Author Topic: In search of a sincere, guided, believing woman!  (Read 8443 times)

huruf

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Re: In search of a sincere, guided, believing woman!
« Reply #40 on: July 13, 2016, 12:52:53 AM »
Imran, you are a nice person but this questionn seems to shock some metal buildingnot in you i may people.

If a man as opposed to woman is a givern because of that little seed, then the woman is what, whe i facct she brings not only the equivaqlent littl seed, bu also aboslutely all the nourisment for that two seeds to grow and become a nnew human being.

Who is a giver as opposed to the other giver?

If a ale is a giver as opposed to nnothig, fie, but to say that as opposed to te female he is the giver...  please, there are better jokes than that.

The thig is that the differeces between the sexes are plain an perfectly objective and they lay almost absolutely in reproduction, the rest may vary from person to person. But he ideologues have always tried to transform those very objective and plain differences betwen the sexes into something mystical or unmesurable which hs always turned ito make the male the star of creation and the woman a mere appendage for his glory.
And whe somebody puts that into question one gets fed the line of "you ar starting he fight between the sexes".

Really, real men are better than that. They can do without the vanity and come down a few steps to real earth, but that is Ibli, who has bee very successul at making a part of male humanity in nneed of beinng them in turn worshiped by some others who only exist for that worship.

here is a lot of confusion on this arena, but the choice is there, to live in reality a do justice to reality or to live in vanity and figment till death or till God may want you open the eyes to somebody.

Real, non vain men without a need for stardom in fact can be happy, very, very happy.

I all statistical studies I have known women are happier as they get older and men are uhappier as they get older. That should tell somethig.   

Salaam

savage_carrot

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Re: In search of a sincere, guided, believing woman!
« Reply #41 on: July 13, 2016, 05:44:02 AM »
Women give eggs every month. Both give. Case closed.

Quote from: huruf
then there are some who still dare sometimes to say that women want to be like men
That's only when the women don't drool and quiver at them instinctively, or in other words when they aren't weak, in need of protection or as has been put across helpfully in this thread...able to be 'controlled'. These women then get called atypical, manly, butch feminists by some since they dared cross the boundaries set for them...by these hunky men :laugh:
God has a plan, Gaius. He has a plan for everything and everyone.

Adam The Warner

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Re: In search of a sincere, guided, believing woman!
« Reply #42 on: July 13, 2016, 06:58:03 AM »
In search of a sincere guided believing woman who will take the time to actually read the text below!

Question.

"Is it only a part of the book you believe in and you reject the rest?"  (سورة البقرة, Al-Baqara, Chapter #2, Verse #85)

In the prophets will you find an excellent example??Question. Did any of them go to college? If so, what college did Muhammad (SAW) attend? ?. Did any of them read hadith? ?..Did any of them go among the disbelievers to hangout?

"Let not the believers Take for friends or helpers Unbelievers rather than believers: if any do that, in nothing will there be help from Allah: except by way of precaution, that ye may Guard yourselves from them." (سورة آل عمران, Aal-i-Imraan, Chapter #3, Verse #28)

Question. How can you guard yourselves from them if you go to school and work with them?

"They will not fail to corrupt you." (سورة آل عمران, Aal-i-Imraan, Chapter #3, Verse #118)

Question. How can you hangout with them and you?re not corrupt?

"Then we put thee on the (right) Way of Religion: so follow thou that (Way)" (سورة الجاثية, Al-Jaathiya, Chapter #45, Verse #18)

Question. Wouldn?t the right course be following exactly what Allah revealed in the Quran and what the Prophets (SAW) did in the Quran? What are you doing?

"And follow not the path of those who know not." (سورة يونس, Yunus, Chapter #10, Verse #89)

Question. Who told you that you have to go to school to obtain a good job in order to provide for your family, does Allah encourage this in the Quran or are you following the worlds life! (I work from home and am a highschool dropout and Allah is the provider and he provides well through this source. I can teach my wife to work from home if she feels the need that she must work.)

"But when they see some bargain or some amusement, they disperse headlong to it, and leave thee standing. Say: "The (blessing) from the Presence of Allah is better than any amusement or bargain! And Allah is the Best to provide" (سورة الجمعة, Al-Jumu'a, Chapter #62, Verse #11) (Note Allah didn?t say you or college was the best provider.)

"Whoever, forsaking allah, takes satan for a friend, hath of a surety suffered a loss that is manifest." (سورة النساء, An-Nisaa, Chapter #4, Verse #119)

Tell m,e who then can find a righteous wife, when the Ummah is deceived by the life of this world and they were duped into following Hadith, when the Allah states that His guidance is the only guidance. Who can find a decent woman when the Ummah is being corrupted by the LGBT and the perverted transgressors communities that surround them and they refuse to move away from them?

