Free Minds

Other Issues => Christianity/Judaism/Others => Topic started by: Emre_1974tr on June 19, 2021, 03:42:33 PM

Title: The religion of the Illuminati is pagan pantheism/spiritualism/New Ageism
Post by: Emre_1974tr on June 19, 2021, 03:42:33 PM
Stay away from this teaching. By the way, the fake Bible is also a semi-New Ageism book too.
Title: Re: The religion of the Illuminati is pagan pantheism/spiritualism/New Ageism
Post by: Green Anarchism on June 19, 2021, 07:58:14 PM
Doesn't make sense at all... justification?

(https://i.ibb.co/1nfkLXC/Religion-Spirituality.jpg)

REASON: God wants Spiritual Fruits, NOT RELIGIOUS NUTS (https://free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9611404.0)
Title: Re: The religion of the Illuminati is pagan pantheism/spiritualism/New Ageism
Post by: Emre_1974tr on June 20, 2021, 08:49:25 AM
Our video,

Islam and spiritual doctrine are completely different from each other:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EXA38GeVM6k
Title: Re: The religion of the Illuminati is pagan pantheism/spiritualism/New Ageism
Post by: Green Anarchism on June 20, 2021, 04:39:27 PM
Do you think this is spiritualism?

Indeed, I have turned my face to the One Who created the heavens and the earth as a true monotheist, and not I am of the polytheists. (6:79, and 53:1-15)



Background

-----------------------------------------------------
Main life issue: What defines you? Who am I?
-----------------------------------------------------

Remember when Ibrahim said to his FATHER [STATISM], Azar, ´Do you take idols as gods? I see that you and your people are clearly misguided.´ Because of that We showed Ibrahim the dominions of the heavens and the earth so that he might be one of the people of certainty.  When night covered him he saw a STAR [ ✡ SUPREMACISM] and said, ´This is my Lord!´ Then when it set he said, ´I do not love what sets.´ Then when he saw the MOON [ ☪︎ SCHISM] come up he said, ´This is my Lord!´ Then when it set he said, ´If my Lord does not guide me, I will be one of the misguided people.´ Then when he saw the SUN [ ✞ MATERIALISM] come up he said, ´This is my Lord! This is greater!´ Then when it set he said, ´My people, I am free of what you associate with Allah. I have turned my face to Him/Sunnatullah Who brought the heavens and earth into being, a HANIF [SPIRITUALISM]. I am not one of the MUSHRIKUN [3:67  ✡ STAR, ☪︎ MOON, ✞ SUN].´ (6:74-78)

Those who have iman [NOT ✡ STAR, ☪︎ MOON, ✞ SUN, 11:17/5:81/3:28] and do not mix up their iman//103/FACT/MUHKAMAT with any wrongdoing/4:82/OPINION/MUTASYAABIHAT, they are the ones who are safe; it is they who are guided.´ This is the [HANIF/NATURALIST] argument We gave to Ibrahim against his people. We raise in rank anyone We will. Your Lord is All-Wise, All-Knowing (6:82-83)

It is Spiritual Naturalism (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spiritual_naturalism)

-----------------------------------------------------

In conclusion, "natural person" means:

1. Not statism
2. Not ✡ STAR/supremacism/Qarun
3. Not ☪︎ MOON/schism/Haman
4. Not ✞ SUN/materialism/Pharaoh
5. Spiritualism/Atomism (align our nature with NATURE)
6. Naturalism (al-Masjid al-Haram, unmixed, logic)
7. Pharaonic Jihad, 11:17, 7:155-158

It is the Deen of Ecospirituality (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ecospirituality)

“There are only patterns, patterns on top of patterns, patterns that affect other patterns. Patterns hidden by patterns. Patterns within patterns. If you watch close, history does nothing but repeat itself. What we call chaos is just patterns we haven't recognized. What we call random is just patterns we can't decipher. what we can't understand we call nonsense. What we can't read we call gibberish. There is no free will. There are no variables.” - Chuck Palahniuk

-----------------------------------------------------
This is the way that Ibrahim was to deny polytheism (shirk) of all kinds and to avoid idolatry in all its forms.
-----------------------------------------------------

A fool would abandon Ibrahim's faith (2:130/2:124/3:33/4:125/3:64-68/22:78)

Say, ´Allah speaks the truth, so follow the religion of Ibrahim, a man of pure natural belief. He was not one of the idolaters.´ (3:95) Say: ´My Lord has guided me to a straight path, a well-founded deen, the religion of Ibrahim, a man of pure natural belief. He was not one of the idolaters.´ Say: ´My salat and my rites, my living and my dying, are for Allah alone, the Lord of all the worlds (6:161-162)
Title: Re: The religion of the Illuminati is pagan pantheism/spiritualism/New Ageism
Post by: Emre_1974tr on June 20, 2021, 07:33:31 PM
Sufis, spiritual naturalists and Kabbalists are also pagan pantheists. . I have Turkish articles and videos on this topic.

Examples;

My Turkish articles with machine translation:

https://translate.google.com/translate?sl=tr&tl=en&u=http://emre1974tr.blogspot.com/2011/11/kainat-veya-zihninizi-put-edinmeyin.html

https://translate.google.com/translate?sl=tr&tl=en&u=http://emre1974tr.blogspot.com/2011/07/kuran-ve-nur.html


And ;

http://emre1974tr.blogspot.com/2011/07/nobody-has-got-ghost-according-to-quran.html

Abandon Pagan Naturalism/pantheism.

Stop worshiping yourself and the universe.

The universes that Allah created out of nothing are His servants, just like insects.

Worship only God.

Leave the shirk.

Do not fall into the trap of demons.
Title: Theism vs Panentheism
Post by: Jafar on September 08, 2021, 04:17:09 AM
From the image below:
(https://www.proginosko.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/Theism-and-Panentheism.png)

Which one is closer to your view?
Theism: A far away God totally separated from this universe ? (#separation)
Panentheism: A very close God where this universe is also part of Itself? (#unity)

It's entirely up to you.

As for me: my view is definitely closer to Panentheism.
With 'slight modification'... God is NOT the blue circle.
God is the white background.. as God is actually infinite and has no boundary / border on any dimension.

Title: Re: The religion of the Illuminati is pagan pantheism/spiritualism/New Ageism
Post by: Green Anarchism on September 08, 2021, 10:17:22 AM
Abandon Pagan Naturalism/pantheism.

Stop worshiping yourself and the universe.

mmm... pagan (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paganism)? but naturalism (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Naturalism_(philosophy))? I don't get it... :rotfl:

and abandon the Sunnatullah (Law of Nature) (https://www.ahmedhulusi.org/en/book/the-essence-of-man/sunnatullah-the-immutable-constants-of-allahs-system), you're truly deluded 

Truly you are guiding to a Straight Path: ie. the Path of Allah (IS) to Whom everything in the heavens and everything on the earth [ie. NATURALISM] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Naturalism_(philosophy)) belongs. (42:52-53) No one disputes Allah´s Signs (Our signs on the horizons and in themselves 41:53) except those who are kafir. (40:4)
Title: Re: Theism vs Panentheism
Post by: Emre_1974tr on September 08, 2021, 03:47:16 PM
From the image below:
(https://www.proginosko.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/Theism-and-Panentheism.png)

Which one is closer to your view?
Theism: A far away God totally separated from this universe ? (#separation)
Panentheism: A very close God where this universe is also part of Itself? (#unity)

It's entirely up to you.

As for me: my view is definitely closer to Panentheism.
With 'slight modification'... God is NOT the blue circle.
God is the white background.. as God is actually infinite and has no boundary / border on any dimension.

No one can interfere with your pagan faith. But as soon as you try to instill this belief in the religion of Islam, I show you that it is wrong.

All pagans say this anyway. That's why the idols they worship are actually the Mother God in their eyes. The things they worship are a reflection of God, a part, a manifestation, a part of the whole..

Meanwhile, Allah is everywhere as a ruler and observer, but as an entity, He is completely outside of His creations. That's why shirk is the biggest sin.

No, if panentheism or pantheism were real, shirk would not be a sin. Paganism already has this philosophy.

But in reality, since Allah created us out of nothing, He has no partners or parts.

Therefore, he has no wife, no children. He gave birth to no one and was not born.

112:3 "Never did He beget, nor was He begotten,"

But if you are saying "God is the white background." You are not pantheist or panentheist.

Because in the white, God is completely outside of His creation. It is separate from them. Surrounding and being close to them does not mean integrating with them.
Title: Re: The religion of the Illuminati is pagan pantheism/spiritualism/New Ageism
Post by: Emre_1974tr on September 08, 2021, 04:08:30 PM
mmm... pagan (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paganism)? but naturalism (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Naturalism_(philosophy))? I don't get it... :rotfl:

and abandon the Sunnatullah (Law of Nature) (https://www.ahmedhulusi.org/en/book/the-essence-of-man/sunnatullah-the-immutable-constants-of-allahs-system), you're truly deluded 



No, you are a lier pagan.

Sunnatullah is not law of Nature. This is your lie.

If you read before and after the relevant verse, it explains the method and reason of Allah's punishment. It is the religious law practiced by God.

The laws of nature are changeable. If Allah wills, He creates directly from the soil like Adam. That is, he creates without sexuality. He creates through sexuality and birth, if he wills.

If he wants, he creates the universe out of nothing/nothing. If he wants, he makes to derive it by using the materials that exist in this universe.

He creates one by one. If he wishes, he raises them together on the Day of Judgment.

What is called the law of nature is that God always does things in the same way. But he can do it in a different way if he wishes. And as you can see, it's variable.

