Author Topic: Yield or prostrate to Adam?  (Read 1185 times)

hawk99

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Re: Yield or prostrate to Adam?
« Reply #40 on: August 04, 2019, 05:20:12 PM »
@ Gl

Whats if your father told same story every year with different updated versions every single year about your late grandfather.


Peace Imran

I think that would invalidate good logic's first conclusion.

Quote:
1-Accept it-   Because you trust your father that he always tells you the truth through
your experience living with him. and his knowledge and thorough research. and it
makes sense to you logically and factually.

Satan is metaphorical.


Peace Cerberus are you referring to Iblis?

The secret to monotheism can be found in the garden

imrankhawaja

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Re: Yield or prostrate to Adam?
« Reply #41 on: August 04, 2019, 06:09:48 PM »
Peace Imran

I think that would invalidate good logic's first conclusion.

Quote:
1-Accept it-   Because you trust your father that he always tells you the truth through
your experience living with him. and his knowledge and thorough research. and it
makes sense to you logically and factually.


Peace hawk,

I think its not about the invalidity of his first and second conclusion,,,

Becoz its not the story of our father ==> Adam but its the story of the father of our FATHERS...

So all our fathers only telling us biography not the auto-biography whats been written by father adam himself hence his both points are already invalidate as per situation in hand..

Becoz the fathers all of them have different versions from time to time.

I tend to agree with cerberus metaphorical approach towards this historical character make much more sense.
Not only that character but i felt all that story is metaphorical.

good logic

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Re: Yield or prostrate to Adam?
« Reply #42 on: August 05, 2019, 05:18:28 AM »
Does metaphorical only exist in our mind? Or can it be real but unseen?

It seems we turn thoughts/ideas that are in our mind to reality sometimes.

The power that Cerberus is talking about must be real otherwise it should not lead to wickedness .

Iblis whether real or metaphorical is playing the part in reality. Just what Qoran implies.
GOD bless.
Peace.
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huruf

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Re: Yield or prostrate to Adam?
« Reply #43 on: August 05, 2019, 05:22:05 AM »
b-l-s is the root of Ibliis. What ibliis is should be clear from the root.

Salaam


Cerberus

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Re: Yield or prostrate to Adam?
« Reply #44 on: August 06, 2019, 02:24:36 AM »
Yes, iblis "the satan".

Metaphorical as in we can't understand "satan" and how it relates to us and how it moves us into action by just reading the stories. One must think and do a lot of self-inquiry specially since people will easily point fingers at "satan" whatever that is to them, while possibly being moved by satan. How can you avoid something you don't know how it operates in relation to you ? How to separate You from You affected by satan ?

good logic

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Re: Yield or prostrate to Adam?
« Reply #45 on: August 06, 2019, 04:57:33 AM »
In other words brother Cerberus Iblis is real. Whether we understand it or not is another issue.

What I mean is that we need to be aware of Iblis and to beware Iblis both.
At the end of the day we need to realise our power is independent of Iblis and we only have ourselves to blame. The buck stops with us not Iblis.
Iblis may be doing his job, but we should also do ours. Iblis cannot benefit or harm us if we only realise.

There is a difference between someone inviting you to do things(your mind/Iblis....) and someone putting a gun to your head demanding you should do certain things. Iblis does the former., hence the blame can only be on us.
GOD bless you.
Peace.
TOTAL LOYALTY TO GOD ALONE.   IN GOD I TRUST

38:65″ Say:? I warn you; There is no other god beside GOD, the One, the Supreme.?

 http://www.total-loyalty-to-god-alone.co.uk/website-pages/good-logic/

huruf

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Re: Yield or prostrate to Adam?
« Reply #46 on: August 06, 2019, 05:11:49 AM »
Aztecs used to celebrate marriage by making the newly married spend something like six days living together without having secual relationship. The ground for this was that there absolutely nothing wrong with sexuals relations, they ar enot dirty, they are pleasurable and no reaosn for not enjoying them, but what is always, always wrong is to loose comand of oneself. Ler oneself be led into something that tempts but one should not do or not want to do but might do out of lack of self comand. This marriage clause was there to make that get a firm foothold on the people's minds. loosing self command wa sloosing human dignity which was sacred as we are made out of God's mercy.

Salaam

Jafar

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Re: Yield or prostrate to Adam?
« Reply #47 on: August 06, 2019, 10:18:39 AM »
Or like this:

GOD:   Are you choosing to disobey?

Iblis:   I am special. I am the one who should be obeyed. I am the best of your creatures.

GOD:   Well. you already know the consequences of your arrogance. Rebels do not belong to my kingdom. You have made your decision and you accept the outcome.

Iblis:  Many of your humans will also be arrogant rebels . Just wait and see.

This conversation with God thingy is actually among the ridiculous part of the Quran story yet the interesting part on this thread. :))

First congratulations on writing the conversations above, it has clearly prove on how easy it is to write such tales.. ;)))

But there is a more 'realistic' flow of the story..

