Author Topic: Contradictions and inconsistencies in the quran?  (Read 34090 times)

enquirer

  • Guest
Contradictions and inconsistencies in the quran?
« on: April 18, 2006, 06:22:59 AM »
Peace all. Because people insist on a literal and 'perfect' interpretation of the quran they leave their book open to contradictions and inconsistencies...If only they viewed their book as a source of potential symbolic wisdom,and not an unverified,literal,perfect idol,then they might actually get to follow god...and not just the quran.
I will start with the first contradiction; 4:78 and 4:79.  Is evil from god or us? The literal translation is contradictory....Explain please.

mquran

  • Wise One / Burnout
  • *****
  • Posts: 2609
Contradictions and inconsistencies in the quran?
« Reply #1 on: April 18, 2006, 06:26:44 AM »
please provide the literal translation and tell us why its contradictory.

mquran

  • Wise One / Burnout
  • *****
  • Posts: 2609
Contradictions and inconsistencies in the quran?
« Reply #2 on: April 18, 2006, 06:29:20 AM »
Quote
Peace all. Because people insist on a literal and 'perfect' interpretation of the quran they leave their book open to contradictions and inconsistencies...If only they viewed their book as a source of potential symbolic wisdom,and not an unverified,literal,perfect idol,then they might actually get to follow god...and not just the quran.


Given by a person who thinks 'ta'wil' is 'far-fetched' , this comes across as rather lacking in credibility :D

enquirer

  • Guest
Peace
« Reply #3 on: April 18, 2006, 06:31:38 AM »
Peace mquran. Its contradictory because it first says everything is from god,...and then says that bad is from us. The only way this is resolved is if we are god. :D  :?:  :idea:  
If you want to post the literal translation,feel free,but i wont waste my time spoon-feeding you verses. Im sure you know the verses (as do many others.),so you or anyone else quote whichever version of verses you want.

mquran

  • Wise One / Burnout
  • *****
  • Posts: 2609
Contradictions and inconsistencies in the quran?
« Reply #4 on: April 18, 2006, 06:34:27 AM »
Quote
Peace mquran. Its contradictory because it first says everything is from god,...and then says that bad is from us. The only way this is resolved is if we are god.    
If you want to post the literal translation,feel free,but i wont waste my time spoon-feeding you verses. Im sure you know the verses (as do many others.),so you or anyone else quote whichever version of verses you want.


Version of verses ? You mean you pick VERSIONS of verses? I'm asking you for the literal translation because I assume you speak directly to the text.

Do you know what a 'nafs' is, before I explain this 'contradition' ?

enquirer

  • Guest
Peace
« Reply #5 on: April 18, 2006, 06:42:45 AM »
peace mquran. I am aware that taweel means 'hidden or more elaborate interpretation',i just used the word in a different context my friend. If you feel i have not translated this word correctly then i dont think it takes a great deal away from the dialogue. And im sure there are different interpretations of this 'clear' arabic word anyway.(or do you have a consensus on this issue.) Educate me if you know soo much,what is taweel and what is nafs...I hope ahmedbhaghat agrees with you,not to mention ayman and anwar.(pro-god.)...Some of You cant even agree on the word islam... ::8)
 I read from the direct text my friend,i am allowing you to post whichever version,even your  own version,i look forward to your explanations. :D

mquran

  • Wise One / Burnout
  • *****
  • Posts: 2609
Contradictions and inconsistencies in the quran?
« Reply #6 on: April 18, 2006, 06:45:08 AM »
Quote
peace mquran. I am aware that taweel means 'hidden or more elaborate interpretation',i just used the word in a different contect my friend. If you feel i have not translated this word correctly then i dont think it takes a great deal away from the dialogue. And im sure there are different interpretations of this 'clear' arabic word anyway.(or do you have a consensus on this issue.) Educate me if you know soo much,what is taweel and what is nafs...I hope ahmedbhaghat agrees with you,not to mention ayman and anwar.(pro-god.)...Some of You cant even agree on the word islam...


So as a 'sincere analyst', you rely on people WHOM YOU'VE NEVER MET to give you interpretations?

Seriously, if you want to be credible, do some work.

Do you know what a nafs is or not?

Quote
read from the direct text my friend,i am allowing you to post whichever version,even your own version,i look forward to your explanations


I see, so you read al-quraan, not a translation. I guess you can thus explain why the word nafs is crucial in this verse then.

savage_carrot

  • Administrator
  • Wise One / Burnout
  • *****
  • Posts: 6683
Contradictions and inconsistencies in the quran?
« Reply #7 on: April 18, 2006, 06:47:54 AM »
I post here a literal translation to ease the woes:-

4:78
Aynama takoonoo yudrikkumu almawtu walaw kuntum fee buroojin mushayyadatin wa-in tusibhum hasanatun yaqooloo hathihi min AAindi Allahi wa-in tusibhum sayyi-atun yaqooloo hathihi min AAindika qul kullun min AAindi Allahi famali haola-i alqawmi la yakadoona yafqahoona hadeethan

Wherever you are, the death catches up/reaches you , and (even) if you were in towers/castles/constellations built/erected , and if a goodness strikes them, they say: "This (is) from at God." And if a sin/crime (harm) strikes them, they say: "This (is) from at you." Say: "All/each (are) from at God, so how those the nation, they almost do not understand an information/speech?"

4:79
Ma asabaka min hasanatin famina Allahi wama asabaka min sayyi-atin famin nafsika waarsalnaka lilnnasi rasoolan wakafa biAllahi shaheedan

What struck you from a goodness, so (it is) from at God, and what struck you from a sin/crime (harm) so (it is) from your self, and We sent you to the people, (as) a messenger and enough with God, (as) a witness/present.
God has a plan, Gaius. He has a plan for everything and everyone.

enquirer

  • Guest
peace
« Reply #8 on: April 18, 2006, 06:48:58 AM »
Peace mquran. I am not relying on you,i have an understanding of what nafs and taweel are, but to clarify the dialogue i asked you if you could educate me.(that was a rhetorical request. :D ) Why dont you explain the contradiction my friend,or are you unable to? You seem to be stalling,ive done my work...Are you going to defend your book?

mquran

  • Wise One / Burnout
  • *****
  • Posts: 2609
Contradictions and inconsistencies in the quran?
« Reply #9 on: April 18, 2006, 06:51:16 AM »
I will, once you tell me what your understanding of 'nafs' is. The word nafs actually changes the dimensionality of the two verses so I'd like you to tell me if you know the word or if its another one of your 'far-fetched' understandings.