Messages

1

Quranic Divinity / Re: Who was the first Muslim?

« on: April 27, 2016, 06:40:03 PM »

Have you ever visited Nepal, Recluse ?

Last year I had the fortune. On my first day at Pokhara, early at dawn our travel guide drove us to Sangarkot viewing site. I was wondering what the big deal was. I learned it soon enough. As the tip of the somber Annapurna range suddenly took a glorious golden hue at the moment of day-break, it was a spectacle to behold! Hardly have I ever seen such a marvel of nature with my own eyes. To experience this marvel one has to keep his eyes open for the exact moment of sunrise.


(Photo credit: https://alokalekhana.wordpress.com/2010/06/29/annapurna-peak-at-sunrise/)

Have you seen the marvel of the first day-break, Recluse?

By the ?first? day break I do not mean the first ever day-break in the history of the earth. The ?first day-break? happens every time the daylight outstretches the darkness of night. And every time it is a marvel.

Don?t get too weary of the night my friend, for the night gets darkest right before the dawn.

May Allah guide us to the straight way.

Regards,
Arman

2

General Issues / Questions / Re: Can we have concensus?

« on: April 12, 2016, 08:05:29 PM »

There is no earning or a free will  a predestinated world.
btw. No one is able to lie against Allah, including Iblies. "aghwaytanee" does not mean astray.
What we stand for is then also predestinated. I can not see how you make this logic work for yourself.
btw when the quran says that Allah will be The Judge on the day we rise, what exactly will He judge if He already had decided that I will do exactly what He programmed in me?

Salam Bender.

I see how you are looking for room in Qur?an to support your ideas. I?ll not attempt a rebuttal. Each of us are responsible for our own understanding.

I?ll however try to answer your question above in red; perhaps, this will help you or someone else:

God has not programmed anything in you. He has caused you to be. He has caused you to be the way you are. The way you are today, the way you will be tomorrow. The way you are born, the way you die ? all of it. He can and will judge what He causes to be. Like an author judges each of the characters in his novel and decides how each character end up being presented to the audience. Nothing can be held against God, like nothing can be held against the author for doing to the characters he himself caused to be in the first place.

I am, because My Master wants me to be. And my Master has absolute authority to judge me how He led me to be. It is only a mercy from my Master that He has given me the ability to think about the choices that I have and make up my mind  about those choices and I own only the choices that I make, not the outcome thereof. But those choices are no more independent of God's will than each wave of the ocean is independent of the ocean. Just like ocean is the platform upon which the waves exist - God's will is the platform upon which this universe exists.

Let me make up a case to illustrate how we are responsible for our choices about our actions but not the predestined outcome of the actions. Let?s say I conspire to kill my boss. I give him a cup of tea with poison. If Allah hasn?t prescribed death for him, one way or another he will skip the tea/poison and survive. But I will be held responsible to my Master for attempting a murder. On the other hand ? consider a different case - maybe I gave my boss a cup of exotic tea with completely benign intensions. My boss has a rare condition of extreme allergy to that drink which even he didn?t know. He drinks it and dies of allergy. That is the death of that person determined by God ? like every death is. Although on strict cause and effect consideration my action has killed my boss ? I?ll not be judged as a murderer. Because I am only responsible for what is in my heart.

The test is real. The test is for us. We are the ones who need to discover ourselves through these tests. God is the one who sets the tests to lead us to the destination that each of us deserve. But yes, on absolute basis God owns the responsibility of every action of every being in this universe. Because He causes everything to be. He owns the crime of the criminal and the suffering of the victim. He created many of us to struggle in His path and then rightfully earn the fruit thereof. He also created many of us to get astray and rightfully earn the result thereof. That?s why Qur?an says that Allah destined many of the men and jins for the hell (Ref 7:179). Indeed, He captures every point of observation and participates in every joy and pain through each point of observation that He created to explore His own creation. So, for Him it is a zero sum affair.

? ? ?

I don't recall saying that Iblis lied to Allah. That Allah led Iblis astray is of course a truth - it is all part of His plan. A being getting deviated due to its own choice and due to God's will are the opposite sides of the same truth. Because every being is caused to be by God.

BTW, what is your understanding of the term "aghwaytanee"? I took my understanding from Lane:

http://www.perseus.tufts.edu/hopper/text?doc=Perseus%3Atext%3A2002.02.0033%3Aentry%3DAgwAhu

But I am open to learning.

? ? ?

