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Messages - Edip Yuksel

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651
Thank you Someone for the links to the recording program. We need some people to volunteer to do the recording of the Paltalk debate.

Any technically gifted volunteer for this task?

Peace,
Edip

652
General Issues / Questions / Silly, ignorant and arrogant
« on: October 11, 2008, 11:21:14 AM »
This is an example of a silly, ignorant and arrogant prose falsely attributed to God! It assumes a God in NEED of attention, love and care. The reality is that God is not out there craving for our attention, hoping that we give him some time. God is high above needing our petty attention. This is one of the many church-fabricated divine characters that needs money, like his fabricators. They fabricate gods in their own image!

Those who pray in order to help a pathetic god who is in need of their prayers (and money through church) perhaps may never improve their personality and intellectual capacity to recognize and appreciate their creator, and may never be able to communicate with real God, the lord of the universe.

Yes, God is loving, caring, forgiving, but God never craves for our attention or hope for our time. We should pray to true God not clergy-made pathetic images and we should pray for our own good, not as a charity to gods of our imagination.

22:73 ... Weak is both the seeker and the sought!

Peace,
Edip

653
Dear brothers and sisters:

To discuss the imperative of Islamic Reform, I will be visiting United Kingdom and Turkey during the first ten days of November. God willing, I will give a series of lectures, participate in meetings and a book fair, and will have interviews with media.

Before or after the lectures I would like to personally meet you and consult you on projects and activities to promote islamic reform under the light of reason and Quran.

Below is the announcement about my lectures at Oxford University. On November 5th, I believe that there will be another lecture in London on the topic of Reason and Faith. For my London schedule please contact MECO and for Turkish trip please contact my publisher Ozan Yayıncılık.

http://meco.org.uk
http://meco.org.uk/forum.htm


MECO
proudly presents two lectures by

EDIP YUKSEL
A leading US-based Islamic thinker and contemporary translator of the Holy Qur?an

A MANIFESTO FOR ISLAMIC REFORM
Monday, 3rd November 2008 at 5pm

A MANIFESTO FOR ISLAMIC REFORM
Tuesday, 4th November 2008 at 7pm

Both lectures will take place at
WOLFSON COLLEGE
Oxford University
Click here for map.

FREE ADMISSION ? ALL WELCOME
Refreshments will be served
For further details email:mailto:info@meco.org.uk

654
Many of those who follow volumes of hearsay fabrications titled hadith (sayings falsely attributed to Muhammad), surely will fall for stories like this without questioning them. This is one of the many fabricated contemporary hadith, like the conversion stories about Neil Armstrong and Captain Custo in the past.

Browsing the list of patents issued in a particular week, one will notice that the followers of hadith and sunna are in the bottom of the list despite their more than a billion population, which they brag about. Since Muslims abandoned the Quran and followed hadith and sunna instead, they have lost their leadership in science and technology. Now they suffer from inferiority complex and resort to delusion and self-deception. What a disgrace! To learn the causes of regression and how to reform, please read Manifesto for Islamic Reform at www.islamicreform.org

Peace,
Edip

655
Correction:

Trial: Since for some participants this will be the first paltalk experience, there will be a gathering at Islamic Reform room on 18 October 2008 Saturday at 9 AM Pacific Time. The names of the participants should be included into the membership list.

656
Peace Ayman: You may revise the following invitation and then consult me for the final version:
 
Niteneen: a Divine Sign or Trial?
Debaters: Edip Yuksel vs. Ayman ......
Time: 19 October 2008, Sunday, 9 AM Pacific Time
Mode: Virtual audio and video
Program: Paltalk
Room: Islamic Reform under the category Religion and Spirituality. The room will open half an hour before the debate.
How: For better access download the free program from www.paltalk.com.
How 2: As an alternative, access the room via  http://express.paltalk.com/index.html?gid=1180111535
Duration: Two hours.
Rules:
  • Equal time for each party.
  • If a party does not use the allocated time for a round he looses the time.
  • If a debater talks more than five minutes without interruption, he may be interrupted by the moderator to give the opponent chance to respond.
  • The first hour of the debate parties will initiate their arguments and will question each other.
  • The second hour, the audience will be given chance to pose questions.
  • Each debater has the chance to address to the same question. If the debate needs more time, then another date could be suggested.
Trial: Since for some participants this will be the first paltalk experience, there will be a gathering at Islamic Reform room on 18 November 2008 Saturday at 9 AM Pacific Time. The names of the participants should be included into the membership list.
 
