in the country were forced to follow it?
I am glad the people and the country chose a secular government where everyone is equal and we follow laws that are just to humanity in general, not taking into consideration any specific religion and religious beliefs.
The same can be said for UK, America etc, isnt it?

mquran

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Is Quran anti- secular?
« Reply #15 on: November 23, 2005, 05:10:44 PM »
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I honestly wanted to know what everyone out here thinks on this subject
.

I didnt bother answering because this person generally doesn't know what he's saying and can't answer a question to save his life but if you want, I can deconstruct the sentence for you.


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I lived all my life in India. And I am sooo glad its a secular government and not a religious government (would be hindu government since they are the majority). If it was a religious government and muslims had to follow their religious laws, even if we dont believe it, it would be unfair, wouldnt it?


The Quran isnt a comparison for this. In an islamic domain, anyone can perform any religious rituals as they so choose. However, ppl are bound by Quranic laws which one might call 'civil' instead of 'religious'. I caution against the use of both terms. Al-quraan gives laws, period. They dont have anything to do with your rituals.


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I am glad the people and the country chose a secular government where everyone is equal and we follow laws that are just to humanity in general, not taking into consideration any specific religion.
The same can be said for UK, America etc, isnt it?


Does al-quraan propagate a religion to you ? If so, I'd urge you to read al-quraan thoroughly and see where it preaches a 'religious' government.

Jaxal

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Is Quran anti- secular?
« Reply #16 on: November 23, 2005, 05:13:58 PM »
The only thing i need to know regarding you is that ur the kind of man who cant keep his marriage together. The rest, as 7 of 9 says, is irrelevant.

SaLaM PM

What you say is right. Even the indians have enough sense not to run their country using religion. IT has already excelled pakistan in nearly all ways.
She Made Me See The World In A Grain Of Sand.
When The Only Choice You Have Left Is The Wrong One, It'S Not A Choice Anymore... It's Fate.

peacefulmuslim

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Is Quran anti- secular?
« Reply #17 on: November 23, 2005, 05:15:03 PM »
Quote from: "mquran"

Obviously, adultery and fornication in thier own space is thier (as with anyone else's) own affair.

So, according to u, there would be no punishment of lashing for adultery among the christians living under muslim law?


Quote from: "mquran"
There's no 'qisas' for marriage and divorce laws, i.e. whether you follow or not, there's no punishement stipulated unless of course, you cheat someone using marriage as a scam. If a marriage and divorce is straightfoward, there's no qisas or equal retribution.

Would the widows be required to wait for a period of 3 months to marry again?
Would they be required to follow divorce procedures like Quran says?
Would all other punishments(from Quran) apply to them?

mquran

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Is Quran anti- secular?
« Reply #18 on: November 23, 2005, 05:17:23 PM »
PM, what did I tell you? Poor chap doesnt have the brains of a 6 yr old. It's good that now the women know what a sex pest he is :) so he can't pull off his lame lines on them.

mquran

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Is Quran anti- secular?
« Reply #19 on: November 23, 2005, 05:20:00 PM »
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So, according to u, there would be no punishment of lashing for adultery among the christians living under muslim law?


No. If they had sex publicly (in front of 4 ppl as the Quran stipulates) then there's punishment for them as with everyone else.

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Would the widows be required to wait for a period of 3 months to marry again?
Would they be required to follow divorce procedures like Quran says?


As far as my reading goes, there's no punishable requirement for divorce laws. If you follow them, you gain Allah's rewards. If you don't, you won't.

 
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Would all other punishments(from Quran) apply to them?


Such as what ?