I believe that differences in these kind of subjects is not that important, because we all have different views, if it's not on this subject then for sure there is some other sensitive subject where we will differ in understanding.
 

This is the point where I do agree with you. The test is not how good we are at theology or how knowledgeable we are. Allah equipped each of us with different level of understanding, so we are only accountable to make the best use of that understanding which we have. Of course there will be differences in opinion and understanding. The real test is whether we can hold on to our faith by acting righteously throughout our life. As long as we agree on that we can coexist and grow together. And that takes me back to the point from where I started this thread.

May Allah guide us all to the straight way.

Regards,
Arman

3

General Issues / Questions / Re: Can we have concensus?

« on: April 10, 2016, 07:48:44 PM »

Salaam Arman,

I am convinced that the quran we have today (in it's totality) is "speaking" the truth.
No. But don't stop reading 
This is how I see it.
When you where born God knows that you have a maximum of 200 years to live if you live in the perfect way.
Every cigarette you smoke there will go 1 minute off from your optimal lifespan.
And so with every action.
Thus yes He knows your optimal lifespan but not when you will die, as it's your choice to smoke or not to smoke, of course UNLESS He speaks His word over you that you will die on time x, then you are predestinated.

If you think that God knows when you will die, then why will you take your son or daughter or mother or father or whoever to a doctor to heal him/her.
The doctor is useless, if God has determined that your son will live 87 years than it is even not needed to feed him when he is just a baby. God's word is will and if He decided 87 years of life for you son than do not feed him or take him to a doctor, God will take care of him and he will survive till he reaches 87.

Salam Bender.

[Salam Brother Someone? this reply applies for you as well.]

The way I see it is - your views do not add up with the following verses of Qur?an:

3:154   (And) later, from after the distress, He sent down upon you security ? slumber veiled a faction of you while certainly a faction themselves made their souls anxious believing about God beyond the truth ?assumptions of ignorance ? saying, ?Is there anything for us from the command?? Say, ?Indeed the command ? all of it ? is for God?. They hide in their souls what they do not make apparent to you. They say, ?If there happened to be anything for us in the command we would not have been killed here.? Say, ?If you happened to be in your houses, those upon whom murder was booked would have surely come out towards their death-beds.? And so that God could test what was in your breasts and that He might purge what was in your hearts, and God is Knowledgeable of what (you) have in the breast.

? ?

10:49   Say, ?I neither have power to harm my soul, nor to benefit (it) ? except whatever God wills. For every community there is a term ? so when comes their term there is no delaying by an hour, nor is there any advancing of it.?

? ?

7:185   Do they not watch over the empire of the heavens and the earth ? and whatever God has created of things ? and perhaps that their term has actually come near? So, in what narrative (حَدِيثٍ) after this will they put faith?

? ?

31:34    Indeed God ? with Him is the knowledge of the hour. And He sends down the rain ? and knows what is in the wombs. And no soul can figure what it will earn tomorrow and no soul figures in which land it will die. Indeed Allah is Knowledgeable, Aware.

(My personal translation, cross checking is recommended, emphasis added.)

Especially if one takes your understanding, the claim in 3:154 appears like an empty threat. In fact if I go by your logic our birth is also not decided by God ? it all depends on whether our parents chose to mate etc. Exalted be He! Above what they imply of Him.

By the way why are we going to hell if you murder someone? When you stand before Allah, you can defend yourself with: 
"well I was just helping you God.
I killed him when he was 35 years old and because the poor guy indeed died means that you already had determined that the poor guy will day at 35.
So I do not understand why you are judging me God, I was just helping you. I am killing in Your name."

I know that for some my view on this is shocking as this makes Allah not almighty according to some, but this is not the case.
Almighty is when you can do whatever you will without limits. And that is Allah, He does what He wills, that is Al Mighty.

I think you missed the point. Of course He can give me a brain damage or make me a zombie so that I will loose even to a frog. That is not the question I am asking.

I have clarified my understanding before, doing so once again, perchance someone listens.

Our parents do not create us or determine our birth. It is God who decides when each of us will come to the world. Our Parents just play along God?s will to earn the right of playing the role of parents, which too is predetermined for them. That is why our obligation to God supersedes our obligation to our parents.

The food that we eat is not ?produced? by us. Allah produces everything. We merely toil in the land and seas to earn our living which has been predestined. That is why we eat everything in the name of God.

