Sahih International: Race toward forgiveness from your Lord and a Garden whose width is like the width of the heavens and earth, prepared for those who believed in Allah and His messengers. That is the bounty of Allah which He gives to whom He wills, and Allah is the possessor of great bounty.
Pickthall: Race one with another for forgiveness from your Lord and a Garden whereof the breadth is as the breadth of the heavens and the earth, which is in store for those who believe in Allah and His messengers. Such is the bounty of Allah, which He bestoweth upon whom He will, and Allah is of Infinite Bounty.
Yusuf Ali: Be ye foremost (in seeking) Forgiveness from your Lord, and a Garden (of Bliss), the width whereof is as the width of heaven and earth, prepared for those who believe in Allah and His messengers: that is the Grace of Allah, which He bestows on whom he pleases: and Allah is the Lord of Grace abounding.
Shakir: Hasten to forgiveness from your Lord and to a garden the extensiveness of which is as the extensiveness of the heaven and the earth; it is prepared for those who believe in Allah and His messengers; that is the grace of Allah: He gives it to whom He pleases, and Allah is the Lord of mighty grace.
Muhammad Sarwar: Compete with one another to achieve forgiveness from your Lord and to reach Paradise, which is as vast as the heavens and the earth, and is prepared for those who believe in God and His Messenger. This is the blessing of God and He grants it to whomever He wants. The blessings of God are great.
Mohsin Khan: Race one with another in hastening towards Forgiveness from your Lord (Allah), and towards Paradise, the width whereof is as the width of heaven and earth, prepared for those who believe in Allah and His Messengers. That is the Grace of Allah which He bestows on whom He pleases. And Allah is the Owner of Great Bounty.
Arberry: Race to forgiveness from your Lord, and a Garden the breadth whereof is as the breadth of heaven and earth, made ready for those who believe in God and His Messengers. That is the bounty of God; He gives it unto whomsoever He will; and God is of bounty abounding.
THE ABOVE VERSE INDICATES THAT THE PARADISE (JANNAH) HAS THE WIDTH OF HEAVEN AND EARTH.. WHY GOD COMPARED THE TINY EARTH WITH HEAVEN. I DON'T KNOW SCIENCE IS PRECISE ON THE SIZE OF HEAVEN BUT, AS FAR AS WE KNOW IN OUR CURRENT KNOWLEDGE AND ACCEPTED MYTH THE HEAVEN(THE UNIVERSE IS NO WHERE NEAR TO THE SIZE OF EARTH) WHAT DOES THIS COMPARISON OF SIZE MEAN BY THIS VERSET? DOES THIS TRY TO SAY EARTH IS NOT TINY AS WE THINK? OR THE OUR BELIEF OF EARTH'S REAL SIZE IS WRONG? ALMOST IMPOSSIBLE WITH SCIENCE.. BUT THEN WHAT?
AND COMPARE THIS VERSE GOD SAYS HE CREATED UNIVERSE (TOTAL) IN SIX DAYS OUT OF THAT, IT TOOK TOTAL 2 DAYS TO CREATE EARTH.. IMAGINE THE SIZE OF UNIVERSE AND THE EARTH. WHY IT TOOK 2 DAYS COMPARED TO EVER EXPANDING UNIVERSE WHICH CONTAINS SUN MOON ALL PLANETS AND STARS ETC.. HMM EARTH IS HABITABLE AND WITH ALL RESOURCES SO IT TOOK 2 DAYS COMPARED TO WHOLE OF UNIVERSE? IS IT FAIR ENOUGH OR IS SOMETHING ELSE.. OR EARTH AS BIG AS SKY :& :whatever:
Quote from: jkhan on April 03, 2018, 11:48:05 PM
Sahih International: Race toward forgiveness from your Lord and a Garden whose width is like the width of the heavens and earth, prepared for those who believed in Allah and His messengers. That is the bounty of Allah which He gives to whom He wills, and Allah is the possessor of great bounty.
THE ABOVE VERSE INDICATES THAT THE PARADISE (JANNAH) HAS THE WIDTH OF HEAVEN AND EARTH.. WHY GOD COMPARED THE TINY EARTH WITH HEAVEN. I DON'T KNOW SCIENCE IS PRECISE ON THE SIZE OF HEAVEN BUT, AS FAR AS WE KNOW IN OUR CURRENT KNOWLEDGE AND ACCEPTED MYTH THE HEAVEN(THE UNIVERSE IS NO WHERE NEAR TO THE SIZE OF EARTH) WHAT DOES THIS COMPARISON OF SIZE MEAN BY THIS VERSET? DOES THIS TRY TO SAY EARTH IS NOT TINY AS WE THINK? OR THE OUR BELIEF OF EARTH'S REAL SIZE IS WRONG? ALMOST IMPOSSIBLE WITH SCIENCE.. BUT THEN WHAT?
"Is as" or "like" means it is a simile. :peace:
57:21 وجنه and garden عرضها width its كعرض like width السما the heaven/sky والارض and the land
Paradise width (immeasurable) = width the heaven/sky (immeasurable) + the land (tiny)
Paradise width (immeasurable) ? the land (tiny) = width the heaven/sky (immeasurable)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Eh5BpSnBBw
Quote from: jkhan on April 03, 2018, 11:48:05 PM
THE ABOVE VERSE INDICATES THAT THE PARADISE (JANNAH) HAS THE WIDTH OF HEAVEN AND EARTH.. WHY GOD COMPARED THE TINY EARTH WITH HEAVEN. I DON'T KNOW SCIENCE IS PRECISE ON THE SIZE OF HEAVEN BUT, AS FAR AS WE KNOW IN OUR CURRENT KNOWLEDGE AND ACCEPTED MYTH THE HEAVEN(THE UNIVERSE IS NO WHERE NEAR TO THE SIZE OF EARTH) WHAT DOES THIS COMPARISON OF SIZE MEAN BY THIS VERSET? DOES THIS TRY TO SAY EARTH IS NOT TINY AS WE THINK? OR THE OUR BELIEF OF EARTH'S REAL SIZE IS WRONG? ALMOST IMPOSSIBLE WITH SCIENCE.. BUT THEN WHAT?
Where does this verse says that heaven=earth
57:21
سَابِقُوٓاْ إِلَىٰ مَغۡفِرَةٍ۬ مِّن رَّبِّكُمۡ وَجَنَّةٍ عَرۡضُہَا كَعَرۡضِ ٱلسَّمَآءِ وَٱلۡأَرۡضِ أُعِدَّتۡ لِلَّذِينَ ءَامَنُواْ بِٱللَّهِ وَرُسُلِهِۦۚ ذَٲلِكَ فَضۡلُ ٱللَّهِ يُؤۡتِيهِ مَن يَشَآءُۚ وَٱللَّهُ ذُو ٱلۡفَضۡلِ ٱلۡعَظِيمِ
Race toward protection from your Lord and jannah whose width is like the width of the heavens and earth, prepared for those who believed in Allah and His messengers. That is the bounty of Allah which He gives to whom He wills, and Allah is the possessor of great bounty.
So as per 57:21 width of janna=like the width of "heavens and earth".
And as per 3:133
وَسَارِعُوٓاْ إِلَىٰ مَغۡفِرَةٍ۬ مِّن رَّبِّڪُمۡ وَجَنَّةٍ عَرۡضُهَا ٱلسَّمَـٰوَٲتُ وَٱلۡأَرۡضُ أُعِدَّتۡ لِلۡمُتَّقِينَ
And hasten to protection from your Lord and janna whose width is "heavens and earth", prepared for those who live by God's Law.
Quote from: jkhan on April 03, 2018, 11:48:05 PM
AND COMPARE THIS VERSE GOD SAYS HE CREATED UNIVERSE (TOTAL) IN SIX DAYS OUT OF THAT, IT TOOK TOTAL 2 DAYS TO CREATE EARTH.. IMAGINE THE SIZE OF UNIVERSE AND THE EARTH. WHY IT TOOK 2 DAYS COMPARED TO EVER EXPANDING UNIVERSE WHICH CONTAINS SUN MOON ALL PLANETS AND STARS ETC.. HMM EARTH IS HABITABLE AND WITH ALL RESOURCES SO IT TOOK 2 DAYS COMPARED TO WHOLE OF UNIVERSE? IS IT FAIR ENOUGH OR IS SOMETHING ELSE.. OR EARTH AS BIG AS SKY :& :whatever:
Yaum is a period of time not necessarily an earth day. What is the concept of earth days before earth's creation?
Novice
@ Novice.. yes we know Yaum is not generally a day of this worlds every time in quran, but whatever it is, it is mentioned 6 and out of it 2 for Earth..
Whether earth is equal to heaven or not, the Most important thing of this subject is WHY COMPARED THE EARTH WITH THE VAST HEAVEN? COMPARISONS ALWAYS GO WITH SIMILAR THINGS (if some one says the area is as wide as HIMALAYA ranges and my 10 perch land, will that give any sense?)
I wonder as Moon landing conspiracy, are we trapped as well with spinning world and tiny mote?
Quote from: jkhan on April 04, 2018, 03:18:31 AM
@ Novice.. yes we know Yaum is not generally a day of this worlds every time in quran, but whatever it is, it is mentioned 6 and out of it 2 for Earth..
Whether earth is equal to heaven or not, the Most important thing of this subject is WHY COMPARED THE EARTH WITH THE VAST HEAVEN? COMPARISONS ALWAYS GO WITH SIMILAR THINGS (if some one says the area is as wide as HIMALAYA ranges and my 10 perch land, will that give any sense?)
I wonder as Moon landing conspiracy, are we trapped as well with spinning world and tiny mote?
Janna starts right here on the earth in this life if we live as per God's Law and it continues after death. This is what I got from subject verses. Please do not tell me that jannah is an actual garden.
Yes Novice.. that's possible, paradise is not somewhere above the skies..
But the place where adam and his partner lived cannot be the earth.. if you read carefully the verses of quran..
Further If God says, You will live on earth and you will die on earth.. So one cannot die in Moon and be buried, people will be resurrected from the very earth..
just think the verses which appears several times i created the heavens and the earth.. Why always these two.. and look at the other verse we created the heavens and the earth and whatever between them.. So the stars sun moon planets and whatever are between this huge universe and EARTH (between the tiny earth?) How come, unless earth is huge?
Are they really between? No according to current accepted science. So earth has to be the lowest and sky has to be highest, to be actually between or Earth is vast as Heaven and rest is small and between these two?
(https://image.ibb.co/nP1PMc/Flat_Earth.jpg)
It all 'make sense' once you accepted the 'correct' cosmology view as illustrated above.
Peace jkhan could you give your definition of what a simile is? :&
There is a saying, when the devil has nothing to do he kills flies with his tail.
I have the impression some flies are around and we are making ourselves a simil with the a devil that has nothing to do.
As far as I can understand God is addressing people who live in a planet which is earth. That is people for whom the ferist reference for anything, would be earth, and then all the rest which really equals to the heavens and what is between them and earth just in case we find that they are a bit far.
Looking for some God's exercise in measurements seems to me pushing things too far. Not only God, most people would become speechless if when speaking we should take care of exact and precise and accurate measurements according to what any person at wall might find as a source of worry as to the real measurements o anything and everythin.
I wonder also whether there ar eno real problems around.
Sorry jkhan, but your question and you worry about it might even worry me that we are eating something in this planet which is making us loose the sense of measure or proportion and are becoming a bit devilish.
Salaam
@Jafar.. Almost nearing my heart towards it.. But need more research.. Till I get convinced with how moon's phases change according to this system.. And whether the Antarctica is surrounded whole world..
Did u notice that God says we drive the clouds to dry lands and let it rain.. As per accepted myth of spinning world and the surrounded atmosphere to spinning with it the same cause.. Could it be possible the clouds and winds hi different directions if they are part of atmosphere.. Correct me pls.. My knowledge on this very minute
Peace. 14:48 The Day the earth is replaced with another earth, as are the heavens, and they will appear before God, the One, the Supreme. (The Monotheist Group translation)
Heaven Hell belief is there long before Mohammed and Quran. Its not restricted to Islam or semitic religions. Mostly all religions has this. In Hinduism most Goddesses are portrayed to be sitting on a lotus, the lotus represents the Heaven and even Buddhism and similar faiths we see Buddha/Saints/Enlightened standing or sitting on top of a lotus.. its symbolic representation that they ve achieved the state of heaven and no karma without rebirth. People sense goodness and bad MIXED in earth in some proportionality and inevitable and so the place or state of ONLY GOODNESS is possible and called to be heaven and the other extremity of ONLY bad or sufferring is Hell. So its all natural and sensible.. now coming to the widths verse, I think It says the Jannah is well equal to the combined width of whatever we know of that of the earth and heaven, so make effort to attain it.
Yes Rilum. Much thoughtful verse it is..
Hmm what about this.. Don't you see we created seven layers of heaven one above others.. And further we can cause a piece of it to fall upon u.. So in this spinning world can only fall upon those who r exposed towards heaven.. Am I weird?? Or earth looks like as Jafar pic 😧
When we see weather report we see hmm like this.. A cyclone is forming and it's three days away from California and would reach to the shores on that day.. So does this mean the atmosphere Upto 35000 ft high (as they claim) is spinning with the Earth together on the same direction.. Bit bizarre.. Isn't it..
Hi amin.. Yes Hindu scriptures definitely talk of heaven and hell and further indicate who created it.. May God bless who follow it and believe all of God's books. But in budism its not clear about paradise and heaven and sort of rebirth to this same world again and again.. N not mentioned who created it and who is God. Sorry I am not clear in their books.. No idea that's the same message Buddha preached or altered God knows..
Quote from: jkhan on April 04, 2018, 11:24:03 AM
Did u notice that God says we drive the clouds to dry lands and let it rain.. As per accepted myth of spinning world and the surrounded atmosphere to spinning with it the same cause.. Could it be possible the clouds and winds hi different directions if they are part of atmosphere.. Correct me pls.. My knowledge on this very minute
Oh yes.. and it takes 1 day which is equal to 50,000 years of time for a spirit and angel to 'ascend' from earth to heaven of heavens, passing through the gate of heavens in the sky
The devil sometimes took the same route to eavesdrop to the conversation happening at the council held on heaven of heavens, when he trespassed through the route he will be chased by the stars. That explained the 'shooting stars' you commonly see in the night sky.
(https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRpo-vJ9-ZggKC3HbrUqM4K7HoHIY6jwkeqC2ekoHoFJjcLHncK)
Oh and 'atmosphere' didn't exist, it was all a false pretense created by satan to mislead human.
When we consider the verses talking about Zul Karnain.. it says.. He approached to a way and he reached the SETTING POINT OF SUN... come on what does it mean? setting place of sun ;D according to current myth.. if i stay in any place on the earth and look towards west i can see the setting place of sun.. No need to go to a particular place.. And he reached to RISING PLACE OF SUN.. same logic turn to east any point of the earth you will see the Rising sun.. What is west and east in the massive universe? what is east and west in the spinning tiny mote called earth? is there any east and west in the universe. i am serious?
Unless there is an edge where WEST ends that verse cannot have a meaning according to current myth same for east..
Anyway who kept the words of EAST & WEST? and based on what it was given its individual names?. Okay it was given by the people of past .. Or God HIMSELF taught what is EAST & WEST to the unknown man (Adam)
Look at this... The LORD of the East & West.. what is it taking into consideration of the whole universe including the tiny earth..? Unless story is different..
EDGE of the Earth (is it a place surrounded by icebergs and no one can approach after certain distance or whoever try to reach get freezed..Suppose if anyone took his journey to Antarctica from from down of southafrica and reached to Antarctica and crossed the whole of antarctica and have come to the other side and saw the seas without any ice.. Have any flights crossed the Antarctica and came all the way to the other side? I am not telling no.. but let me know if anyone has done it or has come to know that it was. Just for research..
Further in one verse God says .. on the day of resurrection the mountains will be powdered and everything will be leveled and no one would see in it any crookedness.. everything looks visible and the Lord and the angels will decent and people looking at for their destiny probably witnessing God.. If the same earth is spinning at that time at 1000 miles per hour, or it would become all visible ground as god explains.. or is it actually even now but hidden because of mountains and ups and downs.. the respective verse i was refering is "They will ask about the mountains, say: My Lord will break them into scattered dust. And leave it (earth) as an empty plane, so you see neither curve nor ruggedness." (Qur'an 20:105-107)
Have not "those who disbelieve" known that heavens and earth were of one piece, We parted them and, We made every living thing of water, will they not then believe?" (Qur'an 21:30)
why Here also Heavens/Universe and the EARTH? Is not the earth also part of universe literally as per the myth? what difference it makes by saying the tiny mote and the massive immeasurable universe were together. Unless the heaven and the earth are marginally similar almost?
We made the heaven as canopy to the Earth.. hey give me a break.. Are we living in the universe which includes earth or earth is isolated and the universe another thing..
Verse 31:10 "He created the heavens/universe without pilars as you see, and has set on the earth form mountains lest it should SHIFT with YOU... "
Now according to spinning world we are shifting and moving at 1600 kmph, and rounding sun as well as well..so we are moving.. Though mountains are fixed as pegs to control it's being shifted from its place..
Okay some translate it instead of SHIFT as Shake.. Still we have quacks, even at mountainous areas, so there is no stopping of it by mountains..
So according to Quran is the earth stationary?
According to accepted myth universe is without pilars and that universe include the tiny earth too.. Why then Quran isolate earth from universe and points as like nailed not being able to move?
Chapter 36 verse 38-40
And the sun runs on its fixed course for a term. That is the decree of the all mighty, the all knowing. And the moon, we have measured for it mansions till it returns like the old dried curved date stalk. It is not for the sun to overtake the moon nor the night to overtake the day. All float in an orbit...
Now the sun runs in it's course.. So is this correct according to myth? Coz sun is spinning on its axis not round anything.. But this verse says sun is running just like moving in a course..
The second point is moon's phases mentioned here and it was mentioned in another verse what is the benefit of it's phases.. But, we don't find earth has any phase according to Quran.. But according to science earth has phases same as moon when you are on moon. Then what actual benefit of earth having phases?
Third point is sun cannot overtake the moon.. Pretty clear they are running a same course.. But according to NASA moon rounds the earth and goes in sun's course but goes with earth.. How contradictory? To overtake something both should go or take same path.. Is Quran right or the myth.. Coz overtaking matter is explained same as night can't overtake day.. We Know night and day goes in the same route not like sun and moon... If so how moon rounds earth..
Is Quran right or science..
Or the system of universe is different from 99% of acceptance by people.. Are we blinded and deep rooted without knowing to us to NASA and others.. It's shame most QURAN believers go with science and adjust Quranic verses to fit science and tries to prove the science and not Quran, and not what actually said in Quran.. According to this spinning myth Veda, Torah, Injeel and Quran falls as foolish stuff made up by human.. Isn't this a great trick of Satan to dupe all the human as he promised and challenged to God.. Satan wants to change the reality of the world.. Think O real believers and lovers of God..
I will produce to you one of the greatest verse which proves the size of earth and heavens..
39:67 "they made not a just estimate of Allah such as is due to Him. And on the day of ressurection the WHOLE OF THE EARTH will be grasped by His HAND and the HEAVENS will be rolled up in HIS RIGHT HAND.... "
What logic is here? Tiny more in hand and the immeasurable universe in right hand.. People come on get up.. Start thinking.. Why here earth separate and heavens separate? If this whole universe is one crystal ball God would have grasped all in one.. See how He removed it's canopy to one hand and the earth to another.. Both marginally same.. That's the truth..
And then continued in verse we All looking God standing and
39:69 and the earth will shine with the light(nur) of its Lord... "
Now heavens (including sun) are removed and the flattened earth on God's one hand and God's light fall on flat earth not Globe.. If globe half of those who are on the north pole south pole and other side would have crushed to god's hand.. And no light would have fallen.. Am I looking bizarre to u all? But that's the truth of God..
Further on the same chapter 39:75 " and you will all see the angels surrounding the throne from Alla round.. "
So we see God and His throne and angels from a flat earth lut by god's light not a rounding crap..
Think O true people. Think.. Just take the verses of God.. Just neglect me.. Just go ahead with his verses.. Don't deny it
Quote from: jkhan on April 08, 2018, 01:42:28 AM
I will produce to you one of the greatest verse which proves the size of earth and heavens..
39:67 "they made not a just estimate of Allah such as is due to Him. And on the day of ressurection the WHOLE OF THE EARTH will be grasped by His HAND and the HEAVENS will be rolled up in HIS RIGHT HAND.... "
What logic is here? Tiny more in hand and the immeasurable universe in right hand.. People come on get up.. Start thinking.. Why here earth separate and heavens separate? If this whole universe is one crystal ball God would have grasped all in one.. See how He removed it's canopy to one hand and the earth to another.. Both marginally same.. That's the truth..
And then continued in verse we All looking God standing and
39:69 and the earth will shine with the light(nur) of its Lord... "
Now heavens (including sun) are removed and the flattened earth on God's one hand and God's light fall on flat earth not Globe.. If globe half of those who are on the north pole south pole and other side would have crushed to god's hand.. And no light would have fallen.. Am I looking bizarre to u all? But that's the truth of God..
Further on the same chapter 39:75 " and you will all see the angels surrounding the throne from Alla round.. "
So we see God and His throne and angels from a flat earth lut by god's light not a rounding crap..
Think O true people. Think.. Just take the verses of God.. Just neglect me.. Just go ahead with his verses.. Don't deny it
Salam,
thanks for the verses.
I would like to add this,
88:20 And to the earth, how was it flattened <sutihat>?(https://i.imgur.com/f0MSCw2.jpg)
Sutihat, in geometry is a plane, that which is divisible symmetrically and terminated by line.
Geometry is talk about the whole object, not only part of it. so the shape of the earth must be based on this information. A globe cannot be terminated by line (or lines).
Peace
Thanks.. As this well known verse too..
78:6-7
"have we not made the earth as bed/cradle(mihadha) and mountains as pegs..
Most suitable I think is cradle.. Cradle needs to hold what is inside of it.. But still spacious and comfortable to the One in it..
Flattened earth needs pegs to hold it without being shifted.. And not rounded earth, mountains from top down sideways.. It's meaningless as pegs if u look at it for a globe..
Earth is a flatten disc with pegs and holding it's contents like a cradle.. Then imagine how it would look.. God will all will come to know soon what it's shape is.. Then How humiliation to the One who concocted it. It will be a great eye opening for the people towards God and His books.. This invented myth slowly taking people away from Belief.. One day scientists would say such and such died on moon.. Then whole Quran is human invention.. Coz God says you live on earth and die on it will be brought forward from earth..
Quote from: jkhan on April 08, 2018, 04:11:07 AM
Thanks.. As this well known verse too..
78:6-7
"have we not made the earth as bed/cradle(mihadha) and mountains as pegs..
Most suitable I think is cradle.. Cradle needs to hold what is inside of it.. But still spacious and comfortable to the One in it..
Flattened earth needs pegs to hold it without being shifted.. And not rounded earth, mountains from top down sideways.. It's meaningless as pegs if u look at it for a globe..
Earth is a flatten disc with pegs and holding it's contents like a cradle.. Then imagine how it would look.. God will all will come to know soon what it's shape is.. Then How humiliation to the One who concocted it. It will be a great eye opening for the people towards God and His books.. This invented myth slowly taking people away from Belief.. One day scientists would say such and such died on moon.. Then whole Quran is human invention.. Coz God says you live on earth and die on it will be brought forward from earth..
You should make it clear when you are talking about the planet and when you are talking about the element. You cannot in one line treat it as being an elemente and then as a planet.
On the other hand I do nto see what you are purporting. If you want to say something I do not know what it is. It seems youa re correcting somebody or some people, but I do nto know what you are correcting or why or what it is you find wrong and how you mean to make it right.
Salaam
Go outside watch satellites including international space station (orbits ~92 min) looks like shooting star.
https://www.n2yo.com/satellites/?c=most-popular
@ Nunwalkalam..Why isn?t the Earth spinning in any of the footage from the the Apollo spacecraft from 130,000k above or even simply from the Moon..? or from ISS. They have so much claim like, no we can't see it. its moving at very minute speed. Hey folks you can see the sun and moon moving from just your naked eye coz of the position it changes. see how fast the sun is setting while you look at..
May i know what is the energy source for these ISS to traverse round the earth twice in 24 hours and daily? just for my info.. They say maximum 35k-4k ft only the atmosphere of the earth is spinning with it. and beyond it is not the atmosphere of the earth.. now i came to know some flights do actually fly at the height of 60000 ft.. so catching the destination would be big task for just merely flying at 600kph since earth spin at 1600kph. Have anyone experienced a difference while travelling towards the motion of the earth and to the opposite of it's motion? i have traveled a lot.. every time it is same.
In one verse Jins say. "We(jins) can't escape form God while being on earth or in flight .." it's so clear the earth is stationary while jins on it compared to their flight..
whatever these theories could be, but my theme in this forum is quran and it's verses which talks about earth, heavens and its shape and activity.. and to see are those verses really go in line with these newly invented theories..For me honestly not.. for me according to all those verses say that earth is as big as heavens.. and moon and suns are just tiny balls when it comes to the vastness of the earth.. That's God's way.. whoever got dazzled by what the inventions say can deny quran.. it won't matter to anyone..
Take one of the oldest photo which nasa has of the earth taken from moon in which you can see from England to Australia completely visible as daylight and all clouds look white as snow.. just imagine, can ever in the world according to the myth be day time from england to australia?
If this earth is spinning in that massive speed, we should see a kind of ring formed as they show to Saturn because of the dust particles and clouds and all atmospheric particles should form a permanent ring while we see from that far..
Quote from: jkhan on April 09, 2018, 12:14:36 AM
Take one of the oldest photo which nasa has of the earth taken from moon in which you can see from England to Australia completely visible as daylight and all clouds look white as snow.. just imagine, can ever in the world according to the myth be day time from england to australia?
If this earth is spinning in that massive speed, we should see a kind of ring formed as they show to Saturn because of the dust particles and clouds and all atmospheric particles should form a permanent ring while we see from that far..
Please be consistent..
NASA photo from moon is hoax.. cannot be used as evidence. All NASA photos are fake..
Saturn and planets do not exist.. Allah never mentioned any of it in the Quran... it's all a myth created by NASA / Satan. Since planet is a myth then Saturn is also a myth. Since Saturn is a myth then the ring of Saturn is also a myth.
Stay consistent with your line of thought..
@ jaffar..
is my last answer or thoughts seems to you inconsistent and off from the line of thought? :wow :nope: :nope: :nope:
Sahih International: Do you not know that to Allah belongs the dominion of the heavens and the earth and [that] you have not besides Allah any protector or any helper?
Sahih International: It is He who created for you all of that which is on the earth. Then He directed Himself to the heaven, [His being above all creation], and made them seven heavens, and He is Knowing of all things.
Sahih International: He said, "O Adam, inform them of their names." And when he had informed them of their names, He said, "Did I not tell you that I know the unseen [aspects] of the heavens and the earth? And I know what you reveal and what you have concealed."
Sahih International: Indeed, in the creation of the heavens and earth, and the alternation of the night and the day, and the [great] ships which sail through the sea with that which benefits people, and what Allah has sent down from the heavens of rain, giving life thereby to the earth after its lifelessness and dispersing therein every [kind of] moving creature, and [His] directing of the winds and the clouds controlled between the heaven and the earth are signs for a people who use reason.
There is nothing i need to explain.. All of you are erudite people..May God bless u and guide you if it is really meant in that way..
Sahih International: Who remember Allah while standing or sitting or [lying] on their sides and give thought to the creation of the heavens and the earth, [saying], "Our Lord, You did not create this aimlessly; exalted are You [above such a thing]; then protect us from the punishment of the Fire.
Just give a glance to this verse, would any of those who was giving a thought of that time of revelation of this verse would be thinking seriously the earth is spinning and tiny ball, and would probably say "our lord you didn't create this aimlessly.." So God let all of those good people who were with utmost effort thinking of His Heaven and earth to think a manner which is entirely erroneous. what sort of thought it was. So allah was happy while they say after giving thought to his creations of Heaven and Earth in whatever manner they thought.. Clearly they thought as they saw them as they were described in Quran.. that's the real story
Sahih International: To Allah belongs the dominion of the heavens and the earth and whatever is within them. And He is over all things competent.
see the highlighted part in blue.. in arabic is feehinna (in them)
but in other verse, "whatever between them (i.e. between heavens and earth)
How clearly God separate these heavens and earth as two separate segments.. He refers to whatever IN THEM and also BETWEEN THEM
6:35 Sahih International: And if their evasion is difficult for you, then if you are able to seek a tunnel into the earth or a stairway into the sky to bring them a sign, [then do so]. But if Allah had willed, He would have united them upon guidance. So never be of the ignorant.
Pickthall: And if their aversion is grievous unto thee, then, if thou canst, seek a way down into the earth or a ladder unto the sky that thou mayst bring unto them a portent (to convince them all)! - If Allah willed, He could have brought them all together to the guidance - So be not thou among the foolish ones.
very interesting verse, so i kept few translation for the reader to see. TUNNEL AND LADDER.. what this suggests to you O my fellow believing folks..
Think that tiny Earth is Round and make a tunnel you end up on the other side of earth in the end it would become meaningless coz he didn't dig from america to reach china or north pole to come south pole, for that no need to dig tunnel, but just can travel, But if it is FLAT YOU END UP TO THE EXTREME DOWN point where no one has reached to bring a SIGN
On a FLAT earth keeping a LADDER and reaching HEAVEN is much more of a sort tangible and imaginable but not with spinning EARTH (Bit funny, hope one climb with a ladder in a spinning earth, so reached the clearance of earth's atmosphere (40000ft) then he is in another part so he start being stationary with himself and now he won't see sky up but down and again during the course he would again see the sky up and down) don't i am crazy.. but that's how it should work practically.
for ME it suggests even you dig a tunnel and go to the extreme of the EARTH and you keep Ladder and climb BOTH SAME OR MARGINAL DISTANCE
Quote from: jkhan on April 09, 2018, 12:03:07 AM
@ Nunwalkalam..Why isn?t the Earth spinning
here is live video feed takes 92.65 minutes to circle
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RtU_mdL2vBM
have you tried to track the international space station?
site lets you know when visible in your area (looks like shooting star), let us know if you see it.
https://www.n2yo.com/satellites/?c=most-popular
btw, when young knew the guy who designed camera lens for Apollo 11
Well done, Nunwalkalam,, you seems to be a guy even one day you would believe a movie to be true.. Yes it's true pictures not movie..you are such a person..You are living in a world era where you can tell and make anything to prove. Same as you believed the Moon Landing in 1969 with video .. Even GE believers refute and accept that Moon landing is a conspiracy.. FEs not anyway.. These are nothing my dear.. i dont need those links i have seen many of them, but i have never deviated from the belief of Quran. Satan is a master, he used one of the greatest learned group under his grip so that duping vulnerable half educated segment is piece of cake for Satan..
Sahih International: And, [O Muhammad], you are not [engaged] in any matter or recite any of the Qur'an and you [people] do not do any deed except that We are witness over you when you are involved in it. And not absent from your Lord is any [part] of an atom's weight within the earth or within the heaven or [anything] smaller than that or greater but that it is in a clear register.
So God knows, the ATOM'S Weight in the tiny mote called Earth and ATOM's weight in the Immeasurable Heaven. Already in the entire universe earth is nothing (same as atom).. this is not the way God explains.. He clarifies very systematically and very openly giving a complete picture what is earth and heavens (both are as vast as other)
Sahih International: Say, "Observe what is in the heavens and earth." But of no avail will be signs or warners to a people who do not believe
I hope you would have observed NASA and their videos more than the self observance of the Heavens and Earth which is in front of you like what all the prophets and good believers did ... because NASA is a kind self assuring guarantee to you i guess than what guarantees to you in the WORD OF THE CREATOR OF IT..
The one who has accepted Quran with absolute trust has no wavering after whatever evidences people with the assistance of jin and satan bring to show.. It will be only like the magic of the people of Pharaoh and the reality what Musa did..Do you think after Iblees challenged to God that i will send all of them in astrary, and will relax. NO.. we know very well what is the way of Satan to dupe.. Satan wont do any harm, but just confuse and wisper to our mind that satan is right..You wait and we wait.. and God will you will see what is truth..For you your system (deen) and for us our system, but for us we already know what is truth. there is no second truth to truth
Salaam jkhan,
Really appreciate what you have done, to promote the Flat Earth to many people, especially in this forum.
People who believe in Flat Earth increase significantly for the last couple years. What we have to do next is just to do this,
110:1 When the victory of God and conquest comes.
110:2 And you see the people entering into the system <diin> of God in flocks.
110:3 You shall glorify the grace of your Lord, and seek His forgiveness; for He is the Redeemer.
God system is not necessary talk about the spiritual things, since the creation of heaven and earth is part of the Diin as well.
9:36 The count of the months with God is twelve months in the book of God the day He created the heavens and the earth; four of them are sacred. This is the correct system <diin>;
Soon God will show us the truth, in the horizon, where earth meet the sky.. and within ourselves as well.
41:53 We will show them Our signs in the horizons, and within themselves, until it becomes clear to them that this is the truth. Is it not enough that your Lord is witness over all things?
Be patience and glorify the grace of your Lord. Let the God become the witness over all things.
Salam
Quote from: jkhan on April 09, 2018, 01:18:27 AM
@ jaffar..
is my last answer or thoughts seems to you inconsistent and off from the line of thought? :wow :nope: :nope: :nope:
Yes
Quote
If this earth is spinning in that massive speed, we should see a kind of ring formed as they show to Saturn because of the dust particles and clouds and all atmospheric particles should form a permanent ring while we see from that far..
Planets do not exist -> Saturn do not exist -> Permanent Ring on Saturn do not exist.
Atmosphere do not exist..
Planets, Saturn, Permanent Ring on Saturn, Atmosphere, Stellar System, Galaxy = Hoax conception created by NASA / Satan.
Sky objects are only Sun, Moon and Stars.
Stars, located at the nearest sky, are there to:
1. Show the way / guide to traveler
2. As lamps to adorn / beautify the sky.
3. Guard against the eavesdropping devil. (acting as a missile that shall be shot out against approaching demon/devil)
@ Jaffar..i never said they exist.. But I answered to people in the form they do believe.. It's strange you thought I believe in them after I have been strongly and vehemently oppose it based on QURAN.. Anyhow for all you folks my English when it comes to depict what I want present what is in my mind is relatively weak.. Still I come to this forum knowing that English experts are here in this forum who would quickly catch my bizarre English.. But I don't mind.. Just I want to present the truth especially to those who take only Quran in any part of the world..
Yes tilhawa.. People are bending to anything even being a true believer.. So as God says "Remind them sometimes reminder would profit them.. ""
To think of God's creation of God we don't need all the technology in the world coz people of the past have thought and won the pleasure of God.. But if u take technology and go in line with then you don't believe His words but technology , coz without knowing your priority is Tech.. That's a trap.. Remember I never say don't use Tech to your life.. Use all of them as much u want to satisfy your life.. But don't compare God with it.(Tech) . That's my point..
Peace jkhan.
So you are presenting the truth according to Qoran?
In my opinion, you are presenting your truth according to your understanding of Qoran.
I see no issue with the earth turning and Qoran confirming this" Yukawiru Al Layl Ala Al Nahar". One side of the earth Layl and the other side Nahar. One side darkness and the other side light. Swapping as the earth turns!!!!
The verb "Yukawiru" ,the noun "Kura" means a round ball. So "Yukawiru" means "Turns" night- day, night day...And so on.
Please do not waste your time and effort on fables, my advice to you if you wish to take it.
GOD bless you.
Peace.
@good logic..
But you don't seems to put your good logic at right angle..
It's the sun factor of light and darkness and not earth.. God turns the ball Sun makes the vast earth into darkness and brightness.. Not only earth the same sky also He covers with darkness and light with turning ball.. That's how night and day turning around.. There is no sides of the earth that's myth you also trapped. Only one side to earth as a surface for us to live.. One side covered thrn night and others side lit.. Just stories well conspired with vast comprehensive wisdom of iblees.. Coz unless is not wake to Hit and beat and torture and make us believe.. Could he, he would have killed Adam n not needed tempt to eat the fruit..
Okay simply read this verse 2:258. Prophet Ibrahim was arguing seriously with his King and challenging.. ".... God BRINGS the SUN from East and you BRING it from west... " think buddy.. Just think verses with general knowledge.. Here He challenged to bring sun from west and not challenged turn the Earth from west to east.. Coz its not the system that great Ibrahim knew.. It's the sun king has to bring not the earth.. Hope u and all got it
Peace jkhan.
Please yourself.
GOD brings the sun from the east means GOD turns the earth as well.
I love to see your map of the world.
Phoning New Zealand from England at 6:00 AM, finds the person you are talking to at approx. 5:00 PM is a Myth? GOD is bringing the sun to England and taking it away from New Zealand!!!! The mind boggles brother at the thought of half of the earth day and the other night?
Hope you also wake up brother ,then we can discuss what Qoran is really saying about our habitable planet earth.(Our "Mahd").
GOD bless you.
Peace.
No dear.. If God brings means He brings the states item that is sun, He moves the sun and not Sun at center and stationary and others moving around it.. When the challenge was presented to bring to king then King's thought should be to bring sun and earth.. Ibrahim could have said my Lord turns the earth to bring the sunlight from east.. No it's Sun (object +light)
Further on your logic in night and day.. Look, buddy.. Earth is always bit somewhere and somewhere dark that's a circle.. God created earth as bad as heaven and made this system.. And there is any universe as u r taught.. Coz God never promised u of ever lasting darkness.. Coz your universe is always at darkness at least 99% of it.. No he brings it continued pattern and darkness is chasing light and light is chasing darkness. That's all coz of Sun n not earth
Earth is flat and shaped as a case to hold it's contents.. And heaven is like dome..
Take a look 81:6 when oceans are spill over / overflown
.that's really flat earth stuff.. And gone beyond its cradle of edges.. In round earth there is no overflow.. It can only pass to vast universe as freezed ice.. God bless u.. He knows us and He knows who is right here, and That truth may succeed and not me or you our arguments.. Prove dear with all earth and heavens verses that world is spinning and heavens are immeasurable.. Start a topic on your own with a nice heading.. And give your thoughts to forum and let people put theirs
Take the word 21:44 it has borders to the earth.. Round earth cannot have borders.. And then these borders are getting reduced gradually.. These covering borders of the earth which hold the vast ocean in tact is getting melt and becoming water and protected border is going further and further(the width of border is decreasing) and spill of ocean is nearing.. God knows best..
Quote from: jkhan on April 09, 2018, 08:39:23 AM
Yes tilhawa.. People are bending to anything even being a true believer.. So as God says "Remind them sometimes reminder would profit them.. ""
To think of God's creation of God we don't need all the technology in the world coz people of the past have thought and won the pleasure of God.. But if u take technology and go in line with then you don't believe His words but technology , coz without knowing your priority is Tech.. That's a trap.. Remember I never say don't use Tech to your life.. Use all of them as much u want to satisfy your life.. But don't compare God with it.(Tech) . That's my point..
Salaam,
I think it's not about the technology, but who behind it and what they say. This case is similar to "quranist" vs religious leader.
Whoever you are, we have the scriptures to judge what you say. The technology is only the tools.
Religious leader and the scientist, they can say what they want, and we can choose what to believe.
22:73 O people, an example is being put forth so listen to it: those you call upon besides God will not create a fly even if they all gathered to do so. And if the fly takes anything from them, they will not be able to return anything from it. Weak is both the seeker and the sought!Does this challenge goes to the religious leader? I don't think so. It goes to the scientist who think that they are god and put all the God information aside, and for those who follow them.
The Diin is not only for the spiritual things. The creation of the universe is also part of the Diin.
Do you believe in God, or the big bang theory?
The choices is yours.
Peace
What is this "believe", "believe"? Is this the inquisition?
God Does say repeatedly to believe in Himself, the angels, the prophets, He doe snto say if you believe the earth is this or that you will go to hell.
What is this believe the earth is this shape or that shape. We do not have to believe anything. od knows, NO MAN KNOWS. You believe... you believ... Believing is nto knowing and if you do not know, then believe is neither here nor there, it is for your own consumption not t0o go around bludgeoning anybody with your beliefs. You understand such and such form the Qur'an? ???GREAT!!! ?Good for you! But your understanding is not authority and it is not knowledge just conjecture and "belief".
We believe in the ghaib. So that is that. What we do not know, we may suspect this or that but it is no knowledge, bor us it is ghaib.
For not being catholics, ?my God! popes here are indeed popping up a dime a dozen, very infallible.
Salaam
Peace jkhan.
Brother, who said the sun is stationary? We know Qoran said it is moving. Actually Qoran says Sun ,Moon and earth(day and night) are moving in their own orbit.
You know Qoran implies day and night on earth, don t you?:
25:47
He is the One who designed the night to be a cover, and for you to sleep and rest. And He made the day a resurrection.
وَهُوَ الَّذى جَعَلَ لَكُمُ الَّيلَ لِباسًا وَالنَّومَ سُباتًا وَجَعَلَ النَّهارَ نُشورًا
25:62
He is the One who designed the night and the day to alternate: a sufficient proof for those who wish to take heed, or to be appreciative.
وَهُوَ الَّذى جَعَلَ الَّيلَ وَالنَّهارَ خِلفَةً لِمَن أَرادَ أَن يَذَّكَّرَ أَو أَرادَ شُكورًا
You telling me GOD brings the sun and ignoring the movement of the earth(day and night) in Qoran and I am telling you GOD brings the sun and turns the earth( day and night means here on earth not in the sun brother!!!!)
As for your other verses, well you need more research on the interpretations ,I will deal with 21:44 as an example:
This is more of an explanation that makes sense to me:
21:44
We have provided for these people and their ancestors, up until an old age. Do they not see that every day on earth brings them closer to the end? Can they reverse this process?
Nothing to do with earth borders.
Please reflect brother on what Qoran is really saying?
GOD bless you.
Peace.
Quote from: tlihawa on April 09, 2018, 06:21:31 AM
Salaam jkhan,
Really appreciate what you have done, to promote the Flat Earth to many people, especially in this forum.
People who believe in Flat Earth increase significantly for the last couple years. What we have to do next is just to do this,
110:1 When the victory of God and conquest comes.
110:2 And you see the people entering into the system <diin> of God in flocks.
110:3 You shall glorify the grace of your Lord, and seek His forgiveness; for He is the Redeemer.
God system is not necessary talk about the spiritual things, since the creation of heaven and earth is part of the Diin as well.
Victory is coming! :bravo: :bravo: :yay: :yay:
Next step; organize people, rally them, arm them, train them and grab power and initiate the conquest!
Soon.. we shall rule the world!! BWAHAHAHA..
Quote from: huruf on April 09, 2018, 12:55:04 PM
What is this "believe", "believe"? Is this the inquisition?
After we grab power.. inquisition shall be the first thing that we do..
To cleanse people from 'false belief' spread by NASA / Satan...
We shall purify them.... by force and torture if necessary.. :elektro:
Quote
For not being catholics, ?my God! popes here are indeed popping up a dime a dozen, very infallible.
Thanks Huruf.. That one really :rotfl: :rotfl: me up..
Peace jkhan,
It may help you to know this definition!Quote from: hawk99 on April 04, 2018, 12:43:45 AM
"Is as" or "like" means it is a simile.
:peace:
and
Quote from: hawk99 on April 04, 2018, 06:45:15 AM
Peace jkhan could you give your definition of what a simile is? :&
See the real way of 21:44
"Nay we give provisions to these and their ancestors until grew long for them LIFE, then don't they see that We reduce (nankus) the Earth (ard) from (min) it's borders (athrafiha) so they will b overcome.
Who taught you athrafiha is End in Arabic.. Taraf(one end), tarafyn(two ends), tarafayin (ends three or more), athraf(border) .. I can't teach u Arabic here.. It's not my aim here..
Now look at the meaning of the verse.. These and their ancestors until life (life in earth grew long) it means time elapsed and new generation is coming continuously.. And this reducing of border is a slow process to overcome everything..
See below verse 41:11
Sahih International: Then He directed Himself to the heaven while it was smoke and said to it and to the earth, "Come [into being], willingly or by compulsion." They said, "We have come willingly."
Such a conclusive verse.. See carefully how dual verbs are present..
Heaven only singular while it was smoke.. And He calls both heaven and earth to come willingly.. Dual.. And they said we come (dual Arabic) willingly.. Coz these two are major two entity.. See here while sky was nothing and just was smoke the earth was present.. While singular heaven was smoke nothing of its contents (Sun, moon stars)were there..
Then see next verse 41:12
"and then He completed the singular heaven it's seven heavens and gave each it's affairs.. How earth is so specific from all these heavens.. These two are two vast things.. And God called both of them and not your myth Universe as one item.. Honestly I am tired.. 😩
You know why I said I am tired.. How truth it is that God says Human is so adamant in his views.. Even dead spoken to them, or pieces of sky fall on them or they go and see everything still they will say our eyes dazzled by magic.. This is the same human they wanted to see God physically.. I don't think even they see God they would believe Him, coz they love this world.. Even God's name is written in sky in order to see permanently these people will not believe, it will be just another element in sky for them.. I guess. But I am absolutely sure they would believe whatever NASA brings to them.. Guys Satan is a real talented guy.. I mean it.. Otherwise Satan can't challenge and win with duping people.. See to whome Satan challenged.. He must b brave.. Only trick of Satan is his wisdom and not force..
Pickthall: Say (O Muhammad): Who is Lord of the heavens and the earth? Say: Allah. Say: Take ye then (others) beside Him for protectors, which, even for themselves, have neither benefit nor hurt? Say: Is the blind man equal to the seer, or is darkness equal to light? Or assign they unto Allah partners who created the like of His creation so that the creation (which they made and His creation) seemed alike to them? Say: Allah is the Creator of all things, and He is the One, the Almighty.
:hypno: :tempt:
Quote from: jkhan on April 09, 2018, 09:35:18 PM
You know why I said I am tired..
6:35 And if their aversion has become too much for you, then perhaps you could make a tunnel in the earth, or a ladder to the heavens, and bring them a sign. Had God willed, He would have gathered them to the guidance; so do not be of the ignorant ones.Don't worry about the people who negatively responded. They are not the target. Use them as a partner to explain more about the system. Surely it will benefit the others, mostly the silent reader ones,
"Remind them sometimes reminder would profit them.. "
Peace
Sahih International: I did not make them (jins/satan) witness to the creation of the heavens and the earth or to the creation of themselves (jins/satan), and I would not have taken the misguiders as assistants.
Very clear how God separate earth and Heavens and Jins. Here notice the significant matter.. God didnt let the Jins to witness His creation of Heavens and earth, So even BEFORE the Earth and Heavens were created Jins were created and present to not being able to witness it. So the Main Purpose of Creation of the Earth and Heavens is for Men for testing us (it can include good jins too) but key is man and everything is for man(coz Jins were only listening to what revealed prophets of men and not of theirs), how disgusting we are neglecting his full authority making the satan on top of everything
12:105 And how many a sign within the heavens and earth do they pass over while they, therefrom, are turning away.
27:65 Say, "None in the heavens and earth knows the unseen except Allah , and they do not perceive when they will be resurrected."
observe these verses.. God says signs are definitely visible to our naked eyes in Heavens and Earth.. But still we disregard them, How actually, we don't neglect what is visible in the heavens and Earth which is visible to us.. But in fact Yes.. coz we have accepted as signs of Heavens and Earth in different shapes away from how He actually created by believing in what NASA depicts to us and make us convince which in the diverts our hearts to association with God, wittingly and unwittingly or foolishly.
Look at the second verse.. None knows the UNSEEN (GHAIB) except God.. it means definitely while having signs, there unseen factors which no one can see.. For me it seems that NASA can see everything what is on earth and almost what is in the Heavens (their universe) soon they would find a Kepler where exist creatures :handshake: So our poor duped folks would say, O how amazing, Most are convinced Yes, it has huge possibilities that the existence of beings in other planets.. How nicely satan has come to his aim..
With such wavering belief people are like the below verse says..
12:106 And most of them believe not in Allah except while they associate others with Him.
Whats the problem? now Jukhan, you can create a science book based on your Quran understanding and distribute to the school kids. No one here objects i think, leave alone NASA guys i think they will also not object.
whatever you meant by your response @ Amin..
Read this also.. If God will someone will get benefited..
Verily! Allah grasps the heavens and the earth lest they move away from their places, and if they were to move away from their places, there is not one that could grasp them after Him. Truly, He is Ever Most Forbearing, Oft ?Forgiving.
Does Allah holding the so called Universe from moving away from its place/s? Or Allah Holding the Earth & Heavens (two entity) from moving its places.. Make sense people..
or else think the verse 34:24
" .... indeed We or You are either upon Guidance or in Clear Error".. God knows best..if taking quran is clear error and then i dont find any to take...
Peace jkhan.
You are tearing at the verses with all your might and making them speak your language!!! I do not think Arabic is saying what you are claiming most of the time?
Calm down and relax. Start from the beginning(Not the beginning of time and space!) and reflect slowly on theses points:
1- Shaitan is getting at everyone else except those that have your understanding.
2-NASA has duped the majority including the Russians and Chinese that compete with it
3-.Science and Qoran never agree on any point?
4-Facts about earth and the universe that can be observed by everyone are to be ignored?
5-Satelites are a myth? Space travel is a myth? Rockets and Astraunots that go on them from USA .China, Russia ,India...Are a myth?
6-The moon that you can clearly see above is flat and has borders?
7-Al Samaa Al Dunia has been separated as Samaa and earth according to you where the Samaa cannot be reached by anyone?
...
Maybe Shaitan has duped all of us, including you but you are not aware of it?
Hope I am not wasting my time asking you to reflect?
GOD bless you.
Peace.
@good logic
If you feel that's a kind tearing the verses, then it's your destiny..
I am always calm and that's a great gift for me from God.. You have numbered a lot which you have gone beyond what I explained meaninglessly..
Yes majority is duped always. Satan challenged to God I will send all of them in astray, and in another verse God accepts it Yes Satan is right he has taken majority.. Think of the verse it says if you follow majority in on earth definitely they divert Yiu from the right path..
Tell me which Prophet had convinced the majority of their community.. Oh.. Some even failed just other than his own family and not even his full family..
And God says I will FILL HELL with men and Jin and there us no such promising of filling paradise.. It's not to b filled. It will never.. It's never ever easy to convince human with truth coz all Gods verses proves it.. All prophets craving to God.. O God tgey rejected me, I conveyed day and night and in public and open.. They will never believe.. This is what prophets knew about their community.. This era is not extraordinary but all same just time passed with modern things.. That's all
@ Manny_E.... Verses of quran : 3:169 And never think of those who have been killed in the cause of Allah as dead. Rather, they are alive with their Lord, receiving provision,. Rejoicing in what Allah has bestowed upon them of His bounty, and they receive good tidings about those [to be martyred] after them who have not yet joined them - that there will be no fear concerning them, nor will they grieve.
23:99-100[For such is the state of the disbelievers], until, when death comes to one of them, he says, "My Lord, send me back That I might do righteousness in that which I left behind." No! It is only a word he is saying; and behind them is a barrier until the Day they are resurrected.
So, let's elaborate this in this way.. first two verses indicate that those who are dead (good believer/martyrs) actually alive and living with pleasure and keep waiting till others join with them. So they are living BUT NOT IN THIS WORLD
SINCE 23:99-100 it says there is a BARRIER (BARZAKH) by which no one can come to this world or perceive what's happening HERE..
So, there is definitely a place where human can live other than this world already. That's why i said the place where Adam and his wife lived initially could not be possible on this earth..
as stated below
And We said, "O Adam, dwell, you and your wife, in Paradise and eat therefrom in [ease and] abundance from wherever you will. But do not approach this tree, lest you be among the wrongdoers." But Satan caused them to slip out of it and removed them from that [condition] in which they had been. And We said, "Go down(ih'biṭū), [all of you], as enemies to one another, and you will have upon the earth a place of settlement and provision for a time."Then Adam received from his Lord [some] words, and He accepted his repentance. Indeed, it is He who is the Accepting of repentance, the Merciful.We said, "Go down from it, all of you. And when guidance comes to you from Me, whoever follows My guidance - there will be no fear concerning them, nor will they grieve.
So the above verses are clear that Adam and rest were dispatched to the EARTH where we are living now to live for sometime till the day of Resurrection..
but Another Earth (Jannah) will be created as vast as the Current earth and Heavens to accommodate only those whom God is pleased with .. 14:48 Sahih International: [It will be] on the Day the earth will be replaced by another earth, and the heavens [as well], and all creatures will come out before Allah , the One, the Prevailing. 81:13 And when Paradise (Jannah) is brought near (zulfa),
IT'S NOT REALLY PAGAN TO THINK IN THE WAY QURAN IS EXPLAINED. IT'S REALLY PAGAN TO MOVE AWAY FROM WHAT QURAN SAYS.. THAT'S WHY THE WORD PAGAN ITSELF HAS A MEANING.. EVEN BEFORE QURAN WHILE ALL THE BOOKS ARE REVEALED PEOPLE PRACTICING CERTAIN WAYS AWAY FROM THOSE BOOKS OF GOD, THAT'S REAL PAGAN.. Pagans are pagans, but to know it we need to live not as pagans, that's to be with words of his book/s
33:72 Sahih International: Indeed, we offered the Trust (AMANAH) to the heavens and the earth and the mountains, and they declined to bear it and feared it; but man [undertook to] bear it. Indeed, he was unjust and ignorant.
33:72 Arberry: We offered the trust to the heavens and the earth and the mountains, but they refused to carry it and were afraid of it; and man carried it. Surely he is sinful, very foolish.
Note the above interesting verse. We know the Heavens and Earth are two separate entities which were joined and then parted and called to come to God willingly or unwillingly.. these matters we already know.. but look at the Addition of MOUNTAINS inserted to this verse.. (it may have it's prime meaning with Tust/amana) But it's not the point i am interested on this addition, Look God didn't say Sun moon clouds stars etc, and(non existing) Jupiter, Venus , mercury whatever, but took the MOUNTAIN.. WE know as per the flattened earth of God's Verses. This Mountain play a major ROLE.. These mountains are the PEGS holding everything, as per God without these PEGS of Mountains, the whole system could MOVE from it's places and it is the backbone of the heavens and earth. For me it is Foundation of the marvelous place we live.. So Asking a TRUST (AMANA) from Earth is much appropriate than tiny elements of sun, moon etc. But they refused. And we ACCEPTED it.. Oh do we behave like we accepted, such forgetful, betraying MAN.. we will see the result of it soon..
Hay hang on.. this clearly prove that there is no MOUNTAINS other than on EARTH.. It's very clear there is no mountain on Moon for naked vision or close camera or telescope. it's nicely moving without any mountains, had there mountains it would have been standstill.. Even these NASA shamelessly states there were no mountains on Moon long time before but coz of recent time falling of asteroid or such materials sum hills and crave have formed. These are guess works, and guess works will not fit for the truth..
Since we talk of Mountains here bit extensively, i thought of presenting the following perception..
As per NASA the look of the Earth is rounded and looking like smooth marble and having no blemishes on its brims/edges around it.. Same the moon that we can see with our naked eye.. My concern is we have mountains on earth heights reaching up to 9 kms almost. and we have very similar altitude mountains around the world. As per NASA also the earth is huge and big circumference, but these mountain ranges are not tiny either and every mountains has its peak and shape..
So why we don't see in their accepted photos at least very tiny projections away from the roundish looking Earth .. Did you get me? i mean extreme brims of the ball should have visible projections.. That projections should appear in photos if we zoom those pictures. Even on Moon if there are Hills then the brims should not look as smooth as a crystal ball but with tiny projections away from the rounded brim of moon. Since there is no mountains on moon it is not visible to us. But Earth definitely has such mountains and they are not small. Where are those projections at brims of Earth? Remember this is not from Quran, but my personal view by seeing them with my eyes
Quote from: good logic on April 10, 2018, 11:47:49 AM
Peace jkhan.
You are tearing at the verses with all your might and making them speak your language!!! I do not think Arabic is saying what you are claiming most of the time?
Calm down and relax. Start from the beginning(Not the beginning of time and space!) and reflect slowly on theses points:
1- Shaitan is getting at everyone else except those that have your understanding.
2-NASA has duped the majority including the Russians and Chinese that compete with it
3-.Science and Qoran never agree on any point?
4-Facts about earth and the universe that can be observed by everyone are to be ignored?
5-Satelites are a myth? Space travel is a myth? Rockets and Astraunots that go on them from USA .China, Russia ,India...Are a myth?
6-The moon that you can clearly see above is flat and has borders?
7-Al Samaa Al Dunia has been separated as Samaa and earth according to you where the Samaa cannot be reached by anyone?
...
Maybe Shaitan has duped all of us, including you but you are not aware of it?
Hope I am not wasting my time asking you to reflect?
GOD bless you.
Peace.
Salaam,
These are things that flat-earthers don't want to understand.
44:29 Neither heaven nor earth wept for them, nor were they respited;
See clearly God separate both the heaven and earth they both wept not and not the UNIVERSE wept.. but both these entities wept not. These are two major segment and not tiny mote myth
52:44 Sahih International: And if they were to see a fragment from the sky falling, they would say, "[It is merely] clouds heaped up."
Very pathetic this people of disbelievers.. just look at their responses. I wonder ever in this world such a fragment has fallen, that God knows. Suppose if a fragment falling.. People would WITNESS something strange happening around all would have noticed also that the things were falling from the sky. But they would compare it to clouds. How pathetic (same GE concept)! but Definitely NASA won't be kept its utterances silent and they would come up with something and make it more comprehensive and elaborate it wonderfully and technically to suit their view and to make people believe something totally away from what they saw. So they won't believe their naked eye, but will definitely believe NASA. Trust your naked folks, perceive what you see, God says i have given you eyes, don't you observe.. In the end the incident of falling of fragment will recorded in the history of the world something of clouds...shhhhhhhhhhhh :nope:
54:11 Then We opened the gates of the heaven with rain pouring down
This verse talks about how Noah people were devastated with great flood.. our topic here Earth and Heavens and its vastness. Interesting thing here is the word used GATES (plural) used to pouring the rain down. Have any one seen such words being used to just elaborate the rain comes down.. For me no.. What i have seen is something like " we send rain from the sky from the midst of heaped clouds..." that's the way rain comes. isn't it?
But, strangely GATES and the word OPENED and it seems like the water for the great flood came from the high heavens through its gates. If the earth is tiny mote and immessurable distance away from Heaven, it wouldn't have reached the spinning earth. It shows the heaven and earth is very much close as we can see. For a flat earth, the dome can be built with a certain pattern to go in line with its size and not beyond it's size. if so then, it is not dome. I wonder how from this so called vast universe it did rain, passing all vast spaces..but from a dome to earth.. it's much tangible and practicable.
Peace jkhan.
Yes indeed, 55:10 والارض وضعها للانام It is He Who has set the earth on a moving course for (His) creatures.
55:7 والسماء رفعها ووضع الميزان
Notice again how وَضَعَ wada'aa is referring to the balance of the orbital systems in the Universe. Here, this Verse is referring to the gravitational balance that keeps the orbits of the Galaxies, their Solar Systems, their Planets and their Moon's in place, and not falling into a massive disarray and out of order and colliding with each others on a large and massive scale!
If we examine, for instance, our beautiful Solar System's orbital system and the balance of its planets and their moon's around our star, the sun, and around each others (the moons orbiting around their own planets), then we'll see the beautiful and powerful BALANCE that Allah Almighty has put to keep us SAFE! Otherwise, our moon would've probably been the first planet to collide with us.
Notice again how وَضَعَ wada'aa here perfectly describes that balance in our MOVING UNIVERSE! So it's the Balance in the Moving Celestial Bodies' orbits, and in their Solar Systems' Orbits, and in their Galaxies' Orbits and so on.
Brother jkhan you are on "spaceship earth" taking you and us to our destination.
You think it is still don t you? like:
[27:88] When you look at the mountains, you think that they are standing still. But they are moving, like the clouds. Such is the manufacture of GOD, who perfected everything. He is fully Cognizant of everything you do.
Best journey to you . Enjoy the trip.
PS: think about this verse(35:44) in the following manner, not like you explained it in one of your posts:
[35:41] It is God Who sustains the heavens and the earth, lest they cease (to function) (stray from their fixed paths-orbits- and fall into complete destruction): and if they should fail stray, there is none - not one - can sustain them thereafter: Verily He is Most Forbearing, Oft-Forgiving.
GOD bless you.
Peace.
55:10
Sahih International :And the He laid out for the Creatures.
Pickthall : And the Earth Hath He appointed for creatures.
Yusuf Ali : it is He who has spread out the earth for creatures.
Shakir: And the Earth He has set it for Living Creatures.
Mohamed Sarwar : He spread out the earth for the People.
Mohsin Khan: And the Earth he has put for the Creatures.
Arberry: And Earth - He set it down for all beings..
Now let me know why you play with words.. People are noticing dear.. I don't say in this forum all believe what is from QURAN.. But all have common sense to see foolish way of manipulate words meaning. Same as you said athrafiha means End😧 That you forgot Mr/ miss Good logic..
O all the members pls go through all words of (wada'a) in quran which appears. U won't find moving or spinning or rounding then u know the intention of this person.. I have no time next time east with your foolish manipulations
So, even in 55:7 when He says "Waalssamaa rafaAAaha wawadaAAa almeezan" He literally laid out the balance?
@good logic manipulation and hiding thre truth of flow of verses..
Let's look at 27:87-88 as he says mountains are moving.. No way.. It's main purpose to keep the earth from moving.. Coz its foundation.. Actually it's pegs..
Let's see the verses
"On the Day the trumpet is blown, and terrified is whosoever is in the Heavens and the Earth, except whom God wills, and everyone shall come to Him all utterly abject, and you will see the mountains that you think them to be solid, and they shall pass away as the passing away of the cloud.... "
Now this is very clear to every erudite man that this is happening on the day of ressurection and mountains will blow away as dust particles.. And even 27:89-90 even continues with day of ressurection.. Clear manipulation of verses.. And it showed your your aim. You neither believer nor an accepting person on the truth of flattened earth.. Since I am convinced about you, surely I have to say this would be the last reply to u.. I have no time for who alter QURAN with intention. God knows best.. May God save u.. T c
@ isamuslim
Yes even 55:7
God created it and leveled it and set balance to it.. Things need it's right balance to remain perfect.. Just any engineer Knows how they construct buildings with pure balance from the beginning of piling to end the task.. Use common sense in right way..
I know very well from where you guys bring these words suchoving and balance.. Coz our own hypocrites try to take words from QURAN to sooth and support those who say earth is spinning, gravity etc.. So that they can say to the world look it was written in Quran before 1400 years
.and you only discovered Now.. Hypocrites at best.. They just want their inner pleasure to the world we won. Our book has things even before u say it.. Such foolish people and not thought what their aim. And I am sure those in NASA must b having a drink in cluster and must be having fun looking at these fools. Yes Satan you won
You can coz u r very crafty.. Coz you have a target to finish that started long back..
.
Quote from: jkhan on April 11, 2018, 12:51:38 PM
I know very well from where you guys bring these words suchoving and balance.. Coz our own hypocrites try to take words from QURAN to sooth and support those who say earth is spinning, gravity etc.. So that they can say to the world look it was written in Quran before 1400 years
.and you only discovered Now.. Hypocrites at best.. They just want their inner pleasure to the world we won. Our book has things even before u say it.. Such foolish people and not thought what their aim. And I am sure those in NASA must b having a drink in cluster and must be having fun looking at these fools. Yes Satan you won
You can coz u r very crafty.. Coz you have a target to finish that started long back..
.
Satan can suck it. He's a douchebag. Sorry i just had to say it. The devil is piece of crap and i really despise that bastard.
Quote from: Manny_E on April 11, 2018, 02:11:57 PM
There's no one called Satan.
To be fair, Shaytan isn't exactly Satan. But shaytan does mean devil or rebel:
Shiin-Tay-Nun (root of shaytan) = become distant/far/remote, enter firmly / become firmly fixed therein / penetrate and be concealed, turn away in opposition (from direction/aim), devil, one excessively proud/corrupt, unbelieving/rebellious/insolent/audacious/obstinate/perverse, rope, deep curved well, it burned, became burnt, serpent, any blameable faculty or power of a man.
shaytan n.m. (pl. shayatin) 2:14, 2:36, 2:102, 2:102, 2:168, 2:208, 2:268, 2:275, 3:36, 3:155, 3:175, 4:38, 4:60, 4:76, 4:76, 4:83, 4:117, 4:119, 4:120, 5:90, 5:91, 6:43, 6:68, 6:71, 6:112, 6:121, 6:142, 7:20, 7:22, 7:27, 7:27, 7:30, 7:175, 7:200, 7:201, 8:11, 8:48, 12:5, 12:42, 12:100, 14:22, 15:17, 16:63, 16:98, 17:27, 17:27, 17:53, 17:53, 17:64, 18:63, 19:44, 19:44, 19:45, 19:68, 19:83, 20:120, 21:82, 22:3, 22:52, 22:52, 22:53, 23:97, 24:21, 24:21, 25:29, 26:210, 26:221, 27:24, 28:15, 29:38, 31:21, 35:6, 36:60, 37:7, 37:65, 38:37, 38:41, 41:36, 43:36, 43:62, 47:25, 58:10, 58:19, 58:19, 58:19, 59:16, 67:5, 81:25
It has been suggested the root is Shiin-Ya/Alif-Tay, see the following note from Lane here. http://www.studyquran.co.uk/Lane/ShTayNun_OR_ShYaTay.jpg (http://www.studyquran.co.uk/Lane/ShTayNun_OR_ShYaTay.jpg)
LL, V4, p: 275, 276 ## http://ejtaal.net/aa/#q=shTn (http://ejtaal.net/aa/#q=shTn)
P.S I know you are have criticized PRL so there are links above which shows Etjaal dictionaries.
Peace jkhan.
So some of us are hypocrites working for NASA and I manipulate Qoran verses?
And what are you doing ? Making the verses dance to your tune? Yes a flat tune!!!
Thanks for the conversation as well.
GOD bless you.
Peace.
@manny_e
Oh no Satan, no angels, No God No man no women oops only You.. Ooh what a world you r alone the king of everything.. Live it as you like.. Try to avoid death which is certain, then it is too late for you to correct them.. :jedi:
@Sardar.. The way you despise Satan seems if you see him you would torture and kill him.. That's where we got wrong.. Satan is so powerful but he is using only his whispering duping quality towards us. To respond to such a creature having angry and showing physics wont work out.. Only way is approach God closer and closer and do everything what God says as much as possible and think of his creations.. In this way Satan will be utterly defeated. We can't defeat powerful creature like Satan by our physic or stoning at him every year.. He is someone not even afraid to blazing shooting fire in the nearest of heavens.. So what is our pebbles.. Only way is to hurt him by getting near to God.. It means we reject his power.. So he mentally fail and will know that this man is tough to bend. That's our test.. Don't lose it.. God bless u Sardar..
Let's get back to the vastness of earth and heavens..
Have anyone seen the way the flatearth community claim the shape of the earth or have u seen the emblem of United Nations.. Of course you can view them.. I am not here to convince you with them.. But they have not changed anything to the map but only thing is the position angle it looks from normal world map..
It reminds me few verses of Quran.. God says "we were one community and became diverse.. And during dulkarnain period people were living in east and west .. No idea when dulkarnain lived but should b long back since his story mentioned in Quran and previous scriptures hopefully.. It shows he was one of the oldest persons in this earth.. Strangly people were living on Both sides of the earth..
Now the concern is how they spread with limited facilities.. Specially we know that the extreme beginning people's stories are quite simply understood to be living in greater part of middle east take Ad or Hud or even Noah after great flood and then continued to Abraham.. If u read Quran and those histories you get rough idea.. But people somehow spread.. HOW?? We know how huge the oceans of pacific and Atlantics, crossing them just to go and settle is something of brave effort.. But as per the map I see UN or FE It is much more possible that anyone can travel the all major continents without hardly voyaging any oceans.. Hardly any self propelling canoe can take them cross few visible distances.. You won't get me unless you look at that map..
Even in Dulkarnain story in Quran God never said he took a rounded trip but Says he took a way and another way and a way.. God could have said dulkarnain went to west setting point sun and continued to same way. but no he (sababa) a way. Looks like he hardly travelled on oceans.. But land itself.. It's really clear even now world is possible to be travelled through land with minimum crossing of sea(just few distance) not vast ocean.. But if course can travel vast ocean too coz its around the entire lands and in
Quote from: jkhan on April 11, 2018, 08:35:22 PM
@Sardar.. The way you despise Satan seems if you see him you would torture and kill him.. That's where we got wrong.. Satan is so powerful but he is using only his whispering duping quality towards us. To respond to such a creature having angry and showing physics wont work out.. Only way is approach God closer and closer and do everything what God says as much as possible and think of his creations.. In this way Satan will be utterly defeated. We can't defeat powerful creature like Satan by our physic or stoning at him every year.. He is someone not even afraid to blazing shooting fire in the nearest of heavens.. So what is our pebbles.. Only way is to hurt him by getting near to God.. It means we reject his power.. So he mentally fail and will know that this man is tough to bend. That's our test.. Don't lose it.. God bless u Sardar..
I know man, i love it when i piss the devil off is to do good & righteous deeds.
77:25 Have we not made the earth as a receptacle .
So God has made the earth to hold everything in it as a container / vessel.
Same we previously observed in verse 78:6 have we not made earth as cradle.. All these are a pattern which can hold the vast ocean water without being spilled..
These verses won't suit anyway near to be rounded ball
@Manny -E
We know from QURAN what actually Satan is.. Actually he is a Jin. Leader of us Iblees a Jin.. They have families like us living around on this earth and they can travel up until the skies.. Satan is common given to the One who are active to dupe man.. As God says in a verse.. " you don't see them, but they do and keep waiting .."
When such whispering is done we get duped.. Even in man such whispering are around.. As per chapter 114. When it comes to shayaitin it is in men and Jin. But Satan is the common name in Quran to whome we are vulnerable.. Read 7:12-18 & 7:22-23 & 7:27 if these verses won't give u meaning of Satan to be as a person with physic surrounding us without being noticed to us. Then you won't get Quran.. God bless u in whatever way to His path.. T c
See this mind blowing verse.. Not a single verse of God support for globe earth.. Coz He knows what He created and not us or NASA
25:45 " Have you not considered your Lord? How He extends the shadow, and if He will He could have made it STATIONARY- then we have made the SUN for its indication.."
Okay most of you would have got it as it is explained, coz its so simple way and very clear.. This would not b possible with GE faith only with FE faith, I mean only with the way God created and not human infusion.. Human infusion of blasphemy always fails but it takes time.. Satan is supporter that's why..
It's crystal clear how God moves the sun and on stationary earth according to the angle of sun it's shadows keep changing til it get set.. Coz God said if the shadow to be stationary then it's cause Sun .. It's not earth it's rotating to give the shadow.. Even for a stationary shadow it's Sun and not earth.. You can't get stationary shadow with moving earth
Peace jkhan.
You really need to reflect on this rush of blood in your threads.
I am only advising you as a friend. I have got this feeling you will regret this ,even be embarrassed in the future with what you are saying.
I have seen many come back here asking admins to delete their threads when they come to realise the nonsense of it?
Your choice.
GOD bless you.
Peace.
:offtopic: :elektro: :whatever: :rotfl:
:rotfl: :rotfl: :voodoo: :voodoo:
People you guess.. We have always Quran.. And many sites to which we can approach people.. After all it's people who study QURAN n follow will succeed.. Its not a new thing.. 😉
Quote from: jkhan on April 12, 2018, 04:27:31 AM
Satan is supporter that's why..
It's crystal clear how God moves the sun and on stationary earth according to the angle of sun it's shadows keep changing til it get set.. Coz God said if the shadow to be stationary then it's cause Sun .. It's not earth it's rotating to give the shadow.. Even for a stationary shadow it's Sun and not earth.. You can't get stationary shadow with moving earth
7:11 And We created you, then We shaped you, then We said to the angels: "Yield to Adam;" so they yielded except for Satan, he was not of those who yielded.
7:12 He said: "What has prevented you from yielding when I have ordered you?" He said: "I am far better than him, You created me from fire and created him from clay!"Should the earth (clay) circling the sun (fire)? or the other way around?
@. Tilhawa
By just looking at your last comment.. Some may think yes.. But for me I always go with Quran.. I don't blame you but it is not.. There is no such connection.. Yes sun is fire n earth is earth.. But giving priority compare with Jin and man is no way close.. Remember MOON also circling.. I wonder what it is made of but it's not fire.. Right? We have immense claim in Quran to prove that earth is no round n spinning n may not necessarily need such.. Hope you got my mindset.. That's my view.. You have your freedom of thought..
Quote from: jkhan on April 12, 2018, 06:29:45 AM
@. Tilhawa
By just looking at your last comment.. Some may think yes.. But for me I always go with Quran.. I don't blame you but it is not.. There is no such connection.. Yes sun is fire n earth is earth.. But giving priority compare with Jin and man is no way close.. Remember MOON also circling.. I wonder what it is made of but it's not fire.. Right? We have immense claim in Quran to prove that earth is no round n spinning n may not necessarily need such.. Hope you got my mindset.. That's my view.. You have your freedom of thought..
No problem jkhan, just wondering whether the satan still use the same old story as what they have done in the past. :peace:
Salaam
@Tilihawa
Don't bother.. In my understanding Satan has duped every single human being at least once in their life time.. Great example is Adam who was living in Jannah no one to share the blessings with him and all for him his family and everything is there and still Satan overcame him by his inborn nature. So we are no one. For me Ibrahim is such a favorite character (don't think I distinguish messengers) but still he was duped by Satan to kill his Son..
But the thing is we should not be vulnerable to his whispering throughout our extended life.. If we surrender in our whole life to Satan then we are doomed.. Definitely Satan will say I didn't do anything all man did, I only whispered.. Yes he is right, that's all he does we, man does the rest..
God knows even Hs true believers are prone to Satan and that's why we are commanded to refuge to God from Satan.. And we are commanded to beg for pardon, coz we have done things wrong knowingly or not, for that Satan is impetus, but we are culprits.. That's why disbelievers are not draged to hell alone but with their respective companion..thats the whisperer
Peace to all
Let me furnish the following few verses to those who ponder and to open their eyes away from myth.. God will you are.
19:88-92
"And they say Ar Rahman has begotten a son, You have uttered a grievous thing, whereby the HEAVENS burst, and the EARTH splits asunder, and the MOUNTAINS collapse in devastation, that they ascribe a son to Ar Rahman .."
These are feelings of these three entities coz of the saying and ascribing a son to their Lord which is a blasphemy.
See the way how God explained what He created. He didn't create other than that for our test.. Rest is his own business such as Arsh (Throne) it's for his own purpose..
Now see how His whole creation almost topple by hearing to these unthankful human.. Just the heavens started bursting and then the earth split and mountains collapse.. That's all the whole system.. To explain this as a universe (myth) it is very hard and these three explanation won't be enough. Coz in myth of universe you have more than that.. It need further elaboration.. They don't exist.. That's why The Creator Himself figured out the verses in this way.. Hope the verses are well clear in its own. We can imagine where we live and in what system we live by these verses.
Quote from: jkhan on April 13, 2018, 05:05:27 AM
Peace to all
Let me furnish the following few verses to those who ponder and to open their eyes away from myth.. God will you are.
19:88-92
"And they say Ar Rahman has begotten a son, You have uttered a grievous thing, whereby the HEAVENS burst, and the EARTH splits asunder, and the MOUNTAINS collapse in devastation, that they ascribe a son to Ar Rahman .."
These are feelings of these three entities coz of the saying and ascribing a son to their Lord which is a blasphemy.
See the way how God explained what He created. He didn't create other than that for our test.. Rest is his own business such as Arsh (Throne) it's for his own purpose..
Now see how His whole creation almost topple by hearing to these unthankful human.. Just the heavens started bursting and then the earth split and mountains collapse.. That's all the whole system.. To explain this as a universe (myth) it is very hard and these three explanation won't be enough. Coz in myth of universe you have more than that.. It need further elaboration.. They don't exist.. That's why The Creator Himself figured out the verses in this way.. Hope the verses are well clear in its own. We can imagine where we live and in what system we live by these verses.
There is
no way to tell from The Quran the shape of the Earth.
Please watch this video from Joseph (Quran Centric):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5hOQfxtqPj0
Instead, anyone with a bit of time and patience can verify that
the Earth is a Globe.
You, as most of the flat-earthers, are accusing anyone that says otherwise than you is a hypocrite trying to protect NASA, etc.
https://www.popsci.com/10-ways-you-can-prove-earth-is-round
This below information for those who are well versed in astronomy and also for anyone.. You would have studied much in it like most of the planets have it's own moon and the time it takes to rotate them and the time those planets take to rotate the sun.. Every planets take different time compared to EARTH.. And some planets rotate totally opposite I mean sun rises from west.. So days and months are not as the earth.. Those who are not familiar can google and verify these details.. For example Jupiter rotates more than two times faster than earth rotates Sun.. These all information and being accepted by almost all, except very few minor community such true Quran believers and strangly by Flatearthers who don't believe in Quran but most believe in their respective books..
Okay let me come to point
The verse 9:36 a familiar verse to many..
"Verily the number of months with God is twelve months, so was it ordained by God in the Day when He created the HEAVENS and the EARTH. ...."
Yes heavens and Earth (that's all He created which included whatever in heavens (Sun, moon stars and living things, unseen etc. & and whatever on earth mountains oceans living things, unseen etc) For this He decreed 12 months which we know either lunar or solar.. This cannot v changed.. But as per myth this won't work out coz for universe it has its own time for each planet and for each moon.. I learned there are 181 moon's rotating.. U can see in case in Google..
How contradictory to what the Creator calls..
It's all for you to verify and think people..
Okay call me qafir call me Munafiq call me by any mean words you like to.. My Lord knows me who I am and I know who I am that's more than enough.. Prophets were mocked and called madman.. Who am I, just a poor man on this earth..so it won't hurt me..
By the will of God why I chose this subject of heavens and Earth.. Coz even how much u prove about all other subjects in Quran, it will be in vain if NASA and rest prove QURAN is wrong and there is no God by their conspiracy if world is spinning and rounding and this myth universe.. Coz QURAN not stated in such manner.. I don't won't to prove anything what NASA brings .. But I need to say this is what Quran has revealed..thats all take it or leave it.. All will see their life after death as per what they have done.. I won't b asked what u did or u won't be asked what I did.. T c
NOTE : Some translate month to full moons as full circle.. It's fine anyway..
Also the matters of 50000 years mentioned are not on this heavens and earth it's beyond it where the Arsh is situated.. No one will know them..
Quote from: tlihawa on April 12, 2018, 06:05:29 AM
Should the earth (clay) circling the sun (fire)? or the other way around?
The Quranic fact clearly explained it well..
?Till, when he (Dzul-Qarnayn) reached the setting place of the sun, he found it setting in a muddy spring (aynin hamiat)"
18:86
The sun don't circle the earth, it set / sunk into it to a water spring. That's a FACT.
Globe earth encircling the round sun is a MYTH.
Jafar, you are wrong, I can see the sun setting in my back garden. May be it is a different sun than the one you describe in 18:86.
I also saw another sun set in the sea when I was on holiday.
Jafar, it depends which sun you are talking about? Or may be there are thousands of suns setting everywhere on earth?
