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Messages - Riz

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1
General Issues / Questions / Re: Is Fasting applicable for us ?
« on: August 08, 2011, 01:48:01 PM »
You are of those who believe in the message of the Quran, so of course you have to fast.  If you don't know which month it is for sure, then it is up to you to find out.  God will judge you based off of what you thought was right, but the command to fast is very clear.

2
Spencer is a truly vile hate mongerer.  What's ironic is that now he is saying that he takes no responsibility for having inspired the Norway terrorist, that his words are being misconstrued to paint him as a violent person!!!

Let him wait then, we too are waiting for the Judgement.

3
I would take anything Muhammad gave me and do whatever he asked.  Did he give us the hadith collections?

4
Questions/Comments on the Quran / Best Recitations of the Quran
« on: June 27, 2011, 11:49:37 AM »
Some of my favorite recitations of various Surahs. They're mostly all pretty uplifting, while some are just powerful (Naba, Naziat). During the past few months I've gone and memorized quite a lot of surahs on my drive to work because it's about an hour long. These are some of the ones which really stuck out for me. I've been going through a huge bout of depression for the past year. Listening/reciting to these and the rest of the Quran has rid me of my depression that I never thought anything could.

Surah Duha (The Morning Light) - Saad Al Ghamdi
http://youtu.be/BV5Pcr1sLqk

Surah Rahman (The Beneficient) - Kamal Uddin
http://youtu.be/vr8DR8frP_s

Surah Maryam (Mary mother of Jesus) - Saad Nomani
http://youtu.be/2CVJ-tIbvZo

Surah Lail (The Night) - Saad Al Ghamdi
http://youtu.be/RFQgeCmyX44

Surah Shams (The Sun) - Saad Al Ghamdi
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6jmfRnriKGA

Surah Naas (Mankind) - Saad Al Ghamdi
http://youtu.be/W5T1AbH3ywM

Luqman (verses 1-11) - Anas Al Ghamdi
http://youtu.be/x6LuiZWmL8w

Surah Abasa (He Frowned verses 17-42) - Moeed Mazeen
http://youtu.be/AWXDiuUHRFQ

Surah Insan (Man/Human) - Mishary Al Afasy
http://youtu.be/jLXSOgauzAA

Surah Naba (The Great News) - Abdul Baset Abdul Samad, Translation is read By Naeem Sultan.
http://youtu.be/0076IW-Wxl8

Surah Naba (The Great News) - Saad Al Ghamdi
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WWrnPpGJeyQ

Surah Naziat (Those that tear out) - Abu Bakr Ash-Shatri
http://youtu.be/6u9p69dsHZs

5
Yea I also believe it to be at Jabal al Lawz.  Please do share your answers to the 6 questions you posed.

6
Prophecies of the Quran / Re: Do we live in the end days?
« on: March 18, 2011, 03:41:31 PM »
I don't think we can ever know if we are close to the end as the Quran says that it will happen all of a sudden.  Also, although our Sun isn't expected to die out anytime soon and the universe will probably go one for many billions of years before it crunches or dies in some other way, the Quran says that humans will still be present when the end comes.  I don't think humans will be around for billions of years, we would certainly have evolved into something else anyways.  God knows best.  So I think it can happen any time.  The Quran describes the Sun exploding and the moon crashing into the Sun, both of which we know will eventually happen, but again it is billions of years in the future, so I think the judgement isn't waiting for that, it will happen before those things can naturally happen.  Our knowledge of the universe and reality is very limited though, so it is impossible to know when it will happen or if it will be a natural course of events which will lead up to it.

7
Archeology & History / Re: Was Moses in Egypt?????
« on: March 16, 2011, 09:54:22 AM »
I posted this in a different thread, but it applies here as well.

As far as the story of Exodus goes, it is easily verifiable and there is much evidence that supports it.  If you are interested, read "The Mystery of Israel in Ancient Egypt: The Exodus in the Qur'an, the Old Testament, Archaeological Finds, and Historical Sources ".   Here are some quick facts that you should consider.  

-The "Israel Stele" of Merneptah mentions Israel, and it refers to them as a group of people, not a nation.

-Unlike the biblical version, the Quran implies that the group that left with Moses was a rather small group.  The bible claims it was 2-3 million.  

-Unlike the Bible, the Quran says that Moses fled with his people and was not allowed to leave.

-Unlike the Bible, the Quran implies that there was only one Pharaoh, not two.

-Unlike the Bible, the Quran states that God preserved the body of the Pharaoh.  The fact that pharaohs were mummified was lost at the time of prophet Muhammad, so for the Quran to claim that God had somehow preserved the Pharaoh so he could be an example to people is certainly something to consider.  Also, this statement is not found in the Bible, so if Muhammad was just copying it, this was a rather bizarre and accurate statement of him to make.  The Quran mentions many nations and people being destroyed, but the Pharaoh is the only one who is said to have been preserved.