When our children become sick and we go to the doctor, we are not fighting against death. We are merely playing our role predetermined by God to earn our satisfaction that we tried our best. That is why when our children die in spite of our best effort we have to accept the fate graciously.

Similarly when we earn the destination of the Garden or the Fire, we are not creating our destiny. We are merely earning our destiny. Guidance is only with God. He guides to the straight way whomever He wills.

Of course there will be people who will claim on the day of rising that they only executed God?s will. So did Iblis when he says? ?because you let me astray? (Ref: 7:16)?. But their execuse will not hold any water. While God determined our destiny (including that of Iblis) He gave us the free will to earn that destiny. We are responsible for how we excercised that free will? not the outcome thereof. And God is not unjust by an atom?s weight.

I have a couple of verses for you:
3:140 إِن يَمْسَسْكُمْ قَرْحٌ فَقَدْ مَسَّ الْقَوْمَ قَرْحٌ مِّثْلُهُ ۚ وَتِلْكَ الْأَيَّامُ نُدَاوِلُهَا بَيْنَ النَّاسِ وَلِيَعْلَمَ اللَّـهُ الَّذِينَ آمَنُوا وَيَتَّخِذَ مِنكُمْ شُهَدَاءَ ۗ وَاللَّـهُ لَا يُحِبُّ الظَّالِمِينَ

3:166 وَمَا أَصَابَكُمْ يَوْمَ الْتَقَى الْجَمْعَانِ فَبِإِذْنِ اللَّـهِ وَلِيَعْلَمَ الْمُؤْمِنِينَ
3:167 وَلِيَعْلَمَ الَّذِينَ نَافَقُوا ۚ وَقِيلَ لَهُمْ تَعَالَوْا قَاتِلُوا فِي سَبِيلِ اللَّـهِ أَوِ ادْفَعُوا ۖ قَالُوا لَوْ نَعْلَمُ قِتَالًا لَّاتَّبَعْنَاكُمْ ۗ هُمْ لِلْكُفْرِ يَوْمَئِذٍ أَقْرَبُ مِنْهُمْ لِلْإِيمَانِ ۚ يَقُولُونَ بِأَفْوَاهِهِم مَّا لَيْسَ فِي قُلُوبِهِمْ ۗ وَاللَّـهُ أَعْلَمُ بِمَا يَكْتُمُونَ

57:25 لَقَدْ أَرْسَلْنَا رُسُلَنَا بِالْبَيِّنَاتِ وَأَنزَلْنَا مَعَهُمُ الْكِتَابَ وَالْمِيزَانَ لِيَقُومَ النَّاسُ بِالْقِسْطِ ۖ وَأَنزَلْنَا الْحَدِيدَ فِيهِ بَأْسٌ شَدِيدٌ وَمَنَافِعُ لِلنَّاسِ وَلِيَعْلَمَ اللَّـهُ مَن يَنصُرُهُ وَرُسُلَهُ بِالْغَيْبِ ۚ إِنَّ اللَّـهَ قَوِيٌّ عَزِيزٌ

20:38  فَقُولَا لَهُ قَوْلًا لَّيِّنًا لَّعَلَّهُ يَتَذَكَّرُ أَوْ يَخْشَىٰ

And there are so many many more verses like this.
And think about the messengers, think about all the inspirations you get daily.

The word ?وَلِيَعْلَمَ?  can be translated as ?And to know..? as well as ?And to make known...?. Shahih International follows the second meaning in their translation, for example. I accept the second understanding for these verses because that is the only understanding which is consistent with other verses in Qur'an. God does not need to know anything. He knows what is in our hearts. But He creates the tests so that we can know ourselves what we actually stand for. And so that we can earn our destiny.

? ?

I know that most people of the world will remain confused about predestination because we humans are too arrogant to let go the notion that at the end of the day we are in control. Generally I try to ignore this debate? because this is not so much a question of understanding that can be explained, this is more of a question of humility ? on which we have to put Faith.