Qoran is a "joke" to you brother, is it?
I am still surprised by your sense of humour at the expense of Qoran! Yet you know it is deliberately false.
GOD bless you.
Peace.
Quote from: good logic on April 13, 2018, 09:10:48 AM
Jafar, you are wrong, I can see the sun setting in my back garden. May be it is a different sun than the one you describe in 18:86.I also saw another sun set in the sea when I was on holiday.
You haven't "reached the setting place of the sun" while Dzul-Qarnayn has..
?Till, when he (Dzul-Qarnayn)
reached the setting place of the sun, he
found it setting in a muddy spring (aynin hamiat)"
18:86
QuoteQoran is a "joke" to you brother, is it?
I am still surprised by your sense of humour at the expense of Qoran! Yet you know it is deliberately false.
Quran is a FACT because it is written 100% by God.. all other sources are MYTH. NASA is a FRAUD.
Quote from: jkhan on April 13, 2018, 08:21:09 AM
This below information for those who are well versed in astronomy and also for anyone.. You would have studied much in it like most of the planets have it's own moon and the time it takes to rotate them and the time those planets take to rotate the sun.. Every planets take different time compared to EARTH.. And some planets rotate totally opposite I mean sun rises from west.. So days and months are not as the earth.. Those who are not familiar can google and verify these details.. For example Jupiter rotates more than two times faster than earth rotates Sun.. These all information and being accepted by almost all, except very few minor community such true Quran believers and strangly by Flatearthers who don't believe in Quran but most believe in their respective books..
Okay let me come to point
The verse 9:36 a familiar verse to many..
"Verily the number of months with God is twelve months, so was it ordained by God in the Day when He created the HEAVENS and the EARTH. ...."
Yes heavens and Earth (that's all He created which included whatever in heavens (Sun, moon stars and living things, unseen etc. & and whatever on earth mountains oceans living things, unseen etc) For this He decreed 12 months which we know either lunar or solar.. This cannot v changed.. But as per myth this won't work out coz for universe it has its own time for each planet and for each moon.. I learned there are 181 moon's rotating.. U can see in case in Google..
How contradictory to what the Creator calls..
It's all for you to verify and think people..
Okay call me qafir call me Munafiq call me by any mean words you like to.. My Lord knows me who I am and I know who I am that's more than enough.. Prophets were mocked and called madman.. Who am I, just a poor man on this earth..so it won't hurt me..
By the will of God why I chose this subject of heavens and Earth.. Coz even how much u prove about all other subjects in Quran, it will be in vain if NASA and rest prove QURAN is wrong and there is no God by their conspiracy if world is spinning and rounding and this myth universe.. Coz QURAN not stated in such manner.. I don't won't to prove anything what NASA brings .. But I need to say this is what Quran has revealed..thats all take it or leave it.. All will see their life after death as per what they have done.. I won't b asked what u did or u won't be asked what I did.. T c
NOTE : Some translate month to full moons as full circle.. It's fine anyway..
Also the matters of 50000 years mentioned are not on this heavens and earth it's beyond it where the Arsh is situated.. No one will know them..
You said:
Okay call me qafir call me Munafiq call me by any mean words you like to.. My Lord knows me who I am and I know who I am that's more than enough.. Prophets were mocked and called madman.. Who am I, just a poor man on this earth..so it won't hurt me..
But before that, you said:
These all information and being accepted by almost all, except very few minor community
such true Quran believers and strangly by Flatearthers who don't believe in Quran but most believe in their respective books..
Actually you first called "non true Quran believers" those who don't believe in the flat-earth fantasy and do not interpret the Quran in a biased way as you do, and then you accused us of calling you a disbeliever.
I think that nobody here is mocking you nor calling you a madman, nor calling you a rejecter nor a hypocrite, unless I missed something in this thread, but you by yourself are partly demostrating this behavior:
When you see them, their appearance appeals to you. And when they speak, you listen to what they say. They are like propped up timber.
They think every shout is aimed at them. They are the enemy, so beware of them. May God destroy them; how devious they are?
(63:4)
Quote from: Jafar on April 13, 2018, 09:45:17 AM
You haven't "reached the setting place of the sun" while Dzul-Qarnayn has..
?Till, when he (Dzul-Qarnayn) reached the setting place of the sun, he found it setting in a muddy spring (aynin hamiat)"
18:86
Salam/Peace Jafar This is from https://lampofislam.wordpress.com/2016/06/27/does-the-quran-say-that-the-sun-sinks-in-a-muddy-lake/ (https://lampofislam.wordpress.com/2016/06/27/does-the-quran-say-that-the-sun-sinks-in-a-muddy-lake/)
Quote(https://lampofislam.files.wordpress.com/2016/06/does-the-quran-say-that-the-sun-sinks-in-a-muddy-lake1.jpg)
Question: The Quran says that Zul-qarnain REACHED the place where the sun sinks in a murky lake (18:86). So, god thinks there is a setting place of the sun on the earth!
Can you refute this very obvious SCIENTIFIC ERROR in the Quran?
Answer: Before drawing any conclusion, we would first like to have a look into the issue.
A CLOSER LOOK INTO 18:86
Let us read the verse in its context:
So he followed a course, 18:85
Until, when he REACHED A SETTING of the Sun, it APPEARED to him that it was SETTING in a murky spring. 18:86
On a closer study of the above, and the highlighted words in particular, we get the following findings:
The verse narrates a setting of the Sun, not a drowning of the Sun
Translated here as ?a setting?, the word ?maghrib? derives from ?gharaba? (blacken, darken), which is opposite of ?sharaqa? (shine, brighten, 39:69).
Thus ?a setting? portrays a process of blackening or darkening (?gharaba?) of the Sun as appears to an observer on the Earth.
This is very DIFFERENT from an actual, physical sinking (?gharaqa?) of the Sun.
The verse deals with an event of setting rather than a place of sinking
Then the phrase ?it was SETTING? ? which uses the word ?gharaba? (set, darken) instead of ?gharaqa? (sink) ? further confirms that it refers to a perceptible phenomenon of Sun?s setting rather than a physical place of Sun?s drowning.
The verse refers to ?a setting point? ? not ?the setting point? ? of the Sun
The word ?maghrib? (setting) in singular form occurs 7 times in the Quran (2:115, 2:142, 2:177, 2:258, 18:86, 26:28, 73:9). In all these occurrences, with the exception of 18:86, it appears as ?al-maghrib? (the setting), i.e. prefixed with ?al? (?the?).
So it is remarkable that 18:86, i.e. the verse we are discussing here, is the only occurrence in the Quran where the word ?maghrib? is without the definite article ?al? (?the?). Thus, rather than referring to ?THE SETTING?, it actually refers to ?A SETTING?.
In other words, in 18:86 Zul-qarnain does not reach ?the (point of) sunset?, but reaches only ?a (point of) sunset?, i.e. only one of the many (points of) sunsets.
Elsewhere the Quran itself confirms that ?points of sunset? are many (70:40). This clarifies the Quranic position that the Sun doesn?t set in a particular point only. And, therefore, the Sun never ?sinks? in a specific place. (https://lampofislam.wordpress.com/2014/10/06/earths-axial-rotation/ (https://lampofislam.wordpress.com/2014/10/06/earths-axial-rotation/))
Please note that, though ?maghrib? actually means ?a setting?, we may also render it as ?a (point of) setting?, in order to facilitate our understanding of this complex natural phenomenon of sunset.
The verse correctly states that one can reach a point of sunset
The Quran has been misjudged by the claim that one cannot reach a point of sunset.
A sunset point is a place where you experience a sunset at a given moment. However, because sunset is a space-time (four dimensional) phenomenon, the sunset point is not static but is moving around the Earth together with its axial rotation. (https://lampofislam.wordpress.com/2014/10/06/earths-axial-rotation (https://lampofislam.wordpress.com/2014/10/06/earths-axial-rotation))
Let us reflect. As the Earth is spinning around itself facing the Sun, the Sun is setting continuously on successive points of the globe, while simultaneously rising on their counterparts (37:5, 7:54, 39:5, 70:40).
Thus, at a given moment there is a specific point/place on the Earth where the perceivable event of sunset occurs. You can reach that point/place at that particular moment to experience the sunset.
Sunset comes back to that specific point approximately every 24 hours. But if you travel fast towards the west, you can reach other points of sunset, earlier than 24 hours.
Every time you experience a sunset, you are at a sunset point.
Now consider a place A on the Earth where the Sun will set today at 10:00 GMT. And you are currently at one hour walking distance from that place. So now it is 9:00 GMT. It means that if you walk one hour towards A, you will reach a sunset point at 10:00 GMT where you will experience the sunset.
The verse defines sunset as a subjective perception
Then interestingly, the phrase ?it APPEARED to him? precisely describes sunset through the eyes of Zul-qarnain.
Thus the Quran defines sunset not within the context of an objective scientific description of the Sun?s motion but merely as a subjective, visual perception of an earthly observer. This concurs with the definition of sunset in modern physics.
This is further consistent with our earlier findings that the verse uses the expression ?setting?, instead of ?drowning?, and ?a setting?, instead of ?the setting?.
These are some of the examples of how the divine revelation chooses the right words and expressions.
In line with the above, 18:86 should be understood as ?Until, when he reached a point where he perceived a setting of the Sun ??.
SUMMARY
We find the verse 18:86 scientifically accurate due to our following observations:
The verse narrates a setting of the Sun, not a drowning of the Sun.
It deals with an event of setting rather than a place of sinking.
It refers to ?a setting point? ? not ?the setting point? ? of the Sun. This is in line with the Quranic concept that ?points of sunset? are many and, therefore, the Sun doesn?t ?sink? in any particular place.
It correctly states that one can reach a point of sunset.
It defines sunset as a subjective perception. This is true from a modern scientific perspective.
CONCLUSION
The verse 18:86 contains no scientific error.
Hey you all know almost 99percent of so called Muslim do take Quran and sunnah from hadith books. When we were kids we used to go at least for jumma prayers with precise time and keep listening with care.. So, have you ever heard this Hadith, saying " there is a house in paradise absolutely parelel to Kaaba in Makka, angels 70 thousand visit it daily and they never return there, and such a frequented bless place.. Even stone falls from there it will exactly fall on Kaaba.. " I can't remember but I put it in a way I do remember.. Honestly I have never read any hadith book in my life but heard almost all.
So. Even a child of this era would get this hadith against the accepted theory of spinning and rounding world.. Coz how can the Kaaba b parelel to anything on top while it is spinning, in addition it is changing its position by rotating sun
Stone fall.. So funny.. 😱
But this hadith is in sahih and accepted. So 99 percent of Muslim should accept coz hadith is part of their belief unless they are rejectors..
Let's come to the matter.. Who ever fabricated this Hadith he or she had a firm belief that this earth was not spinning and it's flat and sky was a canopy.. Atleast had a sort of right belief.. But unfortunately these so called hadith believers do believe the earth is spinning and rotating Sun regardless of what is written in their hadith book..
So strange and very unfortunate is their blindness.. Same most Quran only believers, their aim is to attack hadith believers coz they found out hadith is wrong n not authorized by God.. But they forget what they believe and what they are trapped with..coz they accept things which is entirely against Quran, by accepting and attaching to their life what the crafty inventors conspired.. And what they try to do is put more fuel to it to give more evidence from QURAN to streamline it.. Coz they thought we can't deny the scientific proof accepted by majority so let's support It.
God knows hearts.. Both these Quranist and hadith followers same.. Same route same Satan duped them.. God save!
Quote from: jkhan on April 13, 2018, 10:58:20 AM
Hey you all know almost 99percent of so called Muslim do take Quran and sunnah from hadith books. When we were kids we used to go at least for jumma prayers with precise time and keep listening with care.. So, have you ever heard this Hadith, saying " there is a house in paradise absolutely parelel to Kaaba in Makka, angels 70 thousand visit it daily and they never return there, and such a frequented bless place.. Even stone falls from there it will exactly fall on Kaaba.. " I can't remember but I put it in a way I do remember.. Honestly I have never read any hadith book in my life but heard almost all.
So. Even a child of this era would get this hadith against the accepted theory of spinning and rounding world.. Coz how can the Kaaba b parelel to anything on top while it is spinning, in addition it is changing its position by rotating sun
Stone fall.. So funny.. 😱
But this hadith is in sahih and accepted. So 99 percent of Muslim should accept coz hadith is part of their belief unless they are rejectors..
Let's come to the matter.. Who ever fabricated this Hadith he or she had a firm belief that this earth was not spinning and it's flat and sky was a canopy.. Atleast had a sort of right belief.. But unfortunately these so called hadith believers do believe the earth is spinning and rotating Sun regardless of what is written in their hadith book..
So strange and very unfortunate is their blindness.. Same most Quran only believers, their aim is to attack hadith believers coz they found out hadith is wrong n not authorized by God.. But they forget what they believe and what they are trapped with..coz they accept things which is entirely against Quran, by accepting and attaching to their life what the crafty inventors conspired.. And what they try to do is put more fuel to it to give more evidence from QURAN to streamline it.. Coz they thought we can't deny the scientific proof accepted by majority so let's support It.
God knows hearts.. Both these Quranist and hadith followers same.. Same route same Satan duped them.. God save!
I guess you completely ignored the links I gave you before? I heard no comment from yourself. That man in his video discussed every verse that is commonly taken to mean "flat-earth", and proved that it is not what is meant.
So I conclude that is completely useless trying to discuss with you, as you will keep ignoring any debate or argument, and keep placing those who don't interpret the Quran the way you do among the disbelievers. No offence, but you have the same behavior of the mushrikeen who don't want to abandon their idol.
Jafar, of course I reached the setting of the sun, When I was sat on my chair relaxing listening to the birds, I saw the sun setting in my garden.
Oh I also reached the rising of the sun the next morning, I found it rising on my bedroom window.
It is too silly carrying on this conversation , don t you think?
Brother, study Qoran properly, the years are going by and you are going to look sillier and sillier commenting on the book without knowledge.
My advice to you if you wish to take it?
GOD bless you.
Peace.
Quote from: good logic on April 13, 2018, 11:32:35 AM
Jafar, of course I reached the setting of the sun, When I was sat on my chair relaxing listening to the birds, I saw the sun setting in my garden.
No you haven't.. but Dzul Qarnayn did...
?Till, when he (Dzul-Qarnayn)
reached the setting place of the sun, he found it setting in a muddy spring (aynin hamiat)"
18:86
Otherwise God will write in His book:
"Till, when he (Dzul-Qarnayn) reached a place where he see the sun is setting in a muddy spring (aynin hamiat)".
Quote from: Jafar on April 13, 2018, 11:53:07 AM
No you haven't.. but Dzul Qarnayn did...
?Till, when he (Dzul-Qarnayn) reached the setting place of the sun, he found it setting in a muddy spring (aynin hamiat)"
18:86
Otherwise God will write in His book:
"Till, when he (Dzul-Qarnayn) reached a place where he see the sun is setting in a muddy spring (aynin hamiat)".
Salam/Peace dear brother Jafar, did you see my reply to you?
Peace Jafar.
You are serious, or are you?
Reaching where the sun sets on earth is always a place where we see the sun set, including Dhu Al Qranain!!!
Qoran says sun, moon and earth are independent each running in its own orbit. i.e they do not meet/collide but according to you one sets in the other. The minds boggles at your humour?
This is so obvious even with your understanding of the book ,reaching where the sun sets is always a place on earth where we perceive/see it set.
I still think you are being sarcastic brother, surely you are better than being serious on this simple matter.
Never mind. it is not worth pursuing.
GOD bless you.
Peace.
Good logic,
You should be logic: when the sun sets in water, for instance in the ocean, it is very simple, it dilutes. Then when we see appear whole it is due to it evaporating and fusing again togther to get up in time to appear again nest day for work. So very simple it is!
Salaam
18:86 حتى until اذا when بلغ reach مغرب western/direction sunset الشمس the sun وجدها found it تغرب it west/direction sunset فى in عىن spring حمىه dark mud...
26:28 قال said رب lord المشرق the east/direction sunrise والمغرب and the western/direction sunset وما and what بىنهما between them dual ان if كنتم be you تعقلون understanding
(https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcS8kxzimWKPLK8BjA2IDqN-bKJ_mMuWV2Kf3f8JFPXrrM6SiunH)(https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRr5VXiJ1z_oqmN7RCOgZfdF_cPbf1eHYANRmv8mnwZYC6s-KSIaQ)
55:17 رب lord المشرقىن l-mashriqayni/the eastern/sunrise two (summers and winters solstices) ورب and lord المغربىن l-maghribayni/the western/sunset two (summers and winters solstices)
Quote from: huruf on April 13, 2018, 02:46:46 PM
Good logic,
You should be logic: when the sun sets in water, for instance in the ocean, it is very simple, it dilutes. Then when we see appear whole it is due to it evaporating and fusing again togther to get up in time to appear again nest day for work. So very simple it is!
Salaam
:)
Vastness of earth and heavens..
55:33 "O assembly of Jin and Men! If you(both) have power to cross / pass the ZONES of HEAVENS and EARTH then pass beyond! But you will never be able to pass, Except with Authority " I wonder God would give this authority ever
Many Hadithers and Quranist take this to advantage and go in line with science and nourish them and get in return an image to them.. Remember if you keep on supporting them by manipulating verses, then in the end same NASA and rest would say a different story changing their previous opinion and you will end up trapped and humiliated.. Allah has meant in Quran something then it is only His meaning. And not the meaning of science whether it is right or wrong or they alter it..
Okay let me elaborate this verse.. Think about it or accept it or reject. No worries.. Guidance from God only..
God clearly states that these Jins are mighty in it's own power vested to them.. We have noticed verses they reach to the extreme of heaven to listen.. It shows they can't listen from the earth or any other distance but reached close proximity till they hear.. To support it jins set with Mohammed to listen silently.. So their capacity to listen from distance is weak.. So jins have power to roam around the heavens but cannot pierce pass the zones.. That's crystal clear.. THE STRANGE POINT HERE IS They cannot pass beyond the zones of Earth. That puzzles me.. These same jins brought the palace of Sheba within a blink of an eye, and they dived deep oceans for King Sulaiman.. So still after roaming all paths of heavens they are restricted somewhere on earth where they not being able to reach.. Believe in Unseen(Ghaib) folks. Where these places on earth that powefull Jin and and relatively compared weak men cannot go pass.. As per God, He created Heavens and The Earth and we know it is not an universe myth.. Still this earth should have it's borders too well protected.. Same as the heavens extreme points are protected.. It's so clear God didn't only say it men or only to Jin but to both and further only didn't mention The Heavens but Earth as well where they cannot pass.. But for me these NASA and the super powers claim they have found and reached all places on earth and have videos and pictures of it . Shame.. So these men claim that they have overcome The powerful Jin which is barred from the places of earth to penetrate .. It's all for those who have clear belief and thoughts to ponder and be neutral and not be biased on things that you are taught with.. I know few will accept this.. But those who accept it always text me in silent manner as a mesage not in this forum.. Be brave folks give your thoughts in public.. It's your thoughts.. Human is free to explain what he feels, that's how God has created.. Be afraid to God and not powerless human
Sorry I missed one part to explain so that it would complete..
55:35 states "there will be sent against both you (Jin and Men) flames of fire and (nukhas) and you will not be able to defend yourself "
So if both Jin and Men in case try to encroach beyond the zones of earth and heavens they will be forces which block them.. Since I don't know the exact meaning of nukhas in Arabic I kept as it is.. Some translate it melted brass. But not satisfies me..
Just ponders.. God bless u
Sister huruf, I better call it a day in this thread like go and set somewhere.
You know like disappear into the sunset and melt with the sun in the water!!!
No, I have not lost my sense of humour, I am still smiling. Finding some posts light hearted and others shocking.
I also wonder, is the earth flat because the sun has set in a mountain and flattened it?
GOD bless you.
Peace.
https://www.sciencealert.com/nasa-kepler-google-finds-rocky-exoplanet-solar-system-kepler90
Read the link pls, if u have not read before.. So shame who says we follow Quran, and deny it knowingly.. The link is all about another solar system with 8 planets with habitations.. O God, how do they make blasphemy.. First of all this the place we live is not a solar system as they call with planets and rounding bla bla.. And they have found another.. What to say.. Where do Quran stand? QURAN talks of only one moon one sun and both join in the Day of ressurection.. Be and feel shame to call u Quran followers.. Let the curse of all those curse be on such who invent things like that and those who get attached to it.. Main aim is not Quran, but GODLESS but technologyfull and Mythful world.. Iblees you succeeded. Time of death will tell them what is truth..
It's not strange that God called in verse 56:13 "multitude of those (formost) will be from the first generation (awwaleen) and a very from of those (foremost) will be from the later generation (aakhareen)..
It tells the story that majority will doom.. The verse talk about who goes to paradise.. And clearly the first generation multitude, we know the population of first generation how sparse compared to later generation including us and to come after us.. Uffff. So from later generation very few (billions of people very few) .. That's a clear verdict.. Read 56:39 too.. We can imagine the majorities destiny, if u look majority they will divert you from the right path..QURAN talks.. No wonder why Hell says, is there anymore to fill?
O true believers get out of this shackle.. Thought it is tough, that's the only way..
Quote from: good logic on April 14, 2018, 06:00:56 AM
Sister huruf, I better call it a day in this thread like go and set somewhere.
You know like disappear into the sunset and melt with the sun in the water!!!
No, I have not lost my sense of humour, I am still smiling. Finding some posts light hearted and others shocking.
I also wonder, is the earth flat because the sun has set in a mountain and flattened it?
GOD bless you.
Peace.
good logic drive carefully I would not like to see you fall off the edge of
the planet because you have a heart as big as Texas that reaches from Maine to Montana. :peace:
We are drops of God's good will...
What do we know but just a drop
and what can we
but just a drop of humble good will?
Salaam
Brother hawk, these days I seem to be driving some people mad but I rather drive my my car into a cliff!
Talking about driving:
1-Time to Stop
A traffic cop pulled alongside a speeding car on the motorway. Glancing into the car, he was astounded to see that the young lady, who was driving, was knitting.
Realising that she was oblivious to his flashing lights and siren, the policeman wound down his window, turned on his loudspeaker and yelled, 'PULL OVER!'
'NO, 'the young lady yelled back, 'IT's A SCARF!'
2-One can Meet His/Her Match
A patrol officer pulled over Enid for speeding. Enid was a 65 year old lady from out of state.
The officer asked to see her licence. 'Don't have one' Enid said. 'Can I please see the Vehicle registration' the officer asked firmly but politely. 'Nope' snapped Enid.
In that case I will have to take you into the Police station and charge you there. When they arrived the arresting officer said, to the duty sergeant. This lady has no licence and no vehicle registration.
'Sure I do' said Enid sweetly. 'This officer has got in for me, the next thing is he will be saying that I was speeding' Besides I do not let people I do not like see my licence or registration!
3-No Driving Licence
Betty was sitting on a lawn sunning and reading, when she was startled by a Buick Enclave crashing through a hedge and coming to rest on her lawn. She helped the elderly driver out and sat him on a lawn chair. "My goodness," she exclaimed, "you are quite old to be driving!" "Yes", he replied, "I am old enough that I don't need a license."
"What....NO LICENSE?" "Nope! The last time I went to my doctor he examined me, and asked if I had a driving license. I told I did have one and handed it to him. He took scissors out of a drawer, cut the license into pieces, threw them in the wastebasket and said, 'You won't be needing this anymore.' So, I thanked him and left."
4-Off topic.
A wife was making a breakfast of fried eggs for her husband when he burst into the kitchen.
'Careful, 'he cried, 'CAREFUL! Put in some more butter! Oh my goodness! you're cooking too many at once. TOO MANY! Turn them! TURN THEM NOW! We need more butter. Oh my word! WHERE are we going to get MORE BUTTER? they're going to STICK! Careful ... CAREFUL! I said be CAREFUL! You NEVER listen to me when you're cooking! Never! Turn them! Hurry up! Are you CRAZY? Have you LOST your mind? Don't forget to salt them. You know you always forget to salt them. Use the salt. USE THE SALT! THE SALT!'
The wife stared at him in amazement, 'What in the world is wrong with you? You think I don't know how to fry a couple of eggs?'
The husband calmly replied, 'I wanted to show you what it feels like when I'm driving.'
Sorry jkhan ,guys for the off topic .
GOD bless.
Peace.
Ahh..it's almost Saturday.. Let me give a very relaxing one.. You can see some people here in the forum how proud and showing off some of their lavishness and going away from the reality.. It shows who they are. Just the way of real hypocrites.. Just leave them aside.. They will remain on earth as long as it last.. 36:62 " And indeed Satan did lead astray a great multitude of YOU, did you not then reflect?
Hey O God guided ones.. Just take the picture of apolo 17(google it or NASA web) in which they show African continent and Middle East peninsula clearly.. Have you thought something on it..
So rest of the world should be in the other side of the round earth.. What is rest of the world, both America's including massive Canada, and Greenland, whole of Europe, entire Russia, all of Asia, and Australia.. Hmm why not the gigantic Pacific Ocean. .can the other side hold these? 😧 now don't tell me a ball has more side than that? A funny guy who was GE told me it was an angle of the earth that's why others missing.. 😬😉. Somehow for him he has more than two sides to a ball from any view point.. Leave it.. Some how in this picture, whole of it is lit and day light, it's so clear..
So the other side naturally has to be under darkness, yes night.. Is that possible? All those areas I mentioned above to under night at one given time.. That's against truth of eye witness.. These are forged pictures.. Just people got bamboozled eversince the man allegedly landed on moon.. That's where iblees developed his technology to adapt to new generation.. He can't fool like he fooled the people pharoa.. With magic..right? It won't work out..
Quote from: jkhan on April 15, 2018, 12:20:57 AM
Ahh..it's almost Saturday.. Let me give a very relaxing one.. You can see some people here in the forum how proud and showing off some of their lavishness and going away from the reality.. It shows who they are. Just the way of real hypocrites.. Just leave them aside.. They will remain on earth as long as it last.. 36:62 " And indeed Satan did lead astray a great multitude of YOU, did you not then reflect?
Huh that's odd it's Sunday for me. (I live in Sweden)
Peace Mr Swedish,
So you know what is Sunday and Saturday.. According to spinning ball there cannot be Saturday since I am living in Sweden (Tgats your belief.. Right) . But you couldn't get what East and West and The last place to set sun and first place to rise Sun..
Last year i asked one of my colleagues, what is the place in which sun first rise.. He said Newzealand..O really I heard it like Kiribati.. No they changed it 😴😴. Wow that's nice.. And what is the last place place of Sun set.. American Samoa..😁 Hmm I have heard about Samoa but not America Samoa.. So I checked where this place is hmm Strangly not far from Newzealand .. Well that's the accepted truth anyhow in this world.. I wonder why not Samoa the first place of rising sun or even Hawaii or Alaska or Nipon(as it called sunrise nation) Just leave them.. It's not my interest here.. But they have such places in the world called SETTING PLACE OF SUN AND RISING PLACE..
Dulkarnain was a not someone like you and me, but a person who was given by God What a person can possess MEANS OF EVERYTHING .. it's something to note at.. Then such a guy is taking a journey.. And he was not in his courtyard throught his journey. From where he commenced his journey is mystry but he reached UNTIL (HATHTHA) setting place of Sun.. (magrib Al shams).. God has called in verses the Lord of two Easts and two Wests (mashrikain & maghribain) so clear the word magrib is west too.. And in verse 37:5 mashariq.. More than two.. It's so clear there are different positions of Sun where it rise and sets..
For some it's a joke. Sun sets.. I wonder what they call when the sun is dipping under the horizon.. They must have other names to call it.. Or when the sun is rising above the mountains.. It's well known sun not goes under or rising above. But still we in this generation (with well accepted myth) still call sunset at beach.. But when it is in Quran they have something to mock at.. Regardless of the verse which says sun and float in its orbits and never catch one another.. So both has setting and rising.. In reality nothing sets of rises from moon and sun's positions, but from earth's position it looks.. Coz earth flattened but concave /cradle/receptacle from its borders.. It means elevated..
Let's come back to dhulkarnain.. So he reached certain place but he saw the scene coz he could see Sun setting as we all can see.. It would look all Sun setting in the world.. But difference is it is the last place where it will set.. But it continues its course.. (same as the Google Search Says, last setting place Macao and rising place New Zealand. I wonder how it is true since both are very close).
So dhulkarnain with his power reached to that point and found people.. Then if he stayed in that same place definitely he can see when the morning approach the sun rise.. Every place where Sun set is sun rise should be.. 😬. But not he took his journey ahead and away from that place.
Then he took a way.. Again God says UNTILL (HATHTHA) ..no need someone to reach until he reach sun set.. If not in horizon even behind buildings Sun will set.. So it looks like a long journey to dhulkarnain.. But not if world is as per what we think.. For that look UN pic.. 😊
Then he reach another place.. UNTILL he reached two mountains.. And did many things there.. It could have been done only by someone who possesed all what not other man did.. That's what means EVERYTHING in 18:84 so don't think this just a story without any meaning.. In that same chapter.. People of cave also described taking sun into main factor and God says it was a sign 18:17 so it clearly indicate (gharabath ) is sun rise, without even mentioning Sun side by side.
In this verse Sun is which is moving and not earth to reach right to left.. This was one of those rare verses God could have said earth rotate.. But Not, coz it is not a rotating stuff.. But stationary.. What about this.. When we spinned the earth sun appeared to them on right side and when we further spinned it appeared to them on left.. It's not the case..
If NASA and it's children can say there is a place called sun set and sun rise last and first and you accept it. But when God says setting place and rising place your mind waver.. Make sure QURAN is complete even thought who's world prove it is wrong by indicating in it something erroneous.. That's where we fall from truth.. Coz whole world is human but Quran is God.
Read as** gharabath 18:17 Sun rise.. :sun:
You know it's Sun set :)
Quote from: jkhan on April 15, 2018, 05:05:17 AM
Peace Mr Swedish,
So you know what is Sunday and Saturday.. According to spinning ball there cannot be Saturday since I am living in Sweden (Tgats your belief.. Right) .
Salam/Peace dear brother Jkhan, what do you mean by my belief, i never denied the flat earth.
Sardar.. Oh if what u say is true, I am sorry.. May God forgive me😩
I said coz, you thought there cannot b still Saturday in earth.. Still it could have been in Samoa.. Remember last place of Sun set😧 :sun: almost Monday in New Zealand but in Samoa Saturday.. :rotfl: :wow
Peace to u.. God bless u and may God let me learn from you what I don't know in this forum..
Quote from: jkhan on April 15, 2018, 06:22:59 AM
Sardar.. Oh if what u say is true, I am sorry.. May God forgive me😩
I said coz, you thought there cannot b still Saturday in earth.. Still it could have been in Samoa.. Remember last place of Sun set😧 :sun: almost Monday in New Zealand but in Samoa Saturday.. :rotfl: :wow
Peace to u.. God bless u and may God let me learn from you what I don't know in this forum..
In my time right now it's 12:25 AM and it's Sunday in my country.
@Manny -E,
I don't know what you follow and what your business in this forum, but your tone is good for people to understand.. You seems like some one who holds budists view.. Its Wonderful and good till we live in this world, no harm at all.. But it will not take us to our final destination.. God believers are different they have goal and purpose. If anyone read all the verses in on QURAN which refers hypocrites we can easily identify them.. We should, coz we live with them and it's must know who they are to be safe from them..
Living as just a good person is not enough.. We know. the people in this world are good help others in worries when a calamity falls to others.. Spontaneously help each other. But this is not enough for God.. That's crystal clear.. He needs us to believe in Him and act upon His deen(system) prescribed on us.. For example I don't see anything wrong about the father of Prophet Ibrahim, other than rejecting God and be devoted to his gods, see the word being devoted so, he must b a good person practicing something he found to be good.. That's why Ibrahim asked for forgiveness, coz he knew his father was not a bad character. But unfortunately God called him in Quran to someone to be burned in hell.. That's more than enough evidence.. What about the wives of Lut and Noah they were destined for hell, but they lived their entire life with a God believer.. So amazing, what God belief makes a difference.. And take example the wife King parou.. She was a believer but she lived with him and enjoyed her life.. It's God belief that saves us. God belief means reject whatever against God and his verses.. Actually His verses coz other than his verses we don't know what's God.. Calling the hypocrites as hypocrites or disbeliever as disbliever is no harm.. When they specially with intention attack you with words.. Believer will quickly know what is truth.. Coz prophets good believers said we hear we obey.. And for hypocrites even his life time was not enough.. In my view there can be far better people in this world than believers based on their activities, but all will be in vain since they rejected the One who gave them life..
Quote from: good logic on April 14, 2018, 10:53:58 AM
Brother hawk, these days I seem to be driving some people mad but I rather drive my my car into a cliff!
Talking about driving:
1-Time to Stop
A traffic cop pulled alongside a speeding car on the motorway. Glancing into the car, he was astounded to see that the young lady, who was driving, was knitting.
Realising that she was oblivious to his flashing lights and siren, the policeman wound down his window, turned on his loudspeaker and yelled, 'PULL OVER!'
'NO, 'the young lady yelled back, 'IT's A SCARF!'
2-One can Meet His/Her Match
A patrol officer pulled over Enid for speeding. Enid was a 65 year old lady from out of state.
The officer asked to see her licence. 'Don't have one' Enid said. 'Can I please see the Vehicle registration' the officer asked firmly but politely. 'Nope' snapped Enid.
In that case I will have to take you into the Police station and charge you there. When they arrived the arresting officer said, to the duty sergeant. This lady has no licence and no vehicle registration.
'Sure I do' said Enid sweetly. 'This officer has got in for me, the next thing is he will be saying that I was speeding' Besides I do not let people I do not like see my licence or registration!
3-No Driving Licence
Betty was sitting on a lawn sunning and reading, when she was startled by a Buick Enclave crashing through a hedge and coming to rest on her lawn. She helped the elderly driver out and sat him on a lawn chair. "My goodness," she exclaimed, "you are quite old to be driving!" "Yes", he replied, "I am old enough that I don't need a license."
"What....NO LICENSE?" "Nope! The last time I went to my doctor he examined me, and asked if I had a driving license. I told I did have one and handed it to him. He took scissors out of a drawer, cut the license into pieces, threw them in the wastebasket and said, 'You won't be needing this anymore.' So, I thanked him and left."
4-Off topic.
A wife was making a breakfast of fried eggs for her husband when he burst into the kitchen.
'Careful, 'he cried, 'CAREFUL! Put in some more butter! Oh my goodness! you're cooking too many at once. TOO MANY! Turn them! TURN THEM NOW! We need more butter. Oh my word! WHERE are we going to get MORE BUTTER? they're going to STICK! Careful ... CAREFUL! I said be CAREFUL! You NEVER listen to me when you're cooking! Never! Turn them! Hurry up! Are you CRAZY? Have you LOST your mind? Don't forget to salt them. You know you always forget to salt them. Use the salt. USE THE SALT! THE SALT!'
The wife stared at him in amazement, 'What in the world is wrong with you? You think I don't know how to fry a couple of eggs?'
The husband calmly replied, 'I wanted to show you what it feels like when I'm driving.'
Sorry jkhan ,guys for the off topic .
GOD bless.
Peace.
Good stuff :)
But seriously, could someone tell me what countries are at the edge of the earth! :&
Quote from: The Sardar on April 15, 2018, 05:58:25 AM
Salam/Peace dear brother Jkhan, what do you mean by my belief, i never denied the flat earth.
At the edge of the earth, I do not know, at the edge of falling, all of them. :elektro: :elektro: :elektro:
Salaam
@Hawk
Good stuff :)
But seriously, could someone tell me what countries are at the edge of the earth! :&
Could someone tell me where is the place which quran mentions if MEN & JIN TRY TO ENCROACH ZONES OF THE EARTH WILL BE FOLLOWED BY WITH BLAZING FIRE.. 55:33-35.. we don't see any. Right? but there are, if you are quran follower you have to accept it. these are places of Ghaib where these two cannot encroach :!
Hi all
take your valuable time to read these links, it would give you rough idea what is the shape of the world, and slightly give you a hint that there is something somewhere wrong or a conspiracy. These links are not at all relevant to Globe earth or Flat Earth.
https://www.tripadvisor.com/ShowTopic-g1-i10702-k6999137-Do_All_US_Flights_Fly_Over_the_Pacific_Towards_Asia-Air_Travel.html
http://www.gcmap.com/mapui?P=JFk-HKG+&MS=wls&DU=mi
Now imagine the emblem of UN or any flat earther depict the map of earth, that would seem more tangible.
https://www.google.lk/search?tbm=isch&sa=1&ei=piLUWtijLYPsvASpt4PgDw&q=flat+earth+map&oq=flat+earth+&gs_l=psy-ab.1.0.0j0i67k1j0l8.392090.394428.0.397064.11.8.0.2.2.0.179.518.0j3.3.0....0...1c.1.64.psy-ab..6.5.564....0.RkKYUw82f_8#imgrc=OK4a39qF8uMLFM:
God knows what he created. Time will tell. May God guide me and you and all who are believers in HIM
https://www.google.lk/search?q=flat+earth+map&tbm=isch&tbs=rimg:CeW2NoXfAkh9IjjMw7rcJ0Kb4gc0Zpk6sMEmTdyLsr1h5kRAhG96J4NHefXzSp4rPqwSEuDHJHSjkTUuNFx7FQBVtioSCczDutwnQpviEZb9FU8-GJtDKhIJBzRmmTqwwSYRNShXRtltY1cqEglN3IuyvWHmRBEf9sovTLdTGSoSCUCEb3ong0d5Ee4iJUoJlUQ0KhIJ9fNKnis-rBIR7TjVnqaZx9AqEgkS4MckdKORNRF4ivT0NHlp5yoSCS40XHsVAFW2ESdQj30LzETd&tbo=u&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwiMxcrRiL7aAhULMY8KHXjhBNsQ9C96BAgAEBg&biw=1093&bih=560&dpr=1.25#imgrc=phC4fZzywAVDmM:
Check this out too..
Hi everyone my holidays are over.. And most probably won't b able to come daily on this site.. I will try to come and learn from all the topics posted.. I read many, and topic ramadhan is so interesting.. May God bless u.. T c
Hi everyone..
Since it is weekend, just thought of reminding with interesting thought which could make you think the shape of the place we live..
Just go to any place where you can see Sun setting on horizon.. Or take a look some of the pictures of sunset.. You would Strangly notice that there are clearly clouds behind the sun. This has a big meaning though NASA and rest just described it as optical illusions simply to divert people or to go in line with their view.. No way.. Naked eye not lie, it's not a mirage either.. It's real that clouds are visible behind the sun. 93million miles away the sun.. Cannot have clouds there..dont take it like Sun is well under cloud movements.. Coz this is setting.. You won't see it when sun is above you or well up above horizon. I thought deeply while seeing a recent sun setting.. Yes it's true. If someone study it with much thought, it would present a rough idea how things happen around us. Even for moon setting you can see same phenomena
Weird . I can remember seeing sunsets without a cluod and I can remember seeing pictures of sunsets without clouds on or around the sun.
And I have searched for images of sunsets. Some have clouds, some have not clouds, some have the sky with clouds an no cloud at all near the sun...
Salaam
Hi Huruf..yeah all knows that every day clods won't be visible while setting sun.. But on such given day you can see.. Just look at my profile pic.. 😉
Such sunset clearly indicate that this sun is running in an orbit under a dome called heaven/sky. It's no 93 million miles away.. And even moon is going in its orbit.. Astonishingly, it is only. 0.23 million miles, such a drastic difference.. It's all lies inserted to our blood with precise technique.. But it can't hide absolute truth..
This guy has nothing to do with NASA!
https://www.metabunk.org/explained-why-clouds-appear-behind-the-sun-and-moon.t7084/
May be he rigged the experiment? Well try it yourself?
GOD bless.
Peace.
https://flatearthandthought.com/2017/08/07/proof-behind-the-sun-flat-earth-sunsets/
I know who rejected Quranic proves and it's verses can easily reject these, but still one would ponder.. Remember NASA has theories for everything.. It sounds nice to those who are inclined to it and not for those who take pure meaning of Quran .. QURAN never ever supports this NASA theory which has taken the hearts of majority.. At least few persons may benefit.. Anyhow few only will benefit.. Majority in this world is Christians and I wonder why these so called Muslims rejected the majority.. 😊 God will people understand the truth.. But very rare. Those who are behind majority always doom.. Flat Earthers are very minute.. But they have the truth.. That this majority will never get it.. Same Quran and hadith followers.. Hadith followers will always remain in majority.. Even how much the Quran followers convince them..
But our duty is to REMIND and keep on reminding so that they can't say in the other world we were not aware of it
Salam/Peace brother Jkhan, i wonder, what are your thoughts on black hole? Allah/God (SWTAY) bless you & your family.
No offense jkhan, but a bright light will shine through a less dense object
and appear hidden by an object with more apparent density.
In other words, light has its laws of physics. :handshake:
God's verses enough to laugh at those who disbelieve.. As I mentioned earlier in my post, When fragments of sky fall, they say it's just clouds..so not strange when they see clouds behind sun to call it in front or optical illusion.. That's all disbliever can see. But they have great knowledge, but in vain.. They deny their own eyes.. That's why God ask when they are in hell, is this magic or real?
And @ Sardhar on black hole.. There is nothing like black hole is mentioned in Quran.. It's all our own people giving impetus to NASA by picking very limited words in QURAN in which never give such meaning of black hole.. They only want to show that whatever NASA brings up, yes yes you are right guys.. look it is written in Quran.. Even you read NASA web these scientists only guess and they think such a black hole is possible.. Not with great certainty.. But these guys have found verses already.
As per God's book this sky and Earth is almost identical in size when it comes to its vastness.. So for such black holes and immeasurable magnitude which they describe is never supported in Quran.. Overwhelming proofs of verses furnished in this forum, but believe it or not is up to each individual.. There is not a single verse in Quran which support the myth.. Not only Quran even previous books don't support, even Vedic scripture won't.. They all support a dome of sky and flattened earth.. Just look at most of the Quran translations after technology developed, it all oriented with scientific nature in support of it, in contrast to that those before technology era, most of translations are in line with Hadith .. So strange how human act..
To prove how biased these people to NASA is the verse 54:1-3 is an ideal example.
For ages hadith duped people with an invention saying referring to this verse that Prophet Muhammad split the moon into pieces.. Regardless of the fact QURAN says Mohamed never performed any miracle.. And time elapsed and the Hour didn't occur as the verse states.. For God everything is near but for us 1400 plus years is not absolutely near.. Shame still some translators keep as a foot note the hadith in chapter 54..
Then came an era where almost everyone was duped. Landing on moon 1969..So suddenly another Muslim group cropped up and started pointing out the verse. "Hour is near and moon split.. " anyhow 50 long lunar years passed and almost 50 solar years.. Hour not occurred and the incident of moon split is a well forgotten matter among people. .. So those who supported NASA got some worldly image and respect , well it's written in Quran..
Why people are so much vulnerable towards things which human brings up and why not ponder with exact verses of Quran.. If The Hour has become closer as per the verse you don't need to wait long like we waited.. Does this verse grammatically says that it will be split by others (human or jins) or self? For my knowledge it seems self, correct me if my Arabic understanding is wrong..
Why can't this be a real split in moon which whole world could witness one day with their naked eye and would remain split till the resurrection day fall shortly afterwards.. . And then after seeing the split still just neglect as just another tsunami or Hurricane.. People forget.. Then all of a sudden the Hour fall on us.. ponder deeply the following question!
Is it man the one who brings the SIGNS of day of ressurection or is it GOD Himself?
If u think it is man who brings the sign of the Hour then accept that man landed on moon brought lbs of rocks from moon.. Just insane.. Just on oneside NASA is duping and on another side our own people translate it to suit it and divert people and make them believe.. Hey folks wait for this day, if u are alive.. It is a thing to happen God will and not already happened..
@ manny E
I think I have responded to one of those similar points you raised last time.. Yes dude it matters a lot coz it takes people away from the faith of God gradually without they being perceived.. . Coz they portray a picture which is not real and against the Creator. Hmm in this way you won't get it, coz you look like stranded in between a belief and atheism..
You say there is no deity sometimes or for sure and with certainty no one can believe..
And simply you want to be a good person and excell in it for whatever the reason . Why? Why I in the first place need to be a good person in this unpredictable world with such a short life..?
Trust me, if there is no God and and punishment in this world and hereafter and if there is no day of judgement and hell and paradise destined.. I would never be in any sort of good person.. Instead I would definitely try to achieve whatever I can to live a life suppressing anyone at any cost.. And I will b one of the most selfish person to have my own life bright.. And try maximum to keep away the death.. Coz the death would make things end forever and ever.. What difference it makes even I be good or bad.. Good or bad guys all will die and no one to punish after death and story finish eternally .. So why not try to be as much evil possible to be a successful person on this short life.. Coz good things we do has no value after death and bad things we do have no effect after death..
Hmm one may think if we be evil it would corrupt the normalcy or law and order of the world.. Why do we need law and order, for what? Why can't I break it, if I break what harm? Even I was caught what problem, even they give me capital punishment what worries? Coz Death ends the chapter..
My aim should be to live the life somehow I have been gifted with utmost pleasures.. Have as many girls as I like, steal as much as I like, do as much corruption, and dupe and cheat as I wish.. Do any evil anyone can think of.. No worries.. Coz death will put full stop to everything... There will be no justice here or after death..
Without a superpower behind us, will take human to its lowest position.. Unless he or she has immense wealth by birth.. So he or she would remain satisfied hopefully with what they have and can call we are good people.. The one who is desperate or devestated with poverty would always love a luxury life, so that craving thought and coupled with no belief in God, will make him do anything to achieve his goal.. Coz his belief is only this life. Why to lose? Yes don't lose it buddy? Try to win it, if you lose no one to help u..
If that is so, what would be actual purpose of life..is it just live and die.. Does it make any sense? Or live with all good deeds, that suits for man, coz we are not animals.. Still it won't give meaning when death falls.. No way.. We need justice to be given to all who are met with injustice in this world.. We need all those who were raped be punished, coz they escaped without being punished.. We need those who killed the innocent being punished, coz this world law and order didn't punish them.. We need justice for everything on a day.. We need to see why we lived here for a very brief period with full of tests and predicament..
For this you need for sure a superpower recorded everything, and for that He has given guidance naturally..
This would all make sense with belief in God, it's not blindness but it's truth, for that His creations around us with perfection in everything is an assurance.. It's not something that developed from nothing.. It's man's weakness who call it is not created but it is natural.. So insane.. That's why most of NASA reps are atheists.. That's why most of the scientists are atheists.. Once they are atheists their thoughts will too take them to atheism.. And they would preach atheism with precise technique and methodology for which educated minds bend.. I wonder people accept we are from monkeys.. That's their logic.. But still people ready to believe..
Live as a good person without God in mind and find out where it will take u.. It will only be confusion.
http://vchat.wikia.com/wiki/THE_EARTH_IS_FLAT_AND_I_CAN_PROVE_IT
read the link if you have not read before (sorry it takes lots of time though :hypno:.. )it would also help to raise questions neutrally in your mind.. it shows there are people in this world who are against NASA and their conspiracy with their limited knowledge and technology to pose great threat to a massive and well organized NASA.. without God's will nothing will emerge from it's depth of decay. Lets see why this resurgence for ? after all quran and NASA present two theories.. Somehow NASA has taken the upper-hand.. Creator knows what to put in His book, and how to deal in His way.. let's wait and see..
Let's see few more verses of Quran which clarifies what is earth and heavens and it's vastness
25:61 Blessed is He who has established constellations in the sky and made therein / in the midst (Feehinna) a lamp and a moon a light (noor)
10:05 It is He who made the sun a radiance, and the moon a light, and determined it by stations, that you might know the number of the years and the reckoning. God created that not save with the truth, distinguishing the signs to a people who know.
71:15-16 Have you not regarded how God created seven heavens one upon another, and set the moon therein for a light and the sun for a lamp?
As NASA says the moon light is only from sun and moon itself has no light. to strengthen it some of the leading icons in muslim world such as Zakir Naik and many illustrious translators added a new additional meaning to noor (light) which they say derived / reflected / giving light from sun by being prejudiced to new theories of NASA by which nourishing them and manipulate the verses of God to support weak human. what they think in their mind,if they don't go in line with NASA, quran will be exposed of contradictions. That's where these erudite icons got it wrong fell into traps of iblees. that shows they don't believe in quran with absolute heart but adjusting just save their reputation, coz whole world have accepted the myth and they feel they can't go against so that people would think they are insane.
There is no such meaning in it. Moon has it's own light that's so manifest by the verse itself.
Now lets look at the first verse 25:61 it says God placed in the heaven / sky (samai) constellation, sun and moon.. See the precise way of describing what God created Himself. He used Heaven and not mentioned EARTH. and he placed these elements THEREIN / IN THE MIDST(FEEHINNA) Heaven. It is clear where earth is by this verse. if we go with NASA, this FEEHINNA should include the earth as well then only the myth would come in line. Do you remember the verse which says "We created the heavens and the earth and whatever between them (BAINAHUMA) 32:4. see the difference
in verse 10:05 also moon light is never a reflected light, but it's own. there is no such word to support it. REFLECTION is an invention. and invention takes one to denial and equalizing of God.
Now see 71:15-16 : God says He created seven heavens one above another and placed in the midst / therein the sun and the moon (where is earth here?). But as per the myth moon is placed where the earth is and sun nowhere near the moon and it is more than 93 million miles away.
This very moon is a light(noor) when it is night (coz it's light is only to make the extreme darkness of night away and not to make the night to day- same as we use dim light at night) and this very sun is lamp when it is day and there is no other sun or moon or sun like elements or moon like elements. That's quran. why can't you understand the manifest verses folks. Do you really believe in quran or take it as jest?
Quote from: jkhan on April 21, 2018, 09:02:39 PM
And @ Sardhar on black hole.. There is nothing like black hole is mentioned in Quran.. It's all our own people giving impetus to NASA by picking very limited words in QURAN in which never give such meaning of black hole.. They only want to show that whatever NASA brings up, yes yes you are right guys.. look it is written in Quran.. Even you read NASA web these scientists only guess and they think such a black hole is possible.. Not with great certainty.. But these guys have found verses already.
http://www.noblackholes.com/
Hi all!
One of my friends says, 35:13 and 31:29 QURAN verses indicate night and day and sun and moon each orbit.. So it means earth is spinning and rotating.. Inclusion of Night and day in these verses indirectly refer to earth, and the words (kullu yajree)points it and it emphasize more than two (not only sun and moon)..
Same thing one of the forum member was arguing well earlier under this topic..
For me it is impossible.. How can the words "kullu yajree" can refer three or more and further Include earth. It's only in their mind.. Just to support the myth.. I know I am not Arab.. But I am not fool either..
Then I asked him just look at the verse 13:2, here only sun and moon mentioned, and nothing of day or night or earth mentioned.. Only two items (Sun and moon) same two words "kullu yajree". God is very precise with the placements of words and verses..
Earth is not a rotating stuff, it's a fixed immovable solid thing.. No one can move it, if it moves no one can't hold it except God..
Believe in God as He deserve so that we may get His real Mercy.. His mercy is amazing.. It makes us feel entirely happy and free.. With real trust on Him, makes things clear from all ends.. That's truly I experience.. Honestly..
Peace jkhan.
13;2 "Kullun yajree Li Ajalin Musamma" Each running to a predetermined time . Samawat, Sun and Moon.
Same 35:13 Day,night ,Sun and Moon run for a predetermined time and 31:29.
You have not included Samawat in 13:2 . Kullun is also for samawat ,they also run only for a predetermined time . Then a new samawat and a new earth will be created.
Hence "kullun" is for three or more each time.
GOD bless you.
Peace.
Don't be so irregular with quran O Goodlogic
look at the complete verse below 13:2
Sahih International: It is Allah who erected the heavens (samawathi) without pillars that you [can] see; then He established Himself above the Throne and made subject the sun and the moon, each running [its course] for a specified term. He arranges [each] matter; He details the signs that you may, of the meeting with your Lord, be certain.
Now you are telling the Heavens (samwathi) is Earth as well? :) or are you trying to say heavens running like sun and moon. Or you want to say the Arsh (throne) mentioned in the verse is running too? Do you compare the arsh to sun and moon?
Crystal clear the verse itself, He Erected the Heavens (got to be seven) it includes sun moon constellation, whatever ghaib, Then after erecting them He Established Himself above the Throne. Then specifically states the Sun and the Moon were Subjected(shakhara) clearly these two are running or orbiting. Note that Sun as well Moon float.. God could have simply put the earth somewhere in the quran and said floating with these two, then the problem so clear.
Either you claim God didn't know that Earth is floating as Sun and Moon or you are denying with persistence without being able to get out of the shackle that you are stranded..
Sun is just few thousand miles, and not 93 million miles crap.. I wonder any one can see by the naked eye such a distance (impossible for naked eye)
Yes i forgot one thing.. better put it also in this way.. I was watching a football match a month ago live in the ground. Suddenly i saw the Moon on the big Screen in such close proximity the cameraman zoomed it. so visible the moon's surface. it was wonderful site. Then after the match i approached the guy who took the video of it. I told him it was wonderful, and how powerful your camera is? Yes he said, and i can zoom with this far away objects, even what you see on the horizon. Then how far i asked. he replied around more than 5000 miles.. Hmm.. i was just left him saying, could you zoom 100000 miles.. He was smiling with thumbs up.. and said i would love to..
I was silently thinking then how he took the video of the moon zoomed so closely which is 240,000 miles away..God knows everything..
I am waiting for a day till all these conspiracies are out.. let us all wait.. then may be it's too late for some..
Peace jkhan.
"Yajree Liajalin Musamma" just means will run its course over a predetermined time.
So samawat ,sun and moon will all do that in the context of the whole verse.
Orbit has nothing to do with the verse. Orbit is "Fi Falakin Yasbahoon",which is a different verse.
But you will not be told for some reason to do with "your mind is made up"? I hope not!
Please yourself brother.
GOD bless you.
Peace.
Hi
Thanks for your reply in a peaceful manner..
Yes I know dear yasbahoon is orbiting but this yajree is also run or flow of orbit.. Everything(whatever created for men and Jin for test) is predetermined dear. Not only sun and moon. That's for sure.. Bit these two will of course flow for its predetermined period.. These even before everything is destroyed will stop their running.. Coz it will b joined.. But earth remains as flat empty element for resurrection day.. You got things wrong, in a bizarre way.. That's so sad..
I never made up anything dude.. I never would do such a thing.. It's all your prejudice to some other source which make you distant from correct thought..
God is the one who guide people and Jin.. How much I convince you it won't work out.. Just think we both can't be right.. Yeah.. Either you or me in right path.. But this earth exist in its shape, unfortunately have accepted NASA and you are convinced.. And even take the Quranic verses towards it.. It's fine.. I can't help.. But I wonder how would u feel one day, when things are well clear to you that you were wrong.. Could you imagine then, how much you talked against God without knowledge.. You may think.. It could be same to me.. But no.. Verses don't lie.. Just go through if u have time from the beginning all verses I submitted here. No way near to your theory of spinning..
I just had a chat today in fb with a strange person about flat earth.. His answers were all mocking at me. But he has great faith in spinning myth.. Unfortunately he doesn't know at what speed the rotate per hour.. When I told 1600 kms he was bit doubt of me. Then he checked google and said yes.. I know. See how people trust google.. . But he has seen the earth spin in videos.. And he relies on majority's faith... I feel really proud about this minority in this modern era to be brave to speak against well accepted myth for that solo proof is from who made the myth.. It won't take long.. All this will be cleared in sha Allah.. I think its God's plan.. As God says " you plot, but We too plot, We are best of those who plot... " Now you won't get my advices.. You would just simply neglect them. But the day you have no choice other than reality, would feel so bad.. That would hurt.. Sure.. Coz you cling on to something without any evidence from QURAN..
One more thing.. 99 per cent of those who has accepted the myth of spinning earth, don't know the theory how it works, etc.. But the belief in it is 200 percent perfect.. How they became believers in it God only knows.. If u think I am kidding.. Just ask any 10 people why we see the same side of moon every time or how bigger the sun compared to moon.. Most don't know.. But they believe everything. That's so unfortunate..
https://www.space.com/7015-40-years-moon-landing-hard.html
almost 50 years before they had the technology and the guts to land on moon, and since then how much the world have improved with real and tangible technology. But why they don't go back to moon. but have the extreme cry to go to Mars..
I think 1969 was the apt period to dupe people and put the shit in the mind of people forever..
i wonder when people will open their eyes.. coz all are busy with the love of life and luxury.. :whatever:
Quote from: jkhan on April 03, 2018, 11:48:05 PM
Sahih International: Race toward forgiveness from your Lord and a Garden whose width is like the width of the heavens and earth, prepared for those who believed in Allah and His messengers. That is the bounty of Allah which He gives to whom He wills, and Allah is the possessor of great bounty.
21:30 Have those who disbelieved not considered that the HEAVENS and the EARTH were a JOINED ENTITY and We separated them and made from water every living thing? Then will they not believe?
I do....
Earth is FLAT and has the same width as Heavens!!
(Ocean is part of EARTH, land is where we lived)
Hi guys wish a peaceful weekend
When I searched about why these NASA is not interested anymore in moon is bit hilarious.. Various way they explain.. The technology we had then is utterly destroyed Now.. 😬It's too dangerous out there in moon now not like in sixties.. And aliens has spread out there and it's a threat. And aliens warned them not to return again. And the cost to go Moon is actuallly vain of investment.. Coz there is nothing fruitful in moon.. Such a gullible bunch of guys these NASA.. For me it's not the case.. They can't fool people now like they did in 1969.. With the current technology they have to bring all the proofs in moon live..thats impossible coz they never been to moon and it was concocted made up stories.. Suppose even if they land Now, the powerful cameras each individual has can capture them where they are in the moon.. No need to rely on their own resources.. And to bring the story of moon landing again to already duped people is waste and probably those who are under their umbrella and grip may shift totally if they forge a drama again and things go wrong.. So better keep the accepted myth as it is rather than dig it and spoil the long hidden conspiracy.. So they try another lie.. That is Mars.. Coz our cameras won't reach Mars,, so they can create story as they won't.. Somehow this NASA should run, they have master plans.. They will and they would.. Coz people are ready to believe all their stories..
Google Earth can make the existing earth to any shape they prefer to.. Why I mentioned it coz most ask me what about Google Earth, I can see my home.. Though the pictures are true the shape they can produce round square triangle of whatever and include the actual things of the earth.. It's just simple as makings graphic design
Peace jkhan.
I wonder what you make of these then?:
A
1- The Hour has come closer and the The Moon has split.
54-The Moon,
How many verses are there from the first verse of the sura The Moon until the end of the Quran?
1389
In which year of the Muslim calendar did the first man land on the moon?
1389 (Corresponds to 1969)
B
A very interesting prophecy relates to the moon landing (which occurred in 1969), is it possible The Quran predicted this? Well, judge for yourself by considering the following information ? Chapter 54 of The Quran is entitled ?The Moon? and starts right away by giving us news about the splitting of the moon as a sign that the end of the world is drawing close.
?The moon has split and the hour has drawn closer? (The Quran, 54:1)
When did the prophecy come to pass?
To answer that, one must keep the prophecy in mind: ?The moon has split.? This is a metaphor. Parts of the moon have left its surface. They no longer are part of the moon. So, the prophecy does not refer to the landing on the moon or to the first step made by Neil Armstrong but to the fact that Armstrong and Aldrin collected 21 kilograms of lunar rocks to bring back to earth. The prophecy was fulfilled at the very moment the astronauts left the moon in the lunar module containing 21 kilograms of rocks that had belonged to the moon. This can be confirmed by checking the definition of ?split? in any dictionary, among the definitions given by Dictionary.com are ? ?to divide, disunite, separate?
The date this prophecy came to pass was on July 21 1969. The moment the prophecy was fulfilled is confirmed by the hour of departure of the lunar module, which left the lunar surface at 17:54:1 (Universal Time) or 1:54:1 (EDT) and as you have seen above, verse [54:1] is the verse that deals with the prophecy.
Still not convinced? Lets read the following verses after (54:1) ?
?The moon has split and the hour has drawn closer. Then they saw a great miracle; but they turned away and said, ?Old magic.? They disbelieved, followed their opinions, and adhered to their old traditions.? (The Quran, from 54:1 to 54:3)
Here, the author of The Quran specifically states ? ?the moon has split?, then people will see ?a great miracle?, yet they still ?disbelieved?. Could the ?great miracle? be "GOD Counted the numbers of everything in Qoran"?
C.
All coincidence and conspiracy?
D.
Or you give us your take on verse 54:1?
GOD bless you.
Peace.
@goodlogic
I have already explained this verse 54:1-3
Go back and read it pls if u need to
Peace jkhan.
Your explanation does not make sense to me.
Look again at- B- in my post above, it makes more sense than yours, don t you think?
GOD bless you.
Peace.
@lime juice..
God knows what's in your heart and what's your belief..its between you and your creator.. Glad to here..
Yes this verse 21:30 I explained it clearly.. But people are adamant.. Let me cleared the verse bit more..
21:30 " have not those who disbelieve known that the heavens and the Earth were joined together as one United piece, Then We PARTED THEM (FAFATHAQNAHUMA-dual form) ...." Note the words parted them(is dual Arabic) meant for earth and heavens.. See the difference that even though heavens mentioned in plural and Earth singular, God took it as dual, Coz, though heavens are seven layers, but one element..same earth may have seven element but one entity.. So what God parted are actually earth and heaven.. But they were not their full form .. Same Adam was created. God explains.. he was created by clay, so Adam would have been in some shape till he was given his original shape.. Same heavens and Earth..
People took big support to this verse as Big Bang Theory. NASA theory of Big Bang totally contradictory, but still our learned ones giving them light with this verse..
Just think this verse clearly states Earth and heavens were together then parted them both.. Not as what NASA says.. Earth formed 4.6 billions years before .. Explaining in various ways as blast, burst., etc (earth is not mentioned at all) .. It's not..but God separated these two elements with precise way.. It shows He created the two elements as one entity first and then parted. Big Bang comes no way near to what this verse refers or other verses. See God has not yet created another earth and heavens but He will and that will be our Janna.. If u apply same theory of 4.6 billion years to that.. Just insane.. For everything NASA has given huge numbers (example 93 million sun) just to confuse and not being able to verify.. Any way to God to create another earth and heavens would be much easier than His first one.. There's is logic in it.. Coz God says "in the creations of heavens and earth it not touched hardship(tiredness)for us.. " There is no BIGBANG in Quran..
@ good logic..
If 54:1-3 doesn't give any sense to you, it's fine. Anyhow nothing gave you any sense to you.. That's for sure..
I have seen your "B" comments in many Islamic websites.. You were very specific about the word split used in verse 54:1 . Remember it is the same word used to explain how a seed split and grow, and it is the same word used to elaborate earth split hearing the blasphemy of God having son.. It does not mean remove rocks from moon and bring to earth.. Note when a seed start growing it will definitely split the are it surround in order to get it's growth so that small area won't look same.. And if the total ear split hearing the blasphemy it would be in its own way.. Not as bringing prices of moon..
Signs when nearing the doom is mentioned many in Quran.. Moon split, great smoke, yajooj majooj, heavy earth quack, sun moon join, mountains powder, and many more, and these signs man or Jin cannot do.. They are only from God.. Don't rely on this good logic.. It's not a sign.. It is to happen.. When it happens whole world knows the story.. Still if u go to Brazil or India or Africa etc. there will b big community that would even know man landed on moon.. But God's signs will not be hidden, but will b common to all and all will witness and not one group coz it is the end of the world and not just signs that some prophet brought to his community.. It's entirely different.. I wonder when the moon actually split and visible that would be also an optical illusion from NASA and poor people would call it as they say and just forget the sign..coz the Day of ressurection will come suddenly even though all signs passed..
So sad some have taken NASA to bring the SIGN of doom day.. Just imagine and take into consideration all things what NASA says.. They all go against God's book.. And still you believe that NASA brings the sign.. How you use your wits? See NASA is the one who called there is sun based other places and Earth like other places and many moons and planets which are huge than earth.. And stars are bigger than our own Sun and in some planets Sun rise west, and even they agree man is from monkey.. And they say they can go to alleged place called Mars..one day they would say we landed on Mars and we found aliens there with videos and our people would then search for verses which predicted it.. Or NASA would say QURAN didn't predict this so Quran contradicts.. So you say God used NASA to reveal His sign.. How come your knowledge gone this weak? Why God need such an assistance to show his signs to people.. Forget current day.. Just imagine how many of those who lived on earth in 1969 knew man's landing on moon, what they had.. Just hardly there would have been TV or radio in every house, not everyone reads news papers either .. Only messages go as hearsay. I can't think of anymore.. Coz I was not alive in 1969..God reveals one of His major signs in the form of split moon and hardly half of the world being unknown to it.. Just can't imagine.. Signs of the day of doom is from God only God reveals it. It's not Neils Armstrong who split the moon but All Strong God will split. Wait pls.. Don't b in a hurry..
Brother jkhan ,please reflect on this quote:
Do you expect that thousands of scientists at NASA and space agencies in the world are conspiring, and for what? Politicians and ordinary employees who work on operating the spaceship on the moon and the equipment on Earth should also participate in this lie too. Most important is how they guaranteed that all people kept their deceiving for 38 years! Even if we believe that NASA agency deceives people it means that we must doubt all astronomy science and facts today, and this is impossible.
Our question is: Why didn`t Russian scientists who were in a race and war case with America object to the fact of the landing on the moon? Why didn`t Chinese, Japanese scientists and European Space Agency and other Space Agencies in the world made an objection? Notice that there is no space agency in the world objects to the landing of man on the moon, those who object to this event are only few scientists and amateurs. Why haven`t we see any of the scientists object to the flights carried out by NASA to Mars which is more far away from the moon hundred times at least?
We also say: If any space agency can promote such a lie (as this), we would have seen many claims every day. It is easy for someone to claim that he could go outside the galaxy or to travel in a speed faster than the speed of light and other things which are impossible in science. NASA agency posted an article to replay on these claims. You can look at reference (3) at the end of research.
Fox T.V displayed a documentary program about the landing of man on the moon as a lie and conveyed a lot of fabricated ideas which a lot of scientists and concerned people replied to this claim. This site is a neutral one, which views the program and the scientific replies to the claim, reference (4).
Dr. McKay Head of scientists at NASA agency, says: Fabricating one rock and making it appear like the rocks on the moon is much harder than landing on the moon! The samples which astronauts brought back were examined by thousands of laboratories in many countries of the world and no scientists claimed that these samples are not taken from the moon. In addition, there is a lab at NASA with a store that contains many samples of moon rocks and dust (hundreds of kilograms). These samples were seen by thousands of scientists from many countries of the world. Where did these moon rocks and dust come from? You go to reference (5).This is also another neutral site which presents details of the claim and drives logical scientific proofs.
Just one example among many that are very logical brother.
Sorry to say but your idea of conspiracy is weird and illogical
GOD bless you.
Peace.
Creation of the Universe from Quran's perpective
1. Big Bang
Science agreed that 'something' or 'someone' had caused it to happen but none able to tell who/what that causes it.
"The evidence is in. There is now little doubt that our universe was brought into existence by a "big bang" that occurred some 15 billion years ago. The existence of such a creation event explains a number of phenomena including the expansion of the universe, the existence of the cosmic background radiation, and the relative proportions of various sorts of matter. Astronomer George Smoot suggested as much when he exclaimed at a press conference reporting the findings of the Cosmic Background Explorer (COBE) satellite,
"If you're religious, it's like looking at the face of god."Why? Because something must have caused the big bang, and who else but god could have done such a thing?"
In Quran,
heaven and earth were a joined entity;
He unfold it like opening a folded sheet and slowly He expands both its height and base with might.
The opening/separation that causes the Big Bang.
"Have those who disbelieved not considered that the heavens and the earth were a joined entity, and We separated them and made from water every living thing? Then will they not believe?^ 21:30
In the beginning, the base were water and soon after He creates land for all living things to live in
(All living things were made of water)
AND come the end of times, He will fold it back.
"The Day when We will fold the heaven like the folding of a [written] sheet for the records.
As We began the first creation, We will repeat it. That is a promise binding upon Us. Indeed, We will do it". 21:104
2. Flat Earth
- not flat of a carpet but land laid on the same surface that sptead far and wide as the heaven
"And the heaven We constructed with strength, and indeed, We are [its] expander.
And the earth We have spread out, and excellent is the preparer. 51:47-48
A billion years work in progress and
everything were done in perfect measurement.
And on the land, He placed mountains all around it so it shall not be shifted/moved.
And We placed within the earth firmly set mountains so it should not shift with them, and We made therein [mountain] passes [as] roads that they might be guided. 21:31
this to say;
Land are surronded with water.
It ends with northern, southern, eastern and western part respectively.
NONE are connected to form a rounded shape but all laid on the same 'flat' ground that can never be moved.
This being the reason we don't see aircraft fly under but on the same earth surface to reach its destination.
If man walks on the Moon a HOAX
so were the globe Earth that we been taught and led to believe.
3. Crystal Ball aka Dome
-whole universe is inside a crystal ball
protected by a vault (firmament)
The Lord of the Universe is outside our space and time encompasses everything in it.
"Indeed, your God is the Lord, who created the heavens and the earth in six days* and then established Himself above the Throne, arranging the matter [of His creation]".. 10:3
What that been discovered only in recent times has already made known in an ancient Book of thousand years old.
A Book that were given to mankind during the forgotten of times, explaining the creation of the Universe in precise and easy understanding
AND today it still remains as truth nothing but the truth.
Such is the uniqueness of His message that can only comes from your God,
Lord of the Universe.
Do note,
Quran is NOT a book of Science BUT Signs to those who wants to give thought.
https://www.express.co.uk/news/weird/835564/Moon-landings-hoax-Marcus-Allen-not-possible-Glastonbury-Symposium
https://www.theguardian.com/science/brain-flapping/2012/dec/13/moon-landings-faked-science-confessions
https://www.pbs.org/newshour/science/math-formula-charts-the-lifespan-of-hoaxes
http://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-16909592
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/russia-calls-investigation-into-whether-us-moon-landings-happened-10327714.html
Just see the difference of the theory.. So called myth universe is 14billions years old, earth 4.54 and sun 4.6 billion years.. So after creating heavens, God waited 10 billion years to create earth
But God's verses in 21:30 is completely different..
And in 21:104 God says we will create another .. And says it's binding to God.. So not yet done.. So do we have to wait after dooms day another 14 billion years in order for God to create and keep ready for accommodation.. It's quite big time.. Manifest insult to God's strength. ..
Peace jkhan.
Are you even reading the links you are posting?
"fake moon landing" look what this is saying:
We are not contending that they did not fly [to the moon], and simply made a film about it. But all of these scientific ? or perhaps cultural ? artifacts are part of the legacy of humanity, and their disappearance without a trace is our common loss. An investigation will reveal what happened,? Markin wrote, according to the Moscow Times translation.
And another one says despite the conspiracy "being demonstrated false":
He then tested his formula on four famous conspiracies that persist, despite being demonstrably false. Among them, that the Apollo 11 moon landings were faked, that climate change is a hoax perpetuated by scientists, that vaccinations are unsafe, and that Big Pharma is hiding a cure for cancer. In all four cases, scores of conspirators would be required to keep each secret.
...And the bbc one does not even mention any hoax?
Common brother, read what you are pasting please!
GOD bless you.
Peace.
Peace jkhan, in reference to your avatar: Quote from: hawk99 on April 21, 2018, 06:52:55 PM
No offense jkhan, but a bright light will shine through a less dense object
and appear hidden by an object with more apparent density.
In other words, light has its laws of physics. :handshake:
You can ignore again if you like, but here is a chance to grow.
@good logic..
Yes I read all what those sites presents.. They all have all Mixed up views.. Al major channels seems to have some concern but, NASA conspiracy is powerful not easy to let loose.. Only God will debunk them.. Wait pls..
@ Hawk.. If u perceive that the sun that u look at daily is 93 millions miles then it's your fate, that's your belief and your acceptance of NASA.. Fine keep it up.. QURAN is more than enough to convince what is sun and moon.. And our own eyes too.. I can't convince the one whom God sent astray or sealed the heart or made blind..
Go and find the zones in the earth where u will be chased with fire..or ask NASA u may get help brother.. May 100 million miles away.. Take care brother.. For those who disbelieve they have too much doubt in Quran and they will only will live with doubt.. But for them human infusion will not give a minute out of doubt..
When we have pride ourselves as Quran believer, tht exactly we shld be doing, follow what that been said otherwise its hypocrite of us to tell others to follow when we dont.
He has shown us the SIGNS and its the truth!
Im not asking to follow it blindly but when we start to use our intelligence to scrutinise all that we been taught since young
Globe Earth theory simply dont add up.
Its not SCIENCE that we been taught but RELIGION in the masked of SCIENCE.
HADITH translated as STATEMENT/NARRATION and its not restricted to Bukhari & Co only but every statement that go against the TRUTH...
even if it comes from the hadith of NASA & Co.
Did you buy the idea that we are the descendants of the APES??
Or EVERYTHING comes from NOTHING!!
As a believer, do you believe those that SCIENCE trying hard to shove it into our head?
There are many ways for satan to deceive us but when we stick to the TRUTH (HIS Scripture) alone,
where He is concerned, nothing can go wrong even when we up against the world.
6:116 And if you obey most of those upon the earth, they will mislead you from the way of God .
They follow not except assumption, and they are not but falsifying.
On the contrary, if we to deny His SIGNS like what science today trying to do on us;
2:39 And those who disbelieve and deny Our signs - those will be companions of the Fire; they will abide therein eternally."
dont get me wrong, im not at all against SCIENCE but only those that are out to:-
9:32 They want to extinguish the light of God with their mouths,
but God refuses except to perfect His light, although the disbelievers dislike it.
Right said lime juice
I will add up these two verses to sum up you valuable comments..
31:6-7 " And of mankind is he who purchase idle hadith (statement) to mislead from the path of God without knowledge and takes it (path of God) by way of mockery. For such there will be a humiliating torment. And when Our verses are recited to such a one, he turns away in pride as if he heard them not, as if there were deafness in his ear, so announce to him a painful torment"
Very valuable verses for all time. Statement (hadith) made by human.. NASA states something and people bend their neck and when we recite verses showing the fault in NASA statements they turn away in pride..
But some think this verse only for mere hadith believers.. No it is apt for any statement who are clinged to other than Quran.. And which is against Quran's path and truth..
Salaam jkhan,
وهو الذي خلق اليل والنهار والشمس والقمر كل في فلك يسبحون
Wahuwa allathee khalaqa allayla waalnnahara waalshshamsa waalqamara kullun fee falakin yasbahoona
21:33 He is the One who created the night and the day, and the sun and the moon, each swimming/floating in an orbit.
------------
لا الشمس ينبغي لها ان تدرك القمر ولا اليل سابق النهار وكل في فلك يسبحون
La alshshamsu yanbaghee laha an tudrika alqamara wala allaylu sabiqu alnnahari wa kullun fee falakin yasbahoona
36:40 The sun is not required to overtake the moon, nor will the night precede the day; each of them is swimming/floating in an orbit.
------------
- (If) night and day refers to earth, then earth is floating/swimming ( making same movement? ) like the sun and the moon.
kullun كل is for tree or more.
If floating/swimming refers only to the sun and the moon, then i think that the words would be :
كلاهما في فلك يسبحان
kilahoumaa fee falakin yasbahaan ( dual )
- Can someone correct or confirm ?
***************************
---------
Is there a country that is approving " the flat Earth model" and teaching it in their shools ?
--------
What do you think about this:
China National Space Administration released all of the images from their recent moon landing:
https://techcrunch.com/2016/01/30/china-just-released-true-color-hd-photos-of-the-moon/ (https://techcrunch.com/2016/01/30/china-just-released-true-color-hd-photos-of-the-moon/)
--------
Hi ibn-a
Kullu is not three or more it is only two or more.. Kullu means EACH here. Though Each is one, it cannot be used for only one.. But to refer a group of two more.. That's it.
How irrational to take Night and Day to be considered as earth.. Is Night and Day occurs only to earth? Night and day is in the heavens too.. But as per your myth majority 99% of the space is in complete darkness forever.. And is not night rotating there.. But God created heavens which is everything other than earth.. For both of these day and night is common.. That's the way God created and that's how He explained in His book.. Take all the kullu words in QURAN they give meaning of Each or Alll or Every
To verify takes as example verse 16:111, 13:2, 23:91 or take all of kul and take the meaning
I think that for some people the "belief" in the shape and characteristics of the Earth (planet) seems to be more of a psychological question than of scientific question.
Answering as to 21.33 and 36.40
That is right, there is a clear plural agreeing with the plural antecedent, and not a dual.
Salaam
Quote from: jkhan on April 29, 2018, 07:07:37 AM
Hi ibn-a
Kullu is not three or more it is only two or more.. Kullu means EACH here. Though Each is one, it cannot be used for only one.. But to refer a group of two more.. That's it.
How irrational to take Night and Day to be considered as earth.. Is Night and Day occurs only to earth? Night and day is in the heavens too.. But as per your myth majority 99% of the space is in complete darkness forever.. And is not night rotating there.. But God created heavens which is everything other than earth.. For both of these day and night is common.. That's the way God created and that's how He explained in His book.. Take all the kullu words in QURAN they give meaning of Each or Alll or Every
To verify takes as example verse 16:111, 13:2, 23:91 or take all of kul and take the meaning
Can you bring some other quote from the Qur'an where kullu really is two?
http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2017/jun/22/antinews/its-fake-news-chinese-lunar-rover-found-no-evidenc/
Which one u want to believe.. US, Russia or China..
@ibn-a
If u have time go through all ..but see these 17:20, 19:49, 21"79 .. As I told it gives meaning of two or more not less than two.. Meanwhile I don't see a word as kullahuma in QURAN.. If my memory is right but kullama is there..but different meaning..
Take Quran absolutely or be wavered and take all junks of China US and Russia and India stories.. They all compete each other..
It's not pscycological or scientific.. But truth of Quran.
7.23
وَقَضَىٰ رَبُّكَ أَلَّا تَعْبُدُوا إِلَّا إِيَّاهُ وَبِالْوَالِدَيْنِ إِحْسَانًا ۚ إِمَّا يَبْلُغَنَّ عِندَكَ الْكِبَرَ أَحَدُهُمَا أَوْ كِلَاهُمَا فَلَا تَقُل لَّهُمَا أُفٍّ وَلَا تَنْهَرْهُمَا وَقُل لَّهُمَا قَوْلًا كَرِيمًا ﴿٢٣﴾
Salaam
4.11
وَلِأَبَوَيْهِ لِكُلِّ وَاحِدٍ مِنْهُمَا السُّدُسُ مِمَّا تَرَكَ إِنْ كَانَ لَهُ وَلَدٌ
13.2
اللَّـهُ الَّذِي رَفَعَ السَّمَاوَاتِ بِغَيْرِ عَمَدٍ تَرَوْنَهَا ۖ ثُمَّ اسْتَوَىٰ عَلَى الْعَرْشِ ۖ وَسَخَّرَ الشَّمْسَ وَالْقَمَرَ ۖ كُلٌّ يَجْرِي لِأَجَلٍ مُّسَمًّى ۚ يُدَبِّرُ الْأَمْرَ يُفَصِّلُ الْآيَاتِ لَعَلَّكُم بِلِقَاءِ رَبِّكُمْ تُوقِنُونَ ﴿٢﴾
Once upon a time, US made a big statement saying they have put man in the moon..
the whole world then were in awe of their intelligence only many years later,
world learned its nothing but a HOAX.
now a certain country named China is doing the same, while world has awakened not to be fooled again,
unfortunately there are some still sleeping and allowing himself to be taken for a RIDE AGAIN.