PS: We need applicants/candidates for room administration and moderator position. We also need technical help to record the debate.

You are also invited to become a member of a low activity email group at:

http://groups.google.com/group/19org

Peace,
Edip

657
Forty Plus Grumpy Old Men and My Son

Edip Yuksel

October 2008

I had never seen a class like that. Neither as a student nor as a professor. It was not a regular class. I was conducting an investigation and going to interview a group of selected people there. There were 42 men in the room, lined up by the wall. All were men. I mean, all male, and all white! No black, no brown, no red, no yellow, no rainbow.... Five had beards, four mustaches, one had large mutton-chops, at least two were bald and more than half wore bow-tie. Seven of them had no citizenship; eight were originally from Virginia, seven from Ohio, four from New York and Massachusetts. None from Arizona or Washington, none from Oregon, Colorado or Florida... None had pony tail, nor wore T-shirt. Six James, four Johns, three Georges... No Mike, no Bob, no Elvis, no Chang, no Arjun, and no Muhammad...

This was my younger son's classroom, and I was looking at the pictures of the presidents parading on the wall, to see whether my older son would one day fit this exclusive club. I know that there are thousands of American families who are looking at their teens as if they are looking at the childhood of a future president. Though I have conflict of interest in sharing our strategy with the competitors, I will share with you my son?s quest to climb the political Everest.  Of course, aspiring to be the next president of the USA is like aspiring to win a lottery. So, I decided to study the statistics and groom my son accordingly.

Their ages ranged between 42 and 69. If the cranky old man who recently sang "bomb, bomb, bomb" win this election, then the range would increase by about ten percent. I was surprised to learn that seventy percent of the class was veterans! More than half of the presidents, twenty three of them, served in our government's pastime; wars! Only fifteen presidents did not preside over war during their terms; they were perhaps busy with covert operations or using dictators to increase the market for arms sale.

One crippled, one dwarf, and none was blind. Eleven Episcopalians, ten Presbyterians, five Methodists, five deists, four Baptists, four Unitarians, and only one Catholic. No Hindu, no Buddhist, no Jewish, no Sunni, no Shiite, and none were atheists. All had a solemn, serious look on their faces, except the five men closest to the door, starting with the Catholic, had smiles (or smirks, depending on your political affiliation) on their faces. Eight had no college education, and at least one could act like an idiot. Only 12 out of 42 presidents had no military experience. Six of them owned slaves, three had alcohol problem, eight had proven extramarital affair, and three had out of wedlock children. Though a great majority of them declared wars against poor and remote countries, killing and massacring millions of civilians, only two murdered men in peace time, if there was any. Though almost all were assumed to be crooks, with the exception of one, none showed the courage and naivet? to challenge that assumption publicly. Ironically, the only one who denied his crookedness was forced to resign!

Well, looking at the names and background of the 42 presidents, my older son?s chance is even slimmer than the chance of a USA president not declaring war to this or that "evil" country thousands of miles away. Three Georges, four Johns, and six James do not comfort me about my politically savvy son?s prospects! My son's chance for the top office, after Nine Eleven, is less than a former student of mine named Dusty Broom! Under a dizzying propaganda against Muslims by the coalition of Armageddon-freaks and the Oil/Weapon industry, Yahya Rashad Yuksel, born from Kurdish and Persian parents perhaps has no chance.

But, if senator Barack Hussein Obama, (Mr. H In-the Middle) becomes the 43rd president, then there could be some hope. It would be a big black and foreign-sounding crack in the pigment-free glass ceiling. As a mockery of the First Amendment, Barack Obama was forced to declare that he is not a Muslim but a Christian. He is expected to show off sipping wine pretending that it is the blood of his savior and eat holy cookies pretending it to be his flesh. He will get more votes if he releases the pictures of him participating in this pretentious holy cannibalism. We also know that even if he declares his Christianity 666 times, the religious right would not vote for him. He shares the same name with a dictator that was propped-up by the USA who was used and finally disposed for the barbaric crimes he committed with our support and supervision. Do you remember W's secretary of defense shaking hands with him? But, if Senator H wins the presidential election, it would be a profound fulfillment of ?what goes around comes around.? Or a prophetic nominal reincarnation!