The God that I am slave to is not an entity existing In parallel to the entities of this universe ? playing with them some power game. God is the authority that is the ultimate Originator of every bit of information that makes up the universe? He Originates and sustains all matters, all energy, all senses and all consciousness.  He is the One who feeds and is not fed (Ref: 6:14). This feeding is not merely in terms of food ? it is in terms of information / decision as well. No one takes a decision and feeds back to God ? it is He who takes all decisions and feeds back to each of the pockets of consciousness that He himself originated. To each of these individual pockets of consciousness (which are we) it appears that they are taking these decisions, but in reality they are merely quarantined parts of the ever flowing consciousness Which has caused the universe to be and Which owns the existence, the actions and destinations of each of those pockets with absolute authority. So, it is not a question for me whether I have a free will independent of God - rather, I submit only to the authority who is driving my conscious experience including my free will. Call Him God, call Him Allah, call Him the  Almighty, call Him the Brahman, or call Him the Spirit of the universe ? to that Supreme Authority I am slave to and to Him will I return.

With this I rest my case. May Allah guide us all to the straight way.


Arman

4

General Issues / Questions / Re: Can we have concensus?

« on: April 09, 2016, 03:49:20 AM »

Salam brother Bender.

I have been impressed with your understanding and analysis of Qur'an before so this sudden discovery that you believe in human free will independent of God is somewhat shocking to me. Could you please clarify the few points below:

Q1: Do you have faith in Qur'an (as we have it with us today) in it's totality (as opposed to believing it is party correct and partly corrupted)?

Q2: Do you believe God knows when each of us will die?

If answer to both of the above is no, I have no farther botheration for you... you can believe whatever you like. But if answer to either of the above questions are yes, I will probably seek some more clarifications... for several things are not adding up.

Brother Someone.. the same questions apply for you.

May Allah guide us all to the straight way.

Arman

----------------------

P.S. With regards to your Tic-Tac-Toe Challenge ... the very fact the you are raising the question whether God can defeat you in a game is itself telling a ton. Perhaps you are missing the point that you do not exist independent of God.

But yet, let me demonstrate that God can defeat you in a TTT game:

1) Can you make yourself loose a tic-tac-toe game... for example while playing with a kid... just to give the kid something to cheer about? If you can, then know that it is God who is defeating you. Because God is working through you.

2) Do you believe that your brain can be crippled in a way that you loose all your senses and intelligence? Do you also understand that God has absolute control over every matter in the world including the neurons in your brain? Perhaps you can add these two up?

5

Questions/Comments on the Quran / Re: Inheritance according to Qur?an

« on: April 07, 2016, 08:34:26 PM »

Peace Arman, one can write a will hence there is the flexibility, otherwise one cannot make stuff up according to what they think it should read and likewise whatever they propose needs to be consist and not contradicting for each of the numerous combinations as in the above examples.

Yes, no confusion it's clearly written...
4:11 ... فان so if كن be نساء nisāan/womenfolk فوق fawqa/above اثنتىن two (if 3+ daughters) فلهن so for them (f/p) ثلثا third dual (1/3 x 2 = 2/3) ما what ترك left

Thanks for clarifying your understanding.

Per my reading however "إِن كُنَّ نِسَاءً فَوْقَ اثْنَتَيْنِ" translates as "If they are women more than two" rather than "If be women more than two". And the implication is vast.

Best regards,
Arman

6

Questions/Comments on the Quran / Re: Inheritance according to Qur?an

« on: April 06, 2016, 01:54:13 AM »

Brother Noon:

We had this discussions before. I still hold that the inheritance rules in Qur'an can be implemented in several ways with some core principles being hard-coded. The society has the flexibility to implement within these guiding principles. I view your interpretation as one of the several potential plausible interpretations but not the only possible option.

However just to highlight a possible confusion from the above summary.. what is your suggested distribution for 10 sons and 4 daughters assuming no other beneficiaries? Are you suggesting sons would get 1/30 each and daughters 1/6 each? That is what your second chart means for me.

Regards,
Arman

7

General Issues / Questions / Re: Can we have concensus?

« on: April 05, 2016, 08:26:21 PM »

When a people choose their traditions and practices of their parents over their God-gifted sense of right and wrong, they deserve to be deviated. They earn this deviation by engaging in sectarian hostility, conflict and war.

I think the above statement is what Recluse has been repeatedly saying is unfair. How much do people really chose? If I try to assume more about your response based on "engaging in sectarian hostility, conflict and war", I could assume you may categorize these people by how much harm (or peace) their actions result in.

Thanks Comrox.

I am not talking about people deserving deviation because of their religion / tradition. It is not the birth of a person to a religion that is to be held against the person - but his/her blind following of tradition especially when such following goes against his/her God-gifted sense of right and wrong. And this applies to people of all religions equally.

Being born of a Hindu family is not a sin, nor is it a sin that one follows what one finds best in the tradition that he inherited. But burning widows alive in the name of tradition is of course a sin - and whoever supports such view deserves the deviation and suffering.