Apparently no lesson learned from the first episode
http://www.neonnettle.com/news/3509-north-korea-threatens-to-release-classified-info-on-american-moon-landings
(http://www.neonnettle.com/news/3509-north-korea-threatens-to-release-classified-info-on-american-moon-landings)
"I can recall several times he has made this claim, in 1979, in 1983 and 1986. Every time the US government has proposed economic sanctions on the dictatorship, North Korea comes back with this awkward threat."The weirdest thing about it all is that every single time the US government has backed off, which makes the whole situation increasingly intriguing."
When sun, earth, moon, stars etc all were mentioned clearly in Quran, how in the world day and night can be referred as earth and FLOATING too is really beyond me!
Did God forgot the words?
here I bring the verse in question:-
14:33 And He subjected for you the sun and the moon, continuous [in orbit], and subjected for you the night and the day.
21:33 And it is He who created the night and the day and the sun and the moon; all in an orbit are swimming.
36:40 It is not allowable for the sun to reach the moon, nor does the night overtake the day, but each, in an orbit, is swimming.
If day/night refer as earth,
what is sun and moon doing chasing after its other that none were allowed to overtake?
AND where is this taken place?
are they not FLOATING in the orbits (above us) swimming?
AND what happen to heaven that been separated from the earth, floating too?
If we isolate His verse to understand His message, we only be facing the Great Wall Of China
but when we start to take all as ONE context, He will made it plain easy for us to understand.
said the Lord of the Universe;
And We have certainly made the Qur'an easy to learn, do you want to learn?
54:17/22/32/40
10:37 And it was not for this Qur'an to be produced by other than God but a confirmation of what was before it and a detailed explanation of the [former] Scripture,
about which there is no doubt, from the Lord of the worlds.
http://www.flatearthdoctrine.com/flat-earth-scriptures/
(http://www.flatearthdoctrine.com/flat-earth-scriptures/)
@huruf
It's not 7:23 but 17:23 to be exact. I mentioned it so those who search in English would get benefited.. K L W and K L L has different meaning in Arabic.. 17:23 is K L W while 13:2 and rest are K L L
Hope people get it..
All God revealed Books don't support the myth.. Even Veda one of the very oldest still surving in whatever form it is.. Even all old generation's belief were not round earth except few of Greek and roman philosophers..see what king pharoa said to Haman.. Build a tall structure so that I can climb and see the Lord of Moses.. So it is clear what was the belief of the people of Egypt and Israel those days.. Not round and spinning..
Quote from: jkhan on April 29, 2018, 10:53:26 AM
All God revealed Books don't support the myth.. Even Veda one of the very oldest still surving in whatever form it is.. Even all old generation's belief were not round earth except few of Greek and roman philosophers..see what king pharoa said to Haman.. Build a tall structure so that I can climb and see the Lord of Moses.. So it is clear what was the belief of the people of Egypt and Israel those days.. Not round and spinning..
By following the bible blindly you are imposing on the Qur'an biblical narrations.
The egyptians, ancient egyptians considered the earth a spherical body, no a two dimensional thing, and fir3awn events did not happen in Egypt.
You should stick to the Qur'an and do not import into it other narrations.
Salaam
Salaam,
Quote from: jkhan on April 29, 2018, 07:07:37 AM
Hi ibn-a
Kullu is not three or more it is only two or more.. Kullu means EACH here. Though Each is one, it cannot be used for only one.. But to refer a group of two more.. That's it.
How irrational to take Night and Day to be considered as earth.. Is Night and Day occurs only to earth? Night and day is in the heavens too.. But as per your myth majority 99% of the space is in complete darkness forever.. And is not night rotating there.. But God created heavens which is everything other than earth.. For both of these day and night is common.. That's the way God created and that's how He explained in His book.. Take all the kullu words in QURAN they give meaning of Each or Alll or Every
To verify takes as example verse 16:111, 13:2, 23:91 or take all of kul and take the meaning
Bold: you're right.
Quote from: huruf on April 29, 2018, 07:08:43 AM
I think that for some people the "belief" in the shape and characteristics of the Earth (planet) seems to be more of a psychological question than of scientific question.
Answering as to 21.33 and 36.40
That is right, there is a clear plural agreeing with the plural antecedent, and not a dual.
Salaam
Thanks for your reply.
I didn't say Bible and emphasized on it. But I said all God revealed Books.. Whatever I find identical in other books compared to Quran, It can't be neglected..it may b altered by people but cannot deny that God revealed though hidden or altered.. How can QURAN confirm previous books if u don't take the one identical verses to Quran in Those books.. Why God should order Mohamed to go and ask those who were given the scripture.. Or why Mohamed should say bring Torah and read it to me ...why you and all Muslim proudly say that the advent of Mohamed is written in previous books. Which previous books and why u believe only that? Don't b selfish.. One of the key in belief is believing the books of God. Either seen or not seen..
Misr is the word given in QURAN for Egypt if Misr is not Egypt I wonder what is Misr.. Where those pyramids are.. Whatever and wherever it may be but the kingdom of pharoa was not a small one and not far from Israel and as per Quranic verse which parou uttered is clear that his and his people belief were not round earth.. Undeniable..
Thanks ibn -a
But explore QURAN and find out what is truth only and find out how God guides.. His true guidance will not make any one go astray.. T c
Quote from: huruf on April 29, 2018, 12:20:13 PM
The egyptians, ancient egyptians considered the earth a spherical body, no a two dimensional thing, and fir3awn events did not happen in Egypt.
The Ancient civilization located on the mouth of Nile river banks NEVER call themselves EGYPT.
They refer to their land as :
(https://qph.ec.quoracdn.net/main-qimg-6b41269aac8bb2248685a50015ef0984.webp)
"kmt" - Black Land
Today's Egypt are not related at all to "kmt" in similar manner as today's Israelites are not related at all to the kingdom of Israel or Judah in Canaan.
Now having the definition clear...
The "kmt" people who lived on the banks of nile river until 2600 years ago considered the earth as FLAT.
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/e/e9/Geb_and_Nut03.png/1280px-Geb_and_Nut03.png)
The earth personified by the god Geb is a flat land.
The sky is arching over them and personified by the goddess Nut.
The two were separated by Shu, the god of air.
Beneath the earth lay a parallel underworld and undersky, and beyond the skies lay the infinite expanse of Nu, the chaos that had existed before creation.
The "kmt" people also believed in a place called the Duat, a mysterious region associated with death and rebirth, that may have lain in the underworld or in the sky.
Each day, the sun Ra traveled over the earth across the underside of the sky, and at night He passed through the Duat to be reborn at dawn.
As explained in the Book Of Nut, written 3800 years ago during the reign of His Majesty Senusret III.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Book_of_Nut
The cosmos was inhabited by three types of sentient beings. One was the gods; another was the spirits of deceased humans, who existed in the divine realm and possessed many of the gods' abilities. Living humans were the third category.
The most important among the living humans was the Pharaoh, who bridged the human and divine realms, as such the Pharaoh are both a God and also a human. Acting with Divine authority to rule over the expanse of wide and flat earth until his death on this earth. Afterwards the Pharaoh shall ascend to the sky and dwell among the stars.
I have furnished enough of Quranic verses which clearly indicate that this earth is not spinning but it is stationary and the heavens are canopy to it.. Let me remind with one of those similar verses.. Coz reminder works wonders..
32:4-5
God it is He who has created the Heavens and the Earth and all that is BETWEEN them (dual) in six days.... " "He manages and regulates matters from the Heavens TO the Earth.... "
Two verse are not complete you can read the complete verses in Quran.. I took what is relevant to the subject.. How a Quran only believer can go astray after reading this verse and go and stick to the theory of NASA.. Either he should be just saying he is a believer knowingly rejecting the verse..
Consider the word BAINAHUMA (between them) between Heavens and Earth.. Now take a look at the way NASA depict the universe.. You know very well this doesn't suit to Quran.. Let me clear to you in this way.. Just you know how they explain the eclipses.. One is when moon is BETWEEN earth and sun.. And another eclipse is when EARTH is BETWEEN SUN and MOON.. Oh God save these people who believe it.. When God says I created Heavens and Earth and whatever BETWEEN them.. How then EARTH came between moon? It is a simple example.. But take a look at all alleged planets they all behind earth by distance and some in front and sun is in the center and sky is nowhere..
Strangly they describe sky as gas molecules.. But God describes as a solid structure without rifts and canopy and heaven has gates and it is above us.. They themselves don't know what is sky.. Northern hemisphere u have sky and stars and southern hemisphere u have sky and stars.. It shows for them sky is up and down .. Totally contrary to Quran..
In 31:10 God says He created the heavens without PILARS.. It has a meaning if it is a structure solid and massive.. Still if it is required pilars it would have been on the earth only.. Imagine according to myth where it can post pilars to the heavens.. After all for them earth is without pilar and everything is without pilar and why God singled out Heavens.. It is not like tiny Sun or moon subjected and hanging out there.. But heavens is massive and to construct it without pilars somewhere is real miracle and to ponder and applaud God.. Needless to mention otherwise by God in that manner.. Same time God didn't say I created the Earth without pilars.. No.. He has put pilars to it in the form of pegs..but unfortunately the NASA myth earth is without pilars and spinning in its axis and rotating Sun and moreover ridiculously tilting every now end then as well and further moving away in the space.. If u think God's verses supports it, most welcome accept it and be firm on it.. If u think God's verses no way near to it just accept God's verses.. Or just become an atheist as those who invented the myth.. As per 32:5 God manages things from the heavens to the Earth and that's what He has created.. That's the reality.. If still one argues and says NASA is right, let him .. It's his or her destiny..
@jkhan
you hv said enough for any sound mind to understand the message you put across
AND there are nothing wrong with the verses you brought forth but the mind that refuse to accept it.
Its not your duty to make them believe what you believed but the work of the Lord to guide whom He wishes.
Let it Be.
22:46 So have they not traveled through the earth and have hearts by which to reason and ears by which to hear? For indeed, it is not eyes that are blinded, but blinded are the hearts which are within the breasts
(https://i.redd.it/wg0s85h1nzvy.jpg)
Quote from: lime juice on April 30, 2018, 06:40:55 AM
@jkhan
you hv said enough for any sound mind to understand the message you put across
AND there are nothing wrong with the verses you brought forth but the mind that refuse to accept it.
Its not your duty to make them believe what you believed but the work of the Lord to guide whom He wishes.
Let it Be.
22:46 So have they not traveled through the earth and have hearts by which to reason and ears by which to hear? For indeed, it is not eyes that are blinded, but blinded are the hearts which are within the breasts
(https://i.redd.it/wg0s85h1nzvy.jpg)
May Allah protect us.
The picture that you posted proves your complete ignorance of the laws of physics, especially the law of universal gravitation.
Quote from: IsaMuslim on April 30, 2018, 07:42:37 AM
May Allah protect us.
The picture that you posted proves your complete ignorance of the laws of physics, especially the law of universal gravitation.
"May my Lord increase me in knowledge." 20:114
do enlighten me please how water can stay curved and none spilled to space when earth purportedly spins on its axis at the speed of 1600kmph, SAME TIME orbits tbe sun at 1100kmph?
(mind you Boeing 747 cruising speed 700kmph)
AND if gravity your answer that is strong enough to hold the oceans together
why its not strong enough to glue our leg to earth that even an old lady can walk casually on the land?
seeking your clarification you the enlightened one.
Quote from: jkhan on April 30, 2018, 01:35:11 AM
I have furnished enough of Quranic verses which clearly indicate that this earth is not spinning but it is stationary and the heavens are canopy to it.. Let me remind with one of those similar verses.. Coz reminder works wonders..
32:4-5
God it is He who has created the Heavens and the Earth and all that is BETWEEN them (dual) in six days.... " "He manages and regulates matters from the Heavens TO the Earth.... "
Two verse are not complete you can read the complete verses in Quran.. I took what is relevant to the subject.. How a Quran only believer can go astray after reading this verse and go and stick to the theory of NASA.. Either he should be just saying he is a believer knowingly rejecting the verse..
Consider the word BAINAHUMA (between them) between Heavens and Earth.. Now take a look at the way NASA depict the universe.. You know very well this doesn't suit to Quran.. Let me clear to you in this way.. Just you know how they explain the eclipses.. One is when moon is BETWEEN earth and sun.. And another eclipse is when EARTH is BETWEEN SUN and MOON.. Oh God save these people who believe it.. When God says I created Heavens and Earth and whatever BETWEEN them.. How then EARTH came between moon? It is a simple example.. But take a look at all alleged planets they all behind earth by distance and some in front and sun is in the center and sky is nowhere..
Strangly they describe sky as gas molecules.. But God describes as a solid structure without rifts and canopy and heaven has gates and it is above us.. They themselves don't know what is sky.. Northern hemisphere u have sky and stars and southern hemisphere u have sky and stars.. It shows for them sky is up and down .. Totally contrary to Quran..
In 31:10 God says He created the heavens without PILARS.. It has a meaning if it is a structure solid and massive.. Still if it is required pilars it would have been on the earth only.. Imagine according to myth where it can post pilars to the heavens.. After all for them earth is without pilar and everything is without pilar and why God singled out Heavens.. It is not like tiny Sun or moon subjected and hanging out there.. But heavens is massive and to construct it without pilars somewhere is real miracle and to ponder and applaud God.. Needless to mention otherwise by God in that manner.. Same time God didn't say I created the Earth without pilars.. No.. He has put pilars to it in the form of pegs..but unfortunately the NASA myth earth is without pilars and spinning in its axis and rotating Sun and moreover ridiculously tilting every now end then as well and further moving away in the space.. If u think God's verses supports it, most welcome accept it and be firm on it.. If u think God's verses no way near to it just accept God's verses.. Or just become an atheist as those who invented the myth.. As per 32:5 God manages things from the heavens to the Earth and that's what He has created.. That's the reality.. If still one argues and says NASA is right, let him .. It's his or her destiny..
No contradiction between the Quran and the reality.
1.
(https://preview.ibb.co/nOLXoc/heavens.png) (https://ibb.co/mrkyTc)
2.
(https://preview.ibb.co/eww58c/earth.png) (https://ibb.co/hGY7Mx)
Salaam jkhan,
Quote from: jkhan on April 29, 2018, 07:36:38 PM
Thanks ibn -a
But explore QURAN and find out what is truth only and find out how God guides.. His true guidance will not make any one go astray.. T c
- Thanks for your advice.
- My comment was about kullun
كل.
- I do not agree with "the flat earth model", and your understanding of some verses.
- Many countrys have the technology to verify the shape of the earth,
why would they all teach their students about a globe earth, if the earth is flat.
Quote from: lime juice on April 30, 2018, 08:03:35 AM
"May my Lord increase me in knowledge." 20:114
do enlighten me please how water can stay curved and none spilled to space when earth purportedly spins on its axis at the speed of 1600kmph, SAME TIME orbits tbe sun at 1100kmph?
(mind you Boeing 747 cruising speed 700kmph)
AND if gravity your answer that is strong enough to hold the oceans together
why its not strong enough to glue our leg to earth that even an old lady can walk casually on the land?
seeking your clarification you the enlightened one.
Please watch this video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N9MAN3rjhk8
and this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VbVmM9ymjxA
Then know that rotation is the reason that we have the ocean like it is now, and not still like in your picture.
QuoteThe great circular streams of water in our oceans and of air in our atmosphere give dramatic testimony to the turning of the Earth2. As the Earth turns, with faster motion at the equator and slower motion near the poles, great wheels of water and air circulate in the northern and southern hemisphere. For example, the Gulf Stream, which carries warm water from the Gulf of Mexico all the way to Great Britain, and makes England warmer and wetter than it otherwise would be, is part of the great wheel of water in the North Atlantic Ocean. The wheel (or gyre) that the Gulf Stream is part of contains more water than all the rivers of the world put together. It is circulated by the energy of our turning planet.
Source https://astrosociety.org/edu/publications/tnl/71/howfast.html
And please watch also this video, and do the experiment shown in the end of it.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T4WjyTV98lg
Quote from: IsaMuslim on April 30, 2018, 10:42:26 AM
Please watch this video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N9MAN3rjhk8
and this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VbVmM9ymjxA
Then know that rotation is the reason that we have the ocean like it is now, and not still like in your picture.Source https://astrosociety.org/edu/publications/tnl/71/howfast.html
And please watch also this video, and do the experiment shown in the end of it.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T4WjyTV98lg
neither your video nor the statement you provide answer my Q...
water ALWAYS finds its LEVEL
how in the globe earth it can remains curved?
and if gravity is strong enough to hold the oceans together,
why its not strong enough to glue our feet to the ground that even an old lady can walk casually around?
You that knows the physic,
in your own words, explain to me how the above works in your spinning earth?
-double posting-
Quote from: IsaMuslim on April 30, 2018, 10:07:34 AM
No contradiction between the Quran and the reality.
1.
(https://preview.ibb.co/nOLXoc/heavens.png) (https://ibb.co/mrkyTc)
2.
(https://preview.ibb.co/eww58c/earth.png) (https://ibb.co/hGY7Mx)
In your graphic
is the sun in stationary state or
chasing after the moon in the orbits (above earth) swimming as the verse below tell us
21:33 And it is He who created the night and the day and the sun and the moon; all in an orbit are swimming.
36:40 It is not allowable for the sun to reach the moon, nor does the night overtake the day, but each, in an orbit, is swimming.
@ibn a
I never said you agreed to flat earth.. I know from the tone everyone here.. It's your wish that u accept Quran and at the same time you accept NASA and global education system.. It's fine keep It up.. That's why Quran says who is worse than him who go astray after reminded with our verses..
@Isa muslim
How silly your own myth universe picture itself.. Show it with moving one so that I can see where the moon travels.. Hey buddy I know what is the shape of the myth universe unless I won't make a comment on BAINAHUMA.. Problem with you guys and most is you think you take Quran and at the same time you take myth and proves it without any tangible support..
One was saying looking at lime juice picture.. It's totally against universal acceptance of gravity.. What is universe dude and it's acceptance.. They created myth and they put support and they made theory and some others theories to support and they put it in children's curriculum so that's is system.. So the creator theory is nothing? Go ahead, as long as QURAN talks against it no way the universal myth can debunk Quran..
Hey guys, either be NASA supporter or Quran supporter Coz u look like fools by stranded in between.. What you want to show to world? QURAN is miracle by clinging on to these.. Any atheist can see it how pathetic your stance are..
Believe in air resistance and it's pressure and density rather than gravity.. There is no gravity.. It's a foolish thought we learned with so much interest in college. Just wasted my time on it.. Stupid Newton..
Meanwhile my concern here is not showing thee pictures and confirming or arguing.. For that there is a nice place called flat earth community and you are welcome there.. Or you can go to pinterest.com and insert your pictures.. but my aim here is Quran and simply it's verses go in line with it.. Either you get it or not.. It's all your freedom of thought and expression.. As God says " had we willed we could have guided all of them together, but my word proved against. And fill men and Jin in hell" yes... But there is only one truth.. Truth is we are living on something which has a shape and that shape is not round, that's Quran.. Prove it with all verses of earth and heavens and sun and moon, if u can anyone pls with a new topic.. Let me silently read them.. 😊
Quote from: lime juice on April 30, 2018, 11:04:59 AM
neither your video nor the statement you provide answer my Q...
water ALWAYS finds its LEVEL
how in the globe earth it can remains curved?
and if gravity is strong enough to hold the oceans together,
why its not strong enough to glue our feet to the ground that even an old lady can walk casually around?
You that knows the physic,
in your own words, explain to me how the above works in your spinning earth?
You didn't have the patience to watch all the videos, that is why you didn't find your answers.
I don't know that much of physics. You don't need to be a physician to understand that the force that makes water "always find its level" is the force of gravity itself.
The force of gravity is applied to water towards the center of the earth, so it's obvious that it remains stuck to the surface of the earth.
(https://preview.ibb.co/hdbxoc/water.png) (https://ibb.co/e3HgEH)
The amount of water compared to the entire mass of earth is almost insignificant.
Also, it's not "my spinning earth", the earth is spinning, and we know that since 2000 years.
Quote from: lime juice on April 30, 2018, 11:11:04 AM
In your graphic
is the sun in stationary state or
chasing after the moon in the orbits (above earth) swimming as the verse below tell us
21:33 And it is He who created the night and the day and the sun and the moon; all in an orbit are swimming.
36:40 It is not allowable for the sun to reach the moon, nor does the night overtake the day, but each, in an orbit, is swimming.
(https://preview.ibb.co/dNBzZH/galaxy.png) (https://ibb.co/jmFREH)
Quote from: jkhan on April 30, 2018, 11:23:54 AM
@Isa muslim
How silly your own myth universe picture itself.. Show it with moving one so that I can see where the moon travels.. Hey buddy I know what is the shape of the myth universe unless I won't make a comment on BAINAHUMA.. Problem with you guys and most is you think you take Quran and at the same time you take myth and proves it without any tangible support..
One was saying looking at lime juice picture.. It's totally against universal acceptance of gravity.. What is universe dude and it's acceptance.. They created myth and they put support and they made theory and some others theories to support and they put it in children's curriculum so that's is system.. So the creator theory is nothing? Go ahead, as long as QURAN talks against it no way the universal myth can debunk Quran..
Hey guys, either be NASA supporter or Quran supporter Coz u look like fools by stranded in between.. What you want to show to world? QURAN is miracle by clinging on to these.. Any atheist can see it how pathetic your stance are..
Believe in air resistance and it's pressure and density rather than gravity.. There is no gravity.. It's a foolish thought we learned with so much interest in college. Just wasted my time on it.. Stupid Newton..
Meanwhile my concern here is not showing thee pictures and confirming or arguing.. For that there is a nice place called flat earth community and you are welcome there.. Or you can go to pinterest.com and insert your pictures.. but my aim here is Quran and simply it's verses go in line with it.. Either you get it or not.. It's all your freedom of thought and expression.. As God says " had we willed we could have guided all of them together, but my word proved against. And fill men and Jin in hell" yes... But there is only one truth.. Truth is we are living on something which has a shape and that shape is not round, that's Quran.. Prove it with all verses of earth and heavens and sun and moon, if u can anyone pls with a new topic.. Let me silently read them.. 😊
It's sad the way that you quote the verses talking about guidance, like believing in the flat earth is a criterion to enter paradise.
Quote from: Manny_E on April 30, 2018, 01:47:57 AM
The title Pharaoh emerged somewhere in ancient time and early kings were not referred to as Pharaoh. It's similar to that Roman emperors were named Ceasar.
(https://en.wikipedia.org/w/extensions/wikihiero/img/hiero_O1.png)
(https://en.wikipedia.org/w/extensions/wikihiero/img/hiero_O29.png)
Phrroo, Ancient KMT language, meanings "Great House".
First time used as "title" by His Majesty Thutmose III (15th century BCE).
The role and "divinity" of a Phroo has no equivalent in today's world.
A Phrroo is both God and also man, Fully God and Fully human.
The Phrroo is the sole agent of Gods on earth, the only intercession point between human and the Gods in heaven.
As thus, His wish is the wish of Heaven, His command is the command of The Gods.
Those who dare to rebel against the Phroo has started a rebellion against the Gods, a dire punishment awaits the rebels both in this life and also in the afterlife.
When The Phroo has stated that the Earth is FLAT, it means that the earth is FLAT.
No more questioning is allowed, as it will anger the Gods..
Quote
The fight from the religious side about the Earth being flat is not new as Christian clergymen persecuted people for saying the Earth was round in the second millennium A.D. The aggression from people like jkhan or HP_TECH is hence not new and it shows the lack of tolerance shown by religious people, who call people hypocrites or disbelievers due to it despite that the most logical thing based on observation is to believe the Earth to be round (or spherical) even if one can't study it with their own eyes far above the ground.
The same religious people are usually those who caused a general retardation in all sort of intelligent life and why the worst countries on Earth with unrest are the religious ones which enforce a zealous and dogmatic doctrine.
A dire punishment awaits those who dare to question God's command and decree, both in this life and eternally in the afterlife.
(https://preview.ibb.co/jW2jJc/fake_flat_earth.png) (https://ibb.co/eV6Byc)
Quote from: IsaMuslim on April 30, 2018, 11:40:25 AM
You didn't have the patience to watch all the videos, that is why you didn't find your answers.
I don't know that much of physics. You don't need to be a physician to understand that the force that makes water "always find its level" is the force of gravity itself.
The force of gravity is applied to water towards the center of the earth, so it's obvious that it remains stuck to the surface of the earth.
(https://preview.ibb.co/hdbxoc/water.png) (https://ibb.co/e3HgEH)
The amount of water compared to the entire mass of earth is almost insignificant.
Also, it's not "my spinning earth", the earth is spinning, and we know that since 2000 years.
aahh you ignorant of physic
and nature's law too
FYI, Gravity or not,
water will always finds its level
that is nature law that you clearly have no knowledge of...
even if to go by your logic, the water shld be flowing down due to the spinning/orbiting of the earth but why not?
only in spinning earth that you know 2000 thousand years ago can defies what we called LOGIC
have you seen a commercial aircraft fly acrobatically upside down to reach its destination below yet the passengers can be sound asleep ?
is that LOGIC or RUBBISH?
did I mention the aircraft have to play catch up just to land on the lightning speed of the earth?
how is that even possible?
gravity too!!
phew!!!
Quote from: lime juice on April 30, 2018, 12:15:36 PM
aahh you ignorant of physic
and nature's law too
FYI, Gravity or not,
water will always finds its level
that is nature law that you clearly have no knowledge of...
even if to go by your logic, the water shld be flowing down due to the spinning/orbiting of the earth but why not?
only in spinning earth that you know 2000 thousand years ago can defies what we called LOGIC
have you seen a commercial aircraft fly acrobatically upside down to reach its destination below yet the passengers can be sound asleep ?
is that LOGIC or RUBBISH?
Watwr doesn't find its level if there's no gravity, its molecules stick together trying to make a ball.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=L9xdiDOeXvE
Flowing down where?? The down is the center of the earth if observed on the earth, there is no up and down without a gravitational field.
The airplane flying upside down is the worst example ever done by any flat-earther I discussed with; at start I didn't even get what you meant, now I understand, and again, the down is towards the center of the planet.
I will insert here a picture found on a kids website.
(https://image.ibb.co/hR0zjH/gd_0020.png) (https://imgbb.com/)
Quote from: IsaMuslim on April 30, 2018, 11:40:25 AM
It's sad the way that you quote the verses talking about guidance, like believing in the flat earth is a criterion to enter paradise.
you clearly have no idea do you?
what you think His scripture for?
for Him to dictate our life!!
for Him wanting us to worship Him day and night!!
for Him to punish those that never follow the dead messenger
OR to show us of His SIGNS that He exists?
AND what are those SIGNS that when deny
2:39 And those who disbelieve and deny Our signs - those will be companions of the Fire; they will abide therein eternally."
were those SIGNS refer to
what can/cannot eat of men's rule
perform the make believe Hajj
fasting implemented by men
OR the CREATION OF THE UNIVERSE that He the Grand Master of it??
do you know?
I think you dont otherwise you would not have said this
"It's sad the way that you quote the verses talking about guidance, like believing in the flat earth is a criterion to enter paradise"
Quote from: lime juice on April 30, 2018, 12:19:35 PM
did I mention the aircraft have to play catch up just to land on the lightning speed of the earth?
how is that even possible?
gravity too!!
phew!!!
So according to you, we believe that the earth is spinning but nobody of us in 2000 years ever noticed that if we jump we land on the same place, just as the plane can land without taking into account the speed of earth's rotation?
Know that the atmosphere rotates with the earth.
Brother no offence, but when talking with jkhan at least he knows how the globe-earth model works, and he makes more useful claims than you.
Quote from: lime juice on April 30, 2018, 12:44:49 PM
you clearly have no idea do you?
what you think His scripture for?
for Him to dictate our life!!
for Him wanting us to worship Him day and night!!
for Him to punish those that never follow the dead messenger
OR to show us of His SIGNS that He exists?
What are those SIGNS that when deny
2:39 And those who disbelieve and deny Our signs - those will be companions of the Fire; they will abide therein eternally."
were those SIGNS refer to
what can/cannot eat of men's rule
perform the make believe Hajj
fasting implemented by men
OR the CREATION OF THE UNIVERSE that He the Grand Master of it??
do you know?
I think you dont otherwise you would not have said this
"It's sad the way that you quote the verses talking about guidance, like believing in the flat earth is a criterion to enter paradise"
Ok you are a troll.
You deserve no answers from the people of this forum.
Quote from: IsaMuslim on April 30, 2018, 12:34:54 PM
Watwr doesn't find its level if there's no gravity, its molecules stick together trying to make a ball.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=L9xdiDOeXvE
Flowing down where?? The down is the center of the earth if observed on the earth, there is no up and down without a gravitational field.
The airplane flying upside down is the worst example ever done by any flat-earther I discussed with; at start I didn't even get what you meant, now I understand, and again, the down is towards the center of the planet.
I will insert here a picture found on a kids website.
(https://image.ibb.co/hR0zjH/gd_0020.png) (https://imgbb.com/)
where is the heaven that he made the ceiling to earth the base located in uour image?
top?
side?
bottom?
or where?
Quote from: IsaMuslim on April 30, 2018, 12:47:56 PM
So according to you, we believe that the earth is spinning but nobody of us in 2000 years ever noticed that if we jump we land on the same place, just as the plane can land without taking into account the speed of earth's rotation?
Know that the atmosphere rotates with the earth.
Brother no offence, but when talking with jkhan at least he knows how the globe-earth model works, and he makes more useful claims than you.
Ok you are a troll.
You deserve no answers from the people of this forum.
hahahahaha you clealy clueless to your own belief
nevermind but this you said
"Know that the atmosphere rotates with the earth"
other the atmosphere, what elae rotates with the spinning earth?
were the sun, moon, stars rotates together too?
Quote from: lime juice on April 30, 2018, 12:54:00 PM
hahahahaha you clealy clueless to your own belief
nevermind but this you said
"Know that the atmosphere rotates with the earth"
other the atmosphere, what elae rotates with the spinning earth?
were the sun, moon, stars rotates together too?
See the graphics that I made
Quote from: IsaMuslim on April 30, 2018, 12:57:51 PM
See the graphics that I made
where can I apply this verse to your graphic
2:22 [He] who made for you the earth a bed [spread out] and the sky a ceiling and sent down from the sky, rain
show it to me pls..
Quote from: lime juice on April 30, 2018, 01:00:22 PM
where can I apply this verse to your graphic
2:22 [He] who made for you the earth a bed [spread out] and the sky a ceiling and sent down from the sky, rain
show it to me pls..
Firashan doesn't mean spread out, but it's referring to the comfort of the earth.
The sky is a ceiling and it doesn't imply that it's a dome or flat, and you can see it in my graph the same for the rain water.
Quote from: IsaMuslim on April 30, 2018, 12:57:51 PM
See the graphics that I made
I dont see the stars moon, sun and clouds rotates together with the spinning earth in your graphic...
are you implying, the atmosphere envelopes the earth that all else are outside the atmosphere circumference?
the aircraft fly inside or outside the atmophere tht rotates together with the spinning earth?
Quote from: IsaMuslim on April 30, 2018, 01:08:33 PM
Firashan doesn't mean spread out, but it's referring to the comfort of the earth.
The sky is a ceiling and it doesn't imply that it's a dome or flat, and you can see it in my graph the same for the rain water.
21:32 And We made the sky a protected ceiling, but they, from its signs, are turning away.
contradiction contradiction contradiction
@IsaMuslim
2:42 And do not mix the truth with falsehood or conceal the truth while you know [it].
2:181 Then whoever alters the bequest after he has heard it - the sin is only upon those who have altered it. Indeed, God is Hearing and Knowing.
you have been warned
(Its late here..bye)
Quote from: jkhan on April 28, 2018, 07:33:33 PM
@ Hawk.. If u perceive that the sun that u look at daily is 93 millions miles then it's your fate,
I never said that. :brickwall:
Quote from: jkhan on April 28, 2018, 07:33:33 PM
that's your belief and your acceptance of NASA..
where did I mention NASA? :o
Here are my posts:
Quote from: hawk99 on April 28, 2018, 01:07:10 PM
Peace jkhan, in reference to your avatar:
No offense jkhan, but a bright light will shine through a less dense object
and appear hidden by an object with more apparent density.
In other words, light has its laws of physics. :handshake:
You can ignore again if you like, but here is a chance to grow.
and
Quote from: hawk99 on April 15, 2018, 11:41:36 AM
But seriously, could someone tell me what countries are at the edge of the earth! :&
:peace:
Hi folks rather than get heated each other just watch the link
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-Ax_YpQsy88
Earth is not round is new to many and you are taught with round theory, so get to know other theories also.. And think whether it is possible or not..
It would be useful rather than dig one by one in this forum as Manny E says..why at horizon things missing.. 😬.. I would like to go you Manny e to horizon with my nephews new camera which can zoom Uff magic.. You will find missing objects return again..
It is like convincing hadith believers to Quran only. Have u found hard it is.. Oh God that's tough.. They have all silly stuff well grounded like these well fixed to spinning myth . So hey those true Quran believers don't try convince these round Earthers other than quran.. Coz they are rooted to a theory which they trust and not God.. They may think same time they believe in God.. But impossible.. Same Hadith myth.. Once these two reject Quran how they gonna agree to hard work of these flat earth theory..
I wonder if NASA had said earth is stationary from the beginning and if another community raised up with round and spinning thrn story is different.. These same would mock at saying Oh my god it's spinning 1600 kms.. Shit ...
@ Hawk no countries buddy at the edge.. Try to extremely cross pacific from Japan and let me know.. Don't go towards up and reach America that's how ships going and flights going..
@ Manny e... You call ancient people as Educationally low and that's why they believed in flat earth.. Their effort and education is not comparable to any Now.. They have done wonders.. You speak one of the languages that ancient people created.. Challenge anyone including you to create a perfect language of your own.. No way.. So you consider the ancient mean in education..
Quote Manny E
QuoteAnyways, the air around the aircraft is subjected to the force of gravity and is pulled towards the ground and hence rotates with the planet and the aircraft is likewise forced to rotate with it inside the substance of air and hence it isn't independent of the rotation of the Earth but subjected to it in the same speed. The aircraft then moves in the air with the same principle as a sailing ship in the ocean. And thus the aircraft won't have to "catch up" up with the rotating planet as it rotates with it while airborne.
u didnt realise how foolish the statement you made above?
if aircraft that has an engine power to go high/low altitude YET subjected to the force of gravity and being pulled towards the ground,
from the same logic, explain why clouds that has no engine power yet can stay afloats above the ground?
quote Manny E
QuoteThe planet is a relatively big one, it rotates around its axis in as many as 24 hours and all its mass is drawn to it by the force of gravity, and this makes you unable to feel its movement because your life on Earth is related to it, like relativity.
Do you feel the movement on board an airplane in the isolated environment? You don't fly backwards if you'd jump on board of it.
Do you feel the movement aboard a large ship when it moves at its cruise speed?
The same principle is true for the movement of Earth, it is like a ship you're on board on, and you don't experience its movement speed as you live within its isolated environment.
at the speed the earth is travelling,
even a slightest bump can divert its running course
(Earth spins on its axis @1600lmph SAME TIME orbiting the sun at 1100kmph
while Boejng 747 cruising speed @700kmph)
and here you implying the biliion years old earth that has been floating and circling the sun has always been maintaining the same distance away from it since day 1 at its harmonious speed
AND not once derailed from its course or causes any major catastrophic event to earth even after being hit by the reported massive asteroid time after time?
thats LOGIC to you?
This message is for those who are atheists and challenge to the creations of God
You have lots of theories instituted in physics to elaborate and still you think it is not created and there is no God and everything is just cropped up without anyone being involved behind it. And some further says there is no beginning and no ending.. We human were living in this planet round earth forever like a circle which has no beginning and no ending.
One of my friends who is apparently an atheist and always came up with challenging ideas and said to me. No one created this universe including the earth, you and all those religious minded people brings up in between a never existing God into play and imagine He created. Nonsensical.. And he asked me to prove that it has a beginning and ending. Not necessary for me to prove, but God will I replied with something.
It was tough isn?t it. Somehow he needed a response immediately. I never had any idea, but one way or another, I explained to him in this same way.
What is the population of current world? And what could be the population 100 years before? And make it 1000 years before and why even make it 10000 years before, because you claim no beginning. So make it 50000.. right! So don?t you come to a point that the population of this earth to be very sparse and as one community. He rejected and got angry. So I calmed him down. What is your country of birth? Malaysia.. Ok. Do you know the history of it. Yes of course. Why not.. who lived there in the ancient times. And who came and settled there first. He replied something.. So it proves population were very minute and it spread. So in the same manner, take the world. Go backwards as much as possible, could that be one community? He said yes possible. Then from where this one single community appeared on the earth? Just dilute this single community as well, who are their ancestors?. will you not end up with only one couple. Hmm I don?t trust you, he said.. let me think somehow it was.. Then he asked how these couple came to the earth then? There you got to believe the God the One who creates? O you silly. You all religious minded, and never will you learn. He said.. Then he asked a very silly in a sense but hard question to answer unless give a thought to it..
He then scoffed and raised that silly question. Then tell me.. Did the Egg came first or Hen? Oops. I said Hen.. O u are so quick.. He said..why why can?t be Egg.. Hmm let me explain to you my friend.. let me take example of human ok. Did the Child came first or mother or father? So general logic will work out.. needless to explain, but I explain what I explained to him.. Can a child do anything without the support of his mother, Can the child grow in it?s own? No way.. He needs all the support till at least he can walk and find his food. So mother could have been first. But how mother can have a child without father? Hmm.. so father should have been first. So these two mother and father cannot come on their own to this myth of spinning world and land on it.. There you approach God.. Still I don?t believe. He said.. Why the resources of this earth keep diminishing if it is a circle and never commenced and never ending.. He said calm down. Don?t be aggressive.. I am not gonna believe you anyhow. I said, I know you will not believe..
Ok.. You asked me questions, so let me I ask you a question as well.. What basic things a human need to survive in the earth? He said, Oxygen, water, food and sunlight.. Yes.. what is your point? Okay.. is that so?.. Then would you go to a alleged planet without these four items you mentioned. Unless you would die. Devoid of them you can?t survive. Right. So what would have come first. human or the resources? With a big sigh he said resources.. So could there be a beginning to human? He said No. it?s a circle. I kept silence.. I knew the SIGNS of God will not work out for atheists..
Ok I asked. will anything on this earth survive without sunlight being lit over it. No.. probably die after few days..So do you think the sun was around while the earth was in its full shape.? So do you think water ever started evaporating from vast oceans, rivers and trees without sun?s presence. Do you think before sun it would have ever rained on earth and clouds formed.? It should be.. he said enough enough.. I could have gone on to explain him.. But he is not interested.. That?s why God says I called the earth and Heaven, they came willingly and then we made the heaven into seven heavens and gave it?s affairs.. Undeniable how things have formed precisely. Behind this is GOD.. Just look at the verses of Quran.. Does it give priority to Mohamed and make him high above others. No.. Then what is the point. Then you think Mohamed invented this? No. God Himself wants us to understand him, that?s why He keeps on explaining about the history of many prophets..
Since that day He never asked a single question about creation. I wonder how far my answer is true.. But somehow he never approached me. Since there are many atheist here in this forum. Hope that they would read at least..
@ many-e, don?t just point at those so called Muslim countries and compare the true believers, I personally never accept that there is a single muslim country in this world. Believers are those who surrender to God in any form and live with full of surrendering.. All these muslim countries and just names, just as they are.. Never equal them to believers.. Believers live all over the earth in any name they like to have, but they are very few.. Don?t think believers will cry when the so called muslim nations are destroyed.. Do believers need to cry when God destroys people by Tsunami, Earthquake, cyclone. Or destroyed by others and never being helped by God.. They cant be Surrenders (muslims) or Believers. That?s why God says Earth or Heavens NOT wept when the people of Pharaoh was destroyed. Why should we need to worry which God destroys? We believers will only worry about our fellow believers.. And we don?t worry about destined ones for hell. But we live still, so we remind, that?s our duty. Coz God kept reminded to King pharaoh and his people, same to Children of Isreal and to all others that?s history.. First of all you don?t know who believers are.. Just dragging these pathetic nations into limelight. Just look at what their priority and what they do.. It?s not quran. They have their own books.. just insult to God and it?s not astonishing to see how they are dragged to destruction.. It?s the will of God they get destroyed..
:peace: :!
Quote from: Manny_E on April 30, 2018, 01:58:27 PM
Realize it's logical to find the Earth to be a spherical object and you appear quite stupid to believe the Earth to be flat in the light of all ways to observe the case.
Its called PERSPECTIVE my friend
better still, go buy a good binoculars especially the one used by the military and station yourself anywhere you can see a ship in the horizon,
not just the mast but the FULL BODY of that far distance ship will be shown in clear view into your very eyes
btw, lighthouse to no use in globe earth theory.
go watch the video bro jkhan has provided to educate yourself
(from the Book of Adam)
The "Bright Nature" of man is taken away.
THEN Adam wept and said, "O God, when we dwelt in the garden, and our hearts were lifted up, we saw the angels that sang praises in heaven, but now we do not see as we were used to do; nay, when we entered the cave, all creation became hidden from us."
2 Then God the Lord said unto Adam, "When thou wast under subjection to Me, thou hadst a bright nature within thee, and for that reason couldst thou see things afar off. But after thy transgression thy bright nature was withdrawn from thee; and it was not left to thee to see things afar off, but only near at hand; after the ability of the flesh; for it is brutish."
3 When Adam and Eve had heard these words from God, they went their way; praising and worshipping Him with a sorrowful heart.
https://youtu.be/0xWsuFLdgBs
(https://youtu.be/0xWsuFLdgBs)
Salaam,
ECLIPSE OF FANTASY
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EaXJzhJ9wrc
hope it can helps..
Peace
Just below are two google searches as it is i copied
The diameter of the Sun is 1,390,000 km. Just for comparison, the diameter of the Earth is only 12,742 km. This means that you could put 109 Earths side-by-side to match the diameter of the Sun. And if you wanted to try and fill up the Sun with Earths, it would take 1.3 million Earths to match the volume of the Sun.May 31, 2010
What star is as big as the sun?
Largest ever yellow star is 1300 times bigger than sun. A monster version of our sun has been found, the largest known member of the family of yellow stars to which our sun belongs. The whopper sun emits light in similar wavelengths as our sun but its diameter is over 1300 times larger.
Now look at the verse 39:67 which says..
Sahih International: They have not appraised Allah with true appraisal, while the earth entirely will be [within] His grip on the Day of Resurrection, and the heavens will be folded in His right hand. Exalted is He and high above what they associate with Him.
Pickthall: And they esteem not Allah as He hath the right to be esteemed, when the whole earth is His handful on the Day of Resurrection, and the heavens are rolled in His right hand. Glorified is He and High Exalted from all that they ascribe as partner (unto Him).
Mohsin Khan: They made not a just estimate of Allah such as is due to Him. And on the Day of Resurrection the whole of the earth will be grasped by His Hand and the heavens will be rolled up in His Right Hand. Glorified is He, and High is He above all that they associate as partners with Him!
Arberry: They measure not God with His true measure. The earth altogether shall be His handful on the Day of Resurrection, and the heavens shall be rolled up in His right hand. Glory be to Him! High be He exalted above that they associate!
Now just imagine just the sun and one star how huge they are compared to earth. And ponder why would god say Earth (this tiny mote) to be separate and handful and the rest is in right hand.. Ponder O quran followers. Isn't this a joke of a verse unless you accept the earth to be as vast and huge as heavens. Problem is as the verse start, they esteem not God such as is due to Him.. That's what you measured with NASA.. keep it up.. i will remind who know who goes and take right path, at least they would think..
Not this: :nope:
Quote from: jkhan on April 30, 2018, 08:47:11 PM
@ Hawk no countries buddy at the edge.. Try to extremely cross pacific from Japan and let me know.. Don't go towards up and reach America that's how ships going and flights going..
But this! :yes
Quote from: hawk99 on April 21, 2018, 06:52:55 PM
Peace jkhan, in reference to your avatar:
No offense jkhan, but a bright light will shine through a less dense object
and appear hidden by an object with more apparent density.
In other words, light has its laws of physics. :handshake:
Question:
what is an allegory?
Could you give your definition of what a simile is?
allegories / parables are very clear in quran. and dont make a thing which is not an allegory to pretend as allegory.. :laugh:
Guys, to me you can keep believing that the earth is flat, that the entire world is conspiring against you, and that you are the few illuminated ones that know the truth, and that those who believe the earth is a globe go to hell.
All the pilots are conspiring, ok.
All the astronauts of all nations are conspiring, ok.
All the sailors are conspiring, ok.
The people of the past that knew that the earth was round were conspiring, ok.
The south pole doesn't exist, and all the people that went there are conspiring, ok.
Still, you can't explain how sunrise and sunsets are possible on a flat earth.
You can't explain why in the north emisphere there are different costellations than in the south emisphere.
You can't explain why all the planets and stars are not flat, but the earth is.
There is not a single flat earther that went to the south pole to prove that there are edges.
There is not a single flat earther that brought a SINGLE VALID EVIDENCE that the earth is flat, instead you keep lying about the globe earth and questioning it, even if there are already answers.
If you were real and not just trolling you would put at least 1$ each one of you and send one of you in the space with a shuttle.
You believe in the flat earth geocentric model because you don't think that Allah is enough mighty to create this giant multiverse.
A debate with a creationist is much much more constructive than a debate with a flat earther.
May Allah guide you all.
Quote from: jkhan on May 01, 2018, 03:46:55 AM
Just below are two google searches as it is i copied
The diameter of the Sun is 1,390,000 km. Just for comparison, the diameter of the Earth is only 12,742 km. This means that you could put 109 Earths side-by-side to match the diameter of the Sun. And if you wanted to try and fill up the Sun with Earths, it would take 1.3 million Earths to match the volume of the Sun.May 31, 2010
What star is as big as the sun?
Largest ever yellow star is 1300 times bigger than sun. A monster version of our sun has been found, the largest known member of the family of yellow stars to which our sun belongs. The whopper sun emits light in similar wavelengths as our sun but its diameter is over 1300 times larger.
Now look at the verse 39:67 which says..
Sahih International: They have not appraised Allah with true appraisal, while the earth entirely will be [within] His grip on the Day of Resurrection, and the heavens will be folded in His right hand. Exalted is He and high above what they associate with Him.
Pickthall: And they esteem not Allah as He hath the right to be esteemed, when the whole earth is His handful on the Day of Resurrection, and the heavens are rolled in His right hand. Glorified is He and High Exalted from all that they ascribe as partner (unto Him).
Mohsin Khan: They made not a just estimate of Allah such as is due to Him. And on the Day of Resurrection the whole of the earth will be grasped by His Hand and the heavens will be rolled up in His Right Hand. Glorified is He, and High is He above all that they associate as partners with Him!
Arberry: They measure not God with His true measure. The earth altogether shall be His handful on the Day of Resurrection, and the heavens shall be rolled up in His right hand. Glory be to Him! High be He exalted above that they associate!
Now just imagine just the sun and one star how huge they are compared to earth. And ponder why would god say Earth (this tiny mote) to be separate and handful and the rest is in right hand.. Ponder O quran followers. Isn't this a joke of a verse unless you accept the earth to be as vast and huge as heavens. Problem is as the verse start, they esteem not God such as is due to Him.. That's what you measured with NASA.. keep it up.. i will remind who know who goes and take right path, at least they would think..
Simply because WE ARE THE INHABITANTS OF THAT TINY BIT OF LAND AND THE MESSAGE WAS SENT TO US.
Quote from: IsaMuslim on May 01, 2018, 08:17:48 AM
Guys, to me you can keep believing that the earth is flat, that the entire world is conspiring against you, and that you are the few illuminated ones that know the truth, and that those who believe the earth is a globe go to hell.
All the pilots are conspiring, ok.
All the astronauts of all nations are conspiring, ok.
All the sailors are conspiring, ok.
The people of the past that knew that the earth was round were conspiring, ok.
The south pole doesn't exist, and all the people that went there are conspiring, ok.
Still, you can't explain how sunrise and sunsets are possible on a flat earth.
You can't explain why in the north emisphere there are different costellations than in the south emisphere.
You can't explain why all the planets and stars are not flat, but the earth is.
There is not a single flat earther that went to the south pole to prove that there are edges.
There is not a single flat earther that brought a SINGLE VALID EVIDENCE that the earth is flat, instead you keep lying about the globe earth and questioning it, even if there are already answers.
If you were real and not just trolling you would put at least 1$ each one of you and send one of you in the space with a shuttle.
You believe in the flat earth geocentric model because you don't think that Allah is enough mighty to create this giant multiverse.
A debate with a creationist is much much more constructive than a debate with a flat earther.
May Allah guide you all.
said the Lord..
79:27 Are you a more difficult in creation or is the heaven the Lord constructed it?
AND here you denying all His words in explaining how He constructed it,
the very REASONS He send the Scripture for you to give thought so you not to follow other STATEMENT (HADITH) but HIS ONLY.
Apparently it has gone into deaf ears in you.
said the Lord again
79:28 He raised its ceiling and proportioned it.
21:32 And We made the sky a protected ceiling, but they, from its signs, are turning away.
do you believe above us there are PROTECTED CEILING?
of course you dont,
because your God in NASA has drilled you well into believing that Helio the sun God is the center of the UNIVERSE and you are just small little tiny peenie occupying the little space in the small planet earth of the vast universe.
In my God's cosmology,
Earth where I am standing today is the centre of the UNIVERSE and the focus is me.
2:171 The example of those who disbelieve is like that of one who shouts at what hears nothing but calls and cries cattle or sheep - deaf, dumb and blind, so they do not understand.
Quote from: IsaMuslim on May 01, 2018, 08:17:48 AM
Guys, to me you can keep believing that the earth is flat, that the entire world is conspiring against you, and that you are the few illuminated ones that know the truth, and that those who believe the earth is a globe go to hell.
All the pilots are conspiring, ok.
All the astronauts of all nations are conspiring, ok.
All the sailors are conspiring, ok.
The people of the past that knew that the earth was round were conspiring, ok.
The south pole doesn't exist, and all the people that went there are conspiring, ok.
Still, you can't explain how sunrise and sunsets are possible on a flat earth.
You can't explain why in the north emisphere there are different costellations than in the south emisphere.
You can't explain why all the planets and stars are not flat, but the earth is.
There is not a single flat earther that went to the south pole to prove that there are edges.
There is not a single flat earther that brought a SINGLE VALID EVIDENCE that the earth is flat, instead you keep lying about the globe earth and questioning it, even if there are already answers.
If you were real and not just trolling you would put at least 1$ each one of you and send one of you in the space with a shuttle.
You believe in the flat earth geocentric model because you don't think that Allah is enough mighty to create this giant multiverse.
A debate with a creationist is much much more constructive than a debate with a flat earther.
May Allah guide you all.
You make too much sense IsaMuslim.
@jkhan
:) still you have not answered:
Peace jkhan, in reference to your avatar:
No offense jkhan, but a bright light will shine through a less dense object
and appear hidden by an object with more apparent density.
In other words, light has its laws of physics.
Question: what is an allegory?
Could you give your definition of what a simile is? :peace:
@ Hawk.. Don't u find a dictionary to refer what is simile and allegory are? If I define would You gonna believe?😧
Read chapter 12:4 "when Yousuf told his father; O my father, I saw eleven stars, and the sun and the moon submitting before me.."
Just a precise predicting dream and wonderful allegory and a wise simile.. Is it?
Look at the order of words first stars, then sun, then moon.. What that indicates the distance of each from earth.. Simultaneously, are these referring to brothers and father and mother of Yousuf.. Yes definitely. The end of chapter 12 revealed it..
See the importance God gave to Sun which is His father and the moon His mother and the stars were his brothers..
What you get in this.. Are the stars bigger than sun.. No.. Is the moon bigger than sun.. Not exactly.. God only gave the simile of stars to brothers.. The brothers are never equal to father and mother. So relatively small stars compared to sun and moon just brothers.. Stars can never ever be bigger or worthier than sun.. But unfortunately these people blindly accepts stars are there bigger than sun 1300 times.. Lol what about sun and moon, could be almost identical but sun is comparatively slightly bigger.. Coz the brightness overpower the moon.. What a simile to father and mother! Why here sun is father, coz the character here is Yaqub a prophet and loving father of Yousuf and much mentioned person.. So mother became just moon.. Never mentioned in Quran who she is.. I know there will be among quran believing lip services who would still object this.. What they don't object.. They deny all.. Never mind..
Significant thing here is in the heavens which God created sun is main and moon and then only stars.. Very unfortunately these lipservice group claim there are things bigger than sun and there are many more.. Father and mother God compare to sun and moon.. So shame the size of sun and moon is no way near.. Do you ever ponder folks.. Have you ever seen this much explanation to this kind of verse..
Now your turn dude Hawk explain to all what is allegory and simile.. Did u expect this answer? I doubt.. God bless you, save yourself from hell dude.. That's prepared for deniers of His verses.. God only knows who denies His verses.. T c
Oh sorry... I forget the cream and the essence.. Human always forget.. Yousuf could have dreamt stars and sun and earth.. So atleast earth is bigger than moon.. But unfortunately he didnt.. Wake up people.. Your Lord is watching.. Turn your faces to Him and beg for pardon.. Only the true hearts can do it.. Not the lipservice.. I can see a nice full moon here.. Let me enjoy watching it.. T c
Quote from: lime juice on May 01, 2018, 09:17:03 AM
said the Lord..
79:27 Are you a more difficult in creation or is the heaven the Lord constructed it?
AND here you denying all His words in explaining how He constructed it,
the very REASONS He send the Scripture for you to give thought so you not to follow other STATEMENT (HADITH) but HIS ONLY.
Apparently it has gone into deaf ears in you.
Say: "Roam the earth and observe how the creation was initiated. Thus God will establish the final creation. God is capable of all things."
(29:20)
In the creation of the heavens and the earth, and the difference between the night and the day, are signs for those who possess intelligence.
(3:190)
Quote from: lime juice on May 01, 2018, 09:17:03 AM
said the Lord again
79:28 He raised its ceiling and proportioned it.
21:32 And We made the sky a protected ceiling, but they, from its signs, are turning away.
do you believe above us there are PROTECTED CEILING?
Yes! I do, and in my graph I showed you what this "protective ceiling" could mean in modern terminology. And show me from where do you get that this ceiling must be
solid!?
This protective ceiling is the atmosphere. God says that He made the clouds to be between the Earth and the Heaven, so anything above them is certainly part of the heaven, including the higher atmosphere.
Quote from: lime juice on May 01, 2018, 09:17:03 AM
because your God in NASA has drilled you well into believing that Helio the sun God is the center of the UNIVERSE and you are just small little tiny peenie occupying the little space in the small planet earth of the vast universe.
In my God's cosmology,
Earth where I am standing today is the centre of the UNIVERSE and the focus is me.
2:171 The example of those who disbelieve is like that of one who shouts at what hears nothing but calls and cries cattle or sheep - deaf, dumb and blind, so they do not understand.
Today nobody says that the sun is at the center of the Universe.
Sun revolves around the center of our galaxy, the Milky Way, and Earth revolves around the Sun. And only God know where the center of the Universe is, because with our instruments we can only see a certain amount of Universe (Observable Universe, which, at the moment, I believe is the one that God calls "lowest heaven").
Yes, we are really small, insignificant, compared to the whole Universe (or even Multiverse). You yourself quoted 79:27.
Does this change anything?
The eyesight cannot reach Him, yet
He can reach all eyesight; and He is the Subtle, the Expert.
(6:103)
God, there is no god except He, the Living, the Sustainer.
No slumber or sleep overtakes Him; to Him belongs
all that is in the heavens and the earth. Who will intercede with Him except with His permission? He knows their present and their future, and they do not have any of His knowledge except for what He wishes.
His Throne (i.e. Dominion) encompasses all of the heavens and the earth and it is easy for Him to preserve them. He is the Most High, the Great.
(2:255)
Quote from: IsaMuslim on May 02, 2018, 10:08:04 AM
Say: "Roam the earth and observe how the creation was initiated. Thus God will establish the final creation. God is capable of all things."
(29:20)
In the creation of the heavens and the earth, and the difference between the night and the day, are signs for those who possess intelligence.
(3:190)
Yes! I do, and in my graph I showed you what this "protective ceiling" could mean in modern terminology. And show me from where do you get that this ceiling must be solid!?
This protective ceiling is the atmosphere. God says that He made the clouds to be between the Earth and the Heaven, so anything above them is certainly part of the heaven, including the higher atmosphere.
Today nobody says that the sun is at the center of the Universe. Sun revolves around the center of our galaxy, the Milky Way, and Earth revolves around the Sun. And only God know where the center of the Universe is, because with our instruments we can only see a certain amount of Universe (Observable Universe, which, at the moment, I believe is the one that God calls "lowest heaven").
Yes, we are really small, insignificant, compared to the whole Universe (or even Multiverse). You yourself quoted 79:27.
Does this change anything?
The eyesight cannot reach Him, yet He can reach all eyesight; and He is the Subtle, the Expert.
(6:103)
God, there is no god except He, the Living, the Sustainer. No slumber or sleep overtakes Him; to Him belongs all that is in the heavens and the earth. Who will intercede with Him except with His permission? He knows their present and their future, and they do not have any of His knowledge except for what He wishes. His Throne (i.e. Dominion) encompasses all of the heavens and the earth and it is easy for Him to preserve them. He is the Most High, the Great.
(2:255)
does ANY of the verse you provide tell us
earth a globe? NOPE
earth spin? NOPE
earth orbit? NOPE
earth float? NOPE
hmmmmm......
here I share with you what Ive learned from His HADITH
From His HADITH Ive learned;
He fashioned us from mud and just a blew to the nostril, Adam come to life.... too EASY for Him.
From His HADITH again Ive learned:
Heaven and Earth were ONE!!
He then separates it apart.
Heaven He RAISED it higher and made it a PROTECTED CEILING (Firmament)
He then made SEVEN Heavens above it.
Earth He spreads it WIDE.
He next created the LIGHT (day) to brighten the DARK (night)
Followed by the Sun, the moon
ANd its not allowable for the sun to reach the moon, nor does the night overtake the day, but each, in an orbit, is swimming.
Earth He made a resting place while Heaven the canopy.
He then created the STARS as guidance in the night to those at sea/land.
And CLOUDS to bring rain to the land.
He then placed set of mountains on earth so it shall not moved
Heaven He constructed it with STRENGTH
while mankind, HE just to say BE...
He has detailed it all in His HADITH and made it easy for any sound mind to comprehend of His SIGNS....
AND He reminded us, denying all His hardwork hellfire our companion forever!!
There are about a dozen verse being used to explain all the above
Does any of it give you even the slightest idea that
Earth a Globe that SPINS on its axis @ 1600kmph same time ORBITS the sun @1100kmph?
If yes, you only read a different HADITH
If no, what stopping you fron accepting it?
Ego perhaps..
Quote from: Manny_E on May 02, 2018, 03:46:59 PM
What kind of language is "blew to the nostril"?
Do you seriously believe that shit?
The sectarian rendition of Quran gives not even a hint to that the Earth is flat. It doesn't give a hint to that the Earth is round either, that isn't exactly the important matter but you waste your breath trying to prove some stupid irrelevant point.
We are just an advanced breed of monkeys on a minor planet of a very average star. But we can understand the Universe. That makes us something very special.
Stephen Hawking
meet your far distance cousin
(https://thewondrous.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/04/funny-images-of-monkey.jpg)
@ lime juice..
Take my advice if your inner mind agree.. Don't go after these hypocrites and atheists and answer each and everything. But only answer to a sensible questions.. Be silent to others if u feel how nonsensical the questions are.. Take examples from the book how to argue and move away in a manner that's suits.. Remember this is a free minds forum and let them post whatever they like.. You bring quran verses and explain with logic and make it sound.. People are there who not and think about it and those who are silent no mean in knowledge.. They always take right thing.. People can practice right thing without knowing to others.. Example the one who hid his faith in king Pharaoh family and even his wife. Those who argue with you vehemently knows what is truth and their self consciousness shows it but they deny for their ego and the blindness God made in them.. Remember there are people whose hearts are sealed and eyes made blind.. We don't know them God knows.. Can u guide them. Just remind and bring forth verses. Let someone benefit..that should be the target.. The book itself called reminder and God sent messengers to remind and warn. So never get bored in reminding those who listens with faith.. Don't target these.. God will they will get their guidance.. Or otherwise.. Remember Hell is something to be filled and not to keep it empty.. That's God's word and will.. Don't get carried away by posting such monkeys..just relax.. And don't expect any results visible to your effort.. Only thing remind what is right.. And carry on with life.. You will see after death who benefitted from it. Coz we don't know hearts of people.. God uses us to remind let's just do that.. More than enough
@ Manny E
if u think we waste time as you responded, what you doing in this forum with this subject, wasting your precious 😊 : time with those who waste? Sensible thing is to keep away. Right. Ridiculous for any sound mind.. :yay:
@ jkhan
its laughable to see 'the all knower' here actually knows nothing
talk like a pro but with zero essence.
how I wish he to reflect on his belief first before to condemn the Scripture in this very Quran centric platform
It only makes him look stupid.
Anyway, advice noted with thanks.
4:119 And I (satan) will lead them astray, and fill them with fancies and I(satan) will command them and they will cut off the cattle's ears; I(satan) will command them and they will change the creation of God.' Whoso takes Satan to him for a friend, instead of God, has surely suffered a manifest loss.
4:120 He (satan) promises them and fills them with fancies, but there is nothing Satan promises them except delusion.
4:121 Such men -- their refuge shall be Gahanna(hell), and they shall find no asylum from it.
30:30 So direct your face toward the system, inclining to truth. [Adhere to] the nature of God upon which He has created [all] people. No change should there be in the creation of God. That is the correct system, but most of the people do not know.
Ponder over these verses, definitely appropriate for the caption. Note how influential and deceptive Satan is. He will take you to an imaginary world, which doesn?t exist and in the end it is utter delusion. Some raise fingers in this forum started murmuring with sets of questions (how that could be, how this could be possible if earth is not round, bla bla. They?re convinced on something but not quran for sure) I will bring one of those how?s. One indicated, We (one against round earth) considered God could not create a spinning world and whatever NASA has depicted so that we deemed God and His power mean. My friend there is nothing that God cannot perform. But we should not deny what God has performed in reality not the imaginary and deceptive one. He created everything with strong purpose and everything for our test. And not just to be idle. Coz you are so obstinate that the world should be in fact accurately as per what the theories of Men says (NASA) regardless what the verses say. But you forgot that such Earth doesn?t exist. Who you deny? Your Creator. Had He willed He would have created as NASA depicts or in any other way one can imagine or not even comprehend with? Had the verses of God in conformity with what NASA or any other scientists elaborate there is no reason we should deny them, but instead definitely applaud the intelligence. We are not against science and technology. How thankful when every time we drive a car, how useful it is, how hard life would have been without them these days. All are gifts of God in the form of technology and wisdom bestowed on men. God is never against what human create. For example, God says You create shield to protect you in the wars. So it is clear God doesn?t mind in what man creates using his materials. Coz God didn?t create it in the form available, but only materials and bestowed wisdom to men to perform it. You see loads of such things. When we considered that there is NO ONE EQUAL TO GOD it?s our duty to think many times what is going AGAINST His verses before accepting them, even though how strong their evidences could possibly be, coz Satan is not a mean guy. He challenged to God and to send all of us in astray, coz he was swollen with pride and considered us lowly and considered him elite and became a real enemy. Yes, He will try all he can do, but you don?t get it unfortunately and you take him so lightly. Coz you didn?t give utmost priority to Quran and deviated from Quran, coz worldly life and what glitters on it took your sense away.
Another point one raised in this forum, How all pilots, captains, etc, conspire.. Not anyone of them conspire dear, may be they don?t even know, they conspire. But Chief Deceiver has programmed things which you don?t get it. For instance, even how many times you fly from Tokyo to San Francisco; you won?t reflect how that is possible by this route. But that?s the route and eye witness. If this route is possible then there cannot be a straight route as the real round map shows. Sun should shine well to San Francisco and Japan same time in this round earth. Do you think all who work in NASA knows what the top guys doing in it? Do you think all Russians know what the real conspiracy is? Just imagine for just a simple murder case how long it takes things to be finalized, even though how many eye witnesses around some times story will not come out. This is a well instituted master conspiracy, and used some of the well known ancient theories to buttress their theories, they programmed everything and made theories to everything and they knew how to compete with the threats of other nations and to make comply them (it?s not strange, for money, conspirers join hand in hand with master conspirers). Once you click Google you find their theories and you go to college their curriculum. It?s not easy stuff to overcome. But for a real God believer and a one who takes his verses seriously, this is not a challenge. God exposes things in His own way gradually; He is not in a hurry. That?s why He is God. He gives immense time for all and it is not the Day of Judgment. All these consequences will benefit the true believers and increase their faith. (take example Hadith conspiracy for which God is absolutely against, how well it infused into the life of Muslims and became part of life and spread all over and evidences against Hadith well ironed out in the history except Quran., same this Myth of conspiracy invaded us, all sheer master plan of Satan. God knew what?s happening and didn?t curb it, coz He knows who will cling on to it)
If this Quran was just finished revealing in 2018 and not way back in 6th century, those who call Muslim and Quran believers and rest would hardly accept Quran, and would most probably tell same old stories of ancients, insane in this modern era. And would point out all these Quran verses talks about Earth and Heavens with comparison to NASA and mock with certainty. Coz they accept the myth far beyond anything. Coz 4:119 says: Satan commands fancies which have attraction and almost like truth but it is deception. The way he deceived our father Adam
Peace brothers and sisters.
GOD s way is consistent.
Galaxies rotate anticlockwise east north west south...etc
It is not a coincidence that circling the Kaaba is done anticlockwise( starting at east and going around north west south...) whether one believes hajj or not, the circling of people is done this way regardless?
Earth, and all other planets and most celestial objects, rotate anticlockwise as a result of their formation. As matter accretes under the influence of gravity, the potential energy must go somewhere. It turns into kinetic energy, moving the particles together. When the particles meet and conglomerate (first due to electrostatics, then due to gravity) the kinetic energy must remain within the object as there is no way to get rid of it. It becomes rotational kinetic energy instead of linear kinetic energy, causing the object to rotate.
In addition to orbiting the Sun, the Earth is constantly spinning, giving us day and night as each side of the Earth points toward, then away from, the Sun. This spin also causes a "bulge" at the equator, so that locations there are about 21.3 km farther from the Earth's center than either of the poles. (Yukawiru Al Layla Ala Al Nahar!!)
Why do stars, planets, moons...spin?
Everything in the universe appears to rotate, and we know that angular momentum is conserved in every interaction, so it isn't surprising that the collapse of the original planetary nebula into the Sun and planets would have set everything spinning. It's worth noting that things that rotate in our solar system almost all rotate in the same direction - anticlockwise as seen from a position "above" the north pole of the Sun.
Another possible impetus for the planet's spin would have been the titanic collision between the proto-Earth and a planetoid that hit the Earth early in its history, creating the Moon from the debris. Unless the impact was precisely on center, the impact would have spun the planet like a top.
All but two of the Sun's planets rotate as Earth does. Venus hardly rotates at all, which might have been due to a collision (as above). The planet Uranus spins somewhat normally, but is tipped over on its side, its poles alternately facing the Sun as it moves in its orbit. The larger planets rotate faster than Earth.
The laws of physics say that an object in motion will tend to stay in motion unless an outside force acts on it, and that applies to Earth's rotation. The only reason Earth's rotation has been slowing down( Negligible) is because of drag from the Moon's gravity and impacts with asteroids.
In general:
Rotational inertia.
the earth turns so the whole world has a day and a night.
to give day and night
to let the sun be on the other side of the world and the moon be on ours
To summarise!!!!
God put some spin on it when He served.
Brothers jkhan and lime juice, my head is spinning(yes anticlockwise!!!) from both your take on Qoran.
Qoran does not say what you claim. Never. You must be both "Mashouroon"?
GOD bless you all
Peace.
@ good logic
I do hope you can live up to your good name; not Delusional but Good Logic...
If QURAN to you a GOOD LOGIC
from His SCRIPTURE
could you provide the details to support all the HADITH you made above to prove that the God you believed is indeed the Lord of the Universe
ALSO could you point to me the exact location of the SEVEN LAYERED HEAVENS in your Globe Earth theory please
my head is spinning in trying to locate it..
21:33 And We made the sky a protected ceiling
23:17 And We have CREATED ABOVE YOU SEVEN LAYERED HEAVENS,
and never have We been of [Our] creation unaware.
(http://www.meteoweb.eu/wp-content/uploads/2016/07/solar-system-640x480.jpg)
For any intelligent person I ask to ponder, just look at the picture which lime juice posted and think of the verse God says " We called heaven and earth to come willingly or unwillingly, and they both(dual) came willingly... " just look at it.. How many items there? Imagine Now how they approached to God. What difference it would make to say in dual form, when all these big size planets approach God with tiny earth? Then stars? And sky? Isn't it fair God to call all of them by name and come willingly? Am looking weird? Just look at again the picture.. From North Pole stars are visible and south pole stars are visible. Where is canopy? Oh just out of mind these people..
What about other solar system the same NASA describes..? You can't deny guys.. That's the same source NASA tell you and you rely on them, and there are more and more solar systems? Do you accept that or deny? Or just to save your head for humiliation satisfy with only one sun based system.. If so what make you reject the same NASA? Where are the verses for other sun based 8 planenets? What God created? And what NASA explain? Just advice u.. Be atheist.. That's better than saying a believer and take Quran and meantime say these story in public.. Shame.. I mean it..
Thanks for the picture lime juice..
Quote from: lime juice on May 02, 2018, 12:09:18 PM
does ANY of the verse you provide tell us
earth a globe? NOPE
earth spin? NOPE
earth orbit? NOPE
earth float? NOPE
This demonstrates that you don't even care reading what I write.
However I continue to write because this discussion may be useful for other people reading in the future.
Quote from: lime juice on May 02, 2018, 12:09:18 PM
hmmmmm......
here I share with you what Ive learned from His HADITH
From His HADITH Ive learned;
He fashioned us from mud and just a blew to the nostril, Adam come to life.... too EASY for Him.
If you take into consideration a few verses
alone of course you won't understand nothing.
Actually the Quran preceded the theory of evolution, and in it is
clear that our creation was
not instantaneous and took various steps.
Have those who rejected not seen that the heavens and the earth were one piece, so We split them apart? And that
We have made from the WATER EVERYTHING THAT LIVES. Will they not believe?
(21:30)
The above verse states that ALL LIVING THINGS, including us, were created from water.
And to Thamud was their brother Saleh. He said: "O my people, serve God, you have no god besides Him.
He has established/produced you from the earth, and has made you settle in it; so seek His forgiveness, then repent to Him. My Lord is Near, Responsive."
(11:61)
The above verse says that we were made from the earth. All the other say equivalent words, like "clay"; but the meaning is that our body comes from the same matter of this planet.
And We created you,
THEN We shaped you,
THEN We said to the angels: "Yield to Adam;" so they yielded except for Satan, he was not of those who yielded.
(7:110)
The One who has created you,
THEN evolved/fashioned/proportioned you,
THEN made you upright?
In any which picture He chooses, He places you.
(82:7-8)
I leave you to these articles:
http://www.irfi.org/articles/articles_251_300/evolution_in_the_light_of_the_qu1.htm
http://www.answeringislamicskeptics.com/evolution-in-islam-overview.html
Quote from: lime juice on May 02, 2018, 12:09:18 PM
From His HADITH again Ive learned:
1. Heaven and Earth were ONE!!
2. He then separates it apart.
3. Heaven He RAISED it higher and made it a PROTECTED CEILING (Firmament)
4. He then made SEVEN Heavens above it.
5. Earth He spreads it WIDE.
(numbering is mine)1. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Initial_singularity
2. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Big_Bang#Timeline
3. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atmosphere
The atmosphere helps to protect living organisms from genetic damage by solar ultraviolet radiation, solar wind and cosmic rays.4. I hypotize that the first heaven, that we can see is the Observable Universe
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Observable_universe
And that today we cannot perceive the other 6.
Others proposed that they might be additional Universes.
5. He says that the earth was spread
Wide NOT FLAT. Wide means spacious not flat.
Quote from: lime juice on May 02, 2018, 12:09:18 PM
He next created the LIGHT (day) to brighten the DARK (night)
Followed by the Sun, the moon
ANd its not allowable for the sun to reach the moon, nor does the night overtake the day, but each, in an orbit, is swimming.
Can you please provide the verses that show that the things you mentioned were created in that order?
And yes, the Sun cannot reach the Moon of course;
what has this to do with flat earth???I already told you that
THE SUN AND THE MOON BOTH SWIM IN AN ORBIThttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sun#Orbit_in_Milky_Way
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Orbit_of_the_Moon
Also this verse hints that
also the earth swims in an orbit with the sun and the moon:
لَا الشَّمْسُ يَنبَغِي لَهَا أَن تُدْرِكَ الْقَمَرَ وَلَا اللَّيْلُ سَابِقُ النَّهَارِ وَكُلٌّ فِي فَلَكٍ يَسْبَحُونَ I don't speak arabic, but many confirm this; see this website http://www.quranmiracles.com/2011/03/all-afloat-in-orbits/
Quote from: lime juice on May 02, 2018, 12:09:18 PM
Earth He made a resting place while Heaven the canopy.
He then created the STARS as guidance in the night to those at sea/land.
And CLOUDS to bring rain to the land.
He then placed set of mountains on earth so it shall not moved
Again, can you please provide the verse numbers? I don't remember the particular order that you are describing.
Quote from: lime juice on May 02, 2018, 12:09:18 PM
Heaven He constructed it with STRENGTH
while mankind, HE just to say BE...
No,
anything He creates is by His will, His command. His command is described to us "
Be".
He has all the power and strength, it would make no sense to distinguish different ways of creating, He decides how to create things, but the source is always "Be".
Initiator of the heavens and the earth, when He decrees a command,
He merely says to it: 'Be,' and it is.(2:117)
Is not the One who has created the heavens and the earth able to create the like of them? Yes indeed; He is the Creator, the Knowledgeable.
His command, when He wants anything, is to say to it: 'Be,' and it is.(36:81-82)
He is the One who gives life and death. And
when He decides upon anything, He simply says to it: 'Be,' and it is.(40:68)
The verse that maybe you meant was this:
And the heaven We constructed with strength/resources, and We are
expanding it.
(51:47)
Now tell me, on a flat earth, what does it mean that the heaven is expanding?In the real model of the Universe this is possible and it is happening.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Expansion_of_the_universe
Quote from: lime juice on May 02, 2018, 12:09:18 PM
He has detailed it all in His HADITH and made it easy for any sound mind to comprehend of His SIGNS....
AND He reminded us, denying all His hardwork hellfire our companion forever!!
Sorry brother but you are clearly wrong, because we are not denying anything!
We just have different opinions.Surely those who believe; and those who are Jewish, and the Nazarenes, and the Sabians, whoever believes in God and the Last Day and does good works; they will have their recompense with their Lord, and there is no fear upon them, nor will they grieve.
(2:62)
Quote from: lime juice on May 02, 2018, 12:09:18 PM
There are about a dozen verse being used to explain all the above
Does any of it give you even the slightest idea that
Earth a Globe that SPINS on its axis @ 1600kmph same time ORBITS the sun @1100kmph?
If yes, you only read a different HADITH
If no, what stopping you fron accepting it?
Ego perhaps..
The PHYSICAL PROOFS and BASIC OBSERVATIONS tell us that the earth is not flat.
Following these is not the same as following other hadiths!
Say: "Roam the earth and observe how the creation was initiated. Thus God will establish the final creation. God is capable of all things."(29:20)
And apart from that, there is a verse that suggests that the earth is floating in an orbit,
just read my whole answer instead of skipping directly here, and find it.
Quote from: jkhan on May 02, 2018, 11:23:14 PM
4:119 And I (satan) will lead them astray, and fill them with fancies and I(satan) will command them and they will cut off the cattle's ears; I(satan) will command them and they will change the creation of God.' Whoso takes Satan to him for a friend, instead of God, has surely suffered a manifest loss.
4:120 He (satan) promises them and fills them with fancies, but there is nothing Satan promises them except delusion.
4:121 Such men -- their refuge shall be Gahanna(hell), and they shall find no asylum from it.
30:30 So direct your face toward the system, inclining to truth. [Adhere to] the nature of God upon which He has created [all] people. No change should there be in the creation of God. That is the correct system, but most of the people do not know.
Ponder over these verses, definitely appropriate for the caption. Note how influential and deceptive Satan is. He will take you to an imaginary world, which doesn?t exist and in the end it is utter delusion.
Brothers, it's you who are being deceived by Satan but you are not realizing it. Please see for the actual PROOF that the earth is NOT FLAT, and then re-read the Quran, you will see that they don't conflict.
But no, you won't do that because you are being deceived by Satan.
Quote from: jkhan on May 02, 2018, 11:23:14 PM
Some raise fingers in this forum started murmuring with sets of questions (how that could be, how this could be possible if earth is not round, bla bla. They?re convinced on something but not quran for sure) I will bring one of those how?s. One indicated, We (one against round earth) considered God could not create a spinning world and whatever NASA has depicted so that we deemed God and His power mean. My friend there is nothing that God cannot perform. But we should not deny what God has performed in reality not the imaginary and deceptive one. He created everything with strong purpose and everything for our test. And not just to be idle. Coz you are so obstinate that the world should be in fact accurately as per what the theories of Men says (NASA) regardless what the verses say. But you forgot that such Earth doesn?t exist. Who you deny? Your Creator. Had He willed He would have created as NASA depicts or in any other way one can imagine or not even comprehend with? Had the verses of God in conformity with what NASA or any other scientists elaborate there is no reason we should deny them, but instead definitely applaud the intelligence.
It was me who said that, I think. And I still think it.
Why would you believe in a geocentric model, if not for your own ego? The need to be in the only living place that God has created? Don't you think that God is infinitely wise and powerful to have created all this giant Universe? Why do you want to restrict His creation only to this tiny planet?
And why do you keep crying "NASA! NASA!"? You are obviously aware that:
- NASA is not the only space agency
- The notion of globe-earth exists since at least 2000 years
If you want to sound less ridicolous you should stop screaming "NASA".
Quote from: jkhan on May 02, 2018, 11:23:14 PM
We are not against science and technology. How thankful when every time we drive a car, how useful it is, how hard life would have been without them these days. All are gifts of God in the form of technology and wisdom bestowed on men. God is never against what human create. For example, God says You create shield to protect you in the wars. So it is clear God doesn?t mind in what man creates using his materials. Coz God didn?t create it in the form available, but only materials and bestowed wisdom to men to perform it. You see loads of such things.
But why don't you then check the scientific material that we have on the globe earth? Or why don't you make experiments for yourself? Are you scared to find out that the earth is not flat?