-Hamman is a clear reference to the high priest of Yamānu (also spelled Amon, Amoun, Amen, and rarely Imen or Yamun, Greek Ἄμμων Ammon, and Ἅμμων Hammon).  Note that the Pharaoh consults Hamman for religious matters in the Quran.  He also asks Hamman to make him buildings.  The construction of religious temples was done under the directions of the priests of Amun in ancient Egypt.  The Bible doesn't mention any such figure and the knowledge of the religious courts of ancient Egypt was lost at the time of Muhammad.  In fact most knowledge of the customs and language of ancient Egypt was lost by 300 BCE.

-The Pharaoh asked Hamman to build him a building so he could climb up there and see this God of Moses.  The idea of climbing a high place to speak with gods is in fact what the ancient Egyptians believed.  I've seen this idea mentioned in several documentaries on the History Channel and other channels.

-In the Quran, the Pharaoh keeps saying that he thinks that Moses just wants to drive the people out of the land.  Why does he keep saying this?  It is probably because not too long ago the Hyksos who were a semetic people like Moses had driven the Egyptians out of lower Egypt where the Pharoah now lived.  The Hyksos were defeated and kicked out of Egypt out only a few generations before Ramesses, so he feared that there would again by an invasion by semites.

-The Pharaoh is called Firaun al-awtad, which is often translated as the Pharaoh of might or the Pharah of the stakes, but when read in context, it is probably saying the Pharoah of high/many buildings.   Who was the Pharaoh who was obsessed with building?  Ramesses II.  All the things noted above also point to him being THE pharoah, and yes we do have his body.

-The "Israel Stele" was completed under Ramesses successor Merneptah soon after the death of his father.  In it he claims that the tribe of Israel is destroyed.  Clearly this wasn't the case.  The Pharaoh's would often claim victories when really they had lost.  This is apparent in some of the victories Ramesses II claimed because we also have records from the opposing side (the Hittites).

-The Quran says that the Pharaoh declared himself to be THE God (79:24).  Although Pharoahs were considered divine, very few of them actually made this claim.  As it happens, Ramesses II did declare himself to be God.  The inscription of him declaring this is found at his temple at Abu Simbel.  Again, the Pharaoh is the only one that the Quran says made such a claim and no one could have known this at the time of Muhammad.  

As far as the location of the real Mount Sinai, I think it has been discovered.  Everything is there.  A giant stone altar with engravings of the Egyptian bovine god Apsis, the cave of Elijah, the bitter springs, and even till this day quails descend by it in large groups which is what the Israelites were supposed to have eaten.  It is located in modern day Saudi Arabia.
http://www.arkdiscovery.com/mt__sinai_found.htm

I think the story of the exodus is actually one of the greatest signs that the Quran is indeed divine.  There are so many things in there that Muhammad just could not have known.

8
General Issues / Questions / Re: Former Muslim
« on: March 14, 2011, 05:07:19 PM »
Hello again Wakas,

Yes, I'm using an entirely new username, please forgive my secrecy but I trust you'll understand why :(

I gave the Jesus-myth as a short explanation as to the final days and weeks in the turning point of my understanding, after years of trying to reconcile truth and practise in Islam.

The historicity of Jesus - Jesus the man who was born of a virgin, who exists in no secular sources is in fact a recyled pre-Christian deity (the fact that such things as the virgin birth are accepted in Islam is testament that it recylced the same myths) such as Osiris. Looking in a simillar manner to other pre-Jewish and pre-Islamic/Christian events shows that most of the stories can be seen as having origins in Polytheistic cultures.

If you look further it spills out into the Judaism's Egyptian Captivity myth among other things (since many of these facts are included in the later religions) the original source for these stories being found in ancient art and writing. Genetic analysis of Jewish people corroborates movement contrary to the one found in mythology.

Again - the issues surrounding these things are not the sole reason why I'm no longer a Muslim, there are other issues pertaining directly with Islam itself and the nature of the God and I'd rather reacquaint myself with people right now than sit here writing long posts lol :D

How are you doing anyway Wakas?


I'm going to say that I haven't read the rest of the thread, but I just wanted to respond to this.

As far as Jesus is concerned, the idea that he is a recycled myth relies on really old and mostly bogus information.  Pretty much every major scholar on the subject agrees that Jesus was a historical figure.  The agreement is that he was a Jewish peasant and considered himself to be a prophet.   The fact that he himself is not mentioned in secular documents isn't really a big deal because his immediate family is well documented, aka his brother James and the Jerusalem church which was a wholly Jewish group, ie they didn't claim that Jesus was a man-god or anything like that.  They believed him to be a prophet.  This is what the Quran says as well.  I would recommend you read "Jesus, Interrupted" by Bart Ehrman.  Excellent book on New Testament scholarship.  From your post, it seems like you aren't very aware of what is known about the historical figure of Jesus, so if you are still interested, I would highly recommend it. It is a very easy read.