After all, it is these changes that are called miracles. For example, creating Adam without parents. For example, creating Jesus without a father. These are miracles because they are outside the laws of nature. Likewise, the creation of the universe from nothing is a miracle. In fact, they are miracles for us. Because God creates creation outside the laws of physics. But what is called the laws of physics is also the application of Allah Himself. And through miracles it shows you that He can create differently if He wants. So in reality there is no fixed law of nature. As long as Allah creates it that way, it seems stable to us.

There are no fixed/fixed laws of nature that you pagans worship, in reality. God changes them whenever He wills. None of it happens spontaneously. they are all created by Allah Himself. If he wishes, he creates from nothing, if he wishes, he invents, if he wishes, he creates one by one, if he wishes, he creates collectively, if he wishes, he keeps it alive, if he wishes, he destroys it...
Title: Re: Theism vs Panentheism
Post by: Jafar on September 08, 2021, 04:24:28 PM
Meanwhile, Allah is everywhere as a ruler and observer, but as an entity, He is completely outside of His creations.

This statement by itself is a contradiction.

Something is everywhere, which imply inside and that same something is also outside?

Where is the border that define "inside" and "outside"?




Quote
No one can interfere with your pagan faith. But as soon as you try to instill this belief in the religion of Islam, I show you that it is wrong.

All pagans say this anyway. That's why the idols they worship are actually the Mother God in their eyes. The things they worship are a reflection of God, a part, a manifestation, a part of the whole..

If pagans here means Arab Paganism then their view is actually THEISM.
The Gods are outside of this universe, they're living in "Realm of the Gods and Goddesses" above in heaven, in the sky looking down on the earthly realm.

And there are many Gods and Goddesses each fighting each others for influences.
Including influence over human on the earth realm below.

That's why each God claimed that he/she/it is the only true God and the other Gods and Goddesses are 'false' gods. Each God is envious of other Gods/Goddeses as it sees that the other Gods are his/her competitor.

The statement of there is no other God other than X, implies that those who make such statement does admit that there are many other God.
In the same manner as those who said here is no other Potato Chips other than Lays admit that there are many others Potato Chips which are not Lays.

Quote
But in reality, since Allah created us out of nothing, He has no partners or parts.

The reason why the one infinite creator is only one, is because it is infinite.
It has no border in any dimension.
Thus there could only be one infinity that could possibly exist.

Since it has no border, then definitely this universe that contains trillion of galaxies are indeed inside of it. As this universe is finite and has border.
The one infinite creator cannot be 'separated' since infinite-ness mandate that it has no border  whatsoever and every-thing that is finite (has border) is inside of it.

As thus unity is the inherent nature of the one infinite creator.
Only the one infinite creator alone that actually eternally exist.

All other finite things are temporary, those who has a beginning will have an end.
And only those who has no beginning thus boundless / borderless in time dimension will not have an end.
Title: Re: Theism vs Panentheism
Post by: Emre_1974tr on September 08, 2021, 05:00:21 PM
This statement by itself is a contradiction.

Something is everywhere, which imply inside and that same something is also outside?

Where is the border that define "inside" and "outside"?




If pagans here means Arab Paganism then their view is actually THEISM.
The Gods are outside of this universe, they're living in "Realm of the Gods and Goddesses" above in heaven, in the sky looking down on the earthly realm.

And there are many Gods and Goddesses each fighting each others for influences.
Including influence over human on the earth realm below.

That's why each God claimed that he/she/it is the only true God and the other Gods and Goddesses are 'false' gods. Each God is envious of other Gods/Goddeses as it sees that the other Gods are his/her competitor.

The statement of there is no other God other than X, implies that those who make such statement does admit that there are many other God.
In the same manner as those who said here is no other Potato Chips other than Lays admit that there are many others Potato Chips which are not Lays.

The reason why the one infinite creator is only one, is because it is infinite.
It has no border in any dimension.
Thus there could only be one infinity that could possibly exist.

Since it has no border, then definitely this universe that contains trillion of galaxies are indeed inside of it. As this universe is finite and has border.
The one infinite creator cannot be 'separated' since infinite-ness mandate that it has no border  whatsoever and every-thing that is finite (has border) is inside of it.

As thus unity is the inherent nature of the one infinite creator.
Only the one infinite creator alone that actually eternally exist.

All other finite things are temporary, those who has a beginning will have an end.
And only those who has no beginning thus boundless / borderless in time dimension will not have an end.


No, old Arabs see those gods as reflections, shadows, parts of one God. And they called the main God Allah.

Pagans have a panentheist or pantheistic philosophy.

Theism is the exact opposite of this teaching.

***

As a being, God is completely outside of what He created. That is, he is physically outside the universes.

But he is everywhere as a manager and observer. Observing something from the outside is not integrating with it. Managing something from the outside does not mean integrating with it.

Surrounding something or being very close does not mean integrating with it.

***

And finally, let's remind again;

Christians "3 in 1"

Hindus "333 in 1" and "all things in 1"

Pantheists "all things in 1"

New Agers "we are in 1"

These are paganism.
Title: Re: The religion of the Illuminati is pagan pantheism/spiritualism/New Ageism
Post by: Green Anarchism on September 09, 2021, 01:03:43 AM
You don't even know the most basic in "paganism (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paganism)" and "naturalism (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Naturalism_(philosophy)),"  and desperately claiming it as valid argument :rotfl:

No, you are a lier pagan.

Sunnatullah (https://www.ahmedhulusi.org/en/book/the-essence-of-man/sunnatullah-the-immutable-constants-of-allahs-system) is not law of Nature. This is your lie.

(https://i.postimg.cc/3xM9WQWv/504169505263783.gif)

If you read before and after the relevant verse, it explains the method and reason of Allah's punishment. It is the religious law practiced by God.

The laws of nature are changeable. If Allah wills, He creates directly from the soil like Adam. That is, he creates without sexuality. He creates through sexuality and birth, if he wills.

If he wants, he creates the universe out of nothing/nothing. If he wants, he makes to derive it by using the materials that exist in this universe.

He creates one by one. If he wishes, he raises them together on the Day of Judgment.

What is called the law of nature is that God always does things in the same way. But he can do it in a different way if he wishes. And as you can see, it's variable.

After all, it is these changes that are called miracles. For example, creating Adam without parents. For example, creating Jesus without a father. These are miracles because they are outside the laws of nature. Likewise, the creation of the universe from nothing is a miracle. In fact, they are miracles for us. Because God creates creation outside the laws of physics. But what is called the laws of physics is also the application of Allah Himself. And through miracles it shows you that He can create differently if He wants. So in reality there is no fixed law of nature. As long as Allah creates it that way, it seems stable to us.

There are no fixed/fixed laws of nature that you pagans worship, in reality. God changes them whenever He wills. None of it happens spontaneously. they are all created by Allah Himself. If he wishes, he creates from nothing, if he wishes, he invents, if he wishes, he creates one by one, if he wishes, he creates collectively, if he wishes, he keeps it alive, if he wishes, he destroys it...

Allah/SUNNATULLAH makes the sun come from the East.
Now you make it come from the West? (2:258)

OR, try not to die if what you say is true? (3:168)


(https://i.ibb.co/sJGMDZL/lol.gif)

And the one who was a kafir was dumbfounded. Allah does not guide wrongdoing people. (2:258)

Truly you are guiding to a Straight Path: ie. the Path of Allah (IS) to Whom everything in the heavens and everything on the earth [ie. NATURALISM] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Naturalism_(philosophy)) belongs. (42:52-53) No one disputes Allah´s Signs (Our signs on the horizons and in themselves 41:53) except those who are kafir. (40:4)

The definition of "KAFIR""

(https://i.ibb.co/SnJK8TJ/INSANITY.png)

(https://i.ibb.co/kXBhdLL/Kafir.png)

Title: Re: Theism vs Panentheism
Post by: Green Anarchism on September 09, 2021, 01:36:15 AM
God is completely outside of what He created. That is, he is physically outside the universes.

(https://i.postimg.cc/3xM9WQWv/504169505263783.gif)

(https://i.ibb.co/4p2wPdd/Allahis.jpg)
Title: Re: The religion of the Illuminati is pagan pantheism/spiritualism/New Ageism
Post by: Emre_1974tr on September 09, 2021, 02:36:09 AM
No, you are a lier pagan.

Sunnatullah is not law of Nature. This is your lie.

If you read before and after the relevant verse, it explains the method and reason of Allah's punishment. It is the religious law practiced by God.

The laws of nature are changeable. If Allah wills, He creates directly from the soil like Adam. That is, he creates without sexuality. He creates through sexuality and birth, if he wills.

If he wants, he creates the universe out of nothing/nothing. If he wants, he makes to derive it by using the materials that exist in this universe.

He creates one by one. If he wishes, he raises them together on the Day of Judgment.

What is called the law of nature is that God always does things in the same way. But he can do it in a different way if he wishes. And as you can see, it's variable.

After all, it is these changes that are called miracles. For example, creating Adam without parents. For example, creating Jesus without a father. These are miracles because they are outside the laws of nature. Likewise, the creation of the universe from nothing is a miracle. In fact, they are miracles for us. Because God creates creation outside the laws of physics. But what is called the laws of physics is also the application of Allah Himself. And through miracles it shows you that He can create differently if He wants. So in reality there is no fixed law of nature. As long as Allah creates it that way, it seems stable to us.

There are no fixed/fixed laws of nature that you pagans worship, in reality. God changes them whenever He wills. None of it happens spontaneously. they are all created by Allah Himself. If he wishes, he creates from nothing, if he wishes, he invents, if he wishes, he creates one by one, if he wishes, he creates collectively, if he wishes, he keeps it alive, if he wishes, he destroys it...