GOD:   Are you choosing to disobey?
Iblis (or whom/whatever): Are you not all powerful and all controlling? How could any of your creature possible to disobey your direction?

GOD:   Well. you already know the consequences of your arrogance. Rebels do not belong to my kingdom.
Iblis (or whom/whatever): For God's sake.. you're a God... tell me please.... educate me.. how to start rebellion against you? how it is even possible??? And where could I go since all space and time is within your kingdom???

The logicality of  rebelling / disobeying against God is as if:
- Dracula starting a rebellion against Bram Stoker
- Harry Potter starting a rebellion against JK Rowling
- Sauron starting a rebellion against JRR Tolkien
- Mario brothers starting a rebellion against Shigeru Miyamoto
- Spiderman starting a rebellion against Stan Lee
- Anakin Skywalker starting a rebellion against George Lucas
- Aladin starting a rebellion against Hanna Diyab
- Mickey Mouse starting a rebellion against Walt Disney

Especially now since the true God has revealed that even time and space itself is a creation!

It's all 'virtual'.. this entire universe and all of it's creation (including Iblis if he/she/it exist) are kind of simulation. A universe which is similar to Star Wars universe created by George Lucas or Middle Earth universe created by JRR Tolkien. A God who created this simulation universe is most definitely in control of all things!! Just like Tolkien is in control of all events happening in Middle Earth / Lord Of The Rings trilogy!
A rebellion against something who are also outside of this universe and in total control of it is definitely impossible!

Quote from: imrankhawaja
Satan was nevev been absent brother jafar, also may b hes reading our post and laughing on us how popular he is like celeberity even in negetive role hes successful more fan followers in history than any celebrity ever have   >:D

We see hell of entertainment in all stories versions

Yes this Iblis, Devil, Satan, a trickster figure seems to be among the favorite character of middle eastern story tellers (Sumer, Judah, Christian, Islam) and his/her/it actual role evolves through time. Similar trickster figure also exist in other paganistic traditions, such as nordic mythology, celts mythology, Greek mythology...




imrankhawaja

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Re: Yield or prostrate to Adam?
« Reply #48 on: August 09, 2019, 04:18:56 PM »

Yes this Iblis, Devil, Satan, a trickster figure seems to be among the favorite character of middle eastern story tellers (Sumer, Judah, Christian, Islam) and his/her/it actual role evolves through time. Similar trickster figure also exist in other paganistic traditions, such as nordic mythology, celts mythology, Greek mythology...


even a little care and little know-how of understanding language can tell us lot more myths...

example look at the root and the sources of root make me laugh for a minute , perhaps you will help me out what others cant becoz they are unable to understand at the first place..lets start from here...

ابليس [A name of Satan]
his former name being = (AZAZEEL).. source = lanelexicon but from where mr edward lane got that information about his previous name did satan visit him personally telling mr lane that was my name before the title ibless  :rotfl:

according to corpus ابليس is personal noun of masculine gender form..

now come to the root...

Ba-Lam-Siin = i m gona do the breakup of all root meanings what also contradict with eachother .. example mournful is the opposite of silent  :rotfl:

1 despair = losing hope
2 give up hope,

3 become broken (in spirit),

4 mournful=  if mournful then meanings no 5 is in contradictory position..
5 become silent/confounded/perplexed unable to see right way or course,

6 repent/grieve = really ?

questions are lot just few apparent issues with the  meanings of that root..
was the name/title given to him after the event ?

did he really repent ?
did he really keep silent himself or mournful ?
did he really lose hope? if he lose hope why he ask for the challenge to start a mission against humanity what he was believing his enemy or proving God you are wrong and i am better than this creation?
as the graphs of today was he right as we see billions of crimes ?

most of the meanings does not match with character what we observe ...

if you ask those questions from experts their answers will be weird and interesting as a fact they only know what corpus/lane/secondary sources are telling them.. poor humanity lol

but brother jafar i feel you must have researched all these things and worked it out somehow share something about those things from where they obtain the meanings, basically i m struggling to find the first sources from where we can get information ? is there any grammer book any arabic language book before 7th century ?

i have an idea is it possible to change the meanings of word and install it in to dictionary ? what we say corruption of language or dictionary..

or whats the link of this word with evil/bad/devil/satan ? look how things get confuse  :hmm

lets do one more imp THING

Shiin-Tay-Nun (root of shaytan) = become distant/far/remote, enter firmly / become firmly fixed therein / penetrate and be concealed, turn away in opposition (from direction/aim), devil, one excessively proud/corrupt, unbelieving/rebellious/insolent/audacious/obstinate/perverse, rope, deep curved well, it burned, became burnt, serpent, any blameable faculty or power of a man..

A vs B got lot of difference and confusion and both A and B used for same individual.. confusion upon confusion