If the Tauwrat, Zabur and Injeel are corrupted, why does the Quran say...

[si di]

@centi50

can i give my comment on it as i am now studying the story of Noah.By reading the story of Noah in the Bible,i came to the gopher wood and Moses (author?) didn?t know what Wood it is so i was sugesting that it is a tree unknown to eastern People.


And the Bible says that take seven pairs of the animal and backed with the quran i belive that the ark wasn?t so big as a part of the Bible is desribing it because of the 7 pairs and the quran is telling us that it is a localflood not worlwide.



So in my humble opinion they complement eachother

[quincy]

When you see Al-Injeel in Qur'an it doesnt mean that GOD mentions the canonized Gospels in todays Bible. GOD doesnt even mention Christianity, because Christianity main figure is Paul and his version of the "eternal Christ" and not 'Isa bin Maryam or Iesu-Maria, Yahushua, Emmanuel. GOD mentions the Nazarenes and the original aramaic Gospel of the Nazarenes which you can find if you search in the web, but i still think that it was altered by tibetian Monks. Paul violated the Torah to an extent that the "Goyim" now have a completely different religion, some of the Christians even believe that the God of the Old Testament and the God from the New Testament are 2 different deities. The Nazarene way was based on the Torah with addition of a liberal intepration from 'Isa bin Maryam which was called Al-Injeel.

If you read todays Bible on the Basis of the Qur'an, you wont go astray 

[si di]

If you read todays Bible on the Basis of the Qur'an, you wont go astray

thats good view but hardly someone is doing this and i would add to you pleasant sentce vice versa

[Novice]

God is Telling the people of the book to uphold the Torah and injeel. I am wondering now if those two the Torah and injeel we (I mean majority of traditional Muslims) say is corrupt why would God still tell the people of the book to uphold it and judge by it.

Please someone explain this to me.

So far I haven't understood the discussion on it

God bless you all

God bless

Quran is not telling us to let followers of Al-Injeel to decide as per their book but they were to decide as per their book when it was revealed to them. Please read 5:46-47 together to see what they mean.

5:46-47
وَقَفَّيۡنَا عَلَىٰٓ ءَاثَـٰرِهِم بِعِيسَى ٱبۡنِ مَرۡيَمَ مُصَدِّقً۬ا لِّمَا بَيۡنَ يَدَيۡهِ مِنَ ٱلتَّوۡرَٮٰةِ‌ۖ وَءَاتَيۡنَـٰهُ ٱلۡإِنجِيلَ فِيهِ هُدً۬ى وَنُورٌ۬ وَمُصَدِّقً۬ا لِّمَا بَيۡنَ يَدَيۡهِ مِنَ ٱلتَّوۡرَٮٰةِ وَهُدً۬ى وَمَوۡعِظَةً۬ لِّلۡمُتَّقِينَ (٤٦)

And We sent, following in their footsteps, Jesus, the son of Mary, confirming that which came before him in the Torah; and We gave him the Gospel, in which was guidance and light and confirming that which preceded it of the Torah as guidance and instruction for the righteous.

وَلۡيَحۡكُمۡ أَهۡلُ ٱلۡإِنجِيلِ بِمَآ أَنزَلَ ٱللَّهُ فِيهِ‌ۚ وَمَن لَّمۡ يَحۡڪُم بِمَآ أَنزَلَ ٱللَّهُ فَأُوْلَـٰٓٮِٕكَ هُمُ ٱلۡفَـٰسِقُونَ
so that let the People of the Gospel judge by what Allah revealed therein. And whoever did not judge by what Allah revealed - then it was those who were the defiantly disobedient.

[huruf]

It must not be forgotten that the Bible is not revelation but a collection of different books which contain different things. There are some that are more unified and there are others that are not. The Gospels ar not the injil but a collection of writings which may have some content handed down from old, but which are not textual renditions of anything that might or might not have been given to 'isaa. They have four authors, and each is different and there are many other gospels that are not included in the Bible.

It is useless to bind the Qur'an to the bible, the Bible is a haphazard collection in which some revelations may have been included, but there is no guarantee to it save what is in agreement with Qur'an and that is why Muhammad is khaam an nabiyiin: what agrees with Qur'an may be taken as coming from God, what does not should not be considered as such, no matter where it is wrritten or collected. What is worth in the bible is in the Qur'an, if it is not in the Qur'an then it is just as any other book or tradition handed down, we should  not take it as sacred or guaranteed. And if we do, it is at our own risk nd certainly it would be absurd to expect other Qur'an believers to take those texts or traditions as obligatory or even helpful. There are many a passage int the Bible which outright heinous.

Salaam

[centi50]

Salam to all
THE JEWS JUDGED BY THE TORAH



005.043
But why do they come to you for decision, when they have (their own) Torah before them?  therein is the (plain) command of God; yet even after that, they would turn away. For they are not People of Faith.

at the point of revelation to Prophet Muhammad, (pbuh) the Torah and particularly the Gospels had already undergone canonisation, the council of Nicaea had already convened in 325 AD under Constantine (nearly 300 years earlier), some Gospels had already been assigned an Apocrypha status and the Jewish Tanakh and Talmud had already been canonized as well as the orthodox Gospels.