Quote from: jkhan on May 02, 2018, 11:23:14 PM
When we considered that there is NO ONE EQUAL TO GOD it?s our duty to think many times what is going AGAINST His verses before accepting them, even though how strong their evidences could possibly be, coz Satan is not a mean guy. He challenged to God and to send all of us in astray, coz he was swollen with pride and considered us lowly and considered him elite and became a real enemy. Yes, He will try all he can do, but you don?t get it unfortunately and you take him so lightly. Coz you didn?t give utmost priority to Quran and deviated from Quran, coz worldly life and what glitters on it took your sense away.
Brother, but the fact is that many people like me know that the globe-earth does not go against the Quran!
Why don't you try to reapproach all these verses and see for yourself?
Quote from: jkhan on May 02, 2018, 11:23:14 PM
Another point one raised in this forum, How all pilots, captains, etc, conspire.. Not anyone of them conspire dear, may be they don?t even know, they conspire. But Chief Deceiver has programmed things which you don?t get it. For instance, even how many times you fly from Tokyo to San Francisco; you won?t reflect how that is possible by this route. But that?s the route and eye witness. If this route is possible then there cannot be a straight route as the real round map shows. Sun should shine well to San Francisco and Japan same time in this round earth.
It was me that said that. If they do not conspire then how do they do their job under this deception?
How is it possible that no one even noticed???
And that is incorrect. That route is possible on the round earth.
Quote from: jkhan on May 02, 2018, 11:23:14 PM
Do you think all who work in NASA knows what the top guys doing in it? Do you think all Russians know what the real conspiracy is? Just imagine for just a simple murder case how long it takes things to be finalized, even though how many eye witnesses around some times story will not come out. This is a well instituted master conspiracy, and used some of the well known ancient theories to buttress their theories, they programmed everything and made theories to everything and they knew how to compete with the threats of other nations and to make comply them (it?s not strange, for money, conspirers join hand in hand with master conspirers). Once you click Google you find their theories and you go to college their curriculum. It?s not easy stuff to overcome. But for a real God believer and a one who takes his verses seriously, this is not a challenge. God exposes things in His own way gradually; He is not in a hurry. That?s why He is God. He gives immense time for all and it is not the Day of Judgment. All these consequences will benefit the true believers and increase their faith. (take example Hadith conspiracy for which God is absolutely against, how well it infused into the life of Muslims and became part of life and spread all over and evidences against Hadith well ironed out in the history except Quran., same this Myth of conspiracy invaded us, all sheer master plan of Satan. God knew what?s happening and didn?t curb it, coz He knows who will cling on to it)
If this Quran was just finished revealing in 2018 and not way back in 6th century, those who call Muslim and Quran believers and rest would hardly accept Quran, and would most probably tell same old stories of ancients, insane in this modern era. And would point out all these Quran verses talks about Earth and Heavens with comparison to NASA and mock with certainty. Coz they accept the myth far beyond anything. Coz 4:119 says: Satan commands fancies which have attraction and almost like truth but it is deception. The way he deceived our father Adam
Brother, please, show me
evidence for this conspiracy... Nobody has shown me a proof that this is all a conspiracy.
It all sounds like the plot of a movie, like many other stories from conspiracy theorists.
Peace lime juice.
You mean this understanding of Qoran is alien to you?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3n3ttEA1rbs
Or she is also deluded like the rest of us?
Surely this goes against your understanding of the verses as well!!!!
So you are right? Sorry you and jkhan.
No.The lady in the link is more sound as far as I can tell
Me ,I think like your earth you are both standing still.
GOD bless you.
Peace.
Quote from: jkhan on April 03, 2018, 11:48:05 PM
Sahih International: Race toward forgiveness from your Lord and a Garden whose width is like the width of the heavens and earth, prepared for those who believed in Allah and His messengers. That is the bounty of Allah which He gives to whom He wills, and Allah is the possessor of great bounty.
Pickthall: Race one with another for forgiveness from your Lord and a Garden whereof the breadth is as the breadth of the heavens and the earth, which is in store for those who believe in Allah and His messengers. Such is the bounty of Allah, which He bestoweth upon whom He will, and Allah is of Infinite Bounty.
Yusuf Ali: Be ye foremost (in seeking) Forgiveness from your Lord, and a Garden (of Bliss), the width whereof is as the width of heaven and earth, prepared for those who believe in Allah and His messengers: that is the Grace of Allah, which He bestows on whom he pleases: and Allah is the Lord of Grace abounding.
Shakir: Hasten to forgiveness from your Lord and to a garden the extensiveness of which is as the extensiveness of the heaven and the earth; it is prepared for those who believe in Allah and His messengers; that is the grace of Allah: He gives it to whom He pleases, and Allah is the Lord of mighty grace.
Muhammad Sarwar: Compete with one another to achieve forgiveness from your Lord and to reach Paradise, which is as vast as the heavens and the earth, and is prepared for those who believe in God and His Messenger. This is the blessing of God and He grants it to whomever He wants. The blessings of God are great.
Mohsin Khan: Race one with another in hastening towards Forgiveness from your Lord (Allah), and towards Paradise, the width whereof is as the width of heaven and earth, prepared for those who believe in Allah and His Messengers. That is the Grace of Allah which He bestows on whom He pleases. And Allah is the Owner of Great Bounty.
Arberry: Race to forgiveness from your Lord, and a Garden the breadth whereof is as the breadth of heaven and earth, made ready for those who believe in God and His Messengers. That is the bounty of God; He gives it unto whomsoever He will; and God is of bounty abounding.
THE ABOVE VERSE INDICATES THAT THE PARADISE (JANNAH) HAS THE WIDTH OF HEAVEN AND EARTH.. WHY GOD COMPARED THE TINY EARTH WITH HEAVEN. I DON'T KNOW SCIENCE IS PRECISE ON THE SIZE OF HEAVEN BUT, AS FAR AS WE KNOW IN OUR CURRENT KNOWLEDGE AND ACCEPTED MYTH THE HEAVEN(THE UNIVERSE IS NO WHERE NEAR TO THE SIZE OF EARTH) WHAT DOES THIS COMPARISON OF SIZE MEAN BY THIS VERSET? DOES THIS TRY TO SAY EARTH IS NOT TINY AS WE THINK? OR THE OUR BELIEF OF EARTH'S REAL SIZE IS WRONG? ALMOST IMPOSSIBLE WITH SCIENCE.. BUT THEN WHAT?
AND COMPARE THIS VERSE GOD SAYS HE CREATED UNIVERSE (TOTAL) IN SIX DAYS OUT OF THAT, IT TOOK TOTAL 2 DAYS TO CREATE EARTH.. IMAGINE THE SIZE OF UNIVERSE AND THE EARTH. WHY IT TOOK 2 DAYS COMPARED TO EVER EXPANDING UNIVERSE WHICH CONTAINS SUN MOON ALL PLANETS AND STARS ETC.. HMM EARTH IS HABITABLE AND WITH ALL RESOURCES SO IT TOOK 2 DAYS COMPARED TO WHOLE OF UNIVERSE? IS IT FAIR ENOUGH OR IS SOMETHING ELSE.. OR EARTH AS BIG AS SKY :& :whatever:
The bold part. No such comparison between the Earth and the Sky is made in the verse.
(http://haqeeqat.pk/English%20Tafsir%20e%20Haqeeqat/00.Arabic%20Text/057.%20Al%20Hadid/057.%20B7.gif)
(http://haqeeqat.pk/English%20Tafsir%20e%20Haqeeqat/00.Arabic%20Text/057.%20Al%20Hadid/057.%20B8.gif)
You people emulously aim at taking the lead at seeking protection and forgiveness, which is transmitted to you as promise from your Sustainer Lord,
And take lead towards attaining Paradise from your Sustainer Lord ? Her extensiveness-wideness is like the sum of the wideness of the Sky [stretched into seven layers] and the Earth [seven layers].
Analogy is always between two objects. Width of Paradise is equated to the sum of width of the Sky and the Earth.
57:20-21 (http://haqeeqat.pk/English%20Tafsir%20e%20Haqeeqat/00.%20Individual%20Ayaat/057/057/057.20-21.htm)
There is conspiracy, there has always been conspiracy. Empires are conspirators and governments do lie and scam at will and very much and very deep, but I do not think that the semispherical rotating planet earth is part of the conspiracy.
There is no flat earth. Mountains humbly deny it. Oceans may comparatively flat. But landmass is not flat and the earth is not a round cake. Or how is it according to those who uphold flat earth. What shape is it? Is it a flat circle, a flat square? undetermined shape?
My feeling is that it is the flat earth what is a conspiracy meant to distract people who might be willing to revolt leading them into a useless revolting rather than letting them find a fair cause for revolt, of which there are quite a few.
As I said, there a psycholoogical component in all that fa rmore than a scientific component.
And what has been pointed out by Isa Muslim, this cocoon conception of the earth as the whole universe and us at the centre smacks of sheer fear of not being anything and distruat of the allpowerfulness of God. Us at the centre. Really? the centre of what or where is the centre of anything.
The fact is that only God is, and He is boudnless which is the reason He can create boundlessly, and we are just one of the boundless things He can create, and our planet one of those things also, which does not mean that we are not fully in his sight and care, because He is all powerful and ALLMERCIFUL, and that is why we exist at all.
Salaam
On the Last Day God will remove the mountains and leave the earth a level plain. Those who mocked will be enveloped by what they used to ridicule.
https://youtu.be/MusmZxC_5Ls
@ good Logic : stated ?Galaxies rotate anticlockwise east north west south...etc ?
Scientists believe that on large scales the Universe is isotropic (the same in all directions). Thus, from our perspective, half of all spiral galaxies should spin clockwise, and half counter-clockwise. A recent analysis of the spin of spiral galaxies confirms this.
@ good Logic : stated ?It is not a coincidence that circling the Kaaba is done anticlockwise( starting at east and going around north west south...) whether one believes hajj or not, the circling of people is done this way regardless??
Such a pagan way of thought and here comes to advise with book of God. Manifest Liar, where God has mentioned rotate the kaaba which is in makka anticlockwise. Then the pagans who were practicing it in sheer naked, before the advent of Mohamed could have been more worthy mentioning here. All pagans in the world have such a rounding craps.
Note below statements that?s what your beloved NASA (deceiver) teaches with their technology:
Every planet in our solar system except for Venus and Uranus rotates counter-clockwise as seen from above the North Pole; that is to say, from west to east. This is the same direction in which all the planets orbit the sun.
If viewed from above, Venus and Uranus rotates on its axis the opposite way that most planets rotate. That means on Venus and Uranus, the sun would appear to rise in the west and set in the east. On Earth, the sun appears to rise in the east and set in the west.
Almost all of the asteroids in our solar system are orbiting in a broad band 19,400,000 miles wide between Jupiter and Mars. The asteroids are orbiting the Sun, each one traveling around the Sun fast enough for the orbits not to degrade. ... In fact, Phobos and Diemos, the two tiny moons of Mars, may be captured asteroids.
The asteroids that pepper our solar system come in all shapes (not round), sizes and ages. What causes such a variety among space rocks has been something of a mystery, until now.
Researchers have been using a vast database to study a staggering 11,735 asteroids. They have discovered that asteroids change shape over time, and they think they know the reason why.
Most asteroids lie in a vast ring between the orbits of Mars and Jupiter. This main asteroid belt holds more than 200 asteroids larger than 60 miles (100 km) in diameter. ... Not everything in the main belt is an asteroid ? Ceres, once thought of only as an asteroid, is now also considered a dwarf planet.
For many years scientists have studied our own solar system. But until the last few years, we knew of no other solar systems. This may seem surprising, as the Sun is one of about 200 billion stars (or perhaps more) just in the Milky Way galaxy alone.
All in all, Hubble reveals an estimated 100 billion galaxies in the universe or so, but this number is likely to increase to about 200 billion as telescope technology in space improves, Livio said.
In terms of the number of solar systems present in the universe, there are something like 300 billion stars in the Milky Way, so if 10 per cent of them have planets there are around 30 billion planets in our galaxy alone, and there are over 100 billion galaxies in the observable Universe
NASA's Kepler Space Telescope, astronomers have discovered the first Earth-size planet orbiting it's sun in the "habitable zone" -- the range of distance from a star where liquid water might pool on the surface of an orbiting planet. The discovery of Kepler-186f confirms that planets the size of Earth exist in the habitable zone of stars other than our sun.
While planets have previously been found in the habitable zone, they are all at least 40 percent larger in size than Earth and understanding their makeup is challenging. Kepler-186f is more reminiscent of Earth.
Kepler-186f orbits its star once every 130-days and receives one-third the energy from its star that Earth gets from the sun, placing it nearer the outer edge of the habitable zone. On the surface of Kepler-186f, the brightness of its star at high noon is only as bright as our sun appears to us about an hour before sunset.
@ good Logic : posed. ?Why do stars, planets, moons...spin?
Coz the Massive EARTH is stationary (receptacle, cradle, concave but flattened for the ease of people that?s quran) . Dude, Unless they spin, we won?t get things right on earth. It?s like instead of focusing the light to the stage, chooses to spin the stage to light.. That?s the story. No planets, take it or leave it..
Does
Note: All above from Google search which NASA confirms. You can search.
just add this also to the list of myth....
In November 2013, astronomers reported, based on Kepler space mission data, that there could be as many as 40 billion Earth-sized planets orbiting in the habitable zones of Sun-like stars and red dwarfs in the Milky Way, 11 billion of which may be orbiting Sun-like stars.
Hey folks quran talks of only one Sun and Moon and constellation.. and that same sun and moon will not overtake each other and one day both of them will be joined, that same quran says created the heavens and earth in many many many places.. if you stick to NASA then better forget the God and creations. i wonder what else these NASA would bring forth in future? Words of Human overpowered to your brains..Still shamelessly say quran supports.. I think all these who support NASA are bunch Hypocrites in this forum standing as believers to divert people. Beware O true believers!
You are right Manny-E,, as you stated old book mentions just an example one sun and one moon...That's what quran mentions. You got it right, but unfortunately so quran called believers didn't it get right. I don't care whether it you get right or wrong, it's your fate..
I wonder to whom you referred monkey.. if it is to me, then You think it hurts me.. Hmm not... how far i have cultivated as a person you have no idea. It's all from quran i am living with. Such teasing will never hurt the true believers. You know what hurts believers your destiny which you gonna face eternally without anyone there to been helped. Honestly it hurts me when i think of it. Coz i can't bear the fire, i wonder you can.. wish you can, coz you have the same skin like me.
These are clearly a response of a defeated person who knows what is truth.. Yes our knowledge level is on dark age level, coz we love what is written on that book which your eyes cannot perceive..
take these below craps also to your knowledge, O NASA believers.
Olympus Mons (tallest mountain of the universe)
Olympus Mons on Mars is the tallest mountain on the planet and yet the youngest of the large mountains. Olympus Mons is twice as tall as Earth's Mount Everest. Olympus Mons' elevation above the mean surface level is over 15 miles high, which males it the highest mountain in Solar System on that measure scale.Dec 21, 2013 ( i think that would take quite a bit of time to get powdered on the day of Resurrection, what a name by the way.. Olympus)
Moons of the Universe
As of October 2008, there are 181 known natural moons orbiting planets in our Solar System. 173 moons orbit the "full-size" planets (Mercury, Venus, Earth, Mars, Jupiter, Saturn, Uranus, and Neptune), while 8 moons orbit the smaller "dwarf planets" (Ceres, Pluto, Haumea, Makemake, and Eris).
The terrestrial planets, Mars, Earth, Venus, and Mercury only have three moons between them (Mars has two, Phobos and Deimos, and the Earth has one). The Jovian planets, by contrast, are teeming with moons: At latest count, Jupiter has 67, Saturn has over 60, Uranus has 27, and Neptune has 14.
Main group or Galilean moons: Io, Europa, Ganymede and Callisto. They are some of the largest objects in the Solar System outside the Sun and the eight planets in terms of mass and are larger than any known dwarf planet. Ganymedeexceeds even the planet Mercury in diameter.
The Galilean moons are the four largest moons of Jupiter?Io, Europa, Ganymede, and Callisto. They were first seen by Galileo Galilei in January 1610, and recognized by him as satellites of Jupiter in March 1610. They are the first objects found to orbit another planet. Their names derive from the lovers of Zeus.
O True God Believers! God Created everything and He named and taught to Adam with precise names as Sun, Moon, Stars, Earth, Mountains, etc. But these NASA and their ancestors have named as they like in line with their own God or their nations faith.. (such as Mercury, Venus, Mars, Jupiter, Saturn, Uranus, and Neptune, Galilean moons, Io, Europa, Ganymede and Callisto, Phobos and Deimos).
I wonder God forgot to name them, :rotfl: :rotfl: Which moon God referred in 54:1 will be split? ::) and which moon will be joined with Sun? :rotfl:
craps of satan that tastes nice to some of the lip-service funny, foolish people and think that they can understand quran and elaborate to others.. Just same insane hypocrites only will believe in you and not shrewd and God guided ones. They will go far and far away from your blasphemy
HERE ARE THOSE GODS / GODDESS YOU FOOLISHLY WORSHIP:
Cronus (Saturn) In Greek mythology, Cronus was the son of Uranus and Gaea. He lead his brothers and sisters, the Titans, in a revolt against their father and became the king of the gods. He married the Titan Rhea.
Mercury, Latin Mercurius, in Roman religion, god of shopkeepers and merchants, travelers and transporters of goods, and thieves and tricksters. He is commonly identified with the Greek Hermes, the fleet-footed messenger of the gods.
In Roman mythology, Venus was the goddess of love, sex, beauty, and fertility. She was the Roman counterpart to the Greek Aphrodite. However, Roman Venus had many abilities beyond the Greek Aphrodite; she was a goddess of victory, fertility, and even prostitution.
Pluto was the Roman god of the underworld and the judge of the dead. Pluto is an alternative name for the Greek god Hades, but was more often used in Roman mythology in their presentation of the god of the underworld. He abducted Proserpina (Gr.Persephone), and her mother Ceres
Ouranos - Uranus. Uranus the primal Greek god personifying the sky. His equivalent in Roman mythology was Caelus. In Ancient Greek literature, Uranus or Father Sky was the son and husband of Gaia, Mother Earth.
Jupiter - King of the Gods - Crystalinks. Jupiter is the supreme god of the Romanpantheon, called dies pater, "shining father". He is a god of light and sky, and protector of the state and its laws. He is a son of Saturn and brother of Neptune and Juno (who is also his wife).
Neptune was the name that ancient Romans gave to the Greek god of the sea and earthquakes, Poseidon. He was the brother of Jupiter (Zeus) and of Pluto (Hades).
In ancient Roman religion and myth, Mars (Latin: Mārs, [maːrs]) was the god of war and also an agricultural guardian, a combination characteristic of early Rome. He was second in importance only to Jupiter and he was the most prominent of the military gods in the religion of the Roman army.
Phobos was the god of fear in Greek mythology, son of the gods Ares andAphrodite. He was the brother of Deimos (terror), Harmonia (harmony), Adrestia, Eros (love), Anteros, Himerus, and Pothos.
List goes on for all, even to all those moons they have their goddess names..
They have used all Gods/ Goddess of Greek and Romans Latins names just point at their worship of Sun based alleged imaginary planets.. Same NASA kept continuing those names and you can imagine from where these theories cropped up to NASA to conspire..
There is limit to foolishness O intelligent people..
Quote from: IsaMuslim on May 03, 2018, 12:00:04 PM
This demonstrates that you don't even care reading what I write.
However I continue to write because this discussion may be useful for other people reading in the future.
If you take into consideration a few verses alone of course you won't understand nothing.
Actually the Quran preceded the theory of evolution, and in it is clear that our creation was not instantaneous and took various steps.
Have those who rejected not seen that the heavens and the earth were one piece, so We split them apart? And that We have made from the WATER EVERYTHING THAT LIVES. Will they not believe?
(21:30)
The above verse states that ALL LIVING THINGS, including us, were created from water.
And to Thamud was their brother Saleh. He said: "O my people, serve God, you have no god besides Him. He has established/produced you from the earth, and has made you settle in it; so seek His forgiveness, then repent to Him. My Lord is Near, Responsive."
(11:61)
The above verse says that we were made from the earth. All the other say equivalent words, like "clay"; but the meaning is that our body comes from the same matter of this planet.
And We created you, THEN We shaped you, THEN We said to the angels: "Yield to Adam;" so they yielded except for Satan, he was not of those who yielded.
(7:110)
The One who has created you, THEN evolved/fashioned/proportioned you, THEN made you upright?
In any which picture He chooses, He places you.
(82:7-8)
can WIDE or SPACIOUS be understood.as BALL?
nothing impossible in the GLOBE!!!
I did tell you in my previous reply that none of the verse you provided gives ANY indication that the EARTH is Globe/Spin/Orbit/Float
YET here you doing the same again.
AND I dont even know where to start!!
You were rambling more than addressing the issue.
its all of ZERO substance not worthy a reply.
Like your Globe Earth, your response too makes my head SPINNING in trying to understand it.
AND why are you making it difficult when His words already made PRECISED, DETAILED and EASY for you to understand?
reading from your reply, it takes
a Rocket Scientist to understand what you understood of His verse.
Cant you find any plain simple straight forward verse that says The Earth a Globe/Spin/Orbit/Float?
OR there ISNT any that you force/abrogate it to be one.
here I show you what it meant by PRECISED.
10:5 It is He who made the sun a shining light and the moon a derived light
my Lord taught me,
both SUN and MOON produced LIGHT respectively
Sun the Shinning Light
Moon the derived (smaller) Light
PRECISED yet EASY to understand
Does your Globe Earth teacher teach you the same?
Quote from: good logic on May 03, 2018, 01:54:25 PM
Peace lime juice.
You mean this understanding of Qoran is alien to you?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3n3ttEA1rbs
Or she is also deluded like the rest of us?
Surely this goes against your understanding of the verses as well!!!!
So you are right? Sorry you and jkhan.
No.The lady in the link is more sound as far as I can tell
Me ,I think like your earth you are both standing still.
GOD bless you.
Peace.
when you mentioned Kaabah and people go around it in anti clockwise
my take to your knowledge of the Scripture went DOWNHILL!!!
BUT since its NOT the TOPIC of discussion, I shall just leave your delusional doctrine to yourself.
rather to REFLECT on His VERSE, you brought a video here to educate us on your make believe Globe Earth theory.that CLEARLY has NO SUPPORTS in His SCRIPTURE.
Like the religionist, you too have taken your scholar to be the teacher of Quran.
Did I tell you whoever than Him that teaches the Quran is SATAN!!
yup!! they are all SATAN to be.
By the way, I stop watching the video when the narrator mentioned PLANET in Quran
You dont believe in Quran anymore?
Please dont shoot me, Im only the messenger that bring the verse to you
AND here Im asking you AGAIN
where is the exact location of the PROTECTED CEILING in your Globe Earth.
Even your video agrees God adorned the First HEAVEN with LAMP...
meaning the FIRMAMENT EXIST!!!
so pls tell me where exactly in the Globe Earth the PROTECTED CEILING located?
The TOP,, .RIGHT-SIDE LEFT-SIDE or at the BOTTOM of the Globe Earth?
AND try be more LOGICAL with your reply pls..
Quote from: lime juice on May 04, 2018, 07:10:21 AM
can WIDE or SPACIOUS be understood.as BALL?
nothing impossible in the GLOBE!!!
Can WIDE or SPACIOUS be understood as PLANE?
It is clear that the verse is not talking about the
SHAPE of the Earth, rather it is talking about the blessing that we have received that the Earth is spacious.
Quote from: lime juice on May 04, 2018, 07:10:21 AM
I did tell you in my previous reply that none of the verse you provided gives ANY indication that the EARTH is Globe/Spin/Orbit/Float
YET here you doing the same again.
I DID provide you an instance that could give an indication that the earth is floating in an orbit. Of course you ignored it, even if I reminded you.
I will quote myself:
Quote from: IsaMuslim on May 03, 2018, 12:00:04 PM
I already told you that THE SUN AND THE MOON BOTH SWIM IN AN ORBIT
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sun#Orbit_in_Milky_Way
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Orbit_of_the_Moon
Also this verse hints that also the earth swims in an orbit with the sun and the moon:
لَا الشَّمْسُ يَنبَغِي لَهَا أَن تُدْرِكَ الْقَمَرَ وَلَا اللَّيْلُ سَابِقُ النَّهَارِ وَكُلٌّ فِي فَلَكٍ يَسْبَحُونَ
I don't speak arabic, but many confirm this; see this website http://www.quranmiracles.com/2011/03/all-afloat-in-orbits/
Quote from: lime juice on May 04, 2018, 07:10:21 AM
AND I dont even know where to start!!
You were rambling more than addressing the issue.
its all of ZERO substance not worthy a reply.
Like your Globe Earth, your response too makes my head SPINNING in trying to understand it.
That is because you don't try to understand.
Quote from: lime juice on May 04, 2018, 07:10:21 AM
AND why are you making it difficult when His words already made PRECISED, DETAILED and EASY for you to understand?
reading from your reply, it takes
a Rocket Scientist to understand what you understood of His verse.
Cant you find any plain simple straight forward verse that says The Earth a Globe/Spin/Orbit/Float?
OR perhaps there ISNT any but you force it to be one.
It's nothing complicated! I'm not twisting anything.
The verse says that the sun has an orbit -> the science confirms it.
The verse says that the moon has an orbit -> the science confirms it.
The verse says
NOT "both of them in an orbit they swim", but it says
"they all in an orbit swim" and it didn't use the Arabic dual, meaning that the objects were 3 or more.
Quote from: lime juice on May 04, 2018, 07:10:21 AM
here I show you what it meant by PRECISED.
10:5 It is He who made the sun a shining light and the moon a derived light
my Lord taught me,
both SUN and MOON produced LIGHT respectively
Sun the Shinning Light
Moon the derived (smaller) Light
PRECISED yet EASY to understand
Does your Globe Earth teacher teach you the same?
هُوَ الَّذِي جَعَلَ الشَّمْسَ ضِيَاءً وَالْقَمَرَ نُورًا وَقَدَّرَهُ مَنَازِلَ لِتَعْلَمُوا عَدَدَ السِّنِينَ وَالْحِسَابَ مَا خَلَقَ اللَّهُ ذَٰلِكَ إِلَّا بِالْحَقِّ يُفَصِّلُ الْآيَاتِ لِقَوْمٍ يَعْلَمُونَHe is the One who has made the sun a radiance, and the moon a light, and He has measured its phases; that you may know the number of the years and the count. God has not created this except with the truth. He clarifies the revelations for a people who know.(10:5 - The Monotheist Group)
The fact that God distinguishes between the Sun being "diyaan" and the Moon being "nur" is because the Sun is a "shining light".
21:48 God has given Moses and Aaron something which is described as a "Criterion" (Furqan), and a "Shining Light" (Diyaan).
24:35 and 2:17 are an example that a "diyaan" is something that
illuminates, and the Moon was not called like this exactly because
it doesn't have its own light.
Peace lime juice.
So you stopped watching?
That tells me that you have the "my mind is made up" attitude!!!!
No need to waste any more time discussing here if you stop reading and watching.
Unlike you, I respect every post and read/watch all the contents.
Fairness and honesty requires this from us.
Thank you and GOD bless you.
Peace.
Quote from: IsaMuslim on May 04, 2018, 07:58:53 AM
Can WIDE or SPACIOUS be understood as PLANE?
It is clear that the verse is not talking about the SHAPE of the Earth, rather it is talking about the blessing that we have received that the Earth is spacious.
WIDE as FOOTBALL FIELD
OR
WIDE as a BALL makes more sense to you?
Do you think God to confuse us with His message when He said its PRECISED, DETAILED and EASY??
Quote from: IsaMuslim on May 04, 2018, 07:58:53 AM
I DID provide you an instance that could give an indication that the earth is floating in an orbit. Of course you ignored it, even if I reminded you.
I will quote myself:
Quote from: IsaMuslim on Yesterday at 09:00:04 AM
I already told you that THE SUN AND THE MOON BOTH SWIM IN AN ORBIT
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sun#Orbit_in_Milky_Way
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Orbit_of_the_Moon
Also this verse hints that also the earth swims in an orbit with the sun and the moon:
لَا الشَّمْسُ يَنبَغِي لَهَا أَن تُدْرِكَ الْقَمَرَ وَلَا اللَّيْلُ سَابِقُ النَّهَارِ وَكُلٌّ فِي فَلَكٍيَسْبَحُونَ
I don't speak arabic, but many confirm this; see this website http://www.quranmiracles.com/2011/03/all-afloat-in-orbits/
It's nothing complicated! I'm not twisting anything.
The verse says that the sun has an orbit -> the science confirms it.
The verse says that the moon has an orbit -> the science confirms it.
The verse says NOT "both of them in an orbit they swim", but it says "they all in an orbit swim" and it didn't use the Arabic dual, meaning that the objects were 3 or more.
From the verse you quoted;
It is He who created the night and the day,
and the sun, and the moon; each of them floating in an orbit.
AND you said this:-
The verse says that the sun has an orbit ->
the science confirms it.
The verse says that the moon has an orbit ->
the science confirms it.
You continue saying the verse gives you the HINT that Earth is FLOATING!!!
In QURAN, we are not ALLOWED to follow any ALLEGORY/ASSUMPTION in understanding of His verse this because He had made it PRECISED, DETAILED and EASY to understand.
AND here you share your belief based on 'HINTING' verse!!
Anyway, do you know what ORBIT in Quran means?
Im not going to correct you but for your own good,
do look up in the dictionary for its meaning and do the correction yourself.
When done, do come back and see if your 'HINT' belief still practical or just another delusional thought.
Quote from: IsaMuslim on May 04, 2018, 07:58:53 AM
هُوَ الَّذِي جَعَلَ الشَّمْسَ ضِيَاءً وَالْقَمَرَ نُورًا وَقَدَّرَهُ مَنَازِلَ لِتَعْلَمُوا عَدَدَ السِّنِينَ وَالْحِسَابَ مَا خَلَقَ اللَّهُ ذَٰلِكَ إِلَّا بِالْحَقِّ يُفَصِّلُ الْآيَاتِ لِقَوْمٍ يَعْلَمُونَ
He is the One who has made the sun a radiance, and the moon a light, and He has measured its phases; that you may know the number of the years and the count. God has not created this except with the truth. He clarifies the revelations for a people who know.
(10:5 - The Monotheist Group)
The fact that God distinguishes between the Sun being "diyaan" and the Moon being "nur" is because the Sun is a "shining light".
21:48 God has given Moses and Aaron something which is described as a "Criterion" (Furqan), and a "Shining Light" (Diyaan).
24:35 and 2:17 are an example that a "diyaan" is something that illuminates, and the Moon was not called like this exactly because it doesn't have its own light.
BASIC QURAN UNDERSTANDING
when there is ONLY 1 verse to say something that has no.other supports in Quran
the benefits can be given to the reader to tafseer how he deemed best in his understanding of the message
BUT when there are two verses or more that also says the same, HE means it!! Period!!!
10::5 It is He who made the sun a shining light
and the moon a derived light
25:61 Blessed is He who has placed in the sky great stars
and placed therein a lamp
and luminous moon.
71:16 And made the moon therein a light
and made the sun a burning lamp
Oops!!!! your GLOBE teacher taught you wrong AGAIN!!!
AND youre welcome
Quote from: good logic on May 04, 2018, 08:43:01 AM
Peace lime juice.
So you stopped watching?
That tells me that you have the "my mind is made up" attitude!!!!
No need to waste any more time discussing here if you stop reading and watching.
Unlike you, I respect every post and read/watch all the contents.
Fairness and honesty requires this from us.
Thank you and GOD bless you.
Peace.
show me the word PLANET or SPACE in Quran that been quoted by the narrator please...
If NO, like I said uou have taken your scholar as your god
Simple yet Good Logic!!!
this is so funny
When the verse said He raised the Heaven high and Earth He spreads it WIDE
you tafseer it as this
Quote from: IsaMuslim on May 04, 2018, 07:58:53 AM
It is clear that the verse is not talking about the SHAPE of the Earth, rather it is talking about the blessing that we have received that the Earth is spacious.
eeerr you forgot the HEAVEN!!!
wait!! lemme try..
we shld be grateful.that the HEAVEN is HIGH otherwise we.will hit it when we.stand
hahahahahahahaha
AND here you accuse me of taking only 1 verse to understand the message
Khan G keep your good work. It thrills my mind, explanations are amazing. And your tone speaks of your heart.God bless you.
Isa: Yeah Torah is mentioned diyan, but note carefully quran is mentioned as Nur. Does it mean quran doesn't have it's own light? Don't try to be silly while giving interpretation to Quran. Torah is much large and full of explanation for everything and it is book of series of prophets.. Not identical to Quran which is but confirmation of Torah and Injeel.
Moon has its own light as QURAN has its own light.
I was reading most of the topics in this forum, and this topic enlightend me. But I never commented anything since I felt lazy to register. Anyhow, I registered Now just to give thanks to wonderful explanation of Khan.
Peace to all and seek guidance with pure heart, probably Allah open His mercy. Also my dear brothers and sisters and elders, don't get carried away for pride in this forum so that people would applaud you. Iblees waits for chances. Most seems on such manner, that's clear to a silent reader. Keep your intentions pure and not to show off.
Mr.khan. pls explain me 53:49. Since you cleared me from these Greek gods I would love to hear from you. I have read many people say in their websites as Sirius but after I read your posts here I feel that has to be a different meaning something which suits to that verse and surrounded verses. Even if u send me a private message. Fine.
Salam again to all
Common lime juice, you know very well Arabic words have many meanings according to context.
The word "Samaa" can mean heaven or space above or universe or.. depending on the context of the verse.
Or are you restricting Qoran to your vocabulary and "one word translation" regardless of context?
Similarly words like "madda" the earth or other similar words that you are claiming can only mean a "flat earth" can mean "made it habitable", "expanded it" ...etc? GOD speaks about our earth specifically every time the creation of the universe is mentioned simply because:
A- GOD is addressing us its inhabitants.
B- GOD made it the only planet habitable and able to sustain life.
C- Measured its components including the provisions, oxygen, minerals, water...etc and prepared it well for us
If you insist on closing your eyes to reality please do not close your mind as well!
Your choice and beliefs.
There is nothing more for me to add.I think it is ridiculus we are even discussing
GOD bless you.
Peace.
Quote from: good logic on May 04, 2018, 11:38:31 AM
I think it is ridiculus we are even discussing
True.
Topgun, lime juice, jkhan, can you name anyone who has been to the edge of the earth
in all of history? :hmm
Good ogic and Hawk with your weak argument last few answers with desperation shows you are defeated outright. Coz you were talking but with your pride and with your preconceived perceptions. It seemed to me throughout the course of this argument you were biased to your scholars and not presenting quran in its own meaning. But Jkhan was sticking with Quran that's so obvious by his explanation. I think you both still follow hadith of bukhari and Nasa.
I am aware my response won't taste pleasant to you. But you deserve it. Stop misguiding people for the sake of God. Go back read Quran carefully again and again and then argue. The way Glogic explained anticlockwise.. I knew his innermost self. And Hawk, keel on asking edges same as one who is on the edge of belief.
Jkhan: I am remaining with the anticipation of interpretation of 53:49 .. It seems you didn't come online since yesterday. Pls consider it with priority. I know guidance from God but curious to know your answer. If you missed my point pls go back and read previous pages in this forum where I have my request.. Peace to all
Quote from: Topgun on May 04, 2018, 09:37:11 PM
I think you still follow hadith of bukhari and Nasa.
You don't have to think, just ask.
Do you have an answer for this:
Quote from: hawk99 on May 04, 2018, 09:08:47 PM
Topgun, lime juice, jkhan, can you name anyone who has been to the edge of the earth
in all of history? :hmm
(https://media.giphy.com/media/ToMjGpz81S7usvTIM8w/giphy.gif)
Clearly depict the mental picture. Defeat accepted. :elektro:. That's a good sign for this forum. You are exposed
@topgn
I think you have a clear answer other than Sirius for 53:49 that's clear by your request. Glad to hear few true believers around and they believe not in round crap... Anyway no need your appreciations, coz I can't guid u, only God chooses whome to place his guidance. Just get attached to verses of Quran and get near to you Lord.
Yes dear tgun it's not Sirius. Let me first clear to you what is actually Sirius is.
"SEIRIOS (Sirius) was the god or goddess of the Dog-Star, the brightest star of the constellation Canis Major. The pre-dawn rising of the star in the path of the sun was believed to be the source of the scorching heat and droughts of midsummer."
"Seirios appears in many guises in myth. He or she was variously described as Maira (Maera) daughter of the Titan Atlas, Maira the dog of the hero Ikarios (Icarius), Lailaps (Laelaps) the hound of Orion, and Kyon Khryseos the golden-hound of Zeus. It may also have been associated with Orthros ("Morning Twilight") the hound of Geryon, giant of the west. The star was no doubt also connected with the dog-loving goddess Hekate who was the daughter of Perses "the Destroyer" and Asteria "the Starry One."
Now you know from where this name arises and to whom it is important. Most already know about these god's n goddesses of ancient.
Let me present the verses where it apears
53:45-50
" And that He creates the pairs male and female, from drops of semen when emitted, and that upon Him is Another bringing forth, And that it is He (God) who gives much or little, And that it is He, Lord (Shi'ra), and that it is He who destroyed the former 'Ad' and Thamud. He spared none of them."
Verses goes in that way..
Here Shi'ra is not Sirius as most translated with bias to Hadith. How God would accept another accepted false god and refer I am the Lord of such god which is in fact not god.
With the flow of verses before and after 53:49 is not supporting any relevance to Sirius.
And the word Shi'ra itself has no resembling the word Sirius.
ش ع ر is no way near to Sirius, Sirius starts with س and not withش as Shi'ra and Sirius ends with S while not Shi'ra. So no resemblance either.
According to the flow of verses around it, most appropriate meaning to it Perceptiblity / Preceptor
"And it is He the Lord of Perceptiblity." that's why He gives much and little and that's why He destroyed the Ad and Thamud and people of Noah coz He perceives as non can perceive like Him.
Not in every language people call to each and every star by name, but only those who accepted those stars to be their God has kept names to it.
Prophet Ibrahim saw a star and He didn't call it Sirius or any name. But He called Sun and Moon n Star.. .
Myth will get destroyed or die with those who believe in them...
God called Himself as
Lord of east, west, day break, man, Arsh, earth heaven, all beings (alamin) this city, Your, our. My, and so many but not Sirius (allegedly accepted ancient god). In the same chapter few gods name mentioned 53:19-20 but not Sirius. Take examples from Prophet Ibrahim verse 6:74-78 it's clear.
As far as my memory with Quran I don't see verses which refer to heavenly bodies to state Lord of Sun, Lord of Moon, Lord of Star. My memory can be weak, if there is any let me know, so that I can recollect with right thing..
But anyhow Sirius is not what God mentioned in verse 53:49. There is no need for God to bring a Greek or Egyptian god into limelight.
For some Islamic websites, this verse is miracle and licking the foots of NASA..
Quote from: good logic on May 04, 2018, 11:38:31 AM
Common lime juice, you know very well Arabic words have many meanings according to context.
The word "Samaa" can mean heaven or space above or universe or.. depending on the context of the verse.
Or are you restricting Qoran to your vocabulary and "one word translation" regardless of context?
Similarly words like "madda" the earth or other similar words that you are claiming can only mean a "flat earth" can mean "made it habitable", "expanded it" ...etc? GOD speaks about our earth specifically every time the creation of the universe is mentioned simply because:
A- GOD is addressing us its inhabitants.
B- GOD made it the only planet habitable and able to sustain life.
C- Measured its components including the provisions, oxygen, minerals, water...etc and prepared it well for us
If you insist on closing your eyes to reality please do not close your mind as well!
Your choice and beliefs.
There is nothing more for me to add.I think it is ridiculus we are even discussing
GOD bless you.
Peace.
like KAABA only to mean the Cube in Mecca where thronged of people circumbalate it you mean?
all you mentioned regards space (salat) planet (hajj) universe (sawm), galaxies (zakat) only comes from the HADITH of NASA & Co (BUKHARI & Co) that you been taught since young and still today with the sci-fi movies (you-tube debate/preaching) to support your make believe doctrine thats aldy been emblazzoned into your skull.
(Im not saying hajj, salat, zakat sawm not in Quran but the approached in understanding His mesaage are similarly done by those whose hearts are evil
- taking outside source to understand the Quran)
hear this and hear it well
1. i read full all your statement with understanding but not any outside source u brought that only to deviate me away from His message
2. If u out to find faults in Quran, you will find aplenty as you pointed out case in point.
3. There are NOTHING WRONG with the tradional translation, if NOT the exact message spoken by the LORD, its the closest for us to understand His message
4. Quran translators have much better knowledge in understanding the language that all of you combined.
But like us they too been taught by the 'Guardian of the Book' to BELIEVE all UNTRANSLATED ARABIC words as proper noun (hajj, salat, kaaba, etc)
The agenda set by the 'Guardian' to make us lost in our translations and refer to Hadith for its 'proper' explanation.
5. Read and understand QURAN with a clear mind without any interference from outside make believe source that only to influence your mind in deviating away from it (Quran)
(This is the common mistake done today even from the so-called Quran alone believers)
6. You read His SCRIPTURE once every blue moon but the FALSE DOCTRINE that you been taught since young were played unto you every other day!!
Satan is SLEEK in his works.
7. HIS BOOK(s) are PROTECTED that even the tradional translators dare not to change it...
dont be that FOOL to change/abrogate to your liking.
He well aware of your deeds.
5:17 " And to the Lord BELONGS the dominion of the HEAVENS and the EARTH and whatever is BETWEEN THEM
---- do you think sun comes between heaven and earth that all belongs to Him?
Quote from: hawk99 on May 04, 2018, 09:08:47 PM
True.
Topgun, lime juice, jkhan, can you name anyone who has been to the edge of the earth
in all of history? :hmm
no one ever set foot at the edge of the earth otherwise he will falls off to space
**facepalm**
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/C67wxRAWcAAkizB?format=jpg)
Thx Khan. And that's what I comprehended even before you explained it. Unfortunately, I was behind the curtain all these years considering it to be as Sirius and never ever thought otherwise. Unless Allah would have inserted the word Jupiter instead of Sirius in this verse to give more support to Greek myth. Or else He would have explained Sirius, as you know what Sirius is? Same way he explains Tariq (86:1-3) It makes perfect sense to me throughout. All stars have benefits to us as it showed way in dark nights, it's gorgeous, it has other purposes too chasing Satan away. but I don't see any benefit of planets and their moons. When I read others statements my head spins. I don't wanna comment more. Salam to all
Salaam,
I think it's not the stars used to chase the satan away (and also the human, if they can make it), but a kind of intense heat/projectile/flame of fire. Stars has their clear path in the sky. I have put my opinion on this in here,
https://free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9610135.msg415043#msg415043
The more I think about it the more convinced I am that they already knew something.
https://www.nasa.gov/content/goddard/van-allen-probes-spot-impenetrable-barrier-in-space
They are not stupid at all, but they have to twist the truth to make profit from it.
Peace
Quote from: lime juice on May 05, 2018, 12:58:01 AM
no one ever set foot at the edge of the earth otherwise he will falls off to space
**facepalm**
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/C67wxRAWcAAkizB?format=jpg)
I wonder what lies beyond the Antarctic wall. In fact it reminds me that wall in Game of Thrones.
The ice wall in the landscapes of the brain...
Salaam
Quote from: The Sardar on May 05, 2018, 07:01:21 AM
I wonder what lies beyond the Antarctic wall. In fact it reminds me that wall in Game of Thrones.
Its not what's beyond but what's above that matters
the Edge of the Antartica are still attached to the heaven or ceiling.
We are in a DOME and like it or not,
we cant get out.
21:32 And We made the sky a protected ceiling, but they, from its signs, are turning away.
13:2 He Who raised the heavens without any pillars
AND no Men nor Jinn can penetrate through that PROTECTED CEILING without His approval:-
55:33 O company of jinn and mankind, if you are able to pass beyond the ZONES of the heavens and the earth, then pass.
You will not pass except by authority
Come the end of time, He will levelled the mountains FLATTEN as the EARTH
18:47 And the day on which We will cause the mountains to pass away and you will see the earth a levelled plain and We will gather them and leave not any one of them behind.
When its all over (judgement day)
He will rolled everything back together like He first began;
Heaven and Earth will become ONE again.
21:104 The Day when We will fold the heaven like the folding of a [written] sheet for the records.
As We began the first creation, We will repeat it.
[That is] a promise binding upon Us. Indeed, We will do it.
Earth is NOT a PLANET that is floating but foundation to Heaven
AND everthing that comes between them belongs to Him.
20:6 To Him belongs what is in the heavens and what is on the earth and what is between them and what is under the
(https://galeri14.uludagsozluk.com/818/dunyamizin-ucte-ikisi-sudur_1469512.jpg)
All the above were of His SIGNS,
deny it only at your own peril
2:39 And those who disbelieve and deny Our signs - those will be companions of the Fire; they will abide therein eternally."
10:108 Say, "O mankind, the truth has come to you from your Lord, so whoever is guided is only guided for his soul, and whoever goes astray only goes astray against it.
And I am not over you a manager.
https://free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9609156.0
Jkhan suggested me to read the above link seems useful, so copied the link to enliven you. Read the link. to some extent flat earth was discussed previously, and quite few who opposed 2 years before has changed to flat earth now. God bless them. peace
people may not.know this but real reason for Globe Earth theory being planted into us since young is not to question their agenda:-
A doctrine to deny the Lord of the Universe creations,
ultimately His existence.
Solar system otherwise known as Heliocentric model is not called for nothing but for us to acknowledge
Helio the sun God to be the center of
attention for all other god/goddess (planet) to worship him thats in the middle.
AND that include us in EARTH that surprisingly does not shocked people here that the so-called planet Earth is the ONLY planet that not named after any God/Goddess.
Masked behind science and wlith no limitation to budget
they able to spread their doctrine into school without any problem because it has been carefully crafted and designed as learning purposes.
Do you think money an issue to deviate mankind away from the Truth?
OR do you really think Bukhari & Co is the reason for His scripture to be send to us?
how ignorant can one be into believing such fables in the Solar system as the Truth when He has already explained all in detailed.
Dont you believe in His words anymore?
9:33 They want to extinguish the light of God with their mouths, but the Lord refuses except to perfect His light, although the disbelievers dislike it.
whoever behind fhis is the follower of the RELIGION that worshipped the Sun as their God mentioned in Quran that
Satan are only too happy to assist only for the fools to follow blindly like a donkey.
Heck!! we even have people believed we are the descendants of MONKEYS said Science.
what are His SIGNS that to deny will enter Hellfire forever?
not perfoming Hajj/Salat/Sawm
OR DENY HIS CREATIONS.mentioned in His Book?
THINK and think logical!!
3:54 And the disbelievers planned, but the Lord planned.
And the Lord is the best of planners.
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Cripx2FUMAAjnBJ?format=jpg)
Peace All.
Like I said it is becoming ridiculous discussing this topic. Beyond the joke
We have the means to travel anywhere on earth and beyond ,yet no one has seen the edge of the flat earth or a flat earth for that matter ?
The rockets that you see on the news(Like the one sent to Mars the other day) including the ones sent by Europe, Russia and China in the past are just conspiracies?
So far we have no "real" picture of what our earth looks like, all the globes you see are fakes and conspiracies?
I have yet to see a valid reason for faking what earth looks like?
All I can say is:
Quasars shift red
Hot suns burn blue
Space is warped
Earth is also warped
and so are you
I mean all of us who believe the conspiracies are warped!!!!
As for being defeated, I say we are "flattened".
Really! Well what goes around comes around.
GOD bless you all.
Peace.
Quote from: lime juice on May 05, 2018, 02:16:14 PM
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Cripx2FUMAAjnBJ?format=jpg)
Come on, that is ridiculous.
Glogic : We have the means to travel anywhere on earth and beyond ,yet no one has seen the edge of the flat earth or a flat earth for that matter"
IF SO REJECT THESE VERSE
55:33-35 " O company of jinn and mankind, if you are able to pass beyond the ZONES of the heavens and the earth, then pass. So which of the favors of your Lord would you deny? will not pass except by authority. There will be sent upon you a flame of fire and smoke, and you will not defend yourselves."
So you think God has given this authority? Beyond will be never. Just roam around inside. That's all. Not to extreme edge of heaven or earth.. Shame not even able to penetrate earth zones and dreaming of heaven which even Jin are failed. 72"8-9 "And we have sought to touch the heaven but found it filled with powerful guards and burning flames, and we (Jin) used to sit therein in positions for hearing, but whoever listens now will find a burning flame lying in wait for him."
Sheer proof, but u r blind. You can't get guidance coz your heart not ready to accept God's verses, and His verses not enough for you and didn't give concrete meaning to you. Surrender first to God, then read. Change yourself or get doomed. You are not with God but filled with fancy words of men and Jin.. You forgot God test hearts..
True believers would have submitted seeing all these proofs. For example, Mosa produced real miracle and those well versed magicians knew instantly that what Mosa produced was not magic. Coz these knew what is magic and what is not magic. So immediately submitted.. That's true people and true surrenders and not you.. For me you seems doomed. God save and let me hear otherswise. I think you go under category as God says, " they had great knowledge but in vain.."
Isamuslim / what is ridiculous babe? What can be more ridiculous than calling quran not giving it's own light(nur)? Yeah you didn't say it directly to Quran, but your weakness proved it. But strangely you are here to argue without correcting your mistake. As Khan said to goodlogic, surrender in the first place, thereafter read Quran. It's not an argument to just overcome one another, but it may save us from ever lasting fire.. Peace and God bless you n all
It seems many have sort of concern why all these elites are conspiring? What's the benefit? They have decided there is no such necessity to do so...
No there is and it's how God let them do
Verse sahih international 6:123 "And thus we have placed within EVERY City the Greatest of its Criminals (mujrim) to CONSPIRE therein, but they conspire not except against themselves, and they perceive not"
Who are the Greatest in every city? Is it easy to conspire something well planned? Can fools conspire? Theirs will be exposed the other day.. But when intelligent of those conspire with the assistance of other intelligent one that's mighty.
Here the word mujrim is translated as criminals.. Yes it's right but it can have other similar meanings.. Mujrim is opposite to Muslim (The one who Surrenders to the God).
So those who conspire in every city is the one who opposes / not surrender to God. One of those such who conspirs is NASA of course who oppose God and their main aim is to eradicate the presence of True God from the heart of everyone and to totally rely on their myth.
Why God let it go as He let the yester generation's hadith to pervade, coz He knows His true slaves cannot be overcome by these conspiracies and only those who are destined for hell will bend. Remember God's verse which states " They plot, and we do plot, and we are best of those who plots.." Now it's time to expose those plots, a vast number of people are surging against these round earth... Proof is Google Search on subject such as moon conspiracy and flat earth is gone unprecedentedly high. You may search google and see..
Yup,
God has warned us about this conspiracy things.
58:10 Secret meetings are from the devil, to cause grief to those who believed. However, he cannot harm them except if God wills. In God the believers shall put their trust.
58:8 Have you noted those who were prohibited from holding meetings in secret, but then they go back to what they have been prohibited from? They meet secretly to commit sin, transgression, and disobedience of the messenger.
But if we have to do a secret meeting, we have to do it in righteousness.
58:9 O you who believe, if you must meet secretly, then you shall not meet to commit sin, transgression, and to disobey the messenger. You shall meet to work righteousness and piety. And be aware of God, before whom you will be summoned.
So why all this ellites are conspiring?
This is a recurring story. We should know the motives, who behind this at very top. The Qur'an tells about people in the past us so we can take lessons.
Let's start with a trio of Firawn-Haman-Qarun.
29:39 And Qarun and Pharaoh and Haman. And Moses had already come to them with clear evidences, and they were arrogant in the land, but they were not outrunners
Who is Qarun?
28:76 Indeed, Qarun was from the people of Moses, but he tyrannized them. And We gave him of treasures whose keys would burden a band of strong men; thereupon his people said to him, "Do not exult. Indeed, Allah does not like the exultant.
Qarun is the financial side.
Who is Haman?
28:38 And Pharaoh said, "O eminent ones, I have not known you to have a god other than me. Then ignite for me, O Haman, [a fire] upon the clay and make for me a tower that I may look at the God of Moses. And indeed, I do think he is among the liars.
28:6 And establish them in the land and show Pharaoh and Haman and their soldiers through them that which they had feared.
Haman is represent the government, he had military power.
And they were under control by,
79:24 And (firawn) said, "I am your most exalted lord."
The spiritual leader. He had been punished and become an example for us.
79:25 So Allah seized him in exemplary punishment for the last and the first.
10:92 So today We will save you in body that you may be to those who succeed you a sign. And indeed, many among the people, of Our signs, are heedless
So this all about money, power and spiritual things. The same strategy had been used by Iblees at the very beginning,
17:16 And incite whoever you (Iblees) can among them with your voice and assault them with your horses and foot soldiers and become a partner in their wealth and their children and promise them." But Satan does not promise them except delusion.
Iblees only focus to the spiritual things,
7:16 [Iblees] said, "Because You have put me in error, I will surely sit in wait for them on Your straight path.
And use the military power, cavalry (horses) and infantry (foot soldier) together with the wealth financial system (as mentioned in 17:16) as his tools.
Now let's see what happens in the world today.
It's gonna be a long post to explain about the corrupted financial system, but you can see how the government and the financial institution work together in a what I called "secret meeting" in youtube video below,
The Biggest Scam In The History Of Mankind - Hidden Secrets of Money
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iFDe5kUUyT0&t=0s&list=PLE88E9ICdipidHkTehs1VbFzgwrq1jkUJ&index=4
And you can witness the used of military power to destroy people every where.
But the government didn't stop there. As the ruler, they have capability to control people's mind through the school system. We are only taught about the things they want us to know.
The globe earth is only one of their agenda. To see the connection and motives, I suggest you to watch this video completely to the end.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EaXJzhJ9wrc&t=2332s
And all this party could be used by Iblees, the spiritual side (as the Haman work for Firawn), by exploiting the human greed.
They will make the easy ones to be difficult ones .. So that we stop asking and surrender, and put aside the Lord's guidance.
- Spiritual is easy, but they make it difficult. Al Quran is simplified, is there anybody want to take a lesson?
- The creation of heaven and earth is simple, the earth is flat and motionless, the heavenly bodies moving around. But they fill with the physics and imaginary equations so that it becomes so complex and difficult.
92:5 As for he who gives and is righteous.
92:6 And trusts in goodness.
92:7 We will make for him the easy path.
92:8 And as for he who is stingy and holds back.
92:9 And denies goodness.
92:10 We will make for him the difficult path.
So when somebody ask for the motive, I just simply said this is Iblees motive.
Iblees know that,
3:18 God bears witness that there is no god except He, as do the angels, and those with knowledge, He is standing with justice. There is no god except He, the Noble, the Wise.
With the true science according to God's guidance, then man will be able to witness the existence of One Supreme.
So it is very important for Iblees to separate the scriptures and science, so that the information from the God's scriptures will look like a fairy tales, out-of-date and it is not worth coupling with what they called "modern science".
Peace
Exactly Tilihawa..well said..
Okay let's check something interesting.
How many days in a year? Oops am I silly? you know it's 365 generally..
Yes.. But how many days in a year in other alleged planets? Most don't know.. Right? But some definitely know.. But even those some who knows, ever thought how contradictory it is as per this verse.
32:5 " He manages and regulates affair from the heavens to the Earth; then it (affair) will go up to Him, in one day, the space whereof is a thousand years of your reckoning "
Well.. You have an idea now what i am up to..
Earth year = 365 days
Jupiter year = 4300 days
Venus year = 225 days
Mercury year = 88 days
Mars year = 687 days
Neptune year = 60,200 days
Uranus year = 31,000 days
Pluto year = 90,400 days
Saturn year = 11,000 days..
Story goes on with all and respective moons..
As per the above verse 1000 years of yours is a question? Is it thousand years of only earth or the entire alleged universe which has different number of days per year.. Coz God is not living in this heavens or alleged universe He is above all where only His allowed elite members around.. To roll the entire heavens in one hand we can imagine He has to be something, someone cannot even comprehend.. And to keep massive earth in another handful.. So His place of living is far from reach.. But He says 1000 years of Our reckoning.. What we reckon? What ancestors reckoned? What Quran teaches for reckoning.. ? So we end up clueless according to imaginary myth of days.. YOUR RECKONING CAN ONLY BE ONE RECKONING.. But as per God for this heavens and Earth from the day He created is 12 months either solar or lunar.
But these jins go to the high heaven may be in split of minute.. . Then from heaven to His Arsh or the place He actually live is how far we can imagine.. Compare that with 70:4 "The Angels and Ruh (Jibreal) ascend to Him in a Day the messure whereof is fifty thousand years " quite different yes.. It takes angels 50k yrs, but to His affair (amr) no angels referred here is only 1000 years.. So this AMR / affair has to be His own affair without any one being involved..but for Him it's only ONE day.. So He has days as of His own,..some pose questions how there can be days even before the heavens and Earth are created.. Why not? Can't He keep His own days which is not at all relevant to this heavens and Earth which is only temporary.. HE CREATED HEAVENS AND EARTH IN 6 DAYS.. not our days.. Otherwise He would have mentioned in 6 days your reckoning.. Yes He gave out of those 6 to earth a big portion..
I wonder how many would understand this..
It is clear the Qur'an was revealed to the inhabitants of Saturn not to the inhabitants of planet earth, therefore it is the Saturn year it is talking about.
Salaam
Wa wa wa wa wa. :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl:
That's the most funniest, hilarious, mind-blowing, coolest foolish answer I have seen in my life.... Hmmmmmm let me give you 10 out 10 for your sintilating answer Huruf. :pr :wow :yay: :ignore:
Wise / burnout... Shame on you. Curses of all curse fall on you... :elektro: >:D
Pls guys don't answer to her so that she would suicide hearing your replies with embarrassment. Without any explanation at all, just gave a reply yes, quran was revealed to the inhabitants of Suturn.. :voodoo:she would have done some math on those numbers. I love to live in Saturn. Babe. Where is it? Just get lost.
This verse is apt for you
2:8 And of mankind there are some who say,: we belive in God and the last Day, while in fact they believe not. They think they deceive God and those who believe, while they only deceive themselves, and perceive not"
Perfect for you..
Peace to believers. Take care. :hail
Quote from: Topgun on May 06, 2018, 06:36:45 AM
Wa wa wa wa wa. :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl:
That's the most funniest, hilarious, mind-blowing, coolest foolish answer I have seen in my life.... Hmmmmmm let me give you 10 out 10 for your sintilating answer Huruf. :pr :wow :yay: :ignore:
Wise / burnout... Shame on you. Curses of all curse fall on you... :elektro: >:D
Pls guys don't answer to her so that she would suicide hearing your replies with embarrassment. Without any explanation at all, just gave a reply yes, quran was revealed to the inhabitants of Suturn.. :voodoo:she would have done some math on those numbers. I love to live in Saturn. Babe. Where is it? Just get lost.
This verse is apt for you
2:8 And of mankind there are some who say,: we belive in God and the last Day, while in fact they believe not. They think they deceive God and those who believe, while they only deceive themselves, and perceive not"
Perfect for you..
Peace to believers. Take care. :hail
Are you a sock/troll account by any chance? And why do you keep calling people "babe"? You sound really cringy lol and tbh it's you that's not bringing any arguments and resort to ad hominems instead
Hi 3uni, Palestini,
Why are you freaking out buddy? Keep ice cool head. That's a sign a of patience Lol. In my opinion she deserves my answer.. Any way I don't mind people of the nation of Sodom most will never succeed, once destroyed for sodomy and always doom. That's always a glaring proof with what we see every day. The same gay blood is still running with most. No doubt. Same most of Pakistanis. Is that why you joined two flags together? They love gays. God knows their qualities. But these think they are best of God's creatures. Who can't dream? Even children of Israel thought same way.
It's me. My character. That's how I speak against disbelievers when they attack. They deserve to be shown our disgusting feeling. Coz hypocrites and disbelievers are friends of Satan and friends of Satan is my enemy. Keep enemy in his / her place. But, those who disbelieve and not harm by word and physic always deserve due respect and love as long as they live.
What's wrong calling babe? It's such a kind cool word. You want me to speak your freaking set of words. Lol
Quote from: Topgun on May 06, 2018, 10:25:54 AM
Hi 3uni, Palestini,
Why are you freaking out buddy? Keep ice cool head. That's a sign a of patience Lol. In my opinion she deserves my answer.. Any way I don't mind people of the nation of Sodom most will never succeed, once destroyed for sodomy and always doom. That's always a glaring proof with what we see every day. The same gay blood is still running with most. No doubt. Same most of Pakistanis. Is that why you joined two flags together? They love gays. God knows their qualities. But these think they are best of God's creatures. Who can't dream? Even children of Israel thought same way.
It's me. My character. That's how I speak against disbelievers when they attack. They deserve to be shown our disgusting feeling. Coz hypocrites and disbelievers are friends of Satan and friends of Satan is my enemy. Keep enemy in his / her place. But, those who disbelieve and not harm by word and physic always deserve due respect and love as long as they live.
What's wrong calling babe? It's such a kind cool word. You want me to speak your freaking set of words. Lol
What did I just read.. well I'm really confused reading your post and there's no point in answering anymore so I'll just ignore.
Quote from: عوني on May 06, 2018, 10:39:43 AM
What did I just read.. well I'm really confused reading your post and there's no point in answering anymore so I'll just ignore.
Wise determinati0n, عوني
Salaam
Time to take this thread seriously and give some facts about the earth, moon and sun in no particular order.
The Moon:
Q: Why is the Moon bald?
A: It has no ?air
Q: What was the name of the first satellite to orbit the Earth?
A: The Moon.
Q: What do moon people do when they get married?
A: They go off on their honeyearth!
Q: Why does a moon rock taste better than an Earth rock?
A: It?s a little meteor.
Q: Why couldn?t the astronaut book a room on the moon?
A: Because it was a full moon.
Q: Did you hear about the bones they found on the moon?
A: It seems like the cow didn?t make it after all. (hey diddle diddle). Nor did Appollo!
*One kid asks the other, ?Which is closer, Florida or the Moon? the second answers: ?Duh! The Moon! You can?t see Florida from here!
Q: what do you call a tick on the moon?
A: A luna-tick.
The Sun:
*I was up all night wondering where the Sun had gone? then it dawned on me.
*Living on Earth might be expensive but at least you get a free trip around the Sun every year.
Copernicus? parents might deserve some of the credit for his great discovery. Apparently at the age of twelve they said to him: ?Copernicus, young man, when are you going to realize that the world does NOT revolve around you.?
Now the Earth:
Teacher- what's the shape of our earth?
Child- I don't know
Teacher - what's the shape of your girlfriend's earrings?
Child- square
Teacher- The one she wears on Sunday?
Child- Round
Teacher - so what is the shape of earth?
Child- round on Sunday and square on the rest of the days
Sorry folks, try as I may ,I am not able to take these discussions seriously.
So ignore good logic, disbeliever of Qoran !!!
Sorry again guys.
GOD bless you all.
Peace
Quote from: good logic on May 06, 2018, 03:11:06 PM
So ignore good logic, disbeliever of Qoran !!!
Rightly so!
Its illogical for you to go around spreading His words when yourself not following it!!
2:44 Do you order righteousness of the people and forget yourselves while you recite the Scripture?
Then will you not reason?
I thought about it. You will make sense if you follow what you preach yourself.
Reason and logic + Qoran all go against your logic. Despite your claim that you follow Qoran.
You are making verses of the Qoran apply to anyone and anything, just like those who owned the religion "Islam" to themselves, sorry to say.
I found ,from your posts, that you only think you follow Qoran!
GOD bless you.
Peace
Quote from: lime juice on May 06, 2018, 05:54:50 PM
Rightly so!
Its illogical for you to go around spreading His words when yourself not following it!!
2:44 Do you order righteousness of the people and forget yourselves while you recite the Scripture?
Then will you not reason?
Sunnis: righteousness is following the Sunnah, and praying the correct number of Raka'a
Flat Earthers: righteousness is believing in the correct shape of the earth
Do you see that you do just like the sectarians by taking our of context? Where is the difference?
Quote from: good logic on May 07, 2018, 02:22:09 AM
I thought about it. You will make sense if you follow what you preach yourself.
Reason and logic + Qoran all go against your logic. Despite your claim that you follow Qoran.
You are making verses of the Qoran apply to anyone and anything, just like those who owned the religion "Islam" to themselves, sorry to say.
I found ,from your posts, that you only think you follow Qoran!
GOD bless you.
Peace
why you concerned of me not following the Quran when I only echo what you said this
'So ignore good logic, disbeliever of Qoran !!!'
you admitted to be disbeliever of Quran yet I saw you all over the shop here preaching it.
Its HYPOCRITE of the highest order if to ask me.
And show any of my statement I made here that went against my logic and I show 3 of yours.
Fair deal?
Bring it ON otherwise its only show your desperate attempt in accussing me of manipulating His verse.
Quote from: IsaMuslim on May 07, 2018, 06:09:07 AM
Sunnis: righteousness is following the Sunnah, and praying the correct number of Raka'a
Flat Earthers: righteousness is believing in the correct shape of the earth
Do you see that you do just like the sectarians by taking our of context? Where is the difference?
Ive come to reallize you nowhere near the
minimum IQ requirement to discuss Quran
Perhaps my sharing of His verse here too difficult for your level to comprehend.
L,eave it to those who sincere in seeking the truth, they would appreciate it.
I dont lived with HINTING verse!!
ps* the secterians would love you for your avatar picture...is that your house?
Quote from: lime juice on May 07, 2018, 06:35:25 AM
why you concerned of me not following the Quran when I only echo what you said this
'So ignore good logic, disbeliever of Qoran !!!'
you admitted to be disbeliever of Quran yet I saw you all over the shop here preaching it.
Its HYPOCRITE of the highest order if to ask me.
And show any of my statement I made here that went against my logic and I show 3 of yours.
Fair deal?
Bring it ON otherwise its only show your desperate attempt in accussing me of manipulating His verse.
@good logic
This man can't even understand sarcasm.
Quote from: lime juice on May 07, 2018, 06:39:10 AM
Ive come to reallize you nowhere near the
minimum IQ requirement to discuss Quran
Perhaps my sharing of His verse here too difficult for your level to comprehend.
L,eave it to those who sincere in seeking the truth, they would appreciate it.
I dont lived with HINTING verse!!
No, you quoted that verse out of context. If you didn't, then can you please explain us your reason to quote it? What do you mean by that we are not following the righteousness but preaching it while reading the Book?
Instead I have another verse for you:
Invite to the path of your Lord with wisdom and good advice, and argue with them in that which is better.
Your Lord is fully aware of who is misguided from His path, and He is fully aware of the guided ones.
~ 16:125 ~
Quote from: lime juice on May 07, 2018, 06:39:10 AM
ps* the secterians would love you for your avatar picture...is that your house?
That is the new Temple that protects al-Masjid al-Haram, on Mount Moriah (Marwah), the place where we find the stance of Abraham (Maqam Ibrahim), where he was going to sacrifice his son.
Thus, and whoever honors the symbols of God, then it is from the piety of the hearts.
~ 22:32~
Peace lime juice.
So you did not recognise the irony? My statement was meant to make you think and reflect on what you are saying.
It is coming from your camp that those who do not believe in the "flat earth" are disbelievers of Qoran.
Read topgun, jkhan and your posts again!
good logic is only trying to help you see sense.
good logic knows that a belief on a flat or round or square earth is irrelevant. The minimum requirement for salvation is clear in Qoran and it has nothing to do with the shape of the earth.
Besides, belief is our choice, guidance is from God and is a consequence of that choice.
Why are we even wasting our time discussing the shape of the earth?
GOD bless you.
Peace.
I am tired of this useless discussion with people who just talk and they don't bring anything.
I already attempted to produce a flat-earth model taking many Quran verses into account, and I posted it in a previous post.
IF you (jkhan, lime juice, and their followers) are really serious about this, why I still don't see a detailed analysis of the verses of the Qur'an and a valid model based on the Qur'an alone (not the copy-paste that you made from google) which could work in real life?
Quote all the verses talking about the creation, and produce a model that works, unlike the one that I tried to make:
(https://preview.ibb.co/jW2jJc/fake_flat_earth.png) (https://ibb.co/eV6Byc)
Quote from: IsaMuslim on May 07, 2018, 07:48:38 AM
@good logic
This man can't even understand sarcasm.
No, you quoted that verse out of context. If you didn't, then can you please explain us your reason to quote it? What do you mean by that we are not following the righteousness but preaching it while reading the Book?
Instead I have another verse for you:
Invite to the path of your Lord with wisdom and good advice, and argue with them in that which is better.
Your Lord is fully aware of who is misguided from His path, and He is fully aware of the guided ones.
~ 16:125 ~
That is the new Temple that protects al-Masjid al-Haram, on Mount Moriah (Marwah), the place where we find the stance of Abraham (Maqam Ibrahim), where he was going to sacrifice his son.
Thus, and whoever honors the symbols of God, then it is from the piety of the hearts.
~ 22:32~
God said: theres a PROTECTED CEILING and 7 LEVEL of HEAVENS above it/us.
AND none can get through it without His approval..
Do you still need your SCHOLAR to tafseer to make uou undersfand
OR you simply dont have the capacity to understand it yourself?
Which ONE?
I can try to help......
did I tell you Masjidil Haram were mentioned in Quran but history tell us,
MH today only comes into existence much later after the completion of the Quran.
was your avatar picture the one that comes after the long completion of the Quran?
I think so..
Time and time you mixed your false doctrine to the TRUTH yet here you accuse me of taken His verse out of context..
like I said, minimum IQ requires to understand Quran, its clear to me you dont have it.
Quote from: good logic on May 07, 2018, 07:58:23 AM
Peace lime juice.
So you did not recognise the irony? My statement was meant to make you think and reflect on what you are saying.
It is coming from your camp that those who do not believe in the "flat earth" are disbelievers of Qoran.
Read topgun, jkhan and your posts again!
good logic is only trying to help you see sense.
good logic knows that a belief on a flat or round or square earth is irrelevant. The minimum requirement for salvation is clear in Qoran and it has nothing to do with the shape of the earth.
Besides, belief is our choice, guidance is from God and is a consequence of that choice.
Why are we even wasting our time discussing the shape of the earth?
GOD bless you.
Peace.
were you there when the Lord showed HIS SIGNS by cooling the fire down for Abraham to walk through the furnace unscatched?
were you there when the Lord showed HIS SIGNS
by parting the sea for Moses and his people to walk through?
OR were you even there when the Lord showed HIS SIGNS in assisting Jesus son of Mary to bring life to the dead?
NOPE!!! I dont think so, neither do I
BUT what SIGNS that were refer here when DENY, we will abide in HELL FIRE for ETERNALLY?
2:39 And those who disbelieve and DENY OUR SIGNS - those will be companions of the Fire; they will abide therein eternally."
Quran cant be for people of the past right?
In GOOD LOGIC, care to share what those SIGNS are?
I hv dumped Islam
I hv dumped Muhammad
AND I would hv dump HIS BOOK too
if NOT FOR HIS SIGNS that reconciled well
with my school of thought that He has shown me
do you know what SIGNS are those that made me to embrace Him wholeheartedly?
Quote from: IsaMuslim on May 07, 2018, 08:28:33 AM
I am tired of this useless discussion with people who just talk and they don't bring anything.
I already attempted to produce a flat-earth model taking many Quran verses into account, and I posted it in a previous post.
IF you (jkhan, lime juice, and their followers) are really serious about this, why I still don't see a detailed analysis of the verses of the Qur'an and a valid model based on the Qur'an alone (not the copy-paste that you made from google) which could work in real life?
Quote all the verses talking about the creation, and produce a model that works, unlike the one that I tried to make:
(https://preview.ibb.co/jW2jJc/fake_flat_earth.png) (https://ibb.co/eV6Byc)
But that flat earth that is thought to be the truth still must have a shape: is it a circle, is it a square, a rectangle a trapezium, a trapezoid, an hexagon, what shape is it? or is shapeless. Those who propound a flat earth, could they suply a drawing of the earth seen from the height of the canopy?
Salaam
Quote from: huruf on May 07, 2018, 09:19:22 AM
But that flat earth that is thought to be the truth still must have a shape: is it a circle, is it a square, a rectangle a trapezium, a trapezoid, an hexagon, what shape is it? or is shapeless. Those who propound a flat earth, could they suply a drawing of the earth seen from the height of the canopy?
Salaam
maybe SQUARE..or try TRIANGLE..wait..Globe maybe hmmm..
Why is it so important whether Earth is flat or round?
Quote from: lime juice on May 07, 2018, 09:00:56 AM
God said: theres a PROTECTED CEILING and 7 LEVEL of HEAVENS above it/us.
AND none can get through it without His approval..
Do you still need your SCHOLAR to tafseer to make uou undersfand
OR you simply dont have the capacity to understand it yourself?
Which ONE?
I can try to help......
That is
YOUR INTERPRETATION, your Tafsir, that you're trying to impose like if you're
THE ONE who has got the absolute truth, while the Only One is God.
Quote from: lime juice on May 07, 2018, 09:00:56 AM
did I tell you Masjidil Haram were mentioned in Quran but history tell us,
MH today only comes into existence much later after the completion of the Quran.
was your avatar picture the one that comes after the long completion of the Quran?
I think so..
I know when the Dome of the Rock was built. You didn't read carefully my comment, as always, because you don't give a damn about what another person says.
Quote from: lime juice on May 07, 2018, 09:00:56 AM
Time and time you mixed your false doctrine to the TRUTH yet here you accuse me of taken His verse out of context..
like I said, minimum IQ requires to understand Quran, its clear to me you dont have it.
I am still waiting for your explanation of why you quoted it.
To anyone, your quoting of His verse could seem like you want to say that all the Qur'an Alone followers who don't believe in the ignorant flat earth are hypocrites.
Quote from: A Submitter on May 07, 2018, 09:46:21 AM
Why is it so important whether Earth is flat or round?
What? Brother didn't you know that those who believe the earth is a globe - which it is - go to hell?
Let's all follow brother lime juice, we don't have enough IQ to understand the Qur'an for ourselves, or if we have we are hypocrites, unless we agree that the Earth is flat.
Would a participant of this thread give a synopsis of views.
What is the core point of discussion?
Useless discussing here. All those burnout and wise are part of admin and they block people as they want and they have blocked Jkhan by hacking his account and password they knew. They sent a message to me. After my message to 3uuni and Huruf. and they blocked me too but I am crafty enough to get and pass the message to all. People don't waste time here this so much biased and pls read Quran yourself and beg for guidance from your Lord. Non of these can help. Goodbye forever.
God bless those who are sincere, and He will always guide those good hearts, coz their heart and their action same.
Quote from: Mazhar on May 07, 2018, 04:14:24 PM
Would a participant of this thread give a synopsis of views.
What is the core point of discussion?
(http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-T9TEW2Q9Dz0/VlhoF5cOiUI/AAAAAAAAAHo/Pumql1EgbFE/s640/BwjVzT-IIAA0zWd.jpg)
Flat and round are not opposites. Something can be flat and round, they are confusing planes with bodies. 2 dimensions with three dimensions.
Given that level, anyd iscussion is nonsense and just throwing things at each other for the heck of it, and above all to condemn. As if anybody could do anything aobut such a thing...
It is so preposterous...
But it sure takes up bandwidth
Salaam
Quote from: Jafar on May 08, 2018, 01:30:15 AM
(http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-T9TEW2Q9Dz0/VlhoF5cOiUI/AAAAAAAAAHo/Pumql1EgbFE/s640/BwjVzT-IIAA0zWd.jpg)
Thanks Jafar.
What they think or say as to what is meant by "Flat" and "Round"?
Believe all you want but Quran does not supports the Globe earth theory.
That is FACT!!!!
And dont be the fooled to follow the customary of previous people wrong doing in DENYING His SIGNS...
Example has aldy been shown in the Pharaoh..
8:54 [Theirs is] like the custom of the people of Pharaoh and of those before them. They denied the signs of their Lord, so We destroyed them for their sins, and We drowned the people of Pharaoh. And all [of them] were wrongdoers.
Is His scripture NOT DETAILED enough
that you to follow others and discard all His SIGNS?
7:185 Do they not look into the realm of the heavens and the earth and everything that the Lord has created and [think] that perhaps their appointed time has come near?
So in what HADITH (STATEMENT) hereafter will they believe?
Nuff said, to each his own..
6:112 And thus We have made for every prophet an enemy - devils from mankind and jinn, inspiring to one another decorative speech in delusion.
But if your Lord had willed, they would not have done it, so leave them and that which they invent.
Quote from: lime juice on May 08, 2018, 07:28:17 AM
so leave them and that which they invent.
This is what I will do. Thanks for reminding me of this verse :)
Quote from: IsaMuslim on May 08, 2018, 08:17:27 AM
This is what I will do. Thanks for reminding me of this verse :)
youre welcome and glad to be of help
His SIGNS already made precised and detailed in His Book.
HINTING verse are only to deviate us away to outside source, INVENTION of the devils just so you know.
Quote from: Mazhar on May 08, 2018, 05:32:35 AM
Thanks Jafar.
What they think or say as to what is meant by "Flat" and "Round"?
Flat: The Facts
Quote from: lime juice on May 05, 2018, 09:04:41 AM
Earth is NOT a PLANET that is floating but foundation to Heaven
AND everthing that comes between them belongs to Him.
20:6 To Him belongs what is in the heavens and what is on the earth and what is between them and what is under the
(https://galeri14.uludagsozluk.com/818/dunyamizin-ucte-ikisi-sudur_1469512.jpg)
Other model of cosmology are myths invented by NASA / Satan to deceive the believers.
Included in Satanic myths are: Black Holes, Planets (Mars, Venus, Saturn etc..), Galaxies, Solar Systems, Pulsar, Clusters, Gravity.
Thanks Jafar
Quote from: Jafar on May 08, 2018, 02:05:43 PM
Flat: The Facts
Other model of cosmology are myths invented by NASA / Satan to deceive the believers.
Included in Satanic myths are: Black Holes, Planets (Mars, Venus, Saturn etc..), Galaxies, Solar Systems, Pulsar, Clusters, Gravity.
QuoteEarth is NOT a PLANET
Yes it is not a planet since Qur'aan did not call it a planet. In scientific world also there is debate not to consider it a planet.
QuoteIncluded in Satanic myths are: Black Holes, Planets (Mars, Venus, Saturn etc..), Galaxies, Solar Systems, Pulsar, Clusters, Gravity.
Not myths, but realities. Planets are mentioned in Qur'aan. Black Hole is mentioned in Qur'aan by its description.
(http://haqeeqat.pk/banners/plan.png)
http://haqeeqat.pk/Planets%20Kokab.htm (http://haqeeqat.pk/Planets%20Kokab.htm)
(http://haqeeqat.pk/banners/astr.png)
http://haqeeqat.pk/Asteroids%20Barooj.htm (http://haqeeqat.pk/Asteroids%20Barooj.htm)
(http://haqeeqat.pk/banners/comets.png)
http://haqeeqat.pk/Comets.htm (http://haqeeqat.pk/Comets.htm)
Quote from: Topgun on May 07, 2018, 11:16:57 PM
Useless discussing here. All those burnout and wise are part of admin and they block people as they want and they have blocked Jkhan by hacking his account and password they knew. They sent a message to me. After my message to 3uuni and Huruf. and they blocked me too but I am crafty enough to get and pass the message to all. People don't waste time here this so much biased and pls read Quran yourself and beg for guidance from your Lord. Non of these can help. Goodbye forever.
