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Topics - Cerberus

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Off-Topic / Maybe the Great Flood, according to Astrahasis, 2000 BC
« on: January 23, 2017, 04:04:04 PM »
?Dismantle your house,
Forsake possessions and save your life.
Build a boat, roof it like the Apsu
So the sun cannot see inside it!
Make upper decks and lower decks,
The tackle must be very strong,
The bitumen must be firm.?

[Atrahasis brings his family and all kinds of animals on board. Seven days and nights later?]

?Adad [the storm god] begins to roar in the clouds.
The god they hear, his clamor.
Atrahasis brings pitch to seal his door.
By the time he has bolted his door,
Adad is roaring in the clouds.
The winds are furious as he sets forth,
He cuts the mooring rope and releases the boat.
The flood comes forth.
Its power comes upon the peoples like a battle,
One person does not see another,
They cannot recognize each other in the catastrophe.
The deluge bellows like a bull,
Like a wild ass screaming, the winds howl,
The darkness is total, the sun is gone,
The clamor terrifies the great gods themselves.?

Off-Topic / God
« on: December 11, 2016, 03:20:15 PM »
There is this little voice in my head that calls for the right thing, and then there is that other voice, more catchy, dancing in my head telling me to do the alternatives. In order to hear that first voice, I'll literally have to drop everything I do, and be quiet for few seconds and listen to my deepest to hear that "consciousness" telling me what I should do. But it is easily ignored. Even goes unnoticed sometimes.

I used to think that is just my "consciousness", but then what am I, at that moment, if my consciousness says something and I do otherwise ?
If my reflection is right, then I'm just an actor, whose goal is to manifest God that is in me. So that is God telling me what I should do, not my consciousness. My consciousness is the one that chooses which way to go, so God says one thing, Satan says the other thing, my consciousness follows one way. So God is actually in here, with me, live streaming in my mind telling me what to do.. Maybe ?

I've been looking for God, and so far, all I have of God are the ideas that I acquired from reading books, some less holy than the others. however, these books, and these ideas stocked in my memory and understood by my logic, are easily forgotten at times, or just temporarily clouded, but that is very critical to the outcome of the situation.... I rather hear, or see God, even if It's not physically, just mentally. So as to never break the connection. If that is God in me, then I should listen to Him more carefully, and follow Him with my heart in peace.

"He is the First and the Last, the Evident and the Innermost... And He is with you wherever you may be. God is Seer of what you do."


Off-Topic / Survival of the fittest.
« on: November 30, 2016, 02:17:40 PM »
You should watch this

Can you see life ?

Off-Topic / What's today, yesterday and tomorrow ?
« on: November 24, 2016, 04:44:05 AM »

What is now ?

When does now becomes past ? after a millisecond ? An hour ? 

Where does "the past" go ? What remains from it ?

I think now is the action you are currently doing. I'm now writing this post. I don't know how much it will take of seconds but I'm writing it. After writing this, this will become the past. Where does it go ? It will have an impact. The fact that I wrote this no longer matter, what matter now is that someone will read/answer/react and make an action or not.

But where is Time in all this ? Does time even matter ? Is time a reality ?
I think reality is the action of now. Time is not. The past action is gone and what remains of it is the good/bad impact it has. On you, or anyone else.

To believe that there are 24 Hours in a day and 7 days a week and 365 days a year is kind of misleading. Thinking you have that much time in reality AND that you may have that much time for actions, is wrong.

We focus on the time rather than focus on the action. Time determines the now. Today becomes now. This week becomes now. etc.

But someone said, now is all there is !

I'd like to dive deeper in this concept of now, time, current actions, past actions...and perhaps extend it to the "life time" and the "straight path". Looking for more opinions  :eat:

General Issues / Questions / A straightforward example of the "Soul"
« on: November 01, 2016, 02:45:54 PM »
39:42 God seizes the souls at the time of their death; and for those that have not died, during their sleep. He then keeps those that have been overtaken by death, and He sends the others back until a predetermined time. In that are signs for a people who will think.

The verse above in chapter 39 speaks of the "Nafs" (commonly known as "soul") at both time of death and sleep.

You might think that the alarm clock wakes you up or that you wake up automatically at a certain time (scientifically the "biological clock") and sometimes you wake up before because you want to pee, sometimes way after. But, perhaps one day the alarm will keep on ringing and you won't wake up at all.

Now to go back on topic, the "soul" is the one thing you lose when you're sleeping (scientifically at a certain advanced stage of sleeping). You lose the ability to hear, see, think. You lose the control of your senses and you lose the control of the body you have. Your body, including all of its organs start to work by themselves, but then again, it is God who sustains all that.