Despite this, the Quran's focus still remains on what the Christian and Jewish Arabs, during Muhammad's (pbuh) ministry were reading and believed. These people were part of the primary audience that the Quran was addressing. The immediate focus group was not all of Christendom or the Jewish followers throughout the world in a state of Diaspora, but the immediate contemporaries of the Prophet and what knowledge (scriptures et al) was with them




THE CHRISTIANS JUDGED BY THEIR OWN GOSPELS



005.046

"And in their footsteps We sent Jesus the son of Mary, confirming the Torah that had come before him (Arabic: Bayna yadayhi) : We sent him the Gospel: in it was guidance and light, and confirmation of the Torah that had come before him: a guidance and an admonition to those who fear God."

005.047

"Let the people of the Gospel judge by what God has revealed in it. If any do fail to judge by (the light of) what God has revealed, they are those who rebel (Arabic: Fasiquna)."

  By the time of Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) (Late 6th early 7th century), parts of the Bible had already undergone changes and a creed had developed (The Council of Nicaea congregated in 325AD). The Quran however, is still clearly recognising the text that lay with them.

[LetTheTruthBeTold]

Quran is not telling us to let followers of Al-Injeel to decide as per their book but they were to decide as per their book when it was revealed to them. Please read 5:46-47 together to see what they mean.

5:46-47
وَقَفَّيۡنَا عَلَىٰٓ ءَاثَـٰرِهِم بِعِيسَى ٱبۡنِ مَرۡيَمَ مُصَدِّقً۬ا لِّمَا بَيۡنَ يَدَيۡهِ مِنَ ٱلتَّوۡرَٮٰةِ‌ۖ وَءَاتَيۡنَـٰهُ ٱلۡإِنجِيلَ فِيهِ هُدً۬ى وَنُورٌ۬ وَمُصَدِّقً۬ا لِّمَا بَيۡنَ يَدَيۡهِ مِنَ ٱلتَّوۡرَٮٰةِ وَهُدً۬ى وَمَوۡعِظَةً۬ لِّلۡمُتَّقِينَ (٤٦)

And We sent, following in their footsteps, Jesus, the son of Mary, confirming that which came before him in the Torah; and We gave him the Gospel, in which was guidance and light and confirming that which preceded it of the Torah as guidance and instruction for the righteous.

وَلۡيَحۡكُمۡ أَهۡلُ ٱلۡإِنجِيلِ بِمَآ أَنزَلَ ٱللَّهُ فِيهِ‌ۚ وَمَن لَّمۡ يَحۡڪُم بِمَآ أَنزَلَ ٱللَّهُ فَأُوْلَـٰٓٮِٕكَ هُمُ ٱلۡفَـٰسِقُونَ
so that let the People of the Gospel judge by what Allah revealed therein. And whoever did not judge by what Allah revealed - then it was those who were the defiantly disobedient.

Peace Novice,

So you are saying that 5:47-48 is referring to the people of the Injeel during the time of Jesus, and not during the time of Mohammad? Thanks.

[LetTheTruthBeTold]

Because Tauwrat, Zabur and Injeel do not reference religious books, that is the corruption, to claim they do.

Peace Abdun Nur,

Can you please elaborate more on your position, I am intrigued. Thank you.

[John]

1. Where is any copy of this "injeel" now?

2. What evidence is there that there was an injeel different from the Gospels before and/or at the time of Muhammad?

3. How come your god couldn't stop people tampering with and destroying it?

4. How logistically could a man or group of men go all the way around the world, to every nook and cranny, to every church, home, library, king's palace, monastery, university, rich man's house...and steal the "original" 1000's of injeels and replace it with a fake one OR alter its words? How could this occur and no one get caught or there be no one waking up in the morning going, "Hey, who's been altering my injeel?"

I'm still waiting for an honest Muslim (I know, an oxymoron!).

[Jafar]

Here's a 100% honest answer:

The other books need to be INFERIORIZED in order to SUPREMIZE a specific book.

When we put something on a pedestal, thus higher than others, we need to legitimize such act by putting others as lower compared to the thing that we put on a pedestal.

The mechanism on how we 'lowerize' others varied...
Claiming that "others" are corrupted is only one common example among many.
Others are corrupted while "my/our" idol on the pedestal is not thus it is SUPERIOR compared to others.

So does the thing that we put on the pedestal, it varied, it can be:
- My holy book
- My religion
- My god
- My idol
- My ethnicity
- My nationality
- My political party
- My ideology
- My candidate
- My tribe
- My football club
- My Car
- My Product
- My wife/husband/girlfriend/boyfriend
- My-SELF

And millions of others that we IDENTIFY ourselves with.
In order to SUPERIORIZE the thing we IDENTIFY ourselves with, we need to INFERIORIZE others.