And;

11:107 Abiding therein as long as the heavens and the earth exist, except for what your Lord wishes. Your Lord does as He pleases.

11:108 As for those who are happy, they will be in the Paradise; abiding therein as long as the heavens and the earth exist, except for what your Lord wishes, a giving without end.

Almighty God is here telling us what he will do in the future.

And he says "I will never remove those in Paradise unless I wish otherwise"

And he promises he won't.

In other words, he says, "I can change my decision if I want, but those in Paradise will stay there forever because I have free willed them to stay."

In other words, this is not a natural law of physics, God says.

If Allah wills, he will act differently. There is no such thing as an immutable law of physics.

Pagans, on the other hand, worship the universe and the laws of physics and think they are immutable. That is why they do not believe in miracles, and many of them do not even accept that the universe will perish/doomsday.
Title: Re: The religion of the Illuminati is pagan pantheism/spiritualism/New Ageism
Post by: Green Anarchism on September 09, 2021, 08:15:44 AM
Anything is possible if you don't even know what you're talking about.... ie. INSANITY (KAFIR) (http://www.dpjs.co.uk/satan.html#Self)  :rotfl:

In other words (http://www.dpjs.co.uk/satan.html#Self) (<-- YOUR NONSENSE ABOUT GOD (http://www.dpjs.co.uk/satan.html#Self)), this is not a natural law of physics, God says.

If Allah wills (http://www.dpjs.co.uk/satan.html#Self), he will act differently. There is no such thing as an immutable law of physics. (http://www.dpjs.co.uk/ethics.html#OU1505)

(https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-lIViLRwnCkg/YJFnSAfwIJI/AAAAAAAAC_M/RhDKonAmngYfmo8lL7sQ2p_3rVJgldONwCLcBGAsYHQ/s0/SATANISM2.jpg)

Try not to die if what you say is true? (3:168)

(https://i.postimg.cc/3xM9WQWv/504169505263783.gif)

Allah/SUNNATULLAH makes the sun come from the East.
Now you make it come from the West?
(2:258)
[/size]

Do you believe in part of the Book and disbelieve in another part of it? (2:85)

(https://i.ibb.co/sP0HMZJ/context.png)

Which of you is MAD? (68:6) Shaytans from both mankind and from the jinn, who inspire each other with delusions by means of specious words (6:112)

Pagans, on the other hand, worship the universe and the laws of physics and think they are immutable. That is why they do not believe in miracles, and many of them do not even accept that the universe will perish/doomsday.

If the Truth conformed to their desires [Have you seen the one who has taken his own whims as his god?  25:43], truly, the heavens, and the earth, and whoever is in them would have been corrupted. Instead, We have given them their Reminder, but they turn away from it. (23:71)
Title: Re: The religion of the Illuminati is pagan pantheism/spiritualism/New Ageism
Post by: Emre_1974tr on September 09, 2021, 09:28:07 AM
And;

11:107 Abiding therein as long as the heavens and the earth exist, except for what your Lord wishes. Your Lord does as He pleases.

11:108 As for those who are happy, they will be in the Paradise; abiding therein as long as the heavens and the earth exist, except for what your Lord wishes, a giving without end.

Almighty God is here telling us what he will do in the future.

And he says "I will never remove those in Paradise unless I wish otherwise"

And he promises he won't.

In other words, he says, "I can change my decision if I want, but those in Paradise will stay there forever because I have free willed them to stay."

In other words, this is not a natural law of physics, God says.

If Allah wills, he will act differently. There is no such thing as an immutable law of physics.

Pagans, on the other hand, worship the universe and the laws of physics and think they are immutable. That is why they do not believe in miracles, and many of them do not even accept that the universe will perish/doomsday.


And;

you are a lier pagan.

Sunnatullah is not law of Nature. This is your lie.

If you read before and after the relevant verse, it explains the method and reason of Allah's punishment. It is the religious law practiced by God.

3:137 Many nations have come before you, so roam the earth and see how the punishment was for the deniers.

17:77 Such was the way of those whom We had sent before you of Our messengers. And you will not find any change in Our way.

33:38 There is no blame on the prophet in doing anything that God has decreed upon him. Such was the way of God with the people of old. And the command of God is a determined duty.

35:43 Arrogance on the earth, and evil scheming. And the evil schemes only backfire on those who scheme them. Were they expecting anything different from the ways used on the people of the past? You will not find any change in the way of God, and you will not find any bypass to the way of God.

40:85 But their belief could not help them once they saw Our might; such is the way of God that has been established for His servants; and the rejecters were then totally in loss.

Title: Re: The religion of the Illuminati is pagan pantheism/spiritualism/New Ageism
Post by: Green Anarchism on September 09, 2021, 10:26:43 AM

And;

you are a lier pagan.

Sunnatullah is not law of Nature. This is your lie.

You can't fix stupid, and stupid can't fix themselves...

(https://i.ibb.co/sJGMDZL/lol.gif)


and you're truly deluded/insane... it is natural disaster, LAW OF NATURE

Law of CAUSE & EFFECT! :rotfl:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uxhc0mq_c48

So We sent them the flood, and the locust, and the lice, and the frogs, and the blood; all detailed signs; but they turned arrogant, they were a criminal people (7:133)

(https://video.cgtn.com/news/31557a4d784d544f354d7a4d34517a4d3545444f31457a6333566d54/video/a28b7aa9255549fd90c74a1eae1f11b3/a28b7aa9255549fd90c74a1eae1f11b3.gif)

If you read before and after the relevant verse, it explains the method and reason of Allah's punishment. It is the religious law practiced by God.

(https://i.gifer.com/5KNc.gif)

3:137 Many nations have come before you, so roam the earth and see how the punishment was for the deniers.

(https://media.giphy.com/media/MPgvQBm1RzuTu/giphy.gif)

17:77 Such was the way of those whom We had sent before you of Our messengers. And you will not find any change in Our way.

(https://i.pinimg.com/originals/2f/b7/35/2fb7354712303135a1606b7f3d15834a.gif)

33:38 There is no blame on the prophet in doing anything that God has decreed upon him. Such was the way of God with the people of old. And the command of God is a determined duty.

(https://i.gifer.com/embedded/download/JyKD.gif)

35:43 Arrogance on the earth, and evil scheming. And the evil schemes only backfire on those who scheme them. Were they expecting anything different from the ways used on the people of the past? You will not find any change in the way of God, and you will not find any bypass to the way of God.

(https://c.tenor.com/GnIdq1-KYbAAAAAC/twister-tornado.gif)

40:85 But their belief could not help them once they saw Our might; such is the way of God that has been established for His servants; and the rejecters were then totally in loss.

(https://i.ibb.co/TL9bkx9/Q5l3hPV.gif)


(https://i.ibb.co/jkNSzZ2/EXPLODE.gif)
Title: Re: The religion of the Illuminati is pagan pantheism/spiritualism/New Ageism
Post by: good logic on September 09, 2021, 10:42:50 AM
Peace Green Anarchism.
I hope you have not chosen to call your brothers and sisters here deluded and laugh at their choices?

Think of the "cause and effect".Change the cause that creates negativity  to change the effect/consequence.

You are my brother  and I would not call you deluded nor would I laugh at your choices.

May the Lord bless you and fill your heart with love.
Peace.
Title: Re: The religion of the Illuminati is pagan pantheism/spiritualism/New Ageism
Post by: good logic on September 09, 2021, 10:44:56 AM
Similarly for brother Emre.
GOD bless you and fill your heart with love.
Peace.
Title: Re: The religion of the Illuminati is pagan pantheism/spiritualism/New Ageism
Post by: Green Anarchism on September 09, 2021, 10:45:17 AM
Dear CENTRIST! (https://youtu.be/3mPazYL5Nks?t=263)  :rotfl:

Peace Green Anarchism.
I hope you have not chosen to call your brothers and sisters here deluded and laugh at their choices?

Think of the "cause and effect".Change the cause that creates negativity  to change the effect/consequence.

You are my brother  and I would not call you deluded nor would I laugh at your choices.

May the Lord bless you and fill your heart with love.
Peace.

My brother? no way! These are my worst enemy! 

So I swear...

You have an excellent example in Ibrahim and those with him, when they said to their people, ´We wash our hands of you and all that you serve apart from Allah/Sunnatullah, and we reject you. Between us and you there will be enmity and hatred for ever unless and until you have iman in Allah/Sunnatullah alone.´ Except for Ibrahim´s words to his father: ´I will ask forgiveness for you but I have no power to help you in any way against Allah.´ ´Our Lord, we have put our trust in You. and have made tawba to You. You are our final destination. (60:4)

(https://i.postimg.cc/3xM9WQWv/504169505263783.gif)

They have made their oaths/syahadat into a cloak and barred the Way of Allah/SUNNATULLAH. What they have done is truly evil. (53:2) When you see them, their outward form appeals to you, and if they speak you listen to what they say. But they are like propped-up planks of wood. They imagine every cry to be against them. They are the real enemy, so beware of them. Allah fight them! How they are perverted! (63:4)
Title: Re: The religion of the Illuminati is pagan pantheism/spiritualism/New Ageism
Post by: good logic on September 09, 2021, 10:50:56 AM
Really?
Even  If Iblis /Satan says hello to you, say a better hello to him. brother.
What do you lose if you do not follow him?
Nature is nice and beautiful. Love is natural.
GOD bless you.
Peace.
Title: Re: The religion of the Illuminati is pagan pantheism/spiritualism/New Ageism
Post by: Green Anarchism on September 09, 2021, 10:56:58 AM
Really?
Even  If Iblis /Satan says hello to you, say a better hello to him. brother.
What do you lose if you do not follow him?
Nature is nice and beautiful. Love is natural.
GOD bless you.
Peace.

