Author Topic: God hates america  (Read 3944 times)

Lost Philosopher

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Re: God hates america
« Reply #10 on: April 03, 2007, 06:05:04 PM »
I thought American society is the most tolerant if compared to any other Western countries.
Were tolerant enough to let stuff like 'god hates America' in. As for gay marriage, were getting more tolerant of it, just in the last election, Arizona (AZ rules!) voters voted no to the ban on gay marriage. Arizona has been a republican state for a long time. My only concern about homosexuality is that it will become larger than heterosexuality, I dont whant to be asked out by guys and I hope my children wont either.

I thought it already is?
I meant as drastic as the last crusades, where the entire continent was involved in an open war in the name of christ. This war is for oil.
Everything I say or do is either to gain knowledge and strengthen my philosophy or to express and explain that philosophy. -LP

Nurd

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Re: God hates america
« Reply #11 on: April 04, 2007, 06:23:19 AM »
The problem is not one of tolerance in America.  One can find places that will be tolerant.  There will always be places full of the intolerant, that's how places are.  The problem is our government is slowly stripping away what freedoms we had and leaving us only with an illusion of freedom.  Which sadly shows that the freedoms we thought we had were only better illusions of those same freedoms.

zenje

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Re: God hates america
« Reply #12 on: April 04, 2007, 08:20:24 AM »
Well said, Nurd.  :yes
If they turn away, then Say: "God is enough for me, there is no god but He, in Him I put my trust and He is the Lord of the great throne." [9:129]

Rumi

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Re: God hates america
« Reply #13 on: April 05, 2007, 12:16:38 PM »
The problem is not one of tolerance in America.  One can find places that will be tolerant.  There will always be places full of the intolerant, that's how places are.  The problem is our government is slowly stripping away what freedoms we had and leaving us only with an illusion of freedom.  Which sadly shows that the freedoms we thought we had were only better illusions of those same freedoms.

True your rights are slowly being taken away. But still what makes America truly great is that your most basic fundamental freedoms and liberties are enshrined and guaranteed by your constitution, this goes towards most countries in the west. Do you know how lucky you are to live in the west, you have rights that other can only dream about from their prison cells, others who are living in Muslim countries. Bloggers in Egypt as one example have been jailed for insulting the president, a journalist in Syria was convicted also for insulting his President. In the states, people make fun of US presidents all the time, publicly on talk shows, can you see the HUGE difference?.

The lack of tolerance and understanding happens all over the world, it is just as bad in developed countries as it is in the developing. The difference is that in the west, you can be intolerant about anything, Islam, black people, immigrants, monkeys, aliens, the Simpsons, it is your right to an opinion and to voice that opinion. In other countries, you are not so free, the state controls not only your right to voice an opinion but to have an opinion contrary to state media, policies and decrees, what have you.   

I used to live in Den Haag (The Hague), I have seen the personal freedoms that the Dutch enjoy, from government controlled brothels and sex industry to marijuana cafe's. But this is not to say that the Dutch are all dope smoking  filthy pornographers, they are not!!!! Quite the opposite, there are actually many who are conservative Christians, whilst they disapprove of many aspects of Dutch public policy, they respect the right of the individual.   

The most important thing is this, guaranteeing the right of the individual! Sure there are redneck, hardcore Christians in the US, but they have a right be so!!! Just as someone with opposing views also has the same rights!! It is a great thing!! Would you rather live in a country where you aren't guaranteed these basic rights?

In Malaysia my country, there has never ever been a case where Muslims have legally changed their religion, i.e. becoming an apostate, adopting Christianity for example. There is no freedom of religion for Muslims since it is practically impossible to legally change into another faith, N.B. I have met Malaysian Muslims who have become Christians and atheist albeit in secret. Can you even imagine not being able to practice a religion of your choice? I know quite a few of us in the forum weren't born Muslims, imagine if the state never allowed you to become Muslims in the first place!! You had the right to religion. In Malaysia we also have a heavily censored media, we don't have a right to say and do many things that people in the west take for granted. The US, with all the hate rhetoric, evangelicals, withering personal rights, is still a place FAR FAR freer than most, it has a constitution which guarantees  these basic rights!!

I think I'll stop here. Sorry for the rant, Salams.


zenje

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Re: God hates america
« Reply #14 on: April 05, 2007, 01:31:29 PM »
Peace
Quote
True your rights are slowly being taken away. But still what makes America truly great is that your most basic fundamental freedoms and liberties are enshrined and guaranteed by your constitution, this goes towards most countries in the west. Do you know how lucky you are to live in the west, you have rights that other can only dream about from their prison cells, others who are living in Muslim countries. Bloggers in Egypt as one example have been jailed for insulting the president, a journalist in Syria was convicted also for insulting his President. In the states, people make fun of US presidents all the time, publicly on talk shows, can you see the HUGE difference?.
Do you think this type stuff doesnt happen in the U.S? Whistleblowers are imprisoned. Look at the attorney general's case going on right now and the firings. The thing is, the way it's played out mostly in the media, you have to read between the lines. Something you'd probably never see on the news - A canadian citizen is captured by US and taken to Syria to be tortured. Hundreds of detainees are still held in Guantanamo without once seeing a lawyer. How is that a HUGE difference? Don't be fooled by cartoons of the president looking like a monkey... that's not too much of a stretch. The constitution you speak of has been placed aside on the name of war on terror... check out the patriot act or illegal wire-tapping for more information. The administration that lied to get into an illegal war in Iraq?... nuff said.
If they turn away, then Say: "God is enough for me, there is no god but He, in Him I put my trust and He is the Lord of the great throne." [9:129]

Lost Philosopher

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Re: God hates america
« Reply #15 on: April 05, 2007, 04:06:15 PM »
I'm wondering, how far did we go off topic? 
Everything I say or do is either to gain knowledge and strengthen my philosophy or to express and explain that philosophy. -LP

Nurd

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Re: God hates america
« Reply #16 on: April 05, 2007, 05:51:31 PM »
I'm wondering, how far did we go off topic? 

This isn't the topic?  If we hijacked someones thread I'm very sorry.

Quote from: Rumi
I think I'll stop here. Sorry for the rant, Salams.

No need to apologize for the rant.  I understand what you mean.  Just so you know though, even the constitution can be changed with enough politicians in someones pocket.  Alot of our most basic rights were curttailed with the "Homeland Security Act".   I'm afraid as a nation we are becoming more and more like the countries you describe, all for our own "safety".

mr. humble

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Re: God hates america
« Reply #17 on: April 05, 2007, 06:01:10 PM »
it is just so sad that america has failed to uphold the rights of their forefathes...
"So have Patience(O Mohammad)! Allah's promise is the very truth, and let not those who have uncertainty make you impatient."
-Surah 30:60 (Translation from M.M. Pickthall)

zenje

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Re: God hates america
« Reply #18 on: April 05, 2007, 06:05:01 PM »
Agreed, mr. humble. This beautiful country should be #1 on the planet in every sense, but the reality is different.

 :peace:
If they turn away, then Say: "God is enough for me, there is no god but He, in Him I put my trust and He is the Lord of the great throne." [9:129]

Lost Philosopher

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Re: God hates america
« Reply #19 on: April 05, 2007, 10:17:11 PM »
This isn't the topic?  If we hijacked someones thread I'm very sorry.
We didn't really hijack it, more get it driven off a dirt road parallel to the origional road.
Everything I say or do is either to gain knowledge and strengthen my philosophy or to express and explain that philosophy. -LP