Author Topic: Jinns and Dark Matter  (Read 20004 times)

Nafi

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Jinns and Dark Matter
« on: June 23, 2010, 11:35:24 AM »
In Islam, there are incorporeal beings called Jinns that interact ad reside within a different dimension from our tradition dimension. We cannot see, feel, hear or sense them in any way, in the Quran I think they are described of being made of smokeless flame (very ambiguous, but poetic) Personally as scientic mind, I liken it to plasma, produced by nuclear fusion. But then as a human, I am relatively stupid.

''According to the Quran, we cannot see nor collide with Jinn but they have weight:

[Quran 55.31] We [Allah] will settle your affair, both you of weight (man and jinn)

The Jinn have weight means that we can detect their gravity and they can detect our gravity. So according to the Quran we cannot see the Jinn nor collide with them but we can detect their gravity.

Just as the Jinn is of different type that we cannot see nor collide with but we can detect their gravity, there are six other Heavens that we cannot see nor collide with either but we can detect their gravity, superimposed above the visible one:


[Quran 41.12] So [Allah] decreed them as seven heavens (one above the other) in two days and revealed to each heaven its orders. And We [Allah] adorned the lowest heaven with lights, and protection. Such is the decree of the Exalted; the Knowledgeable.

According to the Quran, only the lowest heaven has visible light. This means that this Dark Matter exists in the six Heavens superimposed above the lowest one. Also according to the Quran, each of these remaining six Heavens is of a different type and each has its own planets like Earth:

[Quran 65.12] Allah is the one who created seven Heavens and from Earth like them (of corresponding type); [Allah?s] command descends among them so that you may know that Allah is capable of anything and that Allah knows everything.


Earth is not a unique planet in Islam. Other planets like Earth do exist throughout the other six Heavens. It is just that we cannot see them nor collide with them but we can detect their gravity.

General relativity predicted gravitational lensing, that is, the gravitational field generated by a galaxy causes the light passing through it to bend (change direction). Dark Matter does not emit any light but scientists can still map its location by using gravitational lensing, that is, by detecting where light is bending in places where it shouldn't. In the above image and video light gets bent by invisible dark matter in places where it shouldn't.

Muslims say that this is how God challenges nonbelievers to detect the remaining six superimposed Heavens:

[Quran 67.3-4] [Allah] is the one who created seven superimposed Heavens. You do not see variations in the formations of the Compassionate, so redirect your sight, do you see any creation? Then redirect your sight again, your vision returns to you in defeat and regret.''


Courtesy of Raef Fanous.

So all in all, In Islamic theology there is only one universe, but this Universe has several facets (dimensions). But these dimensions are vaastly different from the other.
'Why do we drive on parkways, and park in driveways?'

savage_carrot

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Re: Jinns and Dark Matter
« Reply #1 on: June 24, 2010, 03:55:55 AM »
55:31 is referring to calling/settling their accounts/burdens etc. Not physical weight.

Doesn't mean this heaven doesn't have dark matter along with the lights? Are they mutually exclusive? How would you define a heaven?

God has a plan, Gaius. He has a plan for everything and everyone.

Jafar

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Re: Jinns and Dark Matter
« Reply #2 on: August 29, 2010, 04:41:21 AM »
In Islam, there are incorporeal beings called Jinns that interact ad reside within a different dimension from our tradition dimension. We cannot see, feel, hear or sense them in any way, in the Quran I think they are described of being made of smokeless flame (very ambiguous, but poetic) Personally as scientic mind, I liken it to plasma, produced by nuclear fusion. But then as a human, I am relatively stupid.

Yup a living being made of plasma or gas..
Look around 'smokeless fire' a good example is the SUN!
And there are many planets without any solid / earth substance at all.. Jupiter is huge baloon of gasses..



Abdun Nur

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Re: Jinns and Dark Matter
« Reply #3 on: September 08, 2010, 04:33:29 PM »
Salaam,

the idea of Jinn as a fire being is rubbish, and stands as a direct contradiction to the expressed ideas of the Qur'an, as every living thing in our creation is made of water.

21:30 Have not those who disbelieve known that the heavens and the earth were of one piece, then We parted them, and we made every living thing of water ? Will they not then believe ?

The theory of gravity is not correct, and is easily disproved, if gravity truly was an attraction of mass why don't things get pulled sideways towards mountains for example, as for the emperors new suit, dark matter, it's a fiction created to hide the major problems with the false theory of the big bang, anyway people love to believe the majority who are held in subjugation to the sovereign propaganda, if you believe in fire being jinns then you should also believe that the Qur'an has contradictions within it.