Nature (https://3.bp.blogspot.com/-fwHEnOmCPbM/V8FWveWNjqI/AAAAAAAAEe0/skRA4RFTrvoBU_HEU69wfYFwJXgjFeMrQCLcB/s1600/mothernatureistryingtokillyou.jpg) is nice?  :rotfl:

and your hypocrisy (https://youtu.be/3mPazYL5Nks?t=263) "has gained mastery over them and made them forget the remembrance of Allah/Sunnatullah. Such people are the party of Shaytan (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xSnDk3Qmqms) (58:19)"

What do you lose ...?

You will never find a people who have iman in Allah/Sunnatullah and the Last Day on friendly terms with those who oppose Allah/Sunnatullah and His Messenger, though they be their fathers, their sons, their brothers or their clan. Allah has inscribed iman upon such people´s hearts and will reinforce them with a Ruh from Him and admit them into Gardens with rivers flowing under them, remaining in them timelessly, for ever. Allah is pleased with them and they are pleased with Him. Such people are the party of Allah. Truly it is the party of Allah who are successful. (58:22)

(https://i.ibb.co/SQh3sRZ/58-22.jpg)

You will never find a people (58:22)

So which prophets/rasuls that you follow? Which will accept you as Muslim? :hmm

(https://i.ibb.co/sJGMDZL/lol.gif)
Title: Re: The religion of the Illuminati is pagan pantheism/spiritualism/New Ageism
Post by: good logic on September 09, 2021, 12:41:44 PM
Peace brother.
 I take  hypocrisy, lightly. It is just a joke . If nobody wants to be a hypocrite, then nobody is one.

Everyone hates hypocrisy,
unless it happens to suit  their purpose.
 
Who does a hypocrite really hate?
A hypocrite!

Me ,I cannot tell the difference, so everybody must be normal unless they tell me otherwise. .
Who has the courage to be a hypocrite?,
Oh sorry, the fungus is such a hypocrite?
because it doesn't have mushroom to talk.
GOD bless you.
Peace.
Title: Re: The religion of the Illuminati is pagan pantheism/spiritualism/New Ageism
Post by: Green Anarchism on September 09, 2021, 01:04:54 PM
Me ,I cannot tell the difference

That's normal for a centrist, nothing unusual..  :rotfl:

(https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-eA5fbp_jDG8/YQg55cRL5II/AAAAAAAAAnQ/gfaSC340Bqkp_EbRU_db3VoRB1l68yLjACLcBGAsYHQ/s0/WHATISTRUTH.jpg)

So I don't bother to talk/believe in something I cannot prove... we're on a different level lol

You will never find a people (58:22)

So which prophets/rasuls that you follow? Which will accept you as Muslim? :hmm


Say: ´Who is the LordLaw of the heavens and the earth?´ Say: ´Allah/Way of Allah/Sunnatullah.´ Say: ´So why have you taken protectors apart from Him who possess no power to help or harm themselves?´ Say: ´Are the blind and seeing equal? Or are darkness and light the same? Or have they assigned partners to Allah/Way of Allah/Sunnatullah who create as He creates, so that all creating seems the same to them?´ Say: ´Allah is the Creator of everything. He is the One, the All-Conquering.´ (13:16)


So much for wishful thinking...

(https://i.ibb.co/sJGMDZL/lol.gif)
Title: Re: The religion of the Illuminati is pagan pantheism/spiritualism/New Ageism
Post by: good logic on September 09, 2021, 01:37:12 PM
So you only believe in what you prove?
I do not believe you until I see the proof .

I do not believe 9/11 was a government plot. Proof: It worked.

I do not believe Covid virus is a government plot. Proof: It worked.

I do believe Covid vaccine is a government plot: Proof: It does not work.

My toaster is not water proof. Proof: I was shocked!

When you feel lonely, watch a really scary horror movie. Proof: You will feel someone else with you.

Santa Claus is a man. Proof; No woman will wear the same outfit every year.

Anyway, do you know what was my worse day looking for proofs? The day I found out my toaster was not water proof.

Keep on proving things brother.
GOD bless you.
Peace.
Title: Re: The religion of the Illuminati is pagan pantheism/spiritualism/New Ageism
Post by: Green Anarchism on September 09, 2021, 01:41:41 PM
So you only believe in what you prove?
I do not believe you until I see the proof .

I do not believe 9/11 was a government plot. Proof: It worked.

I do not believe Covid virus is a government plot. Proof: It worked.

I do believe Covid vaccine is a government plot: Proof: It does not work.

My toaster is not water proof. Proof: I was shocked!

When you feel lonely, watch a really scary horror movie. Proof: You will feel someone else with you.

Santa Claus is a man. Proof; No woman will wear the same outfit every year.

Anyway, do you know what was my worse day looking for proofs? The day I found out my toaster was not water proof.

Keep on proving things brother.
GOD bless you.
Peace.

Suddenly you're against Allah and the Quran... that's how you prove the hypocrites  :rotfl:

Do not follow blindly what you do not know to be true: ears, eyes, and heart, you will be questioned about all these (17:36)

(https://i.ibb.co/sJGMDZL/lol.gif)

When you see them, their outward form appeals to you, and if they speak you listen to what they say. But they are like propped-up planks of ROTTEN/wood/floor (not to step on... or you will fall  >>LOWEST HELL 4:145<< :rotfl: ).

(https://preview.redd.it/lec6ybzuezk41.jpg?auto=webp&s=18de531dffad16a1210503dcc30b1f3e2fbace2c)

They imagine every cry/TEST/SORROW to be against them. They are the real enemy, so beware of them. Allah fight them! How they are perverted! (63:4)

They try to fool God and the believers, but they fool only themselves and do not even realize it. (2:9)  :rotfl:
Title: Re: The religion of the Illuminati is pagan pantheism/spiritualism/New Ageism
Post by: good logic on September 09, 2021, 02:23:52 PM
Eyes ,ear and a brain?
 Well I have 8 eyes, no brain and 3 ears. You can say I am ugly and dumb.
Yes.  I have 3 ears like doctor Spock? one right ear ,one left ear and one final front ear.
My ears hate badminton  because of the racket.
At the moment I only use one ear,the other two are bandaged. I was ironing and the phone rang that is when I accidently burnt one of them, the other one was burned when I immediately  tried to call the ambulance.

Now I cannot tell between corn on the cob and corn off the cob. I am left with one ear  and no punchline!
I know I have given you some pretty bad ear jokes, but my eye jokes are even cornea.
GOD bless you.
Peace.
Title: Re: The religion of the Illuminati is pagan pantheism/spiritualism/New Ageism
Post by: Emre_1974tr on September 09, 2021, 04:21:31 PM

And;

you are a lier pagan.

Sunnatullah is not law of Nature. This is your lie.

If you read before and after the relevant verse, it explains the method and reason of Allah's punishment. It is the religious law practiced by God.

3:137 Many nations have come before you, so roam the earth and see how the punishment was for the deniers.

17:77 Such was the way of those whom We had sent before you of Our messengers. And you will not find any change in Our way.

33:38 There is no blame on the prophet in doing anything that God has decreed upon him. Such was the way of God with the people of old. And the command of God is a determined duty.

35:43 Arrogance on the earth, and evil scheming. And the evil schemes only backfire on those who scheme them. Were they expecting anything different from the ways used on the people of the past? You will not find any change in the way of God, and you will not find any bypass to the way of God.

40:85 But their belief could not help them once they saw Our might; such is the way of God that has been established for His servants; and the rejecters were then totally in loss.

And;

Quran 112:3 "Never did He beget, nor was He begotten,"

Quran 112:4 "None is equal to Him."

Pantheism, Trinity,Polytheism(shirk) are wrong.

****


Quran 43:15 They assigned a share to Him from His own servants! The human being is clearly denying.

The Pagans think they believe in one God, but in reality they have faith in many gods.

Quran 21:43 Or do they have gods that will protect them from Us? They cannot help themselves, nor can they be protected from Us.

The verse tells one of the reasons for the to attribute a partner to (God) of the villains; To seek refuge in the imaginary gods to protect themselves from God...

For example, seeing Jesus as a partner in God is a kind of.

Bad people seek refuge in the partners to escape from God.

***

Communism, idolatry, pantheism, holy people, pain, spirits, poverty... These are from Paganism/Spiritualism.

7:32 Say, "Who has forbidden the nice things that God has brought forth for His servants and the good provisions?" Say, "They are in this worldly life for those who acknowledge, and they will be exclusive for them on the day of Resurrection" We thus explain the signs for those who know.

God's blessings are a gift to us.

But, pagan teachings are to prohibit the blessings of the world and the hereafter.

***

Pantheist İluminati is communist too.

And now they are trying to make the world adopt communism and pantheism.
Title: Re: The religion of the Illuminati is pagan pantheism/spiritualism/New Ageism
Post by: Green Anarchism on September 09, 2021, 08:40:06 PM
(https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-eA5fbp_jDG8/YQg55cRL5II/AAAAAAAAAnQ/gfaSC340Bqkp_EbRU_db3VoRB1l68yLjACLcBGAsYHQ/s0/WHATISTRUTH.jpg)
Eyes ,ear and a brain?
 Well I have 8 eyes, no brain and 3 ears. You can say I am ugly and dumb.
Yes.  I have 3 ears like doctor Spock? one right ear ,one left ear and one final front ear.
My ears hate badminton  because of the racket.
At the moment I only use one ear,the other two are bandaged. I was ironing and the phone rang that is when I accidently burnt one of them, the other one was burned when I immediately  tried to call the ambulance.

