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Questions/Comments on the Quran / Re: Pork is HALAL
« Last post by Noon waalqalami on Today at 02:12:56 PM »
Salam

Even if you do not want to analyze in depth my assumptions (by my fault - given few arguments) you must know that I prefer the second hypothesisi made in my previous message (Fornication) ...

peace Iyyaka, (welcome) interesting view although talks about context of food not fornication, etc.

http://corpus.quran.com/qurandictionary.jsp?q=TEm#(6:145:11)

6:145 قل say لا not اجد I find فى in ما what اوحى inspires الى to me محرما impermissible of على on طاعم ṭāʿimin/eater ىطعمه yaṭʿamuhu/he eats it الا except ان that ىكون being مىته lifeless او or دما blood of مسفوحا poured forth of او or لحم lahma/flesh خنزىر khinzīrin/swine فانه so surely it رجس filthiness او or فسقا disobedience of اهل dedicate لغىر to other than الله the god به in/with it فمن so who اضطر forced غىر other than باغ desires ولا and not عاد reverts فان so indeed ربك lord your غفور forgiver رحىم merciful

likewise as was already explained ...

2:173, 5:3, 16:115 ولحم walahma/and flesh الخنزىر l-khinziri/the swine (cannot be an adjective)
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how easy to see if someone is contradictory in his/her words ?
best method to see this thread.

Contradiction upon contradiction

i see more than 10 contradiction just within last 5 pages lets carry on another chapter today, as i see there is no one in flat earth community to answer my questions. whoever tried to attempt failed terribly

i have another activity lets see how many contradictions by flat earth members. target is make 100 contradiction. but 50 is also considered as half century so we set our target on 50.

and i think ONE stupid already reached near to the target.

for the first time this of my activity will b hope for flatearthers to prove themselves BEST at Something  Called contradiction.

their kids will say our flat earth father was highest in contradictory posts and free mind forum is evidence he post five contradictions daily.

lets see which flat earther have more contradictions. competetion started now  :eat: :group:
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Questions/Comments on the Quran / Re: Pork is HALAL
« Last post by Iyyaka on Today at 05:47:48 AM »
Salam

Even if you do not want to analyze in depth my assumptions (by my fault - given few arguments) you must know that I prefer the second hypothesisi made in my previous message (Fornication) ; and I will give you my arguments (even in a language, English, that is not natural for me - so sorry in advance for my faults).

Let's start at the beginning. 4 things are forbidden :

- Category 1 => Carrion and in [5:3] this category is more detailed (including the smothered animal)
- Category 2 => Blood
- Category 3 => pork meat
- Category 4 => meat dedicated to idols

Then we have one thing in common. As you mentioned all meat was allowed BEFORE the revelation of the Torah (so pork too ..).
Second verse [5:3] as a whole refers to something that relates to the flesh in the physical sense of the term (which is why I reject my third hypothesis). This is also our second common point.

- - - - - Now see our differences and first your arguments:

1) You quote the deuteronomy and the levitic => Very well but the problem is that it falls in the category 1 and not the 3.

2) Then God already forbids spoiled or smelly meat through category 1. (so I answer your question)

3) Finally the word "Khinzir" in other verses of the Qur'an is unambiguously translated as "pork" (5:60 "Say:" Shall I inform you of it worse than a punishment from God? angry at them, and made of them apes and PIGS .. ")

- - - - - Now, my arguments for saying "pork meat" = Fornication.

                1)God asks us not to practice fornication and adultery :

[23:5] those who preserve their sex,
[23:6] Except for their wives or what they possess by oath, in which they can not be blamed.

But the word "infamy" (alfawahisha in 7:33 for example) concerns in the QURAN only 3 categories:
1) adultery
2) ribba
3) homosexuality.
But not fornication between 1 man and 1 woman ...Also Arabic : ZINA refers in Quran to adultery.

