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Messages - Novice

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1
General Issues / Questions / Re: Confused by the following verse
« on: December 22, 2019, 11:45:13 PM »
Peace brother hawk99

She is referring to 3:133

وَسَارِعُوٓاْ إِلَىٰ مَغۡفِرَةٍ۬ مِّن رَّبِّڪُمۡ وَجَنَّةٍ عَرۡضُهَا ٱلسَّمَـٰوَٲتُ وَٱلۡأَرۡضُ أُعِدَّتۡ لِلۡمُتَّقِينَ

2
How can we have a choice before our creation and before we have the ability to exercise it?

3
Both are true.

Two contradictory statements cannot be true at the same time.


The two verses I quoted are clear. You can not perform an action unless it's willed by God.

You can perform an action with your free choice but the results are not as per your wish. They are either as per Allah's Law or in certain cases as per His "Mashe'at".

You can not decide to be guided.

You can decide to be guided but guidance comes from Allah. He guides those who seek it with sincerity.

You have a project, you want to succeed. It is God who decides the final result: the success or failure of your project.
You see first you decide to succeed in a project. It is your choice but results are either as per Allah's Law or His Mashe'at in certain cases.

The circumstances of life do not unfold as one wishes, it is the will of God. When misfortune strikes, it is also the will of God.

5:15    O people of the Book, Our messenger has come to you to clarify for you much of what you were hiding from the Book, and to pardon over much. A light has come to you from God and a clarifying Book.

5:16    God guides with it whoever follows His acceptance, to the ways of peace; and it brings them out of the darkness and into the light with His permission; and it guides them to a straight path.

Yes the words of Allah are true. He guides those who wants to be guided.

4
Please avoid any assumptions about my beliefs, this is not the purpose of this thread.
Everyone is free to act or believe.

You are contradicting yourself.

First you said divine will predates the personal will

and now you are saying

everyone is free to act or believe.

Which statement is true?

5
So you believe that humans will be punished for their divinely willed wrong actions. 

Please re-think.

6
Salam,
رجما بالغیب is interesting.

Peace

Yes it is interpreted as making conjectures in this verse but at other places they make it star missiles thrown on devils. Agree it is interesting.

7
In my humble understanding these ayats are telling that after God's revelation, conjectures or superstitions have no room in a believer's life. Fortune tellers and star readers are just guessing and have no knowledge of future.

8
Peace

Please back up your points with quotes...

No, If humans are intrinsically good then there was no need of guidance through messengers and books. 

2:28
قُلۡنَا ٱهۡبِطُواْ مِنۡہَا جَمِيعً۬ا‌ۖ فَإِمَّا يَأۡتِيَنَّكُم مِّنِّى هُدً۬ى فَمَن تَبِعَ هُدَاىَ فَلَا خَوۡفٌ عَلَيۡہِمۡ وَلَا هُمۡ يَحۡزَنُونَ

We said fall out of it all together, so when my guidance comes to you then whoever follows my guidance will have no fear on them and not they will grieve.

9
Salam Novice,

You are correct, the verse does speak to both Jinn and Humans. I can't conclude why they are both lumped together and whether the copper is meant for one and the fire for the other...The only observation to be made is that "copper" is a great conductor of energy and this is the only time we see it mentioned (all other verses deal with metal in a general form).

Salam Layth

May be the root ن ح س nūn ḥā sīn can give us some understanding. I am sorry but copper theory does not appeal to me as this root is used at two more places and does not convey the meanings of copper therein.


41:16 فَأَرۡسَلۡنَا عَلَيۡہِمۡ رِيحً۬ا صَرۡصَرً۬ا فِىٓ أَيَّامٍ۬ نَّحِسَاتٍ۬ لِّنُذِيقَهُمۡ عَذَابَ ٱلۡخِزۡىِ فِى ٱلۡحَيَوٰةِ ٱلدُّنۡيَا‌ۖ وَلَعَذَابُ ٱلۡأَخِرَةِ أَخۡزَىٰ‌ۖ وَهُمۡ لَا يُنصَرُونَ

54:19 إِنَّآ أَرۡسَلۡنَا عَلَيۡہِمۡ رِيحً۬ا صَرۡصَرً۬ا فِى يَوۡمِ نَحۡسٍ۬ مُّسۡتَمِرٍّ۬



10
Salam Novice,

Energy has a limit/form (when a lighting bolt strikes, it has a shape/form that can dissipate).

If we think of Jinn as energy being, and we consider that copper is a conductor for electricity - then it makes sense that they be struck with a material which can disrupt their path/flow.

Why else would the Quran speak specifically of copper and fiery projectors striking down those that try to take flight.

Salaam Layth

Thank you for your reply. I assume you are referring to 55:33-35 as the word copper نُحَاسٌ۬ is used only once in the Quran:

يَـٰمَعۡشَرَ ٱلۡجِنِّ وَٱلۡإِنسِ إِنِ ٱسۡتَطَعۡتُمۡ أَن تَنفُذُواْ مِنۡ أَقۡطَارِ ٱلسَّمَـٰوَٲتِ وَٱلۡأَرۡضِ فَٱنفُذُواْ‌ۚ لَا تَنفُذُونَ إِلَّا بِسُلۡطَـٰنٍ۬ (٣٣) فَبِأَىِّ ءَالَآءِ رَبِّكُمَا تُكَذِّبَانِ (٣٤) يُرۡسَلُ عَلَيۡكُمَا شُوَاظٌ۬ مِّن نَّارٍ۬ وَنُحَاسٌ۬ فَلَا تَنتَصِرَانِ

We see here address is to both Ins and Jinn. So what is the rational of striking Ins (human) with copper in your understanding?


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