Now I cannot tell between corn on the cob and corn off the cob. I am left with one ear  and no punchline!
I know I have given you some pretty bad ear jokes, but my eye jokes are even cornea.
GOD bless you.
Peace.

so according to you that is jurisprudence (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jurisprudence)?

(https://i.postimg.cc/3xM9WQWv/504169505263783.gif)

I'm only responsible for what I say, but not for what you understand ...  can't fix it. lol
Title: Re: The religion of the Illuminati is pagan pantheism/spiritualism/New Ageism
Post by: Green Anarchism on September 09, 2021, 08:44:05 PM
But, pagan teachings are to prohibit the blessings of the world and the hereafter.

ie. Law of Nature... the Law of Cause & Effect, therefore... you're pagan   :rotfl:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uxhc0mq_c48
Title: Re: The religion of the Illuminati is pagan pantheism/spiritualism/New Ageism
Post by: good logic on September 10, 2021, 04:05:14 AM
Peace Green Anarchism.

Do you want people to only agree  on your take of cause and effect? Or do you think they do not deserve to know their way? Or that they do not deserve yours?

Do you know that you are also subject to the quantum effect/? Or are you telling me you do not behave differently when you are observed?

Me, I used to think I understand my take on the cause and effect , but the more  I keep looking into it the more I am less and less sure.

For example, why  do some people prefer to take the covid vaccine and some don t.

Oh before I go I must tell you when William Shakespeare came to get vaccinated:

Nurse: Which arm?

Shakespeare: As You Like It

Nurse: Was that painful?

Shakespeare: Much Ado About Nothing

Nurse: You will have to have a second jab.

Shakespeare: Measure For Measure

Nurse: So what do you think of the general awareness with regard to Covid?

Shakespeare: Comedy Of Errors

Nurse: I heard your wife Anne decided to get vaccinated in the company of her friends?

Shakespeare: The Merry Wives of Windsor

Nurse: Did you try convincing her?

Shakespeare: Love’s Labour Lost

Nurse: Wouldn’t she listen to you?

Shakespeare: A Midsummer Night’s Dream

Nurse: So what happened at the other vaccination centre?

Shakespeare: The Tempest

Nurse: But it worked out?

Shakespeare: The Taming Of The Shrew

Nurse: So it is okay then?

Shakespeare: All’s Well That Ends Well

Shakespeare: Will I have any adverse effects?

Nurse:. Wait until The Twelfth Night.

GOD bless you.
Peace.
 
Title: Re: The religion of the Illuminati is pagan pantheism/spiritualism/New Ageism
Post by: Green Anarchism on September 10, 2021, 07:50:02 AM
Children of Adam, did I not make a covenant with you not to serve Satan/6:112, who is clearly your enemy? (36:60)

(https://i.ibb.co/VHRnXFk/giphy-2021-04-28-T143703-728.gif)

Musa said, ´My Lord, I have no control over anyone but myself and my brother, so make a clear distinction between us and this deviant people.´ (5:25)

Peace Green Anarchism.

Do you want people to only agree  on your take of cause and effect? Or do you think they do not deserve to know their way? Or that they do not deserve yours?

(https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-L4yfysZFt-o/YB9smCuTQ2I/AAAAAAAACvY/XB4NfkxqJNAHabv-UQd5VySG5XWcfhHOACLcBGAsYHQ/s0/Syahadat.jpg) (https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-rJLmyKpxKW0/YB9vi3nK18I/AAAAAAAACvs/8XnRpbn3LZsULYt4ioC58wGDVEHsR7-jwCLcBGAsYHQ/s0/Philo.jpg)

Do you know that you are also subject to the quantum effect/? Or are you telling me you do not behave differently when you are observed?

Me, I used to think I understand my take on the cause and effect , but the more  I keep looking into it the more I am less and less sure.

For example, why  do some people prefer to take the covid vaccine and some don t.

Oh before I go I must tell you when William Shakespeare came to get vaccinated:

Do whatever you like, and Allah also gave me the right/60:4 to hate you for my salvation..

who are you then to say I don't have those right? :rotfl:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xSnDk3Qmqms

(https://i.ibb.co/BfBHBZY/punk.jpg)

The hypocrites (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3mPazYL5Nks&t=263s) will be in the lowest depths of Hell (4:145)

(https://i.ibb.co/c6yQbHD/X1.gif)

On the Day We will say to Hell, "Are you full?" And it will say, "Are there some more?" (50:30)


Nurse: Which arm?

Shakespeare: As You Like It

Nurse: Was that painful?

Shakespeare: Much Ado About Nothing

Nurse: You will have to have a second jab.

Shakespeare: Measure For Measure

Nurse: So what do you think of the general awareness with regard to Covid?

Shakespeare: Comedy Of Errors

Nurse: I heard your wife Anne decided to get vaccinated in the company of her friends?

Shakespeare: The Merry Wives of Windsor

Nurse: Did you try convincing her?

Shakespeare: Love’s Labour Lost

Nurse: Wouldn’t she listen to you?

Shakespeare: A Midsummer Night’s Dream

Nurse: So what happened at the other vaccination centre?

Shakespeare: The Tempest

Nurse: But it worked out?

Shakespeare: The Taming Of The Shrew

Nurse: So it is okay then?

Shakespeare: All’s Well That Ends Well

Shakespeare: Will I have any adverse effects?

Nurse:. Wait until The Twelfth Night.

GOD bless you.
Peace.

Keep the story to yourself...  :rotfl:

Shaytans from both mankind and from the jinn, who inspire each other with delusions by means of specious words (6:112)

We did not teach him/BELIEVERS poetry, nor does he need it. This is a reminder and a clear Quran/ARGUMENT (36:69)
Title: Re: Theism vs Panentheism
Post by: Jafar on September 10, 2021, 11:26:09 AM
As a being, God is completely outside of what He created. That is, he is physically outside the universes.

But he is everywhere as a manager and observer. Observing something from the outside is not integrating with it. Managing something from the outside does not mean integrating with it.

You haven't answered my previous question:
Where is the border that define "inside" and "outside"?
Your definition of the word "God" here implies that "God" has border.
As such "God" is NOT infinite... but finite.

Something that has 'border' definitely have possibility of 'many-ness'.
It then can refer to 'itself' as "me" and to others as "he/she/it/them/you".
While something that has 'NO BORDER'  (infinite) then the only possibility is 'one-ness'.

I'm sorry but I found your explanation unintelligible and conflicting.
Yet I have no desire or wishes to change your view either, you are free to believe whatever you want.


Quote
No, old Arabs see those gods as reflections, shadows, parts of one God. And they called the main God Allah.

Pagans have a panentheist or pantheistic philosophy.

Pagan Arabism tradition have many Gods..
Latta, Uzza, Thalab, Manaf, etc..
More than 100 but some of the list can be found here:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_pre-Islamic_Arabian_deities

Each of those Gods, are distinct personalities, have border between "me" and "others".
And they're competing with each others, jealous of each others, warring with each others.
And definitely get angry / pissed off when their human servant / worshipper switched to worship another God.

Basically nearly all of those Gods are crazy / narcisstic / power hungry / brutal and psycho-pathic personalities.

They demand "offerings" from their worshipper, ranging from agricultural products, incense, livestock and even human blood or even human life.

When they're not 'pleased' they will get angry, and when they're angry they will put forth a punishment!
Thus their 'human servants' worshipped them out of FEAR.
And definitely they demanded 100% loyalty from their 'human servants'.

Thus people are then named based on the God that they worshipped.
Such as Abdul-Muthalib (Servant of Thalab), Abdul-Manaf (Servant of Manaf) etc..
Because the contract of serving a God is a lifetime++ contract, when they switched to another God, a very heavy punishment awaited them, both while they're living and after they die.

Such is the 'cultural context' of Arab Paganism.
Thus it fits the "THEIST" model perfectly, hence the name "POLY - THEISM' , many distinct/finite Gods. And all of those Gods are crazy.
Title: Re: Theism vs Panentheism
Post by: Emre_1974tr on September 10, 2021, 12:53:24 PM
You haven't answered my previous question:
Where is the border that define "inside" and "outside"?
Your definition of the word "God" here implies that "God" has border.
As such "God" is NOT infinite... but finite.

Something that has 'border' definitely have possibility of 'many-ness'.
It then can refer to 'itself' as "me" and to others as "he/she/it/them/you".
While something that has 'NO BORDER'  (infinite) then the only possibility is 'one-ness'.



No, on the contrary.

An infinitely powerful being can create out of nothing. In other words, it can create a completely separate entity from itself.

On the other hand, what you believe is a limited being and cannot create. However, it can transform from the existing one, that is, derive it. Of the limited gods you believe in. namely pagan cults.

Pantheism and panentheism are shirk swamps. It is an even greater deviation from the belief in the Trinity. If pantheism or panentheism were real, shirk would not be the greatest sin/haram. For in all things God and holiness as being would be more or less. But the situation is exactly the opposite, shirk is the biggest sin. Because Allah, the Almighty, has the power to create out of nothing. It has the power to create beings completely separate from itself. Here you are denying Allah, by not believing in his power.

****

Again no, all those Arab gods are parts, shadows, reflections, extensions of Allah, the main god. If you read the Qur'an in its entirety, the pre-Islamic Arabs still believed in one God, but they had taken common gods with Him. They were in shirk. So they had a pantheistic philosophy.

They were just like Hindus and other pagans. Just like other pantheists...
Title: Re: Theism vs Panentheism
Post by: Green Anarchism on September 10, 2021, 01:08:57 PM
No, on the contrary.