Let me go back continue sharing with you our family secret. My wife and I are two immigrants whose dreams were interrupted in their birth countries (Iran and Turkey) because of political and religious oppression. We are having derivative dreams through our offspring and we are shooting for the highest. We are raising two sons, Matine and Yahya, with ambitious long term agenda. The younger one is groomed to receive a Nobel Prize in a scientific field and the older one is expected to be the first Muslim president of the USA. For the summary of their progress report, see the footnote, which I had to delete because it was too impressive and would prematurely destroy the dreams of many parents in the competition.

You may blame us for pushing them too hard. To the contrary, we are not. Well, let me not talk on behalf of my wife, who is not even aware that I am letting our family cats out of the bag. No I am not pushing my sons too hard; but I confess that I have pushed them surreptitiously. I used my persuasive skills acquired through my philosophy and legal education and practice. I convinced them to be the best of whatever they choose to be. The best cook, the best plumber, the best carpenter, the best teacher, the best engineer, the best doctor, the best writer, the best mathematician, the best looser, the best of whatever... And one has so far chosen to be a scientist, and the other a politician.

Two major statistical Himalayas are stacked against my older son: religion, genetic origin, and name. Perhaps, at this point I do not need to worry much about the first, since my son does not subscribe to my theology; he has yet to pick one. He followed my advice of not following his parents? religious conviction blindly. There is still another option: Yahya could transliterate his name into Latin, John. He could also change his last name Yuksel with its English meaning, Excel. (Yahya is the Arabic version of Yashua?s contemporary Yuhannan. Neither of them would turn their heads had their friends called them Jesus or John the Baptist). So, the mutated name John R Excel would appeal to the xenophobic Americans.

But, I am sure that the Carl Roves of the future would dig his past, unveil the name change, the meaning of R, the story about his name. Millions of Bible-Gun-Flag clinging Trinitarians would be tempted to declare him as the anti-Christ. If religious and nationalistic hormones were not sufficient to defeat him, cons would just add the most potent one, sex hormones, to the cocktail. They would easily bamboozle the intellectually challenged masses. Perhaps, they would even go further and declare him to be an elite, too smart to be their president; "Yahya is not an idiot like you, he is an elite; so do not vote for him" could be the slogan of their last resort. My only hope is that by the time my son reaches his 35th year in 2025, this paranoid environment would fade away and the number of hormone-addicted zombies would go down.

Adherents.com lists the religious affiliations of presidents. Episcopalians and Presbyterians win in numbers. Despite their great population, there was only one Catholic president, JFK, and he was shot to death. I like Quakers and their social and political stance, yet one of the two Quakers was Nixon, the officially proven crook! As it seems, to increase his chance, my son needs to join a sect of Christianity. Though it is my son's choice, but personally, I will never approve let alone encourage my son's affiliation with any of these polytheistic (Trinitarian) religious groups. However, there is better news:

?One of the most over-represented religious groups among U.S. presidents is Unitarianism. Despite merging with Universalism in the 1960s, the combined proportion of Unitarian Universalists in the U.S. population is just 0.2% of the population (one in every 500 Americans). Yet there have been 4 Unitarian presidents.?

You know by now that I am a Muslim, though a reformist one. When my thirteen years-old son who somehow decided to replace Stanford University, his dream college since his fifth grade, with the University of California at Berkeley, he asked me whether Berkeley was among the so-called "Ivy League" universities. To learn more about Ivy colleges, I visited Wikipedia and there I learned that Harvard was founded by Unitarian Universalists. My curiosity about UU led me their website and then to their church in my neighborhood. I never feel comfortable in any church because of their idol-worship, warmongering, jingoism, irrationalism, anti science attitude, and regressive political agenda. Yet, I felt at home at the Uniterian Universalist church. I have been attending their meetings occasionally and I consider them as muslims without capital letter, that is, those who peacefully surrender to God alone.

Back to the presidents. The Unitarian presidents were John Adams, John Quincy Adams, Millard Fillmore, and William Howard Taft. Considering that the freethinkers or deists such as George Washington, Thomas Jefferson, Abraham Lincoln, and Andrew Johnson who did not join any church and had problem with deity of Jesus, the number of monotheists reaches to eight presidents. If we also include the only Jehovah Witness, Dwight D. Eisenhower, then the number reaches nine.

So, if Barack Hussein Obama wins this coming 2008 presidential election, then Yahya Rashad Yuksel, has a chance to add a few more cracks, perhaps a hole in the glass ceiling, and win the presidency in 2025! However, if Mc Caine (Gun and Flag) and Ms Palin (Bible and Sex) win this election, then my son should replace his American dream with a lifelong nightmare, together with other Americans who do not own seven houses, 13 cars, and do not make 5 millions a year while singing "bomb, bomb, bomb" in the shower.

