Halal.. the real definition?

[sushi1992]

Same here, i currently don't really eat meat....It's kind of hard on my digestion.

people should look into how conventionally prepared animals are brought up and how they're fed....
Ever watched the documentary Earthlings?

Hmm heard of it... what channel did it come on? Discovery channel? And yeah totally agree. My dad suffered stomach cancer and hasn't got a stomach now but when he eats he doesn't eat meat because he finds it heavy and pains him... I think the molecular structure of any meat is just very different (obviously) to the structure of say something like fish or potatoes (though potatoes are quite heavy carbs) but I doubt back in the day in Prophet Muhammads (pbuh) time they used to eat THAT much meat like people do today

[youssef4342]

well i just watched it online actually on google videos.
yuo can watch it for free online
its shows you the mistreatment of animals prepared for food etc

[sushi1992]

well i just watched it online actually on google videos.
yuo can watch it for free online
its shows you the mistreatment of animals prepared for food etc

Thanks Youssef I'll check it out

Peace

[farida]

Selam Farida ,

Thank you for showing me the vids. To me I felt the second vid (and I watched both parts) seemed better to me as at least the animal is calm and in a state of relaxation. The mechanical way of doing it (first vid) kind of felt a bit too... mechanical, in the sense of putting the animal in that cast where it can still see whats happening... though I suppose at least it doesn't see the knife (but could probably see the blood around it). Out of interest Farida, what is your opinion on the subject? Which of the slaughter processes do you prefer? In seems also to me that both the Qur'an and Torah tell us about how an animal should be treated however does anyone know a reference to this in the Bible? Would have thought mum knows because she's a catholic but she doesn't so anyone out there knows please let me know .

Peace out  

Salaam Sushi
I would definately prefer "Mercy Halal Islamic Slaughter" if only I could get my hands on it.
I post this video again incase people missed it and would welcome any comments; http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vc5BWafzEu4&feature=related
Campare it to those butchers who drag animal on Eid Qurban; a day of celebration and slaugher it in the name of merciful.
Salaam

[sushi1992]

Salaam Sushi
I would definately prefer "Mercy Halal Islamic Slaughter" if only I could get my hands on it.
I post this video again incase people missed it and would welcome any comments; http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vc5BWafzEu4&feature=related
Campare it to those butchers who drag animal on Eid Qurban; a day of celebration and slaugher it in the name of merciful.
Salaam

Selam Farida ,

-sighs- I wish all halal farmers would slaughter an animal in the way that Mercy Halal do it... but hey... world isn't all that caring. And my gosh I know... I've never eaten an animal on Qurban anyway lol, I feel that a sacrifice should not necessarily be an animal because judging my Abraham's story, it's more of a personal sacrifice, like a possession or something close... but hey, it's just an opinion ^.^.

Peace  

[mirjamnur]

Salam youssef

From my would-be current understanding

1) God's name does NOT need to be Mentioned AT THE TIME OF SLAUGHTERING.
2) God's name MUST be ***Remembered***before EATING THE ANIMAL

***the word used has the root of Z-K-R, thus you can remember God's name silently over the food, or outloud either way
(Does remembering God's name make a difference? Yes! (research :Masaru Emoto: Messages from Water)

*I think there are laws in the us which make Animals like cows have to be shot by a blow in the head before slaughtering to kind of render the animal brain dead
(This would render the animal unlawful since it has kind of been stricken/hit with an object, even if the animal is slaughtered after, the heart might not function properly to pump the blood out from the body, and the blood might retain in the organs, tissue/meat etc)

*Please only eat organic Kosher or Halal meat, that would be the best option.

i


I'm vegetarian, and I suffer every time I eat meat and I can not represent the conditions in the slaughterhouses and butchers shops ethically. But actually I have a problem with all the halal issue. I was always of the opinion that THE NAME OF GOD must be mentioned at the act of killing himself.. i read also  an interesting article:
http://quransmessage.com/articles/slaughtering%20of%20animals%20-%20the%20correct%20method%20of%20sacrifice%20FM3.htm (look point 4)

Where is the problem? Maybe I've overlooked something important, because English is not my native language? thanks for the clarification
Salam

[sushi1992]

Salam youssefi


I'm vegetarian, and I suffer every time I eat meat and I can not represent the conditions in the slaughterhouses and butchers shops ethically. But actually I have a problem with all the halal issue. I was always of the opinion that THE NAME OF GOD must be mentioned at the act of killing himself.. i read also  an interesting article:
http://quransmessage.com/articles/slaughtering%20of%20animals%20-%20the%20correct%20method%20of%20sacrifice%20FM3.htm (look point 4)

Where is the problem? Maybe I've overlooked something important, because English is not my native language? thanks for the clarification
Salam

Hi there,

Nice article and it addresses everything clear cut. The only part to me which mentions anything about saying Allah's name before slaughter is for surah 22 which is talking about Al-Hajj and everywhere else in the Quran merely says to pronounce Allah's name on "eating".... If I am wrong correct me.

