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Other Issues => Hadith Discussions => Topic started by: dn1 on April 25, 2020, 08:09:40 AM

Title: Mutawathir Hadiths
Post by: dn1 on April 25, 2020, 08:09:40 AM
How you guys dispute hadiths which are mutawathir? Surely it being known to be translated by so many people adds to the authenticity of such a hadith no?
Title: Re: Mutawathir Hadiths
Post by: Wakas on April 25, 2020, 09:28:09 AM
Some questions:

What is your definition of a hadith which is "mutawathir"?

How do you determine the truthfulness of a statement? Let us know the various ways you come up with.

Let's say one can establish with a high degree of certainty a hadith is authentic does that automatically mean it has authority?
Title: Re: Mutawathir Hadiths
Post by: dn1 on April 25, 2020, 02:30:24 PM
Some questions:

What is your definition of a hadith which is "mutawathir"?

How do you determine the truthfulness of a statement? Let us know the various ways you come up with.

Let's say one can establish with a high degree of certainty a hadith is authentic does that automatically mean it has authority?

Hadith that Mutawathir is a hadith that has been so many times it's almost impossible to deny it's been said I believe

2)I'd say examine history, context etc and make your own judgement.

3) Could do depending on the context, for example if the Prophet said I leave behind two things the Qur'an and my Ahlulbayt, how can we say it doesn't have authority?
Title: Re: Mutawathir Hadiths
Post by: Wakas on April 26, 2020, 12:34:31 AM
Hadith that Mutawathir is a hadith that has been so many times it's almost impossible to deny it's been said I believe

I am aware of this general definition however I was looking for specifics. Various scholars have their own criteria, e.g. some say 4 independent sources (i.e. different transmission chains), some say 7, some say 12, some say 40 etc.



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2)I'd say examine history, context etc and make your own judgement.

Interestingly you never said test/examine the actual content/claim of the statement, or compare it to The Quran etc.

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3) Could do depending on the context, for example if the Prophet said I leave behind two things the Qur'an and my Ahlulbayt, how can we say it doesn't have authority?
The last sermon hadith has variations as you probably know.
In any case one way to determine authority is to compare it with a source you definitely consider authoritative e.g. Quran, and see if it allows for such.
Title: Re: Mutawathir Hadiths
Post by: Fadiva on May 09, 2020, 06:31:06 AM
 Can we take those hadiths as revelations from the God ? ( any clue ?) Is it just one proof that Allah confirms thoses adiths ? Are you able to prove that rassol Allah said that ?
How ?

I think that one must be careful.

I can't and I mustn't say that a hadith is from Allah without proof. An I can't do the same for all the nabi and messengers, because it's unfair and it is lying. I  haven't neither witnessed it nor have a guarantee that it is from Allah. Moreover it is unfair to attribute says to any people without proof or having witnessed it ( and be able to restore correctly the said without deformation), we can be liars.
Just imagine that a number of people say you've said a thing and it was partly or totally false, how would you react ?

If you have proof, tell me.

For me, it is not about rejecting those hadiths it's about being fair and not to lie.

I am not saying that one should not follow hadiths or something else, I say  that one should be careful and act fairly. We have to read carefully al quran, Allah said what one have to follow. He knows everything and guides whoever he wants.