I will end this article with a poem I wrote together with Yahya who recited it at Tucson Obamafest:

Yesterday, Today, Tomorrow

Yesterday, we were blinded in a holy smoke
We elected Republicans who are pros to provoke
We trusted snakes, oilmen, merchants of arms
Faith-healers, war-mongers with cunning charms

Today, we inherit an economy worse than hurricane
The culprits now have the audacity to prop up McCane
Today, we are hated abroad, looming disasters are big
Yet, they wave a plain lipstick to fool us with an old rig

Senator who cannot count the fancy houses he owns
Wants us to believe that he understands Janes and Jones
He is tough, he sings "bomb, bomb, bomb;" he is a hero!
He will wage seven wars with a budget far below zero

Today we are going to choose our tomorrow!
No more plunder, no more wars on the borrow!
We shall work harder, smarter; we shall unite
To peace, progress, and egality we TeenDemocrats invite

Let's end this era that's brought far too much drama
Everyone put your hands together for Barack H. Obama!!!

658
General Issues / Questions / Re: Oral Debate between Ayman and Edip...
« on: October 05, 2008, 01:10:05 PM »
A few questions: Can someone answer these questions?

1. Did God give rashid abundant wealth?
2. Did he have children?
....

A futile attempt to attack Rashad. Anthony tries to hurl some mud through his questions yet the direction of the mud is based on getting the Quranic chronology of the description backwards. In other words, his questions are having a silly ride on a boomerang. I am not sure whether he does it deliberately or by ignorance, his prejudice and lack of appreciation of "one of the greatest" signs is obvious from his expressed intention.

According to the Quran, the prototypical unappreciative challenger rejected the divine nature of the Quran and THEN he was subjected to the 19, not the other way around. So, Anthony might wish to twist the facts, but Rashad does not fit this description. He changed his mind after the discovery of the 19 and after witnessing its great paradigm changing message.

With the advent of the fulfillment of the prophecy in 1974, we are all described by verse 74:31. So, the question is: which group do we belong to?

1. The hypocrites and unappreciative people who will fall into a fitna (trial, torturing test) by not comprehending the role of 19 and ask "What God means by this?"

2. Those whose acknowledgment increases by witnessing the great prophecy containing an extraordinary philosophical evidence/proof for the divinity of the Quran and its protection with an embedded mathematical design.

3. The Christians and Jews whose doubts about the authenticity of the Quran is removed through the number 19.

Yes, which of the three groups above do we belong to?

Peace,
Edip

659
Ayman:

I did not get your word regarding the best time interval for the inspeak or paltalk debate on October 19, 2008 as we have agreed.

If you are living in the USA, I think that a two hour period between 9-12AM (that is, 9-11 or 10-12) Pacific time would be better and it would accommodate those who live in Europe or Asia.

What do you think?

Those who would like to get exact information about the program (Inspeak or Paltalk), room name, and the hour of the debate, please subscribe to our low activity group at:


http://groups.google.com/group/19org


A Note for those who live in Europe and Turkey: I will be giving several lectures at Oxford University and London between November 3-5; and again several lectures and a TV program in Istanbul between November 6-10. I will inshallah post the specifics at the group address above later.

I you wish to discuss this issue please visit the following link and post it there.

http://free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9597165.0



660
General Issues / Questions / Nothing but Hellfire?
« on: October 02, 2008, 11:11:23 PM »
Peace Anthony,
Unfortunately, many 19ers falsely quote this "over it is 19" part in isolation to imply that "over it is 19" refers to the great reading and a bunch of other things (the golden ratio, etc...). They take advantage of naive English speakers who will not verify the information and look in the original text to see that in Arabic there is no gender neutral "it" and the passage actually has "3alayha" which literally means "over her" and the Arabic word "quran" is masculine while "saqar"/scorcherer/fire is feminine. So "over it" is actually refering to nothing but the hellfire.

For those who would like to see the hadith-sunna-based distortions made on verses of chapter 74 in opposition to 20:114, please see my exposition titled Which one do you see: Hell or Miracle? at:

http://www.19.org/index.php?id=14,175,0,0,1,0

No wonder Ayman cannot witness Quran's great signs: His eyes and mind are clouded with the smoke of Hellfiire, "Nothing but Hellfire!"

Peace,
Edip




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