Halil

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Re: Jinns and Dark Matter
« Reply #4 on: September 11, 2010, 10:09:12 AM »
The theory of gravity is not correct, and is easily disproved, if gravity truly was an attraction of mass why don't things get pulled sideways towards mountains for example, as for the emperors new suit, dark matter, it's a fiction created to hide the major problems with the false theory of the big bang, anyway people love to believe the majority who are held in subjugation to the sovereign propaganda, if you believe in fire being jinns then you should also believe that the Qur'an has contradictions within it.

According to the law of universal gravitation, which as a model describing our physical reality with a very good approximation on a large scale level (that is non atomic level),  the attractive force (F) between two bodies is proportional to the product of their masses (m1 and m2), and inversely proportional to the square of the distance (r) between them:
F = G*m(1)*m(2)/r^2

The gravitational constant G is measured to about 6.67300 ? 10^-11 N*(m/kg)^2

The force with which a person weighing 100kg is being pulled towards the earth with is almost 1000 Newtons. If you dont think that theres is a force acting between you and the earth than just try jumping and see what happens.
Now for the same force to be actively working between the same person and a mountain at a distance of say 10 kilometers, that mountain would have to weigh something like 15000000000000000000 kg = 1.5*10^19 kg, which is 1500 times the mass of mount everest. You also have to take in factors like the density of the substance that makes up the mountain since you need as much mass centered in one single point as possible if you want to be pulled towards a patricular direction, or have a distance/volume ratio that is very high and on top of that be in a closed system where no other factors are in effect other than the two objects being pulled towards each other or that the relative value of those factors are so small that their effects are negligible.
Theres a gravitational force between the earth and the moon which keeps the moon in orbit so it doesnt fly away, much like when youre spinning an object attached to a long thread with your hand, let go of the thread and the object flies away, try it. Since the mass of both the earth and the moon are so great the gravitational force acting between them is significant.

This is elementary school physics. Did you participate in class?

And the actual topic of my interest, why do you make such an absurd claim with such a certainty? Why spend spend half a careers worth of time and effort to propagate highly nonsensical ideas and thoughts into the most common and intuitive religion throughout mankinds existance?
Who are you really? What is it that is your goal?

God is the light of all on high and all on earth. An example of His light is like a niche that contains a lamp, that lamp being in a certain kind of glass. And it is as if that glass were a brilliant star, lit from some blessed olive tree, neither western nor eastern. The oil of that tree will almost shine without being touched by any flame.  He is a light above any light, and guides to His light whoever wants it and whomever He wishes to bring to it. God gives metaphors for the benefit of people and is discerning of all things.

Quran - 24:35

Noon de Plume

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Re: Jinns and Dark Matter
« Reply #5 on: September 11, 2010, 10:31:15 AM »
Yup a living being made of plasma or gas..

How to make plasma in your microwave with only one match (video)

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=6732382807079775486&hl=en#




Abdun Nur

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Re: Jinns and Dark Matter
« Reply #6 on: September 12, 2010, 04:26:00 AM »
Salaam Halil,

you state things as absolutely determined. In your mind the evidence of the physical effects is proof of the theoretical description of the cause of the physical, the idea that gravity is an attraction of mass is an incredible bad way to describe universal interactions, it fails almost entirely, it cannot even be applied to the orbits of planetary bodies.

You believe that a force that the entire mass of the planet is exerting but has no measureable influence a couple of hundred miles from the earth dominates the universe, the establishment want you to believe the moon 250,000 miles from the earth has a massive gravitational pull as an attraction of mass, causing the earth to bulge, again this is poor physics and also taught in schools, just because the schools teach rubbish does not make it fact.

There is a reason the sovereign elite wish you not to understand physics, if you understood correctly they would quickly lose their parasitical control, the Zionist Einstein corrupted the understanding of physics and the Zionist bankers made certain the universities only teach that confusion.

The entire mafia banking system is based on the charging for energy, this is the reason we all rely on fossil fuels, driving around in technologies which have not fundamentally altered in a 140 years.

Your thoughts on why the mass of mountains has no influence is non-sense, but the idea that gravity is an attraction of mass itself is non-sense, this is demonstrated experimentally with anti-gravity fields, although the establishment work hard to convince the public that these are impossible, these fields demonstrate practically that gravity is not an attraction of mass.

They further wish you to believe energy cannot be created nor destroyed, based on the rules of steam engine engineering of 300 years ago, they took these simple design rules and made them into the laws of thermodynamics, these so called laws are again designed to confuse and mislead the majority, as we exist in an open energy exchange, between this reality and the underlying fluidic manifold which emanates this reality, in truth it is impossible to create a closed energy system, even in a laboratory. This is the reason energy moves in waves as it travels through the underlying fluidic reality.