Once you wake up, for any reason, the Soul is "activated" or put back in your body for you to control it and to live in this material world with the body as a "container", but still both the body and the soul makes your existence, at least in this life. Otherwise you'd be conscious wherever you were outside your body in your sleep.

Let me know what you think of all of this or just feel free to share your view in this subject.

Thank you for reading.

General Issues / Questions / Lost themselves in Sins.
« on: October 26, 2016, 12:56:58 AM »
46:26 And We had established them in the same way as We established you, and provided them with hearing, and eyesight, and hearts. But their hearing, eyesight, and hearts did not help them at all. This is because they used to disregard the revelations of God, and they will be surrounded by that which they used to mock.

16:63 By GOD, we have sent (messengers) to communities before you, but the devil adorned their works in their eyes. Consequently, he is now their lord, and they have incurred a painful retribution.,

11-116/117 BUT, ALAS, among those generations [whom We destroyed] before your time there were no people endowed with any virtue* - [people] who would speak out against the [spread of] corruption on earth -except the few of them whom We saved [because of their righteousness], whereas those who were bent on evildoing only pursued pleasures which corrupted their whole being,* and so lost themselves in sinning. Your Lord never annihilates any community unjustly, while its people are righteous.,

God is surely Merciful in His destruction. I can't imagine this earth at this point without the previous events. God is always acting.

Perhaps, the stories are repeating themselves, we shall then only await the same results.

Let the workers work!

Off-Topic / Feminism 2k16
« on: October 25, 2016, 01:54:20 PM »

<a href="" target="_blank" class="new_win"></a>

<a href="" target="_blank" class="new_win"></a>

How do you contain this ?

It's hilarious though.

Forum Suggestions / section for "pseudoscientifical" claims
« on: October 17, 2016, 10:50:33 PM »
There is this issue of people posting unbacked claims against scientifical evidence. I think they deserve a section called "Skepticals" or something so they can share their UFOs and Flat earth theories there.

 As for the moment I'm reading such posts in "Science" section itself and some other sections...which is dangerous considering the amount of guests reading through the forum and can considerate what is being said outrageous to basic reasoning and logic.

You may say: there is the "off-topic" section. Yes. However, people who want to present such ideas usually don't go for "off-topic" section and rather choose to put their threads in "Questions about Quran" or Science or some other section. Of course that may require a moderator intervention but maybe creating a specific section for them should resolve it ?

Main issue: The issue is readers or translators trying to get a more exact definition of "Salat" as "Prayer" therefore "Education-Process" was suggested as well as "Communion".

In the following set, Salat translation word will be used as "Salat" , as an undefined word, the verbs will be translated to "Do Salat".

  • Translation:Verily, God and His angels bless[Action of Salat]+[On] the Prophet: [hence,] O you who have attained to faith, bless him and give yourselves up [to his guidance] in utter self-surrender!
  • the root of the red word is SLW, the root that is directly associated to Salat as a prayer by translators and readers etc etc
  • All the occurences of the "Salat" and "action of Salat" that root from SLW have a stand-alone meaning, they were directly translated to Prayer such as in "Establish the Salat(Prayer)" and in some occasions translated to different world such as "Blessing" whenever it didn't make sense. Bottom line, these words cannot really be used to understand what is the meaning of the Salat as they refer to the word itself.
  • "and be constant in prayer"Salat", and spend in charity,* and bow down in prayer with all who thus bow down."
    "And seek aid in steadfast patience and prayer"Salat(plural): and this, indeed, is a hard thing for all but the humble in spirit"
    "hence, prayDo Salat+TO thy Sustainer [alone], and sacrifice [unto/to Him alone]."
    "Verily, God and His angels blessDo Salat+ON the Prophet"
    "Say, My Contact Prayers My Salat, my worship practices, my life and my death, are all devoted absolutely to GOD alone, the Lord of the universe.,"
    "They said, "O Shuayb, does your contact prayerSalat(plural) order you that we leave what our fathers served, or that we do not do with our money as we please? You are the compassionate, the sane!" (An individual act that Shuayb used to do frequently)
The above are the words that roots from SLW and that are directly linked to Prayer, eventhough their occurences show no definition and stand alone explaining themselves. Which leads to stipulations.

More occurences here

Below are the other words, that kind of look like "Salat" and hold its root alphabets as well as in their usage yet believed to have a different root word WSL. However, in every occurence they explain themselves in their context and ALL of them share clear similar meanings.

