i like to start this thread by making it clear that I am not here to engage in arguments with those who are sure that Saum is what traditionally people understand it to be and find the verses pertaining to Saum clear and making perfect sense.
Each person is responsible for what s/he believes and attributes to God. And I am responsible for what I believe and attribute to God.
I have for more than 20 years thought about these verses and commonly held understanding. At the university, I was in the Ramadan committee of the muslim student association, putting together handout on what voids and doesn't void fasting according to various schools of thought, like hanafi, Shafi, etc. I would go to tarawih prayers and of course to iftars and eid parties!
And for the past 20+ years, I have always been troubled with this whole month. i have read books on ramadan but something always felt amiss, never making sense. I have read mmkhan' mushu,Wakas, noshirk, and other threads/posts here and left with more questions. I like to look at these verses on Saum, which as translated really don't make much sense to me. Like to share my thoughts, questions, realizations, and hoping that someone here is more guided to understand God's truths.
last year, came to the realization how a lot of my understanding of commonly held beliefs are extra quranic. What I held to be true attributing to God are really not from God. And God has made it clear the consequences of saying God said something when it is not true.
For all those who find me lost, unbeliever, ignorant, etc - all I have to say is that you are entitled to your opinions. God knows me and who I am and what I am about and at the end of the day, that is all that matters.
And what matters is the Truth and what God said. Having said that, I like to look at verses 2:183 - 188
----- ------- -------- ---------- --------
Looking at verse 2:183:
If Siam is no food, no fluids, no sex from sunrise to night time for 3 days or 10 days or 30 days or 60 days or if it is not talking for any length of time...
MY QUESTION is: How does the act of not eating, not drinking, not having sex from dawn to night or not talking (as some believe) lead a person to becoming a muttaqi?
I don't get it. How does not having sex result in tattaqun? How does going without food and water for one month out of the year make one tattaqun?
Ok - if such abstention make you muttaqi then shouldn't we be doing that everyday of our lives?
Why only one specific month out of the year?
various translators have translated tattaqun differently.
2:183 (Asad) O YOU who have attained to faith! Fasting is ordained for you as it was ordained for those before you, so that you might remain conscious of God: -
2:183 (Y. Ali) O ye who believe! Fasting is prescribed to you as it was prescribed to those before you, that ye may (learn) self-restraint,-
2:183 (Picktall) O ye who believe! Fasting is prescribed for you, even as it was prescribed for those before you, that ye may ward off (evil); -
And so when reading translations, i don't just go by how the verses are translated. i also use corpus quran, word for word translation...and i think of the verses, the context and does it make sense.
God says he explains things and in the Koran, God defines tattaqun or who a muttaqi is.
The core message of the koran is crystal clear: to be a muttaqi. in many places God talks about righteousness, and what the day of judgment is about where basically the good things will be weighed against the bad. And God defines the characteristic of a muttaqi.
I just fail to understand how abstaining from eating, drinking and having sex will make you tattaqun?
Has abstaining from eating, drinking and sex lead to Muslims becoming tattaqun? I sure don't see that looking at the state of Muslims in the world.
---
I have so many more questions and much to say but will have to stop for today. I really would like to hear from others who have thought the same questions.
Each person is responsible for what s/he believes and attributes to God. And I am responsible for what I believe and attribute to God.
I have for more than 20 years thought about these verses and commonly held understanding. At the university, I was in the Ramadan committee of the muslim student association, putting together handout on what voids and doesn't void fasting according to various schools of thought, like hanafi, Shafi, etc. I would go to tarawih prayers and of course to iftars and eid parties!
And for the past 20+ years, I have always been troubled with this whole month. i have read books on ramadan but something always felt amiss, never making sense. I have read mmkhan' mushu,Wakas, noshirk, and other threads/posts here and left with more questions. I like to look at these verses on Saum, which as translated really don't make much sense to me. Like to share my thoughts, questions, realizations, and hoping that someone here is more guided to understand God's truths.
last year, came to the realization how a lot of my understanding of commonly held beliefs are extra quranic. What I held to be true attributing to God are really not from God. And God has made it clear the consequences of saying God said something when it is not true.
For all those who find me lost, unbeliever, ignorant, etc - all I have to say is that you are entitled to your opinions. God knows me and who I am and what I am about and at the end of the day, that is all that matters.
And what matters is the Truth and what God said. Having said that, I like to look at verses 2:183 - 188
----- ------- -------- ---------- --------
Looking at verse 2:183:
If Siam is no food, no fluids, no sex from sunrise to night time for 3 days or 10 days or 30 days or 60 days or if it is not talking for any length of time...
MY QUESTION is: How does the act of not eating, not drinking, not having sex from dawn to night or not talking (as some believe) lead a person to becoming a muttaqi?
I don't get it. How does not having sex result in tattaqun? How does going without food and water for one month out of the year make one tattaqun?
Ok - if such abstention make you muttaqi then shouldn't we be doing that everyday of our lives?
Why only one specific month out of the year?
various translators have translated tattaqun differently.
2:183 (Asad) O YOU who have attained to faith! Fasting is ordained for you as it was ordained for those before you, so that you might remain conscious of God: -
2:183 (Y. Ali) O ye who believe! Fasting is prescribed to you as it was prescribed to those before you, that ye may (learn) self-restraint,-
2:183 (Picktall) O ye who believe! Fasting is prescribed for you, even as it was prescribed for those before you, that ye may ward off (evil); -
And so when reading translations, i don't just go by how the verses are translated. i also use corpus quran, word for word translation...and i think of the verses, the context and does it make sense.
God says he explains things and in the Koran, God defines tattaqun or who a muttaqi is.
The core message of the koran is crystal clear: to be a muttaqi. in many places God talks about righteousness, and what the day of judgment is about where basically the good things will be weighed against the bad. And God defines the characteristic of a muttaqi.
I just fail to understand how abstaining from eating, drinking and having sex will make you tattaqun?
Has abstaining from eating, drinking and sex lead to Muslims becoming tattaqun? I sure don't see that looking at the state of Muslims in the world.
---
I have so many more questions and much to say but will have to stop for today. I really would like to hear from others who have thought the same questions.