As far as the story of Exodus goes, it is also easily verifiable and there is much evidence that supports it.  If you are interested, read "The Mystery of Israel in Ancient Egypt: The Exodus in the Qur'an, the Old Testament, Archaeological Finds, and Historical Sources ".   Here are some quick facts that you should consider.  

-The "Israel Stele" of Merneptah mentions Israel, and it refers to them as a group of people, not a nation.

-Unlike the biblical version, the Quran implies that the group that left with Moses was a rather small group.  The bible claims it was 2-3 million.  

-Unlike the Bible, the Quran states that God preserved the body of the Pharaoh.  The fact that pharaohs were mummified was lost at the time Muhammad was a live so for the Quran to claim that God had somehow preserved the Pharaoh so he could be an example to people is certainly something to consider.  Also, this statement is not found in the Bible, so if Muhammad was just copying it, this was a rather bizarre and accurate statement of him to make.  The Quran mentions many nations and people being destroyed, but the Pharaoh is the only one who is said to have been preserved.

-Hamman is a clear reference to the high priest of Yamānu (also spelled Amon, Amoun, Amen, and rarely Imen or Yamun, Greek Ἄμμων Ammon, and Ἅμμων Hammon).  Note that the Pharaoh consults Hamman for religious matters in the Quran.  He also asks Hamman to make him buildings.  The construction of religious temples was done under the directions of the priests of Amun in ancient Egypt.  The Bible doesn't mention any such figure and the knowledge of the religious courts of ancient Egypt was lost at the time of Muhammad.  In fact most knowledge of the customs and language of ancient Egypt was lost by 300 BCE.

-The Pharaoh asked Hamman to build him a building so he could climb up there and see this God of Moses.  The idea of climbing a high place to speak with gods is in fact what the ancient Egyptians believed.  I've seen this idea mentioned in several documentaries on the History Channel and other channels.

-In the Quran, the Pharaoh keeps saying that he thinks that Moses just wants to drive the people out of the land.  Why does he keep saying this?  It is because not too long ago, the Hyskos who were a semetic people like Moses had driven the Egyptians out of lower Egypt where the Pharoah now lived.  They were driven out only a few generations before Ramesses.

-The Pharaoh is called Firaun al-awtad, which is often translated as the Pharaoh of might or the Pharah of the stakes, but when read in context, it is probably saying the Pharoah of high/many buildings.   Who was the Pharaoh who was obsessed with building?  Ramesses II.  All the things noted above also point to him being THE pharoah, and yes we do have his body.

-The "Israel Stele" was completed under Ramesses successor Merneptah soon after the death of his father.  In it he claims that the tribe of Israel is destroyed.  Clearly this wasn't the case.  The Pharaoh's would often claim victories when really they had lost.  This is apparent in some of the victories Ramesses II claimed because we also have records from the opposing side (the Hittites).

-The Quran says that the Pharaoh declared himself to be THE God (79:24).  Although Pharoahs were considered divine, very few of them actually made this claim.  As it happens, Ramesses II did declare himself to be God.  The inscription of him declaring this is found at his temple at Abu Simbel.  Again, the Pharaoh is the only one that the Quran says made such a claim and no one could have known this at the time of Muhammad.  

As far as the location of the real Mount Sinai, I think it has been discovered.  Everything is there.  A giant stone altar with engravings of the Egyptian bovine god Apsis, the cave of Elijah, the bitter springs, and even till this day quails descend by it in large groups which is what the Israelites were supposed to have eaten.  It is located in modern day Saudi Arabia.
http://www.arkdiscovery.com/mt__sinai_found.htm

I think the story of the exodus is actually one of the greatest signs that the Quran is indeed divine.  There are so many things in there that Muhammad just could not have known.

9
Forum Suggestions / Can't I browse articles by their date?
« on: January 01, 2009, 03:26:21 PM »
The old layout of FM used to have a link called "Whats New" or something of the sort.  This was really useful because I could easily check if any new articles had been posted.  The new layout doesn't have anything like that, or if it is there I don't see it.  I think it would be very helpful if this was put back in.

10
You made good points Edip.  Although what Spencer is pointing out isn't wrong, it is his purpose for doing so that is the problem.  He is reciting the worse actions of Muhammad to show that Islam is a terrorist's religion.  For what purpose?  He does it in crowds that cheer him on and leave the room with deep hate for Islam.  Perhaps if he made mention that these sayings and records of Muhammad are extremely unreliable, I would be a bit more understanding.  He doesn't report on the protests against extremism in Muslim nations (like the one after 9/11 in Iran), but only points out the negatives.  All he is doing is inciting hate.  It would be very easy to do that against Catholics by citing the words and actions of Popes or portraying Judaism as a genocidal religion by reciting parts of the Book of Joshua.

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