You can't even understand the question, and yet think you're smarter than anyone else  ... :rotfl:

So let me help you understand the THE QUESTION  ... the issue of "duality (shirk)" of existence ..  lol




Say (before death comes upon you): He, Allah/LIGHT/24:35, is One (112:1) ELSE, shirk!

On the Day We will say to Hell, "Are you full?" And it will say, "Are there some more/SHIRK/muSHRIK?" (50:30)

--------------------------------------------------------

Muhammad's Allah

https://www.ahmedhulusi.org/en/book/muhammads-allah/non-centricity

(https://www.ahmedhulusi.org/content/images/small_en-allah.png)

Non-Centricity

Allah is infinite and limitless…

Thus, it is impossible for Allah to have a center!

In order for something to have a center it must have defined parameters, so the intersection point of its corners can be called its center.

Whereas, Allah has no boundary!

If something has no boundaries it cannot have a center!

Hence, it follows that something without a center cannot have a core or shell, an interior or an exterior!

According to our five-sense perception and the material world we assume as a result of it, an object has inner and outer aspects: a core and a shell. But how can such concepts pertain to something that does not have a center?!

The Quran emphasizes this truth with the following verse:

“HU is the Awwal (the first and initial state of existence) and the Akhir (the infinitely subsequent One, to all manifestation), the Zahir (the explicit, unequivocal and perceivable manifestation; the Absolute Reality beyond the illusion) and the Batin (the unperceivable reality within the perceivable manifestation, the source of the unknown; the Absolute Self beyond the illusory selves)! He is Aleem over all things (the Knower of all things as their creator with His Names)!” (Quran 57:3)

That is, concepts such as the first, the subsequent, the outwardly explicit and the inwardly implicit all pertain to the same reality (https://www.ahmedhulusi.org/en/book/muhammads-allah/unity-of-existence-vs-unity-of-witness); all of it is Allah (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sufi_metaphysics). The manifest and the hidden are not different things; it is our perception that defines them as different (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AqnEGu8VF8Y). The First, the Last, the Manifest and the Hidden all point to ALLAH.

Whether you refer to Allah as the Az-Zahir or the Al-Batin, whether you call Allah Al-Awwal or the Al-Akhir, all of these terms denote the same reality (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jrXGfK5I_rU).

But if we had six or seven or even twelve senses rather than five, our concept of explicit and implicit would have been entirely different! Perhaps we would have perceived what is external or manifest to us today as internal or hidden, or vice versa!

The limitless, infinite ONE denoted by the name Allah is free from concepts such as explicit and implicit. These concepts are only so according to our assumptions (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AqnEGu8VF8Y).

Indeed, how can the One who is beyond conceptualized limitations, such as explicit-implicit and beginning-end, possibly end somewhere at which point a second form of existence begins? Clearly this is not possible! Therefore, every point to which thoughts or imagination can reach contains only the Essence of Allah, the Ahad, with all of His compositional qualities and attributes!

He who believes in the existence of another can only do so as a result of a lack of deep contemplation! This in religious terms is called shirq or duality.


-------------------------------------------------------

Who controls hearing and sight? (10:31)

WHO?
Title: Re: Theism vs Panentheism
Post by: Jafar on September 10, 2021, 08:23:39 PM
No, on the contrary.

An infinitely powerful being can create out of nothing. In other words, it can create a completely separate entity from itself.

By separate entity here it means separate finite entity or separate infinite entity?

When an infinite entity created a SEPARATE FINITE entity then as consequences there will be a border which makes the once infinite entity will no longer become infinite (borderless) but finite (bordered).
Thus I ask the question again: Where is this border?

While there is no possibility that there are multiple infinite entities.
There could only be one infinite entity that is possible to exist.

I'm sorry I still found your concept unintelligible and conflicting..

Quote
Again no, all those Arab gods are parts, shadows, reflections, extensions of Allah, the main god. If you read the Qur'an in its entirety, the pre-Islamic Arabs still believed in one God, but they had taken common gods with Him. They were in shirk. So they had a pantheistic philosophy.

Again you use two different words here God and god. And then put another pairing word with it such as "common god". So there is 'uncommon god' too?
What is your definition of those two words?

Within Arab society (and nearly the entire middle east in general) they do see god as finite entity, that's why conflict among the gods is possible and each gods demands 100% loyalty from it's servant. By 100% loyalty here it means becoming servant of a god and not also servant of another gods.

In the same manner as a woman demands 100% loyalty from her husband of not becoming also a husband of another woman. Which implies that another woman does exist thus becoming husband of another woman is a possibility.

By putting 100% loyalty to a specific woman, the man become a MONO-GAMY. Otherwise when the man also have another wife he become POLY-GAMY.
In the same manner as by putting 100% loyalty to a god, the servant become a MONO-THEIST otherwise when he also serve other god(s) the servant become POLY-THEIST
Title: Re: Theism vs Panentheism
Post by: Emre_1974tr on September 11, 2021, 04:12:30 AM
By separate entity here it means separate finite entity or separate infinite entity?

When an infinite entity created a SEPARATE FINITE entity then as consequences there will be a border which makes the once infinite entity will no longer become infinite (borderless) but finite (bordered).
Thus I ask the question again: Where is this border?



No, you haven't thought enough about concepts and events. You are the one in conflict.

When there was nothing, God was. It is timeless and spaceless. He created other beings when there was nothing but Himself.

You think that God is in an infinite space and covers it. No, it's out of place. What is called nothingness is not the vacuum of space. God's creation out of nothing means that he creates completely separate from himself. That is, he did not derive from anything, he did not derive from himself. He literally created it out of nothing. In your pagan limited understanding of god, this creation thing seems impossible. But it is possible for God in reality. Allah is a being who can create and has infinite power. This is why shirk is forbidden. If you are in shirk, you do not believe in creation from nothing, you deny Allah.

Being eternal does not mean being physically everywhere. Your meaning of infinity is wrong. Though the physical meaning of infinity is misunderstood even in mathematics. For example, there is no such thing as an infinite number, but there is an endless increase of numbers, the process itself is infinite. In heaven your age will never be eternal, but your age will increase forever and ever.

Before God created anything, there was no other being. There was no such thing as outer space. There were no assets.

It is in this painting that he created a being completely outside himself. God is capable of it. In the understanding of God that you believe in, it means that he can only transform himself, can only change the existing, that is, he cannot create. Even we humans make such derivations. You don't believe in God. You believe in a being with very limited power, knowledge and ability.

No again. The ancient Arabs, like the Hindus, believed that the gods were the reflection, part, shadow, partner of the main god. Mother God is unlimited, integral with others in their beliefs. In fact, everything is the main god in the eyes of pagans. They are pantheists. As I said, sub-gods are only reflection, manifestation, partners, part.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Panentheism#Hinduism

Hindus call him Brahman
The ancient Arabs called Allah.

According to them, all beings are manifestations of this main god. Other sub-gods are of course limited beings. But Brahman is unlimited for them.

The pagans are aware that the statues they make are not gods. These idols they make are symbols. Likewise, the gods they symbolize are manifestations of the main God.

In addition, the belief in the trinity in Christianity is pantheist in itself. So what appears to be three separate gods is actually the manifestation of One God.

In short, pantheism and panentheism are paganism itself.

Pagans advocate unity in existence.

Monotheism is the opposite. God is completely separate from His creation. God is one. But there are other beings that God created apart from himself. But these beings have no partnership, no connection with God. No created being is holy. No created thing is divine. God has the power to create out of nothing.
Title: Re: The religion of the Illuminati is pagan pantheism/spiritualism/New Ageism
Post by: good logic on September 11, 2021, 06:06:57 AM
Brother Emre.

GOD said we take on other gods aware or unaware.  whatever seems to make sense to us . Yet our sense is only tailored for our universe and surroundings.

The idea of "Unique being" does not come to it for many.

When GOD says He is everywhere , does it really mean everywhere and everything is GOD? Or we are all within GOD? Are we aware of all the invisible things /other dimensions that are around us and with us?
We are not even aware of other invisible forces and spectrums of lights that are in our universe

Many examples of things we cannot be aware of that exist with us. Here are my favourites:
1-Conversation between two people:

Her: I used to be Christian.

Him: It's all right, I don't really care for those sorts of things.

Her; Thank god! It's so much better now that I'm Christine!

2-In the beginning there was nothing. God said "Let there be light!"
There was still nothing, but now you could see it..

3-After God created 24 hours of alternating darkness and light, one of the angels asked him, "what are you going to do now?"
God said,
"I think I'm going to call it a day."

4-We ignore GOD s existence and only talk to/ask Him in time of danger to our life or when we need something .( Just ask yourself if you are part of GOD!)

And my favourite

There is no God -Stephen Hawking, 2011
There is no Stephen Hawking God, 2018

We will all find out why we die eventually.
GOD bless you.
Peace.
Title: Re: The religion of the Illuminati is pagan pantheism/spiritualism/New Ageism
Post by: Emre_1974tr on September 11, 2021, 07:03:47 AM
Brother Emre.

GOD said we take on other gods aware or unaware.  whatever seems to make sense to us . Yet our sense is only tailored for our universe and surroundings.

The idea of "Unique being" does not come to it for many.

When GOD says He is everywhere , does it really mean everywhere and everything is GOD? Or we are all within GOD? Are we aware of all the invisible things /other dimensions that are around us and with us?
We are not even aware of other invisible forces and spectrums of lights that are in our universe

Many examples of things we cannot be aware of that exist with us. Here are my favourites:
1-Conversation between two people:

Her: I used to be Christian.