Being born of a Buddhist family is not a sin, nor is it a sin that one follows what one finds best in the tradition that he inherited. But persecuting Rohingyas in the name of Budhdhist solidarity is of course a sin - and whoever supports such view deserves the deviation and suffering.

Being born of a Christian family is not a sin, nor is it a sin that one follows what one finds best in the tradition that he inherited. But practicing white supremacy ideology (like the KKK) in the name of Jesus is of course a sin - and whoever supports such view deserves the deviation and suffering.

Being born of a Jewish family is not a sin, nor is it a sin that one follows what one finds best in the tradition that he inherited. But persecuting Palestinians in the name of Zionism is of course a sin - and whoever supports such view deserves the deviation and suffering.

Being born of a Sunni family is not a sin, nor is it a sin that one follows what one finds best in the tradition that he inherited. But harboring hostility against the Shias (and vice versa) and people of other religion in general in the name of Islam is of course a sin - and whoever supports such view deserves the deviation and suffering.

May Allah guide us all to the straight way.

Regards,
Arman

8

General Issues / Questions / Re: Can we have concensus?

« on: April 05, 2016, 03:02:48 AM »

No one deserves to be deviated, they earn it themselves. I would opine that guidance is the set path/package for all and by their actions they choose and thereby earn deviation or further guidance.

When the community rejects the signs of God, they deserve to be deviated. Then they earn the deviation by following the footsteps of devil.

When a person takes worldly pleasure and desires as his goal of life he deserves to be deviated. Then he earns his deviation by acting wickedly and by consuming the unlawful.

When a people become heedless about living in sustainable manner and get obsessed with consumption, they deserve to be deviated - they earn the deviation by depleting the natural resources and destroying their own habitat.

When a people choose their traditions and practices of their parents over their God-gifted sense of right and wrong, they deserve to be deviated. They earn this deviation by engaging in sectarian hostility, conflict and war.

Our attitude and priorities decide what we deserve. Our specific choice of actions decide what we earn.

Hope this clarifies what I meant.

Reference verses from Qur'an based on which I am adopting this terminology:

3:181   Verily God has heard the statement of those who say, ?Indeed God is poor while we are rich.? We will record what they said and the killing of the Prophets without (any) right, and We will say, ?Taste the suffering of burning.?

3:182   That is because what your hands have offered and that God is not unfair to His slaves.

... ...

5:64   And the yahud said, ?The hands of God are shackled?. Shackled are their (own) hands. And they are condemned for what they had said. No! His both hands are fully stretched out ? He spends however He wills. And what has been sent down to you from your Master surely augments many of them in their defiance and (faith) repression. And We have offered among them enmity and hatred till the day of rising. Every time they kindled the fire of the war it was put out by God and they become busy spreading corruption on the earth. And God does not love the corrupter.

5:65   But if that the fraternity of the book had faith and been conscious, surely We would have suppressed their faults for them and surely We would have admitted them into the gardens of delight.

... ...

7:30   He guided a group, and (for) another group - the deviation came true/rightful upon them. Indeed they take the devils as patrons from other than God thinking that they are being guided.

...

7:70   They said, ?Have you come to us that we be slave to God alone and we leave whatever our fathers happened to be slave to? Then bring us with what you promise us if you happen to be sincere.?

7:71   He said, ?Verily, filth and anger from your Master is due upon you. Do you argue with me concerning names that you have named them - you and your fathers ? (whereas) God has not sent down for them any (delegation of) authority? Then keep watching, indeed I am with you among the ones keeping a watch.?

7:72   So We saved him and those with him by mercy from Us, and We cut-off the roots of those who denied Our signs ? and they did not happen to be faithful.

(My personal translation, cross checking is recommended, emphasis added.)

May Allah guide us all to the straight way.

Regards,
Arman

9

General Issues / Questions / Re: Can we have concensus?

« on: April 04, 2016, 08:58:53 PM »

Salamun Alaikum.

Although the debate has moved off-topic here, since the discussion is persisting let me share my perspective.

What does the Qur?an say

2:255   God ? no god except Him: the Ever Living Foundation of Existence. Drowsiness or sleep does not take him over. Whatever (is there) in the heavens and whatever (is there) on the earth (all) belong to Him. Who is the one who can intercede with Him except with His authorization? He knows whatever (happened) up until them (literally: between their hands) and whatever (would happen) after them and they do not capture (literally: surround) anything from His knowledge except what He wills. His domain encompasses the heavens and the earth and guarding of both does not fatigue Him and He is the Highest, the Greatest!