God bless those who are sincere, and He will always guide those good hearts, coz their heart and their action same.
Is hard for me to believe what you said above because i always thought fhis place as the most liberal Quran sharing platform that I ever came across.
As long we stick to fhe rule, any sharing of Quran understanding are welcome here...............
so I thought until my own account been hacked and my IP been blocked from access here.
those thought are now in the bin!!
Apparently my sharing too thought provoking for some CLOSEMINDED individual to accept that he has to silence me from spreading more of His message here.
Ive now come to believe there are aatan influenced in the admin midst that would STOP the truth from coming in.
This platform is no difference to any secterians platform that ONLY allow what they want to hear BUT HIM the Lord of the Worlds existence and His attributes that they want us to DENY!!!
74:31 And We have not made the keepers of the Fire except angels. And We have not made their number except as a trial for those who disbelieve - that those who were given the Scripture will be convinced and those who have believed will increase in faith and those who were given the Scripture and the believers will not doubt and that those in whose hearts is hypocrisy and the disbelievers will say,
"What does the Lord intend by this as an example?"
Thus does the Lord leave astray whom He wills and guides whom He wills. And none knows the soldiers of your Lord except Him. And mention of the Fire is not but a reminder to humanity.
ps..ive to use different IP to said the above.........
Quote from: lime juice on May 11, 2018, 10:56:08 PM
As long we stick to fhe rule, any sharing of Quran understanding are welcome here...............
so I thought until my own account been hacked and my IP been blocked from access here.
those thought are now in the bin!!
This platform is no difference to any secterians platform that ONLY allow what they want to hear
Ck ck ck... if they did as such.. then this is just yet another sectarian platform...
It is very hard to change a mindset..
it's nice to be back on this site. let's hope someone get the benefit... Whatever the reason i am blocked, it's fine. Now i had to approach this site with a hide proxy unfortunately.. fir6001fir@gmail.com anyone who wish to contact me is welcome, in case i get blocked by this approach..
@ Mazhar;;; There is no such planets as they claim Mazhar .. let me explain to you.. your comments for / against are much welcome, so that i can respond to your comments based on quran. accepting and denying is individual's choice... but quran cannot be denied in it's own form and the meaning which God in fact meant.
Although the planets are much smaller than the stars, planets appear to be about the same size as the stars because they are so close to us. Planets don't produce their own light. They reflect the light of the sun in the same way our moon reflects sunlight ? statement of Nasa and Google
Everyone has a rough idea while looking at the sky on a dark clear night. There are so many things on sky which makes the eyes dazzling and breathtaking to the one who behold. They all don?t look similar; some are sizeable compare to others, some are more shiny, some are not twinkling at all, but lit, some are moving suddenly, some are positioned always at the same place, some appear quiet early in the night and some appear late/very late and some disappear well early and very few keep it?s presence till almost sunrise. They all commonly Stars (Najm in Arabic)
Let?s brief out the verses to clarify further
KA?KABAN / KAWAKIB
37:06-08 Indeed, We have adorned the nearest(dunya) heaven with an adornment of stars (Kawakib), And to guard against every rebellious devil, They cannot listen to the higher group (angels) for they are pelted from every side
By the context of the above verse itself, it is evident that the word Kawakib(p) is in fact used to define the stars which are much closer to the edge of the heaven where no one is authorized to touch or wander around. These Ka?kaban(s) has other features as moving with piercing flame to guard against the rebellious devil who tries to encroach the well preserved / guarded zones in the heaven. Otherwise remain in its position. These have their beauty as well. But all in all they are kind of stars family with special entrusted duties to be done on their own. If Ka?kaban is Planets, it?s impractical and foolishness to think that the alleged planets suddenly move from it?s positions to chase the Jins with piercing flame wherever they runaway to escape. Planets have no such qualities as per myth, they rotates in their own axis and rotates their own sun. So Ka?kaban is no where near to the qualities of the myth of planets.
24:35 Allah is the Light of the heavens and the earth. The example of His light is like a niche within which is a lamp, the lamp is within glass, the glass as if it were a pearly star(ka?kaban) lit from [the oil of] a blessed olive tree, neither of the east nor of the west, whose oil would almost glow even if untouched by fire. Light upon light. Allah guides to His light whom He wills. And Allah presents examples for the people, and Allah is Knowing of all things.
what a wonderful verse it is, (NOTE KA?KABAN HAS IT?S OWN LIGHT AS PER THIS CLEAR VERSE 24:35. ACCEPTED THEORY, PLANETS DON?T HAVE THEIR OWN LIGHT) ponder pls.
6:76 So when the night covered him [with darkness], he saw a star (ka?kaban). He said, "This is my lord." But when it disappeared, he said, "I like not those that disappear."
As per 6:76 it is crystal clear that what Abraham saw was a bright star (ka?kaban) which has it?s qualities of appearing and disappearing as sun and moon in a day. Had Abraham really saw a planet with precise knowledge of planets, and then he would have been one of the ancient even before Greeks to know of the planets. But in the end Abraham won?t call smaller in size, as he stated in 6:74-76 When he saw Star, moon and then lastly the Sun and called Yes this is the biggest. Had he in fact had such comprehensive knowledge of planets in the night sky he wouldn?t have called the Sun to be the biggest, since stars are allegedly bigger and even the imaginary myth of planets too (since people consider the one Abraham saw was Venus or Jupiter-bigger than sun). So he never knew of any planets but stars (which has its own quality, all stars are not same)
12:04 when Joseph said to his father, "O my father, indeed I have seen [in a dream] eleven stars and the sun and the moon; I saw them prostrating to me."
When Joseph explained his dream to his father, his father didn?t in return question what is ka?kaban so, it shows Joseph as well his father knew what is ka?kaban and they lived not too far off in terms of time from Abraham. Had they had the knowledge of planets? Of course not according to history they were not aware of planets and they don?t exist too, up until Greek invented a myth.
82:02 And when the stars fall, scattering.
If the verse 82:02 refer planets scattering, where do they scatter and fall to where? But stars would scatter and fall to the massive earth only. As per the myth stars are 1000 times larger than sun.. and alleged planets are not something that would scatter.. when God says mountains powder, and make it as a very big thing on the day of Resurrection, then the planets scatter and 1300 time bigger than sun stars scatter is something worthy more to think..
BURUJ (generally stars but defines well designed constellation / lofty construction)
4:78 Wherever you may be, death will overtake you, even if you should be within towers (buruj) of lofty construction. But if good comes to them, they say, "This is from Allah "; and if evil befalls them, they say, "This is from you." Say, "All [things] are from Allah." So what is [the matter] with those people that they can hardly understand any statement?
15:16 -18 And We have placed within the heaven constellation / great stars (burj) and have beautified it for the observers, and we have preserved it from every accursed devil, except the ones who listen on the sly, yet they are chased away by a shooting flame (shihab mubeen).
By the above verse, it further clears that Ka?kaban is same (Shihab Mubeen) but ka?kaban is just star when it remains without chasing the devils, but it turns out to shooting flame (Shihab mubeen) when it actually required to do so.
25:61 Blessed is He who has placed in the sky constellation /great stars and placed therein a [burning] lamp and luminous moon.
85:01 By the Heaven containing constellation / great stars
Note: Buruj does not seems to have the same quality as of Ka?kaban. That?s pretty clear by the verses of quran. Ka?kaban is specially designed sets of stars.
86:1-3 By the sky and the Al Tariq -And what can make you know what is the Al Tariq? It is the piercing (brightness) star (Najm).
The above three verses describes about a bright Star. The word almost identical to an Arabic word, but God pose a question and say what make you known the Al Tariq is? It is obvious that the people of that time were not aware about Al Tariq by name but would have observed it many a times. And it indicates only to one star. That should be the brightest star in the heaven and has to be bigger in size compare to others since it is outlined specifically.
It's manifest that Al Tariq is not a kind of Ka'kaban (stars with different features) but a brightest star (most probably the one Abrahim referred)
Other than the above explanation, I don?t see any alleged Greek planets bigger than earth or stars which are 1300 times larger than the Sun.
We can imagine that by the verse 41:9-12 when God says He took 2 days to construct the earth and 4 days for it?s resources. And in verse 7:54 He says He constructed the heaven and earth in 6 days. So imagine the how massive earth is by giving almost all of those six days which included lifting the canopy with decoration, But, He accomplished (Qadha) and entrusted / ingrained each heavens duties and function in two days the heavens.
Remind you this verse : 45:03 "Indeed there are signs for believers in the HEAVENS and the EARTH." this verse only will give a meaning first of all to believers and of course to get meaning and to see SIGNS we should be able to see Heavens (7) and earth... no need to depend on NASA for that...
wow... i found i am not blocked anymore... :whatever:
Quote from: jkhan on May 14, 2018, 01:16:22 AM
wow... i found i am not blocked anymore... :whatever:
Good for you and good for the forum.
thanks Jafar for wishes... and sorry all for my previous post at Mazhar half of the texts in white.. i didn't notice it.. sorry for inconvenience in reading them..
Gravity is a force of attraction that exists between any two masses, any two bodies, any two particles. Gravity is not just the attraction between objects and the Earth. It is an attraction that exists between all objects, everywhere in the universe.
Astronauts float around in space because there is no gravity in space. Everyone knows that the farther you get from Earth, the less the gravitational force is. Well, astronauts are so far from the Earth that gravity is so small.
Gravity holds us to the surface of the Earth and keeps our atmosphere wrapped around our planet. An object's weight is a measure of the gravitational force acting on it. Without gravity on earth everything will float.
The above are written theory, we all learned.
Did God create Gravity or a myth? Lets check the gravity with sound judgment. Coz Gravity plays pivotal role in the myth universe, but not in the creation of Earth and Heavens..
As they claim, the vast oceans remain on its surface as a result of gravity which holds it strongly without being spilled to the air all around. Otherwise it is impossible.. How amazing that is for a theory. Tiny birds flocking and hovering around fishing nets very close to the surface of the Sea, but the same gravity couldn?t drag them to the earth. Okay get to the point which I wanted to present here:
Just take for example the Tsunami or powerful magnitude scales of Earthquakes. If Gravity can hold the vast and immeasurable amount of water in its place, why when one of the major Tsunami of 2004 astonished the world with underneath waves at a speed of 500 km/h traversed from Indonesia all the way to Somalia. That?s quite a lot of distance and that too to the opposite side of the rotation of the earth (myth rotate East to west) and reached to the shores swelling up to 100 feet or more away from the surface of the earth. Why the gravity could not hold the water as it was holding all the time? Why the water didn?t rotate same course of earth?s rotation? Why plates of the earth moved and why gravity couldn?t hold it stand still as it does throughout. What caused the nature to trigger breaking all shackles of gravity? people answer in various aspects and angle to these questions keeping the basic theory in mind? some say they are extraordinary cases..
Point number two, You all are well aware how a volcano erupts, just look closely those massive thick fumes, they contain so many elements, one of those is pieces of solid earthly materials going up in all directions. From where it got power source to go up breaking the barriers of Gravity held it for ages. How the solid lava from beneath the earth came upward trespassing the rules of gravity? In the first place why gravity could not control it being erupted, if it could hold the ocean always peaceful (as the gravity pulls things to the center). Look at the way the bulky fumes go up it?s not mere clouds. How powerful it looks. Now compare these volcano fumes to Tsunami Waves. Fumes went up to the sky and waves remained on earth .. Water has its nature to find its path, but fumes has its nature to go up? Nothing to do with gravity?
We can add up to these points, the massive landslides take place all over the world and splitting of icebergs, Why cant gravity hold it? Why building collapse when there is a powerful earthquake. Why not gravity holds it, but it holds when the earth rotates and the things on southern hemisphere which is downward.
I know most won?t agree to the above, so lets go to the end of the world. Then think of when the Day of Judgment occurs, when mountains fly as dust particles breaking all the rules of Gravity. Where would gravity have gone then? Verse 18:47 One Day We shall remove the mountains, and you will see the earth as a level stretch, and We shall gather them, all together, nor shall We leave out any one of them. Yeah one would say, it is coz of the end of the world Gravity disappeared. But NO. We are alive, Yes we still won?t fly like the mountains fly? We will remain on earth and witnessing this great incident. May be gravity has power to hold the people than the mountains? Nonsensical?.. When the oceans spill over on the day of doom? What happened to the gravity? But we still remain on earth witnessing them. We will be raised up from this dead earth when there is no sun, no moon, no alleged gravity, no canopy of heavens, just merely the leveled earth. And with what sort of gravity we stick on earth on that day when all burdens of earth is no more since the theory is we stick to earth just because of the gravity holding us to the earth otherwise we float?. Does the GRAVITY disappear? Has God mentioned in quran of GRAVITY and its disappearance on the Day of Judgment? NO?.
Gravity is another myth of ancients to which NASA gives oxygen to survive? Earth is not round and rotating.. it is one of the hardest thing to convince, coz great, arrogant, intelligent iblees is behind it with his master plan?. God has plan? His plans and miracles are amazingly comes at a time no one expects?
I am happy with your offline answer coz you are an atheist... but If the identical answer is furnished by a Quran believer then, we can think why an atheist and quran believer are identical... Then He cannot be a quran believer and just like u...
Your destiny is with you and i am not responsible for what you perceive since it looks retarded logic to you...
It resembles the responses of the most of the ancients.... who said.. " same old ancients stories, meaningless .."
How can i open your eyes, when your eyes will be well open only on the day of Resurrection... take care and enjoy this brief moments in this world... that's yours Manny-E... and not ours... ours is waiting ....
Brother jkhan do you now accept there are astronauts? Because you say, quote:
Astronauts float around in space because there is no gravity in space. Everyone knows that the farther you get from Earth, the less the gravitational force is. Well, astronauts are so far from the Earth that gravity is so small.
But what about the pictures they take of earth from above, you deny?
Just asking.
GOD bless you.
Peace
Since The Sardar reminded me of this verse 11-106-108.. i feel something in it ...
Can anyone explain these verses of your understanding..
thanx
jkhan brother, I hope you are doing fine.
You know most of what happens after this life is our assumptions/imagination/guess work.
According to Qoran:
-This universe is going to end/collapse on itself/natwi Al Ssama...
-A new heaven and a new earth will be created/nubaddilu Al Ard ghayra Al Ard Wa Al SSamawat...
i.e our universe including our earth will be annexed to GOD s realm (My understanding)
Hence a new creation with a new classification of humans and Jinns.
Again my understanding/guess is this:
GOD will put on motion/create another universe that will contain the "rebels " of the humans and Jinns to be continuing their chosen will of "away from GOD". Until this new universe ends(11:106-108)... Wa Yahmilu Arsh Rabbika Fawkahum Thamaniah...(At the moment there are 7 universes ,there will be eight!)
GOD bless you.
Peace.
thanx for your valuable comments Good Logic... i asked comments only for my personal knowledge.. sorry i wont comment anything in reply..
Yes i am keeping fine.. God bless you
Hi all...
Watch the link pls. May b u will have something to ponder away from normal..
https://youtu.be/McdMMmclGVc
Salam
God bless u...
In the Aya 57:21 it does discuss the actual width. عَرْضُهَا comes from the word عرض to present, display, show. allah is saying that paradise will be exhibited just like our reality and earth is. he's not talking about an actual width.
Watch the below link too.. Most those who are interested in earth and it's reality would have seen,, but I am sure there are many who have not yet watched this video... Take your time pls and be patient in watching it... Be neutral if u can....
https://youtu.be/CoM9C9r-VqM
Qur'an is very precise and free of any error.
Most people have completely underestimated Satan. They can not believe that Satan has infiltrated every aspect of their lives. NASA and other space agencies are run by Satanists to convince people that they live in a vast Universe and that the existence of Earth is as result of chance aka Big bang.
If you research yourself and use actual science with empirical evidence , You will conclude that the Earth is actually flat and not a spinning globe. Earth is surrounded by a massive ice wall. The sky is a physical stucture like a dome. It has Gates and it will shatter on the day of Judgement. The Sun , and moon are within the sky dome. Stars and so called planets are tiny specs of light on the dome. There is no such thing as space and no one can go past the dome. Space agencies are faking space. Google: NASA fakery
also Google Flat Earth
https://youtu.be/JFhKpYJZeoM
When I first came to know about midnight sun in early 2010 I searched google and found sun never sets in such limited countries... It was given around 7 nations of arctic by google search ... No YouTube videos found of Antarctica midnight sun then .. Now all faked videos of Antarctica to debunk the truth are mushroomed... Reality is only in arctic the sun never sets and it is one of the mightiest evidence the naked eye can get to know about the earth.. In Globe earth it is never ever possible.... Forged things will be exposed...
Guys... If u have a Nikon p900 or 1000 u can watch wonders.. If u don't have try to buy or see the videos it has captured...incredible...
God is great and showing His evidences as He planned ...
Keep searching dudes... Truth is like gold, got to dig deep to drag it...
Don't be a fanatic and maybe you'll get a step closer to the truth.
Brother Cerberus, my head is spinning from my own views, theories, assumptions and doctrines instilled there since my youth!!!
Spinning fast. May be I am fanatic about many things also?
Anyway and here is me thinking that earth itself is spinning and not my head!
GOD bless you.
Peace
PS: I could not find that head banging head character above. May be a good job, it will only send my head "unspinning"!
https://youtu.be/7_i6nlaCIoA
I like the logic in this video.. Do you?
Quote from: good logic on September 18, 2018, 11:13:03 AM
Brother Cerberus, my head is spinning from my own views, theories, assumptions and doctrines instilled there since my youth!!!
Spinning fast. May be I am fanatic about many things also?
Anyway and here is me thinking that earth itself is spinning and not my head!
GOD bless you.
Peace
PS: I could not find that head banging head character above. May be a good job, it will only send my head "unspinning"!
Brother Good Logic,
External knowledge is ok, but internal, self knowledge is much better. And yet it's still not enough. No knowledge brings benefit unless we apply it. Maybe knowledge points us to the right (or wrong) direction but the trip to that location we're aiming for is a whole different ball game. And if we're not focused on trying to achieve that what are we doing ?
It's like a traveler who is willing to reach the top of the mountain, but instead decides to sit at the foot of the mountain and endlessly talk about how great the top of the mountain is, while also trying to make sure that the wolves from the surrounding forests do not eat him.
By the way, did you check out the book I suggested to you last time ? :yes
in the example of the traveler, I got inspired by this quote from Confucius:
"The way of the superior man may be compared to what takes place in traveling, when to go to a distance we must first traverse the space that is near, and in ascending a height, when we must begin from the lower ground. "
We must always start from where we are now, from ourselves, and take steps further.
"Man is something that shall be overcome. Man is a rope, tied between beast and overman - a rope over an abyss.What is great in man is that he is a bridge and not an end." says Nietzsche. And we do swing from our lowest to our highest all the time through life, but until when ? This is where no knowledge can help us further. This is the limitation of knowledge. :brickwall:
Is this the wrong the thread to say this ? Probably.
Peace Cerberus.
Thank you for your post.
Yes, that book is on my to do list for October God willing.
I will let you know . Thanks for reminding me.
GOD bless you.
Peace.
https://youtu.be/54Ku3i-zl8U
This is a fascinating video.. Watch pls when U have time...
https://youtu.be/5HMwKwWnV4k
And watch this hilarious drama.... Human has natural spontaneous approaches to questions... They only pre-programmed to act for "DELAY" but their spontaneous actions and movements definitely shows they hear Trump without any delay... Just wake up folks... Why this deception? No has gone to space and there us no space at all.. Space is invention and it only make us space from God... :nope:
Watch carefully from the beginning...
President trump is talking to "fake astronauts? in fake space station?
To stage what?
1- that there is space around us ?
2-That earth is round?
3-That astronauts exist?
4-That we can explore space and visit other planets?
Or simply to dupe folks and the world ? For what reason?
I fail to understand the reason brother!
GOD bless you.
Peace.
Earth is flat in the Quran and the Bible, their model is 100% authentic. Yet the Earth is NOT flat on physical level.
Flat Earth society is alike the 19teeners among the Quran community. Both groups talk about something, which they believe has value and which is true at some point, both groups are completely deluded about the true meaning behind it. They are also completely oblivious about the reasons behind their delusions.
Their example is like someone who has kindled a fire (enlightened the area around him), yet it did not illuminate him.
And the answer is literally everywhere around them, to the point it is painful watching another flat earther or 19er talk about something he has no clue about.
@ good logic... Logic and reason is within Trump's speech itself... Find out... How can any president of US can go against the system... They all will surrender to this deception and persist it...
I wonder you don't know only the reason or even you didn't get that this video has flaws... If u get it that they all acting... Then find out the reason.. What is best than self perceptions
Peace jkhan.
I think most presidents/leaders act in front of camera., especially Trump.
The subject though is real.
Please clarify, you believe the earth is flat but you disagree with flat earth society?
I thought most of your so called evidence and you tube videos came from them?
GOD bless you.
Peace.
https://youtu.be/XRSk04ZJFN8
What you think about this video... Is it too much of an ask for Neil? Or does he believe in Bible and couldn't do it?.. :whatever:... They didn't go to moon.. No need to accept with Bible....
So that is your proof that Neil did not walk on the moon?
Are you serious? I call it desperation not evidence.
The thousands of engineers, team and people who work for NASA. Are they all going to do the same test (Swear on the bible!)?
So you have to bring another thousands of you tubes like it!!!! Then the doubt will start?
GOD bless you.
Peace.
I was hoping someone who was proficient in Arabic would see that
[57:21] is a simile.
[57:21]
Race toward forgiveness from your Lord and a Garden whose width
is like the width of the heavens and earth, prepared for those who
believed in Allah and His messengers. That is the bounty of Allah
which He gives to whom He wills, and Allah is the possessor of great bounty.
While both similes and metaphors are used to make comparisons, the
difference between similes and metaphors comes down to a word. Similes
use the words like or as to compare things??Life is like a box of chocolates.?
In contrast, metaphors directly state a comparison??Love is a battlefield.?
:) I hope no one thinks life is a box of chocolate
sim?i?le
noun: simile; plural noun: similes
a figure of speech involving the comparison of one thing with another
thing of a different kind, used to make a description more emphatic
or vivid (e.g., as brave as a lion, crazy like a fox ).
:peace:
Brothers Good Logic and Hawk....
God knows your hearts...
Remember ... God says God guides and non other can guide... if so, Guidance cannot be of wrong choice.. is it? i have chosen one and you have chosen another... Can both be guidance from God? not exactly...How shame that either me or both of you uttering blasphemy against God by way of treating His verses.. So one of us is totally talking against what actually God has created... do you get how mighty that is... talking against Gods verses... Let me tell about me.. I am not supporting with God's verses any other outside sources... Just think of you two.. Are you sticking with God's verses or you cannot get out of the things that your mind has convinced other than quran?
why i said this is coz you have not brought any single verse in quran to prove that world is globe, but adament that it is globe...
Lets see what is really meant by guidance... The Creator me knows my heart... and i am sure He wont misguide me while i beg for pure guidance with pure intention....
lastly... Go search both of you... where in the earth where you cannot go and you will be chased by flames...before you try it in the sky.... isnt this quran...or it has a hidden meaning?
God bless you two
Good brother jkhan there is no debate with you, I am only looking
at ayat [57:21]. My conclusion of the ayat being discussed is that
it is a simile. Notice the word "like" in the verse. So I ask you or
any other forum member to give the definition of a simile.
:peace:
No debate with you two... somehow i am dragged with you two...God will....
i have explained it in this topic clearly ... i dont want to dig again...
look the identical verse 03:133 ... open your eyes... in this verse there is no "LIKE" as you claim..
even in the verse 57:21 Ka'ardi is not simile .... i don't need to convince you..
God bless you.. ::)
Peace jkhan.
We are brothers discussing amicably.
Please accept my apology if I gave you any cause for concern .
As far as the shape of the earth is concerned, its irrelevant at GOD s. Nothing to do with guidance or lack of it.
The message we are both quoting from points to our deeds and character being the most important task to get right.
So please relax and enjoy yourself.
Peace brother.
GOD bless you.
Brother Hawk?.
This time it is not argument?Explanation to your request of ?Simile?. You have been asking this for ages? I have replied but still you are asking? okay
All who are reading this topic.. Pls read verse 03:133 very carefully?? Does this verse has any simile or parable or allegory ? For me NO? hope for you also.. So what does this verse say? Doesn?t it say that the Garden promised is equal to the Earth and Heavens..?
The very similar verse is 57:21 and read this verse also very carefully.. Does this verse make you feel as a simile / parable / allegory? No way? (Ardhuha Ka?ardi) What is Ka?ardi (like the width).. what is the theme here in the verse ? it is the WIDTH? So God speak that in simple way THE WIDTH OF PROMISED GARDEN IS LIKE THE WIDTH OF EARTH AND HEAVEN.. No other topic only about width? it?s not simile/parable/allegory etc.
Take all Simile / parable / Allegory in entire quran.. there are many various types.. Nothing is matching with 57:21, coz 57:21 is not simile / parable / allegory? it?s a direct verse.. that?s why God placed another same verse without Ka?ardi....
Notice below verse : what is theme here? Deeds.. what is simile? Mirage.. So deeds are depicted by using mirage..
24:39But those who disbelieved - their deeds are like a mirage in a lowland which a thirsty one thinks is water until, when he comes to it, he finds it is nothing but finds Allah before Him, and He will pay him in full his due; and Allah is swift in account.
What is theme here? Moon ? what is simile? Aged stalk of date
36:39 And the moon -- We have determined it by stations, till it returns like an aged palm-bough.
That?s it folks.. you decide?
God bless all
36:39-40 has some glaring proof about real moon.. I will explain to you all in due course..Key word for that is UNTIL IT RETURNS (Haththa aada)
i have already explained that the aya 57:21 does not discuss the actual width of the earth nor the heavens. the translation of the word عَرْضُهَا is translated as mathematical width in english. In arabic its used to mean 2 things exhibition or to present and mathematical width. in the case of this aya its almost a simile as the other user suggested. the word عَرْضُهَا in the aya suggests that we will see paradise as a pysical reality just as we see the our planet. understanding the root word of عَرْضُهَا helps clear this confusion. always remember the arabic language in the quran is precise according to the context of the subject discussed and not placed in vain.
Quote from: tulipred-muslima on October 06, 2018, 06:38:07 PM
i have already explained that the aya 57:21 does not discuss the actual width of the earth nor the heavens. the translation of the word عَرْضُهَا is translated as mathematical width in english. In arabic its used to mean 2 things exhibition or to present and mathematical width. in the case of this aya its almost a simile as the other user suggested. the word عَرْضُهَا in the aya suggests that we will see paradise as a pysical reality just as we see the our planet. understanding the root word of عَرْضُهَا helps clear this confusion. always remember the arabic language in the quran is precise according to the context of the subject discussed and not placed in vain.
quote:
almost a simile Puzzling but you lean towards my conclusion.
Here is brother Noon waalqalami's translation which I find acceptable:
57:21 سبقوا race ye of الى to مغفره forgiveness من from ربكم lord yours وجنه and garden عرضها width its كعرض
like width السما the heaven/sky والارض and the land/earth اعدت prepared للذىن for the ones امنوا believes they of بالله in the god ورسله and messengers his ذلك such فضل bounty الله the god ىوتىه granted he من whom ىشا willed والله and the god ذو owner الفضل the bounty العظىم the major
Similes
use the words like or as to compare things??Life is like a box of chocolates.?
In contrast, metaphors directly state a comparison??Love is a battlefield.?
:) I hope no one thinks life is a box of chocolates
As you can see 57:21 is a simile.
Peace jkhan let's not fight
like cats and dogs :)
Dear All,
My sole aim in this forum is to spread the truth of Quran in its own meaning... I am well aware that it won't be easy for anyone to change from one status to another when it comes to belief... But still it is my duty to reveal what I have found in Quran to be true and what most people have taken as truth..
Knowing that majority always fall to the trap of Satan, still persist with what I have to do to spread the truth.. I know someone will benefit..
Let me turn towards the topic..
I thought brother Hawk got only the Quranic pure meaning wrong with the help of Satan... But now I feel he got the English also wrong.. I am not an English professor. I didn't have my education in English but I have my own brain which God cultivated...
How pathetic he got the simile entirely foolishly.. He keeps repeating movie Forrest Gump dialogue of chocolate box... So funny.. That's the most funniest similes I have heard ever.. You know why it is called like that coz " you never know which one you gonna pick from the chocolate box"... 😉..good luck with chocolate.. Whatever.. Simile is defining entirely two different things while making comparison... Yes it is.. By using like or as. While metaphor not.. It's direct but using entirely different word to the actual matter...
Now let's look 57:21 does this verse talk of entirely Two different things... What are those two different things?... Lol...
Dude Hawk.... Where did you graduated to say that when the word "Like" or "As" is used it will be only simile... Like can be prepositions too... Note... "the width of my house like the width of this house"...is it a simile? What are the two different things here used to compare? Let's take more examples.. The color of the ball on your left hand like/as the color on your right hand...
Now let's see entirely different simile... Let's take from QURAN itself.. Good Deeds are LIKE a good Tree.... Hmm they are entirely two different things good deeds vs good tree...
The one who has read entire QURAN knows what kind of simile or metaphor of parables are used in Quran by God..
I don't need to fight with any human being as he claims... If one takes the argument for truth is same as fighting then note below....
Mohamed came to a society in which different types/religious of people were living.. Those who were given scripture and not etc... When Mohamed argued with those who were given scriptures could have been always irritating coz they already believe in God and practicing what is commanded in the book.. How to believe in Mohamed? It's so impossible... But true believer wouldn't think that Mohamed is trying to divert them ...coz their faith deep rooted and it is not difficult for them to identify truth... For others Mohamed will look like fighting to convince his new invention... Truth is one and it has no second truth...
Unfortunately 3:133 is not even discussed by the one who claims that 57:21 is simile.. Coz he can't explain 3:133...
Words here I used nay be bit annoying but merely for the sake of argument.. Coz you are not the only one who is seeking guidance but all who enter to this topic and read... Among them some may be very very intelligent and totally surrendering to God and some may be intelligent and still moderate knowledge of Quran.. Etc etc
Finally 57:21 "like" is a preposition and not simile.. Coz nothing is compared there with entirely different things... It's same as we say.. The width of my hall like your hall, so we can accommodate the guests...or the size of my tab like/as the tab you are using... It's not simile but simple preposition..
He is like a machine... Simile (different items compared)
He is a Lion ... Metaphor (qualities of lion depicted for his character)
Don't destroy the meaning of 57:21 to these silly chocolate similes which u probably took from Google Search... 😉
Just look at the number of people who viewed this topic within a short period of time.. It's not coz of anyone in this forum.. But coz they all have concern about real truth.. It's coz God wants to reveal what is truth to whome He wills..
God guide us n bless us..
Peace jkhan.
Please analyse what you say here, quote:
THE ABOVE VERSE INDICATES THAT THE PARADISE (JANNAH) HAS THE WIDTH OF HEAVEN AND EARTH.. WHY GOD COMPARED THE TINY EARTH WITH HEAVEN. I DON'T KNOW SCIENCE IS PRECISE ON THE SIZE OF HEAVEN BUT, AS FAR AS WE KNOW IN OUR CURRENT KNOWLEDGE AND ACCEPTED MYTH THE HEAVEN(THE UNIVERSE IS NO WHERE NEAR TO THE SIZE OF EARTH) WHAT DOES THIS COMPARISON OF SIZE MEAN BY THIS VERSET? DOES THIS TRY TO SAY EARTH IS NOT TINY AS WE THINK? OR THE OUR BELIEF OF EARTH'S REAL SIZE IS WRONG? ALMOST IMPOSSIBLE WITH SCIENCE.. BUT THEN WHAT?
AND COMPARE THIS VERSE GOD SAYS HE CREATED UNIVERSE (TOTAL) IN SIX DAYS OUT OF THAT, IT TOOK TOTAL 2 DAYS TO CREATE EARTH.. IMAGINE THE SIZE OF UNIVERSE AND THE EARTH. WHY IT TOOK 2 DAYS COMPARED TO EVER EXPANDING UNIVERSE WHICH CONTAINS SUN MOON ALL PLANETS AND STARS ETC.. HMM EARTH IS HABITABLE AND WITH ALL RESOURCES SO IT TOOK 2 DAYS COMPARED TO WHOLE OF UNIVERSE? IS IT FAIR ENOUGH OR IS SOMETHING
Two very important issues arise:
1- Jannah is an allegory, we have no idea what it is like . So why are you assuming it cannot be the earth as we know it? Why should it be a bigger earth?
So even in your own understanding ,the width of Jannah could be the size of earth + Samawat, why not?
2- Actually it took 4 days to create living conditions on earth . i.e to create the climate ,atmosphere, the right conditions and regulate the oxygen CO2 (plants/vegetation's...Animals...etc i.e billions of years:
"Wa Kaddara Fiha Akwataha Fi Arbaati Ayyamin(4 DAYS) Sawaan Li Assailin" ..For those who ask/research...
As you can see your idea of earth could be vast/bigger or as big as Samawat/heaven is baseless.
So whether you take the simile or your understanding this will have no bearing on the size of the earth as we perceive/know now.
Your point is not valid.
GOD bless you.
Peace.
Oh... Dear dear.... What a baseless response. Answer from a person who is dejected... Self decide my argument is invalid... I wish you are not a judge in real life...
Logic... Your answers almost similar to Hawk... I wonder you both are same... Don't worry just guessing...
Quran's pure meaning cannot be twisted by your opinion... The one who is interested in extreme truth will always search and will be satisfied with what he knows... Whether I explain this topic or not people are now much concerned with the shape of the earth.. They have concern that they have been deceived... Unbelievable hike in Google Search for flat earth is evidence of it... And number of you tube videos... Why this Resurgence...
Hey buddy.... say it invalid or valid, I will be bringing proof from Quran as long as God permits me... And let people decide... I don't need anyone to come up here and say I believe you... It's not my aim or priority..
Hey... You are the one who asked the admin to block me or this topic at the very inception... Right... Thanks God it didn't last..
My private messages really encouraging me to continue this topic... Though I am working day by day for my livelihood and sustenance with much hardship.. . Honestly very limited time even to write something here.. Or even in flat earth society or you tube.... Or fb... But still managing... Hey Logic.. Such challenges from people like you makes the truth more transparent.... You know why.. When the lie is around truth is manifested... The best example in my life is Hadith... If there were no hadith, most probably I wouldn't have perceived quran in its true form.. God will otherwise..
Not only 57:21...i have brought with the help of God, many a glaring proof that this world is not a globe in this entire topic according to Quran .. Unfortunately I didn't have full cooperation from anyone throughout,, though they come up with response to my email personally... I know why.. This is a very critical topic.. They don't like to get ashamed... Coz majority have accepted the world is round... But I am glad at least their innerself have accepted that the earth is flat... Going against majority is always embarrassing and tough... But I won't give up... 😉
If world is a globe then there is no way that I can argue against it.. But it is not a globe that's why I argue and point out from QURAN... Why should I talk against what God has created while He says in the creations of Heavens and Earth and whatever between two of them is SIGN for you... Oops do I need to reject the sign? Pooh.. Did I get one sign and and people like globees got another sign?
Read Quran folks... God orders and insist to compare.. So do compare and verify...
God bless His Believers...
Hi everyone...
We have been taught and still being taught heliocentric system... Who is this Helios.. He is Sun God.. And also Sun in Greek... Those who brought this whole system is to convince their Sun worshipping... Unfortunately we are trapped... Anyway... Watch the video in the link... It really attracted me...
https://youtu.be/Xt0RW6qMbLw
Peace jkhan.
What you say about subjects do not worry me. But this is unjust, quote:
Hey... You are the one who asked the admin to block me or this topic at the very inception... Right... Thanks God it didn't last..
This is a false accusation, I do not go behind people s back. If I have any issue with them, I will say it to them in person not to others about them. Please bring your evidence .
I say it is a lie about me, please refrain from saying things about me that are not true.
I will be an hypocrite if I ever ,GOD forbid, did such a thing. I am 100% behind the freedom of choice and the rights of people whatever their views
Thank you.
GOD bless you.
Peace.
Yes... You did utter a word which really meant...go read around 6-10 of this topic...
Anyhow.. People do mistakes that makes a believer more stronger...
God bless you... And our personal argument is not important here... You bring that confirms world is globe and I will definitely bring in sha Allah to prove that earth is flat... And I already have brought.. That's more than enough for any shrewd Man to grasp...
Logic....
Peace jkhan.
You really need to reflect on this rush of blood in your threads.
I am only advising you as a friend. I have got this feeling you will regret this ,even be embarrassed in the future with what you are saying.
I have seen many come back here asking admins to delete their threads when they come to realise the nonsense of it?
Your choice.
GOD bless you.
---------------------
Didn't you write the above to me Mr. Logic?... why you need to stop the argument even before i initiate it to its peak... what connection for you with admin? and how do you know that people come admin and asking to delete their threads..? After all what's wrong in my argument? Even it is wrong for people like you, what's wrong arguing it if it is free minds' forum?
Peace.
This is a false accusation, I do not go behind people s back. If I have any issue with them, I will say it to them in person not to others about them. Please bring your evidence .
I say it is a lie about me, please refrain from saying things about me that are not true.
I will be an hypocrite if I ever ,GOD forbid, did such a thing. I am 100% behind the freedom of choice and the rights of people whatever their views
Thank you.
GOD bless you.
Peace.
------
Are you really 100% behind the freedom of choice? For me it didnt sound in that way...I love when you argue say against what i bring, so that i bring better than that.. But this admin, and delete bla bla blaa.. i don't like it from a person who is seeking truth.... Why did you call yourself as hypocrite? :&.. Trust me i will never call myself hypocrite even i do the biggest mistake in the world.. Coz i know making mistakes wont become a hypocrite... Hypocrites are born with confusion and they live in confusion and like to confuse others and dies with it..They dont do mistakes but with intention... Even hypocrites call they advise as a friend... :peace:
God bless you...
Peace jkhan.
You have brought me a post addressed to you.. I was conversing with you. And it simply meant you may realise in the future that your views are baseless and may feel embarrassed by them, hence you may regret what you are writing.
Now your accusation was serious - YOU SAID I ASKED ADMIN TO BLOCK YOU,-read your own words and how you phrased it, quote:
Hey... You are the one who asked the admin to block me or this topic at the very inception... Right... Thanks God it didn't last..
You have not brought a shred of evidence regarding your accusation. Admins can confirm that this never happened because it is false.
Please read surah 24, as you say you follow Qoran, see what GOD says about false accusations: example 24:15:
You fabricated it with your own tongues, and the rest of you repeated it with your mouths without proof. You thought it was simple, when it was, according to God, gross.
إِذ تَلَقَّونَهُ بِأَلسِنَتِكُم وَتَقولونَ بِأَفواهِكُم ما لَيسَ لَكُم بِهِ عِلمٌ وَتَحسَبونَهُ هَيِّنًا وَهُوَ عِندَ اللَّهِ عَظيمٌ
There is no big or small accusations as far as accusing anyone is concerned if one cannot bring some sort of proof.
I am fine ,I forgive you but from your side you have not reflected about what you are saying!
Also ,if you read my post properly I did not call myself a hypocrite, I said that if what you said about me was true ,it will render me a hypocrite. A big difference. You are not saying the truth brother.
Please jkhan, do not dig yourself a bigger hole . My friendly advice to a brother.
GOD bless you.
Peace.
Quote from: Makaveli on October 03, 2018, 03:14:09 AM
Earth is flat in the Quran and the Bible, their model is 100% authentic. Yet the Earth is NOT flat on physical level.
Flat Earth society is alike the 19teeners among the Quran community. Both groups talk about something, which they believe has value and which is true at some point, both groups are completely deluded about the true meaning behind it. They are also completely oblivious about the reasons behind their delusions.
Their example is like someone who has kindled a fire (enlightened the area around him), yet it did not illuminate him.
And the answer is literally everywhere around them, to the point it is painful watching another flat earther or 19er talk about something he has no clue about.
https://wikiislam.net/wiki/Flat_Earth_and_the_Quran
Quote from: NewFrenzy on October 15, 2018, 09:55:12 AM
https://wikiislam.net/wiki/Flat_Earth_and_the_Quran
Since when is an islamophobe media an authority in Qur'an?
Salaam
Quote from: huruf on October 15, 2018, 12:34:19 PM
Since when is an islamophobe media an authority in Qur'an?
Salaam
huruf I can't believe you used same "argument from authority" line that traditionalist use against you.
Would the argument be better if I said that they say nothing new or reasonable, but they do so by bringing a set of arguments which are the same as ever as if they ere bringing in something that has not otherwise available? Should it make more respectable the fact that it is a source that has its own agenda against muslims, quranists included? so what authority are you talking about?
Should they be an authority because they are islamophobes?
You have put it there as if it as an authority at least and if not why?
That we should make annybody an authority because they are islamophobes should be more respectable?
is that your argument?
Adding dry wood to the fire of muslim flat earthers to inflate the reputation of backwardness for muslims, quranists included, at large is really a great idea? Should we contribute to their popularity as redeemers of muslims?
I find the whole thing disgusting.
A flat earth I can merely watch and say nothing, a flat and islamophobe earth is too much of a muchness.
Salaam
Quote from: jkhan on October 13, 2018, 05:04:33 AM
Dear All,
My sole aim in this forum is to spread the truth of Quran in its own meaning... I am well aware that it won't be easy for anyone to change from one status to another when it comes to belief... But still it is my duty to reveal what I have found in Quran to be true and what most people have taken as truth..
Knowing that majority always fall to the trap of Satan, still persist with what I have to do to spread the truth.. I know someone will benefit..
[...]
Just look at the number of people who viewed this topic within a short period of time.. It's not coz of anyone in this forum.. But coz they all have concern about real truth.. It's coz God wants to reveal what is truth to whome He wills..
God guide us n bless us..
Yes look at the numbers. How many people have you scared away from "the truth" if there is any in this place, just because you felt compelled to push this flat earth ideology that is by the way not new at all ? No one can tell.
How much does the shape of the earth affect people's lives ? How does it affect their attitude, character, lifestyle and thoughts on their day-to-day life ? Totally irrelevant.
All you have to do is to look around you and see if what you think you have to say is relevant, starting from yourself, obviously the shape of the earth doesn't add anything to the quality of your life, then what is your aim ? And is it reasonable or purely self-centered ?
Ask yourself these questions honestly, not with a defensive mindset.
Quote from: jkhan on October 13, 2018, 05:04:33 AM
Simile is defining entirely two different things while making comparison... Yes it is.. By using like or as. 57:21 does
Congratulations!
Quote from: jkhan on October 13, 2018, 05:04:33 AM
.. Note... "the width of my house like the width of this house"...is it a simile?
:brickwall: no, houses are not two different things :brickwall:
Quote from: jkhan on October 13, 2018, 05:04:33 AM
Let's take from QURAN itself.. Good Deeds are LIKE a good Tree....
Good Deeds are LIKE a good Tree is a metaphor or proverb not a simile.
[14:24] Have you not considered how Allah presents (mathalan)
an example, a good word
like a good tree, whose root is firmly fixed and its branches [high] in the sky? :hmm
In any chase by now anyone should be able to understand that 57:21 is not literal,
I hope you can understand that 57:21 is not literal as well.
:peace:
Hello Cerberus
7:146 Sahih International: I (God) will turn away from My signs those who are arrogant upon the earth without right; and if they should see every sign, they will not believe in it. And if they see the way of consciousness, they will not adopt it as a way; but if they see the way of error, they will adopt it as a way. That is because they have denied Our signs and they were heedless of them.
35:8 Sahih International: Then is one to whom the evil of his deed has been made attractive so he considers it good [like one rightly guided]? For indeed, Allah sends astray whom He wills and guides whom He wills. So do not let yourself perish over them in regret. Indeed, Allah is Knowing of what they do.
18:6 Pickthall: Yet it may be, if they believe not in this statement (quran), that thou (Muhammad) wilt torment thy soul with grief over their footsteps.
I would like to begin my response with the above three verses? so no worries about those who accept that the earth is globe or Heaven is nothing and those who have no idea what the earth is?. Let them be in their confusion? I am not gonna bother.. I have a job to do.. I will do it in sha allah ?
Yes look at the numbers. How many people have you scared away from "the truth" if there is any in this place, just because you felt compelled to push this flat earth ideology that is by the way not new at all ? No one can tell.
So, you have decided what the TRUTH is without proving anything. It shows you have surrendered to something as true and calling me scaring the people away from that truth which is in your mindset which you have surrendered? I wish I could scare people?. Ha ha ha.. What you think Cerburus? People are so awkward or helpless or nonsensical to get scared to me or to what I utter ?. They all free from restrictions of thoughts? Let each individual decide what he or she has in their minds?Don?t self pretend to think that they are compelled here or scared? That?s an absolute biased statement supporting your belief with depression? Yes it?s not new? But there is no harm in reminding?. Reminder will benefit if God will..
How much does the shape of the earth affect people's lives ? How does it affect their attitude, character, lifestyle and thoughts on their day-to-day life ? Totally irrelevant.
3:190 Sahih International: Indeed, in the creation of the heavens and the earth and the alternation of the night and the day are SIGNS for those of understanding.
30:22 Sahih International: And of His SIGNS is the creation of the heavens and the earth and the diversity of your languages and your colors. Indeed in that are SIGNS for those of knowledge / all living beings (alamin)
Why do I need all these SIGNS for life? Unless deeply study and cultivate our knowledge and compare with Quran, Will we ever know what actually God has created as heavens and earth and its signs? What are they before believe in God and His existence? Does it matter or not? For you Cerburus and to those who rely totally on theory invented by Polytheists, it is not relevant or not important.. BUT for me it is very very significant and imperative.. even to understand whether actually there is GOD or NOT.. How grave is that? You want us to blindly believe the shape of the heavens and earth OR just be satisfied with what science already say and close the chapter by accepting it as a dogma which does befit with all aspects and has NO fallacy, without being posing question against it? You want me to nourish it?You do it.. but I won?t.. ?don't blindly accept dogma as justification until it is justified? I need to compare and verify and I did compare and did verify and I found that?s a great deception.. Living in Deception is the worst in life one could ever experience? for instance.. If one?s wife says that I am the most trustworthy wives of this world ever, and made him to convince by way of meticulously deceiving and he is satisfied without any question being raised?Does that life have any meaning? That?s stupidity with blindness while having sight? So, I don?t need anyone to dupe me with their dogma while I raise question and they laugh without answering as if everything in the dogma is precise?That?s the greatest deception..
All you have to do is to look around you and see if what you think you have to say is relevant, starting from yourself, obviously the shape of the earth doesn't add anything to the quality of your life, then what is your aim ? And is it reasonable or purely self-centered ?
Quality of My life depends on how I reason and judge things? Yes.. shape of the earth add everything to me to believe in Quran?Did I believe in quran without verification or with emotion or for fear or for the sake of society and benefit? NO.. Believing in Quran means directly believing in GOD? to believe in God verify what God says in His book and compare it with what we are inculcated outside the quran and with what is naturally do exist. If I talk in public that the earth is not GLOBE, and if people mock hearing it; means that?s the accepted undeniable truth in the erudite society? So if that is the accepted unchallengeable shape of the earth and heavens then the BOOK/ Quran must GO IN LINE WITH IT, otherwise book is erroneous and there is NO GOD? and conclude, No one created the Heavens and Earth?Got me why it is relevant to me??.. Heavens and Earth and whatever between them is what all God has created and nothing else He created other than that for us... One of the key questions God poses at us saying He created the Heavens and Earth and So will you take another Deity with GOD? I would definitely take another Ilah (god/Deity) if I don?t understand what He has created and if I consider it immaterial / minute? Why so many people are Atheist coz they accept the world is globe and it is not created ? reason behind it is that world is a tiny mote inside immeasurable universe and insignificant and it is not a creation.. coz they believe in evolution and not in creation? I can easily drag my mind towards atheism, if I take the reality of heavens and earth to be irrelevant? How many times heavens and earth and sun and moon mentioned in quran? Is it coz it is immaterial to the quality of our life?
what is your aim ? And is it reasonable or purely self-centered ?
What is the AIM of God when He created Moses and all his life and sending to few haughty / aggressive and violent people who would never change and never did destined for hell?And poor Moses was trying hard with all SIGNS unwittingly, but God knew those Pharaoh, Haman, Qarun will not reform.. What is the aim of God? And these stories were included in quran as well.. what is the aim? What did we learn? Is it relevant to our life at all? Or isn?t it? AIM is to spread the truth and not being able to say that WE ARE NOT AWARE OF IT.. Is it reasonable for GOD to play around with Moses life with those violent cluster knowing what is the outcome.. AIM is clear? pervade what is intended by GOD?
My aim is to say to GOD that I spread the guidance I got from GOD.. and I won?t wait untill others accept or reject it? On the day of Questioning if GOD asked me, I guided you.. Did you live as per my guidance and did you spread the true guidance or you lived selfishly? That?s my aim.. Don?t ask the aim but find out the aim and decide and be who you are as you want.. no worries?what is the aim of Free-minds? Do we need to ask? Or we can conclude what their aim and what is the result of it..
What is the aim of Maseeh when he presented all those signs to his community? Was it O! you people all of you surrender and make me happy? NO? just to spread the truth? Let them decide what was the aim behind it? So, will it be like self centered attitude? It depends on how the people judged Maseeh son of Maryam.. for those rejected him would have looked like self centered approach..
What is the aim of Moon landing? Will it be the same answer ? Lol
What is the aim of calling earth is globe ? aims are not answered unless we use our wits?
What is the aim of 9/11?... ????
What is the aim of creating us? Find out for all aims, rather than ask others while you have an answer of your choice?
If someone says my aim is to keep you happy forever.. will my answer be like?Wow how generous you are.. I am really thankful? or it should be like.. let?s see how it goes? AIMs are known with time and proper application of thoughts on what is going on of the outcome?.otherwise it will be only lip service or merely aims not even bothered to execute..
Ask yourself these questions honestly, not with a defensive mindset.
Ask yourself the same with whatever mindset you prefer to..?
Why it is so hard to prove that world is a globe if really quran instruct in that manner? Further you have the strong buttress of NASA and the technology and the 99% of the world community to add to it.. So prove it? bring your proofs.. let me or anyone who is convinced that the earth is flat may answer with quran only?Don?t keep uttering the same dogma in the form of science which has not proved it with verification..How any FE can disapprove which has been verified.. Is verification not an authority of trust?
God bless believers
Ok you want to "believe in quran". But you forget these things: You are the one reading it, and that reading depends on your capabilities, which also depends on how far are you are willing to go in your studies, and the depth of your understandings. So at the end of the process it's no longer "believe in quran" rather it is to believe in the belief you constructed from your reading of the quran. That's a big difference.
Oops off topic. So let's watch some videos...
https://youtu.be/tqKjcqcSh4Y
How courageous people are to spread the truth... God bless them and guide them...
Peace jkhan.
So it comes to videos? What happened to Qoran?
Brother Cerberus has given you the benefit of a doubt and is asking you to search INSIDE YOU,
But you keep searching outside you and outside Qoran?
So are you just giving lip service to Qoran?
Do you really see the irony ?
Or may be your videos have got more truths than NASA videos?
We are here to reflect about the shape of our "Nafs" first and foremost?
Yes brother, follow Qoran and find your real self, then you will see reality and you will become less "fanatic" about false truths.
By all means discuss the shape of the earth but also realise salvation is about "Tuzakki" your own soul. This is the most important truth.
GOD bless you.
Peace.
Quote from: Cerberus on October 18, 2018, 05:20:00 PM
Ok you want to "believe in quran". But you forget these things: You are the one reading it, and that reading depends on your capabilities, which also depends on how far are you are willing to go in your studies, and the depth of your understandings. So at the end of the process it's no longer "believe in quran" rather it is to believe in the belief you constructed from your reading of the quran. That's a big difference.
Spot on, Cerberus, better cannot be said.
That is the usual trouble, to take an opinion, and consecrate it into truth. Of ocurse it is legitimate to have an opinion and many opinions, but one cheats himself when one confuses his or her on opinion with truth. One may believe it is truth, but it is still an opinion, and it is dangerous to promote it into anything else, because then you are confusing yourself with infallibility. And nobody is infallible. Even if many times we are right
we still are not infallible. So when e believe ourselves infallible even if it is only in one thing we do commit shirk, because al Haqq is only God, we are servants, oshippers of it, not the owners.
We may be right, of course, but we are not to pose as if we knew everything, because even if we are right it is still only partial and only an opinion, it may be a relief or a mercy of God, but it is not ours and we do not possess truth.
And also, it is also very, very childish and silly to turn certain kinds of things into a question of truth or lie. Eventually, God says so in the Qur'an He will show us truth. Till that moment our truths are provisional, interine. We gain nothing by becoming warriors for it. The wrong war, rather the right war or the right to competition would be to be merciful and generous with all as best as we are able and to the best of our understanding. The war for flat earth of unflat earth should not be on the level of faith or truth but on the level of humble study. Truth Al Haqq owns us, we do not own it.
Salaam
Quote from: Cerberus on October 18, 2018, 05:20:00 PM
Ok you want to "believe in quran". But you forget these things: You are the one reading it, and that reading depends on your capabilities, which also depends on how far are you are willing to go in your studies, and the depth of your understandings. So at the end of the process it's no longer "believe in quran" rather it is to believe in the belief you constructed from your reading of the quran. That's a big difference.
He is in loving Allah and doing jihad as Allah said he will bring a people who will love him,
Al-Ma'idah 5:54
يَٰٓأَيُّهَا ٱلَّذِينَ ءَامَنُوا۟ مَن يَرْتَدَّ مِنكُمْ عَن دِينِهِۦ فَسَوْفَ يَأْتِى ٱللَّهُ بِقَوْمٍ يُحِبُّهُمْ وَيُحِبُّونَهُۥٓ أَذِلَّةٍ عَلَى ٱلْمُؤْمِنِينَ أَعِزَّةٍ عَلَى ٱلْكَٰفِرِينَ يُجَٰهِدُونَ فِى سَبِيلِ ٱللَّهِ وَلَا يَخَافُونَ لَوْمَةَ لَآئِمٍۚ ذَٰلِكَ فَضْلُ ٱللَّهِ يُؤْتِيهِ مَن يَشَآءُۚ وَٱللَّهُ وَٰسِعٌ عَلِيمٌ
O you who have believed, whoever of you should revert from his religion - Allah will bring forth [in place of them] a people He will love and who will love Him [who are] humble toward the believers, powerful against the disbelievers; they strive in the cause of Allah and do not fear the blame of a critic. That is the favor of Allah ; He bestows it upon whom He wills. And Allah is all-Encompassing and Knowing.
Quote from: huruf on October 15, 2018, 12:34:19 PM
Since when is an islamophobe media an authority in Qur'an?
Salaam
That is a great page on flat Earth and the Quran.
You don't like it I understand I also used to hate it but now I like it. Now I m reading many stuffs which I used to hate.
And that is not an Islamophobe media that is also like a user in this forum posting his views opinions interpretations which you may dislike.
Quote from: NewFrenzy on October 19, 2018, 08:17:06 AM
That is a great page on flat Earth and the Quran.
You don't like it I understand I also used to hate it but now I like it. Now I m reading many stuffs which I used to hate.
And that is not an Islamophobe media that is also like a user in this forum posting his views opinions interpretations which you may dislike.
I do not hate that page or anything. I am not a perosn able to hate, but a disapprove it and consider it prejudicial to many people.
It is islamophobe, but another thing is that you consider that there is a certains strain of islamophobe that you like or that you approve of.
I accpet hat anybody may believe the earth is flat or that the with of this or that is such and such even if I do not believe it myself, being rong is not the same thing as being will willed.
Islmaophobes are ill willed. They spend efforts and money, not theirs, in spreading it and iving every kind of
"proof" that islamophobia is justifiedIt is exactly the same thing as hen yougo about jews being this or that, but you will say but all jews ar enot like onlu some of them, there you are, then do not speak about jews at all, speak about people that this or that, exactly like the qur'an does. Those who do this or that, it is what they do what is right or wrong, not being knows as jew or muslim or christian. Don't you think that we could also create a great christianofobe page? There is no less material for it than there is for islamophobia.
Of course I will never approve of criating a chroanophobe pago ar any kind of ---fobe page. Than why should I approve of any islamohpobe page?
Wrong muslims are no less deserving of respect than wrong anything.
Salaam
Quote from: good logic on October 19, 2018, 02:42:27 AM
Brother Cerberus has given you the benefit of a doubt and is asking you to search INSIDE YOU,
But you keep searching outside you and outside Qoran?
yes, I agree with you Good logic, to search inside of us for the truth.
51:20 And on the earth are signs for those who comprehend.
51:21 And within yourselves; do you not see?within ourselves, we can find the truth.
41:53 We will show them Our signs in the horizons, and within themselves, until it becomes clear to them that this is the truth. Is it not enough that your Lord is witness over all things?We can compare the creation of the universe with the creation of man,..it just about the scale.
40:57 The creation of the heavens and the earth is greater than the creation of the people, but most of the people do not know.I have my own opinion regarding "searching inside of us" for the truth in here,
https://free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9609156.msg413444#msg413444
Hope it helps.
Salaam
Hi Logic and the rest...
Yes brother quran is core for the believer and that's why from the beginning I started this topic with Quran.. But it does not mean that we should neglect our senses and the rest we perceive... Quran is instructions for salvation and at the same time wisdom and truth and proofs for many researches... It doesn't mean that we read Quran and read and be satisfied and agree... No.. Not for me.. Once thorough with Quran then go search and find faults in Quran if possible that I don't see... For example God says to observe how the camel is created... So I cant keep reading it again and again or just like many mainstream guys keep reading it in Arabic hoping you would get benefit... No way.. Once God has said to see how camel is created go look how it is created and why it is created like that or is it created or evolution and why things are perfect... Etc. Etc. Don't tell me brother logic to bring quran and not videos... I know what i am doing... When God says we created two seas and both not join... So search, if not possible find out what others have searched and verify.... Quran is like school.. You remain as long as they keep you, once done keep moving and do research what's taught in school rather than ponder and be satisfied what's taught in school is absolutely right and I am gonna live accordingly.. That's insane... That will make you a blind mere follower..
Yes MissHuruf and Cerberus everyone look at quran in their own angle.. Hadith believers found quran says they should follow hadith and they bring loads of verses to support it and you can keep denying them with what you understood.. So who is right and who is wrong and who will decide what's right.. Same Christians and jews and Hindus etc.. They all will claim they are right and rest are wring.. People can argue and they will bring their own proof and matter will go on.... But as I said earlier in one of my responses... "GUIDANCE CANNOT BE OF WRONG CHOICE " Then it is not guidance.. Yes God guides and if you feel if you are guided and if you are 100 % sure that doesn't end there.. Coz God guides..God definitely will make you feel bothered that you are wrong till He guides if you are someone destined for His mercy n guidance... . And until u die.. That's TEST... Then you should have that guts and strength and open mindedness to accept that I was wrong when truth is manifested... But for some they may think till their death they are guided but in fact not... Problem here is if Logic or Huruf or Cerberus or others feel that they are on right path and I have to accept that I am on wrong path.. Coz I don't accept the way they believe... Now who will judge here who is on the guidance.. No one can ... Right... That's why God tests with our senses... No one has seen the world is round but all are theory but there is one TRUTH... It is there in a shape how God created... BTW God didn't say it's a secret or rather Ghaib... That's where senses comes into effect.. Perceive it, feel it verify it and compare with God's book... Have you done it?... Or you guys remain firm on something which has been taught to you and trying manipulate words according to what's taught... Then God's guidance is not there... Leave everything what has been taught and start fresh and start ponder with your own knowledge so you are not biased to anyone or even to quran.. Then compare with quran if you have totally surrendered to QURAN... Surrender doesn't mean your heart accepted everything and not harbouring any doubt.. Surrending is just a reaction towards something with intention and not practical in all aspects, but a long process of reforming..
God kept in everything what is against the truth...coz God wants to guide whom He wills... But Satan wants to misguide.. So he spread his deception everywhere.. But he forgot his deception makes the believer more stronger.. For disbeliever Satan's deception is decorated... Unless this spinning ball theory is there I won't research the flat earth to this extent... God's plan is great.... God is using Satan itself for the true guidance of believers.. Satan invent and we go away from it though whole world surrender to it... God says we make our signs prevail UNTILL they know it is the truth... So if world is globe does it mean God brought the Truth or some yester year Sun worshipping Greek or NASA... In my experience God won't bring anything at once as truth... Only gradually it comes out ... If world is globe nothing to be brought as truth and everything is already exposed... That doesn't match with the Quranic verse... I trust the minority... Coz I know majority will trust Satan.. Coz Satan words are so fancy and attractive.. In fancy and attraction deception is hidden...
After seeing some of these public videos, I personally feel how far Satan has convinced the hearts of people...
I wish God guide you all... But unfortunately God never change until we change ourself. . God bless believers.
https://youtu.be/bJyT2hD8ox0
https://youtu.be/M2qwvAivfGM
Watch it pls when u have time...
Most heated and surging topic in the internet and here it is moved to off topic.no idea what forum rules.. . Not an issue anyway...
https://youtu.be/ujBBLYHBsQY
Watch this cool video... You can also do such while you fly...what is best than self perceptions and verification..
God bless believers
14:10 -- Their Messengers said:"What ! Can there be a DOUBT (Shaq) about Allah, the Creator of the heavens and the Earth?..... ..."
This was the identical question of almost all Prophets who came before Mohammed... Verify the verses preceding and following...
Now if we ask the same question from a disbeliever "What! Can you doubt God who created the Heavens and the Earth?... Now other question will be what Heavens and Earth? Is it about immeasurable heavens and ever spinning Earth?... or about what actually do exist? . If the messengers of that time and the common people were on a different belief about the heavens and the Earth then... People would have raised questions... Which heaven and earth you are talking about O! Messengers ?... Is it about your belief or our belief of heavens and Earth ..? What a tragedy...
Coz their question was "" CAN THERE BE DOUBT OF GOD ...."? if the shape of heavens and the Earth is not clear to the people... How can the messengers even ask Can you doubt? So before raise that question it should be the duty of those messengers to explain what is heaven and earth as per revelation ... I am sure as mentioned in Quran there would have been clear mentioning of heaven and earth in previous revelations... It also make me to think that people who lived before Mohamed and duirng Mohamed didn't have any objection in taking the earth as they saw and the heavens as they saw.... But people of Greek at a later time changes with an invention to support their Helios (Sun) worship and that creeped into the ideology of NASA from 1957 and that became the dogma of the world for modern society and with the hoax of moon landing it has become unchallegeable... But will God make the truth die?... No... He will gradually let it loose... Didn't the hadith remain as the accepted doctrine among the supper majority of Muslim more than millennium .. Now isn't it being questioned regularly ... Aren't the people slowly opening their eyes and getting away from it...
""can there be doubt of God, Creator of heavens and Earth?... Now that's the biggest issue for atheist claim we don't believe in creation coz this earth is tiny mote and insignificant and it is not created and we doubt God.... Ponder people.... What is more significant? Earth being tiny ball ever travelling or earth being a massive land inside a closed system giving much importance to what is living in it.... That makes to believe in God....
May I Know what will fall down on us as per below verse? If the earth is a ball and there is no structure above us called a heaven?.
22:65 Do you not see that Allah has subjected to you whatever is on the earth and the ships which run through the sea by His command? And He restrains the sky from falling upon the earth, unless by His permission. Indeed Allah , to the people, is Kind and Merciful.
May God guide us...
A meteorite is a solid piece of debris from an object, such as a comet, asteroid, or meteoroid, that originates in outer space and survives its passage through the atmosphere to reach the surface of a planet or moon.
Quote from: imrankhawaja on February 08, 2019, 10:34:56 AM
A meteorite is a solid piece of debris from an object, such as a comet, asteroid, or meteoroid, that originates in outer space and survives its passage through the atmosphere to reach the surface of a planet or moon.
I knew any of the globe head would say this.... I can't help you guys... Unless you don't change the meaning of sky to objects...
Take care brother... What's wrong with your intellect... Has Allah used sama to solid object in Quran... This is sky / sama ...why Allah should say so is coz its a ceiling a dome...
This verse is more than enough though I brought many... Answers of those who deny is very strange... While they argue other general topics with immaculately with precise grammar.... But here totally deny a straightforward word... I wonder another will. Come up saying it is mataphore...
First find out what Quran says about the earth and heaven then research eclipses...
My advises won't work out... Coz you are convinced not coz QURAN says it is ball but coz NASA says and majority says... Talk to your heart find the truth from the beginning by being zero to both globe and flat... Then search quran...
God will one day you will know where you lived all these years on spinning or stationay...
God guide you
may b NASA is the creator of comets in sky.in case they are fake.
becoz i saw a (thing) with a sparkling tail up above the horizon three or four times with my own eyes what was that ?
Peace jkhan.
When I look up I see "Samaa" which has earth atmosphere, then above that there are heavenly bodies like sun, moon ,other planets, stars, meteorites?.etc. What is it that is likely to fall into earth?
You would assume the object in the sky that fall, because the sky without object is nothing/fresh air
So these verses all mention Sama or Samawat :
22:63
Do you not see that God sends down from the sky water that turns the land green? God is Sublime, Cognizant.
أَلَم تَرَ أَنَّ اللَّهَ أَنزَلَ مِنَ السَّماءِ ماءً فَتُصبِحُ الأَرضُ مُخضَرَّةً إِنَّ اللَّهَ لَطيفٌ خَبيرٌ
This sky in this verse ,it is the clouds that bring the rain not the sky without them!
22:64
To Him belongs everything in the heavens/sky and everything on earth. Absolutely, God is the Most Rich, Most Praiseworthy.
لَهُ ما فِى السَّمٰوٰتِ وَما فِى الأَرضِ وَإِنَّ اللَّهَ لَهُوَ الغَنِىُّ الحَميدُ
22:65
Do you not see that God has committed in your service everything on earth? The ships run in the ocean by His command. He prevents the heavenly bodies from crashing onto the earth, except in accordance with His command. God is Most Kind towards the people, Most Merciful.
أَلَم تَرَ أَنَّ اللَّهَ سَخَّرَ لَكُم ما فِى الأَرضِ وَالفُلكَ تَجرى فِى البَحرِ بِأَمرِهِ وَيُمسِكُ السَّماءَ أَن تَقَعَ عَلَى الأَرضِ إِلّا بِإِذنِهِ إِنَّ اللَّهَ بِالنّاسِ لَرَءوفٌ رَحيمٌ
Similarly here it is the heavenly bodies that crash into the earth,not the sky by itself(fresh air) planets,meterorites...etc
Anyway ,NASA has nothing to do with heavenly bodies being in the sky.
GOD bless you.
Peace.
Dear believers....
Why you violate the straight forward word of Quran... Sama is sky/ heaven.... It is not mentioned anything other than sky... Note.. " ..... Withholds the sama (sky) lest/that IT should fall over/on Earth...."..does the word say instead if IT ..lest THEY should fall on earth... No... Singular sky God used and singular IT used..... Though sky has seven layers it is one thing... Has it mentioned OBJECTS ? How many objects God has mentioned which is floating in the sky.. So Many...and many more which are not mentioned... God says they all floating/swiming ..He could have specifically said those objects fall FROM the sky... It is not the case.. But sky itself.... God withhold IT(sky)....if the sky happen to fall objects/cellestial bodies will any way fall... Use common sense...
Yes rain falling from. The sky.. Coz sky is seven layers one above the other. sky at the extreme end is a structure solid... Above all those layers.. Layers are just mere elements or rather change of atmosphere in between the certain altitudes each layers differs..thats samawathi.. . .. rain fall from the lowest of lowest layers of sky...
Note below.. I have brought this verse previously in this topic...
52:44 And if they were to see a piece of the sama heaven/sky falling down, they would say: "Clouds gathered in heaps!
How perfect... 22:65 has no FROM or OF sky,, but 52:44 is clearly says piece/fragment(kisaf) FROM/OF the sky... Kisaf is not celestial body... Kisaf here completely a fragment / portion / piece from the sky....
Still confused..? See how God explains...
"" ... They would say clouds gathered in heaps """
Note the difference... If any celestial bodies fallen on earth ever even seen live or old traces... All has no connection to compare them as heaped up clouds... No similarity at all.... Heaped up clouds has no similarity with those what you claim of falling such as asteroid, space junks.. etc..
God knows what He speaks while using only Sama...
Only intelligent one will understand if the mind is not biased...
May God open our eyes to truth if we are in error...
God beautified(zeena) the SKY of Dunya with (lamps/stars/galaxies/clusters) etc.
God is lord of sirius ?
hez the one who created heavens with layers.
we send down ?iron?(hadeed) from heavens so that you can take advantage from its strength.
SKY is not empty but its more complicated than human being. and see we dnt even know there is a full universe is going on in every cell of body.
thats y again the creation of heavens and earth is far noticeable/complicated than creation of human.
all is from book Quran i dunt know brother which ? sky? you are talking about.
Salam!
وَأَنَّا لَمَسْنَا ٱلسَّمَآءَ فَوَجَدْنَٰهَا مُلِئَتْ حَرَسًۭا شَدِيدًۭا وَشُهُبًۭا
وَأَنَّا كُنَّا نَقْعُدُ مِنْهَا مَقَٰعِدَ لِلسَّمْعِ ۖ فَمَن يَسْتَمِعِ ٱلْءَانَ يَجِدْ لَهُۥ شِهَابًۭا رَّصَدًۭا
072:008 And we stretched towards heaven, but we found it filled with terrible guards and meteors.
072:009 We would sit there on seats to hear; but any listening now finds a meteor in wait for him.
Where did Jinns sit and try to listen?
anyone?
Quote from: imrankhawaja on February 08, 2019, 08:57:50 PM
God beautified(zeena) the SKY of Dunya with (lamps/stars/galaxies/clusters) etc.
God is lord of sirius ?
hez the one who created heavens with layers.
we send down ?iron?(hadeed) from heavens so that you can take advantage from its strength.
SKY is not empty but its more complicated than human being. and see we dnt even know there is a full universe is going on in every cell of body.
thats y again the creation of heavens and earth is far noticeable/complicated than creation of human.
all is from book Quran i dunt know brother which ? sky? you are talking about.
Brother IK
We have read Quran.. Right... There are lots of such things they are not Sky ITSELF...they are the things called whatever between the earth and sky.....we created heavens and the Earth and whatever between Them (dual) .... Don't pls spoil the meaning of sky....
Quote from: jkhan on February 08, 2019, 09:42:29 PM
Brother IK
We have read Quran.. Right... There are lots of such things they are not Sky ITSELF...
ohh its interesting point and i wonder why you are telling me this ?
i suppose if i ask from anybody SKY = (comet, sun, star) they will correct me too.
they will reply me (no).
sky = sky, comet = comet, sun = sun, star = star
Quote from: imrankhawaja on February 08, 2019, 11:36:58 PM
ohh its interesting point and i wonder why you are telling me this ?
i suppose if i ask from anybody SKY = (comet, sun, star) they will correct me too.
they will reply me (no).
sky = sky, comet = comet, sun = sun, star = star
Brother..
Keeo to the topic and specially word sama is concern now ...
God says we placed constellation /big stars in the sky.... Does that mean constellation itself sky.... Constellation is in the sky.... Constellation cannot become sky....
Sky is above our heads be you on the lowest land or Everest peak.... It will reach till it reaches to its end... That's some.. So whatever between is layers samawathi... Layers are with intention...simpl thought... We see always blue sky... But is actually the sky blue? No... It is the one of the layers of sky which looks blue... And the clouds don't pass that blue layer.... Just see a high altitude balloon... From there you can see down the it looks bluish and up is pitch dark... Nothing of the earth is visible the far you reach... Coz you will only see the blueness like we see from down day time sky background behind clouds is blue.. So if the balloon if we pass the blue layer then we see the same scenario from there down blue... Up dark... That's why I always say the pictures taken from moon or some showing the earth in it Africa visible and clouds scattered is such a crap... It is impossible seeing Africa ...or even clouds.. This blue layer will make everything beneath it invisible... Same the blue sky makes everything behind it invisible during day... Except sun and moon since they are light sources.. But night is different.. There is no sunlight so whatever behind this blue layer is visible since they are light sources...
Quote from: TellMeTheTruth on February 08, 2019, 09:14:52 PM
Salam!
وَأَنَّا لَمَسْنَا ٱلسَّمَآءَ فَوَجَدْنَٰهَا مُلِئَتْ حَرَسًۭا شَدِيدًۭا وَشُهُبًۭا
وَأَنَّا كُنَّا نَقْعُدُ مِنْهَا مَقَٰعِدَ لِلسَّمْعِ ۖ فَمَن يَسْتَمِعِ ٱلْءَانَ يَجِدْ لَهُۥ شِهَابًۭا رَّصَدًۭا
072:008 And we stretched towards heaven, but we found it filled with terrible guards and meteors.
072:009 We would sit there on seats to hear; but any listening now finds a meteor in wait for him.
Where did Jinns sit and try to listen?
anyone?
Dear TMTT
I don't know what your belief and understanding based on QURAN is globe or not...
But these two verses are wonderful....
See the galaxy picture... All bodies are rotating and the space Down and up away from galaxy is complete darkness.... No barriers...
Now where actually these Jinns going with the intention of listening malaikas of innumerable... Are the malaikas inside the galaxy? Lol... And moving along with galaxy... It's moving 2.1 million km/hr... So if the jinn pass away from galaxy and to reach endless space to listen elite groups... Then getting back to galaxy is beyond reach...
Simply where is the place jinn going in search of spying to malaika?
Dear.. We men and jinn inside a closed chamber... No escape....
Peace all
In fact it is not the fault of you thise who believe in Globe spin.... It is the fault of beginning of your life and indoctrination...
Why?
Undeniably we learned to read and write at very early stage and went on to learn in depth various subjects and one of them is about the earth and heaven.... So we are taught and equipped to face the society in confidence...
Ask yourself Did you learn to understand QURAN first or to understand what is taught in college and high school... Once instilled it is hard to tackle against... We are groomed with the knowledge of globe head... Meanwhile with the time people approach holy books for guidance since they start to understand that life is nothing... So, some got deep rooted and practice various things in society and some learn QURAN to say against what society practice... But this earth globe and spin most of those not touch in Quran coz they were busy struggling against hadith followers.. .. Even those who look them in Quran would only will start to think that what is told in science is matching with Quran coz it is hard to keep aside what's taught in high school... So they try to go inline with Quran and invention with the help of some who has put many articles claiming science prove this and that and QURAN has said it ages back.... So this fellow get more convinced... And suddenly there comes a notion of flat earth... What would one can do now... Totally built in to adapt to what he was programmed and finds it so hard to digest....quickly decide that they are fools.... Even the verses he sees glaring he will try to divert to make the verses upside down or in the end mock.... He is lost in front of truth coz of the way he came all the way... It is like one who is born and brought up in well accepted any idol worshipping religious belief and he spend half of his life and suddenly one says... Only one God belief is the right choice... He won't listen.. He only will hate it... Coz he can't bear it.. He can't take it to his life all anew again... But God will he will....
That's the story of those who believed something blindly by not counter questioning but supported and strenthened the belief on what is taught with...
May God guide us...
Well, it is also hard for me to understand how there are still people defending the spinning earth, the space and the possibility of extraterrestials. Most of them are atheists to be honest, i have friends who are not flat earthers but dont believe that we are on a spinning ball, with all that evidence we have. And they have never read any scriptures, now they at least believe of a possibilty of an almighty God, a creator. And there are some who are just cowards, afraid of the ruling elite and of the consequences. I myself am coming of an atheist background until i witnessed the power of ALLAH. I had also my time to accept that Truth because i loved space and all that astronomical Stuff...
?Our Lord, we have wronged ourselves, and if You do not forgive us and have mercy upon us, we will surely be among the losers.? (7:23)
Quote from: Abaddon on February 09, 2019, 07:08:37 PM
Well, it is also hard for me to understand how there are still people defending the spinning earth, the space and the possibility of extraterrestials. Most of them are atheists to be honest, i have friends who are not flat earthers but dont believe that we are on a spinning ball, with all that evidence we have. And they have never read any scriptures, now they at least believe of a possibilty of an almighty God, a creator. And there are some who are just cowards, afraid of the ruling elite and of the consequences. I myself am coming of an atheist background until i witnessed the power of ALLAH. I had also my time to accept that Truth because i loved space and all that astronomical Stuff...
?Our Lord, we have wronged ourselves, and if You do not forgive us and have mercy upon us, we will surely be among the losers.? (7:23)
Peace
I am really immensely pleased to hear your thread, not coz you believe in the shape of the earth, but coz you have become a believer from the state of atheist.... God has blessed you... How fortunate you are to be guided to right path.... Whether you were a Christian, or Jew or Hindu or budhist before but you didn't believe in God's power now you believe Him.. That's the the difference... And not what culture or what religion background we are born....
Salvation is only accepting the Creator..
God guide you... And if you don't mind I personally like to hear your story....
May Peace and blessings be upon you too, brother! I have sent you a PM.
Quote from: Abaddon on February 10, 2019, 02:22:33 PM
May Peace and blessings be upon you too, brother! I have sent you a PM.
Thank you...
God is with you as long as you are with him..
Salam!
@JKhan!
As per Qura'n I have to use my own Eyes/Sight, Ears/Hearing and Qalb/Intellect to understand things/matters around me. These are the gifts which will be questioned. So I try to use these gifts at my level best. I see the Earth Flat and not Spinning Globe. But it is not flat as a plain. It has mountains, rivers, paths, high and low lands. It would be flattened at the Hour. I have seen the Earth from above i.e., mountains and it seems flat to me. I have seen NASA videos, which use fish-eye lens and other techniques to prove it a sphere. I know how lens work. I am an expert in Adobe Photoshop and I know how to manipulate images. However, I do not follow the FES like others. I keep away from sects and leaders.
I have Qura'n with me as an Imam and a Ruh. I can see what Allah has revealed and why. It has guaranteed me the success in this world and in the Hereafter. It tells me that this worldly life is just a deception. Real life would be after it. So I am waiting to meet the God who has created me and given such gifts to see His wonderful signs all around me and appreciate Him as much as I can. I wish everyone could study Qura'n without bias and never think that he/she is intelligent than the God. You can twist your tongues or you can change its meanings/interpretations but you cannot change its Words. That is why the word بسم is not changed to باسم or vice versa. That is why the last two Surahs tell that you have to seek refuge after you have read the Qura'n. That is why it starts from Al-Hamd and ends at Ahad. There is no need to follow the theories and philosophies when the facts are clear.
Peace!
Slm TellMeTheTruth,
i have also same thoughts on the shape of earth, like you: now i know, i can move on ;) the world is still spinning
but correct me if i am wrong , the last verse is an-nas ?
what do you mean with this ?
QuoteThat is why the word بسم is not changed to باسم or vice versa.
Salam!