Tell me, who can find a righteous wife when most women reject the parts of the Quran were it states you can marry 4 wives and believing girls, are you going to tell Allah to his face on the day of judgment that the men who do this commit bigotry and child molestation like the world says of our beloved prophet. Then who is your God?

"Therefore lend not thou support in any way to those who reject (Allah's Message)." (سورة القصص, Al-Qasas, Chapter #28, Verse #86)

Questions. Why are you so proudly supporting their college institutions by attending them, and why do you support their businesses by buying from them when you know they contribute to the deaths of your brothers in the east?

"As for those who divide their religion and break up into sects, thou hast no part in them in the least:" (سورة الأنعام, Al-An'aam, Chapter #6, Verse #159)

Question. How can you people then be sunni, shite, sufis, baha'is and ahmadiyyas, how rebellious can you be!

"And hold fast, all together, by the rope which Allah (stretches out for you), and be not divided among yourselves; and remember with gratitude Allah's favors on you; for ye were enemies and He joined your hearts in love, so that by His Grace, ye became brethren;" (سورة آل عمران, Aal-i-Imraan, Chapter #3, Verse #103) ??

Question. Who told you people to be racist and hate and be divided by color, Allah commanded that kindness is due to all people and you will pay everyone their due on the day of Judgment. How do you people discriminate hate and judge skin color, Allah said don?t fail to judge by the book, why are you judging by color or nationality?

I am looking for a believing muslim woman, one who knows and accepts the role that Allah has gave her. One who is devoutly obedient and does not try to assert authority (suggestions are fine), is submissive and recognizes the man as the head and leader. A women who is opposed to feminism and women empowerment because she knows it is against the natural order Allah has set. I will post a verse from the Quran:

"Men are the protectors and maintainers of women, because Allah has given the one more (strength) than the other, and because they support them from their means. Therefore the righteous women are devoutly obedient, and guard in (the husband's) absence what Allah would have them guard." (سورة النساء, An-Nisaa, Chapter #4, Verse #34)

So I will do my part as protector and maintainer and you do yours that you are commanded in that verse by Allah! And of course treat each other with kindness and respect and live in tranquility with one another if Allah wills.

Is there a righteous women out there who truly believes in Allah? If so then, show yourself.  ;)

Do you follow the Torah, Psalms and Gospel also?
May He the Hearer grant us victory in the worldy life, and Hes abundance of Light on the Day of Judgement, and may He the King of kings grant us the eternal Paradise. Peace.

Man of Faith

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Re: In search of a sincere, guided, believing woman!
« Reply #43 on: July 13, 2016, 12:07:05 PM »
The egg remains contained in the female if conceived and not given elsewhere, but the semen is given by the male in order for her to conceive and hence become pregnant. Later the finished child is ejected out of her uterus which is what gives the Arabic descriptive term of mother. The father's descriptive term means what his role is in reproducing children. We cannot escape these linguistic meanings and there is no misogyny in it.

I think I already said this previously and it is tantamount to circular reasoning, but now I have disclosed it with the best of my explanation skill. Furthermore it is off-topic. How did we enter the topic anyway?

Be well
Amenuel
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imrankhawaja

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Re: In search of a sincere, guided, believing woman!
« Reply #44 on: July 13, 2016, 12:43:40 PM »
actually a balance between everything is really nice we should think this thing more than thinking giving or taking

relationship of husband and wife on equality basis is always my way of thinking sister huruf we both man and women in need of eachother and when we understand this need then we relax and our test become easy.

one side i look women suffer more than a man witn respect to kids so thats y logically God created a system in which both male and female are mire attach to mother than father

from the very first day women get stuck with kid so i also admit it and i never ever think in my life to compare man and women on any thing both deserved to be love and respect

peace

Man of Faith

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Re: In search of a sincere, guided, believing woman!
« Reply #45 on: July 13, 2016, 01:16:58 PM »
You are right, imran. We should not hold on so dearly to our gender identities.

Be well
Amenuel
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imrankhawaja

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Re: In search of a sincere, guided, believing woman!
« Reply #46 on: July 13, 2016, 01:20:37 PM »
hmm amanuel exactly

God bless you all


truthseeker11

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Re: In search of a sincere, guided, believing woman!
« Reply #47 on: July 13, 2016, 02:21:38 PM »
Peace Wakas,

Actually, there is one (and perhaps only one?) translation that provides perfect coherence between 4:34 and 4:128 with regard to the point you raise. Scroll down a bit:
http://www.quran434.com/wife-beating-islam.html#part3

Thank you for your response. I have read your article in past quite a few times and read it again now. Whilst you have made an excellent attempt to come up with an alternative meaning of "dharaba", unfortunately it does not provide perfect coherence between 4:34 and 4:128 with regard to the point I raised. Just saying it does, does not make it coherent.

This brings me to couple of suggestions about that portion of your article.

1. You make the following statement in your article which is factually incorrect:

Quote from: Wakas
A perfect match with 4:34!

This statement should be replaced with something like "similar to 4:128". Evidence will follow.