               2) Acts of the Apostles and Parallel with the Qur'an

Quran(5:3..)                              Acts of the apostles (15:20&29)
Carrion (strangled among others…)   Thins strangled
Blood                                                       From blood
Pork meat                                            Fornication
Meat dedicated for idols                     Pollution of idols

=> Acts of Apostles -15:20 "But that they write to them, that they abstain from pollutions of idols, and from fornication, and from things strangled, and from blood. "

                 3) Term "Constraint" uses

QURAN [5:3] ".... But if anyone is forced into it, other than by desire or transgression, then God is Forgiving, Merciful. "
versus
QURAN [24:33] "And in your search for the goods of life here below, do not compel your young girls to prostitution, if they wish to remain chaste. If someone restrains them, then God, after they have been restrained, is Forgiving, Merciful. "

=> Amazing and unique parallel that is not random. We find the notion of constraint (forced) and the fact that God is forgiving, merciful.But it is a matter of forced fornication, and not of adultery, in [24:33].

                 4) Tainted (6:145) "Arabic: RIJS)

Why abstain from pork?
God justifies it by the notion of "defilement" in [6:145].

The word RIJS appears in the following verses:
- 5: 90
- 6: 125
- 6: 145 = pork meat
- 7: 71
- 9: 95
- 9: 125 (2 times)
- 10: 100
- 22: 30 => tainted of idols
- 33: 33

=> The word tainted refers in these verses to the tainted of the soul/heart and not to the physical tainted of the body.
=> It is reasonable to assume that the 6:145 refers to the taint of the soul related to a sin and not to the tainted of the body

                 5) Classical Dictionary

As you have underlined in your first messages the pork is so called because "he looked from the outer angles of his eyes" (Lane's lexicon) Applied to a man this may mean having a concupiscent look => sexual connotations or having lying words (not right).

                 6) Pork taken as allegory (Cf -> 5: 60 quoted above).

We need to know that the Arabs were pragmatic and, like us today, used images of animals to insult or target bad behavior.

                 7) meat as human flesh

Quran - [49:12] "...Would any of you enjoy eating (Arabic: Yakula) the flesh (Arabic: Lahma) of his dead brother? …"
=> Here "Lahma" makes reference to human flesh and it is mentionned in an allegorical meaning

Peace be upon u.
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Peace Everyone.....

Salam....

You would have noticed I brought verses which speak of BAINAHUMA when the heaven is singular and even plural GOD used BAINAHUMA.... It shows everything is between earth and heavens  ...
Now see the below verse.... It reads as FEEHINNA....
5:120 " To Allah belongs the kingdom/dominion of heavens and Earth and whatever FEEHINNA (therein / in them-plural).... ..."
Not used BAINAHUMA or even Feehima....

He is not merely the ruler of earth and heavens but to everything which consists in them .i. e earth and heavens ... God uses His words exactly what He wants to pass in His message...
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Peace All....

2:164 " ..... ..... and [His] directing of the winds and the clouds controlled BETWEEN the Heaven (Sama) and the Earth are signs for a people who use reason."

Now let's look at what our fellow spherical Earth party believes in... They say Sama is Universe.... If you go through their previous threads you will notice...
Now Allah says in above verse; He is directing the WINDS & CLOUDS  being Controlled BETWEEN the Heaven and Earth....  How amazing....  That's perfect for a stationary earth and above it is the canopy... Between both of them clouds and winds are controlled and directed as He wishes....  If we think of this verse in the universe model you will end up clueless .... Are there wind and air in universe BTW??.. They will only know...
GOD says at the end it is a sign for those who apply wits...
When the story goes like this manner, some want me to believe in spinning crap... Lol...  I wish I die before that... 😊
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Questions/Comments on the Quran / Re: Inheritance according to Quran
« Last post by Mazhar on Today at 01:54:04 AM »
Earlier the Arabic text was appearing. Now it seems, some fault in the software of forum that Arabic text is missing.

However, the complete article can be read here and input, critique can be discussed by reference to any point, para.

http://haqeeqat.pk/Economics-Inheritance.htm
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Questions/Comments on the Quran / Re: Inheritance according to Qur�an
« Last post by Mazhar on Yesterday at 11:34:46 PM »
peace, only if in behest/will ...