As for me propagating non-sense as you claim, investigate the idols in physics you adulate, these people are not honest, my motivation is to explain to people with a desire to understand and examine evidence and not a person who accepts without investigation the dogma of conventional physics, you should further consider the use of abstract mathematics within physics, it has little benefit to understanding correctly. James Maxwell rightly understood this, abstract mathematics does not account for the order, therefore cannot be used to explain a physical model, 2+3=5 is not the same as 3+2=5 within a physical universe as the numbers represent a physical reality, you need to apply quaternion mathematics, as Maxwell did.

Anyway you have judge me and no matter what is explained a confused mind will not allow the shirk to be removed, I will leave you to your conventional confusion of the invisible fantasies of dark matter, black holes and nonexistent attractions of mass, etc.


 


Halil

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Re: Jinns and Dark Matter
« Reply #7 on: September 14, 2010, 11:35:49 AM »
Now i can tell that youre probably not an idiot and thats what makes you so interesting  ;), when you propose such an idea, with SUCH a certainty. I mean i dont mind radical ideas and thoughts, i actually like those. But in your case there are no solid underlying arguments for the discarding of the approximated model of gravity.
Each his own i guess. But if theres one thing thats underlyingly more certain for me than anything else its God (not the "No-God"  ;)). And for someone to even propose such an idea of "No-God" while even retaining a certain loyalty to the teachings of the quran, THAT tells even more of the person.
You have a jolly good time with your quest.

Btw, i do hope youre not trying to play me there for my scepticism with those passionate remarks on those zionist bankers and stuff.
God is the light of all on high and all on earth. An example of His light is like a niche that contains a lamp, that lamp being in a certain kind of glass. And it is as if that glass were a brilliant star, lit from some blessed olive tree, neither western nor eastern. The oil of that tree will almost shine without being touched by any flame.  He is a light above any light, and guides to His light whoever wants it and whomever He wishes to bring to it. God gives metaphors for the benefit of people and is discerning of all things.

Quran - 24:35

Abdun Nur

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Re: Jinns and Dark Matter
« Reply #8 on: September 14, 2010, 12:51:30 PM »
Salaam Halil,
the problem with modern science, is it has been transformed from a search for the truth into a priesthood of accepted dogma, just as the religious priests before them they corrupt the truth to maintain the established view, and invent giant lies to justify anything that stands in glaring contradiction to the dogma.
Gravity as an attraction of mass doesn?t hold water if examined honestly, just as the big bang doesn?t hold water, they invest giant lies to justify their theories of gravity and big bang origins with dark energy, dark matter, black holes, all invisible inventions exhibiting no detectable evidence, they have corrupted science to such an extent as to have transformed it into simply a propaganda tool of the elite, to confuse the masses and maintain the sovereign models of exploitation.
The education systems teach as fact comprehensively disproved scientific theories, just as the religions teach comprehensively disproved rituals, dogma and idols, if examined honestly, but few people wish to be honest preferring a conformist view, free of investigation, free of any benefit to themselves or those around them.
I sense you are condescending of my perspective of rational investigation, my refusal to accept something as true that contradicts the physical evidence seems to offend you. You wish to worship a male personification, a God. I say, what is your evidence to prove a God exists, I further explain on my website what the evidence of the physical universe, not the fiction of the priests of science, demonstrates truly exists, and I say this is Allah, and just as Muhammad said I say, ?There is No God.? As the very foundation of Islam, yet you think there is a God, when ?There is only Allah.?.

You want to categorize me, well I can help you, I reject every religion as a crime against humanity, without exception, I follow Islam as a Deen, not a Math?ab or Muzdhab. I believe if you have blind faith you have nothing, only firm belief established through investigation has value. I believe no true Muslim can exist in the modern world, as it?s a way of life not a religion, so unless the environment is Allodial, with polycentric community free of sovereignty and all representation, using common law and human energy as the foundation of the economic system how can you exist Muslim.

Halil

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Re: Jinns and Dark Matter
« Reply #9 on: September 14, 2010, 01:05:45 PM »
All praise is to God, lord of all the universes.
God is the light of all on high and all on earth. An example of His light is like a niche that contains a lamp, that lamp being in a certain kind of glass. And it is as if that glass were a brilliant star, lit from some blessed olive tree, neither western nor eastern. The oil of that tree will almost shine without being touched by any flame.  He is a light above any light, and guides to His light whoever wants it and whomever He wishes to bring to it. God gives metaphors for the benefit of people and is discerning of all things.

Quran - 24:35