Him: It's all right, I don't really care for those sorts of things.

Her; Thank god! It's so much better now that I'm Christine!

2-In the beginning there was nothing. God said "Let there be light!"
There was still nothing, but now you could see it..

3-After God created 24 hours of alternating darkness and light, one of the angels asked him, "what are you going to do now?"
God said,
"I think I'm going to call it a day."

4-We ignore GOD s existence and only talk to/ask Him in time of danger to our life or when we need something .( Just ask yourself if you are part of GOD!)

And my favourite

There is no God -Stephen Hawking, 2011
There is no Stephen Hawking God, 2018

We will all find out why we die eventually.
GOD bless you.
Peace.

Hello Brother;

The invisible beings mentioned in the verses are also servants created by Allah out of nothing.

They are physically separate from God.

God is outside of us. physically outside of all the universes he created. But of course, it has surrounded and surrounded its creations. And it is very close to us.

As a manager and observer, Allah is everywhere. In fact, since he is timeless, God is present at the points of the future, the past, and the present at the same time, as the ruler and observer. If we got into a time machine, we would see that Allah is present as an observer and administrator at the same time in every time zone we go to. But as I said, this management and observation work takes place physically from the outside.

For God as being, there is no such distinction as future time, present time or past time. God is timeless and spaceless. that is, God is outside of time and space. He created time and space for us.

It is also possible to express that Allah surrounds His creations, so we are inside Allah. But such a statement can also be misleading. Because, for example, a multidimensional being can touch the jugular vein of us three-dimensional beings completely from the outside.

In short, God is physically outside the universes He created.

And that's why shirk is the biggest unforgivable sin. For none of us are part or extension, or manifestation or associates of Him.

God has the power to create from nothing. The critical point lies in the fact that we, the servants, see this.

Peace
Title: Re: The religion of the Illuminati is pagan pantheism/spiritualism/New Ageism
Post by: Green Anarchism on September 11, 2021, 08:27:38 AM
Therefore

Stay away from this teaching. By the way, the fake Bible is also a semi-New Ageism book too.

(https://i.postimg.cc/3xM9WQWv/504169505263783.gif)

Whoever Allah does not bless with light will have no light! (24:40)

Say (before death comes upon you): He, Allah/LIGHT/24:35, is One (112:1) ELSE, shirk!

On the Day We will say to Hell, "Are you full?" And it will say, "Are there some more/SHIRK/muSHRIK?" (50:30)

Title: Re: The religion of the Illuminati is pagan pantheism/spiritualism/New Ageism
Post by: Jafar on September 11, 2021, 06:20:57 PM
The invisible beings mentioned in the verses are also servants created by Allah out of nothing.
They are physically separate from God.

Specifically where is this border / limit that physically separated God from this "invisible beings"?

Quote
God is outside of us. physically outside of all the universes he created. But of course, it has surrounded and surrounded its creations. And it is very close to us.

Since you said "God is outside of us"
Who and what are "us" in this case?

Let's take a human individual for example.
The border / limit that usually being regarded as a human individual is his/her physical body.
Thus there's an Inside the physical body and Outside the physical body.
Thanks to such definition of the border / limit, the "Inside" and "Outside" of a human can then be defined.

Thus God is outside of human physical body?
And since you said God is in the surrounding, you mean God still inside let's say the air?

This relate to the question which now I've asked 3 times already.
Where is the border? Limit?
That separated God with "Not God"?

Quote
As a manager and observer, Allah is everywhere. In fact, since he is timeless, God is present at the points of the future, the past, and the present at the same time, as the ruler and observer. If we got into a time machine, we would see that Allah is present as an observer and administrator at the same time in every time zone we go to. But as I said, this management and observation work takes place physically from the outside.

If this Allah is everywhere and timeless, then this Allah has no border in both space dimension and time dimension. Or put it the other way around only something that has no border in both space and time dimension can be everywhere and timeless.

IF this is the definition of "Allah" then it fits well with the definition of The One Infinite Creator.

The One Infinite Creator has no border in any dimension, including THIS time and space.
Since all time and space itself was created by The One Infinite Creator.
And yes there are many time and space, how many? Infinite....

This automatically implies that it is not possible there are others Infinite Creator.
Given an infinity cannot have any border / limit, once it has border / limit then it will become something that is finite.

In time, once something has a beginning, then definitely it will have an end.
In space, once a border is being defined, only then inside and outside can be defined. Without such border, inside and outside cannot even be defined.

Since there are no other Infinite Creator.
Thus it's weird and confusing to say that one MUST NOT serve other Infinite Creator.
Since there are no other Infinite Creator other than The One that is Infinite.

In husband & wife metaphor that I mentioned earlier, the dialogue will be something like this.
Woman: You must not took another woman as your wife.
Man: You're the only woman that exist.. hellloooo??

As such the requirement of one MUST NOT serve other Infinite Creator is quite ridiculous since there isn't any other Infinite Creator in the first place. The act of serving the other Infinite Creator other than The One Infinite Creator is impossible to be performed.
Title: Re: The religion of the Illuminati is pagan pantheism/spiritualism/New Ageism
Post by: good logic on September 11, 2021, 11:28:51 PM
"If this Allah is everywhere and timeless, then this Allah has no border in both space dimension and time dimension. Or put it the other way around only something that has no border in both space and time dimension can be everywhere and timeless."

What you say above Jafar does not mean this infinite creator is not a separate entity. Nor dies it mean that the creations are the infinite creator or parts of the creator..

Can dimensions superimpose one another?

Imagine GOD as a room - infinite room- that holds different furniture- dimensions that superimpose one another-. furniture is not the room nor the room is the furniture.

What s the problem with the Creator being unique and separate?
GOD bless you.
Peace.
Title: Re: The religion of the Illuminati is pagan pantheism/spiritualism/New Ageism
Post by: Emre_1974tr on September 12, 2021, 03:45:36 AM
Allah is outside the universes He created and time. So it's outside the vacuum of space. Therefore, it does not travel in space, nor does it travel in time.

 But We are in time and space, and we travel in time and space.

For example, we are constantly traveling to the future time slowly.

As I said before, a multidimensional being can touch the internal organs of a three-dimensional being from the outside. In other words, Allah is physically outside the universes, but at the same time He is close to every particle, down to our jugular vein.

Apart from that, I always state that he is everywhere as a manager and observer. But He can be physically too, close to our jugular vein.

The number of universes created by Allah is finite. There is no such thing as an infinite number. But there is a number that keeps increasing endlessly. Our age will never be indefinite in Paradise, but our age will constantly increase forever.

It is by Allah's will that we(Paradise peoples) and the Universe of the Hereafter(Indallah/Lord's Floor) will live forever. As he says in the verses, he can do the opposite if he wishes, but as he promised, he chose to keep Paradise and its contents alive forever, and he will do so.

Since God is outside of time, what happens in the future for us is not the future for God. It has already happened. God does not travel in time. The life and existence of Allah is in a way that we cannot imagine.
Title: Re: The religion of the Illuminati is pagan pantheism/spiritualism/New Ageism
Post by: jkhan on September 12, 2021, 04:47:58 AM
Allah is outside the universes He created and time. So it's outside the vacuum of space. Therefore, it does not travel in space, nor does it travel in time.

 But We are in time and space, and we travel in time and space.

For example, we are constantly traveling to the future time slowly.

As I said before, a multidimensional being can touch the internal organs of a three-dimensional being from the outside. In other words, Allah is physically outside the universes, but at the same time He is close to every particle, down to our jugular vein.

Apart from that, I always state that he is everywhere as a manager and observer. But He can be physically too, close to our jugular vein.

The number of universes created by Allah is finite. There is no such thing as an infinite number. But there is a number that keeps increasing endlessly. Our age will never be indefinite in Paradise, but our age will constantly increase forever.

It is by Allah's will that we(Paradise peoples) and the Universe of the Hereafter(Indallah/Lord's Floor) will live forever. As he says in the verses, he can do the opposite if he wishes, but as he promised, he chose to keep Paradise and its contents alive forever, and he will do so.

Since God is outside of time, what happens in the future for us is not the future for God. It has already happened. God does not travel in time. The life and existence of Allah is in a way that we cannot imagine.

Peace my brother in belief....

Whatever the universe even it is many thousands of solar system and a galaxy and many galaxies are combined as universe and such seven universes is Samawathi in Arabic for you then..  God explains in verse number
 9:36 "Surely the number of months with Allah is twelve months in Allah's ordinance since the day when He created the heavens(samawathi) and the earth,
Explain pls the above with logic... Does universe has twelve months identical to earth? According to you it seems earth has one reckoning and universe has another and Allah has another.. But with Allah for earth and samawathi only 12 months.. If earth consider according sun 12 months then universe then samawathi also 12 months just according to sun.. No change in it..

By the way what's this You keep repeating Inda Allah as Allah's  floor...  Why?  Can you explain the word Inda Allah in the above verse please...

Title: Re: The religion of the Illuminati is pagan pantheism/spiritualism/New Ageism
Post by: Emre_1974tr on September 12, 2021, 07:00:34 AM
Peace my brother in belief....

Whatever the universe even it is many thousands of solar system and a galaxy and many galaxies are combined as universe and such seven universes is Samawathi in Arabic for you then..  God explains in verse number
 9:36 "Surely the number of months with Allah is twelve months in Allah's ordinance since the day when He created the heavens(samawathi) and the earth,
Explain pls the above with logic... Does universe has twelve months identical to earth? According to you it seems earth has one reckoning and universe has another and Allah has another.. But with Allah for earth and samawathi only 12 months.. If earth consider according sun 12 months then universe then samawathi also 12 months just according to sun.. No change in it..