  • Translation: and who keep together what God has bidden to be joined,* and stand in awe of their Sustainer and fear the most evil reckoning [which awaits such as do not respond to Him];
  • Looks exactly like the red in the previous image right ? However, it isn't read the same way because of the diacritical marks, that's why it is considered a different word with a different root WSL.
  • In every occurence, the word explains itself in its context: it usually means: "join" "Reach" or "connect" "link"
    "..Never shall [thy enemies] attain to thee!"
    "But that which is assigned to the beings associated in their minds with God does not bring [them] closer to God - whereas that which is assigned to God brings [them but] closer to those beings to whom they ascribe a share in His divinity.* Bad, indeed, is their judgment!
    "who break their bond with God after it has been established, and cut asunder what God has bidden to be joined(or linked), and spread corruption on earth: these it is that shall be the losers."(And what exactly did God order us not to break/cut and that should be Linked/joined ?)
    ".. We have caused this word [of Ours] to reach mankind"

More occurences here

I'll leave the analysis to the readers on whether or not, the words that "root from WSL" can explain the words that are directly associated to "Prayer" i.e root from SLW.

This is a response to this

Finally, excuse any english mistakes, I'm not english. Also, this gave me a headache to arrange and clarify. I hope it's useful.

General Issues / Questions / the Inner-self, Hell, Heaven and Death.
« on: September 10, 2016, 08:35:45 AM »
This subject is related to the post of Man Of Faith originally in this thread in response to some of my questions.

This is an analysis(somehow) of my " classic sometimes sectarian influenced" view of Inner-self/hell/heaven/death and Man Of Faith's view

I also recommend reading it all before attempting to answer any part of it.

Here is the post:
Quote from: Cerberus on September 06, 2016, 11:22:09 PM
We might agree that Quran, like previous Scriptures, is describing the "Way" to "earning a reward".

That is one way of seeing it. Well, Quran does describe a way.
Is the detachment from the body (in this world) the reward ?

If to keep it simple, yes. In Jehennom you have a body whereas in "Heaven" you have not.

It seems that it could easily (the detachment from the body or bodily as you call it) be a consequence of following the Way ?

Red: "Attachment to bodily" is not really I who call it but that is what the term Jehennom means. It is a kind of descriptive term, could be regarded as a "code name", which means "External Attachment Integrity Thereof", i.e. the word in morphology reads it out loud descriptively what it means. The language functions the same when you use the letter 'heh' as personal pronoun, i.e. when you say who/which. The word Jehennom uses the root Jiin-Nun-(Nun) which you are probably familiar with, but which word does not mean invisible but one's covering. Al-Jinn is general for everything which covers, i.e. the bodily.

If one does follow the taught way of abstention from the bodily the result is detachment. You reap what you have sown. This is because you become absolute, much which is a remnant teaching in Hinduism as a fragment of truth in religion, you become al-rahman al-raheem (totally complete), and in Hinduism the condition is called Brahman ironically enough. The underlying purpose in your life is to nurture your spirit which is under delusion from the body preventing it from growing in being. Your person is like a seed needing to be cultivated inside a foreign body under the delusion that you have identity with it. That seed is your true person whereas the body is your false identity, it was made to you as a contradiction on Earth. Quran does frequently speak of Jinn and Naas and it does not refer to invisible beings versus humans but one and the same person who has a "body and spirit/soul". This is where you are required to make a clear separation between the bodily and the spiritual, much like our friend Jesus is seen teaching in the Biblical Gospels. If you can do that you can also see God for what God is, i.e. God's nature. "God" is not at all what most Abrahamic faith followers think, even Christians it seems.

Is accomplishing that "detachment" what you may call "Heaven" "Jannah" ? And Falling into the "bodily" (temptations,wordly desire etc) what you may call Hell "Jahannam" ?

Well rounded up.

What about death ? after death ?

Death is just part of the trickery. If you are not ready you will transfer your Nafs (seed or "Integrity Forth Spirit") into another body with a new bodily identity so you will live a fate which is recurring. You also transfer the progress of your Nafs and this remains the same and you are not unjustly losing any progress. If you have not progressed at all but turned in the negative direction into darkness this is also evident in who you will be thereafter. This is also a reason for the state of the Earth today 2016 with many mentally unstable people, fights, because they have degraded spirits malfunctioning. They are not more than beasts being victims of the body's instinct, and we know that "Satan is of the Al-Jinn". The weaker the spirit the heavier is the "incursion" of the bodily, and could be seen as animalistic behavior, and we know that the human's body is a primate.