33:4 وما and not جعل made ادعىكم adiyaakum/adopted sons yours ابناكم sons yours ذلكم such yours قولكم speech yours بافواهكم with mouths yours والله and the god ىقول speaketh الحق the truth وهو and he ىهدى guided السبىل the path

Salam,

Yes,

5. Prepositional Phrase: لِـكُـلّٛ:  relates to the following Verb. It is always used in construct-possessive phrase. When used elliptically-extremely concise in writing, it always has the [تنوين التعويض] "nunation of compensation" as is the case here. The discourse and the sentence is about allocation of Inheritance, thereby, it manifests that [تنوين التعويض] "nunation of compensation" is for each one of the deceased. The object of verb: مَوَٟلِـىَ   suffices for indicating that it relates to all the deceased and includes the martyrs. كُـلّ: It means each, every denoting no exception. This promulgation in irself is prohibitory that the inheritance be given wholly to two persons. The inheritors must be three or above.
وَٱلَّذِينَ عَقَدَتْ أَيْمَٟنُكُـمْ فَـٔ​َاتُوهُـمْ نَصِيبَـهُـمْۚ
Take note: about those whom your right hand had pledged responsibility, therefore, you people grant them their fortune in the inheritance. [Refer above 4:33]
6. Who are they and weather they can be included in the: مَوَٟلِـىَ not being in real terms kinsfolk-blood relations? The adopted sons are so declared by Allah the Exalted:
ٱدْعُوهُـمْ لِءَابَآئِـهِـمْ هُوَ أَقْسَطُ عِندَ ٱللَّهِۚ
You people are hereby directed to call them (adopted youngsters) by their respective Fathers. This is most appropriate and balanced conduct in the judgment of Allah the Exalted.
فَإِن لَّمْ تَعْلَمُوٓا۟ ءَابَآءَهُـمْ فَإِخوَٟنُكُـمْ فِـى ٱلدِّينِ وَمَوَٟلِيكُـمْۚ
However, if you knew not the Fathers of them, thereby, they are your brothers [not sons] in the Prescribed Code and Physical Procedure [Islam]; And they are your Beneficiaries.
 وَلَيْسَ عَلَيْكُـمْ جُنَاحٚ فِيـمَآ أَخْطَأْتُـم بِهِۦ وَلَـٰكِن مَّا تَعَمَّدَتْ قُلُوبُكُـمْۚ
And [in view of this injunction which is to take effect prospectively] there is no cause of embarrassment and disconcert for you people regarding what you erred in the past in this matter; but that is blameworthy which your hearts purposely did.
وَكَانَ ٱللَّهُ غَفُورٙا رَّحِـيـمٙا
Know it; Allah the Exalted is repeatedly Overlooking-Forgiving, the Merciful. [33:05]
7. The: مَوَٟلِـىَ  kinsfolk are the: ٱلْوَٟرِثِيـنَ inheritors and a solitary son is included in them:
وَإِ نِّـى خِفْتُ ٱلۡمَوَ ٰ⁠لِیَ مِن وَرَآءِى
And I have felt apprehensive of kinsfolk in situation after me �
وَكَانَتِ ٱمْرَأَتِـى عَاقِرٙا
And [though] my wife has been infertile �
 فَهَبْ لِـى مِن لَّدُنْكَ وَلِيّٙا
Therefore, You do give me from Your grace an associate (son) � [19:05]
يَرِثُنِى وَيَرِثُ مِنْ ءَالِ يَعْقُوبَۖ
He will inherit me and he will inherit from the family of Ya'qoob [alahissalam] �

وَٱجْعَلْهُ رَبِّ رَضِيّٙا
And do render him; my Sustainer Lord, a pleasing personality." [19:06]

8. It is thus rendered abundantly explicit that only the: مَوَٟلِـىَ  kinsfolk are the: ٱلْوَٟرِثِيـنَ legal inheritors.
Whatever of economic value that passes on at the death of previous holder to the heirs is referred by: ٱلتُّـرَاثَ heritage, and by verbal noun: مِیرَ ٰ⁠ثُ heritage, escheat (ultimate proprietorship).
The: مَوَٟلِـىَ kinsfolk are the: ٱلْوَٟرِثِيـنَ inheritors and both are two-way relational words.
The heritage is described by sentence:  مِمَّا تَرَكَ ٱلْوَٟلِدَانِ وَٱلۡأَقْرَبُونَ out of that which the parents and the nearer-relatives have left. The object of verb is elided for succinctness and for being obviously understood: heritage.
Related Root:  ت ر ك signifies giving up, desertion, abandonment of a thing. An agent leaves behind estate which becomes another's property. The fortunes accruing to various members of the bereaved family could fluctuate depending upon the number of offspring and blood relatives existing at the time of death of a person leaving heritage.
لِّلـرِّجَالِ نَصيِبٚ مِّمَّا تَرَكَ ٱلْوَٟلِدَانِ وَٱلۡأَقْرَبُونَ
Share is apportioned for the Men partially from the inheritance left by the Parents (Mother and Father) and the relatively Nearer Relatives.