(My personal translation, cross checking is recommended, emphasis added.)

That God knows our future is a recurring theme in Qur?an, including the famous instance above. Another very clear declaration in Quran is that, God has predetermined where/how each of us will die:

3:154   (And) later, from after the distress, He sent down upon you security ? slumber veiled a faction of you while certainly a faction themselves made their souls anxious believing about God beyond the truth ?assumptions of ignorance ? saying, ?Is there anything for us from the command?? Say, ?Indeed the command ? all of it ? is for God?. They hide in their souls what they do not make apparent to you. They say, ?If there happened to be anything for us in the command we would not have been killed here.? Say, ?If you happened to be in your houses, those upon whom murder was booked would have surely come out towards their death-beds.? And so that God could test what was in your breasts and that He might purge what was in your hearts, and God is Knowledgeable of what (you) have in the breast.

(My personal translation, cross checking is recommended, emphasis added.)

If God does not know whether the murderer/killer will choose to kill.. He cannot predetermine the death of the victim.

So, one can choose to have a view that God does not know the future ? but it would be practically impossible to pass on such a view as ?Quranic?.

Also, that God determines what we will is clearly expressed here:

 

76:30   And you will not will accept that God wills. Indeed God happens to be Knowledgeable, Wise.

(My personal translation, cross checking is recommended, emphasis added.)

Let?s do a thought-experiment. Let?s hold a loaded gun to our head and plan for a suicide. If God knows when we are going to die, He must know if I am going to decide to pull the trigger or not. Right?


Is it logically possible for God to know the future

Yes it is. This is especially true for those who understand the relativity of time as postulated in modern Physics. Here is an excerpt about what Einstein believed about time:

Surprising as it may be to most non-scientists and even to some scientists, Albert Einstein concluded in his later years that the past, present, and future all exist simultaneously. In 1952, in his book Relativity, in discussing Minkowski's Space World interpretation of his theory of relativity, Einstein writes:

Since there exists in this four dimensional structure [space-time] no longer any sections which represent "now" objectively, the concepts of happening and becoming are indeed not completely suspended, but yet complicated. It appears therefore more natural to think of physical reality as a four dimensional existence, instead of, as hitherto, the evolution of a three dimensional existence.

Einstein's belief in an undivided solid reality was clear to him, so much so that he completely rejected the separation we experience as the moment of now. He believed there is no true division between past and future, there is rather a single existence. His most descriptive testimony to this faith came when his lifelong friend Besso died. Einstein wrote a letter to Besso's family, saying that although Besso had preceded him in death it was of no consequence, "...for us physicists believe the separation between past, present, and future is only an illusion, although a convincing one."

[Source: http://everythingforever.com/einstein.htm]

Similar view about time is endorsed by the leading scientists of our time. The above site has more details.

If the Future is already existing and God is the One who created it, then God logically knows it. All of it.

Well then, If God determines my wills and choices then how come I am responsible for my actions

Actually this is the Question which confuses most of us into believing that we make our choices independent of God. To clarify this one needs to fully understand this ? God is NOT A DEITY who magically controls certain events and activities in the universe. God is the One who has caused the universe to be. He is the One who gives all objects their properties and He is the One who gives all living beings their consciousness. Everything that is happening in this universe, including the movements of every electron and proton inside our brain is happening because of God?s will. If God is the Foundation of Existence then rather it is impossible for anything to happen or exist beyond God?s will. If we understand God like this, there is no question that every choices that we are making are determined by God.

Everything that is happening in this universe has two sides of it - one the apparent physical side of cause and effect - the other the God's will in the background like the other side of the coin. The wind brings the cloud, the cloud brings the rain - yet God is the One who brings all of it. God's will and the apparent causal relationships in the universe are always simultaneously true.

We eat food that is not ours ? it is from God ? but still we eat it and satisfy our hunger. We breathe not our air ? the air is from God ? but still we breathe and live on. We operate our body ? though the body is not ours ? it is from God ? but still we run around with this body by our choice. Then very well we should make choices with our free will and take responsibility of such ? yet God is the authority who is making those choices for us.