Peace

[mirjamnur]

Salam sushi

hmm and what is with

005.004
“They ask you what is lawful to them Say: lawful to you are (all) things good and pure: and what you have taught your trained hunting dogs in the manner directed to you by God: eat what they catch for you, but pronounce the name of God over it: and fear God; for God is swift in taking account”

Hunting animals (such as dogs) normally catch prey and this verse is not necessarily dealing with sacrificial animals. This verse also follows the verse which details food restrictions.

The verse is clear that one is to pronounce the name of God over the food that is caught. It can be argued that this verse simply requires one to pronounce the name of God before eating the animal and not during slaughter. However, as carrion (dead meat) is forbidden, the hunting animal will be trained to bring the prey alive or in a state where it can be made lawful to eat (by slaughtering it in a lawful manner). It is in this context that the pronouncement of God’s name is being mentioned which is being posited as a requirement for slaughter.
 

and

Please note that the Arabic word 'Thakaytum' has been used for 'slaughter' as a lawful manner of ending the life of an animal for consumption. This term appears in the same verse and is contrasted with the rejection of meat sacrificed on stone altars. Here the term 'Thubiha' is actually used, clearly indicating a familiarity of this process of sacrifice.

The author combines here  clear thakaytum with  killing in a special way = prononce the name of Allah over it, when you kill it.

? Peace

[sushi1992]

Salam sushi

hmm and what is with
and
The author combines here  clear thakaytum with  killing in a special way = prononce the name of Allah over it, when you kill it.

? Peace

Selam Mirjamnur ,

I have read your quotes. I'm slightly confused now... I'm in a sort of agreement but I question a few things, are we to rely on the slaughter that they pronounced God's name when our accounts are we solely responsible for? And what is the definition of dead meat then? If all dead meat is forbidden to us, how can we eat it.. After slaughtering an animal is still dead... Unless by dead meat we are meaning decaying flesh then that opens up other things. Also, do you not think it is necessary to pronounce God's name on all foods and not purely on meat? And this would be at the time of eating (obviously you can't slaughter vegetables). I think it would be useful (if you know Arabic) to post the verses containing the information and to highlight slaughter relating to eating in say red. Because I'm still not entirely convinced.

Peace

[mirjamnur]

Salam Sushi

i'm still to confused not only you.  but i found this article very informative. I discussed the matter before with the author of the website. Then he give me more explanations:
http://quransmessage.com/articles/thakaytum%20FM3.htm
Here we see the expression  thakaytum in different  lexicons. The question arises as to whether those are already influenced by the tradition?



Please note that the Arabic word 'Thakaytum' has been used for 'slaughter' as a lawful manner of ending the life of an animal for consumption. This term appears in the same verse and is contrasted with the rejection of meat sacrificed on stone altars. Here the term 'Thubiha' is actually used, clearly indicating a familiarity of this process of sacrifice.

22.36

والبدن جعلنها لكم من شعئر الله لكم فيها خير فاذكروا اسم الله عليها صواف فإذا وجبت جنوبها فكلوا منها وأطعموا القانع والمعتر كذلك سخرنها لكم لعلكم تشكرون 

 the first example, speaking of thakaytum in connection with the trained animals. This should catch the animal alive, not dead then it is killed by the name of Allah over it . Thakaytum stands for a killing in order to eat it. Zhiba stands for Sacrifice, which God forbid, because it's pointless. In Lexikonen the two terms are always used as synonyms, but the Koran is mentioned Zhiba always negative. What does this mean for us? I think in this day and age, neither the methods of slaughter nor the livestock production is according to the law in the Qur'an . The animal is tortured, butchered, and certainly no thought of God. For me, this meat is not allowed. An animal is not like a plant, animals have a Ruh, a breath of life. We kill an animal and delete this breath with permission from God. Therefore, we should not kill without reason, and all be aware that we have completed a life. I therefore believe in Allah calls us, mention the name over to the animal in contrast to the plants.

If all dead meat is forbidden to us, how can we eat it.. After slaughtering an animal is still dead..

the dead meat, what we didn't thakaytum is forbidden. or meat, what the dogs catch and killed before it reach us.
my humble view .
i wish you peace