This could most likely be connected to Jesus' saying "let the dead bury their dead" referring cryptically to that dead or alive in the flesh with no spirit still signifies lifelessness. His saying is very sarcastic but yet true, he meant to come about blunt in order to shock his audience into reflection. This was his methodology and the pedagogy works very well as you reach the subjects psychologically. Not all tolerated his method of teaching though so he was eventually persecuted, but mostly because his teachings were deemed blasphemous towards their perception of "God", i.e. when he clearly called himself in association with "God". Actually he taught what I am teaching in this forum generating mixed responses. People could be regarded as more advanced and educated than his audience 2000 years ago, but despite this many do not follow my further expanded intricacy making the subject more elaborate and advanced revealing the absolute nature. But most people did not understand Jesus 2000 years ago but made him the exclusive "son of God" and then worshiped exclusively while he himself said that "you can all be like me, children of the abbu", and this delusion lives on still in this millennium while you would expect that people were reevaluating what he said in a new light.

So strengthen the Being by separating from that which does not strengthen but weakens the Being. Soundness is a good way, logic is a linguistically adapted form of soundness, and the word Se-la-ma means that something is "spirit-like" as in whole/sound. Be aware of when Satan is causing you to various reactions in life and prevent those undesired reactions. The body should not affect any of your decisions but they should stem from pure logic. Emotions are driven by the instinct so you must learn that they are part of your negative identity. Heck you should not even become angry even if this reaction is hard to control when under provocation, particularly from lifeless people if you are spiritually ascended and struggle with new hurdles. Anger is a sin and such must be cleansed (sin in "God"'s faith's perspective is everything which is not constructive and has no practical use). It might sound extremist, but copulation intercourse has no practical use except exclusively pleasing the body besides the reproduction of new bodies in this world.

This same what I teach above Jesus taught 2000 years ago in saying: "Moses said that you should not kill, but I say that you should not even be angry with your brother". I taught you that anger is of the instinct and anger further leads to possible violence by not resisting provocation by other. Jesus' teachings as well as the Mosaic law may be using the Semitic word "qatal" so the teaching might not be so colorful but the original law said: "Do not go offensively/defeating", but since qatal was twisted into meaning kill later so then the law also became changed. So the escalation is probably from being angry towards wishing to defeat your subject. When you become angry you tend to wish to defeat others to a greater extent. But before you become angry the first warning signal is that you are emotionally affected by what has been said or acted and you have no resistance to the ignorance and misbehavior of people. Then after you are emotionally affected a sign is that the previously pale/uncolored face begins to become red if you let it escalate. You begin to enter a preparation to enter combat. In children who have more difficulties controlling themselves due to immaturity this can quickly be seen if a child is being bullied because they give in to Satan more quickly. Also when there is no one who they perceive as an authority (e.g. adults) they will show distinctly egotistical indications among other children. Much of this is settled through discipline, but the innate want is still inside the child, and this want continuous in adult age even if we normally employ decently non-violent ways as this is how we were reared.

But in religiously brainwashed people this might exclude infidels and that you can exploit weak people. In humans there is an instinct which is "to dominate" and when you begin to release reward hormones for the thrill of being in charge you might employ dubious methods exploiting others, and you might prefer to do the least among your "servants". You can see signs of Satan in a multitude of people all around you. I am sure you can recall by reflection countless times you have been affected by Satan yourself. If you cannot I am sure you are insincere or you are a miraculous exception. Because if you had been ready previously you would not be here in this world now and the ultimate finishing does seldom occur except in older age.

You might be hearing more.

Be well

Now that was the post that this post is going to be based on. So put your seat belt on.

Is the detachment from the body (in this world) the reward ?
If to keep it simple, yes. In Jehennom you have a body whereas in "Heaven" you have not.

Is accomplishing that "detachment" what you may call "Heaven" "Jannah" ? And Falling into the "bodily" (temptations,wordly desire etc) what you may call Hell "Jahannam" ?
Well rounded up.

Looking at these two statements.Based on the state of "inner-self" 'Nafs' do you reach Jannah/Jahanam as a place(first quote) or as a state of "being" (2nd quote) ?

Death is just part of the trickery. If you are not ready you will transfer your Nafs

First thing that draw my attention: Nafs or more commonly known as "inner-self". Quran speaks of the "Nafs" very often in such:
And Allah would not ever have wronged them, but they were wronging (themselves) their 'Nafs'.

Although classical views of nafs simply refer it to "yourself" as "whatever you think you are" probably why there are some misconceptions out there.