2. You make the following misleading statement in your article:

Quote from: Wakas
4:128
if a wife feared uprising/disloyalty from husband
---> then no blame upon them that they try to reconcile between themselves
---> (if still no resolution, e.g. she is suspended/stuck, do as 58:1-4) idriboo/cite them
---> authority/arbiters can get involved

The red portion of your quote above is not even remotely suggested by 4:128, hence very misleading and partly based on this misleading statement you claim "perfect match with 4:34". The red portion should be taken out.

================================

Following is evidence that your article does not provide perfect coherence between 4:34 and 4:128, instead the discrimination still remains.

1. In 4:34, after husband fearing  "nushooz", 3 steps are recommended before others can get involved (which can be simultaneous as you suggest, by your own admission in the article, hence a contradiction which I will come to later on):

Advise -------> abandon wife in bed -------> "dharab" her (no matter what it means)

In 4:128, after wife feared "nushooz", only one step recommended before others can get involved -------> Reconcile

CLEARLY no perfect coherence between 4:34 and 4:128 and obvious evidence of discrimination.

Why is wife not recommended to "abandon husband in bed" in 4:128 for same fear of ill-conduct/disloyalty as in 4:34? -------> Discrimination

Why is wife not recommended to "dharab" her husband in 4:128 for same fear of ill-conduct/disloyalty as in 4:34? -------> Discrimination


Doesn't matter what "dharaba" means, it should have been equally recommended for both.

2. In 4:34 the recommendation is "3izuhunna"/advise/exhort/admonish/preach/warn

CLEARLY A ONE WAY MONOLOGUE from husband to wife

In 4:128 the recommendation is "yusliha"/reconcile

CLEARLY INVOLVING A TWO WAY DIALOGUE between wife and husband.

CLEARLY no perfect coherence between 4:34 and 4:128 and obvious evidence of discrimination.

When husband fearing "nushooz" then a ONE WAY MONOLOGUE with wife

When wife feared "nushooz" then a TWO WAY DIALOGUE to reconcile.

It should have been a TWO WAY DIALOGUE in both places.


3. In 4:34 after the ONE WAY MONOLOGUE, the possibilities are wife "obeys"/"atanakum" (one sided) otherwise -------> authorities involved.

In 4:34 it's a TWO WAY DIALOGUE which if doesn't work out then -------> authorities involved.

CLEARLY no perfect coherence between 4:34 and 4:128 and obvious evidence of discrimination.

It should have been a TWO WAY DIALOGUE in 4:34, or in 4:128 the wife should also have been given the right to have a ONE WAY MONOLOGUE with husband and his "obedience" to that monologue as the way out.

Finally, I come to the part where it can be simultaneous according to your own contradictory words:

Quote from: Wakas
It is perhaps interesting to note that "if they obeyed you" may have an implication that anything other than advisement is regarded as seeking a way against them, i.e. abandoning them in bed and (then) idriboo them. We will discuss later that it is possible to infer that the 'abandoning them in bed' step could be limited in time, whilst the advisement part whilst still maintaining normal sexual relations does not have a time limit, further reinforcing this first step as what is preferred, hence it being first.

So according to your own inference, the advisement part does not have a time limit but abandoning them in bed could be limited in time, which shows that the two can overlap and be simultaneous.

This contradicts with your statement in the article:

Quote from: Wakas
The "fa" meaning then/so means whatever follows can only apply to the wife in whom the husband fears nushuz, not others. It also implies that what follows is a sequential order of recommendations and not simultaneous.

Peace
6:116 And if you obey the majority of those on Earth they will lead you away from God?s path; that is because they follow conjecture, and that is because they only guess.

10:36 Most of them only follow conjecture. While conjecture does not avail against the truth in anything. God is aware of what they do.

2:170 And if they are told: ?Follow what God has sent down,? they say: ?No, we will follow what we found our fathers doing!? What if their fathers did not understand anything and were not guided?

28:75 And We will extract from every nation a witness, then We will say: ?Bring forth your proof.? They will then realize that all truth belongs with God, and what they had invented will abandon them.

huruf

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Re: In search of a sincere, guided, believing woman!
« Reply #48 on: July 13, 2016, 02:26:55 PM »
There is no husband in 4.34 either to fear nushuz or to do anything at all. Theh aya is addressd to the believers, men and women. Those who fear arethe believers wha re beig addressed and the nushuz can be feared from any womann or women.

Salaam

Wakas

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Re: In search of a sincere, guided, believing woman!
« Reply #49 on: July 13, 2016, 04:47:05 PM »
peace t11,

So as not to go off-topic too much I have replied in the relevant thread:
http://free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9599954.msg391536#msg391536
All information in my posts is correct to the best of my knowledge only and thus should not be taken as a fact. One should seek knowledge and verify: 17:36, 20:114, 35:28, 49:6, 58:11. My articles

www.studyQuran.org