وَلِلنِّسَآءِ نَصِيبٚ مِّمَّا تَرَكَ ٱلْوَٟلِدَانِ وَٱلۡأَقْرَبُونَ
And share is apportioned for the Women partially from the inheritance left by the Parents (Mother and Father) and the relatively Nearer Relatives.
 مِمَّا قَلَّ مِنْهُ أَوْ كَثُرَۚ نَصِيبٙا مَّفْرُوضٙا
This share is out of that which has either become diminutive from that-inheritance or has become greater fortune apportioned. [4:07]
9. The Verbal Sentence: قَلّ is the Relative Clause for the preceding Relative Pronoun. The Verb is Perfect; Third person; Singular; Masculine; Intransitive; and Subject pronoun is hidden linking back to the Relative Pronoun. It is derived from مصدر-قِلَّة Verbal noun. It signifies that its Subject has become in diminutive proportion. After Appositive-coordinating conjunction for alternative option is the Verb: كَثُرَ denoting something having become in abundance or large proportion.

10. The wealth: moveable and immovable assets have become fascinatingly attractive for sensual excitements and gratifications for the majority of people:
زُيِّنَ لِلنَّاسِ حُبُّ ٱلشَّهَوَٟتِ مِنَ ٱلنِّسَآءِ
Know it; the love of erotic predilections - stimulators has become alluring for the people (Men), fetish from the women;
وَٱلْبَنِيـنَ
And liking for having sons has become a longing for people.
وَٱلْقَنَٟطِيـرِ ٱلْمُقَنطَرَةِ مِنَ ٱلذَّهَبِ وَٱلْفِضَّةِ
So has become the desire to have a state of hoarded abundance of Gold and Silver —

وَٱلْخَيْلِ ٱلْمُسَوَّمَةِ وَٱلۡأَنْعَٟمِ وَٱلْحَرْثِۗ
And the marked-pedigree horses [top of the line products], and abundance of herbivore-mammals, and for plenty of harvesting lands.
ذَٟلِكَ مَتَٟعُ ٱلْحَـيَوٰةِ ٱلدُّنْيَاۖ
This is the wealth-sustenance-provision of the transitory worldly life.
 وَٱللَّهُ عِندَهُۥ حُسْنُ ٱلْمَـٔ​َابِ
Mind it that Allah the Exalted grants the most appropriate return and abode by His Grace. [3:14]
11. This being the ground reality, mere laws and regulations to implement justice in all respects in the case of inheritance and other economic problems is quite a difficult proposition for majority of human beings. Therefore, Allah the Exalted encourages creating a situation wherein justice can be established in such matters by heightening the moral consciousness of man and showing of mercy and kindness to those undergoing tribulations.

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Off-Topic / Re: WIDTH OF HEAVEN AND WIDTH OF EARTH.. ARE THEY EQUAL AS PER 57:21
« Last post by jkhan on Yesterday at 08:42:44 PM »
Even if you are to apply cease or stop in these verses you won't get a concrete meaning .... Translate it pls... Then let's see with reality and science and yiur accepted myth... How that works
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My goodness...
What a twister of words you are...
21:15 and 35:41 are totally different letters and words...
Hypocrocy at best...

another clueless ignorant post  not knowing basic difference trailing alif refers to dual.
really should study basic stuff, language, science, etc., you're embarrassing yourself.
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Questions/Comments on the Quran / Re: Inheritance according to Quran
« Last post by Noon waalqalami on Yesterday at 08:33:14 PM »
like under patronage person (in common parlance adopted son).

peace, only if in behest/will ...

33:4 وما and not جعل made ادعىكم adiyaakum/adopted sons yours ابناكم sons yours ذلكم such yours قولكم speech yours بافواهكم with mouths yours والله and the god ىقول speaketh الحق the truth وهو and he ىهدى guided السبىل the path
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