But why we should be held responsible for our choices then? That is because we are making those choices just as much as God is making those choices. We are, in this very limited scope of personal choice making, acting with the authorization of God (bi idhnillah). God brought us into being and given us the freewill ? so He is the One supremely responsible for all of our actions anyway. The fact that God is supremely responsible for everything that happens in the universe does not take away anything from our personal responsibility of the choices that we make with God?s authorization.

When God created Adam, He knew very well that Iblis would choose not to prostrate to Adam. This was all part of God's plan. And Yet Iblis is responsible for his own choice. And he knows and acknowledges this:

7:12   He said, ?What prevented you that you did not prostrate when I commanded you?? He said, ?I am better than him. You created me from fire and You created him from clay.?

7:13   He said, ?Then descend from it ? for it would not be for you that you be arrogant in it. So get out ? indeed you are among the humbled ones.?

7:14   He said, ?Reprieve me till the day they are animated.?

7:15   He said, ?Indeed you are among the reprieved ones.?

7:16   He said, ?So because you have let me astray, surely I will sit for them on Your straight way.?

7:17   (And) later surely I will be brought to them from up until them (literally: between their hands) and from after them and unto their right and unto their left and You will not find most of them appreciative.?

7:18   He said, ?Get out of it disgraced and expelled ? surely whoever follows you ? surely I will fill Hell with you all together.?

(My personal translation, cross checking is recommended, emphasis added.)

The best approach to understand our ownership of our choices is to think like this - we do not make the choices to create our destiny. Our destiny is already predetermined by God. We merely exercise our choices to "earn" that destiny that God has already chosen for us. For some of us who deserve to be guided - God has chosen guidance for us and we will earn such guidance by our own choice. For some others - who deserve to be deviated - God has chosen deviation for them and they will earn such deviation by their own choice.

God is your Master and my Master. Everything in the heavens and on earth are slave to Him willingly or under compulsion. Our Master guides to the straight way whomever He wills.

Best regards,
Arman

10

What is the nature of God? / Re: 99 NAMES OF GOD

« on: April 04, 2016, 08:02:13 PM »

peace:

Arman: Yes I consider Rahman a synonym of Rahym, I do not have enough evidence to do it otherwise. Unless you tell me what change in the tense/meaning does the N at the end of roots exactly do , with evidence.  And, I actually made a mistake, the Spanish word is correct, but the English translation would be more "Compassionate" than " beneficent".

Salam brother.

My proposition with regards to the name Ar-Rahman is as follows. Please let me know exactly for which step you are looking for more evidence:

1. Ar-Rahman as spelled in Qur'an (without the alif in the middle) is not the same as the known Arabic word Ar-Rahmaan (رحمان) which I did agree that it means "Compassionate" - with the ending alif-nun implying an elative form of the word Raheem. But note - to make an elative form the word needs both the letters alif and noon, while Qur'an has skipped the alif.

2. Since I am convinced every word and letter in Qur'an is purposeful - the implication of this different spelling to me is that God has chosen to change the word slightly and hence the best meaning of this new unique Quranic word can only be derived from usage in Qur'an.

3. The usage of the word in Qur'an implies that the word refers to someone with Supreme Authority rather than highlighting His Mercy or Compassion. The article I referred earlier provides detailed review of the usage of the word in Qur'an:

http://www.free-minds.org/Old/articles/gods_system/rahman.htm

4. However, since the linkage of the word to the root R-H-M is obvious, I understand the word as "The One upon whose Mercy we all are absolutely dependent". Thus the link with Mercy is retained and yet the Supreme Authority is implied. Reading it like this on one hand makes the usage of the word meaningful in Qur'an verses (13:30, 19:18, 19:45 etc.) and on the other hand, makes the two frequently paired words Ar-Rahmanur Raheem complementary to each other - God is absolutely Merciful to us and we are absolutely dependent upon His Mercy - rather than being mere repetitions.

5. The word "Almighty" just happens to be the closest approximation of the meaning of "The One upon whose Mercy we all are absolutely dependent" - if I have to choose a single English word. If I find a better word, I am open to accepting it.

This is how I find the word to be the most meaningful in Qur'an. I just wanted to share this with you in case it is helpful to you, or other readers. But of course if you choose to stick to the traditional view that Ar-Rahman is same as Ar-rahmaan (with the center alif) which means same as Ar-Raheem - then of course you are free to understand however you choose. I do not mean to debate with you, my goal is only to highlight the perspective which is often overlooked.

May Allah increase us in knowledge.

Regards,
Arman