@kaltun
Here is a verse I am referring to:
فَإِذَا قَرَأْتَ ٱلْقُرْءَانَ فَٱسْتَعِذْ بِٱللَّهِ مِنَ ٱلشَّيْطَٰنِ ٱلرَّجِيمِ
Have God taught anywhere how to seek refuge with Him? The last two Surahs are telling us how we can seek refuge. Actual message of Quran starts from Al-Hamd and ends at Surah Ikhlas.
word بسم is from root ب س م
Just as the word عِلم is from the root ع ل م and the word رزق (RIZQ) is from the root Ra-Zay-Qaf
and it is not [ب + اسم] as in باسم
See the difference:
بِسْمِ ٱللَّهِ ٱلرَّحْمَٰنِ ٱلرَّحِيمِ
ٱقْرَأْ بِٱسْمِ رَبِّكَ ٱلَّذِى خَلَقَ
Peace!
Salam Kaltun!
In case you feel difficulty in Arabic, here are the Transliterations for both Ayats which I quoted earlier:
https://www.islamawakened.com/quran/1/1/default.htm
Transliteration Bismi Allahi alrrahmani alrraheemi
Transliteration-2 bis'mi l-lahi l-raḥmāni l-raḥīmi
https://www.islamawakened.com/quran/96/1/default.htm
Transliteration Iqra/ bi-ismi rabbika allathee khalaqa
Transliteration-2 iq'ra bi-is'mi rabbika alladhī khalaqa
Peace!
Quote from: TellMeTheTruth on February 11, 2019, 11:27:20 AM
Salam!
@kaltun
Here is a verse I am referring to:
فَإِذَا قَرَأْتَ ٱلْقُرْءَانَ فَٱسْتَعِذْ بِٱللَّهِ مِنَ ٱلشَّيْطَٰنِ ٱلرَّجِيمِ
Have God taught anywhere how to seek refuge with Him? The last two Surahs are telling us how we can seek refuge. Actual message of Quran starts from Al-Hamd and ends at Surah Ikhlas.
word بسم is from root ب س م
Just as the word عِلم is from the root ع ل م and the word رزق (RIZQ) is from the root Ra-Zay-Qaf
and it is not [ب + اسم] as in باسم
See the difference:
بِسْمِ ٱللَّهِ ٱلرَّحْمَٰنِ ٱلرَّحِيمِ
ٱقْرَأْ بِٱسْمِ رَبِّكَ ٱلَّذِى خَلَقَ
Peace!
Aslm ,
wow , just wow , i didnt see that before ( have so much to learn )
بِسْمِ ٱللَّهِ ٱلرَّحْمَٰنِ ٱلرَّحِيمِ
ٱقْرَأْ بِٱسْمِ رَبِّكَ ٱلَّذِى خَلَقَ
according to translate both are : in the name , what is odd cause bi = with ?
can you tell me difference also ?
Salam Kaltun!
This post's topic does not allow me to start another topic. Just notice how we follow with blind-eyes and never use the gifts from Allah! You can refer to :
http://ejtaal.net/aa/#q=bsm for various dictioneries and meaning of the root.
May Allah bless and guide us all!
Quote from: TellMeTheTruth on February 11, 2019, 10:56:46 AM
Salam!
@JKhan!
As per Qura'n I have to use my own Eyes/Sight, Ears/Hearing and Qalb/Intellect to understand things/matters around me. These are the gifts which will be questioned. So I try to use these gifts at my level best. I see the Earth Flat and not Spinning Globe. But it is not flat as a plain. It has mountains, rivers, paths, high and low lands. It would be flattened at the Hour. I have seen the Earth from above i.e., mountains and it seems flat to me. I have seen NASA videos, which use fish-eye lens and other techniques to prove it a sphere. I know how lens work. I am an expert in Adobe Photoshop and I know how to manipulate images. However, I do not follow the FES like others. I keep away from sects and leaders.
I have Qura'n with me as an Imam and a Ruh. I can see what Allah has revealed and why. It has guaranteed me the success in this world and in the Hereafter. It tells me that this worldly life is just a deception. Real life would be after it. So I am waiting to meet the God who has created me and given such gifts to see His wonderful signs all around me and appreciate Him as much as I can. I wish everyone could study Qura'n without bias and never think that he/she is intelligent than the God. You can twist your tongues or you can change its meanings/interpretations but you cannot change its Words. That is why the word بسم is not changed to باسم or vice versa. That is why the last two Surahs tell that you have to seek refuge after you have read the Qura'n. That is why it starts from Al-Hamd and ends at Ahad. There is no need to follow the theories and philosophies when the facts are clear.
Peace!
Salam TMTT
After all God questions each individual for a reason.. And not question like in court...
What is best than self perceptions.... When mind says something and accepting another is the horrible part... Be it right or wrong...
Keep researching.... Accepting and believing may be easy but passing the message is not easy unless we are well equipped with knowledge of Quran and nature....
God guide you to what is right. .may God never send you astray... Let the bless of God be with you always...
SLm to all,
who can explain this to me ??? clouds behind the :sun: ????? how
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=acCURiOcdmQ
SLM
i found an the flat earth clock :)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SzRpiz3KX-4
Peace...
Did you ever thought this? When on full solar eclipse happens suddenly sky gets complete darkness and u see instantly Big stars etc.... But why we don't see the same scenario while Sun goes behind horizon.. I mean when sunset... Did u get me what I mean... When sunsets it is no difference in the sky but slowly and gradually it darkens then civil light disappears stars start to appear one by one visible... But this is not the case when full solar eclipse happens... No after glows or twilights but darkness immediate with sun being blocked....
Science say twilights are results of sun's light which left on Earth and it takes a while to fade off... That should be the case in full solar eclipse is well... Light should not disappear all at once... But it does...
This shows Sun is local and circles above the statuonay earth spreading it's brightness and longer the distance it goes from us it disappears and it's brightness gradually....
Solar eclipse is a great sign when compared with twilight
Slm ,
which of these are spherical ( it can more then one )???
(https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/535398007743709216/545608834131951616/unknown.png)
pls answer my question , and ill show you which one ( s)
Peace all
Have you guys ever witnessed big star/s after sunrise.... Don't think I am kidding or making up... May be you guys seen before... But for me it was first time today...
I was with my friends in one of the shores outer Colombo after Fajr Salat... In the Eastern sky there were two big stars.. I don't know by name.. One is smaller in size and less brightness... Other is bigger and brighter...
I was watching it tirelessly.... Everything was clear and bright and I looked time it was 6:20 and one disappeared... Since I couldn't see horizon sunrise I checked time of sunrise it was 6:27 ... So I thought it would disappear before that time... But it was not.. It remained visible till 7:40 like tiniest of those stars in the sky... My friends never seen stars at day time.. Neither me... 😧... It was quite an experience.... Friends were astonished... It reminded me moon.. How it loses its light with the advent of sun in the sky... It's brightness diminish drastically... No difference to that big star... It went off from vision when sun became very bright well above horizon coz of ita size.. But moon won't go off from vision normally .. Coz of its size... Both are light sources...
You can see in sha Allah tomorrow if sky is clear..... You should not keep your eyes away from it... Then it will be tough to trace again... If you have a Nikon p900 take it with u...
25:61 "Blessed be He who has set in heaven(sama) constellations, and has set among them a lamp(Sun), and an illuminating moon."
Does this fit any other Sun to the Heaven (sama)?
Then Does this verse fit for any other Moon to the Heaven (Sama)?
If there is any other moon in the heavens (sama), then God is lying....
Earth's moon is not the largest and most luminous in the solar system... Is it... Who is lying .... Yes it God who lies... Coz spinning people have brighter and larger moon in the solar system.... But not for God... They call that God lies...
Just shame on those who can't perceive God's verses in their blindness....
Quote from: imrankhawaja on August 16, 2016, 02:47:47 AM
i really like when the discussion of science suddenly take u turn to the discussion of faith... :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl:
and intrestingly i also have some emotional attachments linked up with this theory .. becoz i remeber my first post was on about shape of earth , otherwise i was not about to start the discussion on forum , but again i also learn lot of things from the members... thanx to all of them.. and special thansk to flat earthers who force me to say somethings...
and all the time i come up with baseless claims and interestingly they always avoid questions? some of these questions are here
what bring seasons changing to earth?
why we cannot experience the sudden dark and sudden light in sun set and sunrise, cant b possible in flat earth?
what shape is the sun and other planets of solar system?
does light travel in a straight line?
what is "vanishing point" do you mean the sun moves away from an observer VERTICALLY or HORIZONTALLY or something else? In other words, what motion does the sun have in your view? ponder about this question..
how do you explain regions such as iceland and many other where you can experience months of permanently visible sun, and months of permanently non-visible sun?
all these questions and many more things i ask from experts of flat earthers but one by one everybody run away i dnt know why...? :&
some of them become my enemies and even they make fake ids specially to take piss with me :rotfl: i still dnt understand i think its something like a war or what...
any way mr hsalan if you are ready to give the answers of some of these questions i will be greatful as i see you beleive in flat earth too ?
THREE years old post for the people who (accepted defeat on eclipses)..
2nd face of defeat = (nail in coffin = drilling in their *iCE WALL)LETs SEE how many of them successful to manage any answers of my apparent questions...
Quote from: jkhan on February 28, 2019, 08:28:08 PM
25:61 "Blessed be He who has set in heaven(sama) constellations, and has set among them a lamp(Sun), and an illuminating moon."
Does this fit any other Sun to the Heaven (sama)?
Then Does this verse fit for any other Moon to the Heaven (Sama)?
If there is any other moon in the heavens (sama), then God is lying....
Earth's moon is not the largest and most luminous in the solar system... Is it... Who is lying .... Yes it God who lies... Coz spinning people have brighter and larger moon in the solar system.... But not for God... They call that God lies...
Just shame on those who can't perceive God's verses in their blindness....
Peace Everyone.....
This is what NASA and modern science claim....
"Jupiter's moon Ganymede is the largest moon in the Solar System, and Ganymede as well as Saturn's moon Titan are both larger than Mercury and Pluto. Earth's Moon, Jupiter's moons Callisto, Io, and Europa, and Neptune's moon Triton are all larger than Pluto, but smaller than Mercury"
Just look at it in the light of Quran..... Including 25"61, has Allah mentioned by the name moon any other... Moon is one and Sun is one.... Other celestial bodies different.... But they call and claim there moons Jupiter itself has 60 + moons... Coz they orbit the planet same as the moon of Earth orbit... And they have phases and sun reflected light... God... I can't accept them.... Why should I?... While my Lord says only one moon in the midst of entire sky.... How do you reject Quran folks... Is it coz you are afraid to against modern science.... So you drag QURAN with them.... 180 + moons in the midst of sky... And stars are bugger than Sun.... I can't stop to laugh when Quran says when the stars falls which is more than 400 times of the size of the earth... 😯.... Patience befit... Soon it will be exposed.... The growth as a force against NASA is ever increasing.... Now they slowly start to say moon is inside earth atmosphere... That would change lot of theory... Mind you..
How big stars?????
"Supergiant stars are the largest stars in the universe. They can be thousands of times bigger than our Sun and have a mass up to 100 times greater. The largest known supergiant star, VY Canis Majoris, is up to 2,100 times the size of the Sun (based on upper estimates)"
Now how big sun is????
"The Sun is 864,400 miles (1,391,000 kilometers) across. This is about 109 times the diameter of Earth. The Sun weighs about 333,000 times as much as Earth. It is so large that about 1,300,000 planet Earths can fit inside of it"
Now can you imagine Quran says stars fall.... Do we ever see this as a witness of the day of doom...
2100 times bigger than Sun... ☀... Quran looks ridiculous if you believe science... Believe if you want.... Call me fool, insane or whatever mean anyone can get by words.... I will never believe in this crap.... Quran is perfect as it sounds and as we see the nature....
Quote from: jkhan on March 01, 2019, 09:46:56 PM
How big stars?????
Earth Compared to The Rest of The Universe
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Eh5BpSnBBw&t=45s
Two of the brightest naked-eye celestial bodies ? the Double Cluster and M31 (Andromeda Galaxy)
37:6 انا indeed we زىنا adorn we of السما the sky الدنىا the world بزىنه with adornment الكوكب l-kawākibi/the celestial bodies
(https://s22380.pcdn.co/wp-content/uploads/Naked-Eye-Deep-sky-Double-Cluster-M31_S_ANNO.jpg)
Quote from: jkhan on March 01, 2019, 09:46:56 PM
looks ridiculous if you believe science...
Ridiculous is living using technology, satellites, etc., lacking basic comprehension if referring to a celestial body ?a lamp/sun? and ?a moon? to mean ruling out trillions of celestial bodies e.g. galaxies, stars, planets, moons, comets, asteroids, meteors, etc.
25:61 تبرك blesseth الذى the one جعل made فى in السما the sky بروجا constellations of وجعل and made فىها therein سرجا sirājan/lamp of (?a lamp?) وقمرا and moon of (?a moon?) منىرا illuminate of
Quote from: Noon waalqalami on March 02, 2019, 04:23:14 PM
Earth Compared to The Rest of The Universe
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Eh5BpSnBBw&t=45s
Two of the brightest naked-eye celestial bodies ? the Double Cluster and M31 (Andromeda Galaxy)
37:6 انا indeed we زىنا adorn we of السما the sky الدنىا the world بزىنه with adornment الكوكب l-kawākibi/the celestial bodies
(https://s22380.pcdn.co/wp-content/uploads/Naked-Eye-Deep-sky-Double-Cluster-M31_S_ANNO.jpg)
Ridiculous is living using technology, satellites, etc., lacking basic comprehension if referring to a celestial body ?a lamp/sun? and ?a moon? to mean ruling out trillions of celestial bodies e.g. galaxies, stars, planets, moons, comets, asteroids, meteors, etc.
25:61 تبرك blesseth الذى the one جعل made فى in السما the sky بروجا constellations of وجعل and made فىها therein سرجا sirājan/lamp of (?a lamp?) وقمرا and moon of (?a moon?) منىرا illuminate of
It's not ridiculous to use other person's luxury while God is the one who furnished it for one for others to use... If I am working to a company whose owner is disbeliever it doesn't mean I should not work with him and help him heartily... I am an employee so obey and do for what he pays for me... It's business.. We buy the luxury of believers and disbelievers...it doesn't mean we should surrender to them.... How nonsensical that is.... Did God give His own luxury to only believers... Honesty He has given His luxury to mainly majority wise to disbelievers.... Even knowledge or whatever... God is fair.... It is never unfair If we use technology.... It is from a human to another human.... Belief is totally different thing.....
It doesn't mean that we should discard quran and believe in Bible only just coz they discover things and their book is bible... Just for example...
Totally irrelevant just be stick to topic and threads.... When someone is stuck his brain fails... Lol
Same my budhist friends claim every day... Gloveheads has invented everything and you enjoy and what flat people has contributed to the society... Just ridiculous that is... For example if a government has started a huge development project and mainly to get big portion under their pocket while development taking place... Then people may like it... But conspiracy should be exposed... Or else... If a man runs his family very peacefully with all luxury and wife and kids so happy... And if one questions from where money comes.. Then the money is from drugs... . If wife and kids angry on the one who questioned... That's irrelevant.. Coz he has not done anything on that family... But he exposed the great crime...
You are just off line... Materials are God's and knowledge.... No harm using it...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Eh5BpSnBBw&t=45s
@ NW...
You are simply brainwashed by this you tube.... God only knows how you believe in it and comparing it to quran.....
God must have made a guesswork to say Sun in the midst of sky is radiant while it is nothing compared to the biggest star which is 2100 times bigger than sun.... Sharpen your style of reasoning.....
One day in sha Allah... Again in sha Allah... You will know how far you believed just neglecting quran.... But I doubt that you will ever ponder what is right.... Coz it seems the indoctrination is deep rooted..... Can't help.... Tc.... Still I will beg to God to guide you in privacy .... God.. I am really thankful that I am not one of those who believe in such craps....
https://youtu.be/-AzHNhacWFQ
When people are blind while having sight, that's huge setback.... They don't see what believers see...
Bad luck...
https://youtu.be/w6F78Rx0uug
I can't actually stop laughing.... How weak human is forgetting his own conspiracy....
It was in the middle of the night :rotfl: :rotfl: God... That's fun... :rotfl:
Quote from: imrankhawaja on March 01, 2019, 06:40:52 AM
THREE years old post for the people who (accepted defeat on eclipses)..
2nd face of defeat = (nail in coffin = drilling in their *iCE WALL)
LETs SEE how many of them successful to manage any answers of my apparent questions...
6 questions + one practical (Eclipse)
one question carry 20 marks and practical got 30 marks
passing marks 80/150 lets see who is the intelligent flatearthers we have in our forum.
SPECIAL offer of 80 passing marks becoz it appears students find it hard to solve (all quest) in good three years.
Eclipses + Prediction (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KhiR0mS8lGo)
Nasa predicts the eclipses by using the Saros Cycle made by Ancient Babylonian, using the assumption that the Earth is motionless in a geocentric model.
Also covers the ancient greek Antikythera Mechanism which is a replica of the cosmos. Which also calculates the Saros- and Metonic Cycle of the most precise Sun and Moon calendar.
Quote from: quincy on March 03, 2019, 02:21:33 PM
Nasa predicts the eclipses by using the Saros Cycle made by Ancient Babylonian, using the assumption that the Earth is motionless in a geocentric model
Wrong information of NASA
marks obtained 2 / 150.
( 2 marks given as bonus on house for attending first practical ) :peace:
NEXT student please lol.
Peace Everyone......
11:107 ?They will be] abiding therein as long as the heavens and the earth endure, except what your Lord should will. Indeed, your Lord is an effecter of what He intends.?
11:108 ? And as for those who were [destined to be] prosperous, they will be in Paradise, abiding therein as long as the heavens and the earth endure, except what your Lord should will - a bestowal uninterrupted.?
14:48 ? [It will be] on the Day the earth will be replaced by another earth, and the heavens [as well], and all creatures will come out before Allah , the One, the Prevailing.?
50:15 ?Did We fail in the first creation? But they are in confusion over a new creation.?
See the above verses closely? Once the current earth and Heavens will be replaced with another Earth and Heavens, we will be gathered and judged fairly and will be placed to live in Janna or Jahanna (both on the new replaced Earth & Heavens )
Now the question is God Himself destroyed the Earth and Heavens and not coz they failed to endure, but God has made a word to eradicate everything and recreate? and what will be recreated?.?
That also again Heavens and Earth? 11:107-108 proves it.. Now can we compare science here?. It say stars 2100 times bigger than Sun in our current universe,, will that be created again and all moving in a galaxy??simply crap?
Or the recreation will be also a closed system as we living right now?. God only replace with a better place than we are living right now.. Or There also a tiny mote Earth (Janna+Jahanna) in entire Universe which is nothing compared to other celestial bodies? NO WAY? note God used in 11:107-108 & 14:48 for newly replaced Earth (singular) & Heavens (plural).. It seems no difference to what He created FIRST time which we experience now? but only will be replaced and recreated and showing His power and Promise..as 50:15 indicates..
EARTH is massive structure and sun and moon and stars are tiny motes in comparison to Earth ?. NASA makes you fool the other way around knowing the truth. That?s the reality? Jinn knows it ? coz they do go under this dome everywhere till they find fire missiles chasing them... and believers know it coz they understood message of God and what He created?hypocrites are trapped?
As per 50:15 second creation confirmed ??. the second creation is much bigger (almost double in size).. coz the Janna & Jahanna will be on the earth and only Janna?s width will be equal to the width of current Earth and the Heavens 57:21 & 3:133? Don?t expect AGAINN the SECOND Creation a tiny mote spinning and rotating the sun which is a tiny mote compared to the biggest so called stars? nonsense at its pinnacle ?
No promise or hint from God that He will destroy His second creation?. God will, He may replace the second creation and on? but Quran word of God not promise any such ?.
May God guide us..
-150 / 150
negative marking applied on stupid answers.
Peace jkhan.
All these folks who think they can fool you don t realise that I have tried and did not succeed with this trick:
Christopher Columbus was stranded in Jamaica and needed supplies. He knew that an eclipse was to occur the next day. He told the tribal chief, "The God who protects me will punish you. Unless you give me supplies this night, a vengeance will fall upon you and the moon shall lose its light!"
When the eclipse darkened the sky, Columbus got all the supplies he needed.
Good logic tried the same trick on brother jkhan. "If you do not believe the earth is sphereical," he warned, "vengeance will fall upon you and the moon will lose its light."
"If you're referring to the lunar eclipse," jkhan replied, "that doesn't really happen brother, it is a NASA trick ."
Now good logic is looking to make a carrer out of the eclipse trick, Customers go to his car park, where he will eclipse the sun for two minutes. last time this happened:
By order of good logic , tomorrow at nine o'clock, there will be an eclipse of the Sun outdoors in his car park; Come to see the eclipse for ?5 only. If it rains, the eclipse of the Sun will take place indoors, something that does not occur often.
Hope you have a smile brother.
Your friend in light spirit.
GOD bless you.
Peace.
Good approach GL,
GL u got almost 25/30 in practical i will tell u why u didnt get 30.
u forget to mention about the TILT function of earth thats the reason due to tilt thing we have ECLIPSES at almost all parts of earth one by one.
otherwise it was not difficult to crack.
fakery is not working there so flat earthers have to comeup with explanation ?solid? one thats why they are struggling in eclipses very badly.
if eclipse happened on just one POINT/PLACE of earth the issue would be totally different as we know we have scandavia, greenland, iceland, where we witnessed months of daylight and months of dark.
so when they select one model another conradict ECLIPSES :brickwall: doing this to them. thats why sometimes they bring rahu/magical sun/magical moon etc lol.
another fact as i see their IQ is very very low so only for understanding what ECLIPSE is required like a year of study. so its like if we force a student of year one to understand the practical test of year 10.
God bless you
Peace Brother Imran.
Here is an interesting question:
In Indonesia - Sumatra - If you stand on a line on the road that marked the equator. One foot in Northern Hemisphere, one in Southern. Now if it was mid-winter in the NH, it would be mid-summer in SH. So longest day in SH / shortest day in NH. So how come it would seem much the same to you?
This answer should make sense:
During "midsummer" on the northern hemisphere, the sun is (at noon) shining from an angle of 90 degrees over the Tropic of Cancer (23.43 decimal degrees north). This means that the sun angle for the equator on this day is 90 - 23.43 = 66.57 degrees to the north. Similarly (following the same reasoning), when it is "midsummer" on the southern hemisphere the sun angle for the equator is 90 - 23.43 = 66.57 degrees to the south. So, the conclusion is: At the Equator, the sun "travels" between 66.57 degrees to the north and 66.57 degrees to the south during a one year period.
As for your very interesting question about standing over the equator, you can look at it this way: Compare northern latitudes with southern latitudes pairwise. For example, during midsummer on the northern hemisphere (NH) there is a large difference between 60 degr north and 60 degr south when it comes to the sun angle and the length of day. 30 degr north vs 30 degr south: The difference is getting smaller. 10 degr north vs 10 degr south: An even smaller difference. Now, as we come closer to the equator, the difference in these pairwise comparisons will approach zero.
A lot can be said about this, but at the moment I am wondering how the flat earth group will give the same answer?
GOD bless you.
Peace.
Quote from: good logic on March 04, 2019, 01:39:50 PM
Peace Brother Imran.
Here is an interesting question:
In Indonesia - Sumatra - If you stand on a line on the road that marked the equator. One foot in Northern Hemisphere, one in Southern. Now if it was mid-winter in the NH, it would be mid-summer in SH. So longest day in SH / shortest day in NH. So how come it would seem much the same to you?
This answer should make sense:
During "midsummer" on the northern hemisphere, the sun is (at noon) shining from an angle of 90 degrees over the Tropic of Cancer (23.43 decimal degrees north). This means that the sun angle for the equator on this day is 90 - 23.43 = 66.57 degrees to the north. Similarly (following the same reasoning), when it is "midsummer" on the southern hemisphere the sun angle for the equator is 90 - 23.43 = 66.57 degrees to the south. So, the conclusion is: At the Equator, the sun "travels" between 66.57 degrees to the north and 66.57 degrees to the south during a one year period.
As for your very interesting question about standing over the equator, you can look at it this way: Compare northern latitudes with southern latitudes pairwise. For example, during midsummer on the northern hemisphere (NH) there is a large difference between 60 degr north and 60 degr south when it comes to the sun angle and the length of day. 30 degr north vs 30 degr south: The difference is getting smaller. 10 degr north vs 10 degr south: An even smaller difference. Now, as we come closer to the equator, the difference in these pairwise comparisons will approach zero.
A lot can be said about this, but at the moment I am wondering how the flat earth group will give the same answer?
GOD bless you.
Peace.
Peace GL....
Stories are nice to here... That's why it is stories... But reality is sticking....
I have opened this topic with the will of God and brought evidences which are glaring... And still I will bring God will.... I don't mind people believe or not.. It is not my business.... They have been given freedom to accept.... God presented quran to people and how many on this earth believe in them.... That's key...
BTW GL dude... I can't stop viruses creeping into this topic... That's part of everything from the beginning... The first virus of this entire creation is Iblees, so as long as he is alive his ""chota dudes" will be everywhere.....
FYI.... More than ever before my friends are interested in the shape of earth... It has become a most talking point.... People are opening their minds to the truth..... Wait and see the plan of God in sha Allah if you and me are alive for few more years....
71:15 "Do you not consider how Allah has created seven heavens in layers"
If any of us say that the shape of the Earth and the Heavens are not significant when it comes to belief and salvation... that's really hypocrisy...if one doesn't know .. it's a different story... but if claims that it is nothing to do with the belief... then there is a serious issue..
in the above verse, God clearly say "DO YOU NOT CONSIDER/SEE HOW ALLAH HAS CREATED SEVEN HEAVENS IN LAYERS...... that's a point to think.. coz God himself says "Do you not see".. how can we not see then.. we have to see, we have to find out what God says and what is seven heavens and how it is created... are there really seven heavens????? is it really above us or underneath us... or what is actually heaven/sky itself... can we totally depend on another source while God has explained His creation clearly and asking us to consider while He has given us vision and knowledge to perceive the right and wrong...
What we have CONSIDERED about heavens .... have we considered there is no Heavens at all and all are empty space? Or have we considered there are Heavens one above the other as layers and there is a structure at the end which is not penetrable by anyone... all seven are evened out... or is it like science say there is no structure above us and all you get is mere space...never ending .. no borders ,... no edges... no restrictions... trillion, quadrillion, quintrillion, sextillion, septillion, octillion, nonillion, and decillion or even zillion, gazillion, jillion, squillion miles away...
God guide us..
Quote from: imrankhawaja on March 04, 2019, 09:12:17 AM
another fact as i see their IQ is very very low so only for understanding what ECLIPSE is required like a year of study. so its like if we force a student of year one to understand the practical test of year 10.
brother GL u ask a nice mathematics in your post for me its very apparent to believe in mathematics of ATHEIST. so your question as usual shrouded in pages of history. hahahaha
sometimes its funny to see when umpire gives OUT to batsman and batsman not going back to pavilian/dressing room. and now he take a review and with the help of modern technology hes declared OUT by neutral TV umpire. thats something normal.
but IMAGINE if a batsman is still not going back to pavilion what action should umpire took ?
brother GL i love to hear answer from you if u have bit interest in cricket as we know englang is the founder of cricket.
Peace everyone...
50:06 ?Have they not looked at the heaven above them - how We structured it and adorned it and [how] it has no rifts? ?
Yes? the above is a perfect question raised by the Creator Himself? What is the answer dear members to the question of GOD? He is asking us?
Is the answer to the above question in verse 50:06 is Geocentric or Heliocentric?? How come two answers to one reality?Is the heaven really above us as God claim?? Just look at the Heliocentric GALAXY we are living in ? does it make you feel the heaven is above you and structured(Bana) and does it look that the adornment of the structure looks above us in the GALAXY? what is the Rifts (Furuj)here? What is there in heliocentric model to have a rift?....
Find the answer to the question of God .. isn?t it our duty folks?. Yes it is ? we can?t deviate from the reality? find out what actually God has created?.
https://spaceplace.nasa.gov/galaxy/en/
What is Solar System?
The Solar System is made up of the Sun and all the objects that orbit around it. The Sun is orbited by planets, asteroids, comets and other things. It is billions of years old.
What is galaxy/Milky Way?
Our Earth orbits the Sun in our Solar System. Our Sun is one star among the billions in the (Milky Way) Galaxy. Our Milky Way Galaxy is one among the billions of galaxies in our Universe.
What is Universe?
In terms of the number of solar systems present in the universe, there are something like 300 billion stars in the Milky Way, so if 10 per cent of them have planets there are around 30 billion planets in our galaxy alone, and there are over 100 billion galaxies in the observable Universe
NOW
Compare below verse with above scientific accepted proofs
50:06 ?Have they not looked at the heaven above them - how We structured it and adorned it and [how] it has no rifts? ?
38:27 "And We did not create the heaven and the earth and that between them aimlessly/in vain. That is the assumption of those who disbelieve, so woe to those who disbelieve from the Fire."
God must be kidding ... right... :&
its take 40? to buy a cheap telescope and see God is really kidding ?
AUTHOR said u have kokabs, najam, shahb-e-saqib, SIRIUS, balkhans, Aljawari alkunnasi,
sama (sky) of dunya .. zeena( beautified) with ...kokabs and BURJ.
i had frds who saved my money and i see with my own eyes and author is not really kidding but infact hez telling the billion things and cells functions of human body what we can see, but creation of heavens is far more complicated than human beings. so i did checked it by myself everone should check it too (17:36)
A perosn name edwin hubble GOT a nobel prize for contributing his part with the help of telescope but he was scientists and athiest so hubble telescope is fake and telescope is showing us fake things hahaha.
SUPREME / UNIQUE / EXTREME stupis of 21st century. niether can understand Quran nor science. on top of that lack of common sense is giving a fuel to fire and burned their IQ :elektro:
Peace Imran.
?One of the glories of cricket is the way the drama of a match, were batsmen are these action heroes who destroy the bowlers with their so-called weapon named bat?
And one of the glories of this thread and other "flat earth threads" is the way the drama goes on of claims that we are destroyed by evidence from brother jkhan and company. Not one shred of it as far as everyone can see.
What is Benefit of the Doubt brother Imran?
In (cricket) the principle employed by umpires was, in cases of uncertainty concerning a batsman possibly being out, in which the decision must be in the batsman?s favours. (A favourable judgement given in the absence of full evidence.)
In this thread brother jkhan and company had many benefits of a doubt. Yet not one shred of evidence is produced. We gave them
endless benefit of a doubt and read countless of stuff like links, sites, flattened interpretations of verses of Qoran that claim " earth is flat and motionless". Still, not one shred of evidence.
In cricket brother Imran,benefit of Doubt was given to the batsman because the batsman gets only ?One Chance?.
In this thread, they are laughing and still claiming because of the endless chances. NOT OUT evidence is eclipsed from them!!!
Brother,there is nothing in cricket laws to suggest ?benefit of doubt?. it is a Spirit of Cricket of the game. In true Spirit of Cricket, it says that benefit of doubt always goes to the batsman.
Mainly because bowler gets second chance but batsman doesn?t. Also, if benefit of doubt is given to bowler then, in some cases match may finish in less overs/days than expected.
We are good spirited sort in this thread also. Except the game is going on too long!!!
However, in cricket, all the above sad things and dialog were followed until the technologies was not familiarised to cricket. But now technologies in places, however, it is going in favour of the on-field umpire. Cricket, like many sports played these days, has integrated technology into its everyday live.
Likewise here, despite all the technologies of GPS, SATTELITES,SPACE TRAVEL, ? And ECLIPSES, DAY/NIGHT/TIME ZONES... They are still going along happily claiming tons of evidence in their favour, hoping to ECLIPSE the readers from the facts.
Do not give up brother Imran. What can we do except keep going ?
GOD bless you.
Peace.
PEACE brother Good logic,
thanks for attempting question and no doubt u explain my question with DEFINATION,explanation & examples.
i have no issue giving u 100/100.
BUT i have something interesting to add in your post when tecnologies get birth also the uses of those technologies get birth like making fakery/sahar with technologies.
example a batsman use technology of using face mask to get one more turn by cheating/fakery/dishonesty. now their umpire is Quran and they calimed umpire already declared flat earth.
their umpire is not present atm so they have benefit of doubt lmao :rotfl:
its also two different things what they say about what quran say or what quran actually said.
now lets use modern technology,
it will decide the CASE as they dnt beleive in modern witness from columbus becoz he was rapist. lol
but their problem is they dnt want to accept the decision or tecnology using by third umpire. (planes,sattellites,mathematics,telescopes,ISS) so their case is already finsihed me and you now just playing cricket with them not as a competetion but as FUN.same fun CAT do with mouse.
before killing the mouse cat always play with mouse, tease him, throwing from one place to another what we are actually doing to them.
so i never give up mate but i m just enjoyin the cat mouse part. you should also enjoy it.
God bless you too.
Peace everyone...
79:27 ?Are you a more difficult/tougher in creation or is the heaven? Allah constructed IT (Heaven).?Look how God questions us? these are explicit questions, need to find answers with only perceiving it?and by not going away from God?s manifest book? It shows that it was not equal of creation of HUMAN/JINN to the HEAVEN? He says He constructed it?.remember He is not talking about whatever BETWEEN Heaven and EARTH (stars, sun, moon etc.) but talking merely in relation to the HEAVEN/Sky construction which is a solid structure not being able to penetrate above us 55:33 ? ?O company of jinn and mankind, if you are able to pass beyond the regions of the heavens and the earth, then pass? no authority is given and fire missiles and guards ever ready 55:35..impossible in Heliocentric?already penetrated beyond earth no missiles and even gone to mars, no flaming missiles..
*****No one has any clue where is the point on EARTH where flaming missiles chase if you try to penetrate..55:33-35..*****
79:28 ?He raised ITS (Heaven?s) canopy/Height/Vault(Shamkaha) and proportioned/leveled (Fashawwaha) IT(heaven).?Once the Construction process is done, He has raised ITS (HEAVEN?S) Height/canopy/Vault and evened /proportioned the Heaven.. It shows there is a distance between the edge of the heaven and earth
79:29 ?And He darkened ITS night and extracted/brought forth ITS brightness.?Here comes the next part? He made the darkness.. darkness is not mere automatic thing? but darkness is as well a creation of GOD.. He gave the darkness to the constructed Heaven which is elevated in Height as a canopy over the unfinished Earth?. And then He gave to Heaven Brightness as well (Sunlight)? once the darkness is created only the Brightness is applied/affected?. That?s very much within common sense?
79:30 ?and the earth, AFTER THAT (Ba?da Zhalika) He spread/ expanded (Dhahaha) it out,?Now He crystal clearly elaborate that He Expanded the Earth.. Expanded to where? Expanded in line with the canopy/vault which is the structure of heaven? now both equaled in proportion?Note the clear word of (Ba?da Zhalika-After that).. after what? After The heaven is constructed and elevated and proportioned He has spread the Earth.. How excellent the Earth and Heaven of God?and rest(Sun, moon, stars, etc. is BETWEEN these TWO (Earth & Heaven) ..38:27 ?And We did not create the heaven and the earth and whatever between them in vain?
Of course the creation of Heaven is mightier?.if it is a solid structure without pillars above us?13:02 ?God is the One Who raised the heavens WITHOUT A PILLAR as you can see?. That?s utterly mind popping ? that?s why God says 22:65 ? ?. And He restrains the sky(sama-singular) from falling upon the Earth ?? if pillars were in fact erected then there is no need of such verse?
... Let the believers ponder what God created in fact and i don?t mind viruses creeping in ? and who cares about viruses when believers have mighty virus guard which is holding the rope of ALLAH?
Quote from: imrankhawaja on March 05, 2019, 07:21:19 AM
its take 40? to buy a cheap telescope and see God is really kidding ?
AUTHOR said u have kokabs, najam, shahb-e-saqib, SIRIUS, balkhans, Aljawari alkunnasi,
sama (sky) of dunya .. zeena( beautified) with ...kokabs and BURJ.
SUPREME / UNIQUE / EXTREME stupis of 21st century. niether can understand Quran nor science. on top of that lack of common sense is giving a fuel to fire and burned their IQ :elektro:
marks of candidates
1st candidate 2/150
2nd candidate -150/150
anymore candidates intereting in solving question ? or thats the only failed candidates we have,
let say total number of candidates of flat earth = 100
out of which only 2 dare to attempt the horrible exam and also they failed terribly.
BTW each flat earther carry 10, 10 multiple IDs :police: and our examination hall is empty like dead why ?
Salam!
I think that both the parties are going to some extreme.
وَجَعَلْنَا ٱلسَّمَآءَ سَقْفًۭا مَّحْفُوظًۭا ۖ وَهُمْ عَنْ ءَايَٰتِهَا مُعْرِضُونَ
021:032 And we have made the sky a roof/ceiling protected. Yet they turn away from its portents.
This ceiling or the limit of this universe is no doubt something constructed, protected and without rifts. But it is very high.
See below:
٣٢_٥ يُدَبِّرُ ٱلْأَمْرَ مِنَ ٱلسَّمَآءِ إِلَى ٱلْأَرْضِ ثُمَّ يَعْرُجُ إِلَيْهِ فِى يَوْمٍۢ كَانَ مِقْدَارُهُۥٓ أَلْفَ سَنَةٍۢ مِّمَّا تَعُدُّونَ
032:005 He directeth the ordinance from the heaven unto the earth; then it ascendeth unto Him in a Day, whereof the measure is a thousand years of that ye reckon.
٧٠_٤ تَعْرُجُ ٱلْمَلَٰٓئِكَةُ وَٱلرُّوحُ إِلَيْهِ فِى يَوْمٍۢ كَانَ مِقْدَارُهُۥ خَمْسِينَ أَلْفَ سَنَةٍۢ
070:004 (Whereby) the angels and the Spirit ascend unto Him in a Day whereof the span is fifty thousand years.
Our lord taught us the science علم so we cannot reject science as a whole. On the other hand we cannot reject Ayats of our Lord. Remeber that we are امۃ وسطا a balanced nation and we have our own eyes/sight, ears/hearing and hearts/intellect.
As far as I remember, Hubble was also an idol's name as per traditions. However, most of the images, which are related with Hubble are fake or edited and you can check them. Nikon coolpix cameras are giving better results than Hubble when the moon is zoomed .
Brother Jkhan!
Note that 2 creations are compared due to their equal importance. This cannot necessarily mean that both are equal in size. May Allah bless and guide us all!
Peace!
Peace TellMeTheTruth.
So what is the shape of the earth? And is it motionless?
What extreme are we going to by stating facts that are well known?
You have not clarified in your post.
GOD bless you.
Peace.
Salam!
Brother GL!
I believe that the Earth is not a planet and it is not moving around the sun. I believe that it is not a sphere but it also not flat as a plain. Maybe a spheroid plain :whatever:!
I bet that you have never seen a sphere earth with your own eyes nor you have two witness who can say that they have seen a sphere earth with there own eyes. However, you can never see a sphere earth because almost half of it would be beyond your sight unless you turn it around and then again you will see only half of it. So you cannot witness it in true sense.
There are countless things which are well known facts but they are not proven facts/truth.
Let me give you an example:
The sun rises in the East.
It was considered a Universal Truth a few years back. Do you think it is still a Universal Truth?
Peace!
Peace TellMeTheTruth.
Spherical is not just round, it can also have any of the ellipses shapes of different lengths. The point is is the earth is not flat. I have seen and believe the globe pictures taken by astronauts. And of course the only way you have day/night/tiume is because of the movement of earth(Tajree Li Ajalin Mussamma). It is not possible to have time zones without movement/speed (dISTANCE/SPEED/TIME RELATIONSHIP)
You say, quote:
The sun rises in the East.
It was considered a Universal Truth a few years back. Do you think it is still a Universal Truth?
So GOD is not saying The sun rises /comes from the east--Yaati Bi Shams Mina Al Mashrik) Mashrik is EAST in Arabic.
Mashrik Al Shams--Sun rise-. Maghrib Al Shams--Sun set. Mashrik= East, Maghrib= West. That is the Arabic meaning of the words.
GOD bless you.
Peace.
Salam GL!
Quote from: good logic on March 06, 2019, 02:07:40 PM
You say, quote:
The sun rises in the East.
It was considered a Universal Truth a few years back. Do you think it is still a Universal Truth?
So GOD is not saying The sun rises /comes from the east--Yaati Bi Shams Mina Al Mashrik) Mashrik is EAST in Arabic.
Mashrik Al Shams--Sun rise-. Maghrib Al Shams--Sun set. Mashrik= East, Maghrib= West. That is the Arabic meaning of the words.
GOD bless you.
Peace.
Let's see what science says:
If you are standing at the north pole there is no east, west, or north. Every direction is south.
And when you are at south pole the sun will set and rise out of the North.
Now tally it with what you think that 'God is saying'. Or do you think that north pole and south pole are not parts of the Earth? Or the God is not talking about 'directions'? Science says that the earth is a sphere and sun neither rises nor sets. Then God is not talking about 'rising' or 'setting'?
Peace!
Quote from: TellMeTheTruth on March 06, 2019, 11:32:28 AM
Salam!
I think that both the parties are going to some extreme.
وَجَعَلْنَا ٱلسَّمَآءَ سَقْفًۭا مَّحْفُوظًۭا ۖ وَهُمْ عَنْ ءَايَٰتِهَا مُعْرِضُونَ
021:032 And we have made the sky a roof/ceiling protected. Yet they turn away from its portents.
This ceiling or the limit of this universe is no doubt something constructed, protected and without rifts. But it is very high.
See below:
٣٢_٥ يُدَبِّرُ ٱلْأَمْرَ مِنَ ٱلسَّمَآءِ إِلَى ٱلْأَرْضِ ثُمَّ يَعْرُجُ إِلَيْهِ فِى يَوْمٍۢ كَانَ مِقْدَارُهُۥٓ أَلْفَ سَنَةٍۢ مِّمَّا تَعُدُّونَ
032:005 He directeth the ordinance from the heaven unto the earth; then it ascendeth unto Him in a Day, whereof the measure is a thousand years of that ye reckon.
٧٠_٤ تَعْرُجُ ٱلْمَلَٰٓئِكَةُ وَٱلرُّوحُ إِلَيْهِ فِى يَوْمٍۢ كَانَ مِقْدَارُهُۥ خَمْسِينَ أَلْفَ سَنَةٍۢ
070:004 (Whereby) the angels and the Spirit ascend unto Him in a Day whereof the span is fifty thousand years.
Our lord taught us the science علم so we cannot reject science as a whole. On the other hand we cannot reject Ayats of our Lord. Remeber that we are امۃ وسطا a balanced nation and we have our own eyes/sight, ears/hearing and hearts/intellect.
As far as I remember, Hubble was also an idol's name as per traditions. However, most of the images, which are related with Hubble are fake or edited and you can check them. Nikon coolpix cameras are giving better results than Hubble when the moon is zoomed .
Brother Jkhan!
Note that 2 creations are compared due to their equal importance. This cannot necessarily mean that both are equal in size. May Allah bless and guide us all!
Peace!
Peace TMTT
EAST & WEST?
For God it seems East and West is the direction when it comes to the entire earth? note the below two verses? which clearly says East and the West and WHATEVER BETWEEN THEM (EAST & WEST)? its very clear the Earth is stationary and it has two direction? MASHRIQ & MAGRIB?.
26:28 ?[Moses] said, "Lord of the east and the west and whatever between them, if you were to reason."
24:35 ? ?. A blessed olive tree, neither of the east nor of the west, ??
It clearly shows east and west is designed by God which we have to perceive? Whatever between them (EAST & WEST) is simply beyond possibilities in a heliocentric model? God uses whatever between Earth and Heaven and same He uses whatever EAST and WEST? that?s astounding? Compare all EAST and WEST verses? it gives you lot to ponder that is impossible in a globe..
Remember He is the God of EAST and WEST... EAST of WHAT EARTH or Entire Imaginary universe....nonsense..
DISTANCE TO GOD FROM HEAVEN32:05 & 70:04 regarding the number of years ? these are well discussed in this same topic? you can refer?it has nothing to do with the shape of the earth and the distance to the structure heaven?. We are in a closed and well preserved system call Earth and Heaven? the distance between the Heaven and God is beyond imagination? if God roles the Heaven in His hand then we can imagine the distance to God from heaven which Malaika has to reach?.
It?s very clear from quran it is not the distance from Earth to Heaven structure where Malaika living and to that extreme point Jinn reaches to listen? But it is the distance from where Malaika living to the place of God?. That?s what take 50000 thousand years mailika and ruh to reach? 1000 years is not mentioned any malaika?
Peace Everyone......
POLARIS (NORTH STAR / POLE STAR)
Below are excerpts of scientific explanations
The reason Polaris is so important is because the axis of Earth is pointed almost directly at it. During the course of the night, Polaris does not rise or set, but remains in very nearly the same spot above the northern horizon year-round while the other stars circle around it
(Polaris, the North Star, appears stationary in the sky because it is positioned close to the line of Earth's axis projected into space. As such, it is the only bright star whose position relative to a rotating Earth does not change. All other stars appear to move opposite to the Earth's rotation beneath them.)
Unlike the Northern Hemisphere, the Southern Hemisphere doesn't have a bright pole star. There just doesn't happen to be a bright star, not even a moderately bright star like Polaris, to mark the south celestial pole, the point in the sky directly over the Earth's South Pole. But the stars are not truly fixed.
CIRCUMPOLAR STAR
A circumpolar star is a star, as viewed from a given latitude on Earth, that never sets below the horizon due to its apparent proximity to one of the celestial poles.
stars that are circumpolar, some stars that rise and set daily (like the sun), and some stars that remain below the horizon all year round.
Circumpolar stars always reside above the horizon, and for that reason, never rise or set. All the stars at the Earth's North are circumpolar. Meanwhile, no star is circumpolar at the equator. Anyplace else has some circumpolar stars, and some stars that rise and set daily.
There is no "South Star". It's just a coincidence that there happens to be a brightstar (Polaris) close to the Celestial North Pole. The Southern Hemisphere isn't so lucky. The only star that comes close is Sigma Octans, which is 1 degree away from the South Celestial Pole..
Research or find out from youtube what is Polaris and how it is situated and why it is impossible in a allegedly Tilting Earth.. and Compare the scenario with Midnight sun which occurs in the region where Polaris star is visible above head ? Center of the earth is where Polaris there? all are floating in its orbit.. quran says.. yes even the Polaris star.. but its circling is very minute .. means small circle which is not notable all other stars as per how it situated they a circling its circle? Midnight sun is occurring when the sun circle on the small circle which is beyond Tropic of Capricorn ?Polaris is straight above the center of the Earth always?but nonsensical earth tilt still Polaris is above the center of the earth?.that?s sheer insanity .. I can?t stop laughing when the globe heads comment on Polaris videos saying this and that to cover the fallacy?I didn?t link any videos ? you can simply type and search in youtube ?Polaris proves Earth stationary?
36:40 ? It is not allowable for the sun to reach the moon, nor does the night overtake the day, but each, in an orbit, is swimming.?
The above verse is more than enough to prove the way stars and moon and Sun float above the Earth....Polaris and circumpolar stars and midnight sun are evidence to that..
Anyhow I attached these three links...
https://youtu.be/kWsvHOyHMc8
https://youtu.be/uV5XFlvGcVs
https://youtu.be/Ih29xdaPIyY
https://youtu.be/2NmkDI5QO2o
the sun rises and sets once each year at the poles.
26:28 قال said رب lord المشرق the sunrise والمغرب and the sunset وما and what بىنهما between them dual ان if كنتم be you تعقلون understanding
55:17 رب lord المشرقىن the sunrise two ورب and lord المغربىن the sunset two (i.e. pertains to summers and winters solstices)
Peace TellMeTheTruth.
North and south poles the points are converging. If the east and west converge, the sun rises and sets at the same point. How does that make it any different?
The sun may not set or rises because of the lenght of day/night. But it rises and sets all the same. So as a rule on earth everywhere the sun rises from the east and sets in the west with different day/night lengths.
There is nothing new there!!
GOD bless you.
Peace.
Peace Everyone...
NEAREST Heaven/Sky & DECORATION & INVIOLABLE GUARD?.
These three words can simply suit for a elevated high structure of canopy / vault.. and non other?.
67:3,5 ?He Who created the seven heavens, one above the other ...
And We have adorned the nearest heaven with lamps/stars ...
41:12 ?And He completed them seven heavens in two days
and inspired in each heaven its command;
and We adorned the Nearest heaven with lamps/stars,
and rendered it guarded...
37:6-7 ? Indeed, We have adorned the nearest heaven with an adornment of stars, and to preserve against every rebel Satan;
As per above verses God call the nearest heaven out of Seven Heavens is the nearest the one with structure which cannot be penetrable? rest of the heaven/skies are penetrable(jinn is example) and they are closer to the earth? Nearest is the one farthest from the earth and nearest to the place where Malaika living.. this heaven is well guarded? why need to guard without being able to penetrate? beyond that is not permitted? beyond the structure of heaven is the abode of Malaika..
71:15-16 ?Do you not see how God has created the seven heavens
one above the other,
and made the moon a light in their midst / therein,
and made the sun as a lamp (siraj)?
Now look at the above verses? God doesn?t say that Sun and Moon are at the nearest heaven but in the midst/therein of Heavens ? not near to the earth and not near to the structure of heaven? but in between distance? Stars are of course farther than sun and moon from the earth..
Word DECORATION is very decisive ? God didn?t call sun and moon as decoration, but for stars ?. In Gods Book Earth is stationary plain in which mountains rivers, sea and all things exist and above is the seven layers of sky and the last is the structure which cannot be penetrable? and He decorated the extreme end? does the decoration need to be bigger than the earth.. lol? does the decorating star need to be bigger than the radiant sun? that?s not decoration then.. that?s beyond sense?
These stars also act as objects which chases away the shaitan? Now as per science these farthest stars are bigger than the size of Sun? needless to explain how big the sun is as per science and God uses 2100 times or even bigger than the size of Sun to chase the shaitan?. Simply nonsensical? Or else we can put it this way.. God is chasing shaitan with stars which are bigger than EARTH? do you think Shaitan are bigger than EARTH to chase them while they are living on this very earth? brainwashed by science before reading the quran? cannot help for those minds who are indoctrinated unless they tweak themselves with the book..
These stars are very small in size compared to sun and moon and most of those are not even visible from the earth?
As per alleged Hubble pictures not only stars but tiny mote earth sun moon and many other suns and moons and trillions of stars and all galaxies of various type, all look decoration? just view a galaxy picture? that?s not what God says.. Only nearest Heaven Stars are made as decoration/guard and not sun or moon or earth?.
only the stars of NEAREST heavens are decoration.
sun and moon are not the decoration of nearest heaven :bravo: :rotfl:
:rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl:
:sun: MR sun are you a star too or just a magic ?
INSPIRED (A?AHA) IN EACH HEAVEN ITS COMMAND (AMRAHA). THAT?S NOT UNIVERSE?41:12 ?And He completed them as seven heavens within two days and
inspired (A?aha) in each heaven its
command (Amraha). And We adorned the nearest heaven with lamps and as protection. That is the determination of the Exalted in Might, the Knowing.?
We can deduce that by the above verse there are seven heavens in fact layers of skies one above the other? the last of them is well decorated with stars and guarded? rest of the skies under it? NOTABLE POINT is God say for each Heaven / Sky He has inspired its Command? so other skies have its own function and features?. Modern science also not deny that to certain extent ? how many skies they divide is not what we have to consider but we know skies have layers with different type of atmosphere with different function..?. All these layers above the Earth till reaches the canopy/vault?
That?s what HE created? But HE never mentions anything other than that?what is other than seven layers of sky? As per science our solar system is just one of those many million solar systems and we are in a galaxy and there are many type of galaxies in the alleged Universe?. Did HE create so.. is that what HE says we created SEVEN Layers one above the another?and decorated the nearest and guarded?
Most of all?WHAT ARE THE FUNCTIONS INSPIRED TO EACH SKY? That?s beyond any answer according to heliocentric model and galaxy and universe? Universe doesn?t have seven layers of sky to have each its assigned function..they themselves say? only the Earth has it?s atmosphere which is in fact in seven layers of sky? each has it?s function as per God? Each layers of sky is above this massive expanded stationary Earth.. each layer is very significant?whether we perceive them or not?
That?s our world? That?s what He says Created the Earth and seven Heavens and whatever between the Earth and heaven? Does He say He created other than Earth and Seven heavens?
*****Is seven heavens are equaled to universe?. No? Seven heavens/skies are the layers above the earth?. That?s so obviously visible and its functions*****
SO, where is the Universe (with trillions of galaxies) in quran? PROVE IT.. ?..
Where is the verse to prove the Universe beyond this Earth and its layers of sky?..
Creation of Heavens and Earth is the MAIN CRITERIA to believe in God? so where is the proof of UNIVERSE in quran?. Isn?t the bird flying in the sky, Isn?t the water come from the sky, isn?t the iron comes from sky, isn?t the sun and moon in the midst of sky, isn?t the stars in the last sky, all these between seven layers of heavens and Earth?.
Peace jkhan.
Why not this?:
1-Al Samaa Dunya= Our universe, the first layer of universes if you like.
2- 6 other universes ,one above the other.
In our universe this:
25:61
Most blessed is the One who placed galaxies( each with different constellations of stars) in the samaa(our universe), and placed in it a lamp(Sun), and a shining moon(for our earth)-Living condition on earth are only possible with the sun and moon exactly where they are now-.
تَبارَكَ الَّذى جَعَلَ فِى السَّماءِ بُروجًا وَجَعَلَ فيها سِرٰجًا وَقَمَرًا مُنيرًا
Yes brother just one universe ,our universe is that vast and still expanding!!!!! Can you imagine the second universe? How big will that be?...And so on.
This is showing you brother jkhan that GOD is greaaaaaaaaaa......t, GOD s greatness is such that the earth is Kabdatuhu and the seven universes are Matwiyatun B i Yaminihi- All of them within a grasp of a right hand of GOD brother if you want an allegorical example as context!!!!
Nothing to do with what you are claiming. The shapes chosen for stars,planets ,... in our universe have the same shapes(spherical) and are in motion each running in an orbit to create time and space as we know it and are experiencing it.
The motion is key to time existing,if everything stops, time also comes to a halt. This relationship of speed/distandce and time will coexist until GOD says stop and that day will be on us. Then you will have your flat earth.(Everything gets flattened to undergo the next change in creation)!!!!
See brother ,or do you still see it youe way?
GOD bless you.
Peace.
Salam everyone!
@NW
Al-Mashriq and Al-Maghrib are points/places where the sun 'rises' /-sets'. Pls check all occurrences and verify. Thx
@GL
There is only 1 'universe',. There are only 1 Al-shams', 1 Al-qamr which are timing devices for us. This is the Al-duniya. Get prepared for the Other/the Last/al-akhira. Scientific facts are changing with time but God's message is not changing.
@Jkhan
I will comment later.
Peace!
Quote from: TellMeTheTruth on March 11, 2019, 09:29:40 PM
Salam everyone!
@NW
Al-Mashriq and Al-Maghrib are points/places where the sun 'rises' /-sets'. Pls check all occurrences and verify. Thx
peace -- and what did I post/translate exactly?
cannot believe wasting time responding to this dumb "flat earth" bullshit!
Quote from: TellMeTheTruth on March 11, 2019, 09:29:40 PM
There is only 1 'universe',. There are only 1 Al-shams', 1 Al-qamr which are timing devices for us. This is the Al-duniya.
41:12 فقضاهن so he completed them سبع seven (7) سموت skies (celestial realms) فى in ىومىن days (epochs) two واوحى and inspires فى in كل each سما sky (realm) امرها directive its وزىنا and adorn we of السما the sky (realm) الدنىا the world بمصبىح with lamps وحفظا and guard of ذلك such تقدىر decree العزىز the mighty العلىم the knower
Likewise, multiple realms similar to earth (globe) proven fact else most ignorant of the ignorant!
(https://i.postimg.cc/D0yHD9Pt/ch65v10-ch66v4.jpg)
Peace Everyone?
There is NO Universe?. The EARTH and HEAVEN and whatever BETWEEN Them?. That?s our World?.
Buruj, Najm, Misbah, Kawkaba all thoroughly discussed in this same topic? anyone can go and refer? in a nutshell they all in simple language stars ..6:97 ?And it is He who placed for you the stars (najum) that you may be guided by them through the darknesses of the land and sea. We have detailed the signs for a people who know.? Stars are of variety? needless to say? for example ?Thaariq?
If anyone want to twist word Sama(Heaven/Sky) to anything you prefer, no one to stop you? you can twist as much as you want to adapt and go in line with NASA?that?s your survival?
Below is what you claim?.
Why not this?:
1-Al Samaa Dunya= Our universe, the first layer of universes if you like.
2- 6 other universes ,one above the other.
In our universe this:
25:61
Most blessed is the One who placed galaxies( each with different constellations of stars) in the samaa(our universe), and placed in it a lamp(Sun), and a shining moon(for our earth)-Living condition on earth are only possible with the sun and moon exactly where they are now-.
Do you really have a point what is the accepted science or what NASA says about Universe and Galaxies?.or just try to fool those who have no idea, so that at least that group will bend to your nonsense?
If still you are in elementary stage on this Universe.. then read the link which you follow?
https://spaceplace.nasa.gov/galaxy/en/
SAMA = SKY (WHICH HAS 07 ONE ABOVE ANOTHER FROM THE EARTH WHICH WE SEE for that God placed WEIGHT 55:7-8 And the (Sama) heaven He raised and set the Weight / balance, In order that you may not transgress weight/ balance)??.. thus, no one can break / penetrate the extreme Canopy which is well protected?. Your Universe has no such things?
UNIVERSE = Tiny mote Earth in one of the trillion Solar systems among the billions of galaxies?.NO SEVEN UNIVERSE?. You are overturning from NASA
As per God there is Only THE SUN (AL SHAMS) when it comes to this entire Heavens?. Only in one place in entire quran God used mere SUN (SHAMS) without ?AL? that?s in Janna? He says You won?t see Shams (Sun)?. That?s Janna?
25:61 ?Blessed is He who has placed in the sky (Sama-singular) constellation(Buruj) and placed therein/in the midst a [burning] lamp(Sun) and luminous moon?
That?s the perfect translation?
***Only PURE HEARTS will understand what is EARTH and HEAVEN in QURAN..coz they look for evidence within quran and within the nature and not in DECEPTION ***
Quote from: Noon waalqalami on March 06, 2019, 10:51:56 PM
the sun rises and sets once each year at the poles.
26:28 قال said رب lord المشرق the sunrise والمغرب and the sunset وما and what بىنهما between them dual ان if كنتم be you تعقلون understanding
55:17 رب lord المشرقىن the sunrise two ورب and lord المغربىن the sunset two (i.e. pertains to summers and winters solstices)
Salam brother NW!
Your post above is talking about times 'the sunrise' and 'the sunset' and not places. Also summer and winter are times not places. Moreover, you have not shared your idea about Al-Mashariq (3 or more).
Getting angry at me is not taking us toanywhere coz I am not FES follower.
Peace!
Quote
Likewise, multiple realms similar to earth (globe) proven fact else most ignorant of the ignorant!
(https://i.postimg.cc/D0yHD9Pt/ch65v10-ch66v4.jpg)
Salam brother NW!
Please review The ayah you have quoted/highlighted does not say that there are more universes. See the word من and think again.
Remember that at the time of revelation of AQ, America, Australia and Antarctica were not discivered or known to the audience.
Peace!
Quote from: jkhan on March 12, 2019, 12:21:25 AM
Peace Everyone?
There is NO Universe?. The EARTH and HEAVEN and whatever BETWEEN Them?. That?s our World?.
Buruj, Najm, Misbah, Kawkaba all thoroughly discussed in this same topic? anyone can go and refer? in a nutshell they all in simple language stars ..6:97 ?And it is He who placed for you the stars (najum) that you may be guided by them through the darknesses of the land and sea. We have detailed the signs for a people who know.? Stars are of variety? needless to say? for example ?Thaariq?
If anyone want to twist word Sama(Heaven/Sky) to anything you prefer, no one to stop you? you can twist as much as you want to adapt and go in line with NASA?that?s your survival?
Below is what you claim?.
Why not this?:
1-Al Samaa Dunya= Our universe, the first layer of universes if you like.
2- 6 other universes ,one above the other.
In our universe this:
25:61
Most blessed is the One who placed galaxies( each with different constellations of stars) in the samaa(our universe), and placed in it a lamp(Sun), and a shining moon(for our earth)-Living condition on earth are only possible with the sun and moon exactly where they are now-.
Do you really have a point what is the accepted science or what NASA says about Universe and Galaxies?.or just try to fool those who have no idea, so that at least that group will bend to your nonsense?
If still you are in elementary stage on this Universe.. then read the link which you follow?
https://spaceplace.nasa.gov/galaxy/en/
SAMA = SKY (WHICH HAS 07 ONE ABOVE ANOTHER FROM THE EARTH WHICH WE SEE for that God placed WEIGHT 55:7-8 And the (Sama) heaven He raised and set the Weight / balance, In order that you may not transgress weight/ balance)??.. thus, no one can break / penetrate the extreme Canopy which is well protected?. Your Universe has no such things?
UNIVERSE = Tiny mote Earth in one of the trillion Solar systems among the billions of galaxies?.NO SEVEN UNIVERSE?. You are overturning from NASA
As per God there is Only THE SUN (AL SHAMS) when it comes to this entire Heavens?. Only in one place in entire quran God used mere SUN (SHAMS) without ?AL? that?s in Janna? He says You won?t see Shams (Sun)?. That?s Janna?
25:61 ?Blessed is He who has placed in the sky (Sama-singular) constellation(Buruj) and placed therein/in the midst a [burning] lamp(Sun) and luminous moon?
That?s the perfect translation?
***Only PURE HEARTS will understand what is EARTH and HEAVEN in QURAN..coz they look for evidence within quran and within the nature and not in DECEPTION ***
Salam Jkhan,
Agreed to almost 99% of your above post. Only the word Burj is not costellation.
Peace!
Quote from: TellMeTheTruth on March 12, 2019, 12:53:30 AM
Salam Jkhan,
Agreed to almost 99% of your above post. Only the word Burj is not costellation.
Peace!
Peace TMTT?.
15:16 ? And We have placed within the heaven Buruj and have beautified it for the observers?
If you take this verse and ponder that we see in the sky other than Sun and Moon glittering objects and it is really beautified to us /Observers?. In them You may see variety?. Some may look far away .. some look bigger and smaller, brighter and differences in colors and the way it looks even in shapes..All Nikon P1000 proves?. Impossible focus on objects billions of lights years far? that?s damn science..
BUT all in common God says WE HAVE PLACED in the Heaven Buruj? if you translate Buruj merely as Big Stars etc. then 15:16 we have to consider only God is speaking of Big stars? NO? Are they really only Big stars which are placed in the Sky which is decorated / beautified in the Eyes of Beholders /seers ? NO.. isn?t it? So God must be referring to everything as BURUJ(Plural) other than Moon and Sun?So constellation may considerably fit?Or even merely Stars? if you carefully read the verses of Nujum in Quran, they unambiguously mean stars? in common God uses the word Nujum for everything remember everything what is in the sky which are glittering other than Sun and Moon?
I am fervent to see what your discernment of Buruj is so that I can study further on it whether it befit with the context of quran and if not let me explain why..?So pls TMTT bring your understanding of Buruj?
ADVICE to Sphere Heads..?.. pls don?t waste time in a dumb topic those who think and claim we are dumb? So you must be intelligent? right??? This topic is only to those who is in doubt in NASA and not aware what is in Quran?in a nutshell, in a dilemma ?. Globe heads read or not read or reply or not reply? no grudges at all? So those who have no doubt in NASA? pls don?t simply waste your valuable time? coz you are convinced.. while convinced.. don?t approach dumb people... Why to waste time in reading and responding with dumb people in your recognition.. Open a new topic saying world is Sphere according to Quran so you will have intelligent group there to please you? Soon or later such will come to know who were actually duped openly ?..
Wasting time wittingly is the worst part a person can do?.on top of that an intelligent one.. I wonder why they do that if they are intelligent..?.is that a virus or disease with them that they come after Stationary Earth community and still call dumb?
It is similar to majority of the world who are against quran, they call the Quran is nonsense but they keep referring in Quran? same virus ? not digest?
I am working hard on this simply coz people still read this topic even after it was dispatched to OFF TOPIC?. It?s not coz I am the author of this topic?I am no one to those who read this topic?in fact I am no one?. But clearly majority of people have concern? that?s why people read??I will keep it alive in sha allah at least with a simple verse from Quran without any explanation?.God will.. and I will not slacken to answer all those who asks privately anything from me?
May God guide us which is right...
I brought this before but reminding with some additional particulars...
Solar system model of the planets using scaled diameters
Element Actual Diameter (km) Approximate Scaled Diameter
Sun 1, 392, 000 1, 392 mm (54.8 in)
Mercury 4, 879 5 mm
Venus 12, 104 12 mm
Earth 12, 756 13 mm
Moon 3, 475 3.5 mm
Mars 6, 794 7 mm
Jupiter 142, 980 143 mm
Saturn 120, 540 125 mm
Uranus 51, 120 51 mm
Neptune 49, 530 50 mm
Pluto 2, 300 2.3 mm
Lets turn to Stars?. How big Stars are?
Or you could line up over 100 Earths across its middle. However, compared to otherstars, our Sun is only a medium-sized star, meaning that some stars are much larger than the Sun and some are much smaller. The Sun looks bigger than other stars because it is so much closer to the Earth. Some stars are even 1000 ? 2100 times bigger than our Sun. There are trillions of such stars which are bigger than our Sun. and manifold brighter than Sun. Some are 14000 times brighter than our Sun.
and even below new discovery.
Astronomers have discovered a star that burns 10 million times bright than the Sun. Found within two young star clusters, NGC 3603 and RMC 136a, the stars weigh up to 300 times the mass of the Sun, a figure which doubles the previously accepted limit of solar mass.
Okay story goes on?
Now compare the below verse with all above scientific particulars?..Simply nonsense?
39:67 ?They measure not God with His true measure. The earth altogether shall be His handful/fist on the Day of Resurrection, and the heavens(samawati i.e. all except Earth) shall be rolled up in His right hand. Glory be to Him! High be He exalted above that they associate!?
Earth is in God?s Handful and Heavens in the Hand rolled?..Just piece of joke with science?Just compare the sizes of those entire things and Earth?
HOW CAN SKY BE ROLLED/FOLDED IF IT HAS NO SOLID STRUCTURE?
21:104 ? The Day when We will fold/roll the heaven(Sama) like the folding of a [written] sheet for the records. As We began the first creation, We will repeat it. [That is] a promise binding upon Us. Indeed, We will do it.?
39:67 ??..and the heavens(Samawati) will be folded in His right hand?.?
First verse says SKY(sama-singular) will be folded like a book scrolled
While the second verse says SKIES(Samawati-plural) will be folded in His RIGHT Hand?
We know we cant fold anything which has no shape which is empty? space has no structure as per science.. but empty space? only the objects ?But as per Quran Sky is a canopy/vault expanded with much weight/balance impenetrable which has gates ? beneath it all celestial bodies sun, moon stars, etc..That Sky God fold like a book sheet keeping all the celestial bodies in side the sheet (in fact inside the canopy)?
What in the end God will fold is the STRUCTURE of SKY and while folding all the objects below will consist that will be in His RIGHT Hand?How manifest?.Earth will be in His Handful/Fist?. I wonder how people delude from these?. Yes?ibless is so powerful when trapped no escape?Or else those God send astray who can guide?
UNIVERSE ?meanings? taught by schools in early years.
the earth, sun, moon, alpha centurio, sirius, constellation, 7 heavens/sky, burj ............ etc
When a person want to use a
collective word for
ALL ?as per our limit? what we have and all what we can see through eyes or through telescope we give it a name UNIVERSE its an english word and also in dictionary but unfortunately thats an english WORD cant exist in arabic specially the religious book like quran never used that english UNIVERSE word so lets reject it and make a record of heavy stupidity of 21st century. ( AWARD goes to flat earthers)
QURAN did not use word UNIVERSE
:rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl:
:rotfl:
Salam Jkhan! Buruj is plural of Burj which means a certain type of construction, e.g. A chamber, tower, something high or elevated and prominent. Etc.
See Lane's Lexican for root ب ر ج
You can also check translations of monothiest group, ali qarai, maududi etc. At islamawakened . Com
Peace!
Quote from: TellMeTheTruth on March 12, 2019, 11:03:18 AM
Salam Jkhan! Buruj is plural of Burj which means a certain type of construction, e.g. A chamber, tower, something high or elevated and prominent. Etc.
See Lane's Lexican for root ب ر ج
You can also check translations of monothiest group, ali qarai, maududi etc. At islamawakened . Com
Peace!
Yes... Dear.
We all know that in other verses and root word of bur is lofty construction etcj... But when it comes to sama and burj and decorated.. What are they as per my previous thread.... Do you think we notice as decorated any lofty construction or towers in the sky.. Explain 15:16 pls
Quote from: TellMeTheTruth on March 12, 2019, 12:32:18 AM
Your post above is talking about times 'the sunrise' and 'the sunset' and not places. Also summer and winter are times not places.
peace ? not about times; one person's sunrise can at-same-time be another?s sunset.
2:258 قال said ابرهىم abraham فان so indeed الله the god ىاتى bringeth بالشمس with the sun من from المشرق l-mashriqi/the east (i.e. direction sunrise) فات so bring thou بها in/with it من from المغرب l-maghribi/the west (i.e. direction sunset)
26:28 قال said رب lord المشرق the east (direction sunrise) والمغرب and the west (direction sunset) وما and what بىنهما between them dual ان if كنتم be you تعقلون understanding
55:17 رب lord المشرقىن l-mashriqayni/the east (direction sunrise) two ورب and lord المغربىن l-maghribayni/the west (direction sunset) two
Quote from: TellMeTheTruth on March 12, 2019, 12:32:18 AM
Moreover, you have not shared your idea about Al-Mashariq (3 or more).
What about it? 70:40 المشرق l-mashāriqi/the eastern (m/p) [i.e. direction sunrises]
Quote from: TellMeTheTruth on March 12, 2019, 12:32:18 AM
Getting angry at me is not taking us toanywhere coz I am not FES follower.
ok what about lunar eclipses, did you see it Jan 20, 2019 -- NASA conspiracy too?
Lunar Eclipse 101
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VW2xRR75lKE
Quote from: TellMeTheTruth on March 12, 2019, 12:40:02 AM
Please review The ayah you have quoted/highlighted does not say that there are more universes. See the word من and think again.
Remember that at the time of revelation of AQ, America, Australia and Antarctica were not discivered or known to the audience.
people drew continents (Asia and Europe touch) -- why not include all islands?
likewise to all in thread translate 65:12 state which word means exactly what?
quote author=Noon waalqalami link=topic=9610127.msg423564#msg423564 date=1552404043]
peace ? not about times; one person's sunrise can at-same-time be another?s sunset.
2:258 قال said ابرهىم abraham فان so indeed الله the god ىاتى bringeth بالشمس with the sun من from المشرق l-mashriqi/the east (i.e. direction sunrise) فات so bring thou بها in/with it من from المغرب l-maghribi/the west (i.e. direction sunset)
26:28 قال said رب lord المشرق the east (direction sunrise) والمغرب and the west (direction sunset) وما and what بىنهما between them dual ان if كنتم be you تعقلون understanding
55:17 رب lord المشرقىن l-mashriqayni/the east (direction sunrise) two ورب and lord المغربىن l-maghribayni/the west (direction sunset) two
What about it? 70:40 المشرق l-mashāriqi/the eastern (m/p) [i.e. direction sunrises]
[/quote]
Salam brother NW!
You said earlier that the sun rises and sets at poles two times a year (summer and winter) and that is why المشرقین and المغربین is used in AQ. Just thought that Al-Mashariq may be used for some other specific points on earth where the sun rises 3 or more times in a year. Sorry for my foolish thought.
Now you are telling that Al-Mashriq and Al-Maghrib are two directions. However, one direction is opposite for the other. The East for one person is actually the West for another. The Left side of a person facing North can either be the Sunrise direction or the Sunset direction. So who is the audience of AQ when it talks about sunset or sunrise? I am a bit confused. Again.
Quote
ok what about lunar eclipses, did you see it Jan 20, 2019 -- NASA conspiracy too?
Lunar Eclipse 101
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VW2xRR75lKE
I did not saw this lunar eclipse. The video you have shared is a nice presentation. However, nothing is mentioned in AQ e.g., shadow of the earth, alignment of sun, earth and moon, red blood moon, tilt of earth or moon axis. Would appreciate if you can give references from AQ for my better understanding.
Quote
people drew continents (Asia and Europe touch) -- why not include all islands?
likewise to all in thread translate 65:12 state which word means exactly what?
Yes we can include all islands also.
The word سموت is also used in 2:29. It says that He made 7 layers of السمآء. In 65:12 it says He made the 7 layers from الارض similar to the layers of السمآء. The word مٹلھن is used for these layers i.e., سبع سموت. Bcoz الارض is singular. What is difficult to translate?
Note: Pls do not confuse سموت with السموت.
Peace?
Quote from: jkhan on March 12, 2019, 11:09:20 AM
Yes... Dear.
We all know that in other verses and root word of bur is lofty construction etcj... But when it comes to sama and burj and decorated.. What are they as per my previous thread.... Do you think we notice as decorated any lofty construction or towers in the sky.. Explain 15:16 pls
Salam brother!
When you will read this ayah in context with 15:17-18 it will tell you that how these towers (or guard towers) keep shayateen/jinns away.
Peace!
Peace TellMeTheTruth.
You say , quote:
Now you are telling that Al-Mashriq and Al-Maghrib are two directions. However, one direction is opposite for the other. The East for one person is actually the West for another. The Left side of a person facing North can either be the Sunrise direction or the Sunset direction. So who is the audience of AQ when it talks about sunset or sunrise? I am a bit confused. Again.
Ok, Imagine you are east of me and I am west of you. The sun sets from you west but rises on me east. What is confusing about that?
Remember as far as you are concerned, the sun is gone from you .Your east and west were the correct directions of the sun rising on you and setting from you, you have night time.
Now the sun has come towards me rising from my east which is your west. I have daytime now . soon the sun will set from my west towards some one else s east.
So ,regardless where you are on earth the sun always rises from your east of you and set from your west.
Hope that is not confusing!
GOD bless you.
Peace.
Salam brother GL!
It is a good explanation. I will need some more explanation, i think.
Now lets see: I am (or anyone) is standing on equator facing North and the sun ia rising from my right side (al-mashriq). Then i started moving towards north pole and it is still rising from my right side. When i reach North pole region. Suddenly every direction is South and the sun is rising from my left side. Can I say that it is rising from al-maghrib because al-maghrib was on my left side? May be discovery of poles is a sign of The Hour.
Peace!
NEED to study the flatness of earth on poles like ostrich egg not like ball.
east is always east and west is always west at planet but as soon we leave earth the east and west can not apply as its reffering to earth.
see the model in details for more information how sun reacts at polar regions what cause both east and both west. also some more things are interesting to focus like ?Auroras? greenish light and whats the scientific reason behind it.
https://www.sciencefriday.com/articles/a-physicist-explains-the-shimmering-science-behind-auroras/ (https://www.sciencefriday.com/articles/a-physicist-explains-the-shimmering-science-behind-auroras/)
Quote from: TellMeTheTruth on March 12, 2019, 01:48:27 PM
Salam brother!
When you will read this ayah in context with 15:17-18 it will tell you that how these towers (or guard towers) keep shayateen/jinns away.
Peace!
Peace dear TMTT
thank you for your response..... Interesting you angle of thought. . So I presume you think that buruj are lofty constructions in the sky probably malaika living and shaitan near to hear.... I don't say wrong... Could be option. But we have look every possible ways before deducing and be convinced with them...
Yes... Buruj is plural but what is guarded is singular in 15:17... What is guarded is canopy (sama) ... Even God uses kawkaban as decorated and says those kawkaban guard.... All in all in my understanding they are stars of variety.... But some have different function to chase shaitan....as you see regular stars whatever you see in the sky don't change its movement according to shaitan but they float glide in its orbit....
I respect your opinion... But I wish you meticulously explore buruj, nujum, shihab, kawkaban in their usage and with much application of our common sense and comparing with science...then it would figure out.....
Keep it up you are doing a great job.... May God give you more knowledge and let us have your knowledge shared.....
Quote from: TellMeTheTruth on March 12, 2019, 01:28:59 PM
I did not saw this lunar eclipse. The video you have shared is a nice presentation. However, nothing is mentioned in AQ e.g., shadow of the earth, alignment of sun, earth and moon, red blood moon, tilt of earth or moon axis. Would appreciate if you can give references from AQ for my better understanding.
peace, why reference the obvious which the ancients calculated eclipses, solstices, earth?s circumference, etc.
Quote from: TellMeTheTruth on March 12, 2019, 01:28:59 PM
Yes we can include all islands also.
The word سموت is also used in 2:29. It says that He made 7 layers of السمآء. In 65:12 it says He made the 7 layers from الارض similar to the layers of السمآء. The word مٹلھن is used for these layers i.e., سبع سموت. Bcoz الارض is singular. What is difficult to translate?
then translate what 65:12 says?
Quote from: TellMeTheTruth on March 12, 2019, 01:28:59 PM
Note: Pls do not confuse سموت with السموت.
then tell us the difference?
سما samāin
السما l-samāa
سبع sabʿa/seven سموت samāwātin
السموت l-samāwātu السبع l-sabʿu/the seven
نسا nisāan/womenfolk
النسا l-nisāa/the womenfolk
SHIHAB
72: 8-9 ?And we have sought [to reach] the heaven but found it filled with powerful guards and burning flames.?
And we used to sit therein in positions for hearing, but whoever listens now will find a burning flame lying in wait for him.
37:10 Except one who snatches [some words] by theft, but they are pursued by a burning flame, piercing [in brightness].
KAWKABAN
37:6-7 Indeed, We have adorned the nearest heaven with an adornment of stars, and to Protect against every rebel Satan;
BURUJ
15:16-17 And We have placed within the heaven great stars and have beautified it (Sama) for the observers. And We have protected it (Sama) from every devil expelled [from the mercy of Allah]
Aren?t they all same ? Yes.. they are ? but all have definitely different features..
NUJUM
Most common word used in quran as below perfect verse indicates? All the above three are STARS (NUJUM) ?
16:12 ?And He has subjected for you the night and day and the sun and moon, and the stars are subjected by His command. Indeed in that are signs for a people who reason.?
You can refer below as well...
https://free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9610127.310
Quote from: Noon waalqalami on March 12, 2019, 09:00:46 PM
peace, why reference the obvious which the ancients calculated eclipses, solstices, earth?s circumference, etc.
Salam!
Thank you! I know ancients calculated that earth is like a seven layered pyramid with four corners and we are living in a closed system. So we are going to stop discussion about what is obvious.
نساء is any woman including young and old (general)
النساء is a woman you can نکح، طلق، لمس etc. (specific)
[65:12] Allah is the one who created seven layers (of السمآء 2:29) and from the Earth (layers) like of them (سموت)...
peace!
Quote from: imrankhawaja on March 12, 2019, 03:03:57 PM
NEED to study the flatness of earth on poles like ostrich egg not like ball.
east is always east and west is always west at planet but as soon we leave earth the east and west can not apply as its reffering to earth.
see the model in details for more information how sun reacts at polar regions what cause both east and both west. also some more things are interesting to focus like ?Auroras? greenish light and whats the scientific reason behind it.
https://www.sciencefriday.com/articles/a-physicist-explains-the-shimmering-science-behind-auroras/ (https://www.sciencefriday.com/articles/a-physicist-explains-the-shimmering-science-behind-auroras/)
Salam brother!