By the way what's this You keep repeating Inda Allah as Allah's  floor...  Why?  Can you explain the word Inda Allah in the above verse please...

Peace brother;

God says that from the moment our planet was created, 12 months were ordained for us earthlings. Then he touches on the issue of haram months and similar details.

This is not a statement that covers the whole universe and other universes. This is how it is in explanations about going to the Kaaba or pilgrimage or prayer too.

However, 12 months may have been ordained in the same way in Paradise. A similar and synchronized system with our world may have been established.

I touch on the subject of Indallah in my article, let me give it with machine translation:

https://translate.google.com/translate?sl=tr&tl=en&u=https://emre1974tr.blogspot.com/2011/07/zaman-zamanszlk-ve-rabbin-kat.html

Please pay attention to the following points;

1- The Universe of the Hereafter exists now and has different physical laws from our universe. And there are people living in that universe right now (I gave the relevant verses earlier).

2- The expanse of Paradise is said to be as great as the universes:

57:21 [Hence,] vie with one another in seeking to attain to your Sustainer's forgiveness, and [thus] to a paradise as vast as the heavens and the earth, which has been readied for those who have attained to faith in God and His Apostle: such is the bounty of God which He grants unto whomever He wills - for God is limitless in His great bounty.

3- It is said in the verses that the speed of time in the Hereafter Universe is different from that in our world (a thousand years have passed in our world versus one day spent there).

4- While other universes are destroyed by big crunch, the Hereafter Universe will live forever.(I gave the relevant verses earlier).

5- Other universes have planets too:

65.12 Allah is the one who created seven Heavens and from Earth like them (of corresponding type); [Allah's] command descends among them so that you may know that Allah is capable of anything and that Allah knows everything.

And they(other universes) have got creatures:

Quran 42:29“And among His Signs is the creation of the heavens and the earth, and of whatever living creatures (daabbah) He has spread forth in both. And He has the power to gather them together whenever he pleases”




Title: Theism vs Panen-Theism Opposition Pair
Post by: Jafar on September 13, 2021, 12:13:50 AM
Quote
Imagine GOD as a room - infinite room- that holds different furniture- dimensions that superimpose one another-. furniture is not the room nor the room is the furniture.


If INFINITE space is modeled as GOD
Then yes everything FINITE (Has border) such as furniture, room, window, doors is inside God.
Thus God is NOT 'separated' from any finite or bordered elements.
Since an INFINITE is merely a name for a definition of "Has no Border/Limit".

Thus the query of: is this furniture INFINITE? The answer is no, the furniture is FINITE, there is a limit, this is a furniture and that is NOT a furniture.
Also the query of is this room INFINITE? The answer is no, the room is FINITE, there is a limit, this is a room and that is NOT a room.
And so on for all things that is finite.

When a thing is FINITE / has border, then MANY-Ness is a possibility.
When a thing is INFINITE / no border, then only ONE is a possibility.

The thread starter is correct in terms of THEISM (FINITE THEOS) is nearly in direct opposition of PANEN-THEISM (AN INFINITE THEOS).

Multi Gods is possible in THEISM since God is Finite, While in PANEN-THEISM it's impossible.

Atheism is possible in THEISM since God is Finite, While in PANEN-THEISM it's impossible.
Those who cannot find the border / limit that define "God" and "Not God" will definitely say "God" do not exist, since actually the border / limit do not exist.

However it's true, that The One Infinite created many finite things.
And it's created with a pattern, everything have it's opposing pair.

Here we found THEISM vs PANEN-THEISM as opposing pair.

There are also:
Light vs Darkness
Hate vs Love
Fear vs Courage
Humility vs Pride
Forgiveness vs Revenge
Positive vs Negative
Matter vs Anti-Matter
and billions of other pairs...
The pattern can be shortened as IS vs IS-NOT.

Every finite things is created with it's opposing pair in order for the border thus differences can be recognized. Nonetheless both are originated from the same source, THE INFINITE, as there is no other source to begin with.

Thus any position that you took THEISM or PANEN-THEISM, Hatred or Love, Humility or Pride, you are serving the same One Infinite, given there is no other to serve in the first place.

Within PANEN-THEISM perspective, the motto of this forum; "God Alone", where God is understood as yet another name for The One Infinite is understood as:

"ONLY GOD THAT IS TRULY EXIST"

As everything else that has border / finite are merely temporary in existence.
Has a beginning (border) and definitely an end (another border).

In such viewpoint everything that is finite / has border are merely an illusion.
That is including you, me, us, them, this forum, any religion, any books, any nations, any planets, any stars, any galaxies and any universe.

From personal perspective, PANEN-THEISTS stop to seek the infinite externally from themselves and they start to seek a connection with the infinite within themselves.
As they see that The Infinite is inside me as well, every "me"..

You can see that they're trying to silence their own minds and seek to reduce their identity border that keep their identification separated from everything-else. The border that separated "me" with "you", "them". What they seek is a union with the infinite, and the only way to achieve that is when the their identification border no longer exist.

That's why THEIST aim for separation and in pairing opposition the PANEN-THEIST aim for unity, with the infinite.

Which one that you choose, it's up to you..
 
Title: : MonoTheism vs Panen-Theism
Post by: Emre_1974tr on September 13, 2021, 01:51:10 AM

If INFINITE space is modeled as GOD
Then yes everything FINITE (Has border) such as furniture, room, window, doors is inside God.
Thus God is NOT 'separated' from any finite or bordered elements.
Since an INFINITE is merely a name for a definition of "Has no Border/Limit".



No, on the contrary, in pantheism and panentheism, God is a limited being.

In monotheism, it is unlimited.

There is more than one god in pantheism and theism, and there is shirk.

In monotheism, God is one.

In pantheism and panantheism, a limited god cannot create anything. There is no existence other than God, and all that exists is illusion(acording to paganism).

In monotheism, on the other hand, God can create servants out of nothing. It is infinitely powerful. All his creations are separate from God, and therefore there is no holiness in the creatures.

Pantheism and panantheism are paganism.

Monotheism is the opposite of paganism.

All pagan teachings, from Hinduism to all other far eastern teachings, to ancient Arab teachings or to Indian(Native Americans) religions, are panentheistic or pantheistic.

The religion of Islam came to fight these pagan pantheist and panentheist teachings adoptively .

I still see that you don't understand the concept of infinity, what existence is, and you don't think about it enough, brother. Because your goal is to choose paganism/shirk.

Greetings and love
Title: Re: The religion of the Illuminati is pagan pantheism/spiritualism/New Ageism
Post by: Green Anarchism on September 13, 2021, 04:43:23 AM
Allah is the SUN
I am the SUNLIGHT

The sun alone is the true wujud

(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/proxy/mLsVpnsohvAQfY3oieccFMpF_89SFY4mKkBlRBeAN0pd9L8eWRbmd_MzaarH-UaW2Oe4TmkvSdAX0o5habf-gioAZonABNzG6jq_zabFVg)

while the sunlight dwell in nonexistence (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jrXGfK5I_rU)

Yes, it's that simple.   >:D


Do you not see how your Lord stretches out shadows (God's names and attributes)? If He had wished He could have made them stationary. Then We appoint the sun to be the pointer/shadows to them. Then We draw them back to Ourselves in gradual steps. (25:45-46)
Title: Re: : MonoTheism vs Panen-Theism
Post by: Emre_1974tr on September 14, 2021, 08:37:25 AM
No, on the contrary, in pantheism and panentheism, God is a limited being.

In monotheism, it is unlimited.

There is more than one god in pantheism and theism, and there is shirk.

In monotheism, God is one.

In pantheism and panantheism, a limited god cannot create anything. There is no existence other than God, and all that exists is illusion(acording to paganism).

In monotheism, on the other hand, God can create servants out of nothing. It is infinitely powerful. All his creations are separate from God, and therefore there is no holiness in the creatures.

Pantheism and panantheism are paganism.

Monotheism is the opposite of paganism.

All pagan teachings, from Hinduism to all other far eastern teachings, to ancient Arab teachings or to Indian(Native Americans) religions, are panentheistic or pantheistic.

The religion of Islam came to fight these pagan pantheist and panentheist teachings.

I still see that you don't understand the concept of infinity, what existence is, and you don't think about it enough, brother. Because your goal is to choose paganism/shirk.

Greetings and love

When there was nothing, there was only God.

When you say this, you think that there is a space around God and if God is infinite, he must also cover that space. No, space is an entity. There is no blank, no black or any color. Nothing.

You perceive this  nothing as the vacuum of space. No, there is nothing. It is a 3-dimensional space called space. No nothing there. No space, no vacuum.

Nothing is not the vacuum of space. It is not dark or vacuum. No existence, no space, no color, no vacuum, nothing. You confuse non-existence with the void of space.

There is only God.

Suppose there is a person and nothing else. There is no space around it. There is no darkness either. There is only that person.

It doesn't stretch to infinity, there is only a normal size human body. and nothing more than that.

This was the situation before Allah created it. There was only Him. It doesn't have to be physical size forever. Because there is nothing but him. There is no empty space that it covers. There is no time and place.

At this point, Allah creates out of nothing. Allah does not physically cover everything. It just creates a being other than itself.

In pantheism and panentheism, that is, paganism, God cannot create. It just transforms itself, that is, evolves. It only derives God.(in paganism). And so the creatures created in paganism are also divine and they are worshiped by pagans. Because they think they are part of God.

But the reality is exactly the opposite. Almighty Allah has the power to create from nothing. Therefore, all his creations are separate entities from himself. There is no holiness in the creatures.