While making this post I found  this Sufi website that highlighted the three state of "Nafs" mentioned in the Quran:

  • The commanding soul "Al-Ammara" (Nafs that commands to 'wrong/evil' )as in
    And I do not acquit myself. Indeed, the "soul" 'Nafs' is a persistent enjoiner of evil, except those upon which my Lord has mercy. Indeed, my Lord is Forgiving and Merciful." 12:53
Imam Baghawi (ra) says regarding the Nafs al-Ammara:
The Nafs al-Ammara has Shaytan as its ally. He promises it great rewards and gains, but casts falsehood into it. He invites it and entices the soul to do evil. He leads it on with hope after hope and presents falsehood to the soul in a form that it will accept and admire.

  • Nafs al-Lawwama (The Self-Accusing Soul )as in:
    [Shakir]Nay! I swear by the self-accusing "soul" 'Nafs'. 75:2

Ibn al-Qayyim says regarding Nafs al-Lawwama:
It has been said that the Nafs al-Lawwama is the one, which cannot rest in any one state. It often changes, remembers and forgets, submits and evades, loves and hates, rejoices and become sad, accepts and rejects, obeys and rebels. Nafs al-Lawwama is also the Nafs of the believer?.It has also been mentioned that the Nafs blames itself on the Day of Qiyamah - for every one blames himself for his actions, either his bad deeds, if he was one who had many wrong actions, or for his shortcomings, if he was one who did good deeds. All of this is accurate.

  • Nafs al-Mutma?inna (The Soul at Peace) as in:
    O "soul" 'Nafs' "that art at rest"(confident,peaceful,..) Return to your Lord, well-pleased (with him), well-pleasing (Him), So enter among My servants, And enter into My garden. 89:27-30
Imam Baghawi (ra) says regarding the Nafs al-Mutma'inna:
The Nafs al-Mutma`inna has an angel to help it, who assists and guides it. The angel casts good into the Nafs so that it desires what is good and is aware of the excellence of good actions. The angel also keeps the self away from wrong action and shows it the ugliness of bad deeds. All in all, whatever is for Allah and by him, always comes from the soul which is at peace.

Now this being said, I would like you to relate to the three state of "Nafs" mentioned above to what you said specially regarding the following concept:

If you are not ready you will transfer your Nafs (seed or "Integrity Forth Spirit") into another body with a new bodily identity so you will live a fate which is recurring. You also transfer the progress of your Nafs and this remains the same and you are not unjustly losing any progress.

Now when I mentioned death and after death, I was referring to it as in the "classical" view i.e the end of it i.e you die, and you wake up in a scary place with everyone around waiting for your judgement. However it seems that you consider death merely a change of body, i.e not related to the "End" (Judgement day) which is interesting but also needs some backing up (Preferably from the Scripture). But in the following I'll be using "death" as you expressed it i.e the change of body.

It implies that, there has to be a limited number of "Nafs" (souls) created by God (initially ? or still in progress?) and at the death of someone, the soul is taken, to be put in another body in another place on earth in another time. Now this also implies that between the stage of dying and to be given another body, the souls are somewhere, since the rate of death isn't the same as the rate of birth therefore there has to be some souls wondering around probably "unconscious" of their surrounding. However this also need some backing up. (preferably from the Scripture)

Speaking of the scripture, these verses come to my mind:
[Khan]And say not of those who are killed "qatel" in the Way of Allah, "They are dead." Nay, they are living, but you perceive (it) not. 2:154
[Shakir]Thou makest the night to pass into the day and Thou makest the day to pass into the night, and Thou bringest forth the living from the dead and Thou bringest forth the dead from the living, and Thou givest sustenance to whom Thou pleasest without measure. 3:27
and many other occurences of the same "bringing the living out of the dead.."

It's seems that the "death" you spoke about and the "death" that the Quran speaks of in many occurences never meant "the end". So if you can link your view to such verses, it would make much more sense.

This could most likely be connected to Jesus' saying "let the dead bury their dead" referring cryptically to that dead or alive in the flesh with no spirit still signifies lifelessness.

Referring to the spiritual dead as dead is reasonable and right. No problem here.
[Shakir]Surely you do not make the dead to hear, and you do not make the deaf to hear the call when they go back retreating. 27:80

However since I highlighted the difference between the "death" you spoke about and the classical view of death, I'd like to have your opinion on Judgement day as well.

I think these are the most parts I found intriguing in what you said.

And yes this is a long post, so anyone willing to participate should precise which part he/she is discussing for the sake of efficiency and clarity.

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