I am already studying flatness of earth whether it is on poles or around me.
Thank you for sharing the link about more amazing and fascinating unsolved mysteries. I will surely try to imagine and come up with some 'logical' explanation with some geometrical diagrams or videos as a proof. Hope it will be a great gift to humankind.
"The East is always east and The West is always west on planet." Well, brother NW has a different view. More confusing for my small brain.
Peace!
NW got the same view what i have but as u said ur brain cannot grasping it.
its not about the size of brain but its usage. ;D
Although i agree on what u said about researching more. it will really help.
peace.
Quote from: TellMeTheTruth on March 13, 2019, 12:29:55 AM
Thank you! I know ancients calculated that earth is like a seven layered pyramid with four corners and we are living in a closed system. So we are going to stop discussion about what is obvious.
peace -- ancients wasn't referring to ignorant as today rather mathematicians like Eratosthenes.
Quote from: TellMeTheTruth on March 13, 2019, 12:29:55 AM
نساء is any woman including young and old (general)
النساء is a woman you can نکح، طلق، لمس etc. (specific)
http://www.languageguide.org/arabic/grammar/articles.jsp
no (3+) any age includes "the minors" -- use context.
4:7 وللنسا walilnnisāi/and for the womenfolk (f/p) نصىب share
4:11 فان so if كن be/are (f/p) نسا nisāan/womenfolk (f/p)
Quote from: TellMeTheTruth on March 13, 2019, 12:29:55 AM
[65:12] Allah is the one who created seven layers (of السمآء 2:29) and from the Earth (layers) like of them (سموت)...
imprecise and sloppy "layers" i.e. one above another of ?- different word طباقا ṭibāqan
2:29 هو he الذى the one خلق creation لكم for you ما what فى in الارض the land (f) جمىعا all of ثم furthermore استوى directs الى to السما l-samāi/the sky [celestial realm (f)] فسوهن so fashion them (f/p) سبع seven (7) سموت samāwātin/skies [celestial realms (f/p)] وهو and he بكل in every شى thing علىم knower
65:12 الله the god الذى the one خلق creation سبع seven (7) سموت samāwātin/skies [celestial realms (f/p)] ومن and of الارض the land (f) مثلهن mith'lahunna/similitude them (f/p) ىتنزل descended الامر the directive بىنهن between them (f/p) لتعلموا to know ye of ان that الله the god على on كل every شى thing قدىر supreme وان and that indeed الله the god قد hence احاط encompasses بكل in every شى thing علما aware of
and of the land/earth (f) مثلهن similitude them (f/p) i.e. seven (7) سموت samāwātin/skies [celestial realms (f/p)]
23:86 قل say من who رب lord السموت l-samāwāti/the skies [celestial realms (f/p)] السبع the seven (7) ورب and lord العرش the throne العظىم the major
by the way, above is obviously not talking about ?the earth?s atmosphere? rather the realms of creation.
peace!
LET'S CHECK WHETHER SEVEN EARTHS OR BILLIONS OF THEM.... BELOW definitely not seven.... This is what call the trick of Iblees in 21st Century.... Iblees getting old but not he is a fool, but he fools with his latest technology ... If he can befool your grandpa in Janna then you are are nothing...
On November 4, 2013, astronomers reported, based on Kepler space mission data, that there could be as many as 40 billion Earth-sized planets orbiting in the habitable zones of Sun-like stars and red dwarf stars within the Milky Way galaxy. 11 billion of these estimated planets may be orbiting Sun-like stars.
As of 1 January 2019, there are 3,946 confirmed planets in 2,945 systems, with 650 systems having more than one planet. There are many methods of detecting exoplanets. Transit photometry and Doppler spectroscopy have found the most. In several cases, multiple planets have been observed around a star.
Solar system with planets bigger than earth and stars bigger than sun not enough....
So invented galaxy... Galaxy not enough variety of galaxies that also billions of... And all of them made the universe.... And now that's not satisfied to scientists....
A Universe Not sufficient.... So other Universes....
https://earthsky.org/space/the-strange-case-for-life-in-other-universes
God made Earth and heavens for men and Jin to place them and test.... He created them with strong purpose.... He exposed what He created above us and within us....
I wonder these insane spinning heads ever stop spinning... While the head is spinning can there be any good thoughts....
Allah Created only one structure of sky and made it seven, one above the other... And God made only one Earth which we live and expanded it seven regions... God knows well what these seven regions of earth and heavens... Even God call seven oceans in Quran .. Twisters will always twist.. Coz that's what God planned... Hypocrites should be alive to fill the deepest hell
Quote from: jkhan on March 12, 2019, 11:35:01 PM
SHIHAB
KAWKABAN
BURUJ
Aren?t they all same ? Yes.. they are ? but all have definitely different features..
NUJUM
Most common word used in quran as below perfect verse indicates? All the above three are STARS (NUJUM) ?
no they are not different words are used?
27:7 بشهاب bishihābin/with torch
6:76 كوكبا kawkaban/celestial object of (singular)
37:6 الكوكب l-kawākibi/the celestial objects (pl.)
16:16 وبالنجم wabil-najmi/and/by the star (singular)
6:97 النجوم l-nujūma/the stars (pl.) لتهتدوا to guide ye of بها with it فى in ظلمت darkness
85:1 والسما and/by the sky ذات contain البروج l-buruji/the constructs (constellations)
i.e. all celestial bodies: galaxies, stars, star clusters, planets, comets, meteors, etc.
(https://i.postimg.cc/6pLQ49Mv/Looking-at-starts-at-night-1.jpg)
Quote from: jkhan on March 13, 2019, 11:38:12 AM
LET'S CHECK WHETHER SEVEN EARTHS OR BILLIONS OF THEM.... BELOW definitely not seven
it does not say/compare to #7 rather look at the night sky which is only our sky hence trillions!
and of the land/earth مثلهن similitude them i.e. seven سموت samāwātin/skies [celestial realms (f/p)]
peace!
Quote from: Noon waalqalami on March 13, 2019, 07:57:59 AM
peace -- ancients wasn't referring to ignorant as today rather mathematicians like Eratosthenes.
Salam brother! Have studied about him. There is still controversy among scientists regarding the shape of earth so do not want to discuss which is not yet final. Anyhow i like the idea of pear-shaped earth. Just like the ancients with 7-layered earth model.
Quote
http://www.languageguide.org/arabic/grammar/articles.jsp
no (3+) any age includes "the minors" -- use context.
4:7 وللنسا walilnnisāi/and for the womenfolk (f/p) نصىب share
4:11 فان so if كن be/are (f/p) نسا nisāan/womenfolk (f/p)
So a person can do 'nikah' with any 3+?
Quote
imprecise and sloppy "layers" i.e. one above another of ?- different word طباقا ṭibāqan
Right. طباقا is used for sky-layers and not for earth-layers.
Quote
2:29 هو he الذى the one خلق creation لكم for you ما what فى in الارض the land (f) جمىعا all of ثم furthermore استوى directs الى to السما l-samāi/the sky [celestial realm (f)] فسوهن so fashion them (f/p) سبع seven (7) سموت samāwātin/skies [celestial realms (f/p)] وهو and he بكل in every شى thing علىم knower
استوی means levelled, why directs? How you translate استوی علی العرش?
فسوھن is used for plural while السمآء is singular like الصحرآء. Does it refer to جمیعا or to سبع سموت؟
Quote
65:12 الله the god الذى the one خلق creation سبع seven (7) سموت samāwātin/skies [celestial realms (f/p)] ومن and of الارض the land (f) مثلهن mith'lahunna/similitude them (f/p) ىتنزل descended الامر the directive بىنهن between them (f/p) لتعلموا to know ye of ان that الله the god على on كل every شى thing قدىر supreme وان and that indeed الله the god قد hence احاط encompasses بكل in every شى thing علما aware of [/color]
and of the land/earth (f) مثلهن similitude them (f/p) i.e. seven (7) سموت samāwātin/skies [celestial realms (f/p)]
من = from. الارض is singular. مثلھن is used for سموت and i think it has nothing to do with the number 7 سبع
Quote
23:86 قل say من who رب lord السموت l-samāwāti/the skies [celestial realms (f/p)] السبع the seven (7) ورب and lord العرش the throne العظىم the major
by the way, above is obviously not talking about ?the earth?s atmosphere? rather the realms of creation.
peace!
Agreed.
Peace
Quote from: jkhan on March 12, 2019, 11:35:01 PM
SHIHAB
72: 8-9 ?And we have sought [to reach] the heaven but found it filled with powerful guards and burning flames.?
And we used to sit therein in positions for hearing, but whoever listens now will find a burning flame lying in wait for him.
37:10 Except one who snatches [some words] by theft, but they are pursued by a burning flame, piercing [in brightness].
KAWKABAN
37:6-7 Indeed, We have adorned the nearest heaven with an adornment of stars, and to Protect against every rebel Satan;
BURUJ
15:16-17 And We have placed within the heaven great stars and have beautified it (Sama) for the observers. And We have protected it (Sama) from every devil expelled [from the mercy of Allah]
Aren?t they all same ? Yes.. they are ? but all have definitely different features..
NUJUM
Most common word used in quran as below perfect verse indicates? All the above three are STARS (NUJUM) ?
16:12 ?And He has subjected for you the night and day and the sun and moon, and the stars are subjected by His command. Indeed in that are signs for a people who reason.?
You can refer below as well...
https://free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9610127.310
The one to twist must have a hypocrite mind....read carefully above verses.... God used the same meaning of verses with different words... all are placed as Decoration and Protected as Shield... That's simple logic to understand the meaning of qruan...
Meanwhile...
@ TMTT i am waiting for your reply on what is DECORATED & PROTECTED in 15:16.... In fact verse says BURUJ (plural) but Decorated IT(singular) Protected IT(singular)....
Salam Jkhan!
The answer is السمآء
Peace!
Peace All..
2:255 ? God exists. There is no God but He, the Everlasting and the Guardian of life. Drowsiness or sleep do not seize him. TO HIM BELONGS all that is in the HEAVENS and in the EARTH??.. ??. ?. The heavens and the earth are UNDER HIS DOMINION/ SOVEREIGNTY. He does not experience fatigue in preserving THEM(khifdukuma-dual) both. He is the Highest and the Greatest.?
For almost everyone beginner or expert in quran this verse is very familiar?
look at the first part ??BELONGING? God says Everything is HIS.. how He explains it? All that is IN the HEAVENS (plural)? why plural ?? coz in Each it has different functions different belongings Rain Clouds you see very near to you.. it is the belonging of Allah.. but you won?t get rain cloud where there are blazing flames around or else sun and moon not in where stars around.. ?. So belongings of HEAVENS (plural) is precisely stated..
Next is All that is IN the Earth? No plural? Earth is absolutely ONE but different regions like different Oceans..It is not one above the other like the function of Sky? So whatever belongings on the Earth is God?s?even what is inside the earth is of God?s belongings ? Clearly Earth and Heavens are different...
NEXT?other portion of the verse?
God says HEAVENS and EARTH is under His Sovereignty, He doesn?t tire in guarding THEM(dual? remember words used are HEAVENS(plural) and EARTH) but used dual THEM as Khifduhuma?Though Heavens are made as layers one above the other with different functions they all under one Solid Structure which is the VAULT / CANOPY (Sama)? So God is guarding EARTH and HEAVEN(which has seven layers)
No seven EARTHS like the functions of Heavens?Earth has its regions and as well its underground?
How foolish it is to deduce the verse, as God doesn?t get tired in preserving this tiny MOTE Earth in comparison to the rest of the immeasurable Universe separately? needless to say Earth and heavens? simply as Universe will do?
2:29 ?It is He who created for you all of that which is on the earth. Then He directed Himself to the heaven, [His being above all creation], and proportioned / fashioned them seven heavens, and He is Knowing of all things.?
Only one Heaven proportioned it with layers and different functions and decrees as seven?
88:17-20
?Then do they not look at the camels - how they are created?
?And at the sky - how it is raised high??
?And at the mountains - how they are erected??
?And at the earth - how it is spread out??
What those questions? Do we see all of them? Or Ar Rahman is asking us to see something that we can?t see or which is beyond our vision? No? all in our naked eye vision? Camel, Mountains, Earth and Sky?.
Now the question is the SAMA(Sky/Heaven) stated here is visible according to science? Sky here for Globe heads is space and vast never seen Universe which include billions of solar system and galaxies? do we ever see them to come to a clear deduction to say how it is raised high? NO.
But we see our Sky raised high and all in between them? even we live in New Zealand or India or Norway we see the sky (day or night) what it consists? That?s our world?not beyond vision?
But what science teaches us is beyond our own capacity? for example Jupiter itself is a massive Planet multi time bigger than Earth? So do we really know what is in it? While God asks in 88:20 ?And at the Earth, How it is spread out? ? But we don?t see Jupiter how it is spread out or Mars or other planets of other solar systems.?it is just an example? then imagine the entire universe.. we don?t have any idea?. But God tempt us and instruct us to see what he has created and one of them is SAMA(Sky)? Yes we see what we see and not beyond that.. and beyond that is science fiction. Imaginary deceptive dimensions that their own creation which we are deprived from our vision?God says otherwise? You CAN SEE seven heavens raised high?
What logic brother khan!!!!
It is like saying you see where you live and around you in the place you live on earth, but everything else on earth is science fiction because you do not see it.
If it was not for travel means you will still have that view of earth?!!!!
Wake up brother, travel in space is a reality and when you travel or create machines that travel further, you see into "your science fiction", which unfortunately is a reality as far the universe is concerned. Billions of galaxies,Billions of stars,,....And our earth which you can only see a tiny bit of sky from.
I am surprised at your learmning?
GOD bless you.
Peace.
Quote from: good logic on March 14, 2019, 03:39:06 AM
What logic brother khan!!!!
It is like saying you see where you live and around you in the place you live on earth, but everything else on earth is science fiction because you do not see it.
If it was not for travel means you will still have that view of earth?!!!!
Wake up brother, travel in space is a reality and when you travel or create machines that travel further, you see into "your science fiction", which unfortunately is a reality as far the universe is concerned. Billions of galaxies,Billions of stars,,....And our earth which you can only see a tiny bit of sky from.
I am surprised at your learmning?
GOD bless you.
Peace.
Peace Brother...
You got it absolutely the other way around.... i am not against what is real science and what is technology and what is convenient ..... i am against deception and fictions which are definitely not reality... try to grasp it... I am not a frog inside a well....do you you copy that... Deception is not equal to science.. but mere fiction and their conjecture....
Peace jkhan.
Yes, and I was involved, deeply involved, in that deception... Along with brothers, Imran and Noon
We have deceived our friends here - and we are going to deceive you if you are not careful?.
Common brother, are you saying about reality that it is a deception?
In that case good logic finds pleasure in deceiving brother jkhan!!!.
I consider it necessary, but i do not enjoy it.
Then jkhan very quickly figure it out and now he is into the practice of bigger deceptions.!!!!
Well brother, your deceptions in the course of this thread are indeed nothing but a flat lie and falsehood passing from words into big delusions.
Keep them coming,your choice.
GOD bless you.
Peace.
Quote from: good logic on March 14, 2019, 08:13:42 AM
Peace jkhan.
Yes, and I was involved, deeply involved, in that deception... Along with brothers, Imran and Noon
We have deceived our friends here - and we are going to deceive you if you are not careful?.
YES... That's the absolute reality sadly... For deception you are the root cause coz you didnt verify..... Quran had enough verses for your claim... You may not know your deception but you are... Unless you give quran significance than NASA... You may be thinking yes you do give quran importance but not in reality... Your deep rooted attachment to the deception has overpowered....
I was a curious student when I was studying geography in school and physics in college.. But then I have not read Quran with understanding and interest but I have heard almost everything since we do learn as a conventional Muslim QURAN and hadith from others... ... But my mind always said quran doesn't support what is taught in college.... But just neglected quran and continued my studies.... Masha Allah I was successful in my studies.... I was never a Quran or pure hadith believer ever but I respected both with sheer respect... But God opened my mind to read QURAN about 8 years back... I fully read translation like reading a novel... I said to myself what is in this Quran that surprises western community to convert.... I said to my self nothing... When I grew in age people started asking certain questions from me but I didn't know anything to answer... So I said all religions same and believe in one God.... But they were sort of curious people about our religion and rules... One said to me... I respect your religion coz you bury the corpse so simply... I said Hmmmmmm... Even Hindus does.... I was nothing of a person .... But somehow I was so afraid to God... I am so afraid to do anything wrong even a simple one... Friends say let's drink.... I say no... Come on you are not religious... Why don't you drink.... I say it's OK.... As per first job I could have taken lots of money coz I was attached to a college and post graduate exam papers are within my reach... So many approach me.... Even try to extend money which I can't even Imagine at that time... Coz I was young... And like money so I can be free to spend... But I refused... No idea why I was doing all that.... But later when I am settled in pure job and matured I wanted to read Quran when I saw madness in hadith... Ever since I found quran is right....
Why I told this brief story of me.... Coz I am not blinded... I am well aware what is heliocentric model of earth... Coz I thoroughly learned it.... But what made me go against on something that I spent months in learning.... Yes... Word of God always trigured me.... Last 8 years I perfectly knew I was deceived before that..... I came out of it.... So don't call me back to darkness.....
What makes you convince people from Quran that world is spinning.... There is nothing convincing in Quran to claim it... If so I would have foremost....
@ GL ... I could have brought few verses from Quran how people get deceived and not knowing... But you know them...
Any globe heads... Don't misunderstand me... In my understanding if any fail to grasp what God created then he or she is definitely not guided... That's my personal opinion.... Illiterate not in this list... But who are erudite and fail...
For you your way GL and for me my way and I am not unaware what is your way
@ GL u should save ur time.
flatearthers knows 2+ 2= 4 in matematics and grass is green in planet earth.
but after knowing the truth they want to reject it how can you help a pharaoh who knows the reality about sehar and truth.
either u explain them or not they are like blind as per 2:7 its will not make any difference in their learning.
for proving this verse God is making flatearthers and ?color blind? people SPECIALLY so that people can have entertainment. look how God divided people in brain segregations lmao. :rotfl:
for GOD creating a flatearther= making a stupid/low mind/IQ for make it function. ( thats reality too) may b one day they also blame it on God hahaha
for a ?color blind? person he alreast knows his eyes are showing him what is not real, so he accepted the reality.
for heavily stupid like flat earthers simple math make it work like 2+2 is not 4.
due to LOW iq after getting -ve marks or failed marks in exams a heavily stupid accepts them and they dont do that mistake again by the help of calculator.
BUT we have unique type of stupid as per 2:7 from this we can see QURAN is correct and these type of people are also real who r not blind,deaf and dumb in reality but by functioning. as we have flatearthers in 21st century.
its clearly shows the truth.
whatever u are saying is u repeated it more than one times.
interesting thing to share with people who dont want to go into details.flatearthers failed to provide eclipse model as well as 6 standing questions till now.
waiting for the ?flatearthers? who have IQ of year 10 atleast but it will be unique thing if we can manage to find a IQ of year 10 in flatearth community.
Salam everyone!
Watch this and comment.
https://youtu.be/sssLsGfV_Bk
Peace
Quote from: TellMeTheTruth on March 13, 2019, 08:35:47 PM
So a person can do 'nikah' with any 3+?
peace, no use context نسا nisāan/womenfolk (pl. i.e. 3+)
4:6 وابتلوا and test ye of الىتمى the bereaved حتى until اذا when بلغوا reach they of النكاح l-nikaha/the marriage فان so if انستم perceive you منهم of/among them رشدا rational of فادفعوا so deliver ye of الىهم to them اموالهم wealth theirs
Quote from: TellMeTheTruth on March 13, 2019, 08:35:47 PM
استوی means levelled, why directs? How you translate استوی علی العرش?
use context: استوى is'tawā/ascends على upon العرش the throne
Lexicon by Edward William Lane hence one says, استوى إِلَيْهِ كَالسَّهْمِ المُرْسَلِ He, or it, went towards him, or it, with an undeviating, a direct, or a straight, course, like the arrow hot forth: and hence, ثُمَّ اسْتَوَى إِلَى السَّمَآءِ is metaphorically said of God ... meaning (tropical:) Then He directed himself by his will to the [heaven, or] elevated regions, (Ksh, Bd,) or upwards, (Ksh,) or to the heavenly bodies ... for when الاِسْتِوَآءُ is trans. by means of إِلَى it imports the meaning of the directing of oneself, or, as in this case, of one's design: (TA;) you say of any one who has finished a work and has directed himself to another, قَدِ اسْتَوَى لَهُ and إِلَيْهِ: (Har p. 631:) or the meaning here is صَعِدَ, (Zj, M, K,) or صَعِدَ أَمْرُهُ [i. e. his command ascended]Quote from: TellMeTheTruth on March 13, 2019, 08:35:47 PM
من = from. الارض is singular.
use context thousand+ entries.
6:143 ومن wamina/and of المعز l-maʿzi/the goat (noun) اثنىن pair ?
24:60 والقوعد and the postmenopausal من from/among النسا l-nisāi/the womenfolk (f/p noun 3+) اللاتى the ones (f/p) لا not ىرجون desiring نكاحا nikahan/marriage of
65:12 ومن wamina/and of الارض l-arḍi/the land/earth (noun) مثلهن mith'lahunna/similitude them (f/p) [i.e. 7 skies/celestial realms]
78:14 وانزلنا and descends we of من from المعصرت the clouds (f/p) ما water ثجاجا abundant
97:3 لىله night القدر the decree خىر better من of/than الف alfi/thousand (1,000) شهر moon cycle
Quote from: jkhan on March 13, 2019, 11:50:42 PM
15:16.... In fact verse says BURUJ (plural) but Decorated IT(singular) Protected IT(singular)
use context, listen shock wave steals the hearing.
Meteorite Hits Russia! Feb 15th 2013
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wu8DHCfBbBs
(https://i.postimg.cc/q73PS8vn/ch15v5-26.jpg)
peace!
SKY SPLIT / TORN APART
84:01 ?When the sky has split [open]?
Note ? anything solid can split.. for example when seeds grow splitting the earth?.There is nothing in the space to split? that?s science, but quran states sky is a structure with heavy weight (meezan)..
69:16 ?And the sky(sama-singular) will be rent asunder / split, for it will that Day be flimsy/weak/frail,
69:17 ?And the angel/s will be on the sides/edges/borders of IT(Sky), And there will uphold/carry (Yahmilu) the Throne of your(singular) Lord above them, that Day, eight [of them].
55:37 ?And when the heaven is split open and becomes rose-colored like oil -
25:25 ?Upon the day that heaven is split asunder with the clouds and the angels are sent down in majesty,?
take support for above 25:25 verse by below verse 2:210
"Do they await but that Allah should come to them in covers of clouds and the angels [as well] and the matter is [then] decided? And to Allah [all] matters are returned."
According to the above clear verses, Sky(Sama) will be split? There are more verses in this manner? you can refer..
What actually will SPLIT according to Heliocentric model which unfortunately the majorities choice knowingly or unknowingly?? What in fact will be Very Flimsy and Weak? What are the EDGES of the SKY? When the Sky split only Why Malaika Descend? You know Sky has Gates? malaika used to come through it whenever they want to come to earth, even rained on the day of great flood? on the Day which is the Decider Malaika will come through the already split Sky.. no gates all split? Split Sky will change color ? the Seventh Sky (Structure) will become infirm and The Eighth will be visible with the Arsh of God being carried by Malak above Them?.
78:18-19 ?The Day the Horn is blown and you will come forth in multitudes, And the heaven/sky (sama) is opened(Futhihath) and will become gateways(Abwaba)
I would like to add the above verses to this thread? Isn?t that Gate? Won?t Allah split the Sky and it becomes Opening and in the end becoming as Gateways?Sameway god referred to Nuh?s Great Deluge.. Sky has gates for entry and exit.. He opened the gates of Heaven..54:11 (note the singular usage of SAMA(sky) when it comes to gates and opening
DESCENDING plus ASCENDING
57:04 ?It is He who created the heavens and earth in six days and then established Himself above the Throne. He knows what penetrates into the earth and what emerges from it and what DESCENDS from the Heaven(Sama) and what ASCENDS in it; and He is with you wherever you are. And Allah , of what you do, is Seeing.?
Put this and workout Descending and Ascending in your innumerable solar system and innumerable galaxies?Where is sky and from where things Descend and from where things Ascend and where they ascend to??? DESCEND & ASCEND will never suit to your deceptive imaginary Universe?.But will go well with God?s enclosed system?
How perfect God is in His explanation?
Quote from: Noon waalqalami on March 14, 2019, 10:21:44 PM
peace, no use context نسا nisāan/womenfolk (pl. i.e. 3+)
4:6 وابتلوا and test ye of الىتمى the bereaved حتى until اذا when بلغوا reach they of النكاح l-nikaha/the marriage فان so if انستم perceive you منهم of/among them رشدا rational of فادفعوا so deliver ye of الىهم to them اموالهم wealth theirs
Salam brother Noon!
I do not see the wird نساء in this ayah!
Pls see 2:222 and let know how النساء
(3+} can be among المحیض
Pls also see 2:231 and tell me how can you divorce 3+ (النساء)?
Quote
use context: استوى is'tawā/ascends على upon العرش the throne
Lexicon by Edward William Lane
hence one says, استوى إِلَيْهِ كَالسَّهْمِ المُرْسَلِ He, or it, went towards him, or it, with an undeviating, a direct, or a straight, course, like the arrow hot forth: and hence, ثُمَّ اسْتَوَى إِلَى السَّمَآءِ is metaphorically said of God ... meaning (tropical:) Then He directed himself by his will to the [heaven, or] elevated regions, (Ksh, Bd,) or upwards, (Ksh,) or to the heavenly bodies ... for when الاِسْتِوَآءُ is trans. by means of إِلَى it imports the meaning of the directing of oneself, or, as in this case, of one's design: (TA;) you say of any one who has finished a work and has directed himself to another, قَدِ اسْتَوَى لَهُ and إِلَيْهِ: (Har p. 631:) or the meaning here is صَعِدَ, (Zj, M, K,) or صَعِدَ أَمْرُهُ [i. e. his command ascended]
OK. The God created the earth first. When He finished, then He directed Himself towards the Sky and then made 7 سموت. I do believe in this sequence. But I am sure that it all goes against your lovely science/scientists.
Quote
use context thousand+ entries.
6:143 ومن wamina/and of المعز l-maʿzi/the goat (noun) اثنىن pair ?
24:60 والقوعد and the postmenopausal من from/among النسا l-nisāi/the womenfolk (f/p noun 3+) اللاتى the ones (f/p) لا not ىرجون desiring نكاحا nikahan/marriage of
65:12 ومن wamina/and of الارض l-arḍi/the land/earth (noun) مثلهن mith'lahunna/similitude them (f/p) [i.e. 7 skies/celestial realms]
78:14 وانزلنا and descends we of من from المعصرت the clouds (f/p) ما water ثجاجا abundant
97:3 لىله night القدر the decree خىر better من of/than الف alfi/thousand (1,000) شهر moon cycle
الارض is singular and ھن always refers to f/p. Hope you get my point now.
Peace!
Quote from: jkhan on March 15, 2019, 12:28:51 AM
84:01 ?When the sky has split [open]?
Note ? anything solid can split.. There is nothing in the space to split
one contradictory post after another from flat earth astrophysicist :laugh:
If sky cannot split, cleft asunder, break apart why are the words there?
55:37 فاذا so when انشقت inshaqqati/has split she السما the sky (f) فكانت so be she ورده rose-colored كالدهان like the murky oil
77:9 واذا and when السما the sky (f) فرجت furijat/cleft asunder she
82:1 اذا when السما the sky (f) انفطرت infaṭarat/breaks apart she
Quote from: TellMeTheTruth on March 15, 2019, 10:30:17 AM
I do not see the wird نساء in this ayah!
Pls see 2:222 and let know how النساء
(3+} can be among المحیض
Pls also see 2:231 and tell me how can you divorce 3+ (النساء)?
peace - basic reading comprehension perhaps open different thread.
2:222 وىسلونك and asked they you (peace upon him) عن about المحىض the menstruation قل say هو it اذى ailment فاعتزلوا so abandon ye of النسا l-nisāa/the womenfolk (pl.) فى in المحىض the menstruation
2:231 واذا and when طلقتم divorce you (plural i.e. general address) النسا the womenfolk (pl.)
Quote from: TellMeTheTruth on March 15, 2019, 10:30:17 AM
OK. The God created the earth first. When He finished, then He directed Himself towards the Sky and then made 7 سموت. I do believe in this sequence. But I am sure that it all goes against your lovely science/scientists.
again basic reading comprehension it says ثم thumma/furthermore not first, second, etc.
Quote from: TellMeTheTruth on March 15, 2019, 10:30:17 AM
الارض is singular and ھن always refers to f/p. Hope you get my point now.
do you not read what is posted -- are these feminine plural or masculine singular noun?
6:143 من mina/of الضان l-ḍani/the sheep
ومن wamina/and of المعز l-maʿzi/the goat
6:144 ومن wamina/and of الابل l-ibili/the camel
ومن wamina/and of البقر l-baqari/the cow
76:26 ومن wamina/and of اللىل al-layli/the night
من in Arabic fits perfectly for all occurrences (thousand+) similar as other languages like "od" in Slavic languages, etc. and not always as "from" in English need to rather mold it using context.
preposition: from
indicating the point in space at which a journey, motion, or action starts.
"she began to walk away from him"
indicating the distance between a particular place and another place used as a point of reference.
"the ambush occurred 50 yards from a checkpoint"
indicating the point in time at which a particular process, event, or activity starts.
"the show will run from 10 to 2"
indicating the source or provenance of someone or something.
"I'm from Hartford"
indicating the date at which something was created.
"a document dating from the thirteenth century"
indicating the starting point of a specified range on a scale.
"men who ranged in age from seventeen to eighty-four"
indicating one extreme in a range of conceptual variations.
"anything from geography to literature"
indicating the point at which an observer is placed.
"you can see the island from here"
indicating the raw material out of which something is manufactured.
"a varnish made from copal"
indicating separation or removal.
"the party was ousted from power after sixteen years"
indicating prevention.
"the story of how he was saved from death"
indicating a cause.
"a child suffering from asthma"
indicating a source of knowledge or the basis for one's judgment.
"information obtained from papers, books, and presentations"
indicating a distinction.
"the courts view him in a different light from that of a manual worker"
peace!
Quote from: Noon waalqalami on March 15, 2019, 01:13:29 PM
one contradictory post after another from flat earth astrophysicist :laugh:
If sky cannot split, cleft asunder, break apart why are the words there?
its called check mate upon ?checkmate?
soon we will show our signs to them in horizon :laugh:
brother noon can i ask you a question bit offtopic.
is it possible in this world to have an IQ level in -ve ?
i mean less than zero ?
Salam brother noon!
Sorry for inconvenience. I was talking about the preposition ھن (hunna) in مثلھن.. Pls see again.
Peace!
Quote from: TellMeTheTruth on March 15, 2019, 08:12:16 PM
Salam brother noon!
Sorry for inconvenience. I was talking about the preposition ھن (hunna) in مثلھن.. Pls see again.
Peace!
65:12 ومن and of الارض the land/earth (f/s) مثلهن mith'lahunna/similitude them (f/p)
similitude -- quality of being like something e.g. one to one/many, many to one/many.
2:17 مثلهم mathaluhum/similitude theirs (m/p) كمثل like similitude الذى the one (m/s) ?
2:261 مثل mathalu/similitude الذىن the ones (m/p) ىنفقون spending اموالهم wealth theirs فى in سبىل path الله the god كمثل like similitude حبه ḥabbatin/grain (f/s) انبتت grows سبع seven (7) سنابل husks of corn فى in كل each سنبله corn husk its ماىه hundred (100) حبه grain والله and the god ىضعف multiplied لمن to whom ىشا willed والله and the god واسع extensive علىم knower
6:38 وما and not من of دابه creature (f/s) فى in الارض the land ولا and not طىر flyer (m/s) [e.g. birds, bugs, etc.] ىطىر flyed بجنحىه with wings two its الا except امم communities (f/p) امثلكم similitudes (likenesses) you (m/p) ما not فرطنا neglect we of فى in الكتب the book من of شى thing ثم furthermore الى to ربهم lord theirs ىحشرون gathered being
16:74 فلا so not تضربوا thou strike (cite) ye of لله to god الامثل l-amthāla/the similitudes ان indeed الله the god ىعلم knoweth وانتم and you لا not تعلمون thou knowing
36:81 اولىس indeed and not is الذى the one خلق creation السموت the skies والارض and the land/earth بقدر in capable/able على on ان that ىخلق created مثلهم mith'lahum/similitude theirs (m/p i.e. people)? بلى yes وهو and he الخلق the creator العلىم the knower
peace!
Quote from: Noon waalqalami on March 16, 2019, 01:28:18 PM
65:12 ومن and of الارض the land/earth (f/s) مثلهن mith'lahunna/similitude them (f/p)
Thanks! Exactly my point. So if my translation of 65:12 was correct مثلھن refers to سموت (f/p) then why we are debating?
Peace!
52:09 ?The Day the heaven/Sky (Sama-singular) will sway with a commotion?
The Sky (structure-singular) will make its last presence with terrible presence ? it will shake/sway and further it will split / torn apart? ultimately God will roll it in His hand..
According to myth what will be it? Their universe is running at an incredible speed from billions of years at Trillions of speed to nowhere ..?
But the above verse will perfectly suit to stationary Earth and Stationary Structure of Sky(canopy) that would shake on the Day of Doom.. Such motions will be terribly perceived by people?. Unfortunately current universe terribly sway and spin and rotate and even does everything what it can do?. We don?t perceive at all being part of it..? Now God says, The HEAVEN will sway but on the Day of Resurrection.. that?s expected if it has to break apart/split, then commotion in it is unavoidable?. Remember God made it without pillar so sway means; the balance/weight He established to it will go imbalance?
44:38 ?And We did not create the heavens and earth and whatever between them in play?
21:16 ?And We did not create the heaven and earth and whatever between them in play?
Closely observe the above two verses? Do you see any difference?? YES . . you will.. the difference is ?S? in 44:38 that is to say that 44:38 is SAMAWATHI while 21:16 is SAMA ?BUT? BAINAHUMA (between them) is Dual? between what? Between Heaven/s and Earth? Why? Quran clearly indicates that there is only one Structure of Heaven we see but Heavens are layers with different functions of the single Heaven.. each layer doesn?t have structure but the last one?. That?s the Mighty Heaven impenetrable one..
This is not the reason why I brought these two verses but to explain by this verse about ?PLAY? ?..
What we see on Earth or rather the entire Earth and whatever between them sun, moon, stars, etc all for with strong purpose and for us (jinn and human) for our guidance for our test our benefit etc? There is NO PLAY in it?Not at all?..
But,? what science depict as UNIVERSE is merely fiction and mere PLAY?. For what reason The JUPITER and its huge size compared to EARTH.. Why a STAR bigger than SUN 2100 times?needless to dig deep, you all know how big they all and we are insignificant?. And we are living in a very insignificant tiny mote and meanwhile God says WE didn?t create whatever between EARTH and HEAVEN in PLAY?. Definite PLAY if we are living in a tiny mote as we have been indoctrinated?We are not so trivial ? But we are very important and living in a massive piece of Land called Earth completely inside a closed well protected system?
Quote from: TellMeTheTruth on March 16, 2019, 02:35:18 PM
Thanks! Exactly my point. So if my translation of 65:12 was correct مثلھن refers to سموت (f/p) then why we are debating?
Peace!
peace ? interpretation, I say billions of planets like 7 skies (celestial realms) while you stated has to do with continents and/or islands (Australia, Antarctica, etc.) which reminds of the encounter by Alexander the great with "the naked wise men"
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gymnosophists
"The second, being asked whether the earth or the sea produced larger animals, said the earth did, since the sea was but a part of the earth."
Salam brother noon!
My point is that من الارض 'from the land/earth' (1/single/one) 7 realms/layers like السمآء 'the sky' (1/single/one) has 7 realms/layers. Word سموت is used in AQ for these 7 realm/layers of السماء. This does not mean seven السمآء.
For layers/realms from earth, it has not used the word سموت (f/p) but مثلھن (like/similar to them {f/p). It does not mean that there are 7 earths like the earth.
There is only 1 السمآء and only 1 الارض.
Peace!
Quote from: Noon waalqalami on March 18, 2019, 05:00:52 AM
peace ? interpretation, I say billions of planets like 7 skies (celestial realms) while you stated has to do with continents and/or islands (Australia, Antarctica, etc.) which reminds of the encounter by Alexander the great with "the naked wise men"
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gymnosophists
"The second, being asked whether the earth or the sea produced larger animals, said the earth did, since the sea was but a part of the earth."
Salam!
So you think that oceans/seas are not part of the earth الارض? And there is no land in the bottom oceans/seas?
Peace!
Quote from: TellMeTheTruth on March 18, 2019, 09:08:50 AM
My point is that من الارض 'from the land/earth' (1/single/one) 7 realms/layers like السمآء 'the sky' (1/single/one) has 7 realms/layers. Word سموت is used in AQ for these 7 realm/layers of السماء. This does not mean seven السمآء.
For layers/realms from earth, it has not used the word سموت (f/p) but مثلھن (like/similar to them {f/p). It does not mean that there are 7 earths like the earth.
There is only 1 السمآء and only 1 الارض.
peace, already showed similitude's can be one to one/many or many to one/many.
Quote from: TellMeTheTruth on March 18, 2019, 09:17:32 AM
So you think that oceans/seas are not part of the earth الارض? And there is no land in the bottom oceans/seas?
no, already stated billions of earths similitude 7 skies/celestial realms.
again, elaborate on below -- are not continents etc., part of the earth?
quote author=TellMeTheTruth link=topic=9610127.msg423554#msg423554 date=1552365602
Remember that at the time of revelation of AQ, America, Australia and Antarctica were not discivered or known to the audience.
65:12 الله the god الذى the one خلق creation سبع seven (7) سموت skies [celestial realms (f/p)] ومن and of الارض the land/earth (f) مثلهن similitude them (f/p)
Quote from: Noon waalqalami on March 18, 2019, 10:31:58 AM
peace, already showed similitude's can be one to one/many or many to one/many.
Salam
You gave examples a wrong way. See:
ھم (hum) is pronoun and used for them (m/p)
ھن (hun) is pronoun and used for them {f/p)
ک (ka) is pronoun and usef for you/your (sungular)
کم (kum) is pronoun and used for you/your (m/p)
Etc. Etc.
This is basic grammar.
Quote
no, already stated billions of earths similitude 7 skies/celestial realms.
again, elaborate on below -- are not continents etc., part of the earth?
quote author=TellMeTheTruth link=topic=9610127.msg423554#msg423554 date=1552365602
Remember that at the time of revelation of AQ, America, Australia and Antarctica were not discivered or known to the audience.
Yes. It meant that we know only a few continents and islands of the earth for now and this is not the limit. We may discover more by the time.
Quote
65:12 الله the god الذى the one خلق creation سبع seven (7) سموت skies [celestial realms (f/p)] ومن and of الارض the land/earth (f) مثلهن similitude them (f/p)
No comments until the pronouns and their usage is not clear (see my reply above).
Note: I cannot type details coz my laptop is out of order and i am using mobile phone right now.
Peace!
new planet zealandia ?
scientists agreed upon the new eigth planet zealandia and all planet is underwater apart from the newzeland we know today.
stupidity to say the 7 figure is for planets or continents.
or 7 seas, or seven days a week.
7up drink means there are only six other drinks exist ? lmao
7 is such an important number in the universe lol
Salam!
@IK
Stupidity? What does سبع means in AQ?
I think it means 70 or 700 or may be 7 billion. Well you may tell your 'intelligent than God' answer.
If God do not even know the counting then why are you believing in Him?
If God do not know how many Earths and Moons, Suns etc. are there in His Universe. Why don't you go and tell Him.
Peace!
God already know how many heavenly bodies are there.
but we, me, you, scientists, quran writters/interpretators dnt know how many heavenly bodies are there , thats why every single year they updated the amount of planets and stars with advance knowledge.
and there are some stupids exist who thinks the mistakes of humans = mistakes of God.
who also dnt think about what God said and what people said about what God said.
same stupids who also dnt beleive in calculator becoz its the invention of athiest.
same stupids who reject the relaity of 2+2= 4
same stupids who said grass is not green.
same stupids who will ask if grass is green show a verse in quran.
so according to same stupids quran said seven planets in earth if we discover new zealandia just reject that planet, whoever is beleiving in zealandia will b a kaffir.
freaking hell :rotfl: :elektro:
Quote from: imrankhawaja on March 18, 2019, 03:07:39 PM
God already know how many heavenly bodies are there.
but we, me, you, scientists, quran writters/interpretators dnt know how many heavenly bodies are there , thats why every single year they updated the amount of planets and stars with advance knowledge.
and there are some stupids exist who thinks the mistakes of humans = mistakes of God.
who also dnt think about what God said and what people said about what God said.
same stupids who also dnt beleive in calculator becoz its the invention of athiest.
same stupids who reject the relaity of 2+2= 4
same stupids who said grass is not green.
same stupids who will ask if grass is green show a verse in quran.
so according to same stupids quran said seven planets in earth if we discover new zealandia just reject that planet, whoever is beleiving in zealandia will b a kaffir.
freaking hell :rotfl: :elektro:
Salam IK!
Hope everything is OK with you.
Peace!
If you really think that by reading few sentences here and there, interpreting them the way that fits your lack of knowledge in the matter at hand, you will somehow gain some higher knowledge about the world and how it operates you are lying to yourself.
Look around you. Do you see why we live today the way we live ? And the people whose collective effort helped in the progress of humanity ? Did they use the quran ? or did they use their God given intellect ?
People who spend their time digging through nature trying to understand it use logic and reason, and they find things that can be made sense of, because we are given the ability to make sense of these things. And these things are made to make sense. The world is built with logic.
On top of that, the quran doesn't say: " do they not read ?!" and instead says "do they not reason ?!". So how does one go around reading verses verbatim, stitching things together, and come up with "revolutionary discoveries" ?
The real issue is with fanaticism. People belittling themselves in front of a book. "I don't know, the book knows" yet it is you who read the book and comprehend it as far as your ability allows. the book can't even speak for itself, it is you who can speak for it, as precisely, eloquently, philosophically, analytically as you are able to. So how about you work on this part of you that is related to reasoning and try to improve it, purify it so that it is not poisoned by your personal biases and emotions before trying to tackle subjects that are not even directly affecting your life.
Quote from: TellMeTheTruth on March 18, 2019, 03:47:57 PM
Salam IK!
Hope everything is OK with you.
Peace!
peace,
tell me the truth.
everything is fine and chilling with me whats bout you.
your id name is nice isnt it Tell me the truth how many planets and continents are there in 7th century till now ? :hmm
@ cerberus :bravo: beautiful words by you as always.
Quote from: Cerberus on March 18, 2019, 04:52:17 PM
Look around you. Do you see why we live today the way we live ? And the people whose collective effort helped in the progress of humanity ? Did they use the quran ? or did they use their God given intellect ?
Well said
Quote from: jkhan on March 15, 2019, 05:38:47 AM
DESCENDING plus ASCENDING
Peace brother jkhan
The first six ayats of surah 57 is about Allah, not about
ascending and descending:
[57:1
Glorifying GOD is everything in the heavens and the earth.
He is the Almighty, Most Wise [57:2]
Allah controls life and death. He is Omnipotent.
[57:3]
Allah is fully aware of all things.
[57:4]
GOD is Seer of everything you do. [57:5]
All matters are controlled by GOD.
[57:6]
God is fully aware of the innermost thoughts.The next five ayats are directed at believers.@ TellMeTheTruth, take time to learn similitudes, metaphors,
similes, comparatives because the Quran uses these terms
often.
:peace:
Quote from: Cerberus on March 18, 2019, 04:52:17 PM
If you really think that by reading few sentences here and there, interpreting them the way that fits your lack of knowledge in the matter at hand, you will somehow gain some higher knowledge about the world and how it operates you are lying to yourself.
Look around you. Do you see why we live today the way we live ? And the people whose collective effort helped in the progress of humanity ? Did they use the quran ? or did they use their God given intellect ?
People who spend their time digging through nature trying to understand it use logic and reason, and they find things that can be made sense of, because we are given the ability to make sense of these things. And these things are made to make sense. The world is built with logic.
On top of that, the quran doesn't say: " do they not read ?!" and instead says "do they not reason ?!". So how does one go around reading verses verbatim, stitching things together, and come up with "revolutionary discoveries" ?
The real issue is with fanaticism. People belittling themselves in front of a book. "I don't know, the book knows" yet it is you who read the book and comprehend it as far as your ability allows. the book can't even speak for itself, it is you who can speak for it, as precisely, eloquently, philosophically, analytically as you are able to. So how about you work on this part of you that is related to reasoning and try to improve it, purify it so that it is not poisoned by your personal biases and emotions before trying to tackle subjects that are not even directly affecting your life.
Peace Cereburus.....
Yeah... I am sorry... I can't give well wishes like few of them submitted to you saying well said or beautiful words....
Your emotions and your biased statement in your personal belief won't make anyone to have anything to ponder.... But only Quran will do... Do you get it dear... Only Quran will abd can do it.... If you are in court and if you have given your above statement then it will not have any due respect to it... Needs tangible evidence to support any claim....
So pls bring your evidence from Quran to defy me or to convince that the world you are living is spinning.....
Yeah we all live in this world with hard work and give out best to society so with everyone's commitment world is running at the same time world is getting corrupted without even perceiving.....
Emotions and your belief not gonna help dear with me or with anyone but it will only sooth those who are in your group blindly....
BTW I am not bringing verses from here and there... Anyone who go through the entire topic threads will know it was comprehensive touch....
I will put one example to you... Couple of fellows wrote me saying I now understand that quran says world is stationary.. I asked did you verify... Yes... I researched.... I said... Just you believe world is not spinning won't make you a believer.... One said yes... You came to the point.... Since I found quran is totally supporting statuonay earth.. He gave example of the verse ladder to the sky... He said I won't believe anymore in God... You helped me to it... So, he believes in spinning earth and started to think quran is word of Men... He said I helped him to know truth but unfortunately I can't be a believer....
I said I can't guide you to right or wrong.... It's your true color which was hidden inside has come out.... That's why God tests..... Test to expose hypocrocy inside..... Also God tests to find out the best of hearts....
How far indoctrination of spinning earth has deep rooted in his mind and led to disbelive in God in the end...
That's what hard work of Iblees dear Cereburus... If iblees not work hard even in the form of good and bad... He is a master deceiver and challenged God and begged for respite and God granted and God even accepted that iblees/Satan won in his challenge... Except true believers.... Those will be minute....
So Cereburus bring verses to claim your emotions to a positive aspect....
May God guide you with what is right and make your true belief increase and remain in truth till your death...
That's all I can say... Tc
Quote from: hawk99 on March 18, 2019, 06:24:36 PM
Well said
Peace brother jkhan
The first six ayats of surah 57 is about Allah, not about
ascending and descending:
[57:1 Glorifying GOD is everything in the heavens and the earth.
He is the Almighty, Most Wise
[57:2] Allah controls life and death. He is Omnipotent.
[57:3] Allah is fully aware of all things.
[57:4] GOD is Seer of everything you do.
[57:5] All matters are controlled by GOD.
[57:6] God is fully aware of the innermost thoughts.
The next five ayats are directed at believers.
@ TellMeTheTruth, take time to learn similitudes, metaphors,
similes, comparatives because the Quran uses these terms
often.
:peace:
Salam brother Hawk and all!
If you read, thats what I am doing.
You may understnd My point by below example and hope you will answer :
انا بشر مثلکم I am man like you.
How many people are being compared with how many people? Obviously one man is being compared with many. Does this mean انا can be many men? No. Only one person.
Because انا is a pronoun for single person. While کم is used for many.. Comparing a single object with many cannot make it plural.
Peace!
Peace!
Quote from: imrankhawaja on March 18, 2019, 05:24:32 PM
peace,
tell me the truth.
everything is fine and chilling with me whats bout you.
your id name is nice isnt it Tell me the truth how many planets and continents are there in 7th century till now ? :hmm
@ cerberus :bravo: beautiful words by you as always.
Salam bro ik!
So for, I have not emphasised on the number of planets or contintents. But you had some issue for number 7.. I already said in a previous post that there are layers of earth which are not necessarily 7. This number is used in AQ for layers/realms of the sky.
Please read carefully and be patient since we all are in a process of learning.
Peace!
Peace Everyone.....
STATIONARY & MOVING
35:41 ?Verily! Allah grasps/holds(Yumsiku) the heavens and the earth lest they move away(Thaszula), and if they were to move away, there is not one that could grasp/hold them(AmsakaHUMA-dual) after Him. Truly, He is Ever Most Forbearing, Oft?Forgiving.?
Above verse manifestly speaks the truth of what is Heavens and Earth what their positions? They are STATIONARY?. Non even the EARTH or the layers of HEAVENs don?t move? they all fixed to a stationary position ?.. what is moving then? Whatever between them which are meant to move ? note below verses?
36:40 It is not allowable for the sun to reach the moon, nor does the night overtake the day, but each, in an orbit, is swimming.
21:31 And it is He who created the night and the day and the sun and the moon; all [heavenly bodies] in an orbit are swimming.
Isn?t that what we observe and perceive day to day?when under deception there is no verification?No raising of voice against it? only will nourish the deception? that they won?t perceive it?
Quote from: hawk99 on March 18, 2019, 06:24:36 PM
Peace brother jkhan
The first six ayats of surah 57 is about Allah, not about
ascending and descending:
[57:1 Glorifying GOD is everything in the heavens and the earth.
He is the Almighty, Most Wise
[57:2] Allah controls life and death. He is Omnipotent.
[57:3] Allah is fully aware of all things.
[57:4] GOD is Seer of everything you do.
[57:5] All matters are controlled by GOD.
[57:6] God is fully aware of the innermost thoughts.
The next five ayats are directed at believers.
What nonsense you have written above.... don't twist and omit the verses of quran to taste your ego...
Any member, pls open arabic and translation and see what is written in first 06 verses of chapter 57, and even the verse i brought 57:04 and compare what brother Hawk is written above....
let the twisters keep twisting....
what quran says... "whoever disbelieve in the VERSES of ALLAH, he is the LOSER.".. that's glaring...
Quote from: jkhan on March 19, 2019, 12:49:55 AM
Above verse manifestly speaks the truth of what is Heavens and Earth what their positions? They are STATIONARY?. Non even the EARTH or the layers of HEAVENs don?t move? they all fixed to a stationary position ?..
peace, are the birds in flight stationary? :nope:
35:41 ان indeed الله the god ىمسك yum'siku/holdeth السموت the skies والارض and the land ان lest تزولا tazūlā/cease dual ولىن and surely if زالتا zālatā/cease dual ان not امسكهما holds them dual من any احد one من from بعده after him انه indeed he كان be حلىما tolerant of غفورا forgiver of
67:19 اولم do they not ىروا seeth they of الى to الطىر the flyer (birds, etc.) فوقهم above them صفت spread (wings) وىقبضن and fold inward ما not ىمسكهن yum'sikuhunna/holdeth them (i.e. in flight) الا only الرحمن the almighty انه indeed he بكل in every شى thing بصىر seer
Therefore, not stationary rather holds them in flight/motion like our planet and everything.
(http://d1jqu7g1y74ds1.cloudfront.net/wp-content/uploads/2013/12/tumblr_mj0vvcqnZx1qdlh1io1_400.gif)
Paris, National Library of France: Arabic 328 (c)
Radiocarbon measurement 568-645 CE (95.4%) parchment
https://corpuscoranicum.de/handschriften/index/sure/21/vers/33?handschrift=158
(https://i.postimg.cc/rmCRzJqr/ch21v29-43.jpg)
Quote from: TellMeTheTruth on March 18, 2019, 10:15:01 PM
Salam bro ik!
So for, I have not emphasised on the number of planets or contintents. But you had some issue for number 7.. I already said in a previous post that there are layers of earth which are not necessarily 7. This number is used in AQ for layers/realms of the sky.
Please read carefully and be patient since we all are in a process of learning.
Peace!
forget about number seven and find my post in which i ask questions thats the most knowledgeable post hope u/we will learn better in learning process.
READ carefully all questions
about 7 i dnt have any problem i asked about the 7 continents of 7th century, and another eigth one (currently)but that post is out of ur mind limit thats why i suggest you to start from beginners level and try to attempt the questions let see how good you are in learning.
incase u did not find my post of questions lem me know i wll post again for you as i know spoonfeeding is norm in low IQs.
and if u dnt understand the questions also ask me what examiner is asking.(understanding whats been asked is also a gift). lol
MATHEMATICS = 6 questions + one practical(eclipse) =
7 i love number 7 :muscle:
i can also make passing marks 70 instead of 80 special discount dedicated to number 7 lol
Quote from: jkhan on March 19, 2019, 02:51:46 AM
What nonsense you have written above.... don't twist and omit the verses of quran to taste your ego...
Any member, pls open arabic and translation and see what is written in first 06 verses of chapter 57, and even the verse i brought 57:04 and compare what brother Hawk is written above....
let the twisters keep twisting....
what quran says... "whoever disbelieve in the VERSES of ALLAH, he is the LOSER.".. that's glaring...
Peace good brother, I think you misunderstand what I am trying
to convey.
I did not omit the verses only highlighting the gist of the message!
57:04
?It is He who created the heavens and earth in six days and then established Himself above the Throne. He knows what penetrates into the earth and what emerges from it and what DESCENDS from the Heaven(Sama) and what ASCENDS in it; and He is with you wherever you are.
And Allah , of what you do, is Seeing.?like I pointed out earlier The first six ayats of surah 57 is about Allah
and:
The next five ayats are directed at believers.
Here we go:
[57:7] Believe in Allah and His Messenger and spend out of that in
which He has made you successors. For those who have believed
among you and spent, there will be a great reward.
[57:8] And what reason have you that you should not believe in
Allah? And the Messenger calls on you that you may believe in
your Lord, and indeed He has made a covenant with you
if you are believers.
[57:9] It is He who sends down upon His Servant verses of clear
evidence that He may bring you out from darkness into the light.
And indeed, Allah is to you Kind and Merciful.
[57:10] And why do you not spend in the cause of Allah while to
Allah belongs the heritage of the heavens and the earth? Not
equal among you are those who spent before the conquest and
fought [and those who did so after it]. Those are greater in degree
than they who spent afterwards and fought. But to all Allah has
promised the best. And Allah , with what you do, is Acquainted.
[57:11] Who is it that would loan Allah a goodly loan so He will
multiply it for him and he will have a noble reward?
I hope you get how these eleven verses contextualize the
believers relationship with their lord. :pr :handshake:
Quote from: Noon waalqalami on March 19, 2019, 02:01:59 PM
peace, are the birds in flight stationary? :nope:
35:41 ان indeed الله the god ىمسك yum'siku/holdeth السموت the skies والارض and the land ان lest تزولا tazūlā/cease dual ولىن and surely if زالتا zālatā/cease dual ان not امسكهما holds them dual من any احد one من from بعده after him انه indeed he كان be حلىما tolerant of غفورا forgiver of
67:19 اولم do they not ىروا seeth they of الى to الطىر the flyer (birds, etc.) فوقهم above them صفت spread (wings) وىقبضن and fold inward ما not ىمسكهن yum'sikuhunna/holdeth them (i.e. in flight) الا only الرحمن the almighty انه indeed he بكل in every شى thing بصىر seer
Therefore, not stationary rather holds them in flight/motion like our planet and everything.
(http://d1jqu7g1y74ds1.cloudfront.net/wp-content/uploads/2013/12/tumblr_mj0vvcqnZx1qdlh1io1_400.gif)
Paris, National Library of France: Arabic 328 (c)
Radiocarbon measurement 568-645 CE (95.4%) parchment
https://corpuscoranicum.de/handschriften/index/sure/21/vers/33?handschrift=158
(https://i.postimg.cc/rmCRzJqr/ch21v29-43.jpg)
Peace
How nonsensical you are by comparing birds in flight to God holding the earth and heaven..... We know birds flying sun moving stars moving moon moving flights moving winds moving Malika moving jins moving... Just you are a strawnan..... All they can move coz the earth and heaven is stationary..... Brother... One day in the process of passing of time you will in sha Allah get what is reality in case you are true believer in the eyes of God... Keep learning .... Till then believe what you fantastic picture... That's only solar system of trillions... :rotfl: How deluded these brains.... Yeah Satan is great when you become weak....
Quote from: hawk99 on March 19, 2019, 04:20:33 PM
Peace good brother, I think you misunderstand what I am trying
to convey.
I did not omit the verses only highlighting the gist of the message!
57:04 ?It is He who created the heavens and earth in six days
and then established Himself above the Throne. He knows what
penetrates into the earth and what emerges from it and what
DESCENDS from the Heaven(Sama) and what ASCENDS in it;
and He is with you wherever you are.
And Allah , of what you do, is Seeing.?
like I pointed out earlier The first six ayats of surah 57 is about Allah
and:
The next five ayats are directed at believers.
Here we go:
[57:7] Believe in Allah and His Messenger and spend out of that in
which He has made you successors. For those who have believed
among you and spent, there will be a great reward.
[57:8] And what reason have you that you should not believe in
Allah? And the Messenger calls on you that you may believe in
your Lord, and indeed He has made a covenant with you
if you are believers.
[57:9] It is He who sends down upon His Servant verses of clear
evidence that He may bring you out from darkness into the light.
And indeed, Allah is to you Kind and Merciful.
[57:10] And why do you not spend in the cause of Allah while to
Allah belongs the heritage of the heavens and the earth? Not
equal among you are those who spent before the conquest and
fought [and those who did so after it]. Those are greater in degree
than they who spent afterwards and fought. But to all Allah has
promised the best. And Allah , with what you do, is Acquainted.
[57:11] Who is it that would loan Allah a goodly loan so He will
multiply it for him and he will have a noble reward?
I hope you get how these eleven verses contextualize the
believers relationship with their lord. :pr :handshake:
Peace...
Go read again pls.... If you don't find ascend and descend then atleast find in the picture above what noon walqalami pasted... Till your head spinn you won't find ascend and descend... That's fair... No time brother for strawnan logic...
People are getting what is right.... Email messages are letting me know that.... Even one member reminded this is the most viewed/read topic for whatever the reason.. Same as most searched topic in Google is flat earth.. God knows why this resurgence ..... God kept hiding in the deception and letting lose gradually.... Who is iblees with the plan of God..
Quote from: jkhan on March 19, 2019, 08:36:09 PM
How nonsensical you are by comparing birds in flight
peace, nonsensical is your every clueless post.
likewise doesn?t say "move" rather cease/stop.
35:41 ولىن and surely if زالتا zālatā/cease dual
21:15 زالت zālat/cease تلك this دعوهم call theirs
Quote from: Noon waalqalami on March 19, 2019, 10:46:36 PM
peace, nonsensical is your every clueless post.
likewise doesn?t say "move" rather cease/stop.
35:41 ولىن and surely if زالتا zālatā/cease dual
21:15 زالت zālat/cease تلك this دعوهم call theirs
I have already told you not to waste time with those who are insane coz globe heads are intelligent and convinced.... If still you want to mingle here in this topic then you have an issue in your well accepted theory.... It's okay learn from those who challenge...
It reminds me a message may be almost 10 months before, she told me if QURAN says world is spinning why these people struggle to bring verses to support it while others bring to support earth is stationary..... I won't forget her message... That's the problem....
Even in flat earth society I was wondering why all Globeheads flocking.... And keep parroting NASA while flat Earthers challenge each and every thing... Some say there are other for fun... Some say they want to stop flat earth movement.. :rotfl:....
Finally don't waste time people if you are on the right side... Open a topic of your own keep presenting earth and heaven is spinning according to Quran... So people will leave this topic and join there..... Of you are rightly guided... Do it... Take the challenge... In the end if you are right the one who reads them also will get guided... So why wait...
meanwhile I will continue in sha Allah with what my God guided me with....
We are dummy people.. Right... You are the one who claimed... And other of your cluster keep mocking with various ways... So why still in this topic... Okay.. I can't tell you to go away... It's your freedom you are here... But why with dummy people while you are intelligent... That not an intelligent option...
Quote from: Noon waalqalami on March 19, 2019, 10:46:36 PM
peace, nonsensical is your every clueless post.
likewise doesn?t say "move" rather cease/stop.
35:41 ولىن and surely if زالتا zālatā/cease dual
21:15 زالت zālat/cease تلك this دعوهم call theirs
Salam all!
This is a point to think over. It should be "ceased to exist". Can someone please share root meanings of زول here?
Peace!
Quote from: TellMeTheTruth on March 19, 2019, 11:12:18 PM
Salam all!
This is a point to think over. It should be "ceased to exist". Can someone please share root meanings of زول here?
Peace!
Yes.... We know that it has meaning of decline / remove as well
Peace
Quote from: jkhan on March 19, 2019, 11:07:01 PM
So why still in this topic... Okay.. I can't tell you to go away... It's your freedom you are here... But why with dummy people while you are intelligent... That not an intelligent option...
peace, not posting to convert flat earth people a lost cause, they lack basics, etc.
rather it's to correct erroneous posts and bizarre translations for benefit of others.
Quote from: Noon waalqalami on March 19, 2019, 10:46:36 PM
peace, nonsensical is your every clueless post.
likewise doesn?t say "move" rather cease/stop.
35:41 ولىن and surely if زالتا zālatā/cease dual
21:15 زالت zālat/cease تلك this دعوهم call theirs
My goodness...
What a twister of words you are...
21:15 and 35:41 are totally different letters and words...
I mean to say different meaning... Check 14:46
Chwck
Hypocrocy at best...
Quote from: jkhan on March 19, 2019, 11:31:16 PM
My goodness...
What a twister of words you are...
21:15 and 35:41 are totally different letters and words...
Hypocrocy at best...
another clueless ignorant post not knowing basic difference trailing alif refers to dual.
really should study basic stuff, language, science, etc., you're embarrassing yourself.
Even if you are to apply cease or stop in these verses you won't get a concrete meaning .... Translate it pls... Then let's see with reality and science and yiur accepted myth... How that works
Peace All....
2:164 " ..... ..... and [His] directing of the winds and the clouds controlled BETWEEN the Heaven (Sama) and the Earth are signs for a people who use reason."
Now let's look at what our fellow spherical Earth party believes in... They say Sama is Universe.... If you go through their previous threads you will notice...
Now Allah says in above verse; He is directing the WINDS & CLOUDS being Controlled BETWEEN the Heaven and Earth.... How amazing.... That's perfect for a stationary earth and above it is the canopy... Between both of them clouds and winds are controlled and directed as He wishes.... If we think of this verse in the universe model you will end up clueless .... Are there wind and air in universe BTW??.. They will only know...
GOD says at the end it is a sign for those who apply wits...
When the story goes like this manner, some want me to believe in spinning crap... Lol... I wish I die before that... 😊
Peace Everyone.....
Salam....
You would have noticed I brought verses which speak of BAINAHUMA when the heaven is singular and even plural GOD used BAINAHUMA.... It shows everything is between earth and heavens ...
Now see the below verse.... It reads as FEEHINNA....
5:120 " To Allah belongs the kingdom/dominion of heavens and Earth and whatever FEEHINNA (therein / in them-plural).... ..."
Not used BAINAHUMA or even Feehima....
He is not merely the ruler of earth and heavens but to everything which consists in them .i. e earth and heavens ... God uses His words exactly what He wants to pass in His message...
how easy to see if someone is contradictory in his/her words ?
best method to see this thread.
Contradiction upon contradiction
i see more than 10 contradiction just within last 5 pages lets carry on another chapter today, as i see there is no one in flat earth community to answer my questions. whoever tried to attempt failed terribly
i have another activity lets see how many contradictions by flat earth members. target is make 100 contradiction. but 50 is also considered as half century so we set our target on 50.
and i think ONE stupid already reached near to the target.
for the first time this of my activity will b hope for flatearthers to prove themselves BEST at ?Something? Called contradiction.
their kids will say our flat earth father was highest in contradictory posts and free mind forum is evidence he post five contradictions daily.
lets see which flat earther have more contradictions. competetion started now :eat: :group:
Quote from: imrankhawaja on March 20, 2019, 01:24:39 PM
how easy to see if someone is contradictory in his/her words ?
best method to see this thread.
Contradiction upon contradiction
i see more than 10 contradiction just within last 5 pages lets carry on another chapter today, as i see there is no one in flat earth community to answer my questions. whoever tried to attempt failed terribly
i have another activity lets see how many contradictions by flat earth members. target is make 100 contradiction. but 50 is also considered as half century so we set our target on 50.
and i think ONE stupid already reached near to the target.
for the first time this of my activity will b hope for flatearthers to prove themselves BEST at �Something� Called contradiction.
their kids will say our flat earth father was highest in contradictory posts and free mind forum is evidence he post five contradictions daily.
lets see which flat earther have more contradictions. competetion started now :eat: :group:
Brother IK?..
Peace?..
Just look at you and your threads ?. For me I don't have any respect to you unless I observe in you qualities of a believer ?. You are just a coward hidden under the cloth of grandma?. Just get out of it?. Bring verses of Quran rather than playing around ?.
How many things you have tried in exposing your hypocrisy ? just look at the topics you started in the name of Fakery or Mystery bla blaa to attack merely to attack with your mean quality inside your nasty heart..? People just neglected you.. that's your status?.So you found the most viewed topic to show your hypocrisy to survive..?.. What else you can do?. Keep it up? unless hypocrites and deception around how to identify the truth?
If you are a believer in case behave yourself ?. Never mind attack people with what is right using the Quran if people speak against Quran?. But you don't have guts to perform it?. Recently I read a thread from HP TECH in one of the Administrators posted?.. that's perfect for you? what a shame you are to this forum? every old thread I read you have been called by people hypocrite ?. I never seen a single person being called in that way?
You will never learn?.. That's you ? I wonder your heart has been sealed?..
Ultimately, bring verses of quran either you are right or wrong in your understanding.. no issue.. coz that's what you have understood? no harm? rather than being a nothing of a person without any contribution to the topic? just having fun?.that's pathetic?That's stupidity?
BTW You can't stop me dude? God will?
IBRAHIM & HIS UNDERSTANDING OF HEAVENS AND EARTH
6:75 ?And thus did We show Abraham the realm of the heavens and the earth that he would be among the certain [in faith]?
6:76 ?So when the night covered him [with darkness], he saw a star. He said, "This is my lord." But when it set, he said, "I like not those that disappear.?
6:77 ?And when he saw the moon rising, he said, "This is my lord." But when it set, he said, "Unless my Lord guides me, I will surely be among the people gone astray."
6:78 ?And when he saw the sun rising, he said, "This is my lord; this is greater." But when it set, he said, "O my people, indeed I am free from what you associate with Allah.?
6:79 ?Indeed, I have turned my face toward He who created the heavens and the earth, inclining toward truth, and I am not of those who associate others with Allah."
God Speak the truth?. He showed Ibrahim Heavens and Earth and its Realm /Kingdom?. For what ? To make him more certain in his faith and who the God is etc? Why he should become certain when God showed him the Heavens and Earth? What actually God showed him by saying showed him Heavens and Earth?Did God let Ibrahim to go Antarctica or every place on earth or Did God let Ibrahim to go to Jupiter to see how massive it was and did God showed him how big stars are compared to our sun?... God showed him the reality? that reality Ibrahim challenged to his King as under?
2:258 ? ? ? ? Abraham said, "Indeed, Allah brings up the Sun from the East, so bring it up from the West." So the disbeliever was overwhelmed [by astonishment], and Allah does not guide the wrongdoing people.?
Yes he is the same Ibrahim who said the Sun is the Biggest.. Had Allah really shown him the Realm of Heavens and Earth that Ibrahim doesn't need to speak Sun is the biggest while he already knew that sun is just a tiny mote in the universe..
Ibrahim cannot challenge his King if he knew the reality that sun rises west in the realm of Heaven if God showed him what science elaborate? Yes Sun rises west in many planets? and in other solar systems?
And further as per Ibrahim's challenge for which God says King was trapped speechless ?. So it has to be truth.... What he challenged?. Using what? Yes Ibrahim said God Brings the SUN from EAST? sun is the one which moves to bring from East?If God showed Ibrahim the Realm of Heavens and Earth.. Ibrahim could have said, God Spins the earth so Sun appears to rise from East?. I am afraid Ibrahim didn't say that? he said simply what we all perceive in reality?
@ jkhan u piece of scumbag i told you not to talk with me.
and u said by attitude that u ll not come in contact with me but as i told u before that u like ur ?disgrace? coz u r a disgraceful person. untill u will not have insults or disgrace ur food will not digest. its called law of cause and effect who calls u for your disgrace.
now after you realise people are not good at disgracing you like the way i disgrace you so ?addiction? bring you back now u can happily can have ur satisfaction of disgrace.
at first i decide to stay away from a filthy creature like you becoz if u throw a stone at DIRT u can get ur own cloths dirty. BUT sadly u force me to throw stone in dirt again and this time i m wearing DIRT proof cloth to give u this last reply to show you ur real place filthy face. i CONSIDER it as a charity of my time to disgrace a person who wish to get disgraced. same like people like my hand made food u like my brain made insult towards you. but that post is the last in charity i feel. becoz it got a quite amount of disgrace in it.
and u and all other flat earthers called me and every round earthers hypocrate becoz the questions we ask u dnt have answers for that. from last many years u also come again and again by different ids becoz u r coward,fake,filthy,loathsome,disgusting.and STUPID in understanding simple math.
Quote from: Noon waalqalami on March 19, 2019, 11:41:52 PM
another clueless ignorant post not knowing basic difference trailing alif refers to dual.
really should study basic stuff, language, science, etc., you're embarrassing yourself.
he knows the formula/secret of how to show himself stupid and he do it due to a reason.
REASON embarrasing himself is his favourite thing in this world for getting this DISGRACE he can go to any limits same like drug addict do it. like saying nonsense to people so that he get some insulting remarks on his stupidity as a possible outcome.
YOU cloaked him right brother noon.
now look he said SUN is biggest ? but forget to tell sky is more bigger than sun ? :rotfl: according to abraham.
Quote from: imrankhawaja on March 21, 2019, 02:23:18 PM
@ jkhan u piece of scumbag i told you not to talk with me.
and u said by attitude that u ll not come in contact with me but as i told u before that u like ur ?disgrace? coz u r a disgraceful person. untill u will not have insults or disgrace ur food will not digest. its called law of cause and effect who calls u for your disgrace.
now after you realise people are not good at disgracing you like the way i disgrace you so ?addiction? bring you back now u can happily can have ur satisfaction of disgrace.
at first i decide to stay away from a filthy creature like you becoz if u throw a stone at DIRT u can get ur own cloths dirty. BUT sadly u force me to throw stone in dirt again and this time i m wearing DIRT proof cloth to give u this last reply to show you ur real place filthy face. i CONSIDER it as a charity of my time to disgrace a person who wish to get disgraced. same like people like my hand made food u like my brain made insult towards you. but that post is the last in charity i feel. becoz it got a quite amount of disgrace in it.
and u and all other flat earthers called me and every round earthers hypocrate becoz the questions we ask u dnt have answers for that. from last many years u also come again and again by different ids becoz u r coward,fake,filthy,loathsome,disgusting.and STUPID in understanding simple math.
I don't have time to play with you man... i told you not to involve in my way..... and you couldn't keep the promise .... but still hovering in this topic targeting me and opened many topics as well.... the one who can't keep promises are sign of evident hypocrisy ....don't think i like to respond to hypocrites like you.... Just don't read what i write in this forum... that would help you to have patience....
You are a virus... i got to refresh.. :laugh:
As of last resort.... Dear Brother... pls don't forget that God is watching what you are doing and He knows what is in your heart and why you keep doing the nasty works to many.... you are not arguing but keep personally involving.... Use your God gifted knowledge first to control you and to utilize to your life and hope for the best in the hereafter..... I am afraid, in this manner you won't achieve anything ...... coz If i look at you i don't see that you are a believer..... i may be wrong...but the way of behaviors of people hint something.....
all in all i wish God gives you the patience remove from your heart all the dirty feelings and make you to think in whatever the good ways...I wish you end up the Janna of God... work hard brother.. this is from bottom of my heart.... change yourself.. i don't ask you to change from spinning to stationary but change your arrogance....
I have much sympathy in my heart... i am a kind person,... you will never get me.. i know... But God knows who i am and what i am trying... Every time before i write anything i take refuge in God from satan and beg to God not to allow my fingers to type anything which is against God... make my fingers senseless if i do so...You won't get me....
be brave and face the life in what is right.... If you are a believer without to my knowledge then i am your brother and in case if you are not let my dealings be far away from you....God help you and guide you..
Let things happen as God willed....TC..
at first i was thinking to collect all clueless,ignorant and contradictory posts within last 20 pages by a flatearth reincarnated scientist. then i realised better to save time.
in future may b if i have like 2 or 3 hours spare i will use my laptop instead of phone to quote all blunders and ur extreme stupidity.
example1 sun is biggest?
example2 sun is not in nearest heaven :rotfl:
example 3 4 5 6 and lot more contradiction i will post it if i have a mood and time. btw i dnt need to tell this members themselves can feel it. :yes
UNIQUE type of stupid who is not stupid according to himself. i give it a name
? CONTRADICTORY stupid ? :rotfl:
a type of stupid who have evidence of his own contradictory posts and he still not believing himself as stupid.
hahahahahahaha i dnt know why i laughing like hell.
Go home mate are u shameproof fool or u like getting urself embarrased ?
people are doing ur insults in giga bytes hahahaha but u are unaware of it its called ?height of ignorance?.
even one member said u r a wastage of sperms :rotfl:
and u give him very beautiful remarks after that which proves my point that you are in a TYPE of people who love their DISGRACE.
Peace everyone...
Hope anyone who watches this video will put his her thought to it...
And compare it with 36:39
https://youtu.be/U1Re3wZBLt4
May God make the hearts of believers peaceful.... May God help believers like He helped me in my life in hard time and good time.. God is great.. His belief and his remembrance make a person strong...
Let the peace prevail and evil fade off
You can see the complete interview in below link
https://youtu.be/XhIwZuPGfss
Peace jkhan.
So if a scientist claims something, you take it as fact and you takes on a ride to "plasma moon" with it?
Go and look for another you tube video with a title: " Scientist PROVES the moon is plasma" ,then come back to us here.
That is all there is to say about your post.
GOD bless you.
Peace.
Peace everyone...
I don't care at all what your belief is when it comes to the shape of Earth... Do believe what you believe an Ivan not here to change you... But explore until you get certainty...
Carefully listen to Zakir Naik ehat he says about moon being reflected light in below video..
https://youtu.be/dRIXtpmJn1E
Now without laziness those who have time pls read all Munir or Nur verses in Quran and bring to me and say that Minor means reflected light...
Further pls takr yout time and read all Siraj/Lamp verses in Quran... God has stated Sun as Siraj... We all know sun is not reflected light but its own... Lamp has its own light... And sun is lit always in any part of the world though it is night.. So it is Siraj/lamp...
Moon is not lit like that.. Moon light you can only see when it is night... It cannot be a lamp..
The point is God himself says Siraj is Muneer.. The God perfectly said...
33:46And one who invites to Allah , by His permission, and a lamp illuminating (Sirajn Muneera)
Reflect pls.. Where in Quran it is written Moon is REFLECTED light? why lie against God's verses.? Is that good?
Quote from: jkhan on February 07, 2023, 09:30:04 PM
Peace everyone...
I don't care at all what your belief is when it comes to the shape of Earth... Do believe what you believe an Ivan not here to change you... But explore until you get certainty...
Carefully listen to Zakir Naik ehat he says about moon being reflected light in below video..
https://youtu.be/dRIXtpmJn1E
Now without laziness those who have time pls read all Munir or Nur verses in Quran and bring to me and say that Minor means reflected light...
Further pls takr yout time and read all Siraj/Lamp verses in Quran... God has stated Sun as Siraj... We all know sun is not reflected light but its own... Lamp has its own light... And sun is lit always in any part of the world though it is night.. So it is Siraj/lamp...
Moon is not lit like that.. Moon light you can only see when it is night... It cannot be a lamp..
The point is God himself says Siraj is Muneer.. The God perfectly said...
33:46And one who invites to Allah , by His permission, and a lamp illuminating (Sirajn Muneera)
Reflect pls.. Where in Quran it is written Moon is REFLECTED light? why lie against God's verses.? Is that good?
So many people did ask me,,, Is it really necessary to know to believe in God the shape of Earth and heavens or its truth? ... Well I always say it depends on who they are... If they are laymen and still a believer then no need and if they are intelligent and researcher and person who hunt truth then Yes.. Look below verse...
21:30 Have those who disbelieved not considered that the heavens and the earth were a joined entity, and We separated them and made from water every living thing? Then will they not believe?We in this forum are not fools who debate on various topics. Right.. So I consider everyone here as intelligent... Just reflect the question of God in above verse and how He ends the verse... Can this verse be meant for an illiterate or laymen or fool? No way.. God addresses intelligent here.. Of course lot of intellectual people are disbelivers.. But God questions... For this what God has taken... Yes two very important elements God has taken. The truth of Earth and heavens plus Every creature is created by water.. Then God questions "Will they not believe then? " ...How can an intellectual person answer this unless he applies his knowledge and explore both statements and verify on his own. For that he has to explore and see lot of matters.. cannot depend on one solution... If criteria is wrong then he can say Yes Quran is wrong so I disbelieve... But God says Still don't you believe? It means these two statements seems to have something very strong.. Don't they..
So believing in God is not easy part for intelligent people coz they need evidence unless God showed mercy.. But for laymen with mercy they may believe without even dig deep...
So brothers and sisters.. If the moon is having reflected light then Quran is definitely right... But if moon is having its own light then the book definitely says wrong... So verify first whether Gods says Moon has its own light or not for that you have to go dig deep in Quran itself.. Suppose if anyone finds out Yes according to Quran it is clear moon has its own light.. Then what? Well then science has a different claim... So either choose science or Quran... If you choose Quran then explore ehy moon has its own light... Isn't it worthy brothers and sisters rather than being adament yes moon is reflected light.. Why? Do you feel shame that Quran has stated so... People would laugh if I accept it.. So let's twist.. Why hide truth... It is like you have won a lottery and you want to throw the ticket juat thinking your numbers are wrong.. Just explore pls.. Don't think these things are not required when it comes to belief of an intelligent person. Yes it does..
Thank you.
Quote from: jkhan on February 08, 2023, 03:25:30 AM
So many people did ask me,,, Is it really necessary to know to believe in God the shape of Earth and heavens or its truth? ... Well I always say it depends on who they are... If they are laymen and still a believer then no need and if they are intelligent and researcher and person who hunt truth then Yes.. Look below verse...
21:30 Have those who disbelieved not considered that the heavens and the earth were a joined entity, and We separated them and made from water every living thing? Then will they not believe?
We in this forum are not fools who debate on various topics. Right.. So I consider everyone here as intelligent... Just reflect the question of God in above verse and how He ends the verse... Can this verse be meant for an illiterate or laymen or fool? No way.. God addresses intelligent here.. Of course lot of intellectual people are disbelivers.. But God questions... For this what God has taken... Yes two very important elements God has taken. The truth of Earth and heavens plus Every creature is created by water.. Then God questions "Will they not believe then? " ...How can an intellectual person answer this unless he applies his knowledge and explore both statements and verify on his own. For that he has to explore and see lot of matters.. cannot depend on one solution... If criteria is wrong then he can say Yes Quran is wrong so I disbelieve... But God says Still don't you believe? It means these two statements seems to have something very strong.. Don't they..
So believing in God is not easy part for intelligent people coz they need evidence unless God showed mercy.. But for laymen with mercy they may believe without even dig deep...
So brothers and sisters.. If the moon is having reflected light then Quran is definitely right... But if moon is having its own light then the book definitely says wrong... So verify first whether Gods says Moon has its own light or not for that you have to go dig deep in Quran itself.. Suppose if anyone finds out Yes according to Quran it is clear moon has its own light.. Then what? Well then science has a different claim... So either choose science or Quran... If you choose Quran then explore ehy moon has its own light... Isn't it worthy brothers and sisters rather than being adament yes moon is reflected light.. Why? Do you feel shame that Quran has stated so... People would laugh if I accept it.. So let's twist.. Why hide truth... It is like you have won a lottery and you want to throw the ticket juat thinking your numbers are wrong.. Just explore pls.. Don't think these things are not required when it comes to belief of an intelligent person. Yes it does..
Thank you.
O my fellow believers...
You believe entire Quran? Right.. Yes you may understand certain verses and you may not understand certain verses... Yes it absolutely happens.. No one will understand complete Quran unless God show mercy.. I agree ... There are verses which are clear.. Can we deny those verses? No...
If in case being a believer, you take according to Quran that moon has reflected light pls tell me why? What is your evidence.. Bring the fact which makes you say Yes moon has reflected light and such and such verses prove it... Bring if you are truthful... What hampers you? Okay study all verses of Munir /Nur and Siraj and bring your evidence... If you can't why you linger and accept that moon has reflected light and it doesn't have its own light? If you don't have proof within quran ehat makes you say? That's so strange...
Quote from: jkhan on February 08, 2023, 08:13:11 PM
O my fellow believers...
You believe entire Quran? Right.. Yes you may understand certain verses and you may not understand certain verses... Yes it absolutely happens.. No one will understand complete Quran unless God show mercy.. I agree ... There are verses which are clear.. Can we deny those verses? No...
If in case being a believer, you take according to Quran that moon has reflected light pls tell me why? What is your evidence.. Bring the fact which makes you say Yes moon has reflected light and such and such verses prove it... Bring if you are truthful... What hampers you? Okay study all verses of Munir /Nur and Siraj and bring your evidence... If you can't why you linger and accept that moon has reflected light and it doesn't have its own light? If you don't have proof within quran ehat makes you say? That's so strange...
If you have proof that moon is reflected light within Quran, you would have instantly brought... But you don't have proof.. And verses of Quran so manifest that moon has its own light...
Deny it.. Why you let me speak freely...
Are you arguing with yourself?
Quote from: Euphoric on February 09, 2023, 09:56:14 PM
Are you arguing with yourself?
:whatever:
Yes bro... Coz no one has answers... Is real believer need to be afraid of society and his respect to speak truth? I feel sometimes even though people call them believers they are afraid to speak even though it is written in Quran so that people would call them fool... I know such people I have come accross..
Anyway.. All I need is to show that Moon has its own light.. If no bring evidence within quran.. I am not asking you all to research moon.. But research Quran...
Thank you...
Peace jkhan..
Qoran does not say the moon generates its own light. IT uses "noor" ,contrary to when it describes the sun " Wahajan" which certainly has a meaning of "generating its own energy/light.
Why does it describe the light of the sun and moon with different words? Because they are different. the sun is a star but the moon is not a star.
Because the moon is nearer the earth than Venus or mercury, we can see it bigger, clearer and brighter but we also see Venus and mercury as a bright planet from its brightness . They reflect the light of their nearest star- the sun-.
If we did not live on earth and lived in the moon we would see the earth as bright as the moon or brighter.
SO the question can also be where did the Qoran say the moon generates its own light,?
GOD bless you brother.
Peace.
Quote from: good logic on February 10, 2023, 02:28:07 AM
Peace jkhan..
Qoran does not say the moon generates its own light. IT uses "noor" ,contrary to when it describes the sun " Wahajan" which certainly has a meaning of "generating its own energy/light.
Why does it describe the light of the sun and moon with different words? Because they are different. the sun is a star but the moon is not a star.
Because the moon is nearer the earth than Venus or mercury, we can see it bigger, clearer and brighter but we also see Venus and mercury as a bright planet from its brightness . They reflect the light of their nearest star- the sun-.
If we did not live on earth and lived in the moon we would see the earth as bright as the moon or brighter.
SO the question can also be where did the Qoran say the moon generates its own light,?
GOD bless you brother.
Peace.
Thank you brother GL
Appreciate your reply...
Just to remind you I presented a video in which Dr. Zakir Naik says Moon is REFLECTED or DERIVED Light and not ita own light... So I did ask my fellow believers or readers where in Quran it is written that Moon is reflected light? So far no one answered..
Just simply answer Has Quran mentioned Reflected light for moon? If so why and how and which word?
But God definitely has mentioned qamar Muneer or qamar Nur... So if Muneer or Nur is not reflected light and just light from where the light come to the object moon.. So simple logic.. No intricate science here..
Further you say why God has mentioned two different words for sun and moon light...
And you say Sun is star.. Well Has Allah ever called in Quran Sun a star? Pls speak within Quran.. Allah has called Sun Siraj.. Brother they are different in comparison. .. That's so obvious ..
Why Allah say Washamsi wadhuhaha... Did Allah say Walqamari wadhuhaha? No... Brightness of sun not equal to any illuminating objects of the sky... Nur is light Yes... But not bright so that even the object that produces even not visible.... I don't know you understand me or not unless you you apply deep application of thought into it.
Take this example even God is not illuminating like sun but God has light... By His light Earth will shine on the day of Resurrection coz No sun on that day. God dudnt use daee fir his light but Nur. . Coz people should see not only God's light but God Himself. Two different source of light.. If you cab see the object of light source it is not bright light but if you can't see the object of light source then it is sheer bright. So why should God mention sane to moon as of Sun while both of them are different.
Nur is never a bright light source. But Nur is light. Nur can be used for anything.. Like from darkness to light (Nur).. It doesn't mean from darkness to brightness. That's super weird.. Isn't it?
My question stands... Did Allah state Reflected light of Moon? So use logic if no reflected light mebtioned just light then how does that object gets its light unless it has its own light.
I will give you my lovely brother the best example for reflected light from Quran...
39:69 "And the EARTH will illuminate with the LIGHT (Nur) of ITS Lord, ..."
Here Allah didn't use brightness... Allah has light not the brightness of Sun.. For clarification read 24:35 (Allah never used Siraj but used Misbah)
Well... Reflect... Yes we all know Earth doesn't have its own light.. When sun is there it is bright... It is beyond Nur...
So God's light (Nur) is the source of light for the Earth... Definitely it is derived light on the day of Resurrection... Allah didn't say Ard Muneera (Earth light) but clearly said His light is liting the Earth...
God is careful when using words..
For example...
28:71 " Say, "Have you considered: if Allah should make for you the night continuous until the Day of Resurrection, what deity other than Allah could bring you light(Deeya/brightness)? Then will you not hear?
Allah could have simply used here Nur but Allah used brightness (deeya)
So be it sun or any small object if it is completely bright beyond light glowing it is not simply Nur... Yes Nur is there but with brightness..
Fire which produces light can be Nur but the fire itself not Nur.. That's Deeya..
So brother what is glowing with brightness cannot be Nur in Quran language...
I don't know you get me Co you need loads of comparison to get this..
My question still stands for anyone...
So Brother...God used Siraj / Deeya for Sun which makes complete sense if anyone look at the brightness of sun.. It's not simply light... But glowing brightness..
But God used for Moon Muneer just coz it is light not bright and piercing..
From where Reflected light creeped in? Unless minds are diverted with science...
Peace jkhan.
Qoran has used words that do not say the moon gives it own light nor does it say the moon reflects the sun s light directly.
Therefore ,you are implying that noor can only mean being generated when it can mean both generated and/or reflected.
However GOD has given us the tools to investigate and find out many things with research and observations.
If we are not contradicting what Qoran says - according to our own study- Then where is the problem?
Besides we can clearly see stars lights - they generate their own- and planets light they reflect the lights of their nearest stars and look like stars but they do not generate their own light. They have noor that is reflected to us seeing them at night.
Have you looked at the moon during the daylight and seen it? it has no light shining from it. Is it not evident to you it is not similar to the sun?
Look at the sun directly and the moon directly at daylight and see the difference for yourself?
Sorry brother , I do not understand it the way you do.
I see the difference clearly, the sun generates its own light/brightness ,the moon does not.
GOD bless you.
Peace.
In my opinion, Quran does not explicitly state that the moon has its own light. The Quran describes the moon as a "reflecting light" as is interpreted by some scholars as meaning that the moon reflects light from the sun.
However, it's important to note that the Quran is a religious text, not a scientific one, and its primary purpose is to convey divine revelations and moral guidance to humanity, rather than to provide a comprehensive understanding of the natural world. As such, its descriptions of the natural world should not be interpreted as literal statements of scientific fact, but rather as metaphorical expressions of deeper truths and spiritual realities.
Science is not negative folks, its the use of it that makes the difference, and science is also not definite, but then Quran is not a science book and if there is anything mentioned in Quran that deals outside of the faith, then it needs to be examined and confirmed what God has provided humanity with the tools.
I believe the humans are given the instinct to search, wander and find ways in make and build things that should be used for the good of humanity. One should consult the subject matter expert on how the law of reflection and refraction of light works in view of physics. Just taking a verse of Quran and constructing a whole building over it and making fun of those who wants to study and understand science by saying their minds are diverted is not what is worthy of us where God also ask us to learn.
We have went deep down into oceans, reached peaks of mountains, and have devised so many things that are is use today for the whole humanity. Take for example weather forecasting to some accuracy. However we cant learn all but a little but still there is no objection to how much we can go further in gods universe.
What is needed is to strike a balance. for example humans are dying of hunger and some nations spending billions on some research and shutting their eyes for those in need is also not a good thing. We we as humans make use of curiosity and research and I believe USA would not have been found as a new world as it was written in history. and it will not be a place where every one wants to immigrate even today.
I believe Quran has said seven skies and seven earth alike, it is quite possible that every sky has one habituated earth.. we would not know for sure
until we as humans travel and reach out to far off places... perhaps one day we will be able to reach out to other earths...
We as humans will continue to research and find what we can until the akhira comes and perhaps God will tell us what we wanted to know.
Maybe the other earths have life not necessarily as humans but other forms. who knows..Again verses of Quran which deals with nature can only
be looked with human research and gradually we may know some of things.
Cheers
Quote from: good logic on February 10, 2023, 12:04:51 PM
Peace jkhan.
Qoran has used words that do not say the moon gives it own light nor does it say the moon reflects the sun s light directly.
Therefore ,you are implying that noor can only mean being generated when it can mean both generated and/or reflected.
However GOD has given us the tools to investigate and find out many things with research and observations.
If we are not contradicting what Qoran says - according to our own study- Then where is the problem?
Besides we can clearly see stars lights - they generate their own- and planets light they reflect the lights of their nearest stars and look like stars but they do not generate their own light. They have noor that is reflected to us seeing them at night.
Have you looked at the moon during the daylight and seen it? it has no light shining from it. Is it not evident to you it is not similar to the sun?
Look at the sun directly and the moon directly at daylight and see the difference for yourself?
Sorry brother , I do not understand it the way you do.
I see the difference clearly, the sun generates its own light/brightness ,the moon does not.
GOD bless you.
Peace.
Salam lovely brother...
If you don't get it, then it is Okay.. May Allah guide ui our to what is truth and let you perceive why Quran has mentioned such and such verses while for guidance mere general verses are enough... Research brother if you have time on verses of earth and heavens in depth... I know you don't get it...
Let me answer you only day time moon since you curiously ask... Those who are passionate on subjects they always look at sky during day and night... So you can imagine what I do..
Now I am not talking within Quran but within nature to answer your question...
Sun is brilliant and radiant and bright.. Is there any light you have ever seen to beat the light of sun? Yes or No... No right.. Moon is not sun though it has light.. During day time moon is lit like stars are lit but the light of sun makea all of them nothing...
Make an experiment with your grand children.. Make a small football size ball out if anythjng and lit it with something in a dark room.. Meanehile take radiant torch dozen times better than the light you gave to the ball... See whether the ball has any effect to the room with its light... Well.. Rather than imagine practically observe..
In another forum where static Earth and spinning earth community debate, I was asked by one when I said Moon has its own light.. He was a decent guy. . So my mind opened to answer.. His question was... Have you not noticed moon like patches etc during night and in which you see shadow of those patches. If moon has its own light how can moon itself has shadows in it.. That's why I always observe and question to my self and I find answers within myself..
I told the same thing experiment.. Create a ball or diskl similar to the moon with patches with projections.. And ensure that ball or disk generates its own light keep it in a dark room.. Bring a torch which is absolutely bright ... No need even to directly expose but even from distance.. Let the light of Torch somehow fall on the ball or disk.
He experimented... And he said yes.. I can see shadows coz light of ball is far less... Amazingly experiment was done..
He has targeted the torch light even on open are outside.. Kept the lit ball and from a far distance targeted the torch at the ball.. Distance between ball and torch is in darkness but light travel and fall on the ball and shadow appears..
You can also try...
Moon light is less powerful by which it can only lit the earth to certain extent.. But Sunlight will eradicate the darkness and only brightness will remain... Is it againat natural physics.. If so bring evidence..
Anyway.. Since you or anyone don't understand moon verses of Quran... Let me bring others verses in near future... In sha Allah you all apply some sense to it without leaning to science.. Why not take Quran on its own first.. Then think of science.. Why trying to take the Quran with science.. That's where our eyes get blinded..
35:41 "Indeed, Allah holds the heavens (samawati) and the Earth(Ard), lest they(both dual) move. And if they(both dual) should move, no one could hold them(both dual) after Him. Indeed, He is Forbearing and Forgiving."
Since no one has answered for Moon Light and with their whimsical approach say without any evidence from Quran Moon has reflected light, so I brought another verse. Leta move on with Quran verses..
God has never mentioned Sun and Moon and stars or in a nutshell for all celestial bodies to Heaven (sama) but God clearly says they are in the Sama (sky /heaven) and we know they are moving. But it doesn't mean Heaven is moving... Objects in the Heaven/s are moving for sure.. But not Heaven/s(sama/wati)..
So God is crystal clear in His verse here.. Nothing is moving in case if they(Samawati and Ard) are to move, no one can hold them except Allah..
I know anyone can twist this verse to adapt their preference like they trying to twist the clear Moon light verse.. But what benefit...?
Like those intelligent people either leave all these nonsensical verses of Quran and leave God aside and move on in life with science which has developed to its maximum... Rather than shaping the verses to go in line with science.. Haven't you seen how many erudite people left Islam claiming Quran is contradictory... Coz they understood the verses.. And knew it is not matching with science and they left God and His book.. They are in a way straightforward.. But unfortunately those who say we believe in God and still twisting verses to adjust to modern science thinking Modern science is right when it comes to Universe... Allah never used the word universe in Quran.. Always separated Earth and Smawati .. Allah could have used one word for His entire Creations... But never... Co they are two different entity... They both not same..
Now let me see your understanding brothers and sisters of the above verse... And let reflect why you think so... Curious to know your understanding of the verse 35:41.. Do you feel you want to go with science so you can adjust the verse.. Yes I am sure you adjust.. What benefit... To hide the truth?
Note: I bring only Quran verses... I am not here to debate flat Earth or heliocentric model... My only intention to bring verses of Quran and how it can possibly match whatever your belief of either Heliocentric or Geocentric or whatever.. I only bring Quran verse which talks of Creations..
Peace jkhan.
So you are using experiments? I thought you are asking us to use only Qoran? Then you say,quote:
"Since no one has answered for Moon Light and with their whimsical approach say without any evidence from Quran Moon has reflected light, so I brought another verse. Leta move on with Quran verses.."
Why don t you bring verses that indicate your stand ?i.e that Qoran says the moon does not reflect light ,or the moon generates its own light?Would that not consolidate your argument? Or why should we bring you the opposite in that case?
Qoran does not say that the moon generates its own light and you say it does
Qoran does not say the moon reflects the light and I say it does.
This clearly only means we differ ,and we are both within our right to differ according to our own study and understanding.
It never means you are right or you have evidence from Qoran..
Or may be you do not see this.
GOD bless you
Peace.
Quote from: good logic on February 10, 2023, 11:55:32 PM
Peace jkhan.
So you are using experiments? I thought you are asking us to use only Qoran? Then you say,quote:
"Since no one has answered for Moon Light and with their whimsical approach say without any evidence from Quran Moon has reflected light, so I brought another verse. Leta move on with Quran verses.."
Why don t you bring verses that indicate your stand ?i.e that Qoran says the moon does not reflect light ,or the moon generates its own light?Would that not consolidate your argument? Or why should we bring you the opposite in that case?
Qoran does not say that the moon generates its own light and you say it does
Qoran does not say the moon reflects the light and I say it does.
This clearly only means we differ ,and we are both within our right to differ according to our own study and understanding.
It never means you are right or you have evidence from Qoran..
Or may be you do not see this.
GOD bless you
Peace.
Peace...
It seems like you have forgotten what you asked from.... I asked you to experiment coz you asked a question which is as under
Have you looked at the moon during the daylight and seen it? it has no light shining from it. Is it not evident to you it is not similar to the sun?
Look at the sun directly and the moon directly at daylight and see the difference for yourself?So I asked you to experiment... Got it brother...
Highlighted in red... Brother... That's what I have been answering eversince I resumed this topic again. Quran has not mentioned REFLECTED... And why people add REFLECTED to mere light(Nur) mentioned in Quran.
Quran has clearly mention Qamar Muneera /Nur ... Bring the word REGLECTED from Quran then I accept you or Dr. Zakir Naik or anyone.. But from your pocket you can't say Moon REFLECTED light.. That's a lie. . Then I questioned in previous threads if Quran doesn't mention Reflected Light for Moon, then where does Moon get light while you can see it has LIght .. For that I clearly asked everyone to check all Nur/muneers verses and Shams and Siraj and Daee (brightness) verses. .
But if still claim REFLECTED light with what evidence I need to accept Dr Zakir... Just coz science say... That's not the point here. Why I need to go science while according to science has not even mentioned... Had quran mebtioned reflected light.. Yes I could have approached science and compare.. Coz both identical... But Quran has not mebtioned Why I need to forcibly add the REFLECTED word and go in line with science. Let the science be science... Let Quran be Quran...
Peace jkhan.
Whether you say bring reflected like I would reply bring generates its own makes no difference to the reality. Qoran has not said either directly.
So I would not be able to find you the exact word " moon reflects the light of the sun" and you would not find generates word" moon generates its own light".
But your analysis of what Qoran says about the sun and the moon differs from my analysis of what it says.
Qoran also does not say Mercury or Venus or other solar planets reflect the light but they clearly do . They appear bright at night like the moon does and they certainly do not generate their own brightness.
Qamar-moon- Munir - bright- is reflecting the sun s light on earth and because it is nearer to us than Venus and other planets, it is stronger , bigger and brighter than them.
Munir comes from either straight generated light or reflected one.
SO where is the problem that I have and you do not?
Or your interpretations of verses of Qoran are the true fact?
You say you are missing my evidence, I am also missing yours.
GOD bless you.
Peace.
Quote from: good logic on February 11, 2023, 06:19:47 AM
Peace jkhan.
Whether you say bring reflected like I would reply bring generates its own makes no difference to the reality. Qoran has not said either directly.
.
Peace.
Peace GL...
There you get stuck brother.. I say bring why REFLECTED light coz it is not written in Quran.. But you are forcing to bring what is not written there? I only say what QURAN has written.. It is Moon Light... It is up to believers to deduce where LIGHT of moon comes if not Reflected... I am 100% you are not getting me at all neither the verses and comparison... You are just rushing for the sake of argument.. Pls research.. In sha Allah whatever truth is you will get... All we searched truth..dont we as believers.. We don't like to live in falsehood... As God says.. Truth has come and falsehood will vanish...
Thank you...
Pejkhan.
I agree with you ,searching is ongoing,. Both of us should keep searching.
However , I read and checked your answers and so far I disagree with your take on the moon. and the source of its light..
As for observation and comparison ,is the planets situations not similar to the moon s one in our solar system?
Their light is exactly the same as that of the moon.
You need to check about the moon visit by your fellow humans, do you think they never got there? What kind of light did they find there?
The rocks they brought back on that day when they returned at 54:01 minute past the hour were not luminous ones:
Qoran The Moon (Al-Qamar)
54:01:The Hour has come closer, and the moon has been split.*اقتَرَبَتِ السّاعَةُ وَانشَقَّ القَمَرُ
This important sign came to pass in 1969 when humans landed on the moon and brought pieces-rocks to analyse- of the moon to earth.
Science now knows the composition of both the sun and the moon. Otherwise they would not even contemplate going where there will be no comeback. .
Or that is not what Qoran is saying about the moon according to some. All coincidence, the name, verse number and accuracy of the verse information. of the surah!
Anyway brother you are entitled to understand your way .
I have no doubt the moon has been visited and has no light of its own but gets its light from our sun its nearest star.
Thanks for another useful conversation.
GOD bless you.
Peace.
Quote from: good logic on February 11, 2023, 01:14:35 PM
Pejkhan.
I agree with you ,searching is ongoing,. Both of us should keep searching.
However , I read and checked your answers and so far I disagree with your take on the moon. and the source of its light..
As for observation and comparison ,is the planets situations not similar to the moon s one in our solar system?
Their light is exactly the same as that of the moon.
You need to check about the moon visit by your fellow humans, do you think they never got there? What kind of light did they find there?
The rocks they brought back on that day when they returned at 54:01 minute past the hour were not luminous ones:
Qoran The Moon (Al-Qamar)
54:01:The Hour has come closer, and the moon has been split.*اقتَرَبَتِ السّاعَةُ وَانشَقَّ القَمَرُ
This important sign came to pass in 1969 when humans landed on the moon and brought pieces-rocks to analyse- of the moon to earth.
Science now knows the composition of both the sun and the moon. Otherwise they would not even contemplate going where there will be no comeback. .
Or that is not what Qoran is saying about the moon according to some. All coincidence, the name, verse number and accuracy of the verse information. of the surah!
Anyway brother you are entitled to understand your way .
I have no doubt the moon has been visited and has no light of its own but gets its light from our sun its nearest star.
Thanks for another useful conversation.
GOD bless you.
Peace.
peace.. GL..
Blue... Yes... That's the best a believer can do until his death. Search Quran and explore Quran and observe nature... In sha Allah you continue searching... Today's enemy can be friend tomorrow on things we differ.. Common to me and you...
......
Well on moon rock and landing Blaaa and timing 54:01... If you want you can believe... But believe what it has authentic evidence... As I said truth should have tangible reality facts and evidence with logic... If you feel for moon landing it all comprises... Then it is your life your decision... You are responsible for what you believe.. But when it comes to Quran verses I will keep debating.. Youbknkw brother debating is part of haj and part and parcel of believers in manner that suits eith people who don't mock you... That's why I continue with you though you don't get what I say... But jt is not my duty to guide you that God will do... And in case I am wrong same debate would help me to open my eyes... But I am not going against Quran...
Thank you so much.. Do you have anything to say about the other verse i brought... I know you will differ but it doesn't matter.. There a people who read with sheer intention of knowing truth... And they in sha Allah compare and perceive.
In a nutshell, main reason I don't believe moon landing is according to Quran everything in the sky are combination of gases/dukhan..if you need I explain further...
Quote from: jkhan on February 10, 2023, 11:00:31 PM
35:41 "Indeed, Allah holds the heavens (samawati) and the Earth(Ard), lest they(both dual) move. And if they(both dual) should move, no one could hold them(both dual) after Him. Indeed, He is Forbearing and Forgiving."
Since no one has answered for Moon Light and with their whimsical approach say without any evidence from Quran Moon has reflected light, so I brought another verse. Leta move on with Quran verses..
God has never mentioned Sun and Moon and stars or in a nutshell for all celestial bodies to Heaven (sama) but God clearly says they are in the Sama (sky /heaven) and we know they are moving. But it doesn't mean Heaven is moving... Objects in the Heaven/s are moving for sure.. But not Heaven/s(sama/wati)..
So God is crystal clear in His verse here.. Nothing is moving in case if they(Samawati and Ard) are to move, no one can hold them except Allah..
I know anyone can twist this verse to adapt their preference like they trying to twist the clear Moon light verse.. But what benefit...?
Like those intelligent people either leave all these nonsensical verses of Quran and leave God aside and move on in life with science which has developed to its maximum... Rather than shaping the verses to go in line with science.. Haven't you seen how many erudite people left Islam claiming Quran is contradictory... Coz they understood the verses.. And knew it is not matching with science and they left God and His book.. They are in a way straightforward.. But unfortunately those who say we believe in God and still twisting verses to adjust to modern science thinking Modern science is right when it comes to Universe... Allah never used the word universe in Quran.. Always separated Earth and Smawati .. Allah could have used one word for His entire Creations... But never... Co they are two different entity... They both not same..
Now let me see your understanding brothers and sisters of the above verse... And let reflect why you think so... Curious to know your understanding of the verse 35:41.. Do you feel you want to go with science so you can adjust the verse.. Yes I am sure you adjust.. What benefit... To hide the truth?
Note: I bring only Quran verses... I am not here to debate flat Earth or heliocentric model... My only intention to bring verses of Quran and how it can possibly match whatever your belief of either Heliocentric or Geocentric or whatever.. I only bring Quran verse which talks of Creations..
Any thoughts or difference of opinion ...?
Quote from: jkhan on February 10, 2023, 11:00:31 PM
35:41 "Indeed, Allah holds the heavens (samawati) and the Earth(Ard), lest they(both dual) move. And if they(both dual) should move, no one could hold them(both dual) after Him. Indeed, He is Forbearing and Forgiving."
Since no one has answered for Moon Light and with their whimsical approach say without any evidence from Quran Moon has reflected light, so I brought another verse. Leta move on with Quran verses..
God has never mentioned Sun and Moon and stars or in a nutshell for all celestial bodies to Heaven (sama) but God clearly says they are in the Sama (sky /heaven) and we know they are moving. But it doesn't mean Heaven is moving... Objects in the Heaven/s are moving for sure.. But not Heaven/s(sama/wati)..
So God is crystal clear in His verse here.. Nothing is moving in case if they(Samawati and Ard) are to move, no one can hold them except Allah..
I know anyone can twist this verse to adapt their preference like they trying to twist the clear Moon light verse.. But what benefit...?
Like those intelligent people either leave all these nonsensical verses of Quran and leave God aside and move on in life with science which has developed to its maximum... Rather than shaping the verses to go in line with science.. Haven't you seen how many erudite people left Islam claiming Quran is contradictory... Coz they understood the verses.. And knew it is not matching with science and they left God and His book.. They are in a way straightforward.. But unfortunately those who say we believe in God and still twisting verses to adjust to modern science thinking Modern science is right when it comes to Universe... Allah never used the word universe in Quran.. Always separated Earth and Smawati .. Allah could have used one word for His entire Creations... But never... Co they are two different entity... They both not same..
Now let me see your understanding brothers and sisters of the above verse... And let reflect why you think so... Curious to know your understanding of the verse 35:41.. Do you feel you want to go with science so you can adjust the verse.. Yes I am sure you adjust.. What benefit... To hide the truth?
Note: I bring only Quran verses... I am not here to debate flat Earth or heliocentric model... My only intention to bring verses of Quran and how it can possibly match whatever your belief of either Heliocentric or Geocentric or whatever.. I only bring Quran verse which talks of Creations..
Peace...
Let's see whether Allah has created Universe or only Earth and Heavens.. Note Allah has never used ONE word for Earth and Heavens.. Always separated both of them... And never created all together. ..
41:9 Say, "Do you indeed disbelieve in He who created the earth in two days and attribute to Him equals? That is the Lord of the worlds."
41:10 "And He placed on the earth firmly set mountains above its surface, and He blessed it and determined therein its sustenance in four days without distinction for those who ask.
41:11 "Then He directed Himself to the heaven(Sama-singular) while it was Dukhan (gas) and said to it and to the earth, "Come, willingly or by unwillingly ." They both said, "We have come willingly."
41:12 "And He completed them as seven heavens (Samawati-plural) within two days and inspired in each heaven (Sama) its command. And We adorned the nearest heaven with lamps and as protection. That is the determination of the Exalted in Might, the Knowing.
Above verses are indeed creations of God and that too in literal order. These verses in fact elaborate the order of creations and how many days it took for them to be created by Allah's reckoning..
Accordingly, it is very manifest that God created and completed the Earth in four days... Then only He created the Heavens out one Heaven (Gas) ...
Once the Earth creations is over only God calls Earth and incomplete and mere Heaven (singular) that was in a stage of combination of gas ... You accept or not, everything in the sky is gas and nothing is solid like the Earth.. But gas molecules when it goes through various stages like cooling or hot it can create solid objects... I am not talking even againat acceptable science. . not fiction.. That's what we have learned in college..
So God manifestly said singular heaven which was mere combination of Gas and out of it He fashioned seven heavens and assigned to each heaven its duty... This is definitely obvious.. From earth atmosphere to up until where Jinns secretly go and sit and trying to listen all are heavens... In the midst only God has placed the Sun and the Moon..
Both Sun and Moon are are combination of gases... They are not solid rock like earth but they are gases formed solid.. Same stars... Raw material of Heaven is non other but combination of Gases.. That's super clear with the verse 41:11..
Strangely modem day scientist says 99% of celestial bodies are plasma... It means full various gases.. But why moon become rock or some other so called planets .. Rock doesn't produce light... God is very clear Moon has its light no reflection at all mentioned while we see light in moon..literally in every celestial objects we see light coz all of them gas..
On top of that after creating Earth only creation of Heavens took place, that is to say sun moon stars etc for that last two days He took.. It further proves Earth is before Sun and Moon and stars... This is complete contradiction with modern science..
God's verses clear by stating how many days it took to complete Earth and heavens.. Yes it is 6.. But first two days for mere Earth and aggregate 4 days for the complete earth with mountains and sustenance of Earth and balance two days for heavens out of one Heaven.. Still all Heavens are One but Seven different functions in Each Heavens..
No earthly like material in the skies.. Never no rock will float or fly in the sky... That's super assumption and bizzare .. . . If any such object is to fly then It should have its own energy source.. Let me elaborate... If I throw a ball it flies in the sky according to the energy I applied and the density of the air then fall down.. .. Or a kite the energy source is thread I am holding and the air density compared to the weight of kite. Or flight or any objects it has energy source so it flies.. No rock will fly on its own.. Coz air is less weight than the rock.. Why helium balloon flies in the air coz the helium is less in weight than the air...
Since Allah has created entire heaven through combination of gases(Dukhan41:11) it all floats.. Moon floats coz it is a combination of gas .. Sun floats it is combination of gases... Similarly all.. They are not earthly solid object but solid gas objects and the weight of them is lesser than air density where it floats.. God is precise... God doesn't need to say in 41:11 that Heaven was gas coz it was none but gas.. But Earth is different solid.. Nothing of Earth material flies and it becomes lesser in weight than air or it has its own energy.. Why water evaporates coz evaporation water molecules are less than the weight of air... Mercy of God rains falls when it reaches to the weight which is higher than the air..
That's why I believe we are inside a chamber where no men no jinn can escape.. What is outside the chamber no idea coz it is Gaib.. On what the Earth is standing No idea.. All Ghaib.. Where the existing Janna once Adam lived.. No idea.. All Ghaib.. But one thing is sure the roof of all heavens is extreme solid a d nk KNE can pierce.. On top it what Ghaib is hidden God only knows.. Creator of this massive Earth and heavens never with intent said with ONE WORD as UNIVERSE or any equivalent of Arabic Word.. coz it is not Universe.. From the beginning these Earth and Heaven are two separate but they were together up untill God's creation took place one by one throughout Six Days..
God is the one Holding the Earth and heavens from moving... Both Heavens and Earth stationary.. But has kept the celestial bodies of Heavens to float in its orbit... But Heaven is firm like Earth and never moving.. Confirms 35:41...
Thank you... Let those who reflect, reflect within Quran verses.. Let those who mock, mock at..
Okay brothers and sisters...
Let me ask you a scientific question.. Not from Quran verses.. Mere scientific question.. Reflect well or bring evidence from science and enlighten me.. But don't ask how lunar eclipse do happen... Allah has not mentioned how it happens... Has He?
I have learned and you have learned about celestial bodies in science... everywhere same way they teach...
So my question is... During complete Lunar Eclipse from where the moon gets its light? Take a diagram of simple one.. It clearly shows Earth comes in between Sun and Moon and all three are absolutely aligned.. So the shadow (pitch dark) is falling on the surface of Moon, so moon get little Reddish... But brothers and sisters Moon is still well Lit.. Yes or No? What kind of science can teach that dark shadow can create light on any surface? Earth dark side is exposed to Moon... But moon still has its bright light... If Earth has completly blocked the Moon and the source light for Moon is none other than Sun then how Moon still gets light during complete Lunar eclipse... If we apply proper logic and science Moon should be invisible or pitch dark because of the absence of sunlight during full lunar eclipse...
I don't hoe many of you will first of all understand the question for that you need lots of application of thought...
Everyone is blinded and immediately accepted science Yes Earth's black shadow falls on the surface of Moon so it become Red.. But nobody reflected how Moon gets its Light still if Earth has completly blocked the moon from Sun..
Let's see your understanding of science... Yeah search google.. I don't mind.. Or call your lecturer.. Or Nasa... Lol.. Let's see with what logic you reply... Don't forget to bring a diagram of full Lunar eclipse while you bring your replies.. Thank you...
Its quite easy to explain through science the reddish/blood moon, but then you will need to understand/agree/believe/study in other scientific terms like earth atmosphere, refraction vs reflection, shorter Wavelength of light (in this case sunlight-distance between crests / troughs- scattering of light- as why our sky appears blue) vs longer wavelength of light bends and falls on the moon. Had there been no atmosphere, all 7 rays of light would make the moon appear guess what?
https://www.quora.com/If-the-moon-and-the-earth-dont-emit-light-and-the-moon-is-covered-by-earths-shadow-during-a-lunar-eclipse-how-come-we-can-still-see-the-moon-Where-is-the-light-coming-from
Not sure why you are so adamant on making Quran appear like a scientific book. It is NOT. Leave the study of nature and science to those who want seek knowledge by observation and experiment.. else with your logic no scientific discoveries would be made and you even wont be able to communicate on this forum as every thing a humanity achieved is through collective knowledge...
cheers
Brother jkhan.
You can easily observe the red colour of sunsets and sunrises . It is these colour/s that is reflected to the moon during the eclipse . If you see it from the moon you will see the earth atmosphere turn red like when the sun sets. That is what is reflected unto the moon.
The Moon does not have any light of its own—it shines because its surface reflects sunlight. During a total lunar eclipse, the Earth moves between the Sun and the Moon and cuts off the Moon's light supply. When this happens, the surface of the Moon takes on a reddish glow instead of going completely dark.
The red color of a totally eclipsed Moon has prompted many people in recent years to refer to total lunar eclipses as Blood Moons.
Why Red?
The reason why the Moon takes on a reddish color during totality is a phenomenon called Rayleigh scattering. It is the same mechanism responsible for causing colorful sunrises and sunsets.
Many Shades of Red
The Moon can take on different shades of red, orange, or gold during a total lunar eclipse, depending on the conditions of the Earth's atmosphere at the time of the eclipse. The amount of dust particles, water droplets, clouds, and mist can all have an effect on the shade of red. Volcanic ash and dust in the atmosphere can also lead to the Moon turning dark during an eclipse.
GOD bless you.
Peace.
(https://i.postimg.cc/8CFpYvxS/IMG-20230220-061949.jpg)
Brothers thank you for parroting.. I wanted you to think but unfortunately not... Do you think I have not learned what you describe above...?
Did you forget that the size of Earth is four times almost in contrast to the Moon... @fuse.. I know why sky get blue, I don't deny... @GL well I know why Sun gets orange when setting and rising and why not it makes clouds even to that golden colours...
Pls don't compare truth with falsehood...
Just look at the above picture... I asked you to bring a diagram so your replies may look sound.. Anyway I brought one which science speaks... This is what happens... Remember again Earth is four times bigger than Moon...
Again I reiterate.. Only light source for moon is Sunlight.... When it is blocked No way Moon would get its light... Don't talk of nonsense of golden sky and blue sky.. For all these sun light falls and molecules makes the difference... Just get out of the box and think brothers.. Is someone pointing gun at you so that you licking ass of science..
Well.. I make further easy... Look at Full Solar eclipse.. I mean totality... Pls when you reply don't think I have not learned science and repeat like a parrot... Okay in totality of Solar eclipse The moon comes in between Sun and the Earth.. All completely aligned... What is the consequences... The consequence is very small area in any part of the world is under totall darkness hardly 8 or 10 minutes.. Not entire earth... Why earth get immediately into darkness when totality of Solar eclipse take place is because the sunlight is completely blocked by the the Moon reaching to the earth... Note well no golden atmosphere or like evening colord when sunset'.. But immediate darkness ... Similarly the four times bigger Earth block the Moon in totality of Lunar eclipse and Moon is perfectly lit... Notice.. Even when clouds pass by those clouds also get the colour of moon and why not Moon light is falling on earth as well earth is not under pitch darkness but moon light effect is there like normal full moon.. But theory says Moon is blocked by Earth completly... Why can't you reflect own senses... Am asking you something that you can't do? Why reluctant to ask questions on science theory while you have lot of questions on quran.. Do you think there ja no contradictions in science theory...?
If part of Earth is under darkness during Solar eclipse totality, Why during Moon eclipse totality Moon is still well lit while dark shadow of Four times bigger Earth is falling on Moon..
Explanation science gives is ridiculous.. It can't happen.. It has no sense.. Away from truth... Sheer falsehood.. how come when light source is blocked and the moon still changing its colour only while it is well lit...?
You can't think guys if you close your mind to science and believe in it only, you can think if you question on science like you question quran...
Quote from: Fusion on February 19, 2023, 12:14:58 PM
Not sure why you are so adamant on making Quran appear like a scientific book. It is NOT. Leave the study of nature and science to those who want seek knowledge by observation and experiment.. else with your logic no scientific discoveries would be made and you even wont be able to communicate on this forum as every thing a humanity achieved is through collective knowledge...
cheers
Don't talk blindly about others... Do you think I deny really science.. Do you think I am not using lights instead of candles.. Boy.. Do you think I am not using mobile and its technology.. Do you think I don't see technology which produces great machines.. Etc etc..
I reject nonsense... Nonsense are those who landed on moon.. What benifit they brought for me landing on moon.. Leave me at least to Americans.. What benefits these fancy well paid story tellers in the name of astronauts... What they give back to society rather than keep on talking and wasting money of people...
Bro... There is big difference between proven science and science fiction... You are blinded in science fiction.... 6 times landed on Moon they claim what advantage at all with that science... Science is a methodical way facilitating the users of whatevwr invented by the science... Do I deny you think? If in the name of science if someone fools then it is not science... It is tieing a blindfold in your eyes by great respect you give to it for nothing of an achievement they have done...
Do I deny technology.. Computers, robots etc etc..?
Reflect rather than pointing fingers at others... I am doing my part to allow people to reflect...
What is the single benefit NASA has brought in any individual lifestyle around the world? Is that what science is...
Quote from: jkhan on February 19, 2023, 06:01:04 AM
Peace...
Let's see whether Allah has created Universe or only Earth and Heavens.. Note Allah has never used ONE word for Earth and Heavens.. Always separated both of them... And never created all together. ..
41:9 Say, "Do you indeed disbelieve in He who created the earth in two days and attribute to Him equals? That is the Lord of the worlds."
41:10 "And He placed on the earth firmly set mountains above its surface, and He blessed it and determined therein its sustenance in four days without distinction for those who ask.
41:11 "Then He directed Himself to the heaven(Sama-singular) while it was Dukhan (gas) and said to it and to the earth, "Come, willingly or by unwillingly ." They both said, "We have come willingly."
41:12 "And He completed them as seven heavens (Samawati-plural) within two days and inspired in each heaven (Sama) its command. And We adorned the nearest heaven with lamps and as protection. That is the determination of the Exalted in Might, the Knowing.
Above verses are indeed creations of God and that too in literal order. These verses in fact elaborate the order of creations and how many days it took for them to be created by Allah's reckoning..
Accordingly, it is very manifest that God created and completed the Earth in four days... Then only He created the Heavens out one Heaven (Gas) ...
Once the Earth creations is over only God calls Earth and incomplete and mere Heaven (singular) that was in a stage of combination of gas ... You accept or not, everything in the sky is gas and nothing is solid like the Earth.. But gas molecules when it goes through various stages like cooling or hot it can create solid objects... I am not talking even againat acceptable science. . not fiction.. That's what we have learned in college..
So God manifestly said singular heaven which was mere combination of Gas and out of it He fashioned seven heavens and assigned to each heaven its duty... This is definitely obvious.. From earth atmosphere to up until where Jinns secretly go and sit and trying to listen all are heavens... In the midst only God has placed the Sun and the Moon..
Both Sun and Moon are are combination of gases... They are not solid rock like earth but they are gases formed solid.. Same stars... Raw material of Heaven is non other but combination of Gases.. That's super clear with the verse 41:11..
Strangely modem day scientist says 99% of celestial bodies are plasma... It means full various gases.. But why moon become rock or some other so called planets .. Rock doesn't produce light... God is very clear Moon has its light no reflection at all mentioned while we see light in moon..literally in every celestial objects we see light coz all of them gas..
On top of that after creating Earth only creation of Heavens took place, that is to say sun moon stars etc for that last two days He took.. It further proves Earth is before Sun and Moon and stars... This is complete contradiction with modern science..
God's verses clear by stating how many days it took to complete Earth and heavens.. Yes it is 6.. But first two days for mere Earth and aggregate 4 days for the complete earth with mountains and sustenance of Earth and balance two days for heavens out of one Heaven.. Still all Heavens are One but Seven different functions in Each Heavens..
No earthly like material in the skies.. Never no rock will float or fly in the sky... That's super assumption and bizzare .. . . If any such object is to fly then It should have its own energy source.. Let me elaborate... If I throw a ball it flies in the sky according to the energy I applied and the density of the air then fall down.. .. Or a kite the energy source is thread I am holding and the air density compared to the weight of kite. Or flight or any objects it has energy source so it flies.. No rock will fly on its own.. Coz air is less weight than the rock.. Why helium balloon flies in the air coz the helium is less in weight than the air...
Since Allah has created entire heaven through combination of gases(Dukhan41:11) it all floats.. Moon floats coz it is a combination of gas .. Sun floats it is combination of gases... Similarly all.. They are not earthly solid object but solid gas objects and the weight of them is lesser than air density where it floats.. God is precise... God doesn't need to say in 41:11 that Heaven was gas coz it was none but gas.. But Earth is different solid.. Nothing of Earth material flies and it becomes lesser in weight than air or it has its own energy.. Why water evaporates coz evaporation water molecules are less than the weight of air... Mercy of God rains falls when it reaches to the weight which is higher than the air..
That's why I believe we are inside a chamber where no men no jinn can escape.. What is outside the chamber no idea coz it is Gaib.. On what the Earth is standing No idea.. All Ghaib.. Where the existing Janna once Adam lived.. No idea.. All Ghaib.. But one thing is sure the roof of all heavens is extreme solid a d nk KNE can pierce.. On top it what Ghaib is hidden God only knows.. Creator of this massive Earth and heavens never with intent said with ONE WORD as UNIVERSE or any equivalent of Arabic Word.. coz it is not Universe.. From the beginning these Earth and Heaven are two separate but they were together up untill God's creation took place one by one throughout Six Days..
God is the one Holding the Earth and heavens from moving... Both Heavens and Earth stationary.. But has kept the celestial bodies of Heavens to float in its orbit... But Heaven is firm like Earth and never moving.. Confirms 35:41...
Thank you... Let those who reflect, reflect within Quran verses.. Let those who mock, mock at..
I welcome logical answers from those who think with logic to above explanation...
Thank you
Quote from: jkhan on February 19, 2023, 08:47:10 PM
Don't talk blindly about others... Do you think I deny really science.. Do you think I am not using lights instead of candles.. Boy.. Do you think I am not using mobile and its technology.. Do you think I don't see technology which produces great machines.. Etc etc..
I reject nonsense... Nonsense are those who landed on moon.. What benifit they brought for me landing on moon.. Leave me at least to Americans.. What benefits these fancy well paid story tellers in the name of astronauts... What they give back to society rather than keep on talking and wasting money of people...
Bro... There is big difference between proven science and science fiction... You are blinded in science fiction.... 6 times landed on Moon they claim what advantage at all with that science... Science is a methodical way facilitating the users of whatevwr invented by the science... Do I deny you think? If in the name of science if someone fools then it is not science... It is tieing a blindfold in your eyes by great respect you give to it for nothing of an achievement they have done...
Do I deny technology.. Computers, robots etc etc..?
Reflect rather than pointing fingers at others... I am doing my part to allow people to reflect...
What is the single benefit NASA has brought in any individual lifestyle around the world? Is that what science is...
It is not Nasa but the collective achievement of all humans. It seems your main issues are landing on moon and earth is flat and now the reflected light of moon, and you are trying to prove your points from Quran.
I have tried to explain you so many times that Quran is for guidance of mankind but you continue to use its verses for your own scientific adventures. In my opinion being a consumer of science does not qualify one to indulge in deep scientific discussions, nor you nor me. These are established faculties and let the people who holds specialized knowledge domains can shed some light, this area is not the main theme of Quran and I believe nor should be of this forum to waste your energy and time.
Conspiracy theories are something else but making a blanket statement about astronauts or the related fields is sheer ignorance. I am sorry if i have caused you inconveniences with my limited knowledge but please let us not indulge in such deep academic scientific discussion unless some of folks here hold respective qualifications/degrees.
Moreover I think you are sort of playing with us all. In one of your statement you said "Do you think I have not learned what you describe above...?"
This statement is in bad taste don't you think. its not humble nor polite shows your ego. How do we know what you already know and researched unless you should have posted your complete opinion first including that you already know about Rayleigh scattering to really have a good honest discussion and to save all of us time to repeat post which you already know. But I think you have an agenda in your mind to wait for us to reply and then you counter reply in a manipulated way. :-)
Pease and i will end my part in this thread.
cheers
Quote from: Fusion on February 20, 2023, 12:41:56 AM
It is not Nasa but the collective achievement of all humans. It seems your main issues are landing on moon and earth is flat and now the reflected light of moon, and you are trying to prove your points from Quran.
I have tried to explain you so many times that Quran is for guidance of mankind but you continue to use its verses for your own scientific adventures. In my opinion being a consumer of science does not qualify one to indulge in deep scientific discussions, nor you nor me. These are established faculties and let the people who holds specialized knowledge domains can shed some light, this area is not the main theme of Quran and I believe nor should be of this forum to waste your energy and time.
Conspiracy theories are something else but making a blanket statement about astronauts or the related fields is sheer ignorance. I am sorry if i have caused you inconveniences with my limited knowledge but please let us not indulge in such deep academic scientific discussion unless some of folks here hold respective qualifications/degrees.
Moreover I think you are sort of playing with us all. In one of your statement you said "Do you think I have not learned what you describe above...?"
This statement is in bad taste don't you think. its not humble nor polite shows your ego. How do we know what you already know and researched unless you should have posted your complete opinion first including that you already know about Rayleigh scattering to really have a good honest discussion and to save all of us time to repeat post which you already know. But I think you have an agenda in your mind to wait for us to reply and then you counter reply in a manipulated way. :-)
Pease and i will end my part in this thread.
cheers
Bro... I don't mind you argue or not with my logic... When you have literally accepted that Quran has No scientific truth, then what is the point you are arguing with Quranic verses and real science... If earth and heavens doesnt have science in it then it is strange... So God talks about creations of Earth and heavens in Quran so if not we apply science how we understand the science behind them verses... For you Quran is not scientific so literally it is just a book for laymen to pray fast and charity and some ancient history... So be happy with it...
But I am not you... I am someone who take quran verses seriously so that I can deduce the reality what it speaks... So that I can understand Godliness behind this..
Bro.. How do you know that this Quran is from God? Is it coz verses of Salat or verses of fasting or haj? Why you accept Quran is from God.. Is it coz in Quran itself God says I revealed it? What makes you believe that Quran is from God...
Or you don't have time and you are busy for a better life and meantime just want to have some faith so that you hope you are safe...
Well.. I don't know what your situation but if it is you then not me.. I am researcher until I get convinced with all possible verses which talks about nature... Yeah you may call me egocentric.. Coz one who debate doesn't give up so it is so natural on the eyes of others who give up...
Which fool will accept an ancient book claiming to be from God unless he verifies all possible statemnts in it.. Coz we are not ancient people.. We are living at time where we can verify many a glaring verses by using real science and logic...
So bro... You end your journey but I won't.. My journey will continue in sha Allah coz I am a hunter of truth ..
Strangley you say Quran is not a book which talks about science but guidance... Boy.. Why you you want to take from a book guidance if you don't know it is from God or not... Well had I lived at a time Messengers performed super natural things then I can immediately believe in books they brought coz already signs have come.. Or else Allah blessed with mercy towards guidance..
Why I am working hard is coz I have already believed in God.. No U Turn... And I have taken this book as from God... So I explore to perceive the greatness of God within the book and its verses... So you call it adament... Lol.. You are lazy bro... But not me..
With God's verses I am not saying Ac machine is wrong.. With God's book I am not saying computer is wrong.. Coz Allah didn't literally create them but human... Yes Allah gave knowledge.. But creator is human.. I don't care... That's not my research...
My research is nature.. God created earth and heavens and not human created them... So human speaks about earth and heavens is he wish but God speaks about His creations with reality... Who can speak in utmost truth rather than the Creator... Can these puppets of scientists positioned in NASA can speak the truth beyond God...
I don't seem any resemblance of what God speaks and what scientist speak... That's why I raise my voice.. For that I research what scientist speak and what Allah speaks and what is logic out of both...
Is that looking ego to you? Coz you can't do this job.. You are tired.. You don't want.. You love life... But I love truth... You don't care about truth..you prefer leave it to expert.. Who is expert in earth and heavens subject rather than the Creator Himself and His book and it's explanation .. Sorry.. I am saying it with intent coz I have known you since we have communicated privately many times..
Have you ever thought God says He assigned phases for Moon while Earth alao has phases according to science.. And many a planets have phases.. God's creation He explains let me study it and let me study what people say also do let me decide who speaks the truth.. Is that ego? That's a word of a lazy person who doesn't like truth at all.. But satisfied just for the sake of nothing.. Or is the word of human so strong when it comes to creations subject so you dare not to question them? How can you question them coz you have already accepted their theories.. But God's verses you have no idea...
Thank you... Yes chears.. Enjoy with what you believe..
So God is void of science and He doesn't know to put science in His book... Strange assumption... That's why you fearlessly call QURAN has no science.
Peace jkhan.
You say, quote:
"Did you forget that the size of Earth is four times almost in contrast to the Moon... @fuse.. I know why sky get blue, I don't deny... @GL well I know why Sun gets orange when setting and rising and why not it makes clouds even to that golden colours..."
Well ,what is the problem then? What has the size of the earth compared to the moon got to do with the orange glow that reflects onto the moon at the eclipse?
That glow is on the atmosphere facing the moon . The earth atmosphere surrounds it , so the part of the earth atmosphere facing the moon is the one with the golden colour that gets reflected by the moon.
Like that picture at the top left and its reflection of the red glow on the water it remains ,many minutes after the sun sets
GOD bless you.
Peace.
Quote from: good logic on February 21, 2023, 02:45:11 AM
Peace jkhan.
You say, quote:
"Did you forget that the size of Earth is four times almost in contrast to the Moon... @fuse.. I know why sky get blue, I don't deny... @GL well I know why Sun gets orange when setting and rising and why not it makes clouds even to that golden colours..."
Well ,what is the problem then? What has the size of the earth compared to the moon got to do with the orange glow that reflects onto the moon at the eclipse?
That glow is on the atmosphere facing the moon . The earth atmosphere surrounds it , so the part of the earth atmosphere facing the moon is the one with the golden colour that gets reflected by the moon.
Like that picture at the top left and its reflection of the red glow on the water it remains ,many minutes after the sun sets
GOD bless you.
Peace.
Peace brother GL
Well... Unfortunately your inability understand the science that you have already accepted is obviously depicting from what you ask above .. Can't help dude.. At least think in this way...
Imgine if the size of the Moon is 4 times bigger than the Earth and reflect the scenario on a full solar eclipse (totality) the consequences... So why not reflect what happens to moon when earth is already four times bigger during Lunar eclipse...
On top of that since is not something can call phenomena... But real... Just coz they say by word of Phenomanal it is not but God's creation and is real. Just hide the truth using word Phrnomanl won't work out..
Earth is in full darkness and sun light on Earth during Lunar eclipse totality... Earth has nothing to give to moon as stated under..
No 01.. Earth's side exposed to Moon is darkness..
No. 02.. Dark shadow of Earth won't create light while Earth itself in darkness..
No.. 03 Size of Earth which covers Moon is hardly allowing any light sources for moon since only light source for Moon is as accepted by science is Sunlight..
I don't need Phrnomanl answers from science but need scientific and logical answers..
Thank you.
Peace jkhan.
Again you talk about earth, nothing to do with earth the reflection of the red glow unto the moon. You say, quote:
"arth is in full darkness and sun light on Earth during Lunar eclipse totality... Earth has nothing to give to moon as stated under..
No 01.. Earth's side exposed to Moon is darkness..
No. 02.. Dark shadow of Earth won't create light while Earth itself in darkness..
No.. 03 Size of Earth which covers Moon is hardly allowing any light sources for moon since only light source for Moon is as accepted by science is Sunlight"
The sun light hitting the earth atmosphere that contains clouds,mist-water droplets- ...etc this gives the red glow that in turn is reflected by the moon.Like the case for sunsets and sunrises.
Simple and logical brother.
GOD bless you.
Peace.
Quote from: good logic on February 21, 2023, 07:04:55 AM
Peace jkhan.
Again you talk about earth, nothing to do with earth the reflection of the red glow unto the moon. You say, quote:
"arth is in full darkness and sun light on Earth during Lunar eclipse totality... Earth has nothing to give to moon as stated under..
No 01.. Earth's side exposed to Moon is darkness..
No. 02.. Dark shadow of Earth won't create light while Earth itself in darkness..
No.. 03 Size of Earth which covers Moon is hardly allowing any light sources for moon since only light source for Moon is as accepted by science is Sunlight"
The sun light hitting the earth atmosphere that contains clouds,mist-water droplets- ...etc this gives the red glow that in turn is reflected by the moon.Like the case for sunsets and sunrises.
Simple and logical brother.
GOD bless you.
Peace.
Peace GL...
How fragile you are in your belief of science.. Sorry.. You have no idea what you utter... Have you? If you have you won't repeat the blue sky water droplets, clouds bla bla... Just by saying simple and logical it won't become as you say... Coz you don't at all speak logical here..
Let me at least explain what reality and science is and which makes logic...
Is sky blue at night? It are clouds glowing on a moonless night.. ? Why sky is blue during day time only.?
No other light can make the sky blue but Sun light.. That also not every part or rather every layer of skies (samawathi) but only the layer which God has given its function... In this layer full of gas molecules and when glare or radiance of sunlight falls it gives that layer complete bluish colour... For people who see from down it makes almost everything behind it invisible unless it has its own light... This layer remains in the sky forever... At night this layer will not remain bluish since devoid of sunlight, and it will never get bluish coz of moon light or any other light... If night sky and atmosphere itself in darkness, from where the hell the moon get its glow... For moon to glow no properties except Moon has its own light... Well without knowing to anyone you gradually started saying some other sources not the direct sunlight which glows the moon but water droplets clouds etc but you forgot no sunlight on them.. How nonsensical that is.. Are you really convinced to claim that it is so simple and logical? You can't even elaborate it how it works and but proud to say so simple and logical.. God knows hearts of people what they speak of...
Well.. I gave three points and they are more than enough to nullify any point.. Again see the picture if you want..
(https://i.postimg.cc/8CFpYvxS/IMG-20230220-061949.jpg)
Just look at picture opening both your eyes pls... The side of the Earth exposed to moon is in NIGHT and not day time for you to say water particles and clouds bla bla... What nonsense.. Clouds lighting the moon :rotfl:.. Pls bring something better next time or say you have no knowledge.. That's worthy..
Hang on... I make your job more simpler... Imagine above picture is Solar eclipse totality... But just change the names... Instead of Earth call it Moon.. And instead of Moon call it Earth. ..got it... Now during solar eclipse wgat happens.. Huge land mass gets under darkness... But here it is different. Coz size of Moon FOUR times bigger than Earth. Well.. Then instead of part of Earth being in darkness it literally make entire side of Earth in darkness .. Four times bigger means 8 times of its actual size.. That's hypothetical but you reject actual... Funny isn't it...? I wonder you got me or not.. Whatever...
Quote from: jkhan on February 10, 2023, 11:00:31 PM
35:41 "Indeed, Allah holds the heavens (samawati) and the Earth(Ard), lest they(both dual) move. And if they(both dual) should move, no one could hold them(both dual) after Him. Indeed, He is Forbearing and Forgiving."
Peace everyone...
Let me clear one thing... My intention to specifically to those who believe is to make you reflect or make you yourself question in case you are 100% satisfied with scientific explanation of Earth and Heavens... Pls leave some space for truth and don't seal your thoughts... Is everything what they say is without any ambiguity is correct when you read Quran verses or you prefer their explanations over Quran verses...
Reflect brothers and sisters... Don't close your thoughts when it comes to quran and its true meaning. Question yourself whether what you have accepted is what indeed God has created... In case if not then remember below verses also...
"Do Not pursue in which you have no knowledge of...... "
"And those (true Ibadi Allah) do not bear Witness to Falsehood...... ..... "
So all I have to say is ensure you are not one of those who Witness to falsehood and thus Pursue in which you have simply No knowledge....
For instance.. If you bear witness that they landed on Moon as you have already done and if it is Falsehood then imagine ...
Probably out of ego you may say.. Well same to me.. In case they landed... I never bear witness in which I have no knowledge.. But you guys bearing witness as if you have no doubt at all as if you see your own child. .
God is witness that He sent down this Quran with truth... So find out the truth and chase falsehood... Strive hard for that... Falsehood will ever vanish... For that falsehood should exist in the first place.. Eradicating falsehood is not an easy subject either..
Everybody knows majority will perish... Every believer knows if we follow the path of majority they will divert from the path of God... But they have limited the verse for what they like... Path of God is complete Quran... Not restricted for rituals..
So if Allah has mentioned the width of Earth and heavens are equal as per 3:133 what makes you reject it and take something else as true.. Only reason is majority.. Nothing else...
I have no benefit... But anyone who read this cannot say that I was not aware when God questions or nobody warned us...
I will keep reminding in sha Allah... Believers would reflect within Quran what exactly God has created and what reality is..
Just relax or relieve what your acceptance already and be neutral and read Quran verses and compare science.. Perhaps Allah will you will get what God has created...
When Moses probably 3000 plus years before went to King pharou and told My Lord is the one who created Earth and heavens and whatever between them (dual), would anyone expect earth is spinning... Would musa speak of what he had no knowledge of... He spoke what he knew.. What he knew was manifest... But we after all these years not realising the truth while having eyes walking unfortunately with blindfold in eyes...
Thank you...
Peace jkhan.
This is your translation/understanding of 53:41,quote
"35:41 "Indeed, Allah holds the heavens (samawati) and the Earth(Ard), lest they(both dual) move. And if they(both dual) should move, no one could hold them(both dual) after Him. Indeed, He is Forbearing and Forgiving.""
I will give mine and compare,
25:2
الَّذى لَهُ مُلكُ السَّمٰوٰتِ وَالأَرضِ وَلَم يَتَّخِذ وَلَدًا وَلَم يَكُن لَهُ شَريكٌ فِى المُلكِ وَخَلَقَ كُلَّ شَىءٍ فَقَدَّرَهُ تَقديرًاا
The One to whom belongs all sovereignty of the heavens and the earth. He never had a son, nor does He have any partners in sovereignty. He created everything in exact measure; He precisely designed everything.*
GOD does the plan precisely measured and with fundamental laws to keep it going
GOD also mentions the earth specifically with all the heavens-Samawat-Why?
Because only earth was specially created for us.,like when we launch astronauts into space, we measure precisely the amount of food, water, oxygen, and other needs throughout the journey. Similarly, God has launched us into space - on board spaceship Earth - and He has designed all kinds of renewable provisions for us and other creatures, a perfect design. Think, for example, of the symbiotic relationship between us and the plants; we use the oxygen they produce in photosynthesis, while they use the carbon dioxide we produce in respiration. Mini factories ,impossible for any one to come up with
GOD confirms this by asking us why we take on other gods/idols that cannot initiate anything - they can only use or make other things from what GOD has already created for them - ,they lack knowledge and means? 25:3:
:
Yet, they set up beside Him gods who do not create anything - they themselves are created - and who possess no power to even harm or benefit themselves, nor do they possess any power to control life, or death, or resurrection.
وَاتَّخَذوا مِن دونِهِ ءالِهَةً لا يَخلُقونَ شَيـًٔا وَهُم يُخلَقونَ وَلا يَملِكونَ لِأَنفُسِهِم ضَرًّا وَلا نَفعًا وَلا يَملِكونَ مَوتًا وَلا حَيوٰةً وَلا نُشورًا
So in the same context GOD in Surah 35-The initiator- says this:
Praise be to God, Initiator of the heavens and the earth, and appointer of the angels to be messengers..(.-Sujud to Adam ,like drive the forces and laws of GOD to keep the weather, , the mini factories of GOD are going and the whole system of the universe going with placing of galaxies, stars and planets with gravity and distances all planned and calculated)-. He increases the creation as He wills. God is Omnipotent.
الحَمدُ لِلَّهِ فاطِرِ السَّمٰوٰتِ وَالأَرضِ جاعِلِ المَلٰئِكَةِ رُسُلًا أُولى أَجنِحَةٍ مَثنىٰ وَثُلٰثَ وَرُبٰعَ يَزيدُ فِى الخَلقِ ما يَشاءُ إِنَّ اللَّهَ عَلىٰ كُلِّ شَىءٍ قَديرٌ
Then He asks us the same question,why take on other gods that cannot initiate any creation,here
35:40
Say, "Consider the idols you have set up beside God; show me what on earth have they created." Do they own any partnership in the heavens? Have we given them a book wherein there is no doubt? Indeed, what the transgressors promise one another is no more than an illusion.
قُل أَرَءَيتُم شُرَكاءَكُمُ الَّذينَ تَدعونَ مِن دونِ اللَّهِ أَرونى ماذا خَلَقوا مِنَ الأَرضِ أَم لَهُم شِركٌ فِى السَّمٰوٰتِ أَم ءاتَينٰهُم كِتٰبًا فَهُم عَلىٰ بَيِّنَتٍ مِنهُ بَل إِن يَعِدُ الظّٰلِمونَ بَعضُهُم بَعضًا إِلّا غُرورًا
Then ,my take on 35:41:
God is the One who holds the heavens and the earth, lest they fall apart/ vanish -He has the laws and know how,like gravity laws, distance and placement, life on earth...-. If anyone else is to hold them/ keep them functioning, they will most certainly fall apart/ vanish- They do not have the knowledge and understanding of how to hold them/ keep them going . He is Clement, Forgiving.( For example Without gravity-GOD s law- the solar system will collapse...)
إِنَّ اللَّهَ يُمسِكُ السَّمٰوٰتِ وَالأَرضَ أَن تَزولا وَلَئِن زالَتا إِن أَمسَكَهُما مِن أَحَدٍ مِن بَعدِهِ إِنَّهُ كانَ حَليمًا غَفورًا
Look at the universe and he placement of galaxies,stars, planets and how each system runs in an orbit. The placement of earth exactly at the right distance from the sun and placing the solar system at the calmest and safest place of our milky way galaxy and the precise orbits of each planet ...etc. Gravity is what keeps everything going and at a safe distance from each other
Only GOD has the precise laws and knowledge and is constantly updating and looking after His creations.
Of course ,my understanding.
But you are also entitled to your understanding brother.
GOD bless you .
Peace
Quote from: good logic on February 24, 2023, 08:28:00 AM
Peace jkhan.
This is your translation/understanding of 53:41,quote
"35:41 "Indeed, Allah holds the heavens (samawati) and the Earth(Ard), lest they(both dual) move. And if they(both dual) should move, no one could hold them(both dual) after Him. Indeed, He is Forbearing and Forgiving.""
I will give mine and compare,
25:2
الَّذى لَهُ مُلكُ السَّمٰوٰتِ وَالأَرضِ وَلَم يَتَّخِذ وَلَدًا وَلَم يَكُن لَهُ شَريكٌ فِى المُلكِ وَخَلَقَ كُلَّ شَىءٍ فَقَدَّرَهُ تَقديرًاا
The One to whom belongs all sovereignty of the heavens and the earth. He never had a son, nor does He have any partners in sovereignty. He created everything in exact measure; He precisely designed everything.*
GOD does the plan precisely measured and with fundamental laws to keep it going
GOD also mentions the earth specifically with all the heavens-Samawat-Why?
Because only earth was specially created for us.,like when we launch astronauts into space, we measure precisely the amount of food, water, oxygen, and other needs throughout the journey. Similarly, God has launched us into space - on board spaceship Earth - and He has designed all kinds of renewable provisions for us and other creatures, a perfect design. Think, for example, of the symbiotic relationship between us and the plants; we use the oxygen they produce in photosynthesis, while they use the carbon dioxide we produce in respiration. Mini factories ,impossible for any one to come up with
GOD confirms this by asking us why we take on other gods/idols that cannot initiate anything - they can only use or make other things from what GOD has already created for them - ,they lack knowledge and means? 25:3:
:
Yet, they set up beside Him gods who do not create anything - they themselves are created - and who possess no power to even harm or benefit themselves, nor do they possess any power to control life, or death, or resurrection.
وَاتَّخَذوا مِن دونِهِ ءالِهَةً لا يَخلُقونَ شَيـًٔا وَهُم يُخلَقونَ وَلا يَملِكونَ لِأَنفُسِهِم ضَرًّا وَلا نَفعًا وَلا يَملِكونَ مَوتًا وَلا حَيوٰةً وَلا نُشورًا
So in the same context GOD in Surah 35-The initiator- says this:
Praise be to God, Initiator of the heavens and the earth, and appointer of the angels to be messengers..(.-Sujud to Adam ,like drive the forces and laws of GOD to keep the weather, , the mini factories of GOD are going and the whole system of the universe going with placing of galaxies, stars and planets with gravity and distances all planned and calculated)-. He increases the creation as He wills. God is Omnipotent.
الحَمدُ لِلَّهِ فاطِرِ السَّمٰوٰتِ وَالأَرضِ جاعِلِ المَلٰئِكَةِ رُسُلًا أُولى أَجنِحَةٍ مَثنىٰ وَثُلٰثَ وَرُبٰعَ يَزيدُ فِى الخَلقِ ما يَشاءُ إِنَّ اللَّهَ عَلىٰ كُلِّ شَىءٍ قَديرٌ
Then He asks us the same question,why take on other gods that cannot initiate any creation,here
35:40
Say, "Consider the idols you have set up beside God; show me what on earth have they created." Do they own any partnership in the heavens? Have we given them a book wherein there is no doubt? Indeed, what the transgressors promise one another is no more than an illusion.
قُل أَرَءَيتُم شُرَكاءَكُمُ الَّذينَ تَدعونَ مِن دونِ اللَّهِ أَرونى ماذا خَلَقوا مِنَ الأَرضِ أَم لَهُم شِركٌ فِى السَّمٰوٰتِ أَم ءاتَينٰهُم كِتٰبًا فَهُم عَلىٰ بَيِّنَتٍ مِنهُ بَل إِن يَعِدُ الظّٰلِمونَ بَعضُهُم بَعضًا إِلّا غُرورًا
Then ,my take on 35:41:
God is the One who holds the heavens and the earth, lest they fall apart/ vanish -He has the laws and know how,like gravity laws, distance and placement, life on earth...-. If anyone else is to hold them/ keep them functioning, they will most certainly fall apart/ vanish- They do not have the knowledge and understanding of how to hold them/ keep them going . He is Clement, Forgiving.( For example Without gravity-GOD s law- the solar system will collapse...)
إِنَّ اللَّهَ يُمسِكُ السَّمٰوٰتِ وَالأَرضَ أَن تَزولا وَلَئِن زالَتا إِن أَمسَكَهُما مِن أَحَدٍ مِن بَعدِهِ إِنَّهُ كانَ حَليمًا غَفورًا
Look at the universe and he placement of galaxies,stars, planets and how each system runs in an orbit. The placement of earth exactly at the right distance from the sun and placing the solar system at the calmest and safest place of our milky way galaxy and the precise orbits of each planet ...etc. Gravity is what keeps everything going and at a safe distance from each other
Only GOD has the precise laws and knowledge and is constantly updating and looking after His creations.
Of course ,my understanding.
But you are also entitled to your understanding brother.
GOD bless you .
Peace
Peace GL...
First be neutral and access Quran... Holding another book as truth and just browsing in Quran you won't find truth in it..
Below your fragile thoughts unfortunately..
«««GOD also mentions the earth specifically with all the heavens-Samawat-Why?
Because only earth was specially created for uslike when we launch astronauts into space, we measure precisely the amount of food, water, oxygen, and other needs throughout the journey. Similarly, God has launched us into space - on board spaceship Earth - «««
Brother God didn't create Earth only specifically... What's wrong with your senses.. Gof created Earth and heavens specifically for us...
without heveans, the Earth is nothing... In a nutshell everything God created in Earth will vanish without being able to survive on long run.. ..
When God Himself reiterate everywhere that He created Heavens and Earth for us why you denigrade God's verses by saying God created Earth for us specially...
They are two massive bodies.. They never one... They were together before creations took place but not one but they were two.. That's why God called both of them... And even God says neither Earth nor Heavens wept after destruction of certain community...
Gof Himself segregate on the day of Resurrection Earth will be in His fist and Heavens will be rolled in his right hand... God could have simply said Universe will be in His hand.. They are two brothers and separate... 4 days took for earth and two days for heavens.. Coz they are two not one... Just go with the flow of God's verses.. I have brought all in the past ..
If God created Earth for us specially then it is a big blasphemy agaisnt God's verses.. What a shameful example you gave to substantiate it.. Astronaut and their stuff... So earth is enough?
God kept the sama so high (A'ala) with reason... So that He can keep all seven heavens functions within them precisely. ...
Well reflect.. When it comes to floating or movement.. God has manifestly said sun and moon they all float in proportioned manner for a specific term.. Nothing overtake.. Nothing derail.. And they all are subjected and they won't change their path... And again there is nothing to say about them as fall apart.. We can clearly see sun moon and stars all celestial bodies are moving... And they are well placed and and proportioned.. They never change their path... As it was created and commanded and they are same... God had guaranteed that.. No falling apart.. God has well positioned until the Hour do occur.. Note well these celestial bodies not at all Heavens... They are IN THE HEAVENS.. Like mountains on the earth..
That's why God Says in 35:41 Earth and heavens are static.. No-one can hold them if they both are to move.. If the heavens and earth are static only the celestial bodies can float as proportioned..
Look at verse 22:65 why would Allah hold the (Sama) sky from falling on the Earth as if everything of the universe gonna fall on earth only.. Is earth so massive compared to universe to fall entire sky on Earth for God to hold from falling.. ... Had Allah said holding the moon falling apart on the Earth... At least we can deduce .. On the other hand, can't earth fall on to Jupiter or any other star.. Word used in 35:41 is (Zula-Move) and in 22:65 is (Tha'ka-Fall down)..
Allah will not let the solid construction built as canopy to fall on the Earth..
Why Allah didn't mention He holds (Sama) from falling on the Earth and holding Earth faling on Sama... Reflect...
Again Allah holds the Earth and heavens from moving...35:41 And Allah holds heavens (only) from falling on the Earth 22:65.. Coz it is same size and pilar less...
Thank you..
Peace jkhan.
You are assuming "Samaa" always has only one meaning. Brother, Qoran has context , and GOD s words have a range of meanings according to the context.
Again, we need to compare the verses and subject by looking at the context . See another example, from what you say, that do not make sense here , you say,quote:
"Look at verse 22:65 why would Allah hold the (Sama) sky from falling on the Earth as if everything of the universe gonna fall on earth only.. Is earth so massive compared to universe to fall entire sky on Earth for God to hold from falling.. ... "
For me,the following explanation/translation of 22:65 makes more sense and does not contradict logic, facts and other verses:
"Do you not see that God has committed in your service everything on earth? The ships run in the ocean by His command. He prevents the heavenly bodies from crashing onto the earth, except in accordance with His command. God is Most Kind towards the people, Most Merciful.
أَلَم تَرَ أَنَّ اللَّهَ سَخَّرَ لَكُم ما فِى الأَرضِ وَالفُلكَ تَجرى فِى البَحرِ بِأَمرِهِ وَيُمسِكُ السَّماءَ أَن تَقَعَ عَلَى الأَرضِ إِلّا بِإِذنِهِ إِنَّ اللَّهَ بِالنّاسِ لَرَءوفٌ رَحيمٌ
The subject here is what GOD has provided for us on earth, including our safety to live on earth as long as the determined time runs its course without some comet or big planet crashing into us and destroying the earth completely with everything on it without His authorisation/command.. GOD controls everything..
You also need to reflect . Or does it not make sense to you?
GOD bless you.
Peace.
Quote from: good logic on February 25, 2023, 12:12:18 AM
Peace jkhan.
You are assuming "Samaa" always has only one meaning. Brother, Qoran has context , and GOD s words have a range of meanings according to the context.
Again, we need to compare the verses and subject by looking at the context . See another example, from what you say, that do not make sense here , you say,quote:
"Look at verse 22:65 why would Allah hold the (Sama) sky from falling on the Earth as if everything of the universe gonna fall on earth only.. Is earth so massive compared to universe to fall entire sky on Earth for God to hold from falling.. ... "
For me,the following explanation/translation of 22:65 makes more sense and does not contradict logic, facts and other verses:
"Do you not see that God has committed in your service everything on earth? The ships run in the ocean by His command. He prevents the heavenly bodies from crashing onto the earth, except in accordance with His command. God is Most Kind towards the people, Most Merciful.
أَلَم تَرَ أَنَّ اللَّهَ سَخَّرَ لَكُم ما فِى الأَرضِ وَالفُلكَ تَجرى فِى البَحرِ بِأَمرِهِ وَيُمسِكُ السَّماءَ أَن تَقَعَ عَلَى الأَرضِ إِلّا بِإِذنِهِ إِنَّ اللَّهَ بِالنّاسِ لَرَءوفٌ رَحيمٌ
The subject here is what GOD has provided for us on earth, including our safety to live on earth as long as the determined time runs its course without some comet or big planet crashing into us and destroying the earth completely with everything on it without His authorisation/command.. GOD controls everything..
You also need to reflect . Or does it not make sense to you?
GOD bless you.
Peace.
That's the issue with you.. Allah has not at all mentioned Heavenly bodies but He has mentioned singalar SAMA... Allha has clearly said in other verses He has raised the Heaven so High... That's the SAMA He is holding..
Two different type of explanation in 35:41 and 22:65 ... One is without moving He is holding but both The earth and Heavens... The other explanation is from falling down to THE EARTH specifically ... He doesn't need to say falling down to the earth... Just He could have said from faling... So we can imagine collapse of Solar system... But His explanation is unique.
The massiveness of Earth is well depicted by God's verses... If it is to fall it will fall only on Earth and nowhere else... Allah here never talks about sun moon or stars... They will never fall and they are floating objects which are gases and less than the weight of earth's immediate atmosphere..
But Heaven is a structure and mighty and has doors and so high and strong.. Anyone who near of Jinn are chased.. That body Allah holds from falling to the Earth... Sun and moon and stars are nothing compared to the size of Earth...
Allah never uses Heaven or heaven to sun moon or stars... Coz correctly confirms that He placed Feeha (in heaven) the sun and moon.. Allah has decreed for celestial objects its path... But Earth and heaven Allah called them to come willingly or unwillingly with intent... But they came willingly... But Allah got the grasp of both of them without moving... Both Earth and Heaven are not given their own freedom to move after that... Grip is in God's clutch..
Note.. If solar system collapse or universe collapse it won't fall on earth.. What is earth for everything to fall on us.. But reality is Earth is as big as Heavens.. 3:133 ...
Thank you...
Additional verse for reflecting..
30:25 "And among His signs is that the Heaven (sama-singular) and Earth stand (Thakum) by His Command..
These are manifest verses but blinded your thoughts coz you have already accepted another book so all your imaginations going towards that book of theory with verses of God... These both Heaven and Earth are not moving brother they are static...
3:133 And hasten to forgiveness from your Lord and a garden (Janna) width of It(janna) the heavens(samawati) and Earth (Ard), prepared for the righteous
Salam again..
Okay people... I have never got any tangible and logical answer from anyone for the above verse based on which only I even initiated this topic...
So fellow believers... What does this verse in fact say... Does this verse go anywhere near to what you have accepted as universe... What ambiguity is hidden in this verse.. Nothing very manifest verse God openly promises for believers...
A Janna is intended to be given...
Do you think God doesn't know actual size of Earth and HEAVENS (SAMAWATHI) to say so.. Or are you or hearts not ready to accept God's verses..?
For to further simplify I attach what universe is..
(https://i.postimg.cc/C5R94JXx/IMG-20230226-151408.jpg)
(https://i.postimg.cc/bvNPt0ys/IMG-20230226-151428.jpg)
So what is Heavens in the verse? God has prepared a Janna equal to the size of Earth and then what?
Can anyone pls explain your absolute understanding pls without any ambiguity...
Thank you...
Peace jkhan.
Regarding 3:133,quote:
"3:133 And hasten to forgiveness from your Lord and a garden (Janna) width of It(janna) the heavens(samawati) and Earth (Ard), prepared for the righteous"
How can we understand "width" if we take it as a measure of length? It will make no sense because the measure of a place whether big or small is irrelevant if we do not have access to its limits. So the width in the verse is talking about its limitation.
We have limitations living here on earth,the most we can do is travel through it and maybe even go as far as the moon or mars cannot settle there yet,if ever,,so in reality we are confined to the width of the earth mostly ,may be even to one or two other planets in our solar system. We have a limit and cannot go beyond that limit.
3:133 says "Janna" has a bigger limit for those that will inherit it. The width of the limit is as big as the "samawat + the Ard"
In other words we are in an open prison if you think about it. Over there ,the lucky ones will be free and there will be no limit to their domain.
For example is there a limit to where the Angels go now? They are on a domain that is limitless ,at least the width of our universe or bigger